Anyone see this?

[MizzouRah]

http://img489.imageshack.us/img489/2861/whatie4.jpg


Granted, he stinks (talk about a bust at #31).. but who would sign their first round pick to a 4 yr deal and then release them?

Just seems kind of odd.

[Emiliano]

:eek:

What a bust! Maybe they signed him prior training camp hoping for some improvement, but then he "super-busted" too much to not get cut, even if he was a 1st rounder.

[lynchjm24]

It has to be a scouting byproduct.

[MizzouRah]

It has to be a scouting byproduct.

The Giants scout is rated "very good" in RB. :confused:

He might be fired soon. :D

[MizzouRah]

dola,

I would just think that had to be one heck of a cap penalty.

[Raiders Army]

Yeah it happens. When you finish your season, click on the View Drafted Player Status and check out the rookies who were drafted and were released by their teams. I seem to recall something like this a while ago, but like most of the stuff that's actually about FOF on this board, it's not much talked about. Mostly I see it in the 3rd-7th rounds, but occassionally I've seen some 1st rounders being released by their teams.

[MizzouRah]

I rarely see it for first rounders though, just thought it was odd and something I don't think happens in the NFL.

[daveroswell]

How do you release a draft pick? Do you just wait the entire year and not sign him?

[SteveMax58]

An artform really...the Giants are simply the best at finding these 1st round RB busts.

[Raiders Army]

I just finished a season. There were 2 third rounders, 4 fifth rounders, 4 sixth rounders, and 8 seventh rounders released by their teams after they signed their rookie contracts.

Once again, I had a 1st round QB (Jim Harbaugh) hold out for the next draft. I haven't been tracking it much, but he's at least the 2nd QB to hold out for the next draft in five years. It seems a little much to me.

[nfg22]

Demetrius Underwood?

[Raiders Army]

Demetrius Underwood?

I don't think he was released because the team thought he sucked. There were other issues there. Obviously the Giants rated Nastasi (could've had a great nickname "Nasty") really low after Training Camp. Todd's team rated him 9/15.

[Ben E Lou]

It actually makes sense, given the way some busts happen now. The player was signed before training camp. The immediate, huge busts are revealed AFTER training camp. What happened is that the guy was signed to his rookie contract as a late-first-round caliber player, but then he sucked balls in training cam, showed up overweight, or smoked weed every day (take your pick). ;) Because the team had 60 or less players entering training camp, he stayed on the team through the preseason, but because his ratings sucked, he barely played (notice the high rust). Then, when the cut down to 53 players needed to happen for Week 1, this guy was probably the first guy to go. I'm fairly certain that the release-decision AI is tied to ratings and performance, not to "this guy was a first round pick".

[Raiders Army]

It actually makes sense, given the way some busts happen now. The player was signed before training camp. The immediate, huge busts are revealed AFTER training camp. What happened is that the guy was signed to his rookie contract as a late-first-round caliber player, but then he sucked balls in training cam, showed up overweight, or smoked weed every day (take your pick). ;) Because the team had 60 or less players entering training camp, he stayed on the team through the preseason, but because his ratings sucked, he barely played (notice the high rust). Then, when the cut down to 53 players needed to happen for Week 1, this guy was probably the first guy to go. I'm fairly certain that the release-decision AI is tied to ratings and performance, not to "this guy was a first round pick".

I think the point is that it happens too often...not that it happens at all. In a game where it seems as if the AI is somewhat questionable handling the salary cap, why would teams not regularly, but not irregularly either, release 1st rounders who have a lot of dead cap money in future seasons. Isn't that what you get when you try to trade for a 1st rounder?

Your opponent is unwilling to trade away a player who would cost a lot in dead cap money in future seasons.

[Raiders Army]

Just to illustrate:

If you take the default roster and start with no draft, Johnathan Joseph (CIN) is a RCB who was taken 1(24) in 2006. After 6 trial runs here were his ratings:

24/46
33/60
36/69
27/53
31/68
26/55

Notwithstanding my different scouts, he was the starter for three of these starting seasons and he was a backup the other three. Even for three 1st round picks I couldn't pry him loose because I got

Your opponent is unwilling to trade away a player who would cost a lot in dead cap money in future seasons.

Now there's a big difference between Johnathan Joseph and Richie Nastasi in terms of ratings, but if a team is willing to take the cap hit to let someone go for free, why wouldn't they be willing to take three first rounders for a guy who's not even rated a starter half the time? To me, the AI should be somewhat consistent.

[DaddyTorgo]

Just to illustrate:

If you take the default roster and start with no draft, Johnathan Joseph (CIN) is a RCB who was taken 1(24) in 2006. After 6 trial runs here were his ratings:

24/46
33/60
36/69
27/53
31/68
26/55

Notwithstanding my different scouts, he was the starter for three of these starting seasons and he was a backup the other three. Even for three 1st round picks I couldn't pry him loose because I got



Now there's a big difference between Johnathan Joseph and Richie Nastasi in terms of ratings, but if a team is willing to take the cap hit to let someone go for free, why wouldn't they be willing to take three first rounders for a guy who's not even rated a starter half the time? To me, the AI should be somewhat consistent.

i'll agree that you have an issue here. that "dead cap money" trading message makes me pull my hair out though.

[Vinatieri for Prez]

If I see I will have a lot of cap room next season, I start dumping guys with the big contracts. What was the team's cap status. If they have a lot of cap room next season, ditching the guy now makes perfect sense.

[MizzouRah]

It actually makes sense, given the way some busts happen now. The player was signed before training camp. The immediate, huge busts are revealed AFTER training camp. What happened is that the guy was signed to his rookie contract as a late-first-round caliber player, but then he sucked balls in training cam, showed up overweight, or smoked weed every day (take your pick). ;) Because the team had 60 or less players entering training camp, he stayed on the team through the preseason, but because his ratings sucked, he barely played (notice the high rust). Then, when the cut down to 53 players needed to happen for Week 1, this guy was probably the first guy to go. I'm fairly certain that the release-decision AI is tied to ratings and performance, not to "this guy was a first round pick".

LOL!! :D

[MizzouRah]

If I see I will have a lot of cap room next season, I start dumping guys with the big contracts. What was the team's cap status. If they have a lot of cap room next season, ditching the guy now makes perfect sense.

They have $9.47 mil cap room and $4.95 mil lost cap room total, with $3.26 mil lost cap room next year.

Their biggest need is a RB and after some thought and discussion I think it was a brilliant move by the AI. I know I've dumped a high cap guy before because all of a sudden he took a big ratings hit... it just stood out because the guy was a first rounder. They signed him and then after training camp, cut ties with the guy - funny thing is, he's rated at 100 for leadership and has a strong personality. Looks like he couldn't backup his talk. ;)

[Ben E Lou]

I think the point is that it happens too often...not that it happens at all. In a game where it seems as if the AI is somewhat questionable handling the salary cap, why would teams not regularly, but not irregularly either, release 1st rounders who have a lot of dead cap money in future seasons. Isn't that what you get when you try to trade for a 1st rounder?Yes. I'm pretty sure that these are two completely different calculations, though. The trade evaluation AI factors in lost cap room. The release AI either doesn't at all, or it is a much smaller factor in making the decision. Whether it is a small factor or a non-factor, I'm guessing that that the fact that he's rated 9/15 was the biggest factor in the decision to release him, easily surpassing any "we-don't-want-a-cap-hit" logic.