Werewolf XLVII City of Wonder (Game Over!)

[Barkeep49]

Cronin, why would it give a bad view to one player and not the other? I'm more than happy to submit a question to Barkeep to ask if that is how it works (consider this post that action) but the way I interpret Post #1 does not coincide with the conflicting views.
I either don't understand your question, or if I do I don't think it's my place to answer.

[st.cronin]

Ok, this is my best guess as to what's going on:

- Passacaglia gives the Pardon to Chief Rum. The wolves take control of the pardon.
- A wolf (possibly one of the voters for DT) was likely to be on the spot today, but a different wolf than the one who has the pardon (I'm guessing the pardon gets distributed randomly).
- path12 (possibly the wolf with the pardon), comes out with his "scan," hoping to make it a st.cronin vs. path12 vote.

That's my best guess as to what's going on, but I can't make any scenario work where path isn't a wolf.

[Alan T]

I'm leaving work a bit early today to go take care of cell phone stuff at an "AT&T Corporate store" blah, then date night afterwards. So not sure if I'll be able to check in before the deadline tonight, probably depends on what movie we go see. Right now I feel pretty good about the Cronin/Ardent thing and think we're going in the right direction. I have yet to see a reasonable arguement that helps explain any other scenerio that is more likely.

My only concerns I have are:

1) Cronin mentioned a pardon, and that kind of slipped my mind a bit until now. I'm not sure how that plays into who we vote for, but if we vote for someone with a pardon, its a day lost.

2) If we have a run away vote on Ardent, Cronin or Path we don't learn much about anyone else other than these three. Keeping things close will help us learn about other people's allegiances and might be useful in future days.

3) The item aspect is probably still important. Who jumps on a likely winning candidate will be interesting conversation as well.

[path12]

Ok, this is my best guess as to what's going on:

- Passacaglia gives the Pardon to Chief Rum. The wolves take control of the pardon.
- A wolf (possibly one of the voters for DT) was likely to be on the spot today, but a different wolf than the one who has the pardon (I'm guessing the pardon gets distributed randomly).
- path12 (possibly the wolf with the pardon), comes out with his "scan," hoping to make it a st.cronin vs. path12 vote.

That's my best guess as to what's going on, but I can't make any scenario work where path isn't a wolf.

If I was trying to make it a path vs cronin vote, I would have said you were bad and leave Ardent out of it.

My view is this. I don't know what is going on with the differing views, but I know for a fact that Ardent is a wolf according to my night result. So I've got to keep my vote on the sure wolf.

Like I said earlier, if Ardent somehow comes up good, feel free to lynch me tomorrow. I'll bet my survival this game on this call.

[Lathum]

I am leaning towards voting ardent since path is so sure and Ardent has yet to check in.

I just don't see what Path has to gain by lying.

[Swaggs]

I am leaning towards voting ardent since path is so sure and Ardent has yet to check in.

I just don't see what Path has to gain by lying.

Same here.

[Lathum]

I gotta get ready for work soon.

VOTE ARDENT

Subject to change but I will be out until close to the deadline.

[ntndeacon]

oh since we were giving up what we have. I have the wolfsbane leaf.

[Lathum]

oh since we were giving up what we have. I have the wolfsbane leaf.

maybe I am missing something but what was the point of revealing that?

[Passacaglia]

I'm not sure if item reveals are that good of an idea -- if someone has a good item, it will make them a target for wolves. I guess the leaf is okay, since it protects you, but some of the other items can be dangerous in wolf hands.

[saldana]

interesting day to this point...just got done reading everything that has gone down...not sure what to think yet, but i will be on all evening, so i am gonna wait for ardent.

[Passacaglia]

Thanks for making me feel like jbmagic, Lathum.

[st.cronin]

Actually I think ntn means he had the item last night, and has to give it away tonight. Thats assuming I understand the order of events, and the description of that item.

[Lathum]

Actually I think ntn means he had the item last night, and has to give it away tonight. Thats assuming I understand the order of events, and the description of that item.

well then he just put a pretty big target on his back...

[Passacaglia]

The item description is hard to follow. It says it must be given away, but not when. So you're saying he got it at the end of night actions, then has to give it away tonight? When does he get to use it? Tonight?

I'm not sure if he put a target on his back -- in fact, he's less likely to be eaten now, since he has the leaf (assuming the leaf works for him tonight).

[Lathum]

I read it that he started the game with the leaf and will have to give it away tonight

[Passacaglia]

I read it that he started the game with the leaf and will have to give it away tonight

Why tonight?

[ntndeacon]

Cronin is correct that I was given it from the get go. I have yet to decide what to do with it this evening however.

[st.cronin]

The item description is hard to follow. It says it must be given away, but not when. So you're saying he got it at the end of night actions, then has to give it away tonight? When does he get to use it? Tonight?

I'm not sure if he put a target on his back -- in fact, he's less likely to be eaten now, since he has the leaf (assuming the leaf works for him tonight).

I read it that he was given the leaf last night, and has to give it away today. So somebody passed it to him yesterday, and he was protected from wolf attack last night, and today he has to give it to somebody else. I suppose ntn can clear it up, but I don't think he should.

[ntndeacon]

Actually you dont have to give it away, but if you don't it will be randomly assigned to another player

[Barkeep49]

Just to clarify:
You always have a chance to "use" an item before losing it. So, for instance, the if you're given a wolfbane leaf you use it that night and need to give it away the next. On the other hand if you randomly receive an item then you didn't have a chance to use it that night and get to use it the following night. PMs stated if you were given or received items. If you have any confusion over your own items I'm happy to clarify via PM.

[Passacaglia]

Ah, so if you're given the wolfsbane leaf, you were protected last night, and you get to choose who is protected the next night? That changes my perception of it. Thanks for the clarification.

[Lathum]

Why tonight?

I was under the ompression you could only keep it one day so he would lose it if he didn't use it last night.

The wording in the description is a little confusing

[Lathum]

dola- I have to go. I have a feeling there wil be alot of action when Ardent checks in but for now I see no reason to switch my vote. Hopefully I am home before the deadline.

[LoneStarGirl]

Barkeep I pm'd you. Message me back!

[Barkeep49]

Barkeep I pm'd you. Message me back!
Reply sent.

[Barkeep49]

Ah, so if you're given the wolfsbane leaf, you were protected last night, and you get to choose who is protected the next night? That changes my perception of it. Thanks for the clarification.
That is correct.

[st.cronin]

I'm heading out soon, slim chance I'll be back before deadline.

[hoopsguy]

I've been waiting for Ardent to arrive and give us some accounting of his Night 1, but don't want to drop a vote on Cronin after he is gone. Cronin, between your story and Path's I'm going to side with his because it is easier to believe. I'm not always "Mr. Occam's Razor" but at face value his story is more plausible than yours. I have to connect a few fairly remote circumstances for Path (experienced player) to be setting you up with his play today.

VOTE ST.CRONIN

[st.cronin]

I understand, hoops. I don't have anything else to give you, wish I did. My vote stays on path.

[Barkeep49]

Vote count:

3 Ardent – path (191), alan (204), Lathum (257)
1 Path – st.cronin(223)
2 Cronin – ntn (294), hoops (279)

[LoneStarGirl]

I really hope that Ardent isn't MIA today.... GE and I are going to happy hour and will be back to vote in the next 2-3 hours. Hopefully AE shows his face before then

[Poli]

Well, I had a one time scan, used it on ardent, and he came up villager.

So I'm probably going to be picking from GE, Render, Alan, and LSG, unless something else comes up.
Oh, if you only knew. Welcome to my circle of trust.

[Poli]

Really? What item did you use on Ardent?

I ask because I used the wolf scanner on him last night, and he came up wolf. I chose him for two reasons -- I have a hard time reading him, and he voted for DT.

VOTE ARDENT
Oh now, this is going to be seriously awesome.

[Passacaglia]

ooh, the fun begins!

[Poli]

I'll respond why when I finish reading, 50 or so posts. Man, I love me a good game.

[Poli]

Someone is busted...

Just not sure who yet.
I'll give you a hint. It's cronin.

[Poli]

c'mon ardent. Your on the clock
Sorry, was at SIU-Edwardsville all day working on air handling units. Well, sort of working. I love my job...but not often on the net when I'm in the field.

[Poli]

Only way I can see that all three of us are good is if Identity Switch, or something else, gives a bad view. For example, if somebody used Identity Switch on path, then maybe his scan gets reversed? That's not in the rules, but I can see it as a possibility.
Ding ding ding. I'm a winner and you're the loser, pal. Buy me a hat, wolf.

I had the ident switch and switched with you.

[Passacaglia]

Ding ding ding. I'm a winner and you're the loser, pal. Buy me a hat, wolf.

I had the ident switch and switched with you.

Then why did path find that you were a wolf?

[Passacaglia]

And if cronin is a wolf, why did he need to scan you?

[Poli]

VOTE CRONIN.

[Poli]

And if cronin is a wolf, why did he need to scan you?
Too easy. Gain trust. I doubt he even scanned me. He's a wolf, he knows I'm a villager. He had no idea that path would scan me as well.

Since I traded idents with cronin, path's scan of me came back a wolf. I love this game.

[Poli]

The only way I think this could be fubar is if path is indeed the one lieing. Since he came out second, I kind of doubt it.

[Poli]

And as I think about it, I highly doubt a wolf would come out and pin someone else as a wolf...like path did with me.

[Poli]

I've got softball late tonight. I wonder if it's going to be rained out.

[Poli]

This could get ugly. I think we can safely assume cronin will switch his vote from path to me.

If I die tonight, please vote cronin and not path tomorrow.

If cronin is clean, then please kill path next. Do this in rememberance of me.

[Poli]

Good news. Rainout.

[saldana]

this is getting ridiculous now....

cronin claims he used the wolf scanner on ardent, and the scan came up clean

ardent says he switched identities with cronin (an unreal coincidence, btw), and therefore Path's scan of ardent came up wolf.

i guess now i have to decide if i think all of these coincidences are actually possible...logic tells me they are not, but since this is werewolf, we all know logic doesnt generally apply

[saldana]

i gotta run out for some food, but i will be back...

vote cronin

[path12]

I'll give you a hint. It's cronin.

Wouldn't really expect you to say differently.

[path12]

Too easy. Gain trust. I doubt he even scanned me. He's a wolf, he knows I'm a villager. He had no idea that path would scan me as well.

Since I traded idents with cronin, path's scan of me came back a wolf. I love this game.


OK, I see more where you're getting at now. Why did you pick Cronin to switch identities with?

[saldana]

btw, anyone know what time the deadline is?

[path12]

I think it's 10:30 eastern still.

[Poli]

use the force, luke. one of the 3 of us are lieing.

[Poli]

OK, I see more where you're getting at now. Why did you pick Cronin to switch identities with?
That's an easy one. Cronin kept hinting that I was bad, okay not hinting, saying. I figured if the wolves tried to attack me, he'd be a goner.

I also figured if someone scanned me, I'd at least know what cronin was.

I was slightly disappointed to see CR die instead of cronin.

[path12]

use the force, luke. one of the 3 of us are lieing.

I know that. I didn't consider the identity switch. I'm trying to decide whether to believe you or not.

So why did you decide to switch ID last night with Cronin?

[path12]

Dola, nevermind. Typing while you had posted.

[Poli]

I know that. I didn't consider the identity switch. I'm trying to decide whether to believe you or not.

So why did you decide to switch ID last night with Cronin?
No problem. That was intended for saldana, btw. My brother showed up just as I tried to send it. He's trying to download some song off of torrentz or something. Mary J Blige Don't Break My Heart or some junk. He can't find it. It's great.

[path12]

Ardent, did you get any messages from last night?

[Poli]

I was told I got the charm initially, then another message saying I didn't. The only messages I got were those.

[Poli]

Now that I think of it, that could mean cronin actually got the charm.

[path12]

Identity Switch – Causes the player using to switch identities with another player for the night. The player whose identity has been switched will not know of the switch. If used no other item may be used that night or the following night. If it has not been used after 2 nights it will be given to another player randomly. This item leaves the game after being used.

Wolf Scanner – Is used to scan if another player is a wolf. That player will know if they are scanned. If not used on a night it will be given randomly to another player. Once it has been used it will leave the game.

Posted for reference.

So I'm just wondering. If I go with the premise that Ardent used the ID switch then:

Cronin gets the message he was scanned? Or gets the message that Ardent was scanned? But if that is the case then why would Cronin (who did come out against Ardent yesterday evening) all of sudden decide to clear him publicly?

[Poli]

Well, I didn't get anything like that.

[Chief Rum]

The scream shot out across the city like an arrow. People leave their houses to try and find what the commotion is and finally it is found:

Chief Rum has been killed by the wolves. You have now lost two citizens. Are you any closer to finding the wolves? Hopefully the answer will be yes after today.

I rushed home for this?!? Bah! You all can bite me (and some of you already have). :D

Good luck, villagers!

[Passacaglia]

Well, I didn't get anything like that.

You didn't receive knowledge that you were scanned? Another wrinkle.

[LoneStarGirl]

hmmm I dont have much time to wait around for everybody else to come and voice their opinions but right now it looks like cronin vs AE. And nothing against AE but Cronin is a much better wolf. Plus I really do buy the whole idea that Cronin said he scanned Ardent to gain trust. When reality Cronin is a wolf and would know Ardent isn't, therefore getting in his circle of trust.

vote cronin

[Poli]

You didn't receive knowledge that you were scanned? Another wrinkle.
Yep, kinda weird.

[Passacaglia]

Well, even though that's weird, I'm still going to put in a vote for cronin.

VOTE ST.CRONIN

[Poli]

Good call, pass.

[Poli]

Only thing I can think of is that cronin believes he was somehow scanned as a villager.

[saldana]

anyone got a vote count

[st.cronin]

Well, boy.

unvote path12
vote ardent

Ardent is lying. I know I'm a villager, I scanned ardent, and got a villager read. I don't know what's up with path, and ardent's story makes no sense to me.

[Poli]

I am not lieing. Sorry.

[Poli]

Vote count:

3 Ardent – path (191), alan (204), Lathum (257)
1 Path – st.cronin(223)
2 Cronin – ntn (294), hoops (279)

4 votes since for cronin.

1 vote to me, moved from path.

[saldana]

so its cronin 6, ardent 4, with 3 votes missing.

[Poli]

yeah, think so.

Me, you, pass, LSG voted cronin.

[saldana]

yeah, think so.

Me, you, pass, LSG voted cronin.

and render, ntn, and GE are the ones missing

[Poli]

I saw GE earlier, guess he didn't know what to think of all this.

[st.cronin]

I don't believe I was scanned, ftr. Think about it: If I was a wolf, and I thought I got scanned, wouldn't I come out calling somebody a wolf? How can you make my play make sense if I'm a wolf?

[st.cronin]

I'll be honest, I don't know what to make of all this either.

[Poli]

What I know:

1. I swapped with you.

2. You say you scanned me. I'm good.

3. Path says he scanned me. I'm bad.

One of you is wrong. I'm thinking it's you because I switched with you.

[Alan T]

Just got back from the movies and skimmed through but think I read enough to have a decent understanding of what was going on. We actually got to the movies late, so didnt get to see the movie she wanted to see (Knocked up), so we ended up going with her next pick (Evan Almighty) instead of the ones I wanted to see... I want my 2 hours back now...

Anyways, someone correct me please if I am wrong.. the way things happened since I was gone..

Ardent comes explains he did the identity switch, blasts cronin, people move around votes and its now 6-4 Cronin with 3 people left to vote?

I still don't know if I believe Ardent one bit, and wonder if this is a way to try to save him now. Either way its now Cronin vs Ardent vs Path? With path saying Cronin and Ardent is bad, Cronin saying Path is bad and now Ardent is bad? And Ardent saying path is good and cronin is bad...

I think in light of what all happened while I was gone gives me enough to move my vote

Unvote Ardent
Vote cronin

However I still don't think I trust Ardent, I don't understand why Cronin comes out the way he did about Ardent in this current scenerio if Ardent is good. Or am I missing something?

Going back through to reread again to make sure I didn't misread stuff.

[Alan T]

Ardent, what charm are you talking about that you said you got then didn't get?

[Poli]

I got a PM saying I received the charm of persuasion (or whatever it is). I thought, wow, someone just hooked me up. I then had a PM later in the day stating I didn't actually get it.

I say "later", when in reality I got them both at the same time, which was right about the time I got here this afternoon.

[Alan T]

I got a PM saying I received the charm of persuasion (or whatever it is). I thought, wow, someone just hooked me up. I then had a PM later in the day stating I didn't actually get it.

I say "later", when in reality I got them both at the same time, which was right about the time I got here this afternoon.

Hmm..

DT had a Charm of persuasion and a crystal ball yesterday when he died. My understanding is that goes to someone who voted for DT yesterday randomly.

So I think I am still not certain on all of the scenerios here..

1) Cronin good, Ardent good, Path good - I really don't see any way this is possible now. Someone in this group has to be bad.

2) Cronin bad, Ardent good, Path good - If this is true, why would cronin come out right away saying Ardent was good. Ardent says he ID switched with cronin and that explains why Path got a wolf read on ardent.

3) Cronin good, Ardent good, Path bad - Cronin and Ardent both are good and Cronin's scan of Ardent would show up as it did. If this is true, why does Path come out and lie about his scan of Ardent out of the blue? What would he as a wolf have to gain from this? And furthermore, why doesnt Ardent get notification from either of the scans? The rules say he should have...

4) Cronin good, Ardent bad, Path good - I don't see how this is possible now with what Ardent told us. I think either path or cronin have to be bad now.

5) Cronin bad, Ardent good, Path bad - I guess this is possible, but why on earth would Path come out to dispute cronin's claim if they both were on the same team. makes zero sense to me at all.

6) Cronin bad, Ardent bad, Path bad - Just like #5, I would never understand this move at all. Would seem like an incredibly silly way to try to gain trust for one person by risking 2 others. Unless they just were all bored by the normal wolf game so wanted to make it interesting.

7) Cronin bad, Ardent bad, Path good - Same thing as #2 with the exception that after seeing things going down hill with a wolf - wolf run off today Ardent comes up with a new story to try to create distance between him and Cronin so whichever dies the other will be a bit more trusted. My problem with this scenerio is that if Ardent is lynched first, ends up bad, then Cronin has explaining to do anyhows and it doesnt buy him much.

So looking at all possibilities, I still only see #2, #3 or #7 as the real strong possibilities. IN the 3 cases Cronin is bad in 2/3, Ardent 1/3 and Path 1/3, which is the main reason I moved my vote. If Cronin ends up being bad and Ardent is good, then I really would love after the game this to be explained to what the motivation behind today's move was. Just seemed too risky for so little possible trust gained even if it went off foolproof.

[GoldenEagle]

Letting everyone know I am here and checking in. I will be catching up now.

[Poli]

My only guess is what I explained before. He, being a wolf, would know I "should" come up as a villager.

What I'd like to hear, after the game, is what the wolves thought when path claimed I was a wolf. I bet that was entertaining.

[Poli]

Might explain how cronin came up with my explanation. He was probably scratching his head about how this came unwound.

[Poli]

Triple dola: Happy birthday, GE!

[Lathum]

I just got home and without reading the whole thread it looks like Cronin is going down. I am gonna switch votes so the chance of an item falling into the hands of a wolf decreases.

any objections?

UNVOTE ARDENT
VOTE ST> CRONIN

[Poli]

Hmm..

DT had a Charm of persuasion and a crystal ball yesterday when he died. My understanding is that goes to someone who voted for DT yesterday randomly.

So I think I am still not certain on all of the scenerios here..

1) Cronin good, Ardent good, Path good - I really don't see any way this is possible now. Someone in this group has to be bad.

2) Cronin bad, Ardent good, Path good - If this is true, why would cronin come out right away saying Ardent was good. Ardent says he ID switched with cronin and that explains why Path got a wolf read on ardent.

3) Cronin good, Ardent good, Path bad - Cronin and Ardent both are good and Cronin's scan of Ardent would show up as it did. If this is true, why does Path come out and lie about his scan of Ardent out of the blue? What would he as a wolf have to gain from this? And furthermore, why doesnt Ardent get notification from either of the scans? The rules say he should have...

4) Cronin good, Ardent bad, Path good - I don't see how this is possible now with what Ardent told us. I think either path or cronin have to be bad now.

5) Cronin bad, Ardent good, Path bad - I guess this is possible, but why on earth would Path come out to dispute cronin's claim if they both were on the same team. makes zero sense to me at all.

6) Cronin bad, Ardent bad, Path bad - Just like #5, I would never understand this move at all. Would seem like an incredibly silly way to try to gain trust for one person by risking 2 others. Unless they just were all bored by the normal wolf game so wanted to make it interesting.

7) Cronin bad, Ardent bad, Path good - Same thing as #2 with the exception that after seeing things going down hill with a wolf - wolf run off today Ardent comes up with a new story to try to create distance between him and Cronin so whichever dies the other will be a bit more trusted. My problem with this scenerio is that if Ardent is lynched first, ends up bad, then Cronin has explaining to do anyhows and it doesnt buy him much.

So looking at all possibilities, I still only see #2, #3 or #7 as the real strong possibilities. IN the 3 cases Cronin is bad in 2/3, Ardent 1/3 and Path 1/3, which is the main reason I moved my vote. If Cronin ends up being bad and Ardent is good, then I really would love after the game this to be explained to what the motivation behind today's move was. Just seemed too risky for so little possible trust gained even if it went off foolproof.


I don't want anyone thinking I tried to hide this. I think it's most likely 2, doubtful 3, and no way 7.

[GoldenEagle]

Thanks AE.

I hate that i could only scan this thread. But work + birthday = bad combination for playing WW. I got to admit, I am confused by all of this. But, I guess I will vote st. cronin for now and just see what happens. My mind is still processing all of the information.

VOTE ST.CRONIN

[Barkeep49]

Here's what I've got:
2 Ardent – path (191), cronin (323)
9 Cronin – ntn (294), hoops (279), ardent (292), saldana (300), LSG (317), pass (319), alan (333), lathum (341), GE (343)

No vote: Render & Swaggs

[Poli]

If cronin's a wolf, it's celebration time.

[Alan T]

I think it would be really smart if people have the ability to check out Ardent tonight. If Cronin is bad, then I still don't trust him here. If Cronin is good then I think we have to assume that Path is bad, but it doesnt necessarily mean Ardent is bad..

If that makes sense, it did in my head at least

[Poli]

I'm betting we're about to have a wolf bbq. Who brought the sauce?

[Poli]

I think it would be really smart if people have the ability to check out Ardent tonight. If Cronin is bad, then I still don't trust him here. If Cronin is good then I think we have to assume that Path is bad, but it doesnt necessarily mean Ardent is bad..

If that makes sense, it did in my head at least
If cronin is bad, be my guest. At least we get a wolf in the trade. :)

[Poli]

I'm just a wee bit giddy that I may have helped get a wolf. To think, I wasn't sure if using the ident switch would help. I figured, heck if they come after me on the first day again at least I get a giggle out of it.

Maybe we got a wolf instead! Bonus!

[st.cronin]

boooooooo

[Barkeep49]

If yesterday was about uncertainty, today was about confusion. Magic is what can be counted on in this village. It does its work and does it without fail. And yet there are competing claims about magic today. But then perhaps it is the people who cannot be counted on rather than the magic.

Today the target is cronin, after the day revolves around him and path and ardent. Three people with three somewhat competing claims. The mob springs into action and cronin is soon attacked. However, the battle is fierce and several of the citizens sustain injuries in the attack. Finally, he is subdued. The ferocity and viciousness with which cronin fought can only mean one thing: He was a wolf.

A sigh of relief is felt. One part of your dastardly duty is done.

Vote count:
2 Ardent – path (191), cronin (323)
9 Cronin – ntn (294), hoops (279), ardent (292), saldana (300), LSG (317), pass (319), alan (333), lathum (341), GE (343)

[Poli]

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Poli]

WOOOOOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Poli]

Where's my hat, wolf!

[Poli]

YAHOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[LoneStarGirl]

AE I am glad this worked out for you. But whoever else has the wolf scanner needs to scan path tonight

[saldana]

you happy or something, ardent?

[Poli]

I have to say, I'm pretty suspicious of ardent right now.
:p :p :p :p

[Lathum]

nice work AE

[Alan T]

AE I am glad this worked out for you. But whoever else has the wolf scanner needs to scan path tonight

I personally think Ardent is the better choice of the two.

[Poli]

Just a wee bit happy. Thanks guys, but it was more luck than anything. He was throwing suspicion my way after my vote, so he became my target.

[Poli]

If it helps, have at it. My understanding is that the ident switch left the game after I used it.

I may be the target of a revenge kill, though, after that celebration. :)

[Poli]

There is one way to prove I wasn't lieing. Noone disputed my claim that I used the ident switch...by that I mean noone came out and said I couldn't have used it because they had the item.

[Lathum]

There is one way to prove I wasn't lieing. Noone disputed my claim that I used the ident switch...by that I mean noone came out and said I couldn't have used it because they had the item.

unless I am wrong there can be more then one item in the game

[Poli]

Doh, I thought I might have the only one since it was removed from the game.

[RendeR]

I apologize for not getting my vote in folks. My tennis match went into tie-breakers tonight. Our team lost overall 3 matches to 2 but at least I was one of our mach wins!

Good job on nabbing Cronin, one wolf down, who knows how many to go!

[Swaggs]

Apologies for missing the vote.

I was supposed to be home at 7:30, but just got home a few minutes ago.

I hate missing votes. :(

[hoopsguy]

I think Cronin made enough comments between yesterday and the early part of today that we should have material to pick apart. If tomorrow is slow at the office like I expect, then I'll see if I can do some of that digging. Assuming, of course, that I'm left alone this evening ... if I'm not then I would highly encourage someone else to pick up that particular torch.

[Passacaglia]

Where's my hat, wolf!

Sorry, but I'm the one who ended up with his charm of persuasion. Maybe you got something else.

[path12]

Yay! I had started to wonder if there was some sort of failure rate on the wolf scanner. Bad luck combo of my scan and Ardents ID switch for Cronin.

[path12]

I had a PM last night saying I had received an item that ended up being a error too FWIW.

[Passacaglia]

I had a PM last night saying I had received an item that ended up being a error too FWIW.

That's weird. Last time it kinda made sense, but you voted for cronin, right? So you could have been the one to get the charm.

[Barkeep49]

Working on night results now.

[Alan T]

Got my night PM in, nothing overly exciting in it. Received a new item in, but as best I can tell my old item received no usage. I guess it doesn't hurt to say what my item is that I have now. I had a Wolfbane necklace the last two nights which protected me from attack. I can't keep it tonight which makes me vulnerable I suppose tonight but the good news is I get to choose who to pass it to.

I'm not going to go into alot of discussion of who I will pass it to as I am worried of someone using the item inteceptor to get it. I'll be trying to work out which group of people I trust the most to hand it off to during the day today, but I won't state whom. Only I and that person will know.

[Barkeep49]

After the wolf grillin ceases people go to bed in that blissful state of tired euphoria. Alas it does not last long as there is a chorus of horrors. When the commotion settles it is learned that both Pass and Hoops have felt the savage claw of the wolf and are no longer alive.

[Passacaglia]

&$$#&^$&^$

[Poli]

oh my...oh, man.

[hoopsguy]

Bummer. Good luck to the villagers the rest of the way.

[Poli]

I'm in an absence of information today, fellas. I received an item, but that's it.

[Alan T]

My suspect/trust list hasn't changed really since yesterday evening, so I'm going to wait to see what others have info on before I go with anything today. If completely without new info, I'll probably push one of the people I distrust the most.

I think what would be helpful is for us to continue what Hoopsguy was trying to do yesterday. I think by people reporting how they used items it would be very helpful in trying to trap a wolf. Yesterday Cronin got nailed trying to come up with a fake story to build trust, and I guess only time will tell if Ardent was in on it or not.

I'm not asking for people to talk about items that they have but havent used yet or any such. I do think if people had Scanners or other items that can help us build a CoT better then its worthwhile to come out with the information. This game is different than most games in that the seer is temporary and tied to the item, so telling us your good seer scan doesn't put you at any more risk than normal, and can help open up things for us. It worked to catch Cronin yesterday, so we should try it out again today I think.

1. Alan T - Has Wolfbane necklace, no report of wolf attacks to have fought off. Received new item
3. Lathum
5. path
6. Lonestargirl
8. Render
9. saldana
12. ardent enthusiast - Received new item, no item usage or anything else to tell us.
13. Swaggs
14. ntndeacon
15. Golden Eagle

[LoneStarGirl]

Well all i have right now is an item destroyer.
I had a wolf scanner night one and didn't use it (i forgot it left me if i didn't)
I recieved a wolfbane necklace this morning and 10 minutes later Barkeep took it away from me.

So all I have is the destroyer and I dont know what to do with it

[LoneStarGirl]

I would like to know whoever had the wolf scanner last night what they did with it... I am flying to houston in about 4 hours and I really dont know if i will have time to vote tonight at my aunt's house. I am going to put in a vote right now for ntndeacon to see if that will get him talking... although swaggs might be a good choice to look at today too

vote ntndeacon

[LoneStarGirl]

Ardent and alant, I see you both online...what do you think about ntn or swaggs?

[Alan T]

I dont understand what is going on with people getting items then not having items... Can someone explain that to me? Ardent first said he got some charm, then didn't have a charm. I asked him about it, and as far as i know, Ardent never responded to my question. I assumed from that that Ardent was either bad and messing with us, or good and somehow his identity switch complicated the item receiving process.

Then Pass also said something about getting an item then not having an item, and we know Pass is good, but he didn't really elaborate too much on that. Now LSG is commenting on it... How do you have it taken away? is it a GM mistake that you had it in the first place (ie: we should ignore the mention of it), or is it some game mechanic causing this? (ie: the item interceptor)

[LoneStarGirl]

Also, you know what I just thought of... could cronin and path have set up the whole wolf scanner incident last night so we would think Path was a good guy? That is right up st.cronin's ally I believe

[LoneStarGirl]

I really think it is the game mechanic causing it. I highly doubt Barkeep is making that many mistakes

[Alan T]

Ardent and alant, I see you both online...what do you think about ntn or swaggs?

Swaggs and Render both showed up real fast after the wolf lynch yesterday, which made me have a bit of suspicion about that action. Part of me wondered if I hadn't moved my vote and it had stayed close, if they would have showed up in time to have saved Cronin. Part of me still is deadset on believing that Ardent and Cronin are on the same team and yesterday was a big messup at the start, then damage control by Ardent later. If Ardent is indeed a wolf, then I don't really feel Swaggs or Render are a wolf. In a wolf vs wolf run off, the other wolves just pick someone to throw their vote at and write it off as a loss. I don't see Swaggs or Render getting extra attention missing a vote if they are both wolves.

(ie: we saw how adament Cronin was about not wanting to have people vote Ardent yesterday even if it was to sacrifice himself, then once Ardent showed up with his story, the vote moved over to Cronin in a safe enough buffer for Cronin to place his vote on Ardent.)

Now if Ardent was good, then my suspicion of both Swaggs and Render is a bit higher, but I don't necessarily see missing a vote as a wolf strategy and probably won't place much into that.

As for ntndeacon, he's always a hard read for me since he doesn't really say much or put much into the conversation, so difficult to get a read on him. He was one of the early ones to come flat out voting for Cronin whom we know is a wolf now. If Ardent is a wolf too, then I don't think that says much one way or another about ntn. However if Ardent is good, then I feel a bit better about ntn than I did before. Even though Ntn's vote I think at the time didn't put Cronin in the lead, it did at least start the move on him I think

Either way though, I doubt I would vote ntn today at least.

[Poli]

Alan, I did, in fact, answer your question. Would you like me to do it again, or would you like to read on your own?

[Alan T]

Also, you know what I just thought of... could cronin and path have set up the whole wolf scanner incident last night so we would think Path was a good guy? That is right up st.cronin's ally I believe

That was one of my scenerios I outlined yesterday, I just don't see 2 wolves sacrificing one to give the other trust on day 2. Its way too early in the game to do that. Then with ardent's claims later in the day, I felt Either Cronin or Path had to be bad, but likely not both of them (And we now know for sure it was cronin). THe only real question in my mind was which side Ardent was playing with. I'm hoping someone was able to scan him last night at least to give us more information.

[Poli]

Agreed with alan on the last post, it was a little weird, especially knowing how little cronin was around yesterday as well. He's usually all over stuff but disappeared through the day and night.

[Alan T]

Alan, I did, in fact, answer your question. Would you like me to do it again, or would you like to read on your own?


I'll go back and see if i can find it. I remember reading through alot of those posts real fast last night when I got back from the movies. I really wasn't sure if I wanted to make the move I did or not.

[Swaggs]

I don't mind saying what I have now, but I wanted to keep it secret yesterday.

I started the game with the wolfsbane leaf and the psychic link. I used the psychic link the first night, since I did not want to contact a wolf and assume them in my COT. Last night, I attempted to contact hoopsguy and another player (I'll hold off on naming them, on the miniscule chance that I can catch them in a lie if they claim to have it) last night.

[LoneStarGirl]

unvote ntndeacon

I forgot he started the vote on Cronin

I think ardent's giddiness about cronin dying was very real. I will be surprised if he too was a wolf. I need to go ahead and make a vote but I want it to be meaningful so hopefully other people will jump on and put pressure on somebody. There are two wolves left but I dont think Render and Swaggs are stupid enough to get online right after the vote.... that raised too many eyebrows.

[Poli]

I'm going to vote saldana for now, just to see if any discussion ensues.

VOTE SALDANA.

[Alan T]

Alan, I did, in fact, answer your question. Would you like me to do it again, or would you like to read on your own?

Looking back, I don't think I ever asked the next question to you actually which is why I didn't remember an answer for it. Which was what I asked his morning.. not understanding the mechanism for how people get items then lose them like you did there. Instead I got off on a completely different subject trying to figure out the scenerios on who I believed last night.

Well I'm still for a loss if someone else got one of these items that these people said they had then lost... I'd be really interested in seeing how you got them instead of that person.

[LoneStarGirl]

Alant.... what about Saldana and Lathum

[LoneStarGirl]

Ardent we were thinking the same things.... Sal and Lathum are two good players and heat hasn't been put on them yet. I'll jump on Ardent's bandwagon and hope that something comes out of this.

vote saldana

[Poli]

Alan,

According to my PM, around 9:30 central I was told I had received the charm of persuasion. About 5 hours later I received another PM stating that there was a correction, I never had the charm of persuasion.

These PMs arrived at the same time to me, when I got home around, I guess 4ish after work.

[Alan T]

Alan,

According to my PM, around 9:30 central I was told I had received the charm of persuasion. About 5 hours later I received another PM stating that there was a correction, I never had the charm of persuasion.

These PMs arrived at the same time to me, when I got home around, I guess 4ish after work.

Barkeep can you tell us if this should be considered as something that happened within game, or if it was GM error and we should consider Ardent never received a charm message?

[st.cronin]

Pretty sure at least part of it is GM error. I got a message this morning saying I had received an item, later I got a message saying "disregard, you're dead."

[Alan T]

Alant.... what about Saldana and Lathum


Hmmm.. The last few games Saldana has played in (since he had his child), he's been kind of quiet I guess from what I have seen at least. I don't know if I have read anything more into that than normal. I think last game he was actually a bit more vocal than this game and he was a wolf. As for his play yesterday, with everything up in the air, I don't really know that we learned much since the majority of people either didn't vote or voted Cronin. Only people who didn't vote cronin and voted someone else was Cronin and path, and I already spoke about that.

Lathum I feel a bit funny about, maybe it is just the way he is presenting himself. Like I said earlier I don't want to flat out come out and say who I trust the most or distrust the most because I have to decide where to pass my necklace (even though you seem to be doing a good job of trying to get that info out of me which is a bit worrisome to me). If I had to say though, right now Lathum is one of the ones I am getting the weirdest vibe from. I remember yesterday he seemed to have mirrored my vote alot, and I always get suspicious of people who are going along with me too much (or buddying up without buddying up to me so to speak). If I remember right, he did that with his voting. I woudln't say Lathum is my top suspect, but I don't think I have horrible problems placing a vote on him to get him talking today.

[Alan T]

Pretty sure at least part of it is GM error. I got a message this morning saying I had received an item, later I got a message saying "disregard, you're dead."

lol... :)

[Swaggs]

A couple quick observations:

There are at least two wolves left, as we had two kills last night.

At least one wolfsbane leaf (probably more), which as akin to a bodyguard, is out there.

Also, if the are wolf scanner's out there, we need to start letting folks know who they were used on and what the results are. The wolf scanner is equivalent to being seer for the night, without having the worry of revealing your results, as it passes to someone else afterwards.

[path12]

That's weird. Last time it kinda made sense, but you voted for cronin, right? So you could have been the one to get the charm.


No, I didn't end up getting anything after DT died. And it wasn't for the charm, it was for the Crystal Ball.

[Alan T]

I will go ahead and place this vote out here since she has to leave, and I want to do it where she can respond to it and not after she goes.. I haven't really heard enough from other people yet, so this could change, but wanted to confront her with this vote before she goes..

Vote Lonestargirl

My reasoning:

Came out firing at ntndeacon, whom if Ardent is good, really moves up in my eyes, if Ardent is bad, then is still neutral in my eyes. However in LSG's point of view, she has stated she feels ardent is good (which I don't necessarily agree with), however if she feels that way, she should feel better about ntn than voting him first thing.

Also LSG claimed to have a wolf scanner (which Path and Cronin also claimed to have had the same first day), but didnt use it or provide us any info from it.

Finally I made it clear I didn't want to really come out and say who my candidates to receive my protection necklace would be, but in response she's been trying to go down the line asking me about all kinds of people in a way that feels a bit troublesome to me, as in trying to fish who might be protected tonight or who to prevent from getting it.

[Swaggs]

Also, I'm curious to know if anyone has effectively used a wolfsbane leaf. It would be good information to put out, as it would let us know if the wolves have attempted both double-knight kills already.

[Alan T]

Also, I'm curious to know if anyone has effectively used a wolfsbane leaf. It would be good information to put out, as it would let us know if the wolves have attempted both double-knight kills already.

I am assuming that I would have received notification if attacked, so I don't think I was a target of attack on night 1 or I would have been told I fought it off from my necklace.

Right now this is what I have:

1. Alan T - Has Wolfbane necklace, no report of wolf attacks to have fought off. Received new item
3. Lathum
5. path
6. Lonestargirl - Had wolf scanner night 1, didnt use it and lost it. Received Wolfbane necklace then lost it this morning
8. Render
9. saldana
12. ardent enthusiast - Received new item, no item usage or anything else to tell us.
13. Swaggs - Had wolfsbane leaf and psychic link night 1. Tried to contact hoops + someone else last night)
14. ntndeacon
15. Golden Eagle

[Poli]

FWIW, I was told after using the ident switch on the first day that I couldn't use an item on the 2nd.

[path12]

I don't mind saying what I have now, but I wanted to keep it secret yesterday.

I started the game with the wolfsbane leaf and the psychic link. I used the psychic link the first night, since I did not want to contact a wolf and assume them in my COT. Last night, I attempted to contact hoopsguy and another player (I'll hold off on naming them, on the miniscule chance that I can catch them in a lie if they claim to have it) last night.


Swaggs, are you saying you were able to contact two people with the psychic link or that you contacted hoops and gave away the leaf to someone else?

[Barkeep49]

I dont understand what is going on with people getting items then not having items... Can someone explain that to me?

Yes. It is me fixing mistakes.

[path12]

I am assuming that I would have received notification if attacked, so I don't think I was a target of attack on night 1 or I would have been told I fought it off from my necklace.

Right now this is what I have:

1. Alan T - Has Wolfbane necklace, no report of wolf attacks to have fought off. Received new item
3. Lathum
5. path
6. Lonestargirl - Had wolf scanner night 1, didnt use it and lost it. Received Wolfbane necklace then lost it this morning
8. Render
9. saldana
12. ardent enthusiast - Received new item, no item usage or anything else to tell us.
13. Swaggs - Had wolfsbane leaf and psychic link night 1. Tried to contact hoops + someone else last night)
14. ntndeacon
15. Golden Eagle

For me you can say: Used wolf scanner night 1 on Ardent, came up wolf. Started with another unused (as yet) item and received another item last night.

[Barkeep49]

I do think I have the kinks worked out though and should have fewer mistakes moving forward.

[Alan T]

I do think I have the kinks worked out though and should have fewer mistakes moving forward.


No worries, I'm not complaining. I'm having fun in this game. Just trying to sort out what are stories that people are feeding us vs legitimate mistakes is all. No complaints here :)

[Alan T]

Hmm LSG disappeared without responding to my charges against her. :( I hope she comes back before she leaves. Her actions this morning are pretty troubling to me so I wanted some responses for them.

I also would love if anyone could either vouch for or condemn Ardent today. That would help tie up alot for us in regards to how i feel about ntn and swaggs. Render I don't know if it fully ties up my concern about as he had some odd day 1 actions too in addition to yesterday.

[Swaggs]

Swaggs, are you saying you were able to contact two people with the psychic link or that you contacted hoops and gave away the leaf to someone else?

I was able to name two people to try to link with.

[RendeR]

I had a wolfsbane leaf the first night and gave it to a still living player last night, I recieved and item that I have not used as yet.

I did respond fairly quickly after the lynching last night, however its not to be devious but simply thats when I was able tog et online and check things after my tennis amtch last evening.

I find LSG's constant questioning to be very suspicious and I am also pondering the whole Ardent/path situatoin.

For the time being I'm going to follow my instincts and :

VOTE LONESTARGIRL

[Swaggs]

I hope folks don't take me not voting against me. I can understand it as being used to duck a revenge vote early on (when everyone is looking for the slightest reason to vote for someone), but yesterday, we clearly had 2-3 folks to vote for. I was going to vote for cronin early on and then, after Path's reveal that ardent was a wolf, was looking at ardent, but wanted to hear from ardent before making a vote. But, I never got a chance because I got home late.

If I were a wolf, I could have just as easily voted for cronin or (if I was a wolf, especially) voted for AE and then blamed it on path if he came up clean upon the lynch.

[path12]

I'm hoping Ardent was scanned last night also. I got no message that I was.

[Alan T]

Well today has been rather quiet so far, and with complete lack of information to go on. If I count correctly, the vote count is:

Lonestargirl 2
Saldana 2

And several people haven't checked in yet.

[Swaggs]

Well, I'm going to be away from the computer for awhile, so I am going to get a vote in early today. I should be back in time to make a change if someone makes a compelling argument while I am gone.

As of now, I am going to go with Alan on LSG. She did appear to be fishing for name from Alan pretty hard this morning. Could be nothing, but there is little to go on right now.

Vote LSG

[path12]

I'm not sure how I feel about the LSG thing. It didn't seem out of character for her, and it seems a reach to all of a sudden have a rush on someone who really hasn't been much of a focus to date..

I'll have to go back through the last couple days, but I'm slammed on a project right now so it will have to wait until later.

[Alan T]

I am not really suprised that there has been a run on her suddenly due to her disappearing suddenly once I confronted her this morning while she had just been here asking me questions, combined with the complete lack of any other kind of information whatsoever.

Coming into today my thought was to find out information one way or another about Ardent and take it from there even if it meant lynching him. The one thing that is a bit discomforting for me is the two people who hopped on my vote today are once again Swaggs and Render, this time they didn't do it at the same time though. I wonder if there is any real big reason for that though.

So far we havent heard from saldana, ntn, lathum, and Goldeneagle (who has been around, but hasn't posted anything yet) so I am hoping one of them has some information for us.

[ntndeacon]

the thing Iam confused about is how many different Wolf scanners and psychic links and wolfsbane leaves we have runningh out there

[ntndeacon]

Oh I recieved an item as well last night after having my leaf sent randomly to someone.

[ntndeacon]

In her defence LSG did unvote me after your defence of me Alan. So I imagine Iam willing to give her a touch of lea way.

Just so y'all know how I stand with folks
from more trusted to least trusted:

trust a good deal:
path
AE

trust somewhat:
Alan
Render

dont trust or mistrust:
GE
LSG
Lathum

distrust a little:
saldana
Swaggs

[saldana]

Oh I recieved an item as well last night after having my leaf sent randomly to someone.

that would likely be the one i received then, as i got a leaf last night.

[saldana]

ntn and lsg, not sure what exactly it is i am doing to earn your mistrust...perrhaps it that we havent played alot together, but my standard procedure is to keep my mouth shut and watch for the first couple days, hope to live long enough to notice something, and then rip off a list of wolves...it has been a very successful strategy for me in the past....which is why i rarely live very long in these games (i dont think either of you were playing during my streak of day/night 1 exits)

[Alan T]

So far this is what I have for actions:

1. Alan T - Has Wolfbane necklace, no report of wolf attacks to have fought off. Received new item
3. Lathum
5. path - used wolf scanner night 1 on ardent. Started with another yet unused item night 1. Received new item last night
6. Lonestargirl - Had wolf scanner night 1, didnt use it and lost it. Received Wolfbane necklace then lost it this morning
8. Render - wolfbane leaf first night, gave it to someone else last night. Received new item last night.
9. saldana - Received leaf last night
12. ardent enthusiast - Received new item, no item usage or anything else to tell us.
13. Swaggs - Had wolfsbane leaf and psychic link night 1. Tried to contact hoops + someone else last night)
14. ntndeacon - Sent leaf to someone else and received a new item last night.
15. Golden Eagle

So far there is no sign of LSG's wolf scanner from night 1.
If LSG told the truth, then someone else out there got it randomly night 1 to be able to use it last night. .. so either:

1) GE or Lathum got it and havent checked in yet with the information
2) Someone who already checked in got it but didn't say so for some unknown reason
3) LSG is lying about having it at all.

I don't know if this was answered before, but I remember someone asking it.. Can wolves use an item in addition to performing the night kill?

[Lathum]

dola- I just got home and am checking in. I was already gone when the results were posted.

I have a suspect that I will be posting soon. For now I am keeping my item to myself also.

[Alan T]

Ok, so I decided to go back through all of the posts LSG has made to try to see if I am overreacting to today's actions from her and perhaps convincing myself to go in a wrong direction. I'm trying to stay open minded, but going back through everything, I see too many inconsistancies in her story.. I just don't know if I feel strong enough about anyone else at this point.

hmmm so hoopsguy has wolfbane necklace. I must remember that.

I recieved my role. This is going to be a difficult game for me because I am all about action but since it seems most the items are out of the game after they are used I am going to have to wait to use them.

Wish me luck :P

I remember this quote at the time, it wasnt a big deal to me, just thought it was a joke. Still probably is nothing on its own.

Damnit Lathum and render, that was supposed to me my job.

Daddy you brought this on yourself

vote daddytorgo

Just noting she was one of the people who jumped on DT on day 1.

I think Rum needs to explain his non vote tonight... I hate when people miss votes.

Also, we dont HAVE to do anything tonight correct? We can keep our items if we would like and accept others if they are sent to us? I just dont want to screw up like I did last game

This quote is interesting considering Chief died that night, and she makes sure about her starter items to find out what she should do to which barkeep answers her. (ie: if she needs to use the wolf scanner or not that she supposedly had at this point)

Ok like Alant I didn't use my items last night. I felt no reason to. I probably will tonight though.

I am very confused about the Path / Cronin scenario. Both said they used a wolf scanner and both are saying different things about Ardent. It looks like todays vote will come between 3 players then. And it boils down to who we trust the most unless somebody else has information they haven't told us yet...

But honestly I am more inclined to believe Path right... just going off a hunch

Ok here, she states that she did not use any items night 1 but she probably will night 2... Even though today she states she didnt have the item any more and it was taken away night 1 for not being used?

I dont think Ardent should get lynched for this either. I am curious to read what he has to say about all of this. I would feel better lynching cronin.... but I dont know if his lynch will tell us anything. I honestly doubt a wolf would clear a wolf on the second day. And hoops says he has a scenario in mind in which what happened is plausible. So I definitely am going to wait to give my vote.

Here is the first of a trend where she was the first to jump behind Ardent full force (other than the few hours Cronin did at the start of yesterday). Seemingly without any reason she really pushes anyone other than Ardent over the series of a few posts.

hmmm I dont have much time to wait around for everybody else to come and voice their opinions but right now it looks like cronin vs AE. And nothing against AE but Cronin is a much better wolf. Plus I really do buy the whole idea that Cronin said he scanned Ardent to gain trust. When reality Cronin is a wolf and would know Ardent isn't, therefore getting in his circle of trust.

vote cronin

Same as the last one, backs Ardent even though this post by itself isnt really anything that seems way out there to me.

AE I am glad this worked out for you. But whoever else has the wolf scanner needs to scan path tonight

This one smells weird to me, and I remember responding to it even. After everything yesterday, I think I as well as others made the case why Path seemingly is the most trusted where Ardent is still a big question mark. Yet she tries to point everyone away from Ardent and scan Path, whom I really don't see a way where both Path and Cronin were wolves after yesterday and the obvious scan would be ardent.

Well all i have right now is an item destroyer.
I had a wolf scanner night one and didn't use it (i forgot it left me if i didn't)
I recieved a wolfbane necklace this morning and 10 minutes later Barkeep took it away from me.

So all I have is the destroyer and I dont know what to do with it

So here is a different story about night 1 where she now says she had a third wolf scanner on night 1 (in addition to Path and Cronin's claim, even though I don't know if we have a way to prove that Cronin did even have one at this point) So if she had lost it after night 1, she wouldn't have said on day 2 that she still had it.

I would like to know whoever had the wolf scanner last night what they did with it... I am flying to houston in about 4 hours and I really dont know if i will have time to vote tonight at my aunt's house. I am going to put in a vote right now for ntndeacon to see if that will get him talking... although swaggs might be a good choice to look at today too

vote ntndeacon

Here coming out at ntn, whom I already explained why I felt this was off. If you trust Ardent like she does, then ntn would be the person who you would put support behind not try to lynch.

Ardent and alant, I see you both online...what do you think about ntn or swaggs?

Here is where she starts digging for info about people for an unknown reason after I stated that I didn't want to be too open on who I trust the most today in order to try to be mysterious about where my necklace goes to keep the wolves guessing.

Also, you know what I just thought of... could cronin and path have set up the whole wolf scanner incident last night so we would think Path was a good guy? That is right up st.cronin's ally I believe

Here once again trying to frame Path in a bad light which to me just doesn't seem likely at all and quite a reach.

unvote ntndeacon

I forgot he started the vote on Cronin

I think ardent's giddiness about cronin dying was very real. I will be surprised if he too was a wolf. I need to go ahead and make a vote but I want it to be meaningful so hopefully other people will jump on and put pressure on somebody. There are two wolves left but I dont think Render and Swaggs are stupid enough to get online right after the vote.... that raised too many eyebrows.

Her changing her vote after I explained why I didnt understand it from her point of view at all.

Alant.... what about Saldana and Lathum

Asking me for my thoughts of more people.

Ardent we were thinking the same things.... Sal and Lathum are two good players and heat hasn't been put on them yet. I'll jump on Ardent's bandwagon and hope that something comes out of this.

vote saldana


And finally once again joining in with Ardent on a pick with whatever unknown Trust I do not know.

[Lathum]

OK, I am suspiscous of Render right now.

Missing the vote to me wasn't that big a deal , we all have lives. There are a couple of things that stand out to me.

1. He played very differently last game. He was joking around alot last game and this game has been alot quieter and buisness like.

2. Was the second vote day 1 on DT, like that theory or not he was. Swaggs then pointed out he over the top tried to defend himself.

3. He jumped on LSG right after AlanT did. This vote also tied it up and took pressure off Saldana which could give us a link. If Render is a wolf it is concievable Saldana is also.


VOTE RENDER

I'll be out until close to the deadline but if new info comes out I'll change my vote if needed.

[Lathum]

dola- He also voted for her AFTER Alan pointed out she may be gone for the day...

[Poli]

I find it somewhat hilarious from my end that I'm not trusted. I can somewhat understand it, I mean, Path did point at me and say I was bad. Couldn't I have simply pointed at someone else, say any villager (assuming I'm a wolf, I'd know which are which)say I ident switched with that villager, and bought both cronin and myself a day?

I understand where you might question me still, but it's kind of frustrating...it's like I feel that some of our biggest thinkers are either in on the wolf thing or not thinking it all the way through.

[Poli]

That's a good point about Render as well, Lathum.

[Lathum]

I find it somewhat hilarious from my end that I'm not trusted. I can somewhat understand it, I mean, Path did point at me and say I was bad. Couldn't I have simply pointed at someone else, say any villager (assuming I'm a wolf, I'd know which are which)say I ident switched with that villager, and bought both cronin and myself a day?

I understand where you might question me still, but it's kind of frustrating...it's like I feel that some of our biggest thinkers are either in on the wolf thing or not thinking it all the way through.

FWIW Ardent I trust you as much as I can. I find it hard to believe that of the 3 players involved yesterday ( all 3 great players) 2 would be wolves. Plus there were 2 kills last night so I would assume you couldn't be converted.

The kicker is the dynamics of this game make it hard to fully trust someone elses word as gospel.

[path12]

OK, I am suspiscous of Render right now.

1. He played very differently last game. He was joking around alot last game and this game has been alot quieter and buisness like.

I didn't follow the last game very closely, but didn't he get a lot of pressure last game? That would certainly explain being quieter now.

[path12]

Here is where she starts digging for info about people for an unknown reason after I stated that I didn't want to be too open on who I trust the most today in order to try to be mysterious about where my necklace goes to keep the wolves guessing.

Alan, I just want to tell you that if you are giving your necklace away today that I don't need it.

I'm not sure I come to the same conclusion as you do here, but I can see why you did. Without remembering the order of votes, I think her Cronin vote is a point in her favor, unless it was after there was no doubt.

[Poli]

I think she helped put him away.

[ntndeacon]

Vote count:
2 Ardent – path (191), cronin (323)
9 Cronin – ntn (294), hoops (279), ardent (292), saldana (300), LSG (317), pass (319), alan (333), lathum (341), GE (343)

since someone was aking about order of voting I thought I would bring this up here.

[ntndeacon]

I dont think her vote on cronin tells us anything
remember AE shared his Identity switching thing around post 184-189 So I would not give her too much credit for that.

[saldana]

OK, I am suspiscous of Render right now.

Missing the vote to me wasn't that big a deal , we all have lives. There are a couple of things that stand out to me.

1. He played very differently last game. He was joking around alot last game and this game has been alot quieter and buisness like.

2. Was the second vote day 1 on DT, like that theory or not he was. Swaggs then pointed out he over the top tried to defend himself.

3. He jumped on LSG right after AlanT did. This vote also tied it up and took pressure off Saldana which could give us a link. If Render is a wolf it is concievable Saldana is also.


VOTE RENDER

I'll be out until close to the deadline but if new info comes out I'll change my vote if needed.

i noticed his change in behavior too...and he was acting bizzare in that game way before he took any heat at all...he was barely posting, much like this game, but when he did, there was an air of relaxation to it...he turned up as a villager...i did think maybe the change was because the goofiness got him lynched, but i also thought his defense was a bit strong.

still not sure where i want to go yet, but i am leaning towards render...i guess most of it will depend on whether i need to go with a self preservation vote.

[ntndeacon]

I tend to agree with Alan's reasoning more than Lathum's here, so....
Vote LSG

[path12]

I dont think her vote on cronin tells us anything
remember AE shared his Identity switching thing around post 184-189 So I would not give her too much credit for that.

Actually, it was posts 284-289.

Her vote made it a 2 vote margin. There was much more piling on after that, so while I don't think that clears her by any stretch, it's not like she just jumped on at the end.

Just for the record, before Ardent checked in the vote was:

Ardent 3, path 1, cronin 2. The votes after Ardent revealed the ID switch went like this:

Ardent votes Cronin. AE 3, P 1, C 3
Saldana votes Cronin. AE 3, P 1, C 4
LSG votes Cronin. AE 3, P 1, C 5
Pass votes Cronin AE 3, P 1, C 6
Cronin switches Ardent AE 4, P 0, C 6
Alan switches Cronin AE 3, C 7
Lathum switches Cronin AE 2, C 8
GE votes Cronin AE 2, C 9

So it was still very much undecided when she voted. I find those last three votes more interesting than LSG's.

Note, I'm not trying to sway anyone or claim that she is good. What I am saying is that I'm looking elsewhere.

[path12]

FWIW, my list would stand like this right this minute, from sorta trust to sorta don't trust.

Ardent
Ntndeacon
Saldana
Render
LSG
GE
Alan
Lathum
Swaggs

[ntndeacon]

Actually, it was posts 284-289.

Her vote made it a 2 vote margin. There was much more piling on after that, so while I don't think that clears her by any stretch, it's not like she just jumped on at the end.

Just for the record, before Ardent checked in the vote was:

Ardent 3, path 1, cronin 2. The votes after Ardent revealed the ID switch went like this:

Ardent votes Cronin. AE 3, P 1, C 3
Saldana votes Cronin. AE 3, P 1, C 4
LSG votes Cronin. AE 3, P 1, C 5
Pass votes Cronin AE 3, P 1, C 6
Cronin switches Ardent AE 4, P 0, C 6
Alan switches Cronin AE 3, C 7
Lathum switches Cronin AE 2, C 8
GE votes Cronin AE 2, C 9

So it was still very much undecided when she voted. I find those last three votes more interesting than LSG's.

Note, I'm not trying to sway anyone or claim that she is good. What I am saying is that I'm looking elsewhere.

I goofed on the post numbers. thanks for the assist there. I did not mean to imply she was piling onto a breakaway vote. I do believe that she saw the writing on the wall. And got in early to not appear suspicious. Assuming you believe AE...and he made a convincing case...then there was going to be a change over to croning by a lot of folks. now obviously there is more than one wolf so I have no problem with other people being looked over strongly.

[RendeR]

As a couple of you have noted I have inded been more reserved this game. Everyone jumped on me for being a goofball in the willy-wonka game, I mean Cmon it was WILLY WONKA =)

But anyway, I find it hard to post anything in defense of one's self in these games that doesn't appear in some way over the top, and thereby, suspicious, the game is all about reading between the lines and all that.

So vote your guts and vote your logic, however you feel you should.

Its a good thing I'm wearing my +5 Elven Plate mail bikini ;)

[path12]

Its a good thing I'm wearing my +5 Elven Plate mail bikini ;)


No pixplzkthx.

[Poli]

Kind of a letdown day with no solid information released today. :(

[saldana]

Kind of a letdown day with no solid information released today. :(

same thing happened last game, but you were too dead to see it...:D ...i think we caught lightening in a bottle yesterday and now we are back to normal early game werewolf, trying to find the next bottle.

[path12]

Everyone has checked in, right? And nobody had a scanner to use last night as LSG suggested someone should?

I think anyone using a scanner/crystal ball should reveal the result. Any info helps us here. I'm concerned we're heading into a villager/villager thing today.

[Alan T]

Everyone has checked in, right? And nobody had a scanner to use last night as LSG suggested someone should?

I think anyone using a scanner/crystal ball should reveal the result. Any info helps us here. I'm concerned we're heading into a villager/villager thing today.

I don't believe that Goldeneagle has checked in. He was here for about an hour or so after LSG left this morning, but never posted anything, so not sure how much he actually has read or if he was just hitting refresh and then away from the computer.

Right now either GE has LSG's Scanner, or someone who already checked in isnt talking about it, or LSG lied.

[Alan T]

Went back through the day's votes. This appears to be the current vote count:

(4) Lonestargirl - Alan (405), Render (416), Swaggs (420), ntndeacon (442)
(2) Saldana - Ardent (394) , Lonestargirl (397)
(1) Render - Lathum (431)

No votes: Path, Saldana, Goldeneagle

[saldana]

might as well get this out there...of course subject to change should i need to save my own ass, seeing as i know that i am a villager

vote render

[path12]

I'm out of the office soon. Going to hold my vote until closer to deadline and see if anything breaks -- not thrilled with the choices but I will vote for one of them as opposed to throwing my vote away.

[ntndeacon]

I am gone for a good long while as well. I dont know if iwill be back in time or not.

[Alan T]

Ok, well evening tv time with the lady, I'll try to check in, but can't promise anything. Looks like not much is happening tonight unfortunatly.

[GoldenEagle]

I can confirm that I have the crystal ball that LSG claimed to have had.

[Poli]

Care to let us know anything else?

[GoldenEagle]

I am leaning toward Render at this time. He jumped on the LSG bandwagon pretty early and perhaps was to protect himself. He is been quiet the whole game and then decides to make a detail post about the way LSG is playing, but early enough to try to avoid suspicion. It seems he is using the classic wolf strategy: get your opinions in early and then fly under the radar.

[GoldenEagle]

Care to let us know anything else?

I used and identity switch last night, since it was set to expire if I did not use it. However, I did not find out anything about that person.

[Poli]

I could go with a render vote.

[Swaggs]

I used and identity switch last night, since it was set to expire if I did not use it. However, I did not find out anything about that person.

Couldn't that be important? Since there were two wolves out there making kills last night, you could presumably eliminate someone from consideration there (assuming there are/were not more than 3 wolves).

[Swaggs]

I'm willing to swap to Render, as well.

I thought he seemed suspicious on day 1, when I voted for him. The fact that DT edged him out in a close vote adds to that.

[GoldenEagle]

Couldn't that be important? Since there were two wolves out there making kills last night, you could presumably eliminate someone from consideration there (assuming there are/were not more than 3 wolves).


Yes, I believe it does. I switched identities with AE last night. He did not go anywhere, so therefore he is in my COT.

[Poli]

Woot, but this may pull me out of it, FWIW.

BTW, I can answer with a little more detail what the ident switch does, because I wanted to make certain I knew.

I asked if that meant I could obtain a "seer" or "wolf" role for a night, like giving me the ability to see if someone was a wolf or deciding on a kill on my own.

I was told no, that was wrong. What it meant was if the wolves came after me, they would instead have killed the person I switched with...in my case, cronin. That would have been funny.

If someone checked what item I had or stuff like that, it would have been cronin's item instead of mine as well.

[Poli]

GE, I wasn't told cronin went anywhere either, so that actually should not put me in your circle.

[Poli]

Let's gamble.

UNVOTE SALDANA.

VOTE RENDER

[Poli]

BTW, after seeing that LSG post, I'm miffed she thinks cronin's a better wolf than me. I contend I haven't been a wolf in 15 months.

[Alan T]

I can confirm that I have the crystal ball that LSG claimed to have had.

LSG didn't say she had the crystal ball, she said that she had a wolf scanner. I believe you when you say you have a crystal ball, just saying that wasn't the item that we were looking for.

[Alan T]

Time for my better half to watch starter wife, which I have liittle interest in, so I should be around until deadline unless I get side tracked playing Sim city, Civ 4, Eu3 or something like that :)

I see the vote count currently as:

(4) Lonestargirl - Alan (405), Render (416), Swaggs (420), ntndeacon (442)
(3) Render - Lathum (431), Saldana (453), Ardent (467)
(1) Saldana - Lonestargirl (397)

No votes: Path, Goldeneagle

[path12]

I think Swaggs should be looked at tonight.

VOTE RENDER

I think we're villager/villager today.

[RendeR]

Hrm, its probably because this is only my 4th game, but I think I need to learn when NOT to post anything at all.

None of my posts, timing wise, has any relevance to anything that was said prior to them. I simply posted at the times I was able to log in and check the game out with time enough to post. So the timing issue of my posts really is jut me being a newb at the game and not realizing that WHEN I post carries as much weight as what I post.

I acted the fool in the last game, and it aroused suspicion, I tried being laid back and quiet this game, and aroused suspicion, I tried to revert to being funny, and made it worse. How does one win at this again?

I am a plain old villager. I had a wolfsbane leaf the first night and gave it to Ardent the second night in case the wolves tried to retaliate and kill him for snagging cronin. I can't tell as easily from everyone's posts what makes sense or not. Many of you have dozens of games under your belts and you recognize things in others that I don't yet see.

I don't know what to say in my own defense that you all won't simply take as a wolf covering his bikini clad ass =)

I am a villager. I'm pretty well convinced LSG is a wolf based on her interrogation of Alant earlier. It just didn't sound right to me.

What can I offer that will convince those of you voting for me that I am not a wolf?

[RendeR]

I think Swaggs should be looked at tonight.

VOTE RENDER

I think we're villager/villager today.


Not to seem petulant here, but if you really believe this, change your vote?

[saldana]

current votes

(4) Lonestargirl - Alan (405), Render (416), Swaggs (420), ntndeacon (442)
(3) Render - Lathum (431), Saldana (453), Ardent (467), Path (471)
(1) Saldana - Lonestargirl (397)

No votes: Goldeneagle

[Alan T]

current votes

(4) Lonestargirl - Alan (405), Render (416), Swaggs (420), ntndeacon (442)
(4) Render - Lathum (431), Saldana (453), Ardent (467), Path (471)
(1) Saldana - Lonestargirl (397)

No votes: Goldeneagle

You had the right people voting, just the wrong total. I fixed the bolded part.

[saldana]

You had the right people voting, just the wrong total. I fixed the bolded part.

thanks...math never was my strong suit

[Poli]

render just got a kudos in my book.

Unvote render

[Poli]

I am a plain old villager. I had a wolfsbane leaf the first night and gave it to Ardent the second night in case the wolves tried to retaliate and kill him for snagging cronin.
What can I offer that will convince those of you voting for me that I am not a wolf?
That's all I needed to hear. You're on the up and up.

[saldana]

i hope i dont have to make this choice, but the way the charm apparenly works, i will move my vote before the deadline if GE doesnt show again

[saldana]

dola, guess i should hit refresh..

ardent, are you confirming you got the leaf

[Poli]

VOTE LSG

[Poli]

I am confirming it. You'll note I never mentioned exactly what I got, just that I got something today. Render is correct.

[Poli]

No reason to vote LSG, but I have a better feeling of render at this point.

[saldana]

based on ardents info

unvote render
vote LSG

[Lathum]

I'm sorry but AE getting the leaf from Render means nothing to me.

[RendeR]

I'm sorry but AE getting the leaf from Render means nothing to me.


Can I ask what it is that convinces you I am a wolf then?

[Swaggs]

I don't know how I feel about this one.

Part of me thinks that LSG would be here to defend herself if she was a wolf.

[GoldenEagle]

VOTE RENDER

[RendeR]

In LSG's defense she did say she was traveling and might not have access right away at her destination.

Alan pointed out her odd behaviour today, and that really caught me as odd. She seemed to really be mining for information from other players as if she were planning things out for later.

Seems very wolfish to me.

[Alan T]

VOTE RENDER

This was the best post of the last 30 minutes :D

[Poli]

I think I've played against LSG where she didn't defend herself as a wolf in the past.

Lathum, if that doesn't convince you...well, then I'm concerned about you.

[Lathum]

Can I ask what it is that convinces you I am a wolf then?

I pointed out my reasons, after the blow-ups yesterday we are kind of on square one. I just get the vibe from you.

[Poli]

As for LSG, the only reason I'm voting for her at this point is to try and keep render, who proved himself to ME (Lathum).

[Lathum]

I think I've played against LSG where she didn't defend herself as a wolf in the past.

Lathum, if that doesn't convince you...well, then I'm concerned about you.

she said she was traveling and may not be here to defend herself.

[RendeR]

VOTE RENDER

As with Lathum, can I ask why? Because knwoing I am a villager and that I made a very discreet effort to keep another one alive, I have to wonder why the two of you are so set on taking me down? it sort of reeks of wolves trying to take out a mark thats causing them grief....

[Lathum]

As for LSG, the only reason I'm voting for her at this point is to try and keep render, who proved himself to ME (Lathum).

don't you think it would be a wolfy move to pass the most trusted person in the game ( along with path) that item to gain trust down the road?

[RendeR]

This was the best post of the last 30 minutes :D


Well I'm thrilled that YOU think so ;)

[Swaggs]

Well, this should be interesting.

If LSG comes up clean, I will be looking hard at Render tomorrow. If LSG ends up a villager, this will be the second time in two days that Render has avoided the lynch in favor of a villager.

[Poli]

Lathum, good point.

[RendeR]

VERY nice to see 8 players on here right at deadline time!