So what is the most hallowed sports record now?

[MrBug708]

I don't think Wooden's NCAA streak really counts as one, what is anyone's guess on what it is? DiMaggio's hitting streak?

[Oilers9911]

Joe D's 56 gamer.

[Karlifornia]

Barry Bonds streak of consecutive seasons without giving a damn what you assholes think

[DeToxRox]

Barry Bonds streak of consecutive seasons without giving a damn what you assholes think

Your streak of giving ex-girlfriends you love Chylmedia

[Karlifornia]

Your streak of giving ex-girlfriends you love Chylmedia

I stand corrected.

[SackAttack]

I don't think Wooden's NCAA streak really counts as one, what is anyone's guess on what it is? DiMaggio's hitting streak?

511. Nobody'll touch that one. It's safe even from steroids. ;)

[Crapshoot]

Barry Bonds streak of consecutive seasons without giving a damn what you assholes think

"". He broke the record. Deal with it.

[larrymcg421]

511. Nobody'll touch that one. It's safe even from steroids. ;)

316 is even more untouchable, I think.

[CU Tiger]

probably not as hallowed but 1406 will never be touched. (BTW Bonds is #2 among actives)
2539 (bareer BoBs)Bonds also wins this one
Ditto for 7 no hitters.
and 5714 (Ks) seems pretty safe too

[CU Tiger]

316 is even more untouchable, I think.

And just so I can kick myself, what is 316?

[cartman]

Edwin Moses' 9 year, 9 month, 9 day, 197 consecutive finals victory streak in the 400m hurdles.

[cartman]

And just so I can kick myself, what is 316?

The number of losses Cy Young had.

[RendeR]

200 Cup series wins, Richard Petty

Untouchable.

[samifan24]

I'd say either DiMaggio's 56 game hitting streak or Ripken's 2,632 consecutive games played streak.

[Eaglesfan27]

I'd say either DiMaggio's 56 game hitting streak or Ripken's 2,632 consecutive games played streak.

Agreed. Those would be my top 2 now.

[Peregrine]

The most hallowed record isn't just the one that's most unbeatable, if it's some obscure record no one cares about, it just doesn't qualify. I'd go with Ripken's streak, not only will it probably never be broken but he has huge fan support because of it (just look at the crazy turnout for his HoF induction) and it's a record that people can really relate to.

[DaddyTorgo]

755

hasn't been broken. Won't be broken unless/until A-Rod does.

[14ers]

When Babe Ruth hit 59 homers the player in 2nd hit 19. That is more than 3 times the number of homers. I can't imagine any sport where one player is 3 times better than any of his pears.

Today it would be like a pitcher winning 75 games, a batter hitting 170 home runs, a running back rushing for 6,000 yards in a single season, an NBA player averaging 70 points a game, or a spinter running a 4 second 100 yard dash


Babe Ruth's 59 homerun season is to me the greatest feat in sports history. No one I can think of has ever been that much better than all his pears combined.

[RendeR]

...unless/until A-Rod does.



BAHAHWAHAHWHahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhah

A--haahahahwahahwbaahahahahahaha---ROD?!?!?!



BWAHAhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[tanglewood]

But that doesn't mean that Ruth was three times better than any other player at the time, just that he was 3 times better at hitting homers. Not to belittle the feat by any means, Ruth was a phenomenon likely to be unmatched, but not many other hitters at the time based their game soley around trying to hit home runs. There's the famous story about Ty Cobb, to prove what Ruth was doing was easy, deciding one day to shift his hands to the bottom of the bat and swing for the fences and he hit three homers, then another two the next day. Later in his career he was still hitting tremendous numbers but others like Gehrig, Foxx and so on were almost matching him every season. Was Ruth the best baseball player of all-time? Probably. But he wasn't three times more talented than the guys he played with and against. I think he radically altered the strategy of the game by thinking about it a different way, thus thats he stood out so much more than perhaps his talent deserved (terrible word to use, but you know what I mean). Of course he was a hell of a player too, the best ever.

[MrBug708]

When Babe Ruth hit 59 homers the player in 2nd hit 19. That is more than 3 times the number of homers. I can't imagine any sport where one player is 3 times better than any of his pears.

Today it would be like a pitcher winning 75 games, a batter hitting 170 home runs, a running back rushing for 6,000 yards in a single season, an NBA player averaging 70 points a game, or a spinter running a 4 second 100 yard dash


Babe Ruth's 59 homerun season is to me the greatest feat in sports history. No one I can think of has ever been that much better than all his pears combined.

Roger Federer? He won three grand slams last year to Nadal's one..

I'm partial to Gagne's savemark and the Bulldog's consecutive scoreless streak, but I dont think they are the greatest either though.

Bonds single season HR mark seems a little out of reach, but we know why at least :)

[CU Tiger]

Rodriguez is 32.
8 more 40 homer seasons puts him at 400 with 820 homers.
I dont see the laugh.

Now, all that said.
I HATE BARRY BONDS, but you can no more say he isnt home run champion because you think he used steroids than I can say I think Aaron isnt home run champ because Petee Rose man a huge gamlbing racket and convinced all pitchers to toss up gopher balls for him.

Do i *think* Bonds took steoids, yes probably. But I can tell you without a doubt that as recently as 2 years ago there were legal over the counter products available that if taken in the right doses (read 10-20x label rec) would produce the same results.

[korme]

It's the same one it has always been

4256

No one will ever touch that record

[DaddyTorgo]

I HATE BARRY BONDS, but you can no more say he isnt home run champion because you think he used steroids than I can say I think Aaron isnt home run champ because Petee Rose man a huge gamlbing racket and convinced all pitchers to toss up gopher balls for him.


sure I can. It's an opinion thing. And my opinion is that barry bonds is a cheating sleezeball and i'm not going to recognize his achievement.

[clintl]

To me, to be a hallowed record, I think it has to be famous, valued, and very difficult to break but still breakable. Everyone knows that Jack Chesbro's 41 single season wins and Cy Young's 511 career wins aren't in play because the game has changed. But there's no reason that DiMaggio's 56-game hitting streak, or Cal Ripkin's 2,630 game playing streak, or Bonds' 73 homers couldn't be surpassed by someone with enough talent.

And if A-Rod stays healthy, he WILL break the all-time HR record. Staying healthy is the big if, but I think 800 career HRs is easily within his reach. However, as was pointed out by Jayson Stark yesterday, Ken Griffey Jr. appeared to be on pace to break Aaron's record at A-Rod's age, and we all know how that has turned out.

[clintl]

It's the same one it has always been

4256

No one will ever touch that record

Disagree. If Ichiro had spent his whole career in the US, we'd be tracking his progress toward Rose's record by now. There will be an Ichiro who does spend his whole career in the US. 4256 is by no means out of reach.

[korme]

Disagree. If Ichiro had spent his whole career in the US, we'd be tracking his progress toward Rose's record by now. There will be an Ichiro who does spend his whole career in the US. 4256 is by no means out of reach.

I think you're severely underestimating the odds of that type of longevity. Ichiro, love him as a player, bases his game on his speed, and at 33, his speed is going to start slowing down significantly in the next few years. I would not be surprised at all to see Ichiro fade out earlier that most players, perhaps around 36, or 37. Great hitter, but he isn't exactly like Tony Gwynn.

<table border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="3"><tbody><tr><td align="right">Rank</td><td>Player (age)</td><td align="right">Hits</td><td>Bats</td></tr> <tr><td align="right">1.</td><td>Pete Rose (http://www.baseball-reference.com/r/rosepe01.shtml)# </td><td align="right">4256</td><td align="right">B</td></tr> <tr><td align="right">2.</td><td>Ty Cobb+ (http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/cobbty01.shtml)* </td><td align="right">4189</td><td align="right">L</td></tr> <tr><td align="right">3.</td><td>Hank Aaron+ (http://www.baseball-reference.com/a/aaronha01.shtml) </td><td align="right">3771</td><td align="right">R</td></tr></tbody></table>

[Swaggs]

I think there is a difference between hallowed and unreachable.

I'd say that Wilt Chamberlain's 100 points in one game is reachable, but more hallowed than some of the others listed here.

[Coffee Warlord]

I dunno, I'd like to see someone finish the season batting over .400.

[14ers]

Cy Youngs 749 complete games.



No active pitcher is even in the top 100 for CGs

1. Roger Clemens (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Clemens) - 118
2. Greg Maddux (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greg_Maddux) - 108
3. Randy Johnson (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randy_Johnson) - 98
4. Curt Schilling (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curt_Schilling) - 83
5. Mike Mussina (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Mussina) - 57

[clintl]

I think you're severely underestimating the odds of that type of longevity. Ichiro, love him as a player, bases his game on his speed, and at 33, his speed is going to start slowing down significantly in the next few years. I would not be surprised at all to see Ichiro fade out earlier that most players, perhaps around 36, or 37. Great hitter, but he isn't exactly like Tony Gwynn.

Gwynn was a better hitter than Ichiro is, but they're not all that different. The thing about Ichiro is he has never had less than 206 hits in a season. And he's having one of his best seasons this year, so I don't see the case that he's slowing down. Elite singles hitters like Gwynn and Ichiro can usually maintain a high batting average for a long time, and Ichiro has accumulated hits at an astonishing rate. Because he came here so late, he obviously is not going to approach Rose's record. But I can foresee someone else in the future doing what Ichiro is doing, but starting his career at 20 or 21. It will be a very difficult record to break, but I stand on my position - the only unbreakable records are those that are unbreakable because the way the game is played makes them unbreakable. Rose's record doesn't fall into that category.

[Ryan S]

Don't forget the original KING.

200 wins seems completely out of reach for modern day drivers.

Modern day drivers have no chance as the season has far fewer races.

[BYU 14]

To me, to be a hallowed record, I think it has to be famous, valued, and very difficult to break but still breakable. Everyone knows that Jack Chesbro's 41 single season wins and Cy Young's 511 career wins aren't in play because the game has changed. But there's no reason that DiMaggio's 56-game hitting streak, or Cal Ripkin's 2,630 game playing streak, or Bonds' 73 homers couldn't be surpassed by someone with enough talent.

And if A-Rod stays healthy, he WILL break the all-time HR record. Staying healthy is the big if, but I think 800 career HRs is easily within his reach. However, as was pointed out by Jayson Stark yesterday, Ken Griffey Jr. appeared to be on pace to break Aaron's record at A-Rod's age, and we all know how that has turned out.

I don't think you can discount Cy Youngs record that much. The differences between then and now is one ball was used for the entire game in most instances, the Ballparks were cavernous and there were more off days during the Season. Pitchers then generally threw last pitches per game and had the advantage of the extra off days. Plus because of the extra off days they could start more games per year. Cy Young was ahead of his time in that was not a typical hard living Ballplayer of the era, he took great care of his Arm and overall physical health. He took advantage of the ability to let upm at times during Games because of the size of Parks and that reduced the strain on his Arm. Then like now, many Pitchers (Noodles Hahn, Smokey Joe Wood and Chesbro) who were great Pitchers had shortened careers due to Arm trouble. For Young to do what he did for as long as he did is equivelent to what Clemens and Ryan have done recently in terms of longevity and effectiveness after age 40.

He and Walter Johnson are the only two Pitchers with over 400 wins and Johnson, who still was able to win over 20 games after the game had changed, and would have threatened Youngs records had he played for a better Team. Johnson lost substantially more 1-0 games than any Pitcher in history and did so throwing every Pitch hard. (Speaking of Johnson you can add his 110 Shutouts to this list) 24 Pitchers (Assuming Glavine gets there) have 300 Career wins and 12 of them pitched exclusively after the Deadball era, with two more (Johnson and Alexander) who had careers ended after the Deadball era was over.
Clemans in fact could conceivably end up in 5th place all time, so this milestone has been achieved by Pitchers throughout history, therefore Young's total should be acknowledged as a hallowed record...he took care of himself, rarely missed a start his entire Career and won almost 200 more games than he lost.

Ty Cobbs career .367 career average should be included as well, as should Orel Hershiser's 59 scoreless inning streak.

[Toddzilla]

It's Ripken's streak by virtue of the fact he was beloved by just about everyone in and out of baseball. Most hallowed record by a mile.

Oh, and A-Rod will hit 850-900 HRs before it's all done, so he's got chance to make the HR record mean something again (unless Canseco really does have something on him).

[FBPro]

755

hasn't been broken. Won't be broken unless/until A-Rod does.

Ditto

[FBPro]

It's Ripken's streak by virtue of the fact he was beloved by just about everyone in and out of baseball. Most hallowed record by a mile.

Oh, and A-Rod will hit 850-900 HRs before it's all done, so he's got chance to make the HR record mean something again (unless Canseco really does have something on him).

There is no way Jose has 'roids on ARod, for the simple fact that if he did it would have been in "Jose book #1". The only thing he may have is just a little minor mention or two to try and gain additional interest.

[TroyF]

Gwynn was a better hitter than Ichiro is, but they're not all that different. The thing about Ichiro is he has never had less than 206 hits in a season. And he's having one of his best seasons this year, so I don't see the case that he's slowing down. Elite singles hitters like Gwynn and Ichiro can usually maintain a high batting average for a long time, and Ichiro has accumulated hits at an astonishing rate. Because he came here so late, he obviously is not going to approach Rose's record. But I can foresee someone else in the future doing what Ichiro is doing, but starting his career at 20 or 21. It will be a very difficult record to break, but I stand on my position - the only unbreakable records are those that are unbreakable because the way the game is played makes them unbreakable. Rose's record doesn't fall into that category.


Agree with this 100%. If Ichiro had been in the majors from 22 or 23 on, we'd already be on a countdown. He'd be within 4 or 5 years of the record right now. (he'd have well over 3,300 hits at the age of 33, do you really think he couldn't get the other 800 in 6 or 7 years left of play?)

As for most hallowed, that implies everyone knows about it and that it's something people really care about. I think 56 is the number that fits the category.

[Senator]

99.94 Donald Bradman


In a sport that revels in statistics, the figure 99.94 has become one of cricket's most famous, iconic statistics.

Contextualising Bradman's achievement is easier than is usual for comparisons of cricket statistics across the eras. Compared to his average of almost 100, no other player who has played more than 20 Test match innings has finished his career with a Test average of more than 61 (see the list of highest Test career batting averages).

Bradman scored centuries at a rate better than one every three innings. He converted very nearly a third of his centuries into double hundreds, and his total of 37 first-class double hundreds is the most achieved by any batsman. The next highest total is Walter Hammond's, who scored 36 double hundreds but played in exactly 400 more matches than Bradman's 234.

For decades, Bradman was the only player to have scored two Test triple centuries (both against England at Headingley, 334 in 1930 and 304 in 1934). This feat was surpassed by West Indian Brian Lara in 2004 when he hit a quadruple century, having earlier made a score of 375 (Lara, however, played more than twice as many Tests). Bradman very nearly reached 300 on another occasion, his last partner being run out when he was on 299 not out against South Africa in 1932. Bradman, Lara and Bill Ponsford are the only players with three first class scores of over 350.

In a biographical essay in Wisden, he is hailed as "the greatest phenomenon in the history of cricket, indeed in the history of all ball games."[227]

In The Best of the Best, statistician Charles Davis argues that Bradman's performance is the most dominant of any player of any major sport. He analyses the statistics for several prominent sportsmen by comparing the number of standard deviations above the mean for their sport. The top performers in his selected sports are:

Athlete Sport Statistic Standard
deviations Probability
against (1/x)
Bradman Cricket Batting average 4.4 184,000
Pelé Football (Soccer) Goals per game 3.7 9,300
Ty Cobb Baseball Batting average 3.6 6,300
Jack Nicklaus Golf Major titles 3.5 4,300
Michael Jordan Basketball Points per game 3.4 3,000

This means, using the above criterion, that one would expect someone of Bradman's calibre to appear once in 184,000 batsmen, compared with once in only 9,300 football players for the next most highly rated person, Pelé. It is possible that Bradman's statistics would be even more extreme if extra deviation created by non-batting specialists were taken into account.

In order to post a similarly dominant career statistic as Bradman, a baseball batter would need a career batting average of 0.392, while a basketball player would need to score 43 points per game. For comparison, Michael Jordan holds the NBA record with an average of 30.1 points per game, while Ty Cobb's career batting average of .366 from 1928 still stands as the MLB high mark.

[DolphinFan1]

Ripken's streak will probably never be broken as most of today's players need a "day of rest" every now and then. Bunch of wusses.

Another would be I believe Henderson had over 100 steals in a season. Am I right on this? I don't think anyone will get close on this one. Too many conservative managers now.

[Groundhog]

Adding to Bradman's legend, he only needed 4 runs in his final match to average an even 100, and was instead bowled out for the most famous duck of all time.

[BigMak]

Chamberlain's 10,000+

[Crapshoot]

Adding to Bradman's legend, he only needed 4 runs in his final match to average an even 100, and was instead bowled out for the most famous duck of all time.

One of the saddest things in sports eh? If anyone deserved to average a 100, it was Bradman.

[RendeR]

Modern day drivers have no chance as the season has far fewer races.


Actually the number of races isn't that different. Petty's carreer average of races per season is only in the high 30's and there are 36 races per season currently. More races may well be added in the future.

The real reason no one will ever touch his record of 200 wins is that the3 level of competition is so rediculously much higher now than it was in the 50's and 60's when he collected the vast majority of those win, that no driver has a truly viable chance to do so. When Petty was winning all those races he had perhaps 3 cars on the track who had a legitimate chance of running with him all day, sure accidents and breakdowns happened still but having only 2 or 3 other cars that could stay with you on the track for an entire race gives you a huge advantage when you're already driving the best equipment and have the best supporting team.

Also the rules and playing field of cars they drove back then were sadly mismatched. Today every car is on a par with most every other car. back then a Superbird would run circles (Pun Intended) around everything else. Every team is on a much closer level to every other team. Any pit crew can pull off a 14 second pit stop, while back in the day many driver's pit crews were their sons and daughters, not professional crewmen.

So I have to admit that do to changes in the game, this record can never be reached again. No matter how dominant a driver may be. I still feel this record is the most hallowed in sports, but thats also because unlike any other sport, NASCAR has a King who made the sport what it is.

[Crapshoot]

Ripken's streak will probably never be broken as most of today's players need a "day of rest" every now and then. Bunch of wusses.


This is a parody, right? Ripken's streak kept him in the lineup for days even when he could use a break, as could the team (from having someone else) - instead, they were more deferrent to that then to the overall welfare of the team. Taking a day off doesn't make players today "wussies".

[RendeR]

This is a parody, right? Ripken's streak kept him in the lineup for days even when he could use a break, as could the team (from having someone else) - instead, they were more deferrent to that then to the overall welfare of the team. Taking a day off doesn't make players today "wussies".

True enough. Ripken's record was kept alive FOR him, not BY him. Coming in to a game for an at bat, or taking the field for the ninth inning to keep a streak alive when you should have been put on the DL makes this record one I'd rather laugh at then respect.

It did more to hurt the Orioles than help them.

[Maple Leafs]

Most of the people in this thread don't seem to know what "hallowed" means.

I'd go with DiMaggio's streak. Ripken was fun but I never hear about consecutive game streaks any more. It's such a drawn out achievement that it will be years before it's even on anyone's radar again. The other number that comes to mind is .400, although that's strictly a record.

Although if you really want "most unbreakable", it's clearly AC Green's consecutive shutout streak. No NBA player will ever get within a decade of that.

[TroyF]

Most of the people in this thread don't seem to know what "hallowed" means.

I'd go with DiMaggio's streak. Ripken was fun but I never hear about consecutive game streaks any more. It's such a drawn out achievement that it will be years before it's even on anyone's radar again. The other number that comes to mind is .400, although that's strictly a record.

Although if you really want "most unbreakable", it's clearly AC Green's consecutive shutout streak. No NBA player will ever get within a decade of that.


That's why I said "care about" in my post. Nobody really cares about durability streaks anymore. They are nice for the books, but it doesn't say anything about performence. By itself, does Cal Ripken playing in 162 games a year mean he contributed more to his team than say, ARod in 148?

It's an admirable streak and one that deserves mention. If it happens in my lifetime, I'll certainly watch the next player who reaches that number and applaud him. But to me, it's not a performence based streak and so I don't put it up there with 755 or 56 or 511.

My long way of saying I agree with you. :)

[korme]

Well Miggy Tejada had the longest active streak of games played until he was recently injured this year.

[Maple Leafs]

To me, part of what makes a record "hallowed" is that you can sit around with your buddies and argue about it. You can try to figure out who might break it, how long it would take them, etc. With Ripken's streak, I'm not even sure where you'd start with candidates unless somebody was already over 1,000. And even then, it's like "Well, I guess will see in nine more years".

[CU Tiger]

Actually the number of races isn't that different. Petty's carreer average of races per season is only in the high 30's and there are 36 races per season currently. More races may well be added in the future.




Competition part is dead on, but in the season he won 27 races petty competed in 64 races and missed some 8 or 9 more.

At some points in NASCAR history you would have as many as 5 races/week some happening simultaneously.

[RendeR]

I understand that CU, but over his career he took part in just under 24 races a season on the average. 814 starts over 34 years. During the late 70's and through the 80's there were many fewer races being run. Then with the advent of the popularity boom in the 90's NASCAR has been adding races back to their schedule.

So the opportunity to race enough to get 200 wins is there, but the overall competition level simply wouldn't allow a driver to achieve that many wins.

The interesting thing I find is the win ratio. top 5 ratio and top 10 ratio.

For Petty, he won nearly 1 race for every 4 he started, took a top 2-5 finish 184 times for nearly 1 in 4 as well.

Motorsports almanac didn't have the top 10's info listed at this time.

[albionmoonlight]

I think there is a difference between hallowed and unreachable.

I'd say that Wilt Chamberlain's 100 points in one game is reachable, but more hallowed than some of the others listed here.

I agree.

Indeed, to be hallowed, I would argue that a record has to be theoretically reachable. An effectively unreachable record gets dismissed on some level because "the game has changed so much." And people talk about it much less because it is never in danger of being broken.

[Terps]

Cal's other record that will never be broken: 8,243 consecutive innings, which spanned 904 games of his streak.

[Mustang]

At some points in NASCAR history you would have as many as 5 races/week some happening simultaneously.

Simultaneously? Damn.. how did they not run into each other...

;)

[cartman]

Simultaneously? Damn.. how did they not run into each other...

;)

Where do you think demolition derbies came from? :D