Pregnant Mother Smoking

[Schmidty]

I saw a VERY pregnant woman outside of a YMCA daycare center puffing away at a cigarette today. I was beyond pissed, and I really wish I had said something, but I didn't.

What would you have done?

[oliegirl]

I don't know if I would have said something to her directly, but probably would have not so quietly made a snide comment that I knew she heard...something like "Yeah, someone like you should be having kids". If she chose to respond I'd have gladly told her what I thought.

[sabotai]

I saw a picture of a newspaper not too long ago. It was a story of a pregnant woman who was concerned that the sound of the jackhammering going on next to where she lived was going to harm her child. Next to the story was a picture of her, staring off to the distance (one of those set up shots that's supposed to make you sympathetic or something...). In the photo is her holding a cigarette.

EDIT: Googled to try and find it, and it looks like snopes got to it and confirmed it. http://www.snopes.com/photos/signs/pregnant.asp

[st.cronin]

Is it possible there are people who don't realize that smoking while pregnant is a bad idea?

[clintl]

It's possible. But smoking is an addiction. It's also possible she tried and failed at quitting.

Or that she just doesn't care.

[AlexB]

It's possible. But smoking is an addiction. It's also possible she tried and failed at quitting.

Or that she just doesn't care.

Genuine question - if she wore patches, would the nicotine from the patches affect the baby?

[Toddzilla]

Was it Catherine Zeta-Jones?

[sabotai]

Genuine question - if she wore patches, would the nicotine from the patches affect the baby?

If nicotine itself is in any way harmful to the child, yes it would.

[AlexB]

In that case, as an ex-smoker for about 18 months, I sympathise to an extent with the woman - giving up is very very tough. Without the patches I know I wouldn't have been able to do it.

OK - baby makes it more of an incentive, but to any non-smoker it is not a case of 'Oh, something has changed in my life, I'd better stop smoking'

[Scoobz0202]

I'm only 20 and I can't fucking quit. I tried, but I'm at that point in my life where my number one priority is drinking. Those that smoke know then how hard it is to quit :)

[sabotai]

I'm only 20 and I can't fucking quit. I tried, but I'm at that point in my life where my number one priority is drinking. Those that smoke know then how hard it is to quit :)

Pfft, it's easy. I've done it a hundred times. ;)


And FWIW, every woman I know who smokes and have had kids quit while she was pregnant.

[st.cronin]

It is hard to quit, but on the other hand at some point it would have been very easy not to start. That tends to temper my sympathy.

[lungs]

Who the hell would you be to make a comment directly to her?

The mother of my godson smoked when she was pregnant. It's not like she wanted to, but nicotine isn't an easy addiction to kick.

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want any woman I impregnate to smoke but it's none of my god damned business if somebody else does. I hate people that walk around and think there is a need to tell everybody how to live according to their own standards.

[AlexB]

Not a case of sympathy, but at the same I'm not about to condemn the person for smoking, or not being able to quit. On the other hand, who knows if she's even tried.

There was a sketch by Alexei Sayle a few years ago that st cronin would have liked - he couldn't stand ex-smokers being boastful about quitting: - 'Why do people harp on about stopping something that was stupid in the first place? No-one gets up and expects respect for saying 'It's been two years since I stopped putting my dick in a blender' :D

[Schmidty]

Who the hell would you be to make a comment directly to her?

The mother of my godson smoked when she was pregnant. It's not like she wanted to, but nicotine isn't an easy addiction to kick.

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want any woman I impregnate to smoke but it's none of my god damned business if somebody else does. I hate people that walk around and think there is a need to tell everybody how to live according to their own standards.

So if you see someone beating their child in public, you'd just walk away?

Just curious.

[lungs]

So if you see someone beating their child in public, you'd just walk away?

Just curious.

That would be a serious crime. Smoking while pregnant is not.

[Schmidty]

That would be a serious crime. Smoking while pregnant is not.

It should be.

But I guess that falls under the whole "woman-body-is-it-life-and-at-what-point" thing.

[lungs]

dola

my post may have been a little snide towards you, and I didn't mean it that way. You didn't say anything. I felt you did the right thing. But it's also not wrong that you WANTED to say something.

[lungs]

It should be.

But I guess that falls under the whole "woman-body-is-it-life-and-at-what-point" thing.

That's debatable I guess, and yes, that is more than a murky area.

I guess I just feel that I ought to take care of myself before worrying about others. And that would include not allowing a child of mine to be subjected to cigarette smoke. The father of my godson had no problems with the mother smoking so I felt it was none of my business.

[Schmidty]

dola

my post may have been a little snide towards you, and I didn't mean it that way. You didn't say anything. I felt you did the right thing. But it's also not wrong that you WANTED to say something.

No, it's cool. I can see both sides of the issue too, although I am strongly in favor of one side over the other.

[spleen1015]

The wife of a friend of mine tried to tell us that her doctor told her not to quit while pregnant. Apparently, the shock your system goes through when you quit was bad for the baby.

I know how hard it is to quit. I haven't had a smoke since 1/17. I tried to quit many times before that. I still haven't surpassed my longest stretch with this attempt. It can be tough, but I think I wouldn't have a problem if I were pregnant.

[SteveMax58]

I sympathize with the woman's smoking addiction, as I'm a smoker too. But you have to freakin quit that crap when you know or suspect you might be pregnant. Easier said than done...but you have to.

Not an easy situation either way. I doubt I'd say something, unless it was somebody I knew really well. But the fact that she was smoking outside a YMCA tells me that she didnt even feel shameful about it. If somebody can see you smoking, and you're pregnant, you really arent trying to quit hard enough.

[Icy]

It really pisses me off to see pregnant women smoking or doing anything else proven harmful for the baby. It has always pissed me, but it does way more after we lost our baby a year and a half ago. We did everythig written in the books to have a safe baby, and we ended loosing her, so call it envy or whatever, but it puts me on my nerves to see what other egoist people does with theirs, while we were the ones punished by bad luck.

[st.cronin]

Not a case of sympathy, but at the same I'm not about to condemn the person for smoking, or not being able to quit. On the other hand, who knows if she's even tried.

There was a sketch by Alexei Sayle a few years ago that st cronin would have liked - he couldn't stand ex-smokers being boastful about quitting: - 'Why do people harp on about stopping something that was stupid in the first place? No-one gets up and expects respect for saying 'It's been two years since I stopped putting my dick in a blender' :D

By the way, I am a former dipper AND smoker. :D

[hoopsguy]

It really pisses me off to see pregnant women smoking or doing anything else proven harmful for the baby. It has always pissed me, but it does way more after we lost our baby a year and a half ago. We did everythig written in the books to have a safe baby, and we ended loosing her, so call it envy or whatever, but it puts me on my nerves to see what other egoist people does with theirs, while we were the ones punished by bad luck.

Same boat here. We tried for years to have children and weren't able to do so. Along the way our tolerance level for questionable (at best) parenting decisions dropped steadily. It hasn't inched back up at all since we adopted our baby girl.

I don't know if envy is the right word, but it is in that zip code. I always felt angry when people didn't realize how lucky they were to have a chance at parenting when people like us would have given anything to be in their position.

[Maple Leafs]

I would have walked away, only because I can't imagine my saying something would change anything. She must know what smoking can do to a baby, and she obviously either doesn't care or just can't stop. Either way, I'm not sure what good it would do for me to get involved, even though the whole sight would probably ruin my day.

Compared to somebody beating a kid, where you can actually stop the harm (at least in the short-term), this is a no-win situation.

[nilodor]

I picked walk away because I've heard alot of conflicting information about if it's bad or not for the baby. I have to imagine it is, but I have heard the shock of quitting could be worse (as someone eluded to earlier in this thread). Now if she was drinking in a bar, I probably would have just pissed off a fat chick.

[MizzouRah]

So I guess if you saw her at McDonalds eating a Big Mac you would have told her how bad that food is to her body?

Say nothing, it's none of your business what she does with her life.

[oykib]

So I guess if you saw her at McDonalds eating a Big Mac you would have told her how bad that food is to her body?

Say nothing, it's none of your business what she does with her life.

I call "bullshit."

Eating Big Macs is not going to be particularly harmful to the baby. She could eat at McDonald's every day and, if she ate moderately healthily othwerwise, the baby would be fine.

If that baby comes out with some birth defect, you can be sure that the rest of society will be subsidizing her foolishness.

You can't force her to give up smoking. But people have let the power of shame disappear from society.

[st.cronin]

Even if she wasn't pregnant, society DOES have an interest in the health of its citizens, so its perfectly appropriate for anybody to think less of her for making an unhealthy choice.

[Balldog]

My buddy and his wife adopted a baby two or three years ago, when the lady went into labor they called them to the hospital. When they got there the mom was sitting out on the curb smoking while in labor, needless to say they were EXTREMELY pissed! Luckily he is perfectly healthy, he was a little small though.

[TroyF]

It's horrible what she's doing, but I don't see any positive to piping up and telling her anything.

1) Her doctor has surely told her the consequences of smoking. She knows it's bad for the kid.

2) She's probably been told 100x by various people, including friends and family members to stop. If they weren't able to make her stop, some stranger at the Quik Mart isn't going to do the trick either.

3) She could very well become confrontational. In this society, you never know what the hell you'll get when you nose into someone elses business.

I find what she's doing repulsive, but I don't exactly see how it's going to end well when you speak up. She's going to continue what she's doing, you are never going to see her or her future kid again and you can't call the police because what she's doing is legal.

At the end of the day, you want to say something because it's going to make YOU feel better. You know it isn't taking care of the problem and you know it won't end well. But by saying something, you can tell yourself "I sure as hell tried"

Donate money for some cancer research or donate some time at a children's hospital. It'll make you feel a hell of a lot better and it actually has a chance of making a difference.

[lighthousekeeper]

I'm probably going to come off sounding very stupid here, but what affect does her smoking have on the fetus? I've heard of second-hand smoke, but I didn't know smoking while pregnant was a problem.

[Lorena]

If she's "very" pregnant, then there's nothing anyone can do, it's probably already too late. I'd be pretty pissed myself, but I wouldn't say anything.

[Lorena]

I'm probably going to come off sounding very stupid here, but what affect does her smoking have on the fetus? I've heard of second-hand smoke, but I didn't know smoking while pregnant was a problem.

My aunt smoked while pregnant and my cousin ended up with asthma. I'm pretty sure it's related but not 100%. Babies tend have low birth weight when mothers smoke.

[Marc Vaughan]

It should be.

But I guess that falls under the whole "woman-body-is-it-life-and-at-what-point" thing.

So if you saw someone who was pregnant and obese you'd talk to them about fitness and dieting?
(http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/4115.php)

I agree someone smoking during a pregnancy is distasteful and if it was a friend I'd probably try and make them see sense (and indeed my wife and I originally gave up smoking last time to 'come alongside' a friend who was pregnant and trying to give up, ironically while our friend went back to smoking (before she delivered, baby was fine incidentally - no problems at all) neither my wife or I have).

If I didn't know the person involved then I'd probably not interfere, I don't know the person or the situation involved and I'm realistic enough to realise that its incredibly unlikely for a comment from a random stranger to cause someone to change their ways - especially when it comes to breaking away from a habit forming drug.

[Synovia]

Say nothing, it's none of your business what she does with her life.
Well, considering that shes directly driving up our health insurance rates, I'd say its definitely his business.

[CamEdwards]

I'm a smoker, and I have no problem with people telling me I shouldn't smoke. I also have no problem with people telling pregnant women they shouldn't smoke.

I might not listen to them, but (in my opinion), there's nothing wrong with folks trying to appeal to someone's sense of shame (or lack thereof) to influence their behavior.

[Crim]

My sister smoked throughout her pregnancy. Said she was trying to quit, and I think she did cut back, but I gave her an earful frequently. Healthy baby, so we're all relieved. Specially my sister.

Wierd, though: My mother smoked carrying me (this was in the stone ages, when it really wasn't assumed that smoking was bad for babies, or at least not universally accepted), and I came out fine. Twelve years later, Mom doesn't smoke while carrying my sister, and my sister is diagnosed at a pretty young age w/ mild asthma.

My point is just, there's not always a direct one-to-one correlation between the mother's behavior and the health of the child, and I agree that it is not the business of strangers to counsel people about this stuff.

That said, I think it's disgusting and selfish, and (as I told my sister) being a parent is hard enough work without adding to the chances of your baby having health problems.

[Synovia]

My point is just, there's not always a direct one-to-one correlation between the mother's behavior and the health of the child, and I agree that it is not the business of strangers to counsel people about this stuff.

A more valid point is that you and your mom do not equal a valid statistical sample, and no assumptions should be made from it.

[lighthousekeeper]

A more valid point is that you and your mom do not equal a valid statistical sample, and no assumptions should be made from it.

no, but it is enough of a statistical sample to correctly conclude (as he is) that a pregnant women who smokes will not definitely create health problems for her baby.

[Noop]

Its her life.

[EagleFan]

Its her life.

I guess the unborn child's life doesn't matter... :rolleyes:

[Synovia]

no, but it is enough of a statistical sample to correctly conclude (as he is) that a pregnant women who smokes will not definitely create health problems for her baby.

No, its not, as not all health problems show up early in life.

[Klinglerware]

Well, considering that shes directly driving up our health insurance rates, I'd say its definitely his business.

I believe studies have been done (which of course have been debated) that appear to demonstrate that smokers are a net benefit to health care expenditures, since they tend to die early. Also, isn't it true that smokers' insurance premiums are higher than non-smokers, so they assume (in theory) a slightly higher proportion of the health care costs they incur?

[Dutch]

It is tough to quit smoking, but it's not impossible. It's a personal sacrifice. So I have no sympathy with a mother who could not handle a personal sacrifice for her children.

[SteveMax58]

Also, isn't it true that smokers' insurance premiums are higher than non-smokers, so they assume (in theory) a slightly higher proportion of the health care costs they incur?

I have no study that shows smokers as being a net benefit to the health insurance industry...but I can say that yes, every month I pay around double the cost of a non-smoker. Perhaps rightfully so.

[Edward64]

Great question, got me thinking.

Although personally distasteful to me, I would not have said anything.

1. Even if there is a correlation, is this correlation significant enough statistically and 'as a whole' for us to judge. Ex. I am quite sure the number of mothers smoking in Europe is significant as it was in the US during the 20th century ... we turned out okay, the world moves on without a blip.

2. If you were in another country and saw this, would you say anything? I bet the answer, for the secularist among us, is probably 'no, because its not ultimately my tax money'. This is a perfectly good answer but for those concerned about the unborn baby, how would you answer this? and why?

3. You can't save the world. Life is full of choices and some play the odds and make suspect choices.

[Hammer]

Honestly, if a stranager came up to my partner in this situation with an aggressive attitude they better be ready to fight.

I'm not a smoker and neither is my partner, and yes it is a disgusting habit that can harm the development of a baby. But you think you have some devine right to go up to a pregnant woman and lay the law down to her?

I suggest you do some reading. The stress of giving up/trying to give up can be equally as harmful, if not more harmful to the development of a baby. More importantly, its none of your business and and you should have more respect for people and stop jumping to conclusions! Its a little narrow minded don't you think? The women could be tearing herself up inside feeling the same way as the majority, but fearing the consequences that the stress of giving up could bring. Then some asshole comes and up and scares the life out of her on the street...

[MizzouRah]

Well, considering that shes directly driving up our health insurance rates, I'd say its definitely his business.

Forget she's pregnant then, get up this morning and march out into the streets and start telling everyone you see who's smoking how bad it is and how it's driving up medical costs. :rolleyes:

While you're at it, go into the fast food restaurants and let them know how bad that food is for them.

I'm not saying it's right to smoke when you're pregnant, but I don't believe it's your right to say anything to a complete stranger either.

[Shkspr]

I might not listen to them, but (in my opinion), there's nothing wrong with folks trying to appeal to someone's sense of shame (or lack thereof) to influence their behavior.


Have you ever thought about going into talk radio? :)

[dime]

should have offered her another pack...she's smoking for two now.

[stevew]

I think she just wants her child to have a low birth weight so she can keep it in baby clothes longer. Also it will be less mass to pass through her vagina. That's my idea, anyways.

[B & B]

I think she just wants her child to have a low birth weight so she can keep it in baby clothes longer. Also it will be less mass to pass through her vagina. That's my idea, anyways.


Soooo wrong.










Yet so right.

[Maple Leafs]

Also it will be less mass to pass through her vagina.
I'm guessing you've used this line before.

[Crim]

I'm guessing you've used this line before.

He shoots he scores!

[14ers]

I am with you all in think this is some form of child abuse here; I love this article from 50 years ago? Smaller babies is a good thing during pregnancy. :)

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,835515,00.html
Smoking & Pregnancy

Friday, May. 13, 1966
<!-- Begin Article Copy --><!-- Begin Article Tools -->
Doctors are so accustomed to hearing about bad effects of smoking that the report by four U.S. Navy physicians came as something of a shock.
After a study of 48,505 pregnant wives, half of whom were smokers, Lieut. Commander Paul B. Underwood and his colleagues told the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists, their collected data provide no proof that smoking by a mother harms her unborn child, and in one way it appears to help.

It is true enough, said Dr. Underwood, that mothers' smoking at any stage of pregnancy resulted in the birth of smaller-than-average babies. But these had a lower death rate than that of other premature children, and within a year they caught up with the heavier babies of nonsmoking mothers.

What the Navy researchers found still more surprising was that the 10-to-30-cigarettes-a-day women had fewer incidents of the mysterious condition called "the toxemia of pregnancy." Early symptoms of this trouble are usually rising blood pressure, rapid weight gain and headache, followed by urinary difficulties and abdominal pain. This stage is "pre-eclampsia." The later stage of true eclampsia involves convulsions and threatens the lives of mother and child. Both the moderate and severe forms were less common among smoking than among nonsmoking mothers. Why? The Navy doctors went back to their delivery rooms without hazarding a guess, but hopeful of finding an answer.


"But these had a lower death rate than that of other premature children" Exactly why are they comparing the Smoking babies with ONLY the premature children? It looks good when you first read it, but once you realise that they are selectively comparing only the non-healthy children to the Smoking babies you see the lie.

Why not come out and say in this study they found that the children from smokers were born significantly more healthy than the DEAD babies.

[Richard Weed]

If her friends and family haven't gotten her to quit, why would a complete stranger get her to quit?

[Sweed]

Well, considering that shes directly driving up our health insurance rates, I'd say its definitely his business.

Forget she's pregnant then, get up this morning and march out into the streets and start telling everyone you see who's smoking how bad it is and how it's driving up medical costs. :rolleyes:

While you're at it, go into the fast food restaurants and let them know how bad that food is for them.

I'm not saying it's right to smoke when you're pregnant, but I don't believe it's your right to say anything to a complete stranger either.

I have to agree with MR's post.

As someone else brought up smokers already pay higher health premiums. They also pay a hefty tax on each pack of cigs they buy. If these monies don't cover the costs then pressure needs to be brought on the insurance companies to change the way the rates are established so the smoker pays his share. If the taxes aren't high enough to cover societies costs then your legislature needs to address that issue with higher taxes on smokes. And while they are at it don't put that money in the general fund but use it for smoking issues only. After all it's the smoker that's paying the tax.

FWIW I'm a non-smoker who's Dad died because of smoking.

[MizzouRah]

If I had my way, all tobacco compaines would be shut down... and I've chewed tobacco for years.

[SteveMax58]

If I had my way, all tobacco compaines would be shut down... and I've chewed tobacco for years.

While I'm sure you'd have some negative outcome to coincide, that would probably do a lot of people, myself included, a lot of good.

[MizzouRah]

While I'm sure you'd have some negative outcome to coincide, that would probably do a lot of people, myself included, a lot of good.

Too bad they make so much f'n $$$$ - it'll never happen.

[Ragone]

If I had my way, all tobacco compaines would be shut down... and I've chewed tobacco for years.

Why not just shut down all the alcohol producing companies as well.. they have harmful side effects that are consistantly ignored.

[Richard Weed]

Why not just shut down all the alcohol producing companies as well.. they have harmful side effects that are consistantly ignored.
Ugly chicks and fat chicks would sue you if you tried prohibition.

[RendeR]

A) All you posters "guessing" about the effects, what her doctors told her, etc etc need to actually READ the link posted on page one to the snopes article and follow the link near the end of it to the full article written about her.

B) While I've seen friends try and quit and simply fail miserably, I myself smoked 3 packs a day and stopped cold turkey. Felt crappy for about a week, but nothing that stopped me doing my job/living my life and moved on without incident. If there is anything I've learned about addictions its this:
If you do not truly WANT to quit, you will not quit. When you're really ready to give it up, you'll stop and never look back.


C) As for the calls to end tobacco production and manufacturing in this country altogether, please do a little research first. It would be ignorant and destructive to do so, let alone the overall loss of thousands of products that, while not tobacco themselves, require derivatives from tobacco production.

[MizzouRah]

Why not just shut down all the alcohol producing companies as well.. they have harmful side effects that are consistantly ignored.

Why not shut down the Royals while we're at it? :p

You're probably right though, these are all "choices" we can decide to do or not to do.

[SteveMax58]

B) While I've seen friends try and quit and simply fail miserably, I myself smoked 3 packs a day and stopped cold turkey. Felt crappy for about a week, but nothing that stopped me doing my job/living my life and moved on without incident. If there is anything I've learned about addictions its this:
If you do not truly WANT to quit, you will not quit. When you're really ready to give it up, you'll stop and never look back.


I think you're absolutely right about this. While I would like to not smoke...I havent truly reached a point that I've said, "I WANT to quit this crap, and I'm ready to do it."

I can sense I'm getting there as I keep putting further restrictions on when & where I will smoke...but I still have a little ways to go as I still use it as a stress mechanism.

[PadresFan104]

As my mother sat in bed in the fall of 1968, bedridden due to a tough 3rd trimester with me, her doctor suggested she take up smoking to ease the boredom. I still look at my mom increduosly when she tells me that story, since she became a two-pack-a-day smoker after that, though she did finally quit in 1999 after my Dad passed away from lung cancer. (He was a two pack a day smoker from the age of 19)

I have some minor lung issues, but it has more to do with growing up in a constant fog of smoke in my house, rather than my mom smoking while pregnant.

[Bee]

I'm a smoker, and I have no problem with people telling me I shouldn't smoke. I also have no problem with people telling pregnant women they shouldn't smoke.

I might not listen to them, but (in my opinion), there's nothing wrong with folks trying to appeal to someone's sense of shame (or lack thereof) to influence their behavior.

You shouldn't smoke, it will make your hair fall out. ;)

[CamEdwards]

Have you ever thought about going into talk radio? :)

LOL, that made my day!

And Bee, I'm pretty sure my smoking didn't make my hair fall out... but that's a good line to tell my kids. :)

Actually, I recently tried Chantix to help me quit and it didn't have much effect on me. I'm debating about trying hypnotherapy, but there is a part of me that agrees (God help me) with RendeR... when you're ready to quit you will. I SHOULD be ready to quit, but I don't honestly know that I'm ready to go through the withdrawl.