Padres vs Rockies

[MizzouRah]

Ya, I know Monday night football is on, but for some reason I'm really interested in this game.

[Lathum]

Ya, I know Monday night football is on, but for some reason I'm really interested in this game.

me too. now that the Mets tanked it I am pulling for the Rockies. I had Holliday and Atkins on my fantasy team so I watched alot of their games.

[MizzouRah]

me too. now that the Mets tanked it I am pulling for the Rockies. I had Holliday and Atkins on my fantasy team so I watched alot of their games.

I have a few friends that live in Colorado, so yep.. pulling for them as well.

[Crapshoot]

Far more interested in this than MNF. I think Jake Peavy is the best pitcher in the NL, so I expect the Padres to pull it out - but its still Coors.

[Lathum]

Far more interested in this than MNF. I think Jake Peavy is the best pitcher in the NL, so I expect the Padres to pull it out - but its still Coors.

Coors isn't what it used to be since they started using the humidor. I think the Rockies pull it out in a close game.

[Lathum]

Peavy is doing his best Tom Glavine impression

[Young Drachma]

Coors isn't what it used to be since they started using the humidor. I think the Rockies pull it out in a close game.

I tell ya, when you see a game there...it's nuts to see how a fly ball somewhere else becomes a home run almost instantly.

I bought tickets to Game 3 if they win today. So...it'd be cool to go to a playoff game and I'm rooting for them. They've got a great young ballclub and they've done it the right way.

And I've always said of the expansion teams that have come into baseball in recent years, they have the most "classic" look uniform wise.

[sterlingice]

Um... WOW.

SI

[Young Drachma]

Oops. lol

[Buccaneer]

They broke out the old batch of balls. Yikes. Go Pads.

[MizzouRah]

Wow is right. Could be a l o n g game tonight!

[astrosfan64]

I don't care who wins, the phillies are going to take the national league.

[hoopsguy]

What station is showing this game?

[Radii]

I don't care who wins, the phillies are going to take the national league.

phillies are fucked. Cubs still alive though, thanks for not picking them :)

[MizzouRah]

What station is showing this game?

TBS - 139 for Dishnetwork

[astrosfan64]

phillies are fucked. Cubs still alive though, thanks for not picking them :)

:) - The cubs are over-rated. Actually let me change that, noone thinks they are good anyway, so I guess they can't be over-rated. Instead they just suck.

It will be Arizona vs. the Phillies in the NLCS.

BTW, I did say the Mets were over-rated looks like I was right on that one.

[Buccaneer]

Can someone tell the Pads to layoff the outside pitches, esp. if they are out of the zone?

[mauchow]

Gotta make that catch. That'll cost 'em probably.

[mauchow]

That was SIMPLY AWESOME!

The crowd chanting "MVP MVP MVP"

and BAM he gets a game tying single.

[Young Drachma]

Funny, I remember a conversation back during the WBC who goes, "who is Matt Holliday?" Umm..he knows now. ;)

[MizzouRah]

That was SIMPLY AWESOME!

The crowd chanting "MVP MVP MVP"

and BAM he gets a game tying single.

MVP is right.

[astrosfan64]

One thing I don't understand about baseball is the one game playoff. I mean granted it can be exciting, but shouldn't the team with the best head to head record take it automatically?

So if the Phillies and the Mets tied, this year the phillies should of won because their head to head record was better.

I guess if the teams are equal head to head then there should be a playoff.

Anyway, just curious.

[astrosfan64]

MVP is right.

Rollins should get the MVP. You know what the best part about the Rollins MVP. He was shafted for the All-Star game.

[Young Drachma]

One thing I don't understand about baseball is the one game playoff. I mean granted it can be exciting, but shouldn't the team with the best head to head record take it automatically?

So if the Phillies and the Mets tied, this year the phillies should of won because their head to head record was better.

I guess if the teams are equal head to head then there should be a playoff.

Anyway, just curious.

I think the idea is after playing 162 games, if the teams are still tied, it's not fair to use head-to-head record as a mechanism for determining something with the stakes so high.

If there were say 16 teams in the playoffs or even 12, I'm sure they'd use head-to-head record or other sorts of tiebreaker mechanisms.

But with so few teams making the playoffs, having a coin flip to decide who gets in, isn't really fair.

And by coin flip, I mean using head-to-head..basically saying a game in April or May over a long season should determine who goes to the playoffs and who goes home.

[Young Drachma]

Here's some history... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Game_Playoff#Background)

[mauchow]

Yeah, its pretty dumb..

You've got divisions for a reason, use them the way they should otherwise get rid of them altogether. A team that wins 70% of their games against their division foes may not even go to the playoffs since they lost 70% of the rest of their games to out of division teams.

If it was College Football, that team that won 70% of their games against division teams, would be going to the playoffs.

I think since there are so many games and having a better head to head record doesn't really mean you're the better team.

Actually, I'll stop talking since the more I talk about it the more confused I get and how pointless the baseball season really is.

Put 16 teams in each division and whoever has the best records should go to the World series, or have 4 or 8 teams go. I don't care, mix them all in the same stinkin' division.

[Young Drachma]

I think being the best team in your division doesn't mean a whole lot in a sport where the divisions are uneven.

[mauchow]

I think being the best team in your division doesn't mean a whole lot in a sport where the divisions are uneven.

Making the fact that there are divisions even dumber yet.

[Young Drachma]

Making the fact that there are divisions even dumber yet.

Agreed. I just created an entire MLB league with one league of four divisions just to see how it would work and it's still just as exciting and the matchups are just as interesting.

I think there would need to be real world tweaks applied to it, but...by and large, it'd be a much better idea or at least, would yield much better matchups in the playoffs.

[Young Drachma]

Former Blue Jay on the mound. Didn't even know he was in Colorado.

[SackAttack]

You know I'd be a poor man/if I never saw the Padres diiiiiiiiie

Go Rockies!

[Young Drachma]

Strange. The guy with the Colorado location rooting for the Padres. The California guy rooting for the Rockies.

Soo confused...

[Young Drachma]

The NFL playoffs commercials are so much more interesting than baseball's.

[Buccaneer]

Hey Sack, congrats to the Dodgers for finishing in first like they were predicted to do.

[Buccaneer]

The NFL playoffs commercials are so much more interesting than baseball's.

You actually watch commercials?!?!? Soo confused. :confused:

[Young Drachma]

You actually watch commercials?!?!? Soo confused. :confused:

No. They're on mute. Just an observation.

[sterlingice]

If it was College Football, that team that won 70% of their games against division teams, would be going to the playoffs.

College football? Playoffs?

SI

[Buccaneer]

No. They're on mute. Just an observation.

Understood. That's how I watch YouTube videos that are linked here. Best way to tell if they are funny or not.

[mauchow]

College football? Playoffs?

SI

Yeah. 1st place Big Ten faces 1st Place Pac 10. I'm pretty sure I'd call that playoffs. If the Badgers were 8-0 in the Big Ten and lost all their 'other games' and ended up 8-4. The Ohio State Buckeyes who then finished 11-1(7-1), doesn't get the playoff spot because their record in conference wasn't better.

If it was 'baseball' for college football, tOSU goes in my scenario.

I guess its hard to compare it to that, but I'm sure you understand what I meant.

[mauchow]

By the way, those umps made a horrible call on that homerun..

Does it make any sense whatsoever that a ball bounces 100 feet off a CUSHIONED top of the fence...? Duhhhhh..

[Young Drachma]

Yeah, baseball umps are pretty much terrible.

[mauchow]

MVP MVP MVP MV ...

Ooops.

[MizzouRah]

Rollins should get the MVP. You know what the best part about the Rollins MVP. He was shafted for the All-Star game.

No he shouldn't.

[Young Drachma]

Wow...it all comes down to this.

[Celeval]

The announcers sound like this is a midseason game. If Jack Buck was in the booth, every pitch would be the most important pitch ever made in the history of baseball.

I'm not entirely sure which I prefer, actually.

[mauchow]

Wow, a funny commercial about baseball.

Kenn Lofton has been traded to Chicago. No, wait, New York. He's headed to Boston.. and it goes on and on. Is that Kenny Loftons stuff? Yeah, its going to Japan.

Good stuff.

[Young Drachma]

Speaking of, I'm happy he's back with the Indians for this playoff push after playing well in Texas earlier in the year.

[Celeval]

Speaking of, I'm happy he's back with the Indians for this playoff push after playing well in Texas earlier in the year.

+1

I've always been a fan of Lofton - and I'm glad to have him in his third stint with the team.

[Young Drachma]

Of course, had there been a tiebreaker based on head-to-head record or division record, the Rockies would be in. So maybe they wish there was one..lol

[Young Drachma]

Heads up play to end the inning.

[Buccaneer]

ouch

[MikeVic]

Breaking down pitches with Alyssa Milano? What the.

[Celeval]

Alyssa Milano has been involved in mlb.com all year (blogger), and is essentially filling a sideline reporter role during the playoffs.

[MikeVic]

Alyssa Milano has been involved in mlb.com all year (blogger), and is essentially filling a sideline reporter role during the playoffs.

Cool!

[Young Drachma]

towel-biting?

[korme]

Just flipped to the game - fantastic to see it is in the 11th inning in a game that matters so much.

[mauchow]

I'm starting to get tired. Its no longer keeping me on edge since it feels like it might go 24 innings.

[SackAttack]

Glad I'm not the only one who's capable of applying physics to that home run (blown) call.

Shame the umpires don't seem to have taken a physics class, ever.

[Young Drachma]

Wow....

[mauchow]

Whoa. Looked like Helton pulled his foot there. I'm rewinding now.

[Buccaneer]

Too many LOB.

[Celeval]

His bat looked like it exploded on that groundout.

[mauchow]

Okay, never mind. He was okay.

[mauchow]

His bat looked like it exploded on that groundout.

Cork! :)

[mauchow]

Hit a homerun already.

[Young Drachma]

This feels like OOTP in real life or something.

[MizzouRah]

I'm staying up....

[Ryche]

Damn, don't know if this game will ever end. But I guess there are worse things to be doing while sitting in a hotel room in Utah.

[mauchow]

Yeah, its time to get off the laptop and go watch the game in bed where I'll be a little more comfy. See you guys later.

[GreenMonster]

Jorge Julio is in. This game will not be tied long now..

[Young Drachma]

That was a pretty uninspired call by the announcer.

[Ryche]

Crap

[GreenMonster]

I couldn't speak soon enough. LOL

[Celeval]

Jorge Julio may not make it out of this stadium alive.

[Young Drachma]

With all the guys they left on base earlier in the game, it's not like it should've come to this for the Rox anyway.

[Buccaneer]

'bout time

[MizzouRah]

Ouch.. time for me to watch the rest in bed as well.

[ISiddiqui]

Wow... Julio is BAAAAD. Reminds me of Rick Vaughn in Major League... Ball 8, Ball 12... etc.

[Lathum]

ugh

[Ryche]

Ortiz in now, this could get very ugly

[Wolfpack]

I was just sitting here watch Julio throw wild pitch after wild pitch and said to myself, "He's going to be so concerned about getting a strike that he's going to serve one up." Next pitch, it turned out.

Padres earned this victory because they stayed within themselves and batted under control. Once it got to the 9th and beyond, all the Colorado hitters were trying to end the game on one swing and kept getting blown down.

[molson]

I almost feel bad for Julio. I'm glad he's not near the Mexican Border or anything, he might be looking to unwind later.

It bring up one of the best things about baseball - in other sports, when there's a big spot, it tends to be superstar v. superstar. In baseball, you don't always have that luxury.

[Cringer]

Thanks for bringing up Alyssa Milano. I had no idea she was doing baseball stuff, it's kind of funny and kind of cool at the same time.

Mainly I thank you because it also led me to doing an image search and I saw a nude picture of her at the beach I had never seen. Even bushage. Very nice.

[Young Drachma]

These guys play at Coors Field, I hope the players realize that they better go out there and make that homefield advantage work for them.

[ISiddiqui]

Sad thing is that this game may cost Matt Holliday the MVP award. He was probably up there, but seeing him go 1 for 5 and messing up on the defensive play that tied the game, his vote totals may be far lower than they would have been.

Not saying it's right... just saying how the voters may see it.

[Buccaneer]

I hope Trevor's curve is working tonight.

[Young Drachma]

Sad thing is that this game may cost Matt Holliday the MVP award. He was probably up there, but seeing him go 1 for 5 and messing up on the defensive play that tied the game, his vote totals may be far lower than they would have been.

Not saying it's right... just saying how the voters may see it.

+1

I was thinking that.

But still to even be in a position to be the first team to come from behind to get into Wild Card position is impressive by itself in the last week of the season.

[sterlingice]

Ok, I gotta get offline, but I'll probably watch the game until the end. Depends on when that is, I suppose, as I'm dead tired and on call currently.

SI

[ISiddiqui]

Matsui with a double! And it's getting interesting.

[Ryche]

Cycle time for Tulo

[Young Drachma]

This is scoreboard material for years to come if they can pull this off. Like the '95 Mariners against the Yankees. Stuff like that.

[Wolfpack]

Hoffman's not looking very sharp at the moment.

Rockies also are more patient now that one swing can't win it for them.

[GreenMonster]

For as many saves as Hoffman has, he has blown a ton of big games. This would be awful for his career.

[Young Drachma]

Nice hit, Tulo.

[Celeval]

If Holliday wants his MVP shot, here it is.

[Celeval]

If Holliday wants his MVP shot, here it is.

[Buccaneer]

Guess not.

[Young Drachma]

He just won it. Right there.

[korme]

SHIT

[Wolfpack]

Consider the save blown. Wow.

[Celeval]

Wow

[Young Drachma]

These boys wanna go dancin'.

[yacovfb]

The only person less clutch on the Padres than Peavy is...Hoffman:(

When does hockey start?

[ISiddiqui]

WOW! What I said prior about Holliday... take it back. A game tying single after Tulo doubles in a run, makes up for a LOT! Especially if its the last thing MVP voters see about Holliday. And he may score the winning run... 0 outs, he's on third.

[JonInMiddleGA]

He just won it. Right there.

+1

[Celeval]

This is the way to start the postseason.

[johnnyshaka]

Holy crap...this is why I love baseball!!!!!

[Cringer]

Hell of a hit.

[Young Drachma]

It's REALLY hard to pitch at Coors Field. Period.

[MizzouRah]

oh my.. haven't made it out of the computer room yet.. what a game

[MizzouRah]

Who said Holliday isn't the MVP?

[Young Drachma]

But wow, clutch hitting by the Rox. But no way a team gets as far as they have, without grinding out victories.

[Ryche]

I wish Hoffman would go Nuke LaLoosh on that dinosaur mascot

[Young Drachma]

Goodnight.

[Young Drachma]

What a game.

[Young Drachma]

I love this game.

[molson]

Pretty good ending.

[Celeval]

Holy cow, I thougt they had him dead to rights at the plate.

[spleen1015]

Did he touch the plate?

[ISiddiqui]

ITS OVER! Rockies WIN! WOW, what a finish!!

[Young Drachma]

Shit. Holliday is hurt? I think he'll be okay.

[MizzouRah]

WOW! He dropped the ball!!!

[JonInMiddleGA]

wth

did barrett lose the ball by hitting him in the mouth with it?

[ISiddiqui]

Whoa... Holliday is shaken up by the collision.

[Young Drachma]

Sweet. I get to go to my first playoff baseball game ever. Rock on.

[MizzouRah]

Now kick the Phillies ass!

[Cringer]

Dropped the ball on the play at the plate, that sucks for him.

And Holiday lost half his face on the play.

[Celeval]

Did Holliday touch the plate??

[Young Drachma]

Yeah, he didn't get the plate. But hey...the umps didn't get the homerun either. So it's even.

[MizzouRah]

I don't think he touched the plate.

[ISiddiqui]

Holy crap! Holliday NEVER touched the plate!

[heybrad]

Didn't look like Holliday touched the plate.

[Wolfpack]

Ooh. I don't think he got the plate.

[Crapshoot]

AWful awful call to end the game.

[JonInMiddleGA]

okay, now it's really WTH

[spleen1015]

LOL

[heybrad]

And why the hell is ump waiting so long to make the call unless he knows he didn't touch the plate?

[Cringer]

Wow! He never touched the plate. That blows.

[korme]

Holliday didn't touch the plate

[bhlloy]

Didn't look like he got the plate at all. If so, that's going to look really bad in the commissioners office in super slo mo.

[MizzouRah]

He took quite a hand and face shot going into home.

[Crapshoot]

What shitty umpiring. Seriously - I feel for San Diego here. Trevor Hoffman deserves better.

[JonInMiddleGA]

And a great game just turned into another embarassment for baseball.
WTF, did the umpire decide he just wanted to go home? Or to get out of Denver alive?

[MizzouRah]

blown call..

[Crapshoot]

Yeah, if this isn't evidence for instant replay...

[molson]

The catcher didn't tag him either. If the umpire made the correct call, Holliday could have crawled over and touched home.

So I don't think the call effected much.

[Galaxy]

Wow.........

[stevew]

Why the hell are they passing out wildcard "champs" hats. That's clearly the silliest collectable ever. Next year they'll probably have #8 seed in the eastern conference hats.

[johnnyshaka]

That's why you don't slide head-first at home plate!!!

[ctmason]

Holliday CLEARLY didn't have the plate. I will say that Colorado was probably going to win this game...but that was a bad call that ended San Diego's season. Simple as that.

[MizzouRah]

ESPN will be all over that... and the SD news stations....

[spleen1015]

Rockies win the World Series now.

[Radii]

So... why in the hell would you only walk one guy and put men on first and third? Don't you have to load the bases in that situation no matter who is up?

[Celeval]

Instant replay wouldn't have mattered - would have just added to it. You could make an argument either way that he brushed the plate or not... wouldn't have been enough to 'overturn' it.

[Galaxy]

The catcher didn't tag him either. If the umpire made the correct call, Holliday could have crawled over and touched home.

So I don't think the call effected much.

No way. He would of been out. The catcher was running over to tag him when Holliday was still down.

[MizzouRah]

The catcher didn't tag him either. If the umpire made the correct call, Holliday could have crawled over and touched home.

So I don't think the call effected much.

The catcher DID tag him.

[INDalltheway]

Can't blame that last play on Barrett. He blocked the plate, and you can't expect him to make that pick on the short hop throw.. Holliday might have a sore face, and hand. It looked like the hand took quite a cleating.

[MizzouRah]

Bad call, but they hit the crap out of Hoffman. Who would have thunked that?

[bhlloy]

The catcher didn't tag him either. If the umpire made the correct call, Holliday could have crawled over and touched home.

So I don't think the call effected much.


Barrett had the ball ready to tag him when the umpire signalled safe. Blown call.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Good Lord, the ump in the Milton Bradley deal isn't the only one who ought to be sitting at home.

[SackAttack]

As terrible as the umpiring was all night, and as much as it sucks for the Padres to have the game end on a blown call...it's almost kind of fitting in a way, isn't it?

[Crapshoot]

So... why in the hell would you only walk one guy and put men on first and third? Don't you have to load the bases in that situation no matter who is up?

Yeah, I was screaming for the same thing - with the infield in, the probability of a double play is lowered - you load the bases, and set up the force anywhere.

[MizzouRah]

Crazy...

[yacovfb]

Bad call, but they hit the crap out of Hoffman. Who would have thunked that?

Any Padres fan really...the Union Tribune message board was filled of "don't let Hoffman pitch" quotes after the top half of the inning. Guy just doesn't get it done in the clutch.

[dime]

listening to the rockies' audio feed, and after the game guess who sez "the crowd was was so great, the fans wouldn't let us lose"...?

LATROY HAWKINS.

that's awesome.

[molson]

Now that saw the replay, ya, I was wrong on that.

[Galaxy]

The catcher DID tag him.

The ump called it before he did.

[Cringer]

What is pissing me off more is the TBS guys are now not talking about how he never touched the plate. They mentioned it at first, but the guys in the studio right now just skipped it and talked about how nasty of a slide it was. Chicken shits.

[SackAttack]

Any Padres fan really...the Union Tribune message board was filled of "don't let Hoffman pitch" quotes after the top half of the inning. Guy just doesn't get it done in the clutch.

You forgot the word "anymore."

He used to be fantastic. Now, he brings hope to opposing teams.

[GreenMonster]

Bad call, but they hit the crap out of Hoffman. Who would have thunked that?

I can't think of a more overrated closer than Hoffman. He has blown so many big games, this is just the capper for his career.

[MizzouRah]

Any Padres fan really...the Union Tribune message board was filled of "don't let Hoffman pitch" quotes after the top half of the inning. Guy just doesn't get it done in the clutch.

Seriously? 42 saves this year?

[Young Drachma]

Why the hell are they passing out wildcard "champs" hats. That's clearly the silliest collectable ever. Next year they'll probably have #8 seed in the eastern conference hats.

It doesn't say "champs" on it. I was commenting on it earlier, because in the past they have and it's really irritating and stupid.

But in a sport where only 8 teams make the playoffs...and only 2 of them are non-division winners, I think it's a meaningful enough thing to do it.

[Young Drachma]

Instant replay wouldn't have mattered - would have just added to it. You could make an argument either way that he brushed the plate or not... wouldn't have been enough to 'overturn' it.

Instant replay would've counted that home run from earlier. It's a wash.

[MizzouRah]

The ump called it before he did.

True.. but it looked like the ump was waiting for a tag at first. Why do big games always end in controversy?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Speaking of how weak the TBS coverage was, am I the only one who thought they took forever to get to the replay?

[stevew]

Who cares, both of these shit teams are going to lose to the fucking Phillies.

[ctmason]

That Umpire deserves to lose his job, the game should be called a no-contest, TBS should lose its contract and be taken off the air immediately, Bud Selig should publicly apologize and step down, and the remainder of the Playoffs (and regular seasons) cancelled and the Padres declared World Champions for all time.

Sincerely,

A Braves Fan

[Galaxy]

The catcher or any of the Padres did not protest that last call.

[MizzouRah]

Congrats to the Rockies.. should be a good series vs the Phillies.

[stevew]

dola, At least baseball games are watcheable without tim McFuckface announcing.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Jeez, I'd like to say that the Rockies win this game anyway, even if the umpire gets the call right. If he makes the right call, though, you have Helton on first with two outs, and this game may continue even deeper into the night.

If the umpire starts making the "safe" call from the moment Holliday slides through, then I'd just shrug and say that he simply blew the call. The hesitation made it look like he was just guessing. It's like he saw Holliday injured and decided to give him the benefit of the doubt and just assume that he touched home plate, as there was no way that Holliday was gonna get back up.

What an ugly finish to a terrific game. If Holliday doesn't get hurt, he jumps up and touches the plate just to be sure. Instead, he faceplants and puts everything into a really bad spot. I don't know what else to say. It could've been a relatively easy call, and it ended up being a disaster.

[MizzouRah]

Who cares, both of these shit teams are going to lose to the fucking Phillies.

Didn't you say that about the Cardinals last year? :p

[stevew]

Didn't you say that about the Cardinals last year? :p

Eh, probably.

Hamels can only pitch 2 times in a 5 game series, so honestly I think the phils will lose in 4.

[Young Drachma]

Wow, this place got crowded in a hurry...

[ctmason]

Okay so Holliday either has a concussion or knows he didn't touch home plate with this half-assed interview he gave.

[Young Drachma]

Eh, probably.

Hamels can only pitch 2 times in a 5 game series, so honestly I think the phils will lose in 4.

+1

[Celeval]

So... why in the hell would you only walk one guy and put men on first and third? Don't you have to load the bases in that situation no matter who is up?

I think it was purely setting it up - take your shot at striking out / getting Jamie Carroll to hit into a ground out, or face Brad Hawpe with the bases loaded. If they get Carroll, I think they walk Hawpe and pitch to the next guy.

[Galaxy]

Did his hand slide forward when he slid or get jam? It's hard to see where his hand went after the intial attempt.

[yacovfb]

Seriously? 42 saves this year?

When Hoffman has blown saves this year, he usually blows a couple in a row ...and with the one against Milwaukee that should have been the clinching game, there were a lot of nervous Padres fans with him pitching tonight.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Did his hand slide forward when he slid?
Holliday's hand appeared to hit Barrett's cleats and actually turn sideways as he slid through. I actually thought the injury was to Holliday's wrist at first.

[Celeval]

If the umpire starts making the "safe" call from the moment Holliday slides through, then I'd just shrug and say that he simply blew the call. The hesitation made it look like he was just guessing. It's like he saw Holliday injured and decided to give him the benefit of the doubt and just assume that he touched home plate, as there was no way that Holliday was gonna get back up.

Or... waiting to see if Holliday made a move to go back to the plate. Holliday didn't, the ump assumed he got a piece of it and makes the safe call.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Todd Helton - last Tennessee QB before Peyton Manning

[ISiddiqui]

Instant replay would've counted that home run from earlier. It's a wash.

Wait, what?! No it wouldn't. It was quite clear that it hit the yellow and bounced back.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Or... waiting to see if Holliday made a move to go back to the plate. Holliday didn't, the ump assumed he got a piece of it and makes the safe call.
That could be true, in which case that umpire should never work a playoff game again. It really looks like the umpire never actually saw Holliday's hand touch home plate. If he didn't see that, he shouldn't be making a safe call, no matter what. What a disaster.

[SackAttack]

Wait, what?! No it wouldn't. It was quite clear that it hit the yellow and bounced back.

You're out of your mind, sorry.

A bounce like that happens when the ball ricochets solidly off of metal. Off of yellow, cushy padding, no chance.

[Cringer]

So what does this make it for Rockies playoff appearances now? This their second time ever?

[Galaxy]

Holliday's hand appeared to hit Barrett's cleats and actually turn sideways as he slid through. I actually thought the injury was to Holliday's wrist at first.

It was hard to tell where it went to me. I wasn't sure if it went under his foot (and it would have touch the plate if it slid under). Anyways, go Rockies.

What a hell of a year for baseball. Hopefully the post-season follows suit.

[Karlifornia]

TBS will be good for the baseball playoffs....I like the post-game stuff....It makes it feel like the game actually mattered. If it were on ESPN, Sportscenter would be on 30 seconds later, and we'd be getting NFL injury news.

[ISiddiqui]

You're out of your mind, sorry.

A bounce like that happens when the ball ricochets solidly off of metal. Off of yellow, cushy padding, no chance.

The ultra slow motion showed it hitting off the front corner of the yellow padding. There was NO metal it could have hit off of... unless it totally missed the yellow rail and hit the ground (there were no seats right behind that wall) and bounced back... and it didn't. Or went over and hit a wheelchair sitting there, which it didn't.

[Young Drachma]

So what does this make it for Rockies playoff appearances now? This their second time ever?

Yup. 1995 Wild Card and now. That's it.

[SackAttack]

(there were no seats right behind that wall)

Yes there were. Hell, they showed the chair while the call was being discussed.

[Galaril]

Padres instead of blaming the ump should turn the finger around to themselves. What were the Padres up 4-5 games in the wildcard race with a week left. Christ they got swept by the Rockies last week at home:). Plus they had the NL probable CY winner on the mound starting and had a lead in the 13th inning. Losers. And the Phillies shouldn't take this Rockies team lightly. Sox-Rockies series I called it;)

[JonInMiddleGA]

OMG, did this moron on ESPN actually just say that the spontaneity of the moment was more important than getting the call right?

[ISiddiqui]

Yes there were. Hell, they showed the chair while the call was being discussed.

They showed a wheelchair! That's not a "seat". It was a walkway behind the railing where wheelchairs can be put. And it didn't look like it hit the wheelchair on the super slow motion. It would have had to totally clear the yellow and it didn't.

[Crapshoot]

OMG, did this moron on ESPN actually just say that the spontaneity of the moment was more important than getting the call right?

Jon, why are you ever surprised by the combinations of morons and ESPN? :D

Let me guess - Kruk, Phillips, or Tim Kurjikan?

[ctmason]

OMG, did this moron on ESPN actually just say that the spontaneity of the moment was more important than getting the call right?

I've always liked Kurkijan (or however you spell it)'s analysis but that comment was just mind blowingly stupid. I almost fell out of my chair when I said that.

When is anything more important than getting calls right and therefore calling the game fairly?

[Cringer]

OMG. SOme idiot on ESPN just said right now that instane replay would be bad. That the spontaneity of the game is much more important then gettting that call right.

You have to be kidding me? We shouldn't get a call right that sends one team home and the other to the playoffs, because we don't want to tell the fans in the stadium to hold off on cheering for a few minutes? Sounds like a great arguement. Spontaneity is much more important then the intregrity of the game.

[Young Drachma]

Kurjikan said it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Let me guess - Kruk, Phillips, or Tim Kurjikan?

Kurkjian maybe? The old looking fucker sitting there with the bald guy & Hershisher.

[Karlifornia]

How many different ways can we spell Tim Kurkjian's name? (Did I get it right? I hope so!)

[Young Drachma]

I don't think it's an integrity of the game issue. If you're gonna start having replay in baseball, then you're going to have computers calling balls and strikes and that would fundamentally change the game.

Baseball isn't football. I do think they should have it certain situations. But I just can't see them knowing where to let it end.

That said, this is a league that can't align its divisions right, plays under two different sets of rules and took over 90 years to allow non-division winners into the playoffs.

I wouldn't hold my breath for replay.

[JonInMiddleGA]

That was infinity squared more offensive than anything Harold Reynolds ever did, even if he whipped it out during PTI and pissed all over the studio while live cameras rolled.

[Cringer]

even if he whipped it out during PTI and pissed all over the studio while live cameras rolled.

That wouldn't be offensive. That would be solid gold television, my friend.

edit: and no I don't really long to see his schlong, it would just be funny.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I don't think it's an integrity of the game issue. If you're gonna start having replay in baseball, then you're going to have computers calling balls and strikes and that would fundamentally change the game.

And I'm one of those much-maligned "purists", but I've also been an advocate of making that change as soon as the technology can be made at least as reliable as the existing system (which shouldn't take much). I've got about as much faith in their integrity and ability as I do in NBA refs.

[JonInMiddleGA]

That wouldn't be offensive. That would be solid gold television, my friend.

Corso? Is that you?

[JonInMiddleGA]

How many different ways can we spell Tim Dumbfucker's name? (Did I get it right? I hope so!)

Upon further review, it appears that you indeed spelled it correctly.

[molson]

OMG. SOme idiot on ESPN just said right now that instane replay would be bad. That the spontaneity of the game is much more important then gettting that call right.

You have to be kidding me? We shouldn't get a call right that sends one team home and the other to the playoffs, because we don't want to tell the fans in the stadium to hold off on cheering for a few minutes? Sounds like a great arguement. Spontaneity is much more important then the intregrity of the game.

I don't think it's an easy question.

Baseball is entertainment above all - "He's Safe!!!" is a whole different experience than "He's Safe....let's wait for a replay, still waiting, still waiting, are they going to review it? Yes they are. waiting......waiting......Yes, Safe!!!"

There's a difference between integrity and umps blowing calls here and there. When I don't have a dog in the fight, the latter can actually add to the entertainment value of game. How does a team recover from a blown call, etc.

If it were possible tomorrow to ensure, (though technology, some delays, and a loss of spontaneity), that every single call in all sports was called exactly correct - I wouldn't be in favor of that at all. Maybe I'm the only one.

[PadresFan104]

:(:(:(:(:(:(

Go Phillies....

[Young Drachma]

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/runner_7.jsp

Just for reference...

NOTE: The catcher, without the ball in his possession, has no right to block the pathway of the runner attempting to score. The base line belongs to the runner and the catcher should be there only when he is fielding a ball or when he already has the ball in his hand.

[sabotai]

There's a difference between integrity and umps blowing calls here and there. When I don't have a dog in the fight, the latter can actually add to the entertainment value of game.

I actually agree with this. It's kind of like at the end of a movie when there's a twist and bad guy wins. Or when a totally messed up cliffhanger happens on a TV series. It adds to the drama, the story of the season.


It does suck dockey balls when it happens to your team, though. :)

[Karlifornia]

I've been a fan on the losing end of one of these (Giants@Cubs 1998). It's pretty painful. Hang in there, Pads fans...

Oh, and has Jake Peavy ever come up big in a big game?

[Karlifornia]

I've been a fan on the losing end of one of these (Giants@Cubs 1998). It's pretty painful. Hang in there, Pads fans...

Oh, and has Jake Peavy ever come up big in a big game?

[korme]

I've been a fan on the losing end of one of these (Giants@Cubs 1998). It's pretty painful. Hang in there, Pads fans...

Oh, and has Jake Peavy ever come up big in a big game?

Me too (Reds/Metros '99). It's definitely heart breaking.

[SackAttack]

So, hey, turns out the home plate umpire tonight was the same dude working the plate back in '83 for the Pine Tar game.

[yacovfb]

So, hey, turns out the home plate umpire tonight was the same dude working the plate back in '83 for the Pine Tar game.

In another connection, Bud Black was the starting pitcher for the Royals in that game

[Crapshoot]

And I'm one of those much-maligned "purists", but I've also been an advocate of making that change as soon as the technology can be made at least as reliable as the existing system (which shouldn't take much). I've got about as much faith in their integrity and ability as I do in NBA refs.

Bingo. I don't see how getting something right ruins the game. Ever since Sandy Alderson left the comissioner's office, the umpires have gone back to shit. Seriously - the discrepancy in Questec and non-Questec parks is huge.

[BishopMVP]

Just for reference...


Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">NOTE: The catcher, without the ball in his possession, has no right to block the pathway of the runner attempting to score. The base line belongs to the runner and the catcher should be there only when he is fielding a ball or when he already has the ball in his hand. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Let me know when they start calling strikes letter-high again too.

The Rockies won, they probably would've anyway (and Helton probably would've been on 2nd w/2 outs, not 1st) but the ump blew the call. It looks like ESPN/the media is glossing over it, so it won't get up to Don Denkinger status, but there's really no reasonable explanation he can give for waiting 5 seconds before making the safe call.

Also, want to mention Jim Gray?'s hilarious post-game interview with Jamey Carroll. Asks Carroll a couple questions, Carroll answers, then says "If you don't mind, I'd like to go celebrate!!!!" and Gray busts out the "Did you know your teammate is injured?" line, leading to another 30 seconds of confused, awkward airtime.

[dime]

everything about jim gray is a complete and total buzzkill.

[TroyF]

F'n horrible. Get home from an exciting game and find out a bad call won the F'n game. NOTHING pisses me off more than something like this. NOTHING. The game should have been 8-8 with Brad Hawpe coming to the plate with Helton on second. Instead we won on a blown call and anything we do from this point forward is going to have a taint on it because of it. Instead of talking about an incredible 3 run rally off of Trevor Hoffman, we are talking about a horrific umpiring decision having an impact on the game.

Ugh.

:(

[Toddzilla]

WOW - There's a bunch of Cubs Karma flowing this post season...

(1) The Mets blew the biggest September lead in baseball history and missed the playoffs - karma from the 1969 Cubs who had a 14-game lead in August and were overtaken by the Mets.

(2) The Padres just had to win one game on the road to make the playoffs with their ace on the mound and they lost - karma from the 1984 Cubs who led the Padres 2-0 in the NLCS but lost all 3 games in San Diego and the Padres went to the World Series.

(3) The Brewers simply choked away their entire season by sucking balls down the stretch - karma from, well, pick any Cubs team from recent memory.

(4) The Cardinals just stunk this year - the karma here is obvious.

Yes, baseball fans, it's destiny my friend...

[Pumpy Tudors]

Strangely, the first thing I thought of when I woke up this morning was Todd Helton. I realized that I had said last night that he'd be on first with two outs. As others have kindly pointed out, he more likely would have been on second base if the call at the plate had been correct. My bad on that one.

That's the third time this year that I've woken up with Todd Helton on my mind.

[sterlingice]

Strangely, the first thing I thought of when I woke up this morning was Todd Helton. I realized that I had said last night that he'd be on first with two outs. As others have kindly pointed out, he more likely would have been on second base if the call at the plate had been correct. My bad on that one.

That's the third time this year that I've woken up with Todd Helton on my mind.

Mancrush, pumpy? ;)

SI

[sterlingice]

The Rockies won, they probably would've anyway (and Helton probably would've been on 2nd w/2 outs, not 1st) but the ump blew the call. It looks like ESPN/the media is glossing over it, so it won't get up to Don Denkinger status, but there's really no reasonable explanation he can give for waiting 5 seconds before making the safe call.

Back when the Milton Bradley situation had just happened. Jayson Stark was on in KC, doing a weekly baseball segment, and talking about how there are quite a few in the higher up baseball brass who want to see some umpires punished for their confrontationalism and, ultimately, want to be the star of the game (paraphrasing, my words not his).

I think this easily explains the 5 seconds to make a call. I also think that's really bad form as, of course, typically that means the player didn't touch home and we're waiting for the play to complete. Clearly, he was just showing off. That said, there are a ton of people that are really wanting to glom onto that fact as something horrible, those 5 seconds, when it just clearly is another example of how everything {insert any other sport here} does is wrong but football can just teflon off everything because it's the big dog.

Also, want to mention Jim Gray?'s hilarious post-game interview with Jamey Carroll. Asks Carroll a couple questions, Carroll answers, then says "If you don't mind, I'd like to go celebrate!!!!" and Gray busts out the "Did you know your teammate is injured?" line, leading to another 30 seconds of confused, awkward airtime.

That was pure gold. Jim Gray just isn't much of an interviewer, tho. I couldn't help but think that all of his interviews were just not very good.

SI

[sterlingice]

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/runner_7.jsp

Just for reference...
NOTE: The catcher, without the ball in his possession, has no right to block the pathway of the runner attempting to score. The base line belongs to the runner and the catcher should be there only when he is fielding a ball or when he already has the ball in his hand.

Let me know when they start calling strikes letter-high again too.

Two very different types of calls. This is one of those "should be called" not a judgement call on every play. Heck, in KC, we had a guy called out for being inside the baseline on a bunt a couple of days ago and while it's a little esoteric of a rule and something that often gets missed, it should be called. This strikes me as one of those rules.

Do I think the umpire was thinking this when he made the call? If I had to guess, probably not, tho we haven't heard from him or the umpire office and probably won't about it. That said, this tells me it probably was inadvetantly the right call. Barrett didn't have control of the ball at all (or he wouldn't have dropped it) and his foot blocking the plate was the only thing that kept Holliday's about-to-be-mangled hand from touching it.

SI

[JonInMiddleGA]

... anything we do from this point forward is going to have a taint on it because of it.

I agree completely, or at least it has tainted it for me. I do, however, appreciate you acknowledging the situation.

In spite of the UT connection for Helton (which is about my only particular rooting interest in the team I can find), at this point I'd be reasonably pleased if they got swept out from this point.

[mauchow]

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/runner_7.jsp

Just for reference...

After watching the game in my bed and not being on the laptop I waited til morning to say what you did.

Without the ball he cannot interfere the runner.. so he's safe regardless, so maybe that's why there was a delay. Maybe the ump said this in that article you posted or that's just a link to the rule, regardless. He's safe, in my opinion.

[Celeval]

Back when the Milton Bradley situation had just happened. Jayson Stark was on in KC, doing a weekly baseball segment, and talking about how there are quite a few in the higher up baseball brass who want to see some umpires punished for their confrontationalism and, ultimately, want to be the star of the game (paraphrasing, my words not his).

I think this easily explains the 5 seconds to make a call. I also think that's really bad form as, of course, typically that means the player didn't touch home and we're waiting for the play to complete. Clearly, he was just showing off. That said, there are a ton of people that are really wanting to glom onto that fact as something horrible, those 5 seconds, when it just clearly is another example of how everything {insert any other sport here} does is wrong but football can just teflon off everything because it's the big dog.

Actually, I disagree with this in this instance - his safe call was very slow and tentative. He didn't wait five seconds, point to home plate and then give a huge, active, attention getting "safe"... he waited, and then just extended his arms and got out of the way.

I don't doubt the "be-the-man" thing exists among MLB umpires, but this doesn't match for it.

[Logan]

I agree, it was such a slow signal that he seemed confused by what was going on.

[Butter]

Just to correct, that was Craig Sager doing the interviewing of Jamey Carroll last night, not Jim Gray. Both knobs, but Gray is much more so.

[molson]

F'n horrible. Get home from an exciting game and find out a bad call won the F'n game. NOTHING pisses me off more than something like this. NOTHING. The game should have been 8-8 with Brad Hawpe coming to the plate with Helton on second. Instead we won on a blown call and anything we do from this point forward is going to have a taint on it because of it. Instead of talking about an incredible 3 run rally off of Trevor Hoffman, we are talking about a horrific umpiring decision having an impact on the game.

Ugh.

:(

I'd bet that every single close game (in any sport) is effected by the umpires on some level. Maybe the missed call happens on the last play, maybe it's a more subtle ball/strike or foul/no foul call earlier in the game.

[TroyF]

I agree completely, or at least it has tainted it for me. I do, however, appreciate you acknowledging the situation.

In spite of the UT connection for Helton (which is about my only particular rooting interest in the team I can find), at this point I'd be reasonably pleased if they got swept out from this point.

I'm still a fan and I'll still cheer the guys on through however long they last. And I still hope they win the World Series. It's not the Rockies fault the ump blew the call. It's also not like the Rockies lose 100% of the time if a correct call is made. (and that's the only thing you'll hear from me in the way of rationilaztion. I'm not going into the was/wasn't a HR or any other BS thing. It's simple fact that the Rockies don't lose 100% of the time if the right call is made here) I think your point above takes it a bit too far.

But. . . it just sucks that a call like this happened. It really, really sucks. As far as acknowledging the situation, it's the only thing I can do without being a hypocrite. If I say "It's my team that got the call so it's all ok" then I have to shut my mouth after something like game 6 of the Lakers/Kings series or when a call goes against "my" team.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I'm still a fan and I'll still cheer the guys on through however long they last. And I still hope they win the World Series.

That's quite cool by me.

As far as acknowledging the situation, it's the only thing I can do without being a hypocrite.

I was really thinking more in terms of acknowledging the possibility that things could be tainted for some people (like me for example) than the blown call itself.

[TroyF]

That's quite cool by me.



I was really thinking more in terms of acknowledging the possibility that things could be tainted for some people (like me for example) than the blown call itself.


I don't think enough people understand how much it takes away from accomplishments. Were the Yankees an incredible team that won a crapload of titles in the early 90's? Sure. Does the Jeffrey Mahr incident (as well as others) detract from that a little? IMO, it does. And I think it does in a lot of others minds. It's why reffing/umpiring is so critical to a sport. When the missed calls start impacting the publics view of a team or your sport, things are in really bad shape. No way you ever get rid of them completely, but it'd be nice to have competant refs out there most of the time.

[molson]

I don't think enough people understand how much it takes away from accomplishments. Were the Yankees an incredible team that won a crapload of titles in the early 90's? Sure. Does the Jeffrey Mahr incident (as well as others) detract from that a little? IMO, it does. And I think it does in a lot of others minds. It's why reffing/umpiring is so critical to a sport. When the missed calls start impacting the publics view of a team or your sport, things are in really bad shape. No way you ever get rid of them completely, but it'd be nice to have competant refs out there most of the time.

I kind of feel bad for you - I'm not saying you're wrong in the least, but I've just always been able to look past these things, even remember them fondly over the years. Jeffrey Mahr, the 5th down, etc, they all become just a part of the American sports story. The Rockies got a lucky break because the ump missed the call. If the call was correct, the Padres would have gotten a lucky break that he missed the plate by two centimeters. I few those kinds of breaks the same.

I can't imagine having the level of frustration you've expressed in this thread every time a bad call effects the outcome of the game. It's facinating to me how different people can view sports completely differently.

[sabotai]

After watching the game in my bed and not being on the laptop I waited til morning to say what you did.

Without the ball he cannot interfere the runner.. so he's safe regardless, so maybe that's why there was a delay. Maybe the ump said this in that article you posted or that's just a link to the rule, regardless. He's safe, in my opinion.

This reminds me of the "tuck rule" incident, just that most people seem to be on the other side of the fence on this one (and the ump isn't making reference to the rule). By the rules, it seems like the technically correct call, but not being a baseball fan, I can't say if this has happened a thousand times before, and the ump called it differently the other 999 times.

[molson]

This reminds me of the "tuck rule" incident, just that most people seem to be on the other side of the fence on this one (and the ump isn't making reference to the rule). By the rules, it seems like the technically correct call, but not being a baseball fan, I can't say if this has happened a thousand times before, and the ump called it differently the other 999 times.

Good comparison. Though I think that after the Brady tuck game, the rule was reviewed, they remembered why it was there, kept it, and now I've seen it called at least a half dozen times since then.

Probably won't see the same aftermath here.

[Galaril]

Who cares, both of these shit teams are going to lose to the fucking Phillies.

Good call. Typical arrogant northeasterner;) Rockies 4- Phillies 2:cool: