Werewolf LVII: Cathedral (GAME OVER!)

[Barkeep49]

This game has been inspired by Coffee Warlord’s famous Yak game, as well as a game I saw somewhere that involved the idea of building something. Not sure whose that was. I will also say that I have nothing but the utmost respect for those who are of religious belief and am using religion in more of the cultural folklore sense than any literal interpretation.

Introduction
The year is 1350 and the town of St. Saldana has been prosperous for many years. It is now time to take that prosperity and use it to honor God, who has made it all possible by building a cathedral.. This would lack any noteworthiness were it not for the fact that the Devil was in a particular pique one day about all of the church construction, only days before the cathedral was to be completed. Hoping to win favor with the boss, Lucifer has led a crack team of demons to stop this cathedral. Not wanting to see years of piousness go to waste, St. Gabriel has led his own SWAT team of angels to make sure that the years of hard work do not go to waste. And then on top of all this you have the Bishop (the Bishop!) in town to consecrate the church and you have a quite a few hectic days ahead.

Sides and Victory Conditions

Villagers : Win a normal victory by either eradicating the village of demons or by completing the construction of the cathedral. Win a major victory if they complete both.

Angels: Win a major victory if the church is completed. Win a minor victory if the devils are eradicated from the village but the church is not completed.

Demons: Win a normal victory if they prevent the construction of the cathedral by achieving a 1-1 ratio with the villagers, a minor victory if the angels are eradicated, and a major victory if they accomplish both.

Bishop: The Bishop is a revered person in the community, but no one is quite sure whose side he’s on since his rise to the position of power was not completely through sacrosanct means.

Note: The game will end either if there are no Demons left or at the end of the following day after all work on the Cathedral is complete (so if all work is done by the end of Day 3, the Cathedral must still have no work left at the end of Day 4).

Cycles
Day Cycle – During the day cycle players can do two things: vote and work on the cathedral. A player may do 2 of one thing, or 1 of each.

A vote should be at the end of a post, bolded, and in the color orange, so it looks like this:
I’ve never seen someone who is more obviously a wolf.

Vote Barkeep
Votes not properly formatted may be missed.

Once a player works on the Cathedral they may not change where they are working.

Once a player votes they may unvote and choose a different player to vote for but they may not work on the Cathederal.

A player may do two actions in one post. Each action should be listed separately. If voting for a player twice, vote on separate lines.
Day Cycles begin approximately 8 AM Eastern and last until 10 PM Eastern. Players may choose to PM the moderator with an advance action if they’re unavailable during the Day Cycle. The player with the most votes will be lynched, and removed from the game.

Ties: In the event of two players having an equal amount of votes at the end of the day, the player whose average vote has been on the longest (determined by post #) will be lynched. In the event of this being equal, the player with the longest held vote will be lynched.

Night Cycle – Lasts from 10 PM Eastern to 7 AM Eastern. During this time anyone who has a night action may submit it.

Each night the Demons will have the option of either killing a player or having two demons sabotage the Cathedral and attempt to damage it. They may sabotage the same place twice or two separate places. The Demons cannot do the same night action more than two days in a row.

The order to the Night Cycle actions are not publicly known due to the hidden nature of powers in the game.

Roles

Villagers
All players will have a public role. Not all roles have a special power or ability. Angels/devils may get to keep the power of their public role. There is the standard Duke (http://www.rwbl.net/fofcwiki/index.php?title=Duke), Bodyguard (http://www.rwbl.net/fofcwiki/index.php?title=Bodyguard), Seer (http://www.rwbl.net/fofcwiki/index.php?title=Seer). There will also be a cultist who appears to the seer to be a villager, and counts as a villager for ration purposes, but wins with the Demons. He has other abilities.

Demons
This is a list of possible Demon roles. Only Lucifer is guaranteed to be in the game. Demons are allowed to communicate freely outside of the game thread.

Lucifer – The head Devil. As an incredibly powerful supernatural being he cannot hide his identity from St. Gabriel, but equally he knows the identity of St. Gabriel. He will, however, appear as a villager if scanned by the seer. According to The Rules, he may not reveal who St. Gabriel is posing as, even to the other Demons. He may freely communicate with St. Gabriel (cc’ing the GM). Lucifer also has other powers, unknown to any but himself.

Azazel – Brutal wolf. If lynched he will be able to kill another player. If killed at night he will kill the player attacking him before he dies.

Beelzebub – Any night attempt at sabotage is guaranteed to succeed and will cause double damage to that area. If blocked by Michah, he will only cause normal damage.

Leviathan – Once per game he may make a night kill which cannot be blocked. If the bodyguard is present, the bodyguard will learn the identity of the Leviathan.

Henchman – No special powers.

Angels
This is a list of possible Angels roles. Only St. Gabriel is guaranteed to be in the game. Angels are allowed to communicate freely outside of the game thread.

St. Gabriel – The head Angel. As an incredibly powerful supernatural being he cannot hide his identity from Lucifer, but equally he knows the identity of Lucifer. He will always appear as a villager if scanned. According to The Rules, he may not reveal who Lucifer is posing as, even to the other Angels. He may freely communicate with Lucifer (cc’ing the GM). Gabriel also has other powers, unknown to any but himself.

Elijah – Once per game may designate a player (non-Angel) who cannot be killed or lynched for the next 3 cycles (beginning with that cycle).

Michah – May designate an area to be safe from wolf sabotage each night.

Rhamiel – May scan a player each night to attempt to learn the details of their powers.

Uriel – Every other day may do twice as much work as normal on the Cathedral.


Building the Cathedral

There is unfinished work left to be done in several areas of the Cathedral. In order to work on the Cathedral post the “Work on” action in bold and in the color orange. So, for instance

Work on Walls

There is work to be done on the following areas:
Walls
Roof
Windows
Artwork
Carpentry

How many shifts of work are left to be completed will be announced at the start of the game.

No work on the Roof or Windows may be done until the Walls are finished. If the Walls become damaged during the course of the game work may continue on the Windows and Roof.

A player may choose to fake their work on an area by PM’ing me.

Different areas cause different amounts of damage if sabotaged. When an area is sabotaged successfully it will always cause the same amount of damage, however, there are powers which can mitigate the damage in an area.

[Barkeep49]

List of Roles:
Bishop: Neon Chaos
Bishop's Assistaint: ntndeacon
Lord Leige: Alan T
Knight: Lathum
Page: oliegirl
Friar: saldana
Novice: Chief Rum
Peon: path12
Moneylender: DaddyTorgo
Goldsmith: Mr. Wednesday
Blacksmith: Pass
Shepard: st.cronin
Mason: Schmidty
Butcher: Anxiety
Carpenter: PurdueBrad
Musician: RendeR

Alternate:
ArlingtonColt

[Barkeep49]

Status of the Cathedral:

UNFINISHED

Left to do:

Walls - Finished
Roof - Completed - May not be further damaged
Windows - Finished
Artwork - Completed - May not be further damaged
Carpentry - 6 units of work

[Barkeep49]

Placeholder 2

[saldana]

wow...i have a town named after me, i feel so honored.

[Neon_Chaos]

In.

[st.cronin]

I'll play.

[path12]

Yes please.

[Lathum]

Great, now I need to deal with Saldana's ego for the rest of my life.


In

[Chief Rum]

In!

[RendeR]

Count me in, I've become so addicted to this damn game its not even funny. THe good side of this is that my job now allows me ample time to post during the week.

[hoopsguy]

I'm assuming start time for this is next Monday?

[Barkeep49]

I'm assuming start time for this is next Monday?
Correct. Roles will go out Sunday with the first deadline Monday.

I'm currently polishing the rules. I expect them up around 4 or so Eastern.

[Passacaglia]

In. Pretty cool that now we have two saints playing werewolf.

[PurdueBrad]

I'm in

[hoopsguy]

OK, then I'm going to have to miss this one. Have a flight out on Thursday, will be doing a migration over the weekend, and another flight on Tuesday. Too much time that I would be missing in the middle of the game.

Bummer - usually like to try and play in BK's games and this will be the second in a row I've missed.

[st.cronin]

OK, then I'm going to have to miss this one. Have a flight out on Thursday, will be doing a migration over the weekend, and another flight on Tuesday. Too much time that I would be missing in the middle of the game.

Bummer - usually like to try and play in BK's games and this will be the second in a row I've missed.

This is all just a ruse to avoid being lynched on day 1.

[hoopsguy]

I'm now ducking games to keep the "never lynched as a villager" streak alive :) God I'm pathetic.

[Alan T]

I'm going to have to miss this one as well I think. Put me down as an alternate though as I might have a few days in the middle that I am available. Just not available this weekend, or the following weekend and none of november (I assume it wouldnt last that long though).

[Mr. Wednesday]

When's the estimated finish of this game? If it'll be done by the 25th, I can play.

[Barkeep49]

When's the estimated finish of this game? If it'll be done by the 25th, I can play.
Since it looks like we're going to have a smaller group of players I'd imagine we'd be finishing up around that time.

[Barkeep49]

I'll also add the the full rules have now been posted. While not a simple rule set, I've really tried to keep things simple compared to other games of mine.

[ArlingtonColt]

If it's gonna be weekend exempt I'll play... I'm busy all weekend

[Schmidty]

I've got my laptop now, and a ton of time at work, so I'm in. One caveat: I'll be most active during the middle of the night (work), and I won't be around until 2-3 pm EST each day. If that's ok, I'm in. If it's not, let me know.

[oliegirl]

What the hell, I'm in...damn addicting werewolf games!

I'm actually off work next week so I'll be around and available all day, nights it just depends on what is going on but I should be around for deadline every night with one possible exception...

[DaddyTorgo]

IN

is it bad i don't even read the ruleset anymore, i just type in?

[DaddyTorgo]

if i'm lucifer or grabriel what use will i make of my power to PM my opposite number?? ohhh just you wait and see...it will be interesting

[RendeR]

if i'm lucifer or grabriel what use will i make of my power to PM my opposite number?? ohhh just you wait and see...it will be interesting


You sir are Had as a Matter.

[Neon_Chaos]

Oooh. Render's playing?


Sweet.

[Lathum]

so when is this starting?

[Neon_Chaos]

so when is this starting?

dolaquestion.

[Barkeep49]

Roles are going to be sent out Sunday, first deadline will by Monday night.

[Alan T]

If it's gonna be weekend exempt I'll play... I'm busy all weekend


BK, what was your answer to this question? I absolutely won't be able to play any weekend this month. I probably won't be able to post any during the evenings on any weekday or be around at deadlines, but I can probably play and post while at work during the days. If this fits ok with the game, you can slide me from being an alternate to playing.

[Barkeep49]

I normally do a normal night on Friday and then run a day from Saturday morning until Sunday night with another normal night Sunday night, as it keeps the game moving.

However, I'd like you both to play so it would be more likely that I would run a super long day, ending at a normal Monday time, in there somewhere since I think no weekend play at all can kill momentum.

[Alan T]

Ok, go ahead and put me in, since the weekend would come after my normal day 3 death, it probably doesn't matter. Worst case, I miss one vote I guess.

[Abe Sargent]

Count me in as well please

[saldana]

if still taking ins, in would like to be in as well

[saldana]

I would like to be in as well

[EagleFan]

I may enter. I have been away for a while and my wife was unable to get online all week. I had similar problems this morning but am okay at the moment. These comcase problems seem to occur suddenly and last up to month and a half with no guaranteed connection and then vanish as wuickly as they show up. Because of that I want to see if the connection stays reliable before I commit as I don't want to be in the middle of something like this and then not be able to get online.


(don't see this as guilty chatter and duke me.... :D)

If I do get in, let me know when I can vote AC and vote cronin.... :D j/k

[RendeR]

Oooh. Render's playing?


Sweet.

I live for nothing more than your entertainment.

[Barkeep49]

Roles will start to be sent out shortly. Please do not post until I've posted the game opening post.

A quick note on how roles were determined. Each role was given a power. I then used random.org to decide which roles would be the demons/angels. Certain roles could not become a demon or angel and other roles had their powers decreased if they became an angel or demon. I then used random.org again to decide who would have what role.

[Barkeep49]

There is excitement in the air (or at least fumes). After years of work there is so little left to do on the beautiful Cathedral. The community has worked together for years to finish this mammoth project and it is so close you can almost taste it (though tasting is not advised as brick and mortar is rather poisonous).

But now, just as victory seems so close there was a set back. Your priest has warned you about the temptation of the Devil but it seems that some did not heed his warnings and now the Devil is in your very town. But you know that God would not forsake you and so perhaps there are some sent to help you. And so begins the work of both finding the devils and completing the work on the Cathedral.

The game has now started and you may start posting. I have posted the list of public roles in post 2.

This last half hour has been exceedingly busy at my work and so I have not finished balancing how much work needs to be done in the different areas. I will be posting this as soon as I am happy with the balance.

Remember that you have two actions to do each day and may choose to do one of two things with each: work on the Cathedral or vote for a player.

[DaddyTorgo]

I'M THE MONEYLENDER!!!!

[Chief Rum]

I have a public role, but not sure what point there is to share it yet. I am a villager.

[ntndeacon]

could you lend me some money DT?

[Neon_Chaos]

Bishop here. We're officially starting tomorrow morning right?

[Barkeep49]

I have a public role, but not sure what point there is to share it yet. I am a villager.
Check post 2. Everyone's role is listed there.

[Barkeep49]

Bishop here. We're officially starting tomorrow morning right?
First deadline is tomorrow at 10 PM but play can start at any time

[Barkeep49]

Looking over the work that has yet to be done you see the following needs:

Walls - 8 units of work
Roof - 4 units of work
Windows - 2 unit of work
Artwork - 12 units of work
Carpentry - 12 units of work

Each work action completes 1 unit of work

[Chief Rum]

Check post 2. Everyone's role is listed there.

I'm still not saying what I am. :)

[Chief Rum]

And at least I'm not the Shepherd that sheep-bleeping pervert.

[st.cronin]

And at least I'm not the Shepherd that sheep-bleeping pervert.

Ex-squeeze me?

[Lathum]

bahhh

[Chief Rum]

Ex-squeeze me?

Ya heard me!

[st.cronin]

Well, may as well start working on the cathedral.


WORK ON WALLS

[Abe Sargent]

Ex-squeeze me?

No, I'm not a sheep. I'm the butcher :)

In other news, I'm back after a long hiatus. Hope I'm not too rusty.

I too have a villager role, but I'll keep it hidden for now. It;s not major or significant, but I like keeping an ace in my sleeve, or pork in my boot or whatever the appropriate butcher analogy is.

-Abe

[st.cronin]

Welcome back, Abe. I really missed having you in these games.

[ntndeacon]

Sounds like a plan cronin..

Work on walls

[Barkeep49]

Welcome back, Abe. I really missed having you in these games.
I'll echo this thought.

[Abe Sargent]

Welcome back, Abe. I really missed having you in these games.

Thanks buddy, I really appreciate it!

[Alan T]

Hey, I'm checking in, sorry I haven't had much time to catch up I just got home from moving stuff from storage to my new home. I tried to skim through the rules real quick, but ran out of time (have to do a work change at 8pm tonight), so I'll try to catch up further during the work day tommorrow.

I don't have enough feel for anyone to make a vote for anyone just yet (I haven't fully read all of the posts yet -- am still on page 1). The main things I picked up in the rules was that it seems important to do work on the cathedral, and a day 1 vote where we don't know much about other people does not seem like a good day to do a double vote for someone. I looked then to see where to work on, and it seems to make the most sense to work on the walls, as two other areas depend on its construction..

I'll try to familiarize myself with other people's role descriptions and such tommorrow if I have time. Back tommorrow!

So...

Work on walls

[st.cronin]

That's three people working on walls (presumably). We need 8 units of work on the walls - until then, no work on windows or roof can be done.

I feel like we have a better shot at forcing the demons to cooperate if we spread out the work we do, so I suggest splitting our work between WALLS, ARTWORK, and CARPENTRY. That way supposing some work that was announced does not get done, we have a list of 5 or 6 possible people to vote for.

Even if this plan is unworkable (which I guess it probably is), I still think its a good idea for us to divide our efforts in those three areas.

By the way isn't the proper spelling "shepherd"?

[saldana]

checking in...will post a work action in a bit...just rereading the whole ruleset

[oliegirl]

Villager checking in...and posting my work action. I'd hate to break a nail doing constuction or working on walls, so...


WORK ON ARTWORK

[Abe Sargent]

That's three people working on walls (presumably). We need 8 units of work on the walls - until then, no work on windows or roof can be done.

I feel like we have a better shot at forcing the demons to cooperate if we spread out the work we do, so I suggest splitting our work between WALLS, ARTWORK, and CARPENTRY. That way supposing some work that was announced does not get done, we have a list of 5 or 6 possible people to vote for.

Even if this plan is unworkable (which I guess it probably is), I still think its a good idea for us to divide our efforts in those three areas.

By the way isn't the proper spelling "shepherd"?

Makes sense.

Build Artwork

[RendeR]

Just got time to check in, I'll pay you all a lullabye as I am the Musician. I ned to read up on the rules again so I can offer something useful tomorrow

For now, I'm out!

[RendeR]

Thats PLAY you a lullabye, DT is the money man, HE'll pay you for...well whatever sins he's into I guess =)

[DaddyTorgo]

Thats PLAY you a lullabye, DT is the money man, HE'll pay you for...well whatever sins he's into I guess =)

right now i'm very into beautiful blonde girls from cleveland who think that i'm the best thing that ever happened to them.


errrr ummm...okay...back to WW

[Schmidty]

So we're already starting?

[Barkeep49]

So we're already starting?
Just a long Day 1. No worries if you don't post until tomorrow.

[Schmidty]

Welcome back, Abe. I really missed having you in these games.

Hey, no love for Schmidtmeister too?

[st.cronin]

Hey, no love for Schmidtmeister too?

Well, I knew you'd be back eventually ... I was genuinely worried that Abe was gone forever.

But, yes, I do love you as well Schmidty. :)

[PurdueBrad]

Hey all, carpenter should probably do some carpentry work, so:

work on carpentry

BTW, I'm sure that there are some wood-working jokes out there to be made but I'll leave it untouched (hehe) for now.

[path12]

Welcome back, Abe. I really missed having you in these games.

+1 and checking in.

[Abe Sargent]

Hey, no love for Schmidtmeister too?

I love you too!!!

[Schmidty]

I feel the love. I love everyone!!!!!!!

[Passacaglia]

Blacksmith checking in. I'd like to see the walls done as soon as possible. I'm going to work on them once tonight, then a second time again this afternoon -- I'll keep the one around, in case I need to throw a vote on someone, though I don't see that as being likely Day 1.


WORK ON WALLS

[RendeR]

There is way too much man-love going around in here for my taste....

[Schmidty]

There is way too much man-love going around in here for my taste....

I'm sending you a mental kiss right now.

[Chief Rum]

I will be out all day tomorrow as usual, so having the long Day One is actually of significant benefit to me. I will put in my votes right now.

WORK ON CARPENTRY

Since we seem to be following the sheep-bleeper's plan.

And...

VOTE ANXIETY

Welcome back, Abe!

[Chief Rum]

Hmm, maybe selected the wrong color. Oh well, it still seems rather obvious.

[saldana]

i agree with whoever said we should get the walls done first so we can have access to the roof and windows....as long as we get them done, that opens up the ability to get everything started, even if they later get sabotaged.


work on walls

[Barkeep49]

Hmm, maybe selected the wrong color. Oh well, it still seems rather obvious.
The color should be "orange".

[DaddyTorgo]

unfortunately i'm not lucifer or gabriel so you can't see what types of nefarious things i'd get up to with my PM's as I alluded to earlier in the thread.

[Passacaglia]

I will be out all day tomorrow as usual, so having the long Day One is actually of significant benefit to me. I will put in my votes right now.

WORK ON CARPENTRY

Since we seem to be following the sheep-bleeper's plan.

And...

VOTE ANXIETY

Welcome back, Abe!


I don't like this play at all. I really feel like we should be making sure one part is totally finished. Also, why put in a vote for Anxiety? I'd rather us get the Cathedral finished then waste our time pointing fingers at each other with no info. I realize this gives the demons some power over the vote, but I think we can use that -- voting for someone at this point seems like a demon move. Also, that yellow is blinding! :p

[Coffee Warlord]

I highly reccommend you sacrifice some yaks to make this project go well. :)

Good luck everyone, will be enjoying my view from the gallery.

[Lathum]

Morning all.

first, you are a bunch of fags. :)

second, I think a good place to look is someone who was quick to begin building something. It seems like a good place for a wolf to try and hide.

[Neon_Chaos]

The good Lord has tasked us to complete this cathedral... but he also warns us of demons in our midst.

As His standard-bearer, I cannot sit idly by and watch as these sons of Satan wander in our midst. I must find them, I must do what is tasked to me by Him on high.

so....

Work On Walls

and a vote to be named later.

[Neon_Chaos]

first, you are a bunch of fags. :)


Speak for yourself, oh loser to King-Nines! ;)

[st.cronin]

So, per the rules, we can perform two actions: if we like, we can actually vote twice. Or, we can work on the cathedral, or do one of each action. If nobody votes for anybody today, and we all work on the cathedral, I am guessing there will be no lynch.

I have argued this in other games, but I believe that no lynch on day 1 is normally a benefit to the village - we've had a number of games recently where that's been borne out. So I am urging all parties to NOT vote for anybody today, and instead work on the cathedral twice.

The downside is that, apparently, if only one player casts one vote, that vote will result in a lynch. We already have one vote for Anxiety, which I hope gets taken back.

I'll be out most of the day, but will check in around lunchtime.

[Lathum]

I think if we are going to randomly vote it may be a good idea to look at the public roles and try to determine which one is potentialy the least valuable to us.

I have to go to an eye doctor appointment but I am gonna do some analysis on that when I get back

[RendeR]

I think if we are going to randomly vote it may be a good idea to look at the public roles and try to determine which one is potentialy the least valuable to us.

I have to go to an eye doctor appointment but I am gonna do some analysis on that when I get back


I don't think the public roles really mater, they're just a point from which we can get into character. The real power lies in the secret roles that we don't want to give out to avoid being killed off early.

I'd really LOVE to avoid a first day reveal/death by the seer for once (last 2-3 games the seer has bit it before day 3)

I'm actually in agreement with Cronin on this one. Lynches right now don't help us at all, we need everyone we can get to work on the cathedral and get stuff done. Once we can at least work on all the areas we can spend some actions voting people out. Even then though, perhaps we'd just be ebtter off working our asses off 2x a day and finishing the cathedral before the demons ever have time to defeat us?

I mean at best there are what? 4 demons? so thats 12 or so people doing 2 bits of work a day, thats 24 units of work a day, we COULD finish the cathedral by day 2-3 max.

If we DO that, even if the demons kill one or two over those 2-3 days, we win with ease.

Or am I missing something realy simple here that would cause that to fail?

[Mr. Wednesday]

I don't think the public roles really mater, they're just a point from which we can get into character.
That's not true of my role. I actually do have a minor ability to assist the village, which I prefer not to discuss at this time (so as not to give the wolves additional info in choosing their targets).

[Mr. Wednesday]

I mean at best there are what? 4 demons? so thats 12 or so people doing 2 bits of work a day, thats 24 units of work a day, we COULD finish the cathedral by day 2-3 max.

If we DO that, even if the demons kill one or two over those 2-3 days, we win with ease.

Or am I missing something realy simple here that would cause that to fail?

I have to assume that Barkeep has the game a little better balanced than that. :)

(Or, alternatively, that when he sees the game going that way, he will react accordingly.)

[saldana]

barkeep, question about this...

Once a player works on the Cathedral they may not change where they are working.


does this mean that since my first action was to work on the walls, if i want my second action to also be a work action, it has to be ALSO on the walls, or can i choose a different location for my second action?

i would suggest no one else put in work orders until this gets answered, as we may have so many people already working on one spot that we are going to waste efforts today.

[Barkeep49]

barkeep, question about this...

Once a player works on the Cathedral they may not change where they are working.


does this mean that since my first action was to work on the walls, if i want my second action to also be a work action, it has to be ALSO on the walls, or can i choose a different location for my second action?

i would suggest no one else put in work orders until this gets answered, as we may have so many people already working on one spot that we are going to waste efforts today.
No. Each action is independent. So you've submitted a work action on the walls and that's not going to change. However you can work on a different area with your second action, or cast a vote.

[Abe Sargent]

interesting point saldana.

And thanks CR, I maybe don't love you as much as the others now. ;)

[saldana]

So, per the rules, we can perform two actions: if we like, we can actually vote twice. Or, we can work on the cathedral, or do one of each action. If nobody votes for anybody today, and we all work on the cathedral, I am guessing there will be no lynch.

I have argued this in other games, but I believe that no lynch on day 1 is normally a benefit to the village - we've had a number of games recently where that's been borne out. So I am urging all parties to NOT vote for anybody today, and instead work on the cathedral twice.

The downside is that, apparently, if only one player casts one vote, that vote will result in a lynch. We already have one vote for Anxiety, which I hope gets taken back.

I'll be out most of the day, but will check in around lunchtime.


unfortunately, even if the vote is taken back, according to the rules, an unvote cannot be turned into a work order, only another vote...this fact makes the quick vote for anxiety stink a little bit more in my opinion...because of it, we now have a "random" vote on someone, and lost a work action.

[RendeR]

I have to assume that Barkeep has the game a little better balanced than that. :)

(Or, alternatively, that when he sees the game going that way, he will react accordingly.)


Well, you read the rules and let me know where the difference is, He said he balanced out the requirements for the cathedral.

Secondly, I've never seen a GM step in and "adjust" things mid-game so I'm not really buying into BK doing anything if we actually do try ths tactic. Worst case is we get the demons trying to sabotage everything as soon as they can and hopefully in doing so will give themselves away.

[saldana]

No. Each action is independent. So you've submitted a work action on the walls and that's not going to change. However you can work on a different area with your second action, or cast a vote.

thanks BK....one more question...if someone decides to bluff their work order, can they change to another section via pm, or change to a vote, or do all orders have to be public, and only the bluff notification goes to you by PM?



with that in mind, here are the work levels thus far.

Walls - 8 needed, 6 publicly completed (cronin, NTN, alan, pass, saldana, N_C)
Artwork - 12 needed, 2 publicly completed (olie, anxiety)
Carpentry - 12 needed, 2 publicly completed (PB, CR)

so we only need two more people to put in work orders for the walls, and we can then assume they will be complete at the end of the day...if they arent, it means someone lied, and then we have a starting point for tomorrow.

[Abe Sargent]

Okay, let me talk a little more about the strategy which st. cronin suggested yesterday. I agree, and I worked on the artwork. Why?

If we have 4/5s of the players work on the same thing, and some work goes undone, what have we learned? That out for 80% of the players at least one is a demon? Thats not that much help. Divide everybody into groups of six or so, and do work, now the demons have less room to hide. If they choose to not do work, then we have a smaller working group. It forces the demons to work.

[Abe Sargent]

If we go 8 on teh walls, thats half. The other four people should diuvide evenly between artowrk an dcarpentry.

[Lathum]

I don't think the public roles really mater, they're just a point from which we can get into character. The real power lies in the secret roles that we don't want to give out to avoid being killed off early.





As the Knight I also have a minor power I will keep to myself.

Mr. Wednesday confirmed he had a power as well to go with his role.

I am wondering if Demons don't have that and Render just tipped his hand here.

[Passacaglia]

Anxiety, I like your thinking. I'm considering working on the walls a second time, to reduce the number of people working on it. Thoughts?

[Passacaglia]

Here's another thought: Why shouldn't we just kill the Bishop?

[Barkeep49]

thanks BK....one more question...if someone decides to bluff their work order, can they change to another section via pm, or change to a vote, or do all orders have to be public, and only the bluff notification goes to you by PM?

I don't think I quite understand the question, but I'm going to try and answer it anyway. Think of submitting a work order as going to that part of the church and doing some work. You can fake the work you've done but with so many people around you can't sneak off to another place. All actions are public with only the faking being a PM.

[Alan T]

I don't know if it is because I am reading everything all at once instead of how I normally am here as posts come in, but this day one seems to have alot of people "teaming up" on like ideas so to speak in a way that feels a bit off to me.. maybe its just my perception of it all..

So I think I caught up on everything.. I don't have the time to jump back a page to a few of the comments that I felt a bit weired out by, so just chose one of the ones on page 3 with me to make it fast/easy.

Here's another thought: Why shouldn't we just kill the Bishop?


I don't understand this point of view.. if I read the rules right (maybe I didn't fully comprehend them or something here), we don't know if the bishop is good or bad, so in the end he is the same as any of the rest of us.. someone with a public role that we don't know their private allegience.. I don't understand how that singles him out any more than anyone else. Maybe he has his own victory conditions? The rule page doesn't list any for him.. but I guess if he has his own private allegience, it probably wouldn't... I just assume some of the public roles are powerful and the bishop would be one of those such roles.. Why would we want to kill off someone who might be on our side that could carry a powerful role quickly? That doesn't really sit right with me.

I think the better approach to the bishop would be assume he does have a powerful role and try to figure out which side he is planning on using that power on through whatever means we have available to us. The same thing could be said about a few other of the publicly listed roles as well I would think. In many games, the seer has to figure out who they want to scan based on other things, but this game there is a different factor for them to work in, so I would think the Bishop would be one of the roles (just as my own role) that seem to lead itself to needing to be scanned early on. If I was the seer, I would probably scan either neon or myself early in the game. I don't see why you would want to then just kill off the bishop that early on for no reason.

As for some of the other stuff going on. I think its important to get the walls built, so I am hoping that we see enough people do work in order to get them completed so we can start working on the next sections of the cathedral. Either through people doing double work, or additional people doing the work. Its also apparent that we won't have a no lynch today, so the idea Cronin tossed out is an impossibility. Once the vote has been cast, you can't undo it. (other than moving it to someone else). So we'll have a lynch of some sort today, it now just depends on who will get the most votes.

Part of me wanted to come out and vote for Chief because of his quick vote putting us into this situation before any more conversation could come from it.. however thinking about it for a little longer (for like 2-3 minutes instead of the instant gut check), I think I'm going to play a hunch here and vote with Chief. We're going to have to lynch someone, so Anxiety probably is just as good as anyone else.

I wish I could be around for more of the conversation, but I doubt I will be back again the rest of the day. If I do manage to get back, it will be tonight (possibly right before or after the lynch). So good luck on the rest of the day!

Vote Anxiety

[Passacaglia]

Alan -- Given what you've read about the Bishop in the rules, what would you guess is the probablity that he's not interested in helping us?

the problem with having the seer scan the Bishop is that I'm not sure the results would be interesting to us.

[Passacaglia]

And geez, don't you people want to build this damn Cathedral?!?

[Lathum]

OK, here are the public roles. I have highlighted the ones I don't see having much potential value

Bishop: Neon Chaos
Bishop's Assistaint: ntndeacon
Lord Leige: Alan T
Knight: Lathum
Page: oliegirl
Friar: saldana
Novice: Chief Rum
Peon: path12
Moneylender: DaddyTorgo
Goldsmith: Mr. Wednesday
Blacksmith: Pass
Shepard: st.cronin
Mason: Schmidty
Butcher: Anxiety
Carpenter: PurdueBrad
Musician: RendeR


These are the ones I see having not much value. Combine that with what I think is a screw up by him I will

VOTE RENDER

[Passacaglia]

Couldn't his screw up just been because his role is one of the few with no value?

[Neon_Chaos]

Here's another thought: Why shouldn't we just kill the Bishop?

Because it wouldn't be nice? :)

[Lathum]

Walls - 8 units of work
Roof - 4 units of work
Windows - 2 unit of work
Artwork - 12 units of work
Carpentry - 12 units of work

Each work action completes 1 unit of work

Walls- 6 ( St.Cronin 55), (NTNDeacon #58), (alanT #61), (Passacaglia #77), (Saldana #82), (NeonChaos #88)

Artwork- 2 (Oliegirl 64), (Anxiety #65)

Carpentry- 2 (PerdueBrad #73), (chiefrum #80)

So this is what we still need done

Walls - 2 units of work
Roof - 4 units of work
Windows - 2 unit of work
Artwork - 10 units of work
Carpentry - 10 units of work

[RendeR]

I got the responses I wanted from my post. I have an ability, but I was afraid to jump in and admit I did until I knew for certain there were others with one.

I agree we should get the walls done asap So:


Work On Walls

[Lathum]

Couldn't his screw up just been because his role is one of the few with no value?

I don't think I understood the question.

as far as I know everyone should have some sort of hidden minor ability. Render claimed not to have one. I know it's not much but it's something.

[Lathum]

I got the responses I wanted from my post. I have an ability, but I was afraid to jump in and admit I did until I knew for certain there were others with one.


I'm calling BS

[RendeR]

I'l save my second action in case we get into a bad voting situation. I firmly believe we should be wasting our actions on voting today and that the longer we keep everyone around working the easier this game will be and the faster it will end.(for the villagers win)

[Passacaglia]

Because it wouldn't be nice? :)

Can you tell us any more about your role?

[Passacaglia]

I don't think I understood the question.

as far as I know everyone should have some sort of hidden minor ability. Render claimed not to have one. I know it's not much but it's something.

But it seems like you've spelled out three people who you don't think have a hidden minor ability, so it's not everyone, right?

[Lathum]

Work on Walls


that should theoreticaly complete our work on the walls unless someone is faking ( which I consider likely )

[RendeR]

I'm calling BS


How does this NOT surprise me. You're being awfully aggressive for a first day Lathum, who put a bug up your butt?

[Lathum]

But it seems like you've spelled out three people who you don't think have a hidden minor ability, so it's not everyone, right?

I never said that I don't think they have an ability. I said I think their abilities could be less usefull.

For example who would you assume is more valuable the blacksmith or the muscian?

[Lathum]

dola- I know it's not much but I'm bored and it;s something to discuss

[st.cronin]

Alan, why did you cast a second vote on Anxiety? Can you explain that?

VOTE CHIEF RUM

That gives us three candidates. I don't like the two early votes for Anxiety - when Abe was a regular, I thought he was the best villager around. I think both those votes stink to high heaven.

[Lathum]

How does this NOT surprise me. You're being awfully aggressive for a first day Lathum, who put a bug up your butt?

no bug up my but.

I am usually agressive on day 1, more often then not it gives us information down the road.

Plus when I see something I think is off I am going to point it out.

I think your statements are off.

[st.cronin]

VOTE CHIEF RUM

Reposting for color purposes, although I want to state that I can barely read the orange text.

[RendeR]

Lathum, if you really need to know my ability to relieve your suspicion I'll announce it. I don't think its enough to make me a huge target for the demons as I'm betting they would rather fry some flying fish instead of a wandering minstral.

So you make the call, If it will get you off my back I'll reveal what I can do for the village.

[Passacaglia]

I never said that I don't think they have an ability. I said I think their abilities could be less usefull.

For example who would you assume is more valuable the blacksmith or the muscian?

I see what you mean -- my power is pretty valuable, so it's a good thing for us that it's ended up in the hands of someone like me.

[Lathum]

Lathum, if you really need to know my ability to relieve your suspicion I'll announce it. I don't think its enough to make me a huge target for the demons as I'm betting they would rather fry some flying fish instead of a wandering minstral.

So you make the call, If it will get you off my back I'll reveal what I can do for the village.

show me where I said I want you to reveal anything?

besides, you can say anything at this point and there is no way to verify it, so why even bother.

[RendeR]

I want to reiterate that I think based on the rules of the game lynching is a bad idea. The more people we get rid of the less people there are to get work done. The fastest and simplest way to win this game for us is to get everyone building each day.

Its simple math, the demons can't out-kill our ability to build, even with sabotage I don't think they have the numbers to kill us off faster than we can complete the job.

[Passacaglia]

VOTE CHIEF RUM

Reposting for color purposes, although I want to state that I can barely read the orange text.

TWO votes on him? This is craziness, and while I don't like the Anxiety votes, it really seems to be taking us away from the task at hand.

Do you have some extra motiviation to save Anxiety?

[Neon_Chaos]

Can you tell us any more about your role?

Well, I am heavily invested in the Cathedral being finished. But unlike the angels and demons, my loyalties lie not to their own respective groups, but to my flock, the villagers. True victory for mankind can only be achieved by fulfilling His will. Alas, I am sworn to a vow of silence, and cannot explain much further.

[st.cronin]

Lathum, I didn't post anything in thread but I had a similar situation to Render. I had to read my pm three times before I figured out what my ability was. I would give him the benefit of the doubt for now.

[Passacaglia]

Well, I am heavily invested in the Cathedral being finished. But unlike the angels and demons, my loyalties lie not to their own respective groups, but to my flock, the villagers. True victory for mankind can only be achieved by fulfilling His will. Alas, I am sworn to a vow of silence, and cannot explain much further.

That's not exactly instilling me with confidence.

[st.cronin]

TWO votes on him? This is craziness, and while I don't like the Anxiety votes, it really seems to be taking us away from the task at hand.

Do you have some extra motiviation to save Anxiety?

No, its a combination of sentimentality and respect for his skillz as a villager. Also his spelling is highly amusing. There was one game where, in a single post, he spelled the word "the" three different ways.

Seriously, I prefered no-lynch. Two of the first three votes were for Anxiety, which seems incredible to me. I'd bet one of CR or Alan T is a demon.

[Lathum]

Lathum, I didn't post anything in thread but I had a similar situation to Render. I had to read my pm three times before I figured out what my ability was. I would give him the benefit of the doubt for now.

do you still feel the same way now that he is claiming he was attempting to find out if other people had abilities?

[Neon_Chaos]

I want to reiterate that I think based on the rules of the game lynching is a bad idea. The more people we get rid of the less people there are to get work done. The fastest and simplest way to win this game for us is to get everyone building each day.

Its simple math, the demons can't out-kill our ability to build, even with sabotage I don't think they have the numbers to kill us off faster than we can complete the job.

To the simple-minded worker, or a supernatural being whose only purpopse is to finish a stone monument, this is so. But when you are given a higher calling... things are not as simple as it seems.

Might I quote the Bible.

Villagers win true victory if they destroy the beings foul, AND complete the cathedral. They merely win a minor one should the cathedral be completed.

Lest you be a divine seraph, sir, would you consider victory to be true by merely completing the place of worship.

The flock must be guided to His will. Of course, I cannot blame you, a mere musician, for having a narrow-minded view of things. You have naught an idea of the storm that brews beneath.

As Bishop, I am indeed leaning on voting for either Chief Rum or Anxiety. An inquisition must take place.

AND NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!!!

[RendeR]

show me where I said I want you to reveal anything?

besides, you can say anything at this point and there is no way to verify it, so why even bother.

See, this is the crap I dislike. You toss out some accusation and when I try to offer a rebuttle you take the "doesn't matter what you say" position and no matter how I try to handle it it just makes me look worse. OF course then I'm all but required to point out what an excellent con job it is for you to do so on the first day and you toss back "so now your accsing me, blah blah blah"

Did I miss the statement in the rules that informed us that the regaular villager roles would have secret abilities? I've read over them twice now and I'm not seeing it. Please do enlighten me. If I'm just an idiot and missed it I'll admit so.

I wanted to know if others had some sort of skill/ability, but admiting I had one if no-one else did makes me look like a Deamon/Angel and makes me a target. If I downplay the value of the public roles, then someone will pipe up with a reason they are important, exactly as they did.

So now we all know that probably everyone has some sort of special skill which makes your notion that there are any that are expendable, rather wrong. They're all important in some way.

This brings me back to why you're interested in lynching someone anyway, as I've stated before and I tihnk Cronin did as well, finishing the cathedral is the quick win play. If we lynch people we lose work ability, lets build as fast as we can and see what we can learn from the seer(s) for a day or two and then take that info and go after people.

Or am I just making you more suspicious simply by defending myself?

[st.cronin]

do you still feel the same way now that he is claiming he was attempting to find out if other people had abilities?

Eh, I can see that as a weasely villager play too. Sometimes when the pressure is on you have to come up with weird stuff.

I'm ok with a Render lynch, but I don't see what you're seeing.

[Neon_Chaos]

Did I miss the statement in the rules that informed us that the regaular villager roles would have secret abilities? I've read over them twice now and I'm not seeing it. Please do enlighten me. If I'm just an idiot and missed it I'll admit so.


Villagers
All players will have a public role. Not all roles have a special power or ability. Angels/devils may get to keep the power of their public role. There is the standard Duke (http://www.rwbl.net/fofcwiki/index.php?title=Duke), Bodyguard (http://www.rwbl.net/fofcwiki/index.php?title=Bodyguard), Seer (http://www.rwbl.net/fofcwiki/index.php?title=Seer). There will also be a cultist who appears to the seer to be a villager, and counts as a villager for ration purposes, but wins with the Demons. He has other abilities.

Might this mean that certain public roles, but not all, have secret abilities!?

*SHOCK!*

May I call thee an idiot now, ser?

:)

[RendeR]

To the simple-minded worker, or a supernatural being whose only purpopse is to finish a stone monument, this is so. But when you are given a higher calling... things are not as simple as it seems.

Might I quote the Bible.

Villagers win true victory if they destroy the beings foul, AND complete the cathedral. They merely win a minor one should the cathedral be completed.

Lest you be a divine seraph, sir, would you consider victory to be true by merely completing the place of worship.

The flock must be guided to His will. Of course, I cannot blame you, a mere musician, for having a narrow-minded view of things. You have naught an idea of the storm that brews beneath.

As Bishop, I am indeed leaning on voting for either Chief Rum or Anxiety. An inquisition must take place.

AND NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!!!


Forgive my insolence Reverend, but give me your ear for a moment and let me explain the goodly bent of my thoughts.

We go majorly hard at finishing the cathedral. I'm assuming based on the math that we "could" finish it on day 3" (If anyone has numbers otherwise please post them!)

That gives us 2 days for those powers that be to help guide us to the deamons and hopefully finding at least one, perhaps leading us to a situation where we can complete oth of your grande convictions.

The inquisition father, is a foolish toy at this time, let those who live the sinful life reveal themselves to us as they most assuradly will as al know that evil cannot abide good and will succumb to the urge to act on their evil.

Then we will have them.

[Passacaglia]

NC, based on your quote, I think RendeR's fine. He obviously just doesn't have a special role after all.

[Abe Sargent]

Alan, why did you cast a second vote on Anxiety? Can you explain that?

VOTE CHIEF RUM

That gives us three candidates. I don't like the two early votes for Anxiety - when Abe was a regular, I thought he was the best villager around. I think both those votes stink to high heaven.

Yeah, but it will take me a while to get back to speed. :)

And I wasn;t that great. Lathum, CR, hoops, BK are all better'n me and about ten people are my equal.

[RendeR]

Might this mean that certain public roles, but not all, have secret abilities!?

*SHOCK!*

May I call thee an idiot now, ser?

:)


Gah...indeed, I am an idiot, the Village idiot it seems.

[Passacaglia]

Well, I am heavily invested in the Cathedral being finished. But unlike the angels and demons, my loyalties lie not to their own respective groups, but to my flock, the villagers. True victory for mankind can only be achieved by fulfilling His will. Alas, I am sworn to a vow of silence, and cannot explain much further.

If you're invested in the Cathedral being finished, why are you supporting a lynch?

[Lathum]

See, this is the crap I dislike. You toss out some accusation and when I try to offer a rebuttle you take the "doesn't matter what you say" position and no matter how I try to handle it it just makes me look worse. OF course then I'm all but required to point out what an excellent con job it is for you to do so on the first day and you toss back "so now your accsing me, blah blah blah"

I never said your rebuttle doesn't matter. I meant you could claim to have any secret ability and there would be no way to verify

Did I miss the statement in the rules that informed us that the regaular villager roles would have secret abilities? I've read over them twice now and I'm not seeing it. Please do enlighten me. If I'm just an idiot and missed it I'll admit so.

no one said you are an idiot.

The rules state that not all roles have a special power or ability, so why would you have a plan to find out if other people have a power or ability? It doesn't make much sense.

I wanted to know if others had some sort of skill/ability, but admiting I had one if no-one else did makes me look like a Deamon/Angel and makes me a target. If I downplay the value of the public roles, then someone will pipe up with a reason they are important, exactly as they did.

Why not just come out and say " I have a special ability, does anyone else?"

IMO trying to be coy about it seems far more suspicous.

So now we all know that probably everyone has some sort of special skill which makes your notion that there are any that are expendable, rather wrong. They're all important in some way.

from the rules

Villagers
All players will have a public role. Not all roles have a special power or ability


This brings me back to why you're interested in lynching someone anyway, as I've stated before and I tihnk Cronin did as well, finishing the cathedral is the quick win play. If we lynch people we lose work ability, lets build as fast as we can and see what we can learn from the seer(s) for a day or two and then take that info and go after people.

Or am I just making you more suspicious simply by defending myself?

I never think it is a good thing to no lynch and if you think the game is going to be as easy as rush to build the cathedral then win I think you are mistaken.

[Lathum]

NC, based on your quote, I think RendeR's fine. He obviously just doesn't have a special role after all.

he claims he does in post 114

[Neon_Chaos]

If you're invested in the Cathedral being finished, why are you supporting a lynch?

Unlike angels, we mortals must fulfill the Lord's desire. We are his chosen, and only through true victory will we be saved.

[Abe Sargent]

Alright, we need to cut out the Day One stuff and move on to building. Unfortunately we can't unvote the ones who have voted, so it looks like someone is going down tonight for sure. I am going to save my second action for later in teh day, in case I need to vote self-defensively.

[Lathum]

dola- I just want to point out that if you guys think this game is going to be as easy as rushing to build a cathedral you are nuts

[Abe Sargent]

I never said your rebuttle doesn't matter. I meant you could claim to have any secret ability and there would be no way to verify



I actually have a minor role that is verifiable, but I'd prefer not to have to have that person do so on Day One.

[Passacaglia]

dola- I just want to point out that if you guys think this game is going to be as easy as rushing to build a cathedral you are nuts

I don't think many of us think it will be that easy -- but I happen to think it's the best Day 1 play.

[st.cronin]

Lathum, I doubt building the cathedral will be easy at all. But I don't think its a bad idea to TRY to build the cathedral.

[RendeR]

show me where I said I want you to reveal anything?

besides, you can say anything at this point and there is no way to verify it, so why even bother.

This says you did in fact say any rebuttle is pretty well meaningless.

Gah...indeed, I am an idiot, the Village idiot it seems.

I was asking for someone to point out something I missed, they did, so I'm calling myself an idiot, I never suggested you caled me one.


The rules state that not all roles have a special power or ability, so why would you have a plan to find out if other people have a power or ability? It doesn't make much sense.


I didn't read it right, or thoroughly enough, NC pointed it out and I admit my mistake.


Why not just come out and say " I have a special ability, does anyone else?"

IMO trying to be coy about it seems far more suspicous.


Are you stoned? If it turned out that only a very few people had special skills then I'd be lining myself up at the executioners block for the deamons to slaughter. Come on now, you're not that naive.


I never think it is a good thing to no lynch and if you think the game is going to be as easy as rush to build the cathedral then win I think you are mistaken.

I would normally agree with you on the no lynch, most games with a more standard rule set mean that lynches are our only real way to gain knowlege, howver this is not a basic game, there is a very good reason to keep people alive. A- it gives us more work actions, speeding up the build, B- it keeps the villager/Deamon ratio far away from a 1-1, especially as most day 1 lynches are villager/villager affairs.

So i understand you want a lynch, I'm just hoping you can see how this game makes a day 1 or even day 2 lynch a bad thing if they are blind, no knowledge, "we HAVE to lynch someone" actions. it just doesn't benefit us.

[Lathum]

Lathum, I doubt building the cathedral will be easy at all. But I don't think its a bad idea to TRY to build the cathedral.

show me where I said it was?

[Barkeep49]

I just want to be clear: There will be a lynch each day. One way or another...

[Passacaglia]

Lathum, I doubt building the cathedral will be easy at all. But I don't think its a bad idea to TRY to build the cathedral.

If you really think that, why would you waste your actions voting for CR?

[Passacaglia]

I just want to be clear: There will be a lynch each day. One way or another...

oh shi

Still, I think we're best served by building this cathedral first, then figuring out who the demons are. I liked Anxiety's plan for how we could both build the Cathedral and try to find some demons. I think we should really proceed with that tomorrow.

[Lathum]

oh shi

Still, I think we're best served by building this cathedral first, then figuring out who the demons are. I liked Anxiety's plan for how we could both build the Cathedral and try to find some demons. I think we should really proceed with that tomorrow.

hmmmm

Maybe I am missing something here but if someone is going to get lynched regardless don't you think we should focus some of our efforts into finding the demons?

[st.cronin]

Ok, well, I'll be back later. I hope to see some explanation from CR and Alan T for their votes when I get back.

[oliegirl]

I have a private role as well, but would rather not reveal it this early in the game.

Not sure where I stand on the voting, I've got some stuff to do around the house and then I'll go through and re-read everything and make my observations and decisions...

[RendeR]

I just want to be clear: There will be a lynch each day. One way or another...


Well shit then....this blows my position to hell and back.


Fuckit, lynch me, go for it. I'm no deamon so all you learn is that...GASP, I'm no deamon.:(

[Neon_Chaos]

The Lord almighty has spooken! An inquisition must take place!

AND NOBODY EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!

[Lathum]

I have a private role as well, but would rather not reveal it this early in the game.

Not sure where I stand on the voting, I've got some stuff to do around the house and then I'll go through and re-read everything and make my observations and decisions...

I'm confused.

role or ability?

[Neon_Chaos]

I hath misspelled spoken!

[Passacaglia]

hmmmm

Maybe I am missing something here but if someone is going to get lynched regardless don't you think we should focus some of our efforts into finding the demons?

I have never been interested in avoiding a lynch -- I just want to get as much built as we can, and quickly.

This begs the question, what happens if we kill the demons -- is there anything stopping us from just finishing the cathedral? I don't get how a major victory isn't just automatic if we kill the demons.

[DaddyTorgo]

been busy all day so far. haven't really even thought about checking in. figured i'd go with the "no vote and build instead" idea barring any major snafus by the demons.

[RendeR]

I have never been interested in avoiding a lynch -- I just want to get as much built as we can, and quickly.

This begs the question, what happens if we kill the demons -- is there anything stopping us from just finishing the cathedral? I don't get how a major victory isn't just automatic if we kill the demons.

My ponderings had just hit upon this question as well. perhaps the quick-fix of building confused me a ibt. If we kill al the deamons we should automatically win the major victory.

[oliegirl]

I'm confused.

role or ability?

Sorry, ability.

[Passacaglia]

hmmmm

Maybe I am missing something here but if someone is going to get lynched regardless don't you think we should focus some of our efforts into finding the demons?

My ponderings had just hit upon this question as well. perhaps the quick-fix of building confused me a ibt. If we kill al the deamons we should automatically win the major victory.

I had already sent Barkeep a PM asking about it. Hopefully his answer will clear things up.

[RendeR]

I had already sent Barkeep a PM asking about it. Hopefully his answer will clear things up.

Good man!

[path12]

I would have been in favor of the no lynch plan today, but I'm just a peon, so what do I know? Well, I do know a thing or two actually, but that's not important yet. It looks like we're set on walls, so I will

WORK ON CARPENTRY

I'll save a vote for later, but have to say the quick two votes on Anxiety stunk from this viewpoint also.

[Barkeep49]

My ponderings had just hit upon this question as well. perhaps the quick-fix of building confused me a ibt. If we kill al the deamons we should automatically win the major victory.
The OOG explanation is that I intended to make major victories difficult. The game automatically ends when all the Demons have been killed, but not when the Cathedral is finished. Logically you are correct, that would make sense, it's just not how it happens in this game :)

[RendeR]

Ok, that makes sense then, i don't think any of us realized that the game didn't end with the Cathedral being built.

So my original plan should work out the best, get the thing built and done so we don't have to worry about it and then go whole hog after the demons.

Simple ;)

[RendeR]

Ok, so there will be a lynch, one way or another, the game does NOT end with the building of the Cathedral, but that is a winning point for us if we manage it.

So lets get crackin boys! get this bitch built and lets get to dealin some death to some deamons!!!

[Barkeep49]

Let me just quote the rules to be clear about what I'm talking about:

Note: The game will end either if there are no Demons left or at the end of the following day after all work on the Cathedral is complete (so if all work is done by the end of Day 3, the Cathedral must still have no work left at the end of Day 4).

[saldana]

I want to reiterate that I think based on the rules of the game lynching is a bad idea. The more people we get rid of the less people there are to get work done. The fastest and simplest way to win this game for us is to get everyone building each day.

Its simple math, the demons can't out-kill our ability to build, even with sabotage I don't think they have the numbers to kill us off faster than we can complete the job.

not making a judgment on render as demon or not, but this is a false assumption...we have no idea at this point how much work will be undone by a successful sabotage mission, nor how much and how many times they can amplify their damage...our entire days work could be undone in one night for all we know right now.

[Mr. Wednesday]

See, this is the crap I dislike. You toss out some accusation and when I try to offer a rebuttle you take the "doesn't matter what you say" position and no matter how I try to handle it it just makes me look worse. OF course then I'm all but required to point out what an excellent con job it is for you to do so on the first day and you toss back "so now your accsing me, blah blah blah"
The problem is, you didn't actually come out and cop to having some unrevealed ability until after several other people had already done so. This is the sort of thing where, for better or worse, you only get one chance to make the right decision, and you can't really do anything to fix it if you choose wrong. I'm not sure which way I go on how innocent your mistake is, but it's something that's very difficult to talk your way out of.

[Mr. Wednesday]

WORK ON ARTWORK

[Mr. Wednesday]

What's our vote count?

[Passacaglia]

WORK ON WALLS

[RendeR]

not making a judgment on render as demon or not, but this is a false assumption...we have no idea at this point how much work will be undone by a successful sabotage mission, nor how much and how many times they can amplify their damage...our entire days work could be undone in one night for all we know right now.

You are absolutely right sal, I am making an assumption that they can't undo a butt-load of work at any give time. if they can then there is no rush either way, and has further discussion (and GM explanation have shown) we don't win automaticaly when the cathedral is finished, its a way to get a win but its probably not as easy as I would have thought in the beginning.

[Barkeep49]

What's our vote count?
Now that I'm home I'm going to go through and do an official tally.

[RendeR]

The problem is, you didn't actually come out and cop to having some unrevealed ability until after several other people had already done so. This is the sort of thing where, for better or worse, you only get one chance to make the right decision, and you can't really do anything to fix it if you choose wrong. I'm not sure which way I go on how innocent your mistake is, but it's something that's very difficult to talk your way out of.


I wasn't aware that anyone had come out and said anything about abilities prior to my stating that I thought the public roles were unimportant. I know 2 people did shortly after that and that is what I hoped would happen with my comments.

My only real error was not reading and comprehending the rules as listed. NC pointed them out to be after the fact and I put on my village idiot cap. Done and done.

[Barkeep49]

Here's what I have:

Cathedral:
Walls – cronin (55), ntn (58), Alan (61), Pass (77), saldana (82), Neon (88), Render (114), Lathum (120), Pass (181)
Artwork – olie (64), Anxiety (65), Mr. W (179)
Carpentry – PurdueBrad (73), Chief Rum (80), path (172)

Votes:
Anxiety – Chief Rum (80), Alan (107)
Render – Lathum (110)
Rum – Cronin (124)

Remaining Actions: Neon Chaos (1), ntn (1), olie (1), saldana (1), path (1), Daddy T (2), Mr. W (1), cronin (1), Schmidty (2), Anxiety (1), Purdue (1), Render (1)

[saldana]

so based on barkeeps numbers, we could finish either the artwork or the carpentry today as well if enough people put in the same work order

[Neon_Chaos]

Ah, what have we here, votes on the Butcher, the Novice, and the Musician?

Seeing as you already have two votes upon your name. Pray tell, Butcher Anxiety, why should I not place a vote upon you? How are we certain that your daily slaughters are not for want of sacrifice to the demonic hoardes?

And you, Musician Render, what say you to the accusation brought forth by the Knight? Perhaps your simple tunes are nothing more but a ruse... you play pleasant tunes when in fact, you serve a purpose much darker than the notes that you pluck?

And where has this Novice been? I will have to question his motives as well... casting the first stone against the Butcher.

I have lent my service to building the cathedral. A vote must now be given. 'Tis a burden to do so, but the Lord wills it. I must come to a decision before the hour of judgement is at hand.

[Abe Sargent]

Ah, what have we here, votes on the Butcher, the Novice, and the Musician?

Seeing as you already have two votes upon your name. Pray tell, Butcher Anxiety, why should I not place a vote upon you? How are we certain that your daily slaughters are not for want of sacrifice to the demonic hoardes?

And you, Musician Render, what say you to the accusation brought forth by the Knight? Perhaps your simple tunes are nothing more but a ruse... you play pleasant tunes when in fact, you serve a purpose much darker than the notes that you pluck?

And where has this Novice been? I will have to question his motives as well... casting the first stone against the Butcher.

I have lent my service to building the cathedral. A vote must now be given. 'Tis a burden to do so, but the Lord wills it. I must come to a decision before the hour of judgement is at hand.

Maybe Chief Rum was throwing out a random Day One vote, and he chose me because I hadn't played in awhile and he liked the irony.

The problem is that he didn;t need to vote. He could have saved his second action for cathedral building, but he didn;t. Now he can;t take it back and do work. Instead he has to vote for someone, althoughhe can change targets. Since his action locked him in to voting instead o fbuilding, I have to quesiton his motives.

-Abe

[Barkeep49]

I'm off to dinner, and will likely be back in an hour and a half or so.

[Neon_Chaos]

O Lord! O Lord! Where hast thou gone!? Why do I smell roasted pork and carrots!?

[RendeR]

Ah, what have we here, votes on the Butcher, the Novice, and the Musician?
...
And you, Musician Render, what say you to the accusation brought forth by the Knight? Perhaps your simple tunes are nothing more but a ruse... you play pleasant tunes when in fact, you serve a purpose much darker than the notes that you pluck?
...
I have lent my service to building the cathedral. A vote must now be given. 'Tis a burden to do so, but the Lord wills it. I must come to a decision before the hour of judgement is at hand.



Typical clergyman, lazy, self ritious, self import......err..Oh hi there Bishop =)

Not to point out the obvious, but yer assistant should be keeping you up to date on matters of state and all that. please re-peruse the thread thus far and you'll find my statements to the aforementioned accusations.

[RendeR]

O Lord! O Lord! Where hast thou gone!? Why do I smell roasted pork and carrots!?


Actually it was corned beef and fettucini alfredo....

[RendeR]

I will happily ad to the work being done (I've already added to the wall) once I know that I'm not going to be lynched, until then I have to keep my remaining action available for self preservation purposes.

[Abe Sargent]

Typical clergyman, lazy, self ritious, self import......err..Oh hi there Bishop =)

Not to point out the obvious, but yer assistant should be keeping you up to date on matters of state and all that. please re-peruse the thread thus far and you'll find my statements to the aforementioned accusations.

This is funny to me. I laughed.

[ntndeacon]

I do not like the early votes on Anxiety either. I am unsure where Chief Rum came up with those.

Vote Chief Rum

[Schmidty]

Why do I still have 2 actions? I think I need to read the rules again.

Here's what I have:

Cathedral:
Walls – cronin (55), ntn (58), Alan (61), Pass (77), saldana (82), Neon (88), Render (114), Lathum (120), Pass (181)
Artwork – olie (64), Anxiety (65), Mr. W (179)
Carpentry – PurdueBrad (73), Chief Rum (80), path (172)

Votes:
Anxiety – Chief Rum (80), Alan (107)
Render – Lathum (110)
Rum – Cronin (124)

Remaining Actions: Neon Chaos (1), ntn (1), olie (1), saldana (1), path (1), Daddy T (2), Mr. W (1), cronin (1), Schmidty (2), Anxiety (1), Purdue (1), Render (1)

[Neon_Chaos]

I do not like the early votes on Anxiety either. I am unsure where Chief Rum came up with those.

Vote Chief Rum

Ah my wonderful assistant. Where have you been? The day has been long, and quite tiring. I need a bath, preferrably with delightful little bubbles.

[Schmidty]

Ok, well I'm the mason, but it looks like there's enough work on the walls, so I'll:

WORK ON ARTWORK

[RendeR]

I'm at work and students are stupid, so I'll be back later on prior to deadline.

[Lathum]

I am getting ready to go out for the Giants game in a few minutes.
hopefully we bag us a demon tonight

[ntndeacon]

and watch the Giants go down in flames

[Lathum]

and watch the Giants go down in flames

listen here....

[ntndeacon]

hey what can I do. I am a Falcons fan

[Neon_Chaos]

What is this talk of Giants and Falcons!?

Heretics!? Blasphemers!?

[ntndeacon]

Pish posh! Falconing is the sport of nobility. nothing Blasphemous about it.

Now Giants on the other hand.....

[Abe Sargent]

Pish posh! Falconing is the sport of nobility. nothing Blasphemous about it.

Now Giants on the other hand.....

...have big gazongas?

[Mr. Wednesday]

So I can either cast a deciding (for the time being) vote on the Chief or Anxiety, or I can create a tie by going with RendeR, or I can start in on somebody new...

Hmm, I'm concerned by Torgo's failure to get any work done yet.
VOTE Daddy Torgo

[PurdueBrad]

Guys/gals, sorry, not feeling well at all (Crohn's disease issues), so I'm likely out the rest of tonight. I'll put in my work request because I'm a bit drained to read through the last couple pages.

Work Carpentry for the second time today.

[Abe Sargent]

Guys/gals, sorry, not feeling well at all (Crohn's disease issues), so I'm likely out the rest of tonight. I'll put in my work request because I'm a bit drained to read through the last couple pages.

Work Carpentry for the second time today.

No prob buddy. Hope everything is better tomorrow.

[DaddyTorgo]

torgo's had a busy day and been wrapped up with lady. Here now

and just about to ask...any disadvantages to doing 2 pieces of work?

[DaddyTorgo]

WORK ON WALLS

[saldana]

torgo's had a busy day and been wrapped up with lady. Here now

and just about to ask...any disadvantages to doing 2 pieces of work?

WORK ON WALLS

this has me a bit miffed....i can understand being busy at work and home just as well as anyone, but it would have taken about 2 minutes to go back and see that work orders for the walls were overkill, and as a result, a wasted action!

that is a very wolfy move to me.

[saldana]

dola...he only had to go back 15 posts to see the day's action summary.

[saldana]

and his posts were 7 minutes apart, so he didnt go back 15 posts in 7 minutes ?!

[DaddyTorgo]

this has me a bit miffed....i can understand being busy at work and home just as well as anyone, but it would have taken about 2 minutes to go back and see that work orders for the walls were overkill, and as a result, a wasted action!

that is a very wolfy move to me.

yeah it would have taken too much time. I can unwork on walls can't i?

UNWORK ON WALLS

[DaddyTorgo]

and his posts were 7 minutes apart, so he didnt go back 15 posts in 7 minutes ?!

nope. Watching the Sox game.

[saldana]

you cant unwork....once you name a spot, you are stuck there

[DaddyTorgo]

you cant unwork....once you name a spot, you are stuck there

oh...well...fuck me very much

any disadvantage to working on a second thing somewhere else?

[saldana]

no...you can use your second work action on a different location.

[saldana]

or you can vote with it

[oliegirl]

hey what can I do. I am a Falcons fan

I am too, but I still leave in the real world...I hope for the best, but have learned not to expect it...

GO FALCONS!

[Abe Sargent]

This is the obligatory self-defense vote.

Vote Chief Rum

[Barkeep49]

Here's what I have as of 222:

Work Completed
Walls – cronin (55), ntn (58), Alan (61), Pass (77), saldana (82), Neon (88), Render (114), Lathum (120), Pass (181), DaddyT (211)
Artwork – olie (64), Anxiety (65), Mr. W (179), Schmidty (198)
Carpentry – PurdueBrad (73), Chief Rum (80), path (172), Purdue (208)

Vote Count:
Anxiety – Chief Rum (80), Alan (107)
Render – Lathum (110)
Rum – Cronin (124), ntn (195), Anxiety (222)
Daddy T – Mr. W (207)

Remaining Actions: Neon Chaos (1), olie (1), saldana (1), path (1), Daddy T (1), cronin (1), Schmidty (1), Render (1)

[saldana]

Here's what I have:

Cathedral:
Walls – cronin (55), ntn (58), Alan (61), Pass (77), saldana (82), Neon (88), Render (114), Lathum (120), Pass (181), DaddyTorgo (211)
Artwork – olie (64), Anxiety (65), Mr. W (179), schmidty (198)
Carpentry – PurdueBrad (73), Chief Rum (80), path (172), PurdueBrad (208)

Votes:
Anxiety – Chief Rum (80), Alan (107)
Render – Lathum (110)
Rum – Cronin (124), ntndeacon (195), anxiety(222)
DaddyTorgo - Mr. Wed (207)

Remaining Actions: Neon Chaos (1), olie (1), saldana (1), path (1), Daddy T (1), cronin (1), Schmidty (1),Render (1)

updated

[saldana]

fine barkeep...do it yourself...see if i care.

[oliegirl]

His absence during the day, and then lack or reading/research before submitting his night action definitely leaves me suspicious. And after his behavior in the last game, I'd prefer to err on the side of caution this time...

VOTE DADDY TORGO

[path12]

Anxiety is good.

VOTE CHIEF RUM

[Barkeep49]

fine barkeep...do it yourself...see if i care.
I appreciate someone checking my work as I've been known to make mistakes.

[Neon_Chaos]

Mmmm. Now this is intriguing. The Peon path12 has vied for the Butcher's innocence. Very well. There is much to be gained from this.

Vote Chief Rum

[saldana]

anxiety....knowing how we do, that Chief Rum is never around on Mondays, if you would be inclined to switch your vote to DaddyTorgo, i would go there as well to make the lynch for the same reasons Olie outlined above.

[path12]

anxiety....knowing how we do, that Chief Rum is never around on Mondays, if you would be inclined to switch your vote to DaddyTorgo, i would go there as well to make the lynch for the same reasons Olie outlined above.

I would be willing to go along with this, for the record.

[saldana]

what would be best is if we could agree on a lynch candidate without people that still have actions having to vote, that way we could still get a little more work done...Neon...would you consider going from Rum to Torgo?

[Abe Sargent]

That;s fine,. I'll lead. Again, purely sd, but I don;t mind where people vote and CR won;t be here to efned himself.

Vote DaddyTorgo

[Neon_Chaos]

what would be best is if we could agree on a lynch candidate without people that still have actions having to vote, that way we could still get a little more work done...Neon...would you consider going from Rum to Torgo?

Willing, yes. But what business is it of a Friar to meddle in others' affairs? Perhaps one could tell him to mind his own flock, lest he be under the scrutinous eye of an inquisition himself. It makes no difference, the Novice, or the Moneylender. But perhaps the Moneylender has more to offer than a mere Novice? Willing, indeed, I may be willing, but certainly not easily swayed.

[Barkeep49]

That;s fine,. I'll lead. Again, purely sd, but I don;t mind where people vote and CR won;t be here to efned himself.

Vote DaddyTorgo
You need to unvote first.

[Abe Sargent]

Sorry. I was all frenetic and stuff.

UNVOTE CHIEFRUM
VOTE DADDYTORGO

[path12]

UNVOTE CHIEF RUM
VOTE DADDYTORGO

[saldana]

Willing, yes. But what business is it of a Friar to meddle in others' affairs? Perhaps one could tell him to mind his own flock, lest he be under the scrutinous eye of an inquisition himself. It makes no difference, the Novice, or the Moneylender. But perhaps the Moneylender has more to offer than a mere Novice? Willing, indeed, I may be willing, but certainly not easily swayed.

begging your pardon, your reverence, but how would one that commits the sin of usury bear your trust, while one who has started down the path to the service of our Lord bear your scorn.

[Barkeep49]

Here's what I've got as of 238:

Work Completed
Walls – cronin (55), ntn (58), Alan (61), Pass (77), saldana (82), Neon (88), Render (114), Lathum (120), Pass (181), DaddyT (211)
Artwork – olie (64), Anxiety (65), Mr. W (179), Schmidty
Carpentry – PurdueBrad (73), Chief Rum (80), path (172), Purdue (208)

Vote Count:
Anxiety – Chief Rum (80), Alan (107)
Render – Lathum (110)
Rum – Cronin (124), ntn (195), Neon (229)
Daddy T – Mr. W (207), oliegirl (226), Anxiety (236), path (237)

Remaining Actions: Daddy T (1), cronin (1), Schmidty (1), Render (1)

[path12]

I must run. Back after deadline.

[saldana]

barkeep...i still have an action left.

[Barkeep49]

barkeep...i still have an action left.
Correct.

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE CHIEF RUM

self defense

sorry i've been busy today people...but it's a day 1

[Neon_Chaos]

begging your pardon, your reverence, but how would one that commits the sin of usury bear your trust, while one who has started down the path to the service of our Lord bear your scorn.

You have the votes that you need, from what I see, four hands to three by the last count of the nearest sinner. You have no use of mine, and it shall stay as it is.

The hour of judgement is near. I feel that angels and demons shall soon meddle in the affairs of mortal men.

[Neon_Chaos]

VOTE CHIEF RUM

self defense

sorry i've been busy today people...but it's a day 1


Ah... and now the plot thickens! Four votes to four, indeed! How many among the plebians are left to vote? So, Moneylender, would you be so inclined as to convince me to not move my vote over to you?

[Neon_Chaos]

The Shepard, Mason, and Musician have yet to inform us all of his actions. Will they be around for when the bell tolls?

[DaddyTorgo]

STOP VOTING ME !!!

[Neon_Chaos]

*their

[DaddyTorgo]

goddammit people

[saldana]

You have the votes that you need, from what I see, four hands to three by the last count of the nearest sinner. You have no use of mine, and it shall stay as it is.

The hour of judgement is near. I feel that angels and demons shall soon meddle in the affairs of mortal men.

again begging your pardon, your grace, but with the last vote of the usurer against one our our lords acolytes, the turn of your vote to the sinner is needed.