Racisim or Economics?

[Fritz]

Bias suit filed over cost of haircut
Salon tried to charge black woman extra
By B. Scott Bortnick
Special to The Denver Post

Friday, March 28, 2003 - Sophia Burns came in for a trim, but says she left a Denver hair salon with an emotional cut that led to a racial discrimination lawsuit in federal court.

Burns, a 22-year-old African-American, said the operators of a Great Clips for Hair salon at 5145 Chambers Road charged her an "ethnicity" fee when she came in for a haircut on March 8.

Burns said the shop's owner, Brenda Cripe, said the salon "usually catered to white people," according to a lawsuit filed Thursday in U.S. District Court.

"There was not much work needed to style their (white people's) hair, but that with black people, there was more to it and that was why she was being charged," Cripe said, according to the lawsuit.

Several messages left at Cripe's home were not returned. The store's manager, who declined to give her full name said, "I don't know anything about the situation. I don't know what went down with Ms. Burns."

The lawsuit alleges the manager told Burns about the additional "ethnicity price." The added fee boosted the advertised cost of a cut and style from $28 to $35 to about $50 for Burns, according to the lawsuit.

"I refused to pay it and asked for a better understanding by what they meant," Burns said Thursday. "The owner and manager said because I was black, I had to pay more money. I thought they did not understand what they were saying. Then they said because I was not white, they had to do more to my hair."

The store waived the extra fee after Burns discussed the matter for 20 minutes.

Time has not reduced the insult.

"I was humiliated," Burns said. "I have never been exposed to racism like that in my life."

Burns said her 6-year-old brother and her 14-year-old sister witnessed the encounter. Both children remain upset by the incident, she said.

"We were all raised in a Christian home and he (the 6-year-old) did not understand why being black would bring a penalty," Burns said.

The African-American stylist who cut Burns' hair called her and apologized, according to the lawsuit. The stylist, who refused to give her full name when called Thursday, remembered Burns but declined to comment.

Burns wants to see the store punished. "I want them to understand what they are doing is not right," she said.

The lawsuit seeks unspecified damages and attorneys' fees.

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Is this naked racism, or simple economics?

[Qwikshot]

I believe the way it was handled was racist.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally posted by Qwikshot
I believe the way it was handled was racist. I'm not sure I'd use the word "racist." I would say "very insensitive" though.

[cthomer5000]

the only solution I would see is to charge a per/hour rate for haircuts.

[Ben E Lou]

Originally posted by cthomer5000
the only solution I would see is to charge a per/hour rate for haircuts. .....or to have a rate for what sort of hairstyle desired. Back when I used to get haircuts (prior to the shaved-head look I've had the last 10 years or so), black barbers had different prices for different styles. An "even" cut was the cheapest. High-top was more expensive. If you wanted a "fade" added to the sides, that was more. Getting something written on the back had a price as well. I don't know if it is that way any more (like I said, it has been 10 years since I've paid for a haircut), but it seems like women's hair stylists could have a similar price list.

[voltaris]

I have had the same thing happen to me at a salon. I was told the extra charge was due long hair. I agree with cthomer

[Ksyrup]

A little tact, and a better explanation, is all that was necessary. I just don't think the owner is smart enough to understand. Stupidity is the root of racism, and this proves it.

Normal people think, "I don't have the skill or knowledge to cut this person's hair, since it is different than the type of hair I normally cut. Plus, it will take longer than the typical styling. That means I should charge more for the time and skill necessary to style this person's hair."

A moron thinks, "I don't have the skill or knowledge to cut this person's hair, since it is different than the type of hair I normally cut. This person is black, so I have to charge black people more to style their hair."

I think the black lady should have realized what she was dealing with, and understood that while the hairdresser was explaining it as the latter, she meant the former.

[Anrhydeddu]

I agree, I had been charged extra for haircuts when my hair was long. Time = money.

In this situation, it probably was handled insensitively. However, what if it a posted price list says "black" hair styling will cost $35 instead of $32 for "whites" - just like in some shops it says $18 for long hair (guys) instead of $15? It seems that no one wants to admit that there are differences among races or at least, differences among hair styles.

[sachmo71]

Originally posted by Ksyrup
A little tact, and a better explanation, is all that was necessary. I just don't think the owner is smart enough to understand. Stupidity is the root of racism, and this proves it.

Normal people think, "I don't have the skill or knowledge to cut this person's hair, since it is different than the type of hair I normally cut. Plus, it will take longer than the typical styling. That means I should charge more for the time and skill necessary to style this person's hair."

A moron thinks, "I don't have the skill or knowledge to cut this person's hair, since it is different than the type of hair I normally cut. This person is black, so I have to charge black people more to style their hair."

I think the black lady should have realized what she was dealing with, and understood that while the hairdresser was explaining it as the latter, she meant the former.


She may have, but this is a clearcut oppurtunity to sue the crap out of a business. No one really loses, right? :)

[sabotai]

I pretty much agree with Ksyrup.

I think the thing that kind of gets on my nerves about this is she got the "extra charge" taken off. But she's still sueing...

I'm sick of seeing people complain and sue over their "emotions". Get over it. If this was some old black woman that had to go through the whole civil rights movement thing, ok, I'd understand. But this girl is 22. I'm not saying racism still doesn't go on, but if this the thing that occured in her life that has prompted her to actually sue over it...I don't think it's a big deal.

[mckerney]

Originally posted by sabotai
I'm not saying racism still doesn't go on, but if this the thing that occured in her life that has prompted her to actually sue over it...I don't think it's a big deal.

when things like this bring allegations of racism less attention is paid when someone does have a complaint that acctually deals with racism.

[Fritz]

Originally posted by Qwikshot
I believe the way it was handled was racist.

I can see this. When I was about 14 (1982) I was getting a haircut when a black kid came in. My barber told him that he did not cut black people's hair. The kid, of course, left.

Racist?

After the kid left the barber says "I don't know how to cut black people hair."

I find this to be possible. I don't know the ins and outs of hair cutting.

It was all in the way he handled it.

[QuikSand]

Maybe there ought to be a "nappy hair" surcharge, with no mention of race at all.

That ought to quell the controversy.

[sabotai]

"when things like this bring allegations of racism less attention is paid when someone does have a complaint that acctually deals with racism."

Good point mckerney. When the news gets flooded with these ho-hum lawsuits, it takes the meaning and attention away from the racism lawsuits that are a big deal.

[Ksyrup]

Which is why people like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson have set the legitimate issues championed by black people (or for black people) back decades. When they play the race card at every turn, two things can happen - (1) people stop listening to all of it, legitimate or not; or (2) people get focused on race and start paying attention to it, even when they weren't before.

[Qwikshot]

Originally posted by Fritz
I can see this. When I was about 14 (1982) I was getting a haircut when a black kid came in. My barber told him that he did not cut black people's hair. The kid, of course, left.

Racist?

After the kid left the barber says "I don't know how to cut black people hair."

I find this to be possible. I don't know the ins and outs of hair cutting.

It was all in the way he handled it.

Thank you for seeing my point...if the salon stylist had explained that because of the hair that there would be an extra charge, rather than because of a racial identity, perhaps it would've been seen in a better light. I don't know how to cut hair so I don't know what is more difficult to do.

It should have also been explained up front, not after the bill was given, that's poor business sense.

[Fritz]

Originally posted by Qwikshot
Thank you for seeing my point...if the salon stylist had explained that because of the hair that there would be an extra charge, rather than because of a racial identity, perhaps it would've been seen in a better light. I don't know how to cut hair so I don't know what is more difficult to do.

It should have also been explained up front, not after the bill was given, that's poor business sense.

A person should also be told up front the cost for services.

[sjshaw]

I thought only southerners were racist.

[Fritz]

Southern Cali

[cthomer5000]

Originally posted by Qwikshot
Thank you for seeing my point...if the salon stylist had explained that because of the hair that there would be an extra charge, rather than because of a racial identity, perhaps it would've been seen in a better light. I don't know how to cut hair so I don't know what is more difficult to do.

It should have also been explained up front, not after the bill was given, that's poor business sense.

Anyone who's ever had friends of different races can see there is a world of difference in the actual hair type and texture. Some haridressers have much less experience with some hair types, leading them to have a much harder time dealing with types they rarely see.

I think the hairdressers intentions were genuine, they probably just have a much harder time dealing with a black persons' hair. If they were more intelligent or articulate, they probably could have explained that it would take them longer, need more work, and therefore would cost more. If someone's hair is going to take longer to style, I don't think any of us would object to it costing more.

I can understand how this girl might have been offended at the time, but I think suing is a bit outrageous.

[GrantDawg]

I usually get a discount at hair salons. Hey, wait a minute. They are doing that because I'm bald! That has hurt me emotionally. Any of you lawyers handle personal cases?

When I was living in North Carolina, I wanted to go to a barbershop. Since I really just wanted a buzz, I figured just a classic little shop on the town center would do. I found one and went in. I quickly discovered I was the only white person in the shop. The barber asked if he could help me, and I asked him for a haircut. He looked at me like I was nuts, but told me to sit down.

Let me tell you, it was the best haircut I've ever had. He gave me a shave and the whole nine-yards. A few people came in and stopped at the door. Some even made snide comments. I heard a few people giggle over in the corner. It didn’t both me though, and I gave the barber a good tip.

[SportsDino]

It shouldn't be called an ethnicity fee. What if a white woman came into the shop and requested the same type of hair style (with the same time intensive costs, etc.)? It was handled in a racist manner, not very of the bother of court action in my opinion, but some sort of apology and change in store policy should be done at least.

[tucker342]

When they made it an ethnicity charge it became racist. If you say, you'll have to pay more because the type of hair cut you want takes longer, than that's okay.