NCAA accuses Memphis Hoops of major violations

[DeToxRox]

I know, I know, you're all shocked.

NCAA accuses Memphis of major violations during 2007-08 season - NCAA Division I Mens Basketball - CBSSports.com News, Fantasy, Video (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/story/11793579)

The NCAA has formally accused the Memphis men's basketball program of major violations during the 2007-08 Final Four season under John Calipari.

In a letter -- which was first obtained by The Commercial Appeal -- the NCAA alleges "knowing fraudulence or misconduct" on an SAT exam by a player on the Final Four team. The player is not named in the report. But if the allegation is proven true, Memphis could be forced to forfeit the Final Four appearance.

Memphis is also accused of providing $2,260 in free travel for an associate of a player.

Calipari is not named or directly implicated in the report.

He now coaches at Kentucky.

CBSSports.com's initial attempt to reach Calipari by cell phone Wednesday was unsuccessful.

[wade moore]

In before MBBF rains joy over this thread.

[Logan]

Shit wade beat me.

[DeToxRox]

Dola, I won't be shocked at all if Memphis takes a beating on this one while USC gets the slap on the wrist. Memphis is coming off being a top 10 program the last 5 years, but now with Cal gone they'll go back to being a decent top 25ish program year in and year out, and even though USC hoops isn't that, it is still SC and that name means something.

Memphis, it might be nice knowin' ya.

[DaddyTorgo]

wooo! who do we think it was? D-Rose?

[wade moore]

In all seriousness.

This does bring up an issue that I've seen discussed on the CAA board that I frequent.

At what point are coaches themselves going to face some sort of punishment. Kelvin Sampson is a perfect example people use - but now Calipari. He'll be able to carry-on with no consequences whatsoever at Kentucky. If he made/condoned/directed the violations - shouldn't he personally have some repercussions? You even wonder if he had some idea this was coming and that influenced him leaving.

[Logan]

I thought some of the sanctions followed Sampson? Either way though, not enough and I agree.

[DeToxRox]

Apparently Memphis was told of this back in January so obviously Cal had to know it was coming. I think he needs to be punished since didn't he have a problem at UMass as well?

Oh well, as long as he wins at Kentucky no one will care until he's elsewhere and the next guy is left with a program in ruin.

[wade moore]

I thought some of the sanctions followed Sampson? Either way though, not enough and I agree.

Looks like you're right...

From Wiki:

In addition to the Gordon incident, Sampson has been in the middle of a number of other controversies. Under Sampson's watch, Oklahoma was placed under a three-year investigation by the NCAA for recruiting violations. At the end of the their investigation, the NCAA issued a report citing more than 550 illegal calls made by Sampson and his staff to 17 different recruits. The NCAA barred Sampson from recruiting off campus and making phone calls for one year, ending May 24 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_24), 2007 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007).<sup id="cite_ref-4" class="reference">[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelvin_Sampson#cite_note-4)

And:

</sup>On November 25, 2008, the NCAA slapped Indiana with three years' probation for violations largely tied to Sampson's watch. It also imposed a five-year show-cause (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_to_show_cause) order on Sampson, meaning that no NCAA member school would be able to hire Sampson without demonstrating to the NCAA that Sampson has served his punishment. However, most NCAA members will not even consider hiring a coach with an outstanding show-cause order, so the show-cause will likely have the effect of banning Sampson from coaching at the major-college level until 2013.

But still. It took multiple serious incidents for the show-cause. The other punishment seems relatively minor compared to what the universities suffer.

[DeToxRox]

From reading other sites, it sounds like Pastner, their new coach who was Cal's assistant obviously knew about this so it isn't like he is going to be some innocent guy stuck in Cal's mess if that's true.

[wade moore]

From reading other sites, it sounds like Pastner, their new coach who was Cal's assistant obviously knew about this so it isn't like he is going to be some innocent guy stuck in Cal's mess if that's true.

Yeah.. promoting the assistant removes a little bit of the "victim" issue.

[GoldenEagle]

From reading other sites, it sounds like Pastner, their new coach who was Cal's assistant obviously knew about this so it isn't like he is going to be some innocent guy stuck in Cal's mess if that's true.

Pastner was not on the staff when the reported allegations took place. The player in question is Derrick Rose. I don't see how this is any different from the Darrell Author (sp?) incident at Kansas.

The title is a bit of media sensationalism. Most of the allegations in the letter point to women's golf.

Now, this could be the tip of the iceberg.

[stevew]

Lance Bass is gay.

[BishopMVP]

I think he needs to be punished since didn't he have a problem at UMass as well?Marcus Camby accepted money and jewelry from an agent. You can argue that Calipari, like everyone else on campus, must have known when Camby started walking around with a 5-figure necklace, but he never gave things to Camby and was cleared by the NCAA. He definitely never had any academic issues, and in fact UMass had multiple non-qualifiers come, sit out freshman year, and graduate within 4 years to regain that last year of eligibility. I'm not arguing that Calipari or UMass at the time was clean, I'm just arguing they did nothing that Kansas, Duke, etc, weren't doing.

The player in question has to be Derrick Rose based on the wording. Otherwise other years would have been implicated.

[stevew]

I think the sanctions should also follow the coach if he was involved.

[DaddyTorgo]

I'm just glad I went to a school where this type of things never happens, even if we're not perpetually in the championship game

[BishopMVP]

I'm just glad I went to a school where this type of things never happens, even if we're not perpetually in the championship gameWait, you went to BC, right? :lol: :lol: :lol:

[wade moore]

I'm just glad I went to a school where this type of things never happens, even if we're not perpetually in the championship game

+1, but to say.. "even if we're playing in a mid-major conference and generally not in the conference title picture".

[miami_fan]

Wait, you went to BC, right? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Are you trying to say someone needs a history lesson on basketball scandals?;)

[Arles]

Man, Arizona supposedly had a blank check for Calipari off the bat (before he went to KY) and was talking to Floyd about the position later. If it comes out that Pitino did some shenanigans at Louisville, this might be the "Curse of the Wildcat" - where all coaches who passed on Arizona are doomed ;)

[DaddyTorgo]

LOL - well not under the new regime.

and hey - we've got one of the highest athlete graduation rates of any school in the country - between two of the service academies last time i looked i believe

[panerd]

Wait, you went to BC, right? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Somebody needs to watch Goodfellas, eh? This has to be the worst unintentional comedy of all time. Where does BC rank? With the Black Sox maybe?

[DaddyTorgo]

lol

[GoldenEagle]

Dola, I won't be shocked at all if Memphis takes a beating on this one while USC gets the slap on the wrist. Memphis is coming off being a top 10 program the last 5 years, but now with Cal gone they'll go back to being a decent top 25ish program year in and year out, and even though USC hoops isn't that, it is still SC and that name means something.

Memphis, it might be nice knowin' ya.

We will see. We did get a commitment from 5 star SF/PF Latvious Williams yesterday. I think Pastner has the tools to be successful here. Calpari laid the ground work and showed how to win at Memphis. Pastner just has to follow it.

Edit: Other than the whole cheating part.

[Ksyrup]

Lot of news here in Lexington tonight, what with this and Gillispie filing alawsuit against the school. Calipari isn't named in the report, but has been asked to appear at the hearing. If he was involved, sanctions could follow him, but they would have named him if they had anything connecting him to this, I assume.

[molson]

I think the sanctions should also follow the coach if he was involved.

I think it needs to go further, and sanctions should follow the coach if they happened on his watch.

It's too easy to hide the paper trail, etc. It's ultimately the coach's responsibility to run a clean program. If he can't do it, there should be some sanction.

[wade moore]

We will see. We did get a commitment from 5 star SF/PF Latvious Williams yesterday. I think Pastner has the tools to be successful here. Calpari laid the ground work and showed how to win at Memphis. Pastner just has to follow it.

Edit: Other than the whole cheating part.

Even with the edit, are we gonna leave this low-hanging fruit out there?

[RainMaker]

What does the SAT thing mean? That they helped him cheat? Aren't SATs taken in high school?

[GoldenEagle]

The rumor is someone else took the SAT for Derrick Rose.

[RomaGoth]

Gotta love Calipari...:lol:

Five years from now, maybe Kentucky will have sanctions again too, eh?

[mh2365]

As someone who hates everything about UK ... love it

[BishopMVP]

LOL - well not under the new regime.I love Al Skinner as much as the next man, but you don't get players like Sean Williams to stick around that long without some faustian deals. And graduation rates are no panacaea - look at Duke and Corey Maggette.The rumor is someone else took the SAT for Derrick Rose.Am I mis-remembering, or what that rumor going around when he was still in HS too? How many times did he take the SAT?

[MrBug708]

Oops

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

In before MBBF rains joy over this thread.

I'm sure all the defensive Memphis fans from the college basketball thread are feeling pretty sheepish right now. They were likely the only ones surprised by this announcement.

Two things:

1. Judging from previous examples, I have no doubt that the penalties levied against Memphis will be much harsher than similar examples at bigger name schools. Sad, but true.

2. Calipari really should receive some penalties from the NCAA. The hit-and-run nature of leaving after you know penalties are coming is bush-league at best.

[wade moore]

I'm sure all the defensive Memphis fans from the college basketball thread are feeling pretty sheepish right now. They were likely the only ones surprised by this announcement.

FWIW, this is one time I think a little "I told you so" dance from you is justified.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

FWIW, this is one time I think a little "I told you so" dance from you is justified.

It's never a good thing when a fan base gets blindsided like this. Mizzou went through the whole Quin debacle. I feel bad for the fans and the loyal people within the program. They're the ones that want the program to do well, but they end up getting blindsided and the jackass outsider who ruins the program heads to the hills to collect a paycheck somewhere else. Mizzou has been blessed enough to find a good man who does things the right way and wants to retire at Mizzou rather than use it as a stepping stone. Hopefully Memphis finds a similar coach, because that's what they really need at that program.

I will say that the departure of Calipari and this investigation (it may have only become public now, but many NCAA coaches knew it was in progress a month or two ago) have done wonders for other schools recruiting in Memphis. There's a ton of good talent in Memphis. Coach Anderson and his staff are recruiting 5 good players in Memphis in the 2010 class along with a couple of 2011 players. This announcement will only help in that regard. Those coaches coming in to take Memphis players now have ammo to use against that program.

[Kodos]

I thought some of the sanctions followed Sampson? Either way though, not enough and I agree.

I'm pretty sure that Sampson can't coach at the collegiate level for a number of years. That's why he's an assistant in the NBA right now.

[Samdari]

Calpari laid the ground work and showed how to win at Memphis. Pastner just has to follow it.

Edit: Other than the whole cheating part.

LOL.

You can't learn to win without cheating from Calipari.

You can learn to win. But cheating has always been a part of that winning with him.

[Kodos]

Everyone hates cheats, that's for sure.

[RainMaker]

2. Calipari really should receive some penalties from the NCAA. The hit-and-run nature of leaving after you know penalties are coming is bush-league at best.
I'm really sick of the hit-and-run shit these coaches pull. Cheat for a few years, earn a big contract elsewhere, then let your old team deal with the consequences.

I think coaches need to be penalized just like the schools. The Sampson penalty should be the rule, not an anamolly. I guarantee a 5 year ban for any coach who knowingly cheated would clean up the NCAA a lot.

[Ksyrup]

I don't really get all the outrage over coaches who haven't been found to have knowledge of or participated in cheating or in committing violations. The Sampson thing played out like it did because he was directly involved. Thus, he was individually charged and the sanctions he got followed him. I'm not trying to be purposely naive here, but in order to enforce its rules, the NCAA has to have some standard of proof in order to go after somebody.

I'm not trying to defend Calipari here - I barely follow college basketball and I'm not even a UK fan (although I'm obviously aware of the school now that I live here) - this is just my general feeling on the matter. There are so many moving parts to a big-time college sports program (and athletic department) that I don't have any doubt most coaches couldn't control what goes on even if they wanted to. At worst, I bet a lot of these guys are guilty of turning a blind eye to this stuff, or simply not wanting to be informed so they have plausible deniability. And I'm not really sure how you police that without taking down truly innocent coaches whose programs get screwed over by some over-zealous booster or players' family/advisors looking to cash in.

[wade moore]

KSyrup - I'm specifically talking about situations where there is evidence that the coach was involved (whether doing the action, directing the action, or knowing about it and doing nothing).

[Ksyrup]

Well, I guess I'm responding to the general tenor of this thread, which seems to be labeling Calipari as a "cheater" despite the fact that there's no evidence he had knowledge of or was involved in what appears to be a single SAT cheating incident and payment of travel money to someone involved with the player.

I mean, I could go out right now as a "friend of the University" and secretly offer to fly some prospect's family to a home game of their choice next year and get the school in trouble. Hard to see how Rich Brooks or John Calipari should be individually penalized for that.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

I don't really get all the outrage over coaches who haven't been found to have knowledge of or participated in cheating or in committing violations. The Sampson thing played out like it did because he was directly involved. Thus, he was individually charged and the sanctions he got followed him. I'm not trying to be purposely naive here, but in order to enforce its rules, the NCAA has to have some standard of proof in order to go after somebody.

Calipari was lucky to escape UMass without any significant sanctions. There was some dirty business going on there as well. His problem now is that a pattern of behavior is quickly developing. You can only feign ignorance so many times before it becomes unbelievable.

[wade moore]

Calipari was lucky to escape UMass without any significant sanctions. There was some dirty business going on there as well. His problem now is that a pattern of behavior is quickly developing. You can only feign ignorance so many times before it becomes unbelievable.

Exactly. It's hard to imagine that this cloud has followed him with repeated sanctions under his times as head coach without realizing that he's dirty. Maybe there isn't evidence, but Calipari had a reputation with many as dirty before this even came about.

[Ksyrup]

Calipari was lucky to escape UMass without any significant sanctions. There was some dirty business going on there as well. His problem now is that a pattern of behavior is quickly developing. You can only feign ignorance so many times before it becomes unbelievable.

Unbelievable to whom? The general public? Who cares! UK specifically stated that they vetted Calipari with the NCAA, including directly speaking to the guy who penned the letter to Memphis about these violations. Plus, IIRC, the chick who was with the NCAA and involved in the UMass investigation is now on staff at UK. If they had any real concerns above mere taint - especially since they were aware of this investigation at the time they interviewed him - then I think they might have acted differently.

I guess I'm trying to understand how an agent paying a player and somebody cheating on an SAT test is automatically the coach's fault, or suggests he was even aware of it at the time? I see a clear difference between these situations (at least, what we know at this point) and the Sampson or Clem Haskins' situations.

[GoldenEagle]

I think this is really a case of forcing a one and done player to come to school. Derrick Rose knew he was going to the NBA and going to be a millionaire. He just paid someone to take the test for him to ensure that he gets into college and can showcase his skills for a year. He never intended to be a student-athlete. He went to school because he had to. It is entirely possible that Calipari had no idea.

I also like how Calipari issued a statement through UK that this is Memphis's problem, not mine.

[Logan]

He could've went to Europe for a year like Brandon Jennings.

[DeToxRox]

Well the next NBA CBA will probably force kids to play 2 years of college ball so I expect a lot more kids in Europe.

[GoldenEagle]

He could've went to Europe for a year like Brandon Jennings.

Maybe. But he would have been the first to have done so (Jennings was a 2008, Rose a 2007). By all accounts, Jennings really struggled in Europe and actually hurt his draft status. I don't think you will see many go that route, unless they don't qualify. Hence the reason you need someone else to take the SAT for you.

What the NBA should do is allow players to be drafted but require that they stay in the NBADL for two years. This would instantly boost the popularity of the development league and teach young players about the lifestyle of the NBA. But that is probably for another thread.

[Ksyrup]

Maybe. But he would have been the first to have done so (Jennings was a 200, Rose a 2007). By all accounts, Jennings really struggled in Europe and actually hurt his draft status. I don't think you will see many go that route, unless they don't qualify. Hence the reason you need someone else to take the SAT for you.

I've never even heard of Brandon Jennings. You think, at this point, Europe is a viable alternative for a kid who can play well in college for one year, get on TV multiple times during the season, have a great run through the tournament and become a household name, and then parlay that into a top 5 draft pick status?

[molson]

I wish there could be some slap on the wrist to coaches even if there isn't direct evidence of their involvment. The only difference between Sampson, Haskins, and Calapari is that Calapari is slicker and smarter about letting others do the dirty work (Just my opinion)

But even if it doesn't go that far, the culture of cheating starts with the head coach. A coach can make it his business to know how his recruits are getting to campus, where they got the new car. It's not possible, of course, to stamp out 100% of issues by being aware of what's going on in your own program, but currently, there's no incentive to even try (and actually, a pretty strong incentive not to).

It's not enough for coaches to turn a blind eye, or even to just intentionally stay out the inner workings of the program.

[DeToxRox]

I've never even heard of Brandon Jennings. You think, at this point, Europe is a viable alternative for a kid who can play well in college for one year, get on TV multiple times during the season, have a great run through the tournament and become a household name, and then parlay that into a top 5 draft pick status?

Jennings will still be a top 6 or 7 pick, and he got some nice bank to play in Europe. If he has a good rookie year I really think more kids will head off to Europe because you get money, you don't have to study or worry about school at all, and you're playing against grown men. That is experience you cannot get in college.

And like I said, if the new CBA does push the years between HS to the Pros to two years, I can see a lot of kids deciding to head to Europe because they want to get paid.

[Logan]

Maybe. But he would have been the first to have done so (Jennings was a 2008, Rose a 2007). By all accounts, Jennings really struggled in Europe and actually hurt his draft status. I don't think you will see many go that route, unless they don't qualify. Hence the reason you need someone else to take the SAT for you.

What the NBA should do is allow players to be drafted but require that they stay in the NBADL for two years. This would instantly boost the popularity of the development league and teach young players about the lifestyle of the NBA. But that is probably for another thread.

I've never even heard of Brandon Jennings. You think, at this point, Europe is a viable alternative for a kid who can play well in college for one year, get on TV multiple times during the season, have a great run through the tournament and become a household name, and then parlay that into a top 5 draft pick status?

Jennings is making over $1 million a year between his salary and endorsements. That makes it a viable alternative. He had problems with his game coming out of high school but word was he still would've been a top 5-10 pick if he was able to go straight to the NBA. He didn't do so well in Europe because he was playing against experienced guys 10 years older than him, but I'm willing to gamble his game is way above where it would be if he just dominated in college only to hit the NBA and experience the same sort of thing he saw in Europe. Jennings isn't the same type of PG as Rose - he was much more raw. He wouldn't have come in and dominated. If he's "ready" earlier than he would've been by going to Arizona (believe that was his destination), then it was a great move -- and he made a ton of money.

Oh, and he's projected to go in the 5-7 range this June from what I've seen. Best case he would've dominated college and maybe been ahead of Rubio as the #2 pick. Congrats, he ends up in Memphis. This isn't the NFL where your signing bonus is enormous. He's much better off going to Golden State at 7 or NY at 8.

[molson]

Jennings is making over $1 million a year between his salary and endorsements. That makes it a viable alternative. He had problems with his game coming out of high school but word was he still would've been a top 5-10 pick if he was able to go straight to the NBA. He didn't do so well in Europe because he was playing against experienced guys 10 years older than him, but I'm willing to gamble his game is way above where it would be if he just dominated in college only to hit the NBA and experience the same sort of thing he saw in Europe. Jennings isn't the same type of PG as Rose - he was much more raw. He wouldn't have come in and dominated. If he's "ready" earlier than he would've been by going to Arizona (believe that was his destination), then it was a great move -- and he made a ton of money.

Oh, and he's projected to go in the 5-7 range this June from what I've seen. Best case he would've dominated college and maybe been ahead of Rubio as the #2 pick. Congrats, he ends up in Memphis. This isn't the NFL where your signing bonus is enormous. He's much better off going to Golden State at 7 or NY at 8.

Random thought, but if the 18-year old stud US player can't compete with Europeans 10 years older, it makes you wonder why more of those 28-year old Europeans aren't in the NBA.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Unbelievable to whom? The general public? Who cares! UK specifically stated that they vetted Calipari with the NCAA, including directly speaking to the guy who penned the letter to Memphis about these violations. Plus, IIRC, the chick who was with the NCAA and involved in the UMass investigation is now on staff at UK. If they had any real concerns above mere taint - especially since they were aware of this investigation at the time they interviewed him - then I think they might have acted differently.

I guess I'm trying to understand how an agent paying a player and somebody cheating on an SAT test is automatically the coach's fault, or suggests he was even aware of it at the time? I see a clear difference between these situations (at least, what we know at this point) and the Sampson or Clem Haskins' situations.

FWIW, I saw that one of the prominent UK bloggers is taking a stance similar to what you're proposing.......

Kentucky Basketball: Romancing the Stone*Thursday - A Sea Of Blue (http://www.aseaofblue.com/2009/5/28/891196/kentucky-basketball-romancing-the)

[Fighter of Foo]

Random thought, but if the 18-year old stud US player can't compete with Europeans 10 years older, it makes you wonder why more of those 28-year old Europeans aren't in the NBA.

Why come here and sit on the bench when you can start in your own country and make the same or similar money?

[Samdari]

You think, at this point, Europe is a viable alternative for a kid who can play well in college for one year, get on TV multiple times during the season, have a great run through the tournament and become a household name, and then parlay that into a top 5 draft pick status?

No, but its the only real alternative for kids who have the talent and inclination to be pro basketball players and cannot meet the academic standards to play college for their one forced year.

Oops, never mind, I see now that cheating on your SATs is another way.

I don't think Jennings hurt his stock. I think he's going to be drafted exactly where he would have had he played 2008-2009 at Arizona - in the top 10.

[Logan]

Random thought, but if the 18-year old stud US player can't compete with Europeans 10 years older, it makes you wonder why more of those 28-year old Europeans aren't in the NBA.

No one said he couldn't compete, but the holes in his game weren't going to disappear right away. Very few of the kids who went straight to the NBA before the age limit were immediately successful. More of them took a few years to develop their games to the point where they could contribute meaningful minutes (while some completely crashed and burned). Jennings is really talented but will take some time...but like I said, he's probably ahead of the curve than he would have been if he went to Arizona and got by on his pure physical talents.

[BishopMVP]

Calipari was lucky to escape UMass without any significant sanctions. There was some dirty business going on there as well. His problem now is that a pattern of behavior is quickly developing. You can only feign ignorance so many times before it becomes unbelievable.No, he wasn't, and no, there was nothing unusual going on at UMass compared to any other big-time basketball school. Look at Myron Piggie and Duke/Kansas, look at Jim Calhoun and the multiple incidents at UConn, look at any coach that brings in a one-and-done player, unless they're actually smart and well-off like Kevin Love.

The only reason there is such a cloud of suspicion around Calipari is that he made 2 non-BCS schools perennial contenders. Yes, he hangs around shady people. It's called the AAU scene. Other teams coaches and fans start most whispers merely due to jealousy.

[BishopMVP]

No one said he couldn't compete, but the holes in his game weren't going to disappear right away. Very few of the kids who went straight to the NBA before the age limit were immediately successful. More of them took a few years to develop their games to the point where they could contribute meaningful minutes (while some completely crashed and burned). Jennings is really talented but will take some time...but like I said, he's probably ahead of the curve than he would have been if he went to Arizona and got by on his pure physical talents.It's also Europe where they have a different culture and coaches don't like to play youngsters. Plus he's a PG - name a single successful PG to jump from HS to the NBA. The only place Jennings (or Rose if he went over) hurt himself was in marketing exposure.

[Logan]

Well, he already has a 4 year deal with Under Armour, who chose him as their first basketball endorser. I'm sure he'll do pretty well in that regard, comparable at least to what Rose earned.

[GoldenEagle]

Calipari is always going to go right up to the line. He may never cross it, but he is going to bend the rules as much as he can. When he was the coach of Memphis, I just kind of looked the other way and ignored the rumors. But there is a lot more of this that goes on that we know about. As someone else mentioned, almost every program in the country does the same thing. You have to play the game to get the top recruits. It is a dirty system that is not entirely the coaches fault. People around a star recruit expect to get paid.

My problem with Calipari right now is his complete disregard toward Memphis. He tooked signed recruits with him and did not even give the new coaching staff a crack at them. He also signed a PG in Eric Bledsoe that he probably really didn't need, but only because he was probably going to Memphis otherwise. I think his ego is huge and that he has to prove that Memphis did not win because of Memphis, but because of Calipari.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

As someone else mentioned, almost every program in the country does the same thing. You have to play the game to get the top recruits. It is a dirty system that is not entirely the coaches fault. People around a star recruit expect to get paid.


This isn't accurate either. Are there coaches that pay players or reward family/coaches directly or indirectly? Yes. Do the majority of BCS coaches do that? No.

[GoldenEagle]

This isn't accurate either. Are there coaches that pay players or reward family/coaches directly or indirectly? Yes. Do the majority of BCS coaches do that? No.

Pay does not always have to be a direct monetary payment. It could be helping get the coach a better job or a promotion at work, a new car, whatever. I think you are very naive if you think the majority of college coaches don't play the "game", but I think we have been down that path before and I don't attend to go down it again.

[digamma]

Just for that, I'm not going to attend any Memphis basketball games next year.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Pay does not always have to be a direct monetary payment. It could be helping get the coach a better job or a promotion at work, a new car, whatever. I think you are very naive if you think the majority of college coaches don't play the "game", but I think we have been down that path before and I don't attend to go down it again.

Yes, but things like hiring a coach to a position at the school is not against the rules. Also, business cars are provided to all coaches every year and is perfectly legitimate. We're specifically talking about breaking NCAA rules in this thread and that was specifically where my comment was directed.

Now, if you're arguing whether some of the things that are allowed are ethical or should really be allowed, that's another thread worth of arguments. But hiring a coach or providing vehicles to the staff is perfectly legitimate.

[GoldenEagle]

Yes, but things like hiring a coach to a position at the school is not against the rules. Also, business cars are provided to all coaches every year and is perfectly legitimate. We're specifically talking about breaking NCAA rules in this thread and that was specifically where my comment was directed.

Now, if you're arguing whether some of the things that are allowed are ethical or should really be allowed, that's another thread worth of arguments. But hiring a coach or providing vehicles to the staff is perfectly legitimate.

I was really talking more about a player's coach or a player's "handlers".

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

I was really talking more about a player's coach or a player's "handlers".

I was as well. Those people are routinely hired to positions in a program to land a player. KU makes a habit of hiring the fathers of players who are coaches at the high school level. Chalmers and Manning are just two examples. Mizzou did the same thing with Julian Winfield in the mid 90s. It may teeter on being unethical, but it's certainly not against the rules as long as it's nothing more than a coach being hired to a position.

I personally believe the practice should be against the rules, but it's not right now.

[watravaler]

Of course Calipari is dirty, along with quite a few NCAA coaches. He certainly isn't the exception to any rule, nor is Derrick Rose. With that being said, Calipari has so many yes men/handlers under him, he will always come out smelling like some type of flower.

Studs like Rose don't need college, but the NCAA obviously needs them since they got in bed with the NBA and their stupid "one year" rule. It's all a big joke...

Nevertheless, I think Europe will become the place to be for prospects like Rose, as it should be.

[Arles]

This is just getting weird. And, once again, shows what a joke the NCAA is. If they were truly worried about the "high standards of honesty and sportsmanship normally associated with the conduct and administration of intercollegiate athletics", they would have barred him from playing in the tourney. Instead, they let him play, cashed the checks from the Tourney, then sent an email out about a month after the championship telling Memphis that Rose was ineligible:

One month after Memphis lost to Kansas in overtime in one of the most thrilling national championship games in recent memory, the Tigers were rocked by an e-mail from the NCAA.

It was then that Memphis was first notified that star freshman point guard Derrick Rose, who helped the Tigers to an NCAA-record 38 wins and was soon going to become the No. 1 pick in the 2008 NBA draft by his hometown Bulls, had an invalidated standardized test score the previous year at Chicago's Simeon High School, according to multiple sources with direct knowledge of the e-mail.

The University of Memphis' legal counsel, Sheri Lipman, would not identify the student-athlete as Rose, but said Monday, "for the student-athlete, whoever that was, the first indication that we got was in early May [2008] that his score was being invalidated."

Memphis' administration knew that if this were indeed true, then coach John Calipari's team rode the superstar exploits of an ineligible player to an extraordinary season that was stopped just short of the program's first national title.

"It certainly came as a surprise," Lipman said of the e-mail.

Was it odd to be notified of a test score after the "student-athlete" played his freshman season? "Absolutely," Lipman said. "That's when we started with the NCAA, looking into the case."
Sources: Derrick Rose's test score in question at Memphis Tigers month after 2008 NCAA final - ESPN (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=4222106)

[RainMaker]

The NCAA is a joke when it comes to bigger schools and penalties. I think the Jerry Tarkanian quote said it best, "the NCAA got so mad at Kentuck that they gave Cleveland State two more years of probation".

[MrBug708]

I was as well. Those people are routinely hired to positions in a program to land a player. KU makes a habit of hiring the fathers of players who are coaches at the high school level. Chalmers and Manning are just two examples. Mizzou did the same thing with Julian Winfield in the mid 90s. It may teeter on being unethical, but it's certainly not against the rules as long as it's nothing more than a coach being hired to a position.

I personally believe the practice should be against the rules, but it's not right now.

Since Kansas makes a habit of it, do you have more examples other then the two listed?

[RainMaker]

Since Kansas makes a habit of it, do you have more examples other then the two listed?
I know Memphis did it with DeJuan Wagner years ago. Think it was his father they hired for some job right after he signed.

[MrBug708]

I know Memphis did it with DeJuan Wagner years ago. Think it was his father they hired for some job right after he signed.

Wagner didn't play for Kansas

[RainMaker]

Wagner didn't play for Kansas
Sorry, thought it was about all teams doing it. Didn't read thoroughly enough.

[Radii]

Robert Dozier of Memphis Tigers had SAT test invalidated - ESPN (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=4233718)

Pretty long article but some highlights:


According to Dozier's academic records, which were obtained by ESPN.com through Georgia open records laws, he took the SAT for the first time on Dec. 6, 2003, about five months after he verbally committed to play for the Tigers. Dozier scored a 1,260 of a possible 1,600 (the highest score at the time) on the test, according to the records.

Dozier later reneged on his commitment to Memphis, and signed a national letter of intent with Georgia in March 2004. But Georgia admission officials were immediately alarmed by Dozier's high SAT score, which they claimed didn't correlate with his below-average academic performance at Lithonia (Ga.) High School or his previous scores on the PSAT, a preparatory exam for the SAT.

In its report to UGA president Michael Adams, the school's faculty admissions review committee, which evaluates the admission applications of prospective student-athletes, recommended a "strong deny" in Dozier's case.

"Of greatest concern is the gross inconsistency in his testing record," the committee wrote in its report. "His [SAT verbal score of 590] would place him in the 76th percentile nationally, while his [SAT math score of 670] places him in the 89th percentile. This raises a serious red flag, since his PSAT from October 2000 places him in the 4th percentile nationally in both areas. Such a remarkable improvement in testing abilities in the span of nine months is highly improbable, particularly for a student with a C-minus record in average college prep courses in high school."

...

ETS officials offered Dozier a chance to validate his earlier scores by taking the SAT again. Dozier took the test in July 2004 and scored 720 -- 540 points lower than his earlier score.

As a result, ETS officials canceled the scores from his first SAT attempt. Adams denied Dozier's admissions application to UGA on Aug. 18, 2004.


Go Memphis!!!

[molson]

The LSAT requires fingerprinting, maybe the SAT should go that route. I mean, you can just take a test for someone else? I imagine that's rampant, even outside athletics. I wonder how much you can make being a professional SAT test taker.

[Warhammer]

Robert Dozier of Memphis Tigers had SAT test invalidated - ESPN (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=4233718)

Pretty long article but some highlights:




Go Memphis!!!

Actually this article has the timing wrong on this. I was listening to Garry Parrish on the radio today, who covered Memphis at the time, he said that the test taken after Dozier reneged on his commitment to Memphis. He basically laid out the time line, as well as mentioned that one of the guys at the Georgia program at the time was well known for getting guys to pass the SATs.

[DaddyTorgo]

Robert Dozier of Memphis Tigers had SAT test invalidated - ESPN (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=4233718)

Pretty long article but some highlights:




Go Memphis!!!

wow. Dozier might be the dumbest person alive. 4th percentile? Wow. :lol:

[Ksyrup]

If you're going to pay someone to take this kind of test, wouldn't you want someone who's NOT going to score too highly? Or did he just say fuck it, if I'm going this route I might as well qualify for Duke and not limit my options?

[molson]

If you're going to pay someone to take this kind of test, wouldn't you want someone who's NOT going to score too highly? Or did he just say fuck it, if I'm going this route I might as well qualify for Duke and not limit my options?

Well, he did finish in the 4th percentile....Which is apparently all the smarts you need to crack the SAT security measures, though not quite high enough to do so without getting caught.

[Ksyrup]

Hey, he's no Vince Young but he's getting there.

[Neuqua]

wow. Dozier might be the dumbest person alive. 4th percentile? Wow. :lol:

hmmm..

[Radii]

hah good catch neuqua.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Damn, Neuqua beat me to it.

[MrBug708]

What does that say about a Memphis education? 4 years to graduate from that school with that SAT score?

[DeToxRox]

What does that say about a Memphis education? 4 years to graduate from that school with that SAT score?

That their tutors go above and beyond?

[Eaglesfan27]

If you're going to pay someone to take this kind of test, wouldn't you want someone who's NOT going to score too highly? Or did he just say fuck it, if I'm going this route I might as well qualify for Duke and not limit my options?

I'm no expert but doesn't the clearing house use a sliding scale in which the SAT score required is inversely proportional to the GPA? Maybe, he needed a high score and just overshot it?

[Radii]

What does that say about a Memphis education? 4 years to graduate from that school with that SAT score?

I love poking fun at athletic programs as much as the next guy, but I hope you're not seriously suggesting Memphis is a bad university for the general population(or any different from UCLA or any other division I school, for that matter) b/c a football/basketball star who probably wasn't smart enough to get a degree found a way to get one?

[Pumpy Tudors]

I love poking fun at athletic programs as much as the next guy, but I hope you're not seriously suggesting Memphis is a bad university for the general population(or any different from UCLA or any other division I school, for that matter) b/c a football/basketball star who probably wasn't smart enough to get a degree found a way to get one?
That damn Robert Dozier. He has discredited all Memphis graduates everywhere. My wife is going to get stripped of her PhD and fired from her professor position because she got her BS at Memphis.

Shit. We are so done.

[Radii]

Sorry to hear your wife went to such a shitty school Pumpy :(

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Whoops! A freelance Lexington photographer unknowingly caught Calipari in a NCAA violation with a photo he took. No coach is allowed to instruct or even watch off-season scrimmages or practices by their players. Yet he's doing exactly that in this photo......

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2009/0720/ncb_u_jcaliparits_576.jpg

[DaddyTorgo]

LMAO

[molson]

I think Calapari should be applauded for exceeding all reasonable expectations about how long it would take him to start violating rules at Kentucky.

[JeeberD]

Whoops! A freelance Lexington photographer unknowingly caught Calipari in a NCAA violation with a photo he took. No coach is allowed to instruct or even watch off-season scrimmages or practices by their players. Yet he's doing exactly that in this photo......

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2009/0720/ncb_u_jcaliparits_576.jpg

They're just doing calisthenics. I'm sure he left when the basketball playing began. Yeah, that's the ticket...

[Logan]

Whoops! A freelance Lexington photographer unknowingly caught Calipari in a NCAA violation with a photo he took. No coach is allowed to instruct or even watch off-season scrimmages or practices by their players. Yet he's doing exactly that in this photo......

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2009/0720/ncb_u_jcaliparits_576.jpg

I see no definitive proof that this is in fact John Calipari :).

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

In related breaking news, the freelance photographer has been reported missing by his family. They report he never returned from a photo shoot at the UK campus.

:D

[fantom1979]

If Nike was running that practice, there is no way that picture would have got out.