CM4 Tactics Question

[Bee]

I have I guess what is best considered a "tactics" question for some of our soccer experts. I'm playing a modified version of Marc's 4-1-3-2 tactic from CM3. I'm actually having good success with wins, but almost all my scoring is from my 2 forwards. In my first full season, 1 forward scored 58 goals (!) and the other 28 goals. But my highest scoring midfielder scored only 3 goals. Watching the matches, it looks like my midfielders never try to score even when they have "open" shots but instead try to set up my forwards. They generally only score on counter attacks when they are completely free. I know almost nothing about soccer, so is this normal? If not, is there some kind of setting I can adjust to get my midfielders to take the shots when they have them?

[Calis]

You know, I think that might be an issue with the engine in general, as I've tried about every possible thing I can think of to try and switch that up some. Putting some of your better midfielders on forward runs and such helps out some, but strikers are scoring obscene amounts of goals for me.

Not sure if there is a way to fix this up, but maybe I'm missing something as well.

[moriarty]

There's alot of posts on the CM board that the forwards scoring too much is a 'bug'. Don't know if this is true or not, but alot of people are seeing the same thing.

I haven't had much success getting my midfielders to score, but a suggestion would be to set individual instructions for those midfielders. Try instructing them to make forward runs, and take long shots.

Just a thought.

[andy m]

i've been seeing the 'forwards scoring too much' thing. was playing as sampdoria in serie B, with a 4-3-2-1 formation, and my lone striker (a guy called Colombo who had 3 career goals before 2002) was banging them in left right and centre, averaging over 2 goals a game. in one match he scored 6 and another 5, as well as getting another hat trick. crazy stuff. he would get so many break aways where he'd beat a defender then lob the keeper or curl one round him from distance. he was incredible.

then i got fired for having a bad relationship with my team :(

[Bee]

I'll try the forward runs and long shots.

The scoring does seem unbalanced. I know that I've played 40+ seasons of previous versions of CM and never had a player score that many goals in a season. Usually I'm lucky if I have a guy with 30 goals. Of course, I don't follow soccer so I had no idea which way was more realistic. :D

[moriarty]

I think 'realistic' varies by league as some leagues are much more high scoring.

To give you an idea, with about six games remaining in the English Premier League the top scorer has 20 league goals (or somewhere close), and Ruud van Nistelrooy a top striker for Man Utd has 34 total goals, which includes European competitions.

[Bee]

What about scoring from the midfielders? From what I remember in old versions, I often had guys from the midfield that would score 8-10 goals a season. Is that abnormally high?

[andy m]

that's about right for a goal scoring midfielder.

[ColtCrazy]

yeah, I've read about the forward scoring bug on the SI site. Even some of the SI people have admitted it needs tweaking.

I use Marc's fabled 4-1-3-2 as well. Last year with CM01/02 my best mf would get about 8 goals. I'm sure this will be fixed in the next enhancement pack.

[Bee]

Well, I can see where people would be upset by the scoring. Even after it's patched, you have to decide if you want to restart your career. The scoring problem throws off previous stats and records. Someone really into soccer would probably be peeved about it.

[Katon]

The main problem with the bug isn't so much the records it produces as how much it overrates forwards. If you don't have good forwards, then even a very strong midfield can't save your attack.

[Bee]

Originally posted by Katon
The main problem with the bug isn't so much the records it produces as how much it overrates forwards. If you don't have good forwards, then even a very strong midfield can't save your attack.

Thats the bigger problem right now, but even when that's fixed if you continue your career you'll have screwed up stats and records.

[condors]

definatley have them go an runs and have long shots on that will help also i have had success having defenders good in the air get goals on coner kicks (my forwards are crap in the air), and last season i scored 58 goals total 40 of them were scored by my forwards. Hopefully that helps some, don't look at the goals scored but look and see if anyone is getting shots if not adjust

[ice4277]

I was going to open a new thread about this, but this one seems to be along the same track, so I will bring it up here....

I've played 12 or 13 matches so far, counting pre-season, with Ipswich. I've only given up 2 goals the entire time. My record is either 10 or 11 wins and 2 draws. I know Ipswich is a pretty good first division team, but when I play a game, I get the feeling that no matter what I set the tactics to or who I play, I am going to get a win. My team plays just as well on the road against top opposition as it does at home against the minnows. I rarely, if ever, give up a decent shot on goal, and if the opposition gets one, it looks like they hit a 'slow roller' right at my 'keeper. I have been over to the SI Games messageboards and it seems like a number of people have had the same experience of too easy of victories. Most of them, though, have scored insane numbers of goals, but it seems to be the reverse for me, that my defense is impenetrable. I really haven't had too much time to play so I probably need to play more, it may just be an abberation to this point, but something just feels off. Anybody else had an experience like this yet?

[Bee]

My first season with Barnet in the Conference I was basically unbeatable. I think I lost 2 conference matches for the entire season. My second season in Division Three has been much more reasonable.

[Calis]

Ice, I've definitely seen an instance of that before. I started out with the England National squad, ans so far I've won 21 games, and had 2 draws, with no losses. It's not even so much a matter of that, but the wins are unreal, I think I've my goal ratio is something like 77-20 or so.

I'm going to go ahead and start up a Conference career, as I know England isn't exactly the toughest nation to start up with, but when I'm breezing by teams like Brazil 4-0 in the Confederations Cup Final, Hungary went down 11 to frigging 0, and France 5-1 in the European Championship Final, it kinda takes the excitement out of things. I've been running a pretty heavily modified 3-5-2, and it's just been unstoppable. I do however, think I will win the World Cup before calling this career quits...or I might try out a sub-par Country and see if I can take them the distance.

I've had I believe 5 games where a striker has netted 5 goals for me, Owen's goals per game is unbelievable, and Roonaldo is getting up there. :)

[moriarty]

Originally posted by Calis
... Owen's goals per game is unbelievable, and Roonaldo is getting up there. :)

Owen is definitely jacked up in CM4. I'm playing Liverpool and, when not injured, he's averaging almost two goals per game.