There's a game on ESPN classic right now

[panerd]

between the Steelers and the Browns in 2003. Plaxico Burress just made an amazing touchdown grab. It got me to thinking, of all of the shit that has happened with NFL players in the past 6 years, why is he the one that's in prison? (we will ignore Rae Curruth for purposes of this argument) He shot himself in the leg, that's it!

[Tigercat]

Because he could have quite easily accidentally shot other people in that bar through his illegal actions. Not saying it justified as much jail time as he got, but its easy to see why he got jailtime.

[panerd]

Because he could have quite easily accidentally shot other people in that bar through his illegal actions. Not saying it justified as much jail time as he got, but its easy to see why he got jailtime.


But the last part is the important one. It would be like saying I understand why Dan got convicted for arson for burning down that building, not sure why he got the death penalty but I understand why he got convicted.

Two years? Really? This couldn't have been taken care of with a large fine or probation to tell him he needs to quit fucking around? People are really scared about carrying guns now in New York City because of Plaxico Burress? This guys life was really worth fucking up completely to prove the point that you can't carry an unregistered weapon?

Random Drug Dealer:"No I don't carry a gun, look what they did to Plax!"

[JPhillips]

I'm not against some form of punishment, but (and this may get my liberal card revoked) I think it's ridiculous that he got that mandatory sentence for not filling out the proper paperwork.

[panerd]

I just wonder how much his perceived attitude played into this. Can you imagine Bono or Brad Pitt or Shaq (not making a racial argument, making a like/dislike argument) going to prison for two years if they had an unregistered gun on them?

[RainMaker]

Seems you guys are more angry about the law in place than with what Plaxico got. The fact is that they have really strict gun laws. They feel you can't have people walking around a major city with guns in their pants.

What happened with Plax is the exact reason that law is in place. So a shit-for-brains doesn't have his gun go off and blow off someone's head by accident.

[JPhillips]

I just wonder how much his perceived attitude played into this. Can you imagine Bono or Brad Pitt or Shaq (not making a racial argument, making a like/dislike argument) going to prison for two years if they had an unregistered gun on them?

I thought it was a mandatory sentence.

edit: Looked it up and he faced a mandatory minimum of 3.5 years on the initial charges and pled guilty to a lesser charge to get a 20 month sentence.

[EagleFan]

between the Steelers and the Browns in 2003. Plaxico Burress just made an amazing touchdown grab. It got me to thinking, of all of the shit that has happened with NFL players in the past 6 years, why is he the one that's in prison? (we will ignore Rae Curruth for purposes of this argument) He shot himself in the leg, that's it!

The punk got what he deserved. End of story.

[stevew]

Compared to some of the other crazy shit, it is amazing he is doing this much time. Hopefully the governor will pardon him(if that is possible).

[RendeR]

Hopefully he won't.

There are a number of factors that played into this. He knowingly took a gun that wasn't registered, a gun that he DID NOT KNOW HOW TO USE PROPERLY, a gun that was not Holstered, a gun that the safety was not engaged on, into a night club full of people, IN HIS PANTS.

he did so because..why? What possible reason did he have for violating the law, intentionally?

If everything about the gun and its owner had been completely legal and there was an accident he'd never have seen jail. Unfortunately for Plax he's a fucking MORON.

I hope he serves every minute of the sentence he got.

[Danny]

Hopefully he won't.

There are a number of factors that played into this. He knowingly took a gun that wasn't registered, a gun that he DID NOT KNOW HOW TO USE PROPERLY, a gun that was not Holstered, a gun that the safety was not engaged on, into a night club full of people, IN HIS PANTS.

he did so because..why? What possible reason did he have for violating the law, intentionally?

If everything about the gun and its owner had been completely legal and there was an accident he'd never have seen jail. Unfortunately for Plax he's a fucking MORON.

I hope he serves every minute of the sentence he got.

I agree completely.

[illinifan999]

Compared to some of the other crazy shit, it is amazing he is doing this much time. Hopefully the governor will pardon him(if that is possible).


Would you want the governor to pardon a gang member who committed the same crime?

[stevew]

I don't really care. If you're comparing athletes to athletes, Plex has caused so much less harm, than say PacMan. Yet pacman is free, while plex is serving 20 months to prove a political point.

[stevew]

and read the fucking first post.

It got me to thinking, of all of the shit that has happened with NFL players in the past 6 years, why is he the one that's in prison?

this isn't about the population at large. So i could give a fuck if a gang member gets pardoned. Plex has his faults, surely. He's a very bad teammate. But, he's a fucking saint compared to many of the other pieces of shit who aren't serving 2 years in prison right now.

[Telle]

I don't really care. If you're comparing athletes to athletes, Plex has caused so much less harm, than say PacMan. Yet pacman is free, while plex is serving 20 months to prove a political point.

Doesn't it make more sense to compare crime to crime? How much time does the average person who does something similar get?

[stevew]

And for reference sakes, off the top of my head.......

NFL assholes that surely should be in prison before Plex
-Pacman-enough said
-Jared Allen-3 time DUI champ
-Larry Johnson-beat and spit on women
-chris henry-just a charming individual


The above 4 assholes did like less than a month combined, yet Plex is in for 2 years. Think about it.

[RainMaker]

It is not to prove a political point. That is what the law is there in New York. It's very strict when it comes to guns and no one gets off without jail time.

[sabotai]

Doesn't it make more sense to compare crime to crime? How much time does the average person who does something similar get?

From what I remember reading at the time when this all started, the average person with no prior criminal record usually pled to a lesser charge that had them serve anywhere from 3 to 12 months of jail time.

This is why some people say it was a DA trying to make a name for himself to look tough on crime. Plex got harsher treatment than the average person.

[Telle]

From what I remember reading at the time when this all started, the average person with no prior criminal record usually pled to a lesser charge that had them serve anywhere from 3 to 12 months of jail time.

This is why some people say it was a DA trying to make a name for himself to look tough on crime. Plex got harsher treatment than the average person.

Now an argument on those grounds I can accept. If he got a harsher sentence than normal then that's something to point out. But claiming that he should get a light sentence because he's a football player and other football players got light sentences for their crimes is just complete bullshit.

[illinifan999]

and read the fucking first post.



this isn't about the population at large. So i could give a fuck if a gang member gets pardoned. Plex has his faults, surely. He's a very bad teammate. But, he's a fucking saint compared to many of the other pieces of shit who aren't serving 2 years in prison right now.

I did. You said he should be pardoned. That's a whole different ballgame than just talking about the punishment he received. Did I touch a nerve or something?

[k0ruptr]

I'm wondering if people realize that he will serve more time in prison than Michael Vick did... don't you think that is fucked up?

[Telle]

I'm wondering if people realize that he will serve more time in prison than Michael Vick did... don't you think that is fucked up?

Yes. Vick should have gotten much more time than he did.

[k0ruptr]

I'm actually on the other side of the fence, I think Vick's sentence was fair, and Plax' wasn't. I know its the law, So I disagree with the law then. I understand why its there, but I think it should be adjusted, or at least evaluated case by case.

[JPhillips]

into a night club full of people, IN HIS PANTS.


There's a night club in my pants!

[Jon]

Doesn't it make more sense to compare crime to crime? How much time does the average person who does something similar get?

It does--and it makes sense to compare state to state. It's not New York county's fault that they enforce the law whether you're a celebrity or not. And New York County is really good at treating people the same.

What we forget is that gun violence is a BIG issue for Mike Bloomberg and Robert Morganthau, the DA of New York County. NY County has zero tolerance for gun crime, period. They push jailtime if you have an unlicensed weapon.

Besides, he committed a felony when the gun went off. It was reckless endangerment.
And don't forget he made attempts to cover it up.

[samifan24]

How is Leonard Little still in the league? Didn't he kill a woman while drunk driving? After that, wasn't he arrested years later for hitting someone else with his car?

[molson]

It's really interesting when the tough gun control laws/liberal criminal punishment ideas kind of come together in conflict like this. (As generally, those who favor harsher gun control favor lighter criminal sentences, and vice versa).

The idea that he "only forgot to do paperwork" is pretty humorous and unrealistically apologetic of the crime he committed.

The U.S. varies greatly from state to state on gun laws. Do this in Idaho, you'll get a fine (and maybe a "nice gun man, where can I get one?" from the prosecutor). Do this in NYC, and you're fucked. So if you do it in NYC, you're a moron. That's one of the things that's great about America (though this is fading away as the federal government gets stronger and stronger all the time). NYC, and Idaho, can choose how retarded they think this behavior is, and punish it accordingly. Communities can choose their values. Now that a beloved pro athlete gets in the middle of it - suddenly people turn on the values that NYC has chosen for itself. It's kind of funny to see people outside NYC all pissed off about NYC'S values.

For that reason, comparing this case to Michael Vick makes zero sense. They're two completely different jurisdictions. They're not required to cross-reference each other and concede to each other's values about what's appropriate. They're allowed to have their own opinions.

[Logan]

First of all panerd, could you really not have just read through the old thread on this?


But, he's a fucking saint compared to many of the other pieces of shit who aren't serving 2 years in prison right now.

And for reference sakes, off the top of my head.......

NFL assholes that surely should be in prison before Plex
-Pacman-enough said
-Jared Allen-3 time DUI champ
-Larry Johnson-beat and spit on women
-chris henry-just a charming individual


The above 4 assholes did like less than a month combined, yet Plex is in for 2 years. Think about it.

Jesus fucking Christ, why do people love comparing cases against each other? Yes, our judicial system is fucked up...but why the fuck should Plax get off because some dipshit judge went light on Jared Allen?

It does--and it makes sense to compare state to state. It's not New York county's fault that they enforce the law whether you're a celebrity or not. And New York County is really good at treating people the same.

What we forget is that gun violence is a BIG issue for Mike Bloomberg and Robert Morganthau, the DA of New York County. NY County has zero tolerance for gun crime, period. They push jailtime if you have an unlicensed weapon.

Besides, he committed a felony when the gun went off. It was reckless endangerment.
And don't forget he made attempts to cover it up.

Thank you. God forbid people should be held accountable for their actions. He should be locked up like the criminal he is for 3.5 years and not a god damn day less.

[k0ruptr]

Absolutely, I just think its fucked up whats going on compared to others, thats all. I agree he should do the time that the state law says, I just don't agree with the state law.

[JPhillips]

It's really interesting when the tough gun control laws/liberal criminal punishment ideas kind of come together in conflict like this. (As generally, those who favor harsher gun control favor lighter criminal sentences, and vice versa).

The idea that he "only forgot to do paperwork" is pretty humorous and unrealistically apologetic of the crime he committed.

The U.S. varies greatly from state to state on gun laws. Do this in Idaho, you'll get a fine (and maybe a "nice gun man, where can I get one?" from the prosecutor). Do this in NYC, and you're fucked. So if you do it in NYC, you're a moron. That's one of the things that's great about America (though this is fading away as the federal government gets stronger and stronger all the time). NYC, and Idaho, can choose how retarded they think this behavior is, and punish it accordingly. Communities can choose their values. Now that a beloved pro athlete gets in the middle of it - suddenly people turn on the values that NYC has chosen for itself. It's kind of funny to see people outside NYC all pissed off about NYC'S values.

For that reason, comparing this case to Michael Vick makes zero sense. They're two completely different jurisdictions. They're not required to cross-reference each other and concede to each other's values about what's appropriate. They're allowed to have their own opinions.

I don't think he forgot the paperwork, nor am I apologizing for the crime. I just think it's stupid to have such harsh mandatory sentences for lack of paperwork. If the crime had more to do with discharging the weapon I'd be more receptive. Overall I think there's way too many licensing laws and fees nationwide, from cars and guns to hair stylists and plumbers.

[sterlingice]

I think this is a good idea for a thread. Not so much from the "why was Plax screwed" angle but from the "why did all of these other guys get off so light" part

SI

[Samdari]

I don't think he forgot the paperwork, nor am I apologizing for the crime. I just think it's stupid to have such harsh mandatory sentences for lack of paperwork. If the crime had more to do with discharging the weapon I'd be more receptive. Overall I think there's way too many licensing laws and fees nationwide, from cars and guns to hair stylists and plumbers.

You clearly have no idea what he was convicted of. There aren't harsh mandatory sentences for not doing paperwork. Registered or not, the crime he committed was walking into the crowded nightclub carrying a loaded, concealed handgun. Where you got the idea that you can get a permit for that in NYC I do not know, but I assure you, there is no paperwork he could have filled out that would have made carrying that gun into the club legal.

[RendeR]

I don't think he forgot the paperwork, nor am I apologizing for the crime. I just think it's stupid to have such harsh mandatory sentences for lack of paperwork. If the crime had more to do with discharging the weapon I'd be more receptive. Overall I think there's way too many licensing laws and fees nationwide, from cars and guns to hair stylists and plumbers.


I'm not sure there is even enough time to list off everything that is wrong with this post.

The punishment was for discharging an "illegal" firearm. He would still have gotten arrested if it was legal, the fact that he was a dumbass and didn't ensure that it was covered properly bumped this from a misdemeanor or very low level felony to a major weapons charge.

Without those licensings and fees you would never have recourse to go after someone that screwed you over. There would be no way to trace fly-by-night scammers. Licensing and fees and most all things like that make it possible to go into a business and trust that its a legitimate establishment where you can not worry about getting ganked.

Plax got a big sentence because he made NUMEROUS personal choices that he KNEW were wrong, one right after another.

Didn't register the gun properly.
Took the gun to a night club full of people.
Didn't have the safety on.
Kept the gun in HIS PANTS.

If he had done everything the right way, I'd STILL expect him to get jail time for taking a handgun into a night club because thats just fucking stupid. But the truth of it all is, IF he had done it all correctly then he'd have gotten a fine and probation and we'd never hear about this again.

As for the others I honestly don;t know their cases as well as Plax's so I can't say on particulars, but I'm assuming they all went through due process and got whatever they could or should have gotten based on precedence and whatever laws required for their crimes.

I just don't get the outrage. Should the league simply make a regulation that says "if you commit X level crime then you're no longer eligible to play in the NFL and forfeit any further rights to your contract"?

I personally think that would help. If there was a real threat of players losing everything and getting booted permanently then I think we'd see far less of this.

As it is the league just ignores most of it or slaps them on the wrist. I think its high time the league says enough is enough. You want to PRIVILEGE of playing in the NFL and making ungodly amounts of money? then you're going to be a MODEL citizen or you're gone.