Official College Football Thread - Championship Week

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Pretty interesting start this week. The Big Ten is using a Craigslist ad through a third party to quietly pay people $75/person to go to the Big Ten Championship game.

The Big Ten Championship is Looking for ‘Event Seat-Fillers’ | Kegs 'n Eggs Blog (http://kegsneggsblog.com/2011/11/30/the-big-ten-championship-is-looking-for-event-seat-fillers/)

[Honolulu_Blue]

Pretty interesting start this week. The Big Ten is using a Craigslist ad through a third party to quietly pay people $75/person to go to the Big Ten Championship game.

The Big Ten Championship is Looking for ‘Event Seat-Fillers’ | Kegs 'n Eggs Blog (http://kegsneggsblog.com/2011/11/30/the-big-ten-championship-is-looking-for-event-seat-fillers/)

No. It's not. That's already been exposed as a hoax.

[JPhillips]

A source close to the Wiscy AD told me that they are planning on using mannequins and ballistic dummies to "enhance" the look of the crowd.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

No. It's not. That's already been exposed as a hoax.

Ah, just saw the description of how they pulled it off. Pretty funny stuff.

[Ksyrup]

There are conference championships, so that's accurate.

Of course, winning or even playing for your conference championship doesn't matter in the broad sense to the outcome of the national title, but I guess it's good for bragging rights.

I'm sure Brad Edwards or someone has already mathematically proven even this won't matter, but the only interest I have in this weekend, aside from hoping for some good football games, is seeing LSU lose and OK State beat OU by 3 TDs. That would at least generate some potential for movement and controversy.

I still can't believe that out of 60 AP voters, 20 have OK State ranked 5th or lower, several outside the top 10 (as low as 14). That's a total screw job. They might not be better than Alabama, but on total body of work, I think they're probably more deserving than Alabama (assuming they beat OU). The only hope I'm holding out is many skeptical voters are keeping them back waiting to see what happens against OU, and then will move them up if they impress. Otherwise... total screw job.

[Marmel]

Question: If Georgia wins the SECCG, they get an automatic BCS bowl bid.
Each conference can only send 2 teams, maximum to the BCS Bowls.

So, would a Georgia win mean that LSU and Alabama cannot both go to the Title game? Or can the SEC somehow get 3 teams in the BCS bowls by having 2 of them in the title game?

[digamma]

The rule was changed in 2007 to allow 3 teams. Prior to that the conference champion would have been left out.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Question: If Georgia wins the SECCG, they get an automatic BCS bowl bid.
Each conference can only send 2 teams, maximum to the BCS Bowls.

So, would a Georgia win mean that LSU and Alabama cannot both go to the Title game? Or can the SEC somehow get 3 teams in the BCS bowls by having 2 of them in the title game?

This article has a discussion about the possibility of three teams from the SEC.

MrSEC.com (http://www.mrsec.com/2011/11/when-it-comes-to-championship-games-the-sec-gets-it-right/)

[Ksyrup]

The only way 3 teams make it is in this exact scenario - two of them would have to make the title game for the third, which would have to be the conference championship game winner, to also make it.

That may be more of a reason for voters to make sure Alabama and LSU play in the NCG than any unfairness to OK State or another team, because if UGA wins and voters want to put OK State against LSU, then Alabama cannot play in a BCS bowl (or, if LSU gets blown out somehow, and OK State would play Alabama for the title, LSU gets left out of the BCS).

[Matthean]

A source close to the Wiscy AD told me that they are planning on using mannequins and ballistic dummies to "enhance" the look of the crowd.

A guy in my class said he and some buddies are going and fillers are paid $9.

[Ksyrup]

You know, thinking through my last post, college football is so screwed up, that there is LESS of a chance for OK State to play for the title if LSU LOSES than if they win. Think about that.

If LSU loses, UGA is automatically in, and the only way both LSU and Alabama get to play in a BCS bowl is if they both are in the title game. And so my guess is voters would not move OK State (or Stanford, or VT, etc.) up, becacuse then either LSU or Alabama is totally out of the BCS, which I don't think anyone thinks would be right.

But if LSU wins, and OK State beats OU by 3 TDs, then I could see a slim chance that OK State moves to #2, Alabama drops to #3, but Alabama still gets an at-large bid, which would be fair.

So OK State should be rooting for LSU to win. Otherwise, they are likely locked out of the title game.

Bizarre.

[Matthean]

OSU needs to beat the living hell out of OU for a chance. I still think OU wins, but I don't think the margin is that big either way.

A practical thought that won't go anywhere, if the Big 12 was done last week like other conferences, OSU and 'Bama could spend this week playing for a spot against LSU. The "And 1" could be dealt with even after the conference championships so the bowls games have everything sit up from the get go.

[jbergey22]

A source close to the Wiscy AD told me that they are planning on using mannequins and ballistic dummies to "enhance" the look of the crowd.

A guy in my class said he and some buddies are going and fillers are paid $9.

Seems surprising to me I guess. Wisky travels very well usually and Id assume the same from Michigan St. I guess the fans just arent as excited about this B10 championship as they are bowl games.

[digamma]

If LSU loses, UGA is automatically in, and the only way both LSU and Alabama get to play in a BCS bowl is if they both are in the title game. And so my guess is voters would not move OK State (or Stanford, or VT, etc.) up, becacuse then either LSU or Alabama is totally out of the BCS, which I don't think anyone thinks would be right.


I think you're giving the voters way to much credit in going to the second or third level of thinking this would require.

[jbergey22]

You know, thinking through my last post, college football is so screwed up, that there is LESS of a chance for OK State to play for the title if LSU LOSES than if they win. Think about that.

If LSU loses, UGA is automatically in, and the only way both LSU and Alabama get to play in a BCS bowl is if they both are in the title game. And so my guess is voters would not move OK State (or Stanford, or VT, etc.) up, becacuse then either LSU or Alabama is totally out of the BCS, which I don't think anyone thinks would be right.

But if LSU wins, and OK State beats OU by 3 TDs, then I could see a slim chance that OK State moves to #2, Alabama drops to #3, but Alabama still gets an at-large bid, which would be fair.

So OK State should be rooting for LSU to win. Otherwise, they are likely locked out of the title game.

Bizarre.

Basically it sounds like Okie St has no chance. I didnt even think of it from this angle but you are absolutely correct.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I think you're giving the voters way to much credit in going to the second or third level of thinking this would require.

It's also overthinking it.

I believe the voters have made it pretty clear what the top two teams are, and even a fluke loss by LSU to UGAg isn't likely to do anything more than flip which order they consider them.

[Ksyrup]

It's not overthinking it from a theoretical standpoint. If, for some reason, OK State had a better than slim/none chance of leapfrogging Alabama, I would expect someone to point this out.

I'm not really thinking about it from an LSU perspective, but a "what if OK State does the improbable and blows out OU?" perspective. I think LSU is in, win or lose, but I'm just thinking through scenarios where OK State could jump Alabama. The only way I think voters would allow that is if LSU wins. If LSU loses, they wouldn't give in to the temptation to jump Alabama, if it meant Alabama was out of the BCS entirely.

But yeah, I guess I agree with your general thought that I'm giving the voters way too much credit to think it through like this. But still, I'd expect there to be a few twitter/internet folks who would point this out Saturday night into Sunday, so that some voters would be aware of it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

It's not overthinking it from a theoretical standpoint.

Oh no, that's fine, it's a valid hypothetical/theoretical. I was just trying to say that it isn't going to get that far.

[Matthean]

Seems surprising to me I guess. Wisky travels very well usually and Id assume the same from Michigan St. I guess the fans just arent as excited about this B10 championship as they are bowl games.

Wisconsin gave back 2K in tickets.

http://nebraska.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1301085

[Passacaglia]

Wisconsin gave back 2K in tickets.

HuskerOnline.com - Big Ten title game not a hot ticket (http://nebraska.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1301085)

Crazy. If Michigan had made it, I would have really wanted to go to the first Big Ten Championship Game ever.

[panerd]

OSU needs to beat the living hell out of OU for a chance. I still think OU wins, but I don't think the margin is that big either way.

A practical thought that won't go anywhere, if the Big 12 was done last week like other conferences, OSU and 'Bama could spend this week playing for a spot against LSU. The "And 1" could be dealt with even after the conference championships so the bowls games have everything sit up from the get go.

Except OSU hasn't played the second best (or best in a lot of people's minds) team in the conference yet.

[Ksyrup]

I thinnk Matthean's assumption for his comment is that OK State and OU would have played before this week, and OK State would have won. Obviously, a 2-loss OK State is out of the title game picture.

[Matthean]

I thinnk Matthean's assumption for his comment is that OK State and OU would have played before this week, and OK State would have won. Obviously, a 2-loss OK State is out of the title game picture.

+1. Hence the comment "if the Big 12 was done last week."

[mauchow]

I couldn't convince my wife to let me take a 7 hour road trip to Indianapolis to watch the first ever B1G Championship to watch the Badgers take on MSU.

Game time getting closer.. getting pumped up now.

[panerd]

+1. Hence the comment "if the Big 12 was done last week."

Right but that is a huge assumption. Its not like OSU is playing Kansas. So to say this would be a good week for the playoff is completely ignoring that the big 12 saved some of its better games for the final weekend of the season. I am not against a playoff but sometimes the arguments for playoffs (or "+1's") take a lot of liberties with assumptions.

[Ksyrup]

I think he's talking not only theoretically with respect to this particular season, but in general going forward. Basically, if the Big 12 ended its season a week early, and some team was 11-1 and fighting for a spot in the NCG, then this would be a good weekend for a playoff match-up. But as it stands, the Big 12 season is extended, and that match-up can't occur.

I'm not sure he was expressing any particfular confidence in OK State, other than for this season, if they beat OU and ended up 11-1, they'd be the Big 12's entry in a possible playoff. I don't think this is really about OK State at all, other than they happen to be the team this year (if they beat OU), but what the Big 12 could/should do to facilitate a playoff.

[Easy Mac]

oh dabo. (skip to 1:47).

<iframe width="853" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/4hiCvFHR2Vo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[JonInMiddleGA]

What the heck, do they randomly interview coaches in the Clemson parking lot after practice or something?

My other initial reaction is that for a question that he said he didn't like, he sure had a long answer.

[Matthean]

He mentions he had heard about what was said so he might have prepped for it, or just knows his history. SoCar has been vastly a nobody before Holtz showed up.

[Chief Rum]

What, no talk about the expected brawn versus brute force matchup of UCLA-Oregon tonight? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

Odds that Chris Petersen's name is mentioned as many times as UCLA's #1 running back Franklin. I'll say it's even odds.

[Young Drachma]

BEST REGULAR SEASON IN SPORTS.

eyeroll.

[JonInMiddleGA]

eyeroll.

I see your eyeroll & raise you one.

What else compares, the NB ... oops, nevermind ;)

[Swaggs]

WVU, with a last second FG win last night over USF, earned a share of the Big East championship.

If Cincy can beat UConn at home on Saturday (Cincy is favored by 10 points), WVU will likely get a shot at the Orange Bowl (and quite possibly vs our old friend Virginia Tech). :)

[Swaggs]

I see your eyeroll & raise you one.

What else compares, the NB ... oops, nevermind ;)

Seriously.

I love MLB, NFL and NCAA basketball, but I'd give them up in a second to have college football year round.

[Ksyrup]

I think the Dabo/Spurrier "controversy" is a fine example of the stupidity of reacting to something you were told about second-hand, and/or the dangers of reading into something written what clearly wasn't there when spoken.

In writing, it looks like Todd Ellis was giving a full Spurrier quote. When you hear him saying it, it's obvious Ellis himself added the "we ain't Clemson" part. Which, IMO, is standard rivalry smack talk, anyway.

[Young Drachma]

Your regular season isn't shit if all of the games boil down to I WONDER HOW THE POLLSTERS WILL VOTE. It's like an election where the results are decided by a three legged race. Each week. Blindfolded. Into a canyon.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Dabo Swinney's rant over misattributed Steve Spurrier quote creates Twitter stir - Page 2 - ESPN (http://espn.go.com/espn/page2/index?id=7305975)

edit to add: Here's the real telling thing about all this I think
Bothered "the quote" was getting attention, when he believed the focus should be on Saturday's ACC title game, the Clemson coach concluded, "So, you can print that, tweet that, whatever."

Your not-rivalry with South Carolina is more interesting than the ACC title game ... I'm pretty sure that says something about the state of the landscape in college football.

[Matthean]

WVU, with a last second FG win last night over USF, earned a share of the Big East championship.

If Cincy can beat UConn at home on Saturday (Cincy is favored by 10 points), WVU will likely get a shot at the Orange Bowl (and quite possibly vs our old friend Virginia Tech). :)

Now if OU would beat OSU and WVU beats VT, we get to see what people would do trying to decide between 'Bama and Stanford who gets to go to the title game when neither won their conference. :lol:

[Young Drachma]

Seriously Fox? A 30 minute pregame show for a "championship" game featuring a 6-6 UCLA team with a lame duck coach?

I'm sure the block was scheduled for no matter who got there. What would you prefer they do? Just run 30 min of ads? An hour-long Stanford special? P0rn?

Also, isn't that the beauty and magic and grandeur of what makes this sport so fantabulous? That on any given Saturday or Thursday or Friday that someone might beat someone else with a clever title attached to the game like The Hateful Family Reunion or some such? I mean, it's these <s>money grabs</s> sacred events that protect us from an educationally degrading playoff, right? Let us herald those South Division champions of the Pacific-12!

[dawgfan]

I don't think you'll find many college football traditionalists that will argue in favor of "conference championship games".

That said, this game would have looked far more appealing had USC not been on probation...

[Lathum]

That said, this game would have looked far more appealing had USC not been on probation...

I dunno, then people would be screaming because this game was already played 2 weeks ago.

[Grover]

Seriously Fox? A 30 minute pregame show for a "championship" game featuring a 6-6 UCLA team with a lame duck coach?

I wouldn't put anything beyond Fox for a pre-game. You saw their Champions League final pre-match last year, right?

Worst pre-game in the history of sports, ever.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Seriously Fox? A 30 minute pregame show for a "championship" game featuring a 6-6 UCLA team with a lame duck coach?

You'd prefer more commercials in-game? That's probably the option in lieu of the additional inventory that the pregame provides.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I don't think you'll find many college football traditionalists that will argue in favor of "conference championship games".


I imagine you're right about that.

[bhlloy]

UCLA plays really well on downs 1-3 and then decides to put 6 defenders out on fourth down and gives up the easiest 40 yard run I've ever seen. This could get ugly.

[bhlloy]

lol, or not

[k0ruptr]

Or still yet...

[Ksyrup]

Fox has AWFUL college football coverage. Good Lord. It's like watching Versus' first broadcast. The announcer pre-game intro/discussion was like watching something on public access TV or a sports reporters class at the local community college.

[Ksyrup]

I'm really beginning to enjoy this Ohio team. Solich has them very well coached. Son of Fruit Loops might be my favorite QB in college right now even if he is only 5'11".

They're giving Mickey Tettleton Mrs. Kurt Warner screen time.

[BishopMVP]

BEST REGULAR SEASON IN SPORTS.

eyeroll.I guess I don't get what these lackluster championship games are proving for the playoff proponents. If there were a playoff with any significant number of teams (8-12-16-etc) there would just be more of these games late in the regular season where an elite team has already clinched a berth and can afford a loss.

It also proves the allure of each individual "minor" game - did anyone before the season have Oklahoma State/Iowa State, OU/TT, VT/Clemson or even Boise/TCU circled as elimination games? (maybe the last 2) Because that's essentially what they ended up being. In a world where any BCS team can afford 1 loss and make the playoffs, they wouldn't have been.

[EagleFan]

Could be a good ending for the MAC championship, for those watching the blowout in the PAC. Northern Illinois down 20-13 and getting the ball back with about 4 minutes left in the game.

[EagleFan]

I guess I don't get what these lackluster championship games are proving for the playoff proponents. If there were a playoff with any significant number of teams (8-12-16-etc) there would just be more of these games late in the regular season where an elite team has already clinched a berth and can afford a loss.

It also proves the allure of each individual "minor" game - did anyone before the season have Oklahoma State/Iowa State, OU/TT, VT/Clemson or even Boise/TCU circled as elimination games? (maybe the last 2) Because that's essentially what they ended up being. In a world where any BCS team can afford 1 loss and make the playoffs, they wouldn't have been.

You still get those so called elimination games. Give playoff births to the conference champions and it makes every in conference game meaningful and the conference championship games. Fill in the last few teams with at large bids and it still makes every game meaningful as teams can't afford to risk being a one loss team and potentially missing that bubble if they don't win their conference.

There is nothing lost. The rivalries remain, the intensity remains and is turned up to 11 when the playoffs begin.

This MAC championship game, which is already a good finish tied 20-20 with about a minute left, would be that much more intense with a playoff birth at stake.

[EagleFan]

More icing of the kicker.

Couldn't it actually be better to not take that timeout at some point. Everyone is waiting to hear the whistle blow and the play to stop. Couldn't it mess with them more if the timeout doesn't happen? After the back to back timeouts the kicker knows that the play is definitely happening now as there are no timeouts left. He can be completely focussed for that kick that actually happened. Don't take that second timeout and now the play has to start while the kicker could have been in the mental state that he wasn't actually going to have to kick it yet.

[RomaGoth]

Every other college sport has some type of playoff system, from NCAA hockey (Frozen Four) to baseball (College World Series). All professional leagues have playoffs in the United States, and as far as I know, in other countries as well (i.e., soccer and hockey in Europe).

The proponents of the BCS baffle me sometimes. I just don't get the love for it at all. :confused:

[StLee]

Every other college sport has some type of playoff system, from NCAA hockey (Frozen Four) to baseball (College World Series). All professional leagues have playoffs in the United States, and as far as I know, in other countries as well (i.e., soccer and hockey in Europe).

The proponents of the BCS baffle me sometimes. I just don't get the love for it at all. :confused:

Not to mention that one half of Division I college football has a playoff system...

[MrBug708]

Well, we didnt totally embarrass ourselves

[JonInMiddleGA]

Well, we didnt totally embarrass ourselves

No, you didn't. Under the circumstances I'm not sure how much more could have been expected from the Bruins.

[MrBug708]

Which is a sad state of affairs for our athletic department.

[RomaGoth]

Which is a sad state of affairs for our athletic department.

On the bright side, Neuheisel his gone!

[RainMaker]

Thought this number was interesting. Fox paid $14 million to carry the P-12 title game. They paid $10.5 million to carry 6 P-12 games on Fox Sport Net.

[RainMaker]

The proponents of the BCS baffle me sometimes. I just don't get the love for it at all. :confused:
The proponents of it are Fiesta Bowl Inc, Sugar Bowl Inc, etc. Companies that buy off ADs and other vested interests and get them to take less money for their schools to run some sham system. You have a postseason that forces schools to lose actualy money.

And there doesn't need to be some elaborate playoff concocted. It's done in every major professional sport. It's done in every other level of college football. This isn't rocket science to put together. So the logistics argument is laughable. And don't even get me started on those pretending this is about tradition.

[Lathum]

Thought this number was interesting. Fox paid $14 million to carry the P-12 title game. They paid $10.5 million to carry 6 P-12 games on Fox Sport Net.

That really isn't that bad considering the implications that game can have. They got a dud this year with UCLA getting in and Oregon having no shot at the NC game, but there are a ton of scenarios where that game could have huge implications.

[BishopMVP]

You still get those so called elimination games. Give playoff births to the conference champions and it makes every in conference game meaningful and the conference championship games. Fill in the last few teams with at large bids and it still makes every game meaningful as teams can't afford to risk being a one loss team and potentially missing that bubble if they don't win their conference.

There is nothing lost. The rivalries remain, the intensity remains and is turned up to 11 when the playoffs begin.Oh, I get the playoff argument, and I'm somewhere between agnostic and agreeing with it, but I just don't see how a playoff proponent can use the lackluster championship game weekend due to LSU/Alabama as an argument. LSU (and Alabama) wouldn't have needed to win the last two weekends. OK State wouldn't need a win.

And teams like OK State, OK, UGA, Clemson, and even UCLA have a shot this weekend at winning their conference, (and presumably a playoff berth) proving all those teams could afford 1 (or more) losses and still have a playoff berth. Look at the FCS system - there's a whole lot of 3 loss teams and even past champions.And none of those would let UCLA anywhere near the playoff system. I'd much rather have 8-12-16 teams that are actually good playing for a real championship than a system that could conceivably allow an awful team like UCLA anywhere near one of the supposedly premier bowl games.UCLA won their division, played in the title game, and thus could have won the PAC-12 conference. Almost every proposed playoff system would have automatically included them as a BCS conference champion (if they had won). Being mad that instead they had an equal chance to play in the 5th highest rated consolation/exhibition game under this system is just weird. Maybe JIMGA or some Pac-12/Big-10 fans will argue with you about the tradition of the Rose Bowl, but that's certainly not what I like about the current system, or why I defend it. I'd also argue that certain teams (Stony Brook, Albany, Tennessee Tech, etc) are quite obviously inferior to the ~15 FCS schools that deserve to compete for the title year in and year out. (I also find it amusing when people constantly claim a playoff system (like in FCS!) would be so much fairer - despite at least 3 conferences having never been selected for an at-large berth and thus never had a playoff team.)

imo, the biggest problem with a playoff system is that it would need to be agreed upon before the season, and in actuality the number of teams that deserve to play for it changes from season to season. This year you could argue either 3 (OK St/Bama winner plays LSU) or 5-7 (those 3 + Stanford, Boise, possibly VT and Houston depending on tomorrow's results) unless you want to get crazy and argue the 3rd best team in its division (Arkansas) deserves to go. Some years it would be as few as two (Texas/USC, Miami/Ohio State), some years as many as 12, but where that tier breaks off changes year to year, and no NCAA system could be flexible enough to address that.

[jbergey22]

Especially after the article earlier showing that the folks at the BCS don't even have access to 5 of the 6 computer formulas that are used for it. It's a complete fraud/joke on every conceivable level.

One of these days FBS will crown the first ever champion of the top division of NCAA football.

Why exactly does the BCS need access to these formula? If they knew how to or wanted to create formulas they would just do it themselves.

They use 6 computer rankings from respected sources. They throw out each teams highest/lowest computer ranking. Im not seeing the "complete fraud/joke on every conceivable level" that you are.

I love how you go around throwing out WAR and xFIP in every possible baseball debate but cant grasp the concept of computers doing a decent job in college football.

[jbergey22]

LOL. Did you bother reading the article at all? The one formula they have access to was looked into, and they found entry errors. Then there's the part where one of the formulas ranks all the way down to the JC level and had a JC college ranked 30th.

It's not that computers can't do a decent job, it's that anyone with a clue about quantitative research scoffs at the formulas being used as complete bunk.

No I didnt read it. Getting harder to find reading material that is trustworthy these days. Ill take a look at it again.

[BishopMVP]

You really don't think OK/Ok St. would serve as a probable eliminator this weekend?Depends on the number of teams. 16+ and OK State is easily in already. Even a 12-team one and they're in. Who are the at-larges ahead of 2-loss OK State? Alabama, Stanford, (Houston and Boise if they're not in automatically), maybe Arkansas? I don't see South Carolina, Michigan or Kansas State beating them out. Again, there are plenty of valid reasons for a playoff system - I just don't see any way this weekend would be more meaningful with one.There's a reason I proposed an 8 FBS win threshold, even for conference winners. FCS has a 7 D-I win threshold for everyone outside the conferences and has considered making it a rule even for conference winners.Yeah, but that's you proposing a rule. I'm sure if you were in charge of the BCS qualifying criteria you'd also propose a win threshold.

[molson]

This year you could argue either 3 (OK St/Bama winner plays LSU) or 5-7 (those 3 + Stanford, Boise, possibly VT and Houston depending on tomorrow's results) unless you want to get crazy and argue the 3rd best team in its division (Arkansas) deserves to go.

Or really, this year, a playoff isn't even necessary, you could argue LSU should just be the champion. I realize in other sports, Arkansas would still have a chance to be national champion at this point, but that's never been a compelling argument for me. College football is different. The games are more important. There is a lot less randomness in the outcomes. Arkansas should not have a chance for the championship at this point and I'd oppose any system in which they would (or for that matter, I'd oppose any system where the Sun Belt or Big East Champion still has a chance for the championship)

[jbergey22]

There, maybe even you can understand that having formulas that are mocked by everyone with a clue about quantitative analysis, mocked by everyone because they're hidden and cannot be checked for accuracy, and mocked by everyone who understands the created bias by releasing the results half way through the season is a complete joke. The 6 formulas are not from respected sources, they're from guys who tinker with numbers but are so insecure about their findings that they don't release the formulas for peer scrutiny. No one with a functioning brain would take their results seriously.


I am not going to debate you on this other than to mention that Jeff Sagarin is respected and this was an obviously very bias article with no proof of any of their claims.

Yahoo isnt exactly cutting edge information.

[Buccaneer]

molson is correct, why would Arkansas or Alabama get to have another shot? Those were two of the biggest games this regular season and why make those meaningless? The NFL is paid to produce a slick product, college football has a lot of tradition, rivalries and simply fun gameday experiences that makes their place in the bigger picture somewhat irrelevant. I think most Georgia fans cared much more about its games with Auburn and GT than the upcoming LSU game or whoever they would play in a hypothetical playoffs.

Look at the list of rivalry games. That's what makes college football unique and special. Playing the rivalry game again in the same season would be silly and redundant. If a team does good in the regular season, just send them to a bowl game as a reward. If there are those that can't live without whose #1 (or how your team ranks), just go by the subjective AP poll as they have done for years. Do away with the BCS nonsense and any thoughts of a superflous playoffs.

[gstelmack]

I am not going to debate you on this other than to mention that Jeff Sagarin is respected and this was an obviously very bias article with no proof of any of their claims.

It was nationally noted last year that they found entry errors in the one computer poll they got to look at.

Then there's the fact that one human poll is from coaches who often have a staffer fill it out, because they don't get to actually watch the games, plus the bias of humans tending to rate things the same outside of a loss, meaning it's hard to move up into the top if you don't start there unless everyone ahead of you loses no matter how well you play. So your odds of making the championship game are based on how you START the year, not how you actually play out the year.

Have verification of the computer data, and don't do a poll until the end of the season, and maybe you've got something. But the system right now is full of biases and problems.

[molson]

molson is correct, why would Arkansas or Alabama get to have another shot? Those were two of the biggest games this regular season and why make those meaningless? The NFL is paid to produce a slick product, college football has a lot of tradition, rivalries and simply fun gameday experiences that makes their place in the bigger picture somewhat irrelevant. I think most Georgia fans cared much more about its games with Auburn and GT than the upcoming LSU game or whoever they would play in a hypothetical playoffs.

Look at the list of rivalry games. That's what makes college football unique and special. Playing the rivalry game again in the same season would be silly and redundant. If a team does good in the regular season, just send them to a bowl game as a reward. If there are those that can't live without whose #1 (or how your team ranks), just go by the subjective AP poll as they have done for years. Do away with the BCS nonsense and any thoughts of a superflous playoffs.

I think one of the big differences of opinion on the playoff thing is whether you have the mindset that the singular championship is all that matters in sports, and if a game doesn't have some implication towards that final championship, it's meaningless. That mindset has led to expanded playoffs in most other sports to try to create more meaning - even if it's just the Seahawks v. Eagles. Even though crappy, that game still has some "meaning" because both teams still were in contention for the playoffs, and could, possibility, be champions.

College football is much less like that though, as you point out. Even with no championship, some fans still find huge meaning in rivalries, conference games, or even non-conference head-to-head matches (Boise St. v. Georgia, for example, had meaning beyond the eventual national championship - it was SEC v. dominant small-conference team). I think other sports USED to have that kind of thing (pre-baseball playoffs, when most teams were never in contention for a championship, I'm sure the games themselves had meaning.)

[jbergey22]

It was nationally noted last year that they found entry errors in the one computer poll they got to look at.

Then there's the fact that one human poll is from coaches who often have a staffer fill it out, because they don't get to actually watch the games, plus the bias of humans tending to rate things the same outside of a loss, meaning it's hard to move up into the top if you don't start there unless everyone ahead of you loses no matter how well you play. So your odds of making the championship game are based on how you START the year, not how you actually play out the year.

Have verification of the computer data, and don't do a poll until the end of the season, and maybe you've got something. But the system right now is full of biases and problems.

I agree on the human poll part. I think that is a joke.

I believe that they found clerical errors but I guess why I claimed "no proof" was did these errors actually mess something up? Its possibly that after week 8 they may have had some errors but by the time the final results are completed you would think that they were all checked out.

I just dont like articles that are obviously bias. They only mention partial facts. Like in that article they mention a computer generated average score but they fail to mention the highest/lowest rankings are thrown out.

[molson]

In a 12 team, OK State could easily go out if you're using conference champs as autobids. 16 teams and they might still be in.

Wouldn't that be a wonderful playoff where OK State is out and Big East Champion Louisville plays for the championship.

In that scenario, it would be to the Big East's advantage to keep their core 5 and find the crappiest 3 teams possible to join them.

[DeToxRox]

Crazy wind in this SMU/Houston game.

[DeToxRox]

Yeah I butchered it, it's USM. I'm just used to watching SMU when its one because I love the June Jones offense. Same diff anyway, fuck 'em.

[DeToxRox]

So seeing as how it's likely neither Sumlin or Fedora will be back at their current schools next year, which one do you all think will be more successful at its next stop?

[JonInMiddleGA]

that invalidate the entire structure.

Except for the fact that it has regularly done a darned good job matching up the two best teams in the country, fulfilling it's mission quite well.

[jbergey22]

Unbelievable. I'll take people who know and understand math, who all point out that it's questionable at best that you can even put together a legitimate mathematical system for so many teams with such a small sample size, over "Jeff Sagarin is respected."


Because "anyone who understands math" realizes the sample size is much too small to get a great indicator of the results. They can mock the system all they want but what the hell are they going to do to create a larger data size? It is the best they can do under the situation they have.

Its not rocket science on why Bill James hates the BCS. He loves years of data to conclude his findings which is IMPOSSIBLE in a 11-12 game format.

[bronconick]

The obvious answer to keeping a Big East or Sun Belt champion out is to require the conference champion to be ranked in the top 10-20 in a 6-12 team system (adjust as necessary), or require a conference to have a rating over a certain amount to receive an autobid that season, while leaving their top teams eligible for at-large spots.

[Buccaneer]

Because "anyone who understands math" realizes the sample size is much too small to get a great indicator of the results. They can mock the system all they want but what the hell are they going to do to create a larger data size? It is the best they can do under the situation they have.

Its not rocket science on why Bill James hates the BCS. He loves years of data to conclude his findings which is IMPOSSIBLE in a 11-12 game format.

Esp. in a 11-12 game format where there are very little commonality compared to the NFL.

[DeToxRox]

This fucking game is going to end at like 4:30-5.

[JonInMiddleGA]

14-0 USM over Houston early Q2

[jbergey22]

14-0 USM over Houston early Q2

This wind is going to make it tough on Houston.

[jbergey22]

Esp. in a 11-12 game format where there are very little commonality compared to the NFL.

Yep.

Thats the thing. The FBS clearly has different conference tiers while the FCS has more balance so something that works well for the FCS isnt going to work exactly the same for the FBS.

I know people have different opinions on what the playoff should be but I have no desire to see LSU kick the crap out of Arkansas St in a playoff game. Of course if people are looking for teams that deserve the shot based on performance and eliminating computer/human biases a team like Arkansas State should be in for winning the Sun Belt.

This is the part I am confused about. Do people want the 8/16 best teams in the playoff or the teams that won the most games?

[cartman]

And just like that Houston ties the game up. Case Keenum started out 4 for 10, but has now hit 11 passes in a row.

[RomaGoth]

...but I have no desire to see LSU kick the crap out of Arkansas St in a playoff game.

But this is exactly what happens at least 2-4 times every season for most big-time programs during the regular season (beating a clearly inferior team by 50 points), and those results, whether we like it or not, play a big part in the rankings which ultimately decide who plays for the championship.

BCS proponents want to have the cake and eat it, which just isn't a viable option here. The BCS does nothing more than determine who wins the popularity contest each season out of the major programs. This may often include the best team or two in the country, but imo that is mostly just luck.

You can't have a legitimate championship system that is dependent upon people voting for the best teams, which the BCS system relies heavily upon, often by people with very limited knowledge of the teams they are voting for.

[Passacaglia]

Yep.

Thats the thing. The FBS clearly has different conference tiers while the FCS has more balance so something that works well for the FCS isnt going to work exactly the same for the FBS.

I know people have different opinions on what the playoff should be but I have no desire to see LSU kick the crap out of Arkansas St in a playoff game. Of course if people are looking for teams that deserve the shot based on performance and eliminating computer/human biases a team like Arkansas State should be in for winning the Sun Belt.

This is the part I am confused about. Do people want the 8/16 best teams in the playoff or the teams that won the most games?

People want the NFL, with college teams.

[Buccaneer]

Alabama is already getting another shot. In a playoff they would actually have to play their way into it.

Which leads to the best alternative: LSU goes to the Sugar Bowl and Alabama plays in the Cotton or the Orlando bowl game.

[RomaGoth]

People want the NFL, with college teams.

No, we just want a legitimate system, not this smoke and mirrors crap that is the BCS.

[RomaGoth]

TD USM....

[DeToxRox]

Huge answer by USM.

[Grover]

USM/Houston has been a very fun game to watch.

[Passacaglia]

No, we just want a legitimate system, not this smoke and mirrors crap that is the BCS.

What do you mean by a legitimate system?

[RomaGoth]

What do you mean by a legitimate system?

Any system that relies on human voting is clearly inferior. What other league, anywhere, does that?

[VPI97]

It's just as wrong to arbitrarily rule someone out of the championship as it is to rule them in. Alabama is likely a top 2 team this year. They have every reason to expect a chance at the national title. So do teams like Oklahoma St, VT, etc.

VT doesn't deserve a chance at the national title right now...we lost to Clemson.

[Passacaglia]

Any system that relies on human voting is clearly inferior. What other league, anywhere, does that?

You're off your rocker here. This means that you would prefer a BCS system that relies solely on computer rankings over the current BCS? You can't possibly believe that.

[Warhammer]

It's just as wrong to arbitrarily rule someone out of the championship as it is to rule them in. Alabama is likely a top 2 team this year. They have every reason to expect a chance at the national title. So do teams like Oklahoma St, VT, etc.

At least the old bowl system didn't pretend to make a real attempt at determining the champion. That would be preferable to the BCS. Either come up with a legitimate option for a champion or don't even pretend to be trying to find one.

+1

The thing I liked about the old bowl system was you knew what you had to do. If you were #1, win and you're pretty much assured the title. Unless the #2 team played #3 and absolutely blew them out. #3 could sneak in if things swung the right way, etc. That was fine, because then you had the body of work play into things. You have an undefeated team who played cupcakes shut out when an 11-1 team who played and beat 4 of the top 5 teams in the country and beat all but one win based upon their body of work.

The problem I have with the current system is that they still have the traditional bowl locations. LSU is going to have a freaking home field advantage in the title game. Same goes for USC/UCLA when the game is at the Rose Bowl. Play the game on a neutral field or somewhere that is not going to favor one conference champion over another.

Another issue is now, the majority of years there is dispute over who the second team is in the title game. How often have there been a clear cut #1 and #2. Additionally, for all those who claim the sanctity of the regular season, Alabama is a virtual shoo-in for the title game. What did the game against LSU mean for them, other than they don't have an additional tough game in the SEC title game? What happens if Alabama defeats LSU in the title game, what happens to the "importance of the regular season" then?

BCS proponents are speaking out of both sides of their mouth. With the playoff system take the conference winners. Have a random draw and random selection of where the games are played. If there are at-large teams (likely in a 16-team playoff), they play away games. Two things this accomplishes:

1) The importance of conference play is maximized. Win your conference and you are in. Conferences can still have title games. These still matter.
2) For the at-large teams, your body of work is still important. If you don't win your conference you are punished for it, but you are not completely out of the picture.

The other things I love about a playoff is you are not hosed due to an early season slip up. This will actually lead to better non-conference games that are used as a tune up to conference play. Texas and OSU do not need to worry about knocking each other out of the title hunt if they play in September like they do now. PSU and Alabama becomes a great tune up game to conference play. The winner of these games put themselves in great position for at-large births if they slip up during their conference schedule.

I've said it before, if we mess up the #15 or 16 team, I am much better with that then when we mess up who the #2 team is.

[jbergey22]

And OK St lost to Iowa St, Oklahoma lost to Texas Tech, Alabama lost to LSU, etc. Ranking one of those above the others continues to be arbitrary when there's nowhere near the necessary level of inter-conference play to determine the true difference between them. Gets back to the old eye test BS that has kept FBS college football in the dark ages.

What is your suggestion to fix the problem? Rather than disagree I want to hear what you propose.

[Warhammer]

You're off your rocker here. This means that you would prefer a BCS system that relies solely on computer rankings over the current BCS? You can't possibly believe that.

I actually prefer computers over flawed human voters. However, the computers need to be transparent. The formulas need to be known beforehand. The fact that computers cannot use margin of victory under the current system, yet human voters do is ludicrous and hamstrings the system.

[Warhammer]

What is your suggestion to fix the problem? Rather than disagree I want to hear what you propose.

Give teams incentives for playing tough non-conference foes.

[jbergey22]

+1


So are you in favor of the top 16 teams in the country based on computer rating and not giving auto bids to conference winners?

Just asking because I want to get a feel of what the playoff people are after.

[larrymcg421]

How much money does Southern Miss lose if they win this game?

[RomaGoth]

You're off your rocker here. This means that you would prefer a BCS system that relies solely on computer rankings over the current BCS? You can't possibly believe that.

A system that has nothing do with popularity would be an improvement over the sham that is the BCS. I will take my computer rankings over the good 'ol boy rankings any day of the week.

[Warhammer]

So are you in favor of the top 16 teams in the country based on computer rating and not giving auto bids to conference winners?

Just asking because I want to get a feel of what the playoff people are after.

Answered lower in my post. Take the conference winners, and then fill the remainder of the field with at-large teams.

[larrymcg421]

So are you in favor of the top 16 teams in the country based on computer rating and not giving auto bids to conference winners?

Just asking because I want to get a feel of what the playoff people are after.

Major conference champs get in. Computers determine which minor conference champs get in and which at-large teams get in.

[RomaGoth]

Answered lower in my post. Take the conference winners, and then fill the remainder of the field with at-large teams.

Major conference champs get in. Computers determine which minor conference champs get in and which at-large teams get in.

This.

[jbergey22]

Answered lower in my post. Take the conference winners, and then fill the remainder of the field with at-large teams.

Ok thanks, sorry I missed that part. I skim through a lot.

[DeToxRox]

Amazing.

[Logan]

Wow, what a block!

[Grover]

How much money does Southern Miss lose if they win this game?

I believe I heard CUSA would get something like $8m if Houston won and potentially got a BCS bowl.

edit: apparently $17m. Southern Miss would get around $3m

[RomaGoth]

Houston is in trouble.

[jbergey22]

Major conference champs get in. Computers determine which minor conference champs get in and which at-large teams get in.

Thanks.

This is all I was after. Atleast I am getting consistency from most in this thread.


The "computers suck we need a playoff" people I dont get because I cant figure out how they expect to find a decent playoff without the use of computers in some way.

[DeToxRox]

I really wanted to see Michigan/Houston in the Sugar Bowl, but that sure isn't looking likely now. If Michigan gets into the BCS it seems likely it'll be against TCU now.

[Young Drachma]

I've said it before, if we mess up the #15 or 16 team, I am much better with that then when we mess up who the #2 team is.

This.

[Young Drachma]

Well if this game doesn't send Sumlin packing for an upgrade job and a payday, nothing will.

[jbergey22]

Big play by Houston. Stupid throw by Davis.

[cartman]

Houston isn't done quite yet. Nearly a pick 6 for them.

[whomario]

Houston D comes right back with an Int of their own, Hayes finishes it and now only 21-28 :)

[molson]

I've said it before, if we mess up the #15 or 16 team, I am much better with that then when we mess up who the #2 team is.

I get that, but that 16/17 debate (ignoring conferences for a second) makes things even stranger and less desirable for me. Let's see, which team should have a chance at a championship, Baylor or Michigan? I can't get past my belief that the answer is "neither".

[jbergey22]

I dont get this "You have to play conventional talk" in this Houston/Sou Miss game. Its not the NFL.

Houston has a great shot of making the 4th and 1. Even if they punt S Miss has a great shot of scoring again.

If you are LSU/Alabama yes you punt but not when you have a great offense and crappy defense and are down 2 tds.

Maybe it works out and they get this fumble.

[DeToxRox]

I am not trying to say Michigan would destroy Houston, it would be a close game, but I could see UM running for 300 yards as a team, if not more.

[DeToxRox]

Well my post seems irrelevant now.

[Young Drachma]

Too much Call of Duty for Houston, it seems.

[Young Drachma]

Is that woman they keep showing Case Keenum's wife or something?

[jbergey22]

Playoff. Where have you been? That's the only chance to determine an actual champion.

You have always been the King of obvious havent ya. I am sure glad you have put a lot of thought into it.

Draw names out of a hat or what?

[Grover]

Is that woman they keep showing Case Keenum's wife or something?

Yep

[jbergey22]

Already said it several times in this thread.

Conference champs with a threshold of at least 8 FBS wins to get the autobid. Fill out the rest via computer or a selection committee like NCAA hoops does. That would keep someone like Louisville out if they won the Big East at 7-5.

Atleast you committed to something other than the 8 win threshold. I'll give you credit on that. Now we have something for when you complain that the committee/computer system sucks because 10-1 Tulane got left out of the playoff should it happen.

[Bigsmooth]

Yep

Yikes. Looks like he'll never make it in the NFL.

[jbergey22]

Any Mountain West fans out there? Did Nwoke for Col St get injured today?

[larrymcg421]

Um, if they don't go for it here, then Sumlin shouldn't get an offer from ANY team.

[Young Drachma]

Any Mountain West fans out there? Did Nwoke for Col St get injured today?

Yes, questionable to return to the game.

[Grover]

I am willing to console some of those distraught Houston cheerleaders.

[jbergey22]

Yes, questionable to return to the game.

Thank you.

I have him in one of my college fant teams today. Bad sign if he doesnt come back.

[cuervo72]

Thats the thing. The FBS clearly has different conference tiers while the FCS has more balance so something that works well for the FCS isnt going to work exactly the same for the FBS.

There are too many teams classified as FBS that shouldn't be.

And really, it's 8 or 9 games. Those OOC games (except for the occasional LSU/Oregon, etc) are really just the equivalent of NFL preseason games. The schools get money for putting on games, but the outcomes really don't mean anything.

[kingfc22]

Here's to hoping that Georgia wins to end this BCS charade that "every game matters".

[SirFozzie]

And Southern Miss officially costs CUSA schools $17 million.

[cuervo72]

And Southern Miss officially costs CUSA schools $17 million.

Although they may have done Houston a favor if tales like UCONN losing a couple mill are to be believed.

[mauchow]

Okay, here we go. GO GEORGIA!

[whomario]

successfull onside kick by Georgia, awesome :popcorn:

also TCU has 35 points on 190 offensive yards

[kingfc22]

Catch the damn ball!

[whomario]

brutal drop by the WR :banghead: They should be up 14-0 right now instead of 3-0

Murray is really fun to watch.

[JonInMiddleGA]

#2 Georgia Southern wins 55-48 over ODU to be the 1st team into round 3 of the FCS playoffs. They'll host the winner of Maine and App. St. next week. Currently Maine is ahead 27-12 early in the 4th quarter.

I was just looking at that boxscore. Just short of 1200 yards total offense between GSU & ODU.

[Swaggs]

Unless Cincy somehow gets a ton of extra votes for beating UConn and can pass us up, WVU should be locked into a BCS spot now. Hoping for Orange against Virginia Tech, but Sugar vs Michigan would be fun (and probably make for entertaining television with probably 120 points scored), too.

[Tigercat]

brutal drop by the WR :banghead: They should be up 14-0 right now instead of 3-0

Umm, only if that WR in the end zone was calvin johnson-esque, capable of the pushoff and going high for the TD catch.

If Georgia plays well in this game for four quarters, my hat is off to them, because they are being coached like they can't stay with LSU, and teams coached like that usually don't win games.

Boykin looking really good out there today for UGA. Single handedly making sure LSU has their two three and outs.

[larrymcg421]

The brutal drop was on the 2nd possession, not on the first.

[Tigercat]

The brutal drop was on the 2nd possession, not on the first.

Yea, just don't agree that by any stretch it "should be" 14-0. 10-0 maybe, UGA was lucky not to get offensive pass interference in the end zone on their first drive. Definitely a case of the dropsies for UGA right now though.

[Swaggs]

So, with Houston out of the picture, is Boise guaranteed a BCS game or are they out because TCU won the conference? Could TCU sneak in?

[Tigercat]

And today we are seeing nervous-Jefferson, where he airballs almost everything. (As oppossed to nervous-Lee, where he forgets the color of his team's jersey.)

[Julio Riddols]

I would love to see a Georgia win big and throw a giant monkey wrench into the BCS.

[spleen1015]

I would love to see a Georgia win big and throw a giant monkey wrench into the BCS.

+1

[panerd]

Depends on what the voters who didn't watch the games, and computers that are completely unchecked, decide.

The real fun begins if UGA figures out a way to win today.

Can't wait until they implement your playoff system whose teams are decided and seeded by something other than voters and/or computers.

[k0ruptr]

I'd like to see Boise sneak into a BCS game

[Julio Riddols]

That LSU punter is a beast.

[larrymcg421]

So, with Houston out of the picture, is Boise guaranteed a BCS game or are they out because TCU won the conference? Could TCU sneak in?

The rule for non-BCS teams is only in effect if they win their conference. TCU will go to a BCS game as long as they stay ahead of West Virginia and Southern Miss in the BCS rankings.

[TroyF]

And today we are seeing nervous-Jefferson, where he airballs almost everything. (As oppossed to nervous-Lee, where he forgets the color of his team's jersey.)

Are we watching the same game?

Yes, Georgia has been aggressive with their play calling and the onside kick, but this should be 17-0 right now. I'm thinking the onside kick was more of an F U to the LSU offense than it was to "oh crap, we can't win the football game"

LSU may come back and destroy Georgia the rest of the way, but thus far I don't see anything but a confident football team dominating the favorites.

[Young Drachma]

Wyoming knocks off CSU 22-19 to claim the Bronze Boot on the road in Ft. Collins and an 8-win season. Not bad for the team picked to finish 2nd to last in the MWC.

Boot stays in Laramie for the 3rd straight year.

[Tigercat]

Are we watching the same game?


We aren't considering my post about UGA coaching like they can't stay with LSU was midway through the first quarter. :p UGA was throwing out the gimmicks in the first couple of drives. Since then UGA is building on the momentum by beating LSU at the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball.

[B & B]

IM SO EXCITED TO SEE UGA PLAY BAMA FOR THE CHAMPIONSHIP


OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHYEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAHHHHH

[kingfc22]

Honey Badger is making more and more $$$$$ each week.

[mauchow]

IM SO EXCITED TO SEE UGA PLAY BAMA FOR THE CHAMPIONSHIP


OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHYEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAHHHHH

Is this sarcasm? There is zero chance of that happening in any scenario.

[whomario]

That LSU punter is a beast.

i just googled him and according to an article from Nov 18th plus the box scores after that LSUs opponents have 6 yards on Punt Returns all season. Not per game but total :eek:

[Ben E Lou]

http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/390397_2400665252386_1123680038_32254018_1128231276_n.jpg
My two-year-old is watching the game with me and is hunkering down in a stance before every play. And when the ball is snapped, she fires off and yells "IT'S TIME TO RUN!!!!!!"

Even if LSU wins 45-10, this will still be the most entertainment I've ever gotten out of a televised sporting event. :D

[Tigercat]

Sooner or later LSU needs to go with pass first. If they don't believe that is Jefferson's offense, they need to sink or swim with Lee. UGA is a very good run D, and they are keying in on it.

[cschex]

http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/390397_2400665252386_1123680038_32254018_1128231276_n.jpg
My two-year-old is watching the game with me and is hunkering down in a stance before every play. And when the ball is snapped, she fires off and yells "IT'S TIME TO RUN!!!!!!"

Even if LSU wins 45-10, this will still be the most entertainment I've ever gotten out of a televised sporting event. :D


At least she's wearing the right colors ;)

[Tigercat]

How can it be so difficult for players to go into the end zone with the football and then give it to the ref? Why is that challenging for these some of these idiots?

Honey Badger is usually a very aware player, so I will assume this is a one time brain fart. Still, yes, make sure you are well into the end zone, why the hell not? Still can't believe that Desean Jackson has done it three times in front of the cameras.

[TroyF]

SEC replay refs trying to ensure LSU gets a W. The punt return shouldn't have been a TD and should have been Georgia ball 1st and 10 at the 20 after the ball goes out of bound out of the end zone. Good job fellas. Make sure you keep your cash.

[whomario]

What an awesome punt under pressure by Wing :) Both punters have been stellar.

Have a hard time seeing Georgia winning it though, would have to be up by more points i´m afraid, can´t see LSU playing as poor in the 2nd half.

[Tigercat]

SEC replay refs trying to ensure LSU gets a W. The punt return shouldn't have been a TD and should have been Georgia ball 1st and 10 at the 20 after the ball goes out of bound out of the end zone. Good job fellas. Make sure you keep your cash.

Eh? Do you think that in every instance of a TD every camera view is instantaneously fed to the booth and they look through all of them even when there isn't an obvious question? No one questioned the return at the time. If basically no one else notices how close that type of thing is, the ref booths won't notice how close it is either to review it.

Now if you want to question some no calls on questionable blocks around the shoulders on that return, that would at least make sense.

[Tigercat]

Ha! "Dr. Pepper is seriously the best thing to ever happen to me!" Best result/reaction ever for a sports contest sponsor?

[sterlingice]

Here's to hoping that Georgia wins to end this BCS charade that "every game matters".

But we've already had it. Multiple times. And it doesn't matter. The chaos is fun but the charade will continue.

2001 and 2006 each had 2x 1 loss teams playing an undefeated team: Nebraska/Oregon and Florida/Michigan
2003 was a mess to the point where there was a split champion and they changed the system
2005 had 3 undefeated teams at 1-3 (USC, Oklahoma, Auburn) and also 11-0 Utah and there's no champion for that year because USC had to vacate
2007 has 1-loss #1 Ohio State playing #2 2-loss LSU; #3-#5 all had 2 losses
2008 had 5 1-loss teams thrown into a hat and drawn at random
2009 was the opposite with 5 undefeated teams: Alabama, Texas, Cincinnati, TCU, and Boise State

If LSU loses tonight, it will be most like 2008. And you know on Monday, there will be Jim Rome or whatever other little tools are out talking about the BCS and how every game matters and how if Oklahoma State/Stanford/Virginia Tech, wanted to be in the title game, they shouldn't have lost. Of course, neglecting the fact that the rule doesn't apply to Alabama or LSU (if they lose tonight).

SI

[TroyF]

Eh? Do you think that in every instance of a TD every camera view is instantaneously fed to the booth and they look through all of them even when there isn't an obvious question? No one questioned the return at the time. If basically no one else notices how close that type of thing is, the ref booths won't notice how close it is either to review it.

Now if you want to question some no calls on questionable blocks around the shoulders on that return, that would at least make sense.

Those were blatantly obvious, I didn't figure I needed to comment on them because of how ridiculous the return was to begin with.

I thought it was obviously close from the start and have no idea how they didn't double or triple check all replays before they kicked the point after. Then again, I know why they didn't. It's the SEC afterall. :)

[Tigercat]

I thought it was obviously close from the start

Then you were one of the 1% (one of which probably informed CBS about it, NONE of their camera guys or directors saw it, thus they took half an hour to show it.) The announcers and the internet were quiet about it until they got word and showed it.

I could try unsuccessfully to speed bump any more of your rants, but forget it, you're rolling! :popcorn:

[BillJasper]

Matt Millen is terrible. That is all.

[johnnyshaka]

RG3 is pretty good. That is all.

[Grover]

Mathieu is some kind of awesome.

[TroyF]

Then you were one of the 1% (one of which probably informed CBS about it, NONE of their camera guys or directors saw it, thus they took half an hour to show it.) The announcers and the internet were quiet about it until they got word and showed it.

I could try unsuccessfully to speed bump any more of your rants, but forget it, you're rolling! :popcorn:

I'm rolling? Because replay booths officials who have nothing else to do in the game other than look at plays like that can't get it right? Then I watch LSU smack Murray upside the face after a throw and a ref whose sole job it is to look for things like that doesn't see that either? I should have known this would be a damned joke and it is. (by the way, how is it that the ref right on the goal line misses the call? Why does it ever go to the replay booth. it was a half yard for God sakes)

Tyrann Mathieu is the single best player I've seen in college football this year and it really isn't close. LSU isn't in the title game. If he's not in the final five for the Heisman, something is wrong. Then again, something is clearly wrong with division one college football.

SEC has assured itself of getting exactly what it wants. (Nice to see they got the facemask right. Important to protect the running back and not a QB, right?) I know, I'm making an idiot of myself, the SEC officiating crew isn't.

[Tigercat]

If LSU had a QB that could be a consistent threat, this might be one of the best college teams of all time. The special teams + defense is amazing. (And every position but QB on offense is very good.) Even with survival tonight, QB play needs to improve. As it is, it will difficult winning the BCS championship game with the level of QB play LSU has had tonight.

[Tigercat]

Well, on the goal line official, Mathieu and everyone watching the play saw the ref hoist his arms before the flip. I think that is what caused the flip and why consciously and subconsciously pretty much no one thought to take a closer look. The ref was the one who really lost the place of the field and set everything into motion.

[cuervo72]

SEC has assured itself of getting exactly what it wants.

Isn't this the case fairly often in most conferences though? At some point in the season the possible BCS teams are identified, and then seem to get the calls in close games afterwards.


(Sak to come in to defend ref integrity in 3, 2, 1...)

edit: what is the reasoning behind the conferences maintaining their own crews, anyway? Why isn't this an NCAA thing?

[TroyF]

If LSU had a QB that could be a consistent threat, this might be one of the best college teams of all time. The special teams + defense is amazing. (And every position but QB on offense is very good.) Even with survival tonight, QB play needs to improve. As it is, it will difficult winning the BCS championship game with the level of QB play LSU has had tonight.

I think they've been playing the wrong QB the last month. Lee is the better thrower and doesn't take sacks. (Jefferson has taken double the number of sacks in 1/3 of the pass attempts)

The only thing that can hurt LSU is negaive plays by the offense. Jefferson makes more of those than Lee does IMO

[TroyF]

Isn't this the case fairly often in most conferences though? At some point in the season the possible BCS teams are identified, and then seem to get the calls in close games afterwards.


(Sak to come in to defend ref integrity in 3, 2, 1...)

Look, when you start missing shots to the face on the QB, you start to go off the deep end. They missed multiple "tackles" on the first punt return. Then they missed a sure fire hit to the head on a QB? I mean, how can you logically miss that? Your job is to look for that sort of thing.

[TroyF]

Well, on the goal line official, Mathieu and everyone watching the play saw the ref hoist his arms before the flip. I think that is what caused the flip and why consciously and subconsciously pretty much no one thought to take a closer look. The ref was the one who really lost the place of the field and set everything into motion.

That's an explanation I can live with. I still (and will never) understand why the replay officials didn't look at the call, but that at least makes sense. Still and incredibly idiotic play by a smart player.

[MizzouRah]

RG3 is pretty good. That is all.

He should get the heisman.. damn he is fun to watch. Maybe I'm way off base, but I think he's the best QB in the next draft. (assuming he's coming out)

[Julio Riddols]

I'll echo a previous statement.. If LSU had an offense to match their defense, they would be an amazing team and I would really enjoy watching them. As it is, I think we're destined to see another 6-3 type game in the national championship.. The only thing that might change that is the month plus layoff in between games, which is another thing I hate about the bowl system.

[Tigercat]

As it is, I think we're destined to see another 6-3 type game in the national championship..

Perhaps, but JJ and McCarron have the ability to drive the ball against even good defenses when they are on. LSU and Bama both have NFL players scattered throughout their offenses. If both QBs have a good game (which may be a big if) it could be a really good game on both sides of the ball. Still low scoring probably, 20-17 or so.

But, yea, I wouldn't bet on it unfortunately.

[Matthean]

I think they've been playing the wrong QB the last month. Lee is the better thrower and doesn't take sacks. (Jefferson has taken double the number of sacks in 1/3 of the pass attempts)

The only thing that can hurt LSU is negaive plays by the offense. Jefferson makes more of those than Lee does IMO

He's also a much better match up against 'Bama than Lee is.

[sterlingice]

If it's just going to be against Alabama, can we just forego the National Championship game and give LSU the title?

If not, this will be a replay of that thread about soccer a couple of weeks ago where football fans were bitching about arbitrary things like aggregate goals in low scoring games deciding titles.

SI

[Matthean]

If it's just going to be Alabama, can we just forego the National Championship game and give LSU the title?

If not, this will be a replay of that thread about soccer a couple of weeks ago where football fans were bitching about arbitrary things like aggregate goals in low scoring games deciding titles.

SI

It's not like 'Bama was beaten soundly. An OT game with four missed field goals makes me think 'Bama has a shot.

[Tigercat]

I'm surprised so many people are writing off Oklahoma State. They win by 14, or even better 20+ tonight, is it that sure of a thing that Bama maintains #2? I wonder.

[sterlingice]

It's not like 'Bama was beaten soundly. An OT game with four missed field goals makes me think 'Bama has a shot.

But that's my point- they were already beaten so why do we get to suffer through it again? Even better will be if Alabama wins 10-7. That way, LSU won 6-3 and Alabama won 10-7, so both teams scored 13 in 2 games and the arbitrary determiner of who is better will be the one that won it a few weeks later on the calendar

SI

[JonInMiddleGA]

is it that sure of a thing that Bama maintains #2? I wonder.

Book it.

[Matthean]

But that's my point- they were already beaten so why do we get to suffer through it again? Even better will be if Alabama wins 10-7. That way, LSU won 6-3 and Alabama won 10-7, so both teams scored 13 in 2 games and the arbitrary determiner of who is better will be the one that won it a few weeks later on the calendar

SI

Why did we need to have the Super Bowl with the Giants and the Pats? The Pats beat them in week 17 while on the road.

[Atocep]

Unless Cincy somehow gets a ton of extra votes for beating UConn and can pass us up, WVU should be locked into a BCS spot now. Hoping for Orange against Virginia Tech, but Sugar vs Michigan would be fun (and probably make for entertaining television with probably 120 points scored), too.

It sounds like Houston's loss probably pushed us to the Orange.

[Scarecrow]

If it's just going to be against Alabama, can we just forego the National Championship game and give LSU the title?


Did you not just hear the CBS announcers (glad they're not too bias); They said that even if Bama beats LSU in the Championship game (they announced that it was impossible for OSU to reach #2), LSU should be co-champions.

[BillJasper]

I don't know who #18 is for Georgia is, but he wants no part of the LSU running backs. Seen him continue to backpedal several times instead of trying to come up and make a tackle.

[sterlingice]

Why did we need to have the Super Bowl with the Giants and the Pats? The Pats beat them in week 17 while on the road.

Yes, because a system based on a larger regular season with a playoff and one where it's a beauty pageant to enter a winner-take-all game is equivalent

SI

[JonInMiddleGA]

I don't know who #18 is for Georgia is, but he wants no part of the LSU running backs. Seen him continue to backpedal several times instead of trying to come up and make a tackle.

Baccari Rambo, one of the more prolific trash talkers at UGAg.

[SFL Cat]

I'm a SEC guy, but I can't really say I'm jazzed about an Alabama-LSU national championship game.

[Tigercat]

I was hoping to take my dad to the BCSCG for his 65th birthday coming up. Neither of us have been to a LSU bowl game before... Unfortunately, the consensus is that tickets won't dip below 1.2k a piece anywhere, anyhow if Bama is involved, and that is a bit too rich for me. OSU might be/have been a different story. So, yea, not really jazzed about it either from a personal standpoint.

[cuervo72]

where it's a beauty pageant

The subjectivity is definitely part of the beef. "Sports" like figure skating, gymnastics, diving, freestyle skiing...these are sometimes criticized because they involve a judging element, which introduces the opportunity for bias - the ol' Russian judge (or at least *I* criticize them, as I believe sports should be decided by measurables such as points, weights, times, distances). While games are decided on the field, there is still the judgement element of the polls.

[MJ4H]

bias
biased

choose wisely

[SFL Cat]

Playoffs...nuff said. Sometimes it's fun beating a dead horse...

[Tigercat]

Come on, Okie St, win 63-3!

[k0ruptr]

BYU 7-6 over Hawaii midddle 2nd quarter.. A Hawaii win puts them in the Hawaii Bowl. A loss hopefully means a new coach.

[JPhillips]

bias
biased

choose wisely

I choosed poorly.

[mauchow]

Montee Ball with his second TD of the game already - over 100 yards rushing. In the 1st quarter. And 32 yards passing. LOL

[mauchow]

We've got a shootout in Indianapolis. Whoever makes fewer mistakes will win this one. With a lost fumble for MSU already - the Badgers hold that edge. 21-14 at the start of the 2nd quarter.

[lungs]

Come on Bucky!

[spleen1015]

Nice play. I'm surprised we don't see that more often

[M GO BLUE!!!]

THAT WAS NIIIIIIIIICE!

Good job, Sparty!

[JPhillips]

I don't think I've ever seen that on a conversion.

[Eaglesfan27]

For all of the arguments that playoffs would make the regular season meaningless, I find myself failing to get hooked in by any of the games this weekend when it seems inevitable that LSU will face Alabama despite what happens today. I hope Oklahoma State somehow sneaks in, but it seems unlikely even with a solid showing tonight...

[mauchow]

What happened to the play calling? Paul Chryst sometimes has no brain whatsoever. We run the ball with authority in first three drives and then turn focus to pass game and go three and out twice in a row. Hmmm

Need a stop on defense now.

[mauchow]

And Johnson makes up for his miscue on the 4th and 1. Attababy. Nice pick, kid.

[SFL Cat]

What makes it worse, if Alabama beats LSU in the rematch, you know LSU fans will be screaming about how unfair it is for the Tide to be the national champions when the teams have essentially split their meetings during the season.

[mauchow]

Not sure what Chryst continues to do - passing on first down. Unreal. If you're going to pass at least do play action and sell it good - Christ, Chryst.

[Tigercat]

Yes! Keep it up Pokes! Let's have a real good time, let's have a real good time! (Damn you and your hypnotism Pitbull!)

[JonInMiddleGA]

What makes it worse, if Alabama beats LSU in the rematch, you know LSU fans will be screaming about how unfair it is for the Tide to be the national champions when the teams have essentially split their meetings during the season.

If it's a 3 point 'Bama win, much as I dislike LSU, I'd agree they have a point.

I don't think it'll be that close.

[MJ4H]

What makes it worse, if Alabama beats LSU in the rematch, you know LSU fans will be screaming about how unfair it is for the Tide to be the national champions when the teams have essentially split their meetings during the season.

I absolutely despise that type of thinking. The BCS championship game is the championship game. The winner is the champion. Everyone knew this well before the season started. Playing these silly mind games is just ridiculous.

[Julio Riddols]

This Wisconsin/Michigan State game has been a blast to watch.

[mauchow]

Boy, oh, boy I knew the Badgers defense was not good but didn't figure them to get beat up this badly all day long. Aye, aye, aye. Need to answer back with a score of our own, even if its just a field goal. Way too reminiscent of the first game against MSU.

[rowech]

I absolutely despise that type of thinking. The BCS championship game is the championship game. The winner is the champion. Everyone knew this well before the season started. Playing these silly mind games is just ridiculous.

I love how precedent was set that no rematch would be allowed and Florida beat OSU in the title game to prevent a rematch. Wish the same thing would happen here assuming this scoreline holds up. It'll be shame if Oklahoma State doesn't give a shot and a team LSU already beat gets the chance instead.

I still continue to be baffled how this is fair to LSU to have to beat Bama again, after they beat them on the road, and if they don't then it was all for not.

College football...where every game counts...except the ones that don't.

[MJ4H]

I don't think that just because something happens doesn't mean it is precedence for it to always happen.

[rowech]

I don't think that just because something happens doesn't mean it is precedence for it to always happen.

I'm not sure how that case is any different than what we see here. The #1 team beat the #2 team by a field goal the last game of the season. They gave a one loss Florida team a title shot instead of having a rematch. It's almost identical save that game happened the last week of the B10 season.

[Eaglesfan27]

I love how precedent was set that no rematch would be allowed and Florida beat OSU in the title game to prevent a rematch. Wish the same thing would happen here assuming this scoreline holds up. It'll be shame if Oklahoma State doesn't give a shot and a team LSU already beat gets the chance instead.

I still continue to be baffled how this is fair to LSU to have to beat Bama again, after they beat them on the road, and if they don't then it was all for not.

College football...where every game counts...except the ones that don't.

Agreed. It feels very contrived, particularly when many of the BCS computer polls use unclear criteria.

[Tigercat]

If most voters don't vote OSU #2 after a 10+ win tonight, blame the voters. I can't speak for the computers, they do their own thing. But, subjectively as humans, IF OSU wins big tonight, isn't it a easier subjective case to make that OSU has had a better season?

And I don't think it will be SEC bias that would win the day if they don't move OSU up, I think it would be general stubbornness.

[mauchow]

Okay. This is nuts. First matchup against MSU. Badgers off to a 14 point lead after first quarter. MSU scores 23 in the second while shutting down Wisconsin.

Game two, Badgers up 21-7, 14 points, after one... and what does MSU do for the second quarter? Outscore WIsconsin 22-0.

THat second quarter is all on the OC though - not running the Ball with your Heisman Horse. I gotta believe there is a reason for it - injury perhaps. There can't be another logical reason.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I still continue to be baffled how this is fair to LSU to have to beat Bama again, after they beat them on the road, and if they don't then it was all for not.

It's "fair" in the sense that there's a contractual obligation to put two teams in that particular game. There's really no rational choice other than it to be Alabama.

Sucks for LSU, I'll acknowledge that. Then again, that win also assured LSU of a chance to play for the title regardless of what they did today ... although that may have done them no favors for the first quarter this afternoon

[JonInMiddleGA]

And I don't think it will be SEC bias that would win the day if they don't move OSU up, I think it would be general stubbornness.

More like reasonable football sense. Want a shot at getting your ass handed to you by LSU? Then don't lay such a gigantic egg against a mediocre team like OkState did, simple as that.

[MJ4H]

I'm not sure how that case is any different than what we see here. The #1 team beat the #2 team by a field goal the last game of the season. They gave a one loss Florida team a title shot instead of having a rematch. It's almost identical save that game happened the last week of the B10 season.

The biggest difference between the two situations is the one you mentioned: time. When Bama lost, they indeed dropped out of the top 2 of the BCS. The difference is they had time for circumstances to allow them to climb back.

In other words, the actual precedence was that the losing team drops. That happened both times.

[rowech]

More like reasonable football sense. Want a shot at getting your ass handed to you by LSU? Then don't lay such a gigantic egg against a mediocre team like OkState did, simple as that.

Truth is, the way I see it, despite losing to a lesser team, they lost on the road, in OT, on a day they had to deal with a plane crash for the second time to their university.

[MJ4H]

I'm not saying it's not stupid. The whole system is stupid. I'm just telling you that the two situations are not identical, and the difference is the exact reason one team is getting a rematch and the other isn't.

[SackAttack]

College football is a fucking joke.

Yes. Correct.

[Tigercat]

More like reasonable football sense. Want a shot at getting your ass handed to you by LSU? Then don't lay such a gigantic egg against a mediocre team like OkState did, simple as that.

If OSU has the best season, they earned that right. I never understand why there is an instinct to go by best team when teams have equal win/loss, nevermind that all wins and losses aren't created equal.

Because if we start going by best team over best season, why even go by win/losses at all? Lets just put in the two teams with the most NFL talent. This system is supposed to award best season, we know this. But somehow, through all these debates, EVERYONE and their mothers seem to forget this and start debating "best team."

[SFL Cat]

MJ4H...I agree. LSU is the undisputed SEC champ. But Alabama is #2 and even if OSU holds on to beat OU tonight (starting to look like a lock) I don't see how they move past Alabama in the polls (or the BSC computer BS). So it's going to be LSU and Alabama for the championship. If LSU takes care of business, no problem...but if the Tide rolls, they win the championship (or at the very least a tie for the title with LSU) despite getting beaten by LSU during the season and NOT participating in the SEC championship game.

[mckerney]

THat second quarter is all on the OC though - not running the Ball with your Heisman Horse. I gotta believe there is a reason for it - injury perhaps. There can't be another logical reason.

Probably don't want to tire Ball out in the first half and they don't have another back they trust against a team like MSU.

[Tigercat]

Truth is, the way I see it, despite losing to a lesser team, they lost on the road, in OT, on a day they had to deal with a plane crash for the second time to their university.

That's why, if they win big tonight, I would give them a slight edge. Bama didn't defend their home in conference, OSU lost away from home. Add back extra subjective points for circumstances surrounding that away loss and add minor points for winning a non championship game conference title, and to me OSU has the better season.

[MJ4H]

If OSU has the best season, they earned that right. I never understand why there is an instinct to go by best team when teams have equal win/loss, nevermind that all wins and losses aren't created equal.

Because if we start going by best team over best season, why even go by win/losses at all? Lets just put in the two teams with the most NFL talent. This system is supposed to award best season, we know this. But somehow, through all these debates, EVERYONE and their mothers seem to forget this and start debating "best team."

+1 billion. My biggest pet peeve is that the "polls" don't even have a clearly defined question.

[mauchow]

Well, I'm officially on board with OSU getting the nod over Bama. Why not.

[JonInMiddleGA]

That's why, if they win big tonight, I would give them a slight edge. Bama didn't defend their home in conference, OSU lost away from home. Add back extra subjective points for circumstances surrounding that away loss and add minor points for winning a non championship game conference title, and to me OSU has the better season.

The "circumstances" surrounding that loss is a nice story, but it's pure fiction in terms of the impact on that loss. If you can find me 10 kids on a football team outside of Knoxville & Storrs who can name their women's basketball coach I'll eat my hat.

If losing to Iowa State > losing to LSU then I don't know what I can tell you, maybe this just isn't the game for you. And that's before we even get to "better season" versus "better team". Both are factors in the equation, always have been.

[SFL Cat]

What has Alabama done to deserve losing the #2 slot?

[JonInMiddleGA]

What has Alabama done to deserve losing the #2 slot?

Be in the SEC at the same time the #1 team in the country is also in the SEC apparently.

[DeToxRox]

The Bama fans on here (fan? Matthean) are cool but I would love to see an epic meltdown by a fan base and Bama fans have the ability to make it the best ever if OSU jumped them.

[TroyF]

The "circumstances" surrounding that loss is a nice story, but it's pure fiction in terms of the impact on that loss. If you can find me 10 kids on a football team outside of Knoxville & Storrs who can name their women's basketball coach I'll eat my hat.

If losing to Iowa State > losing to LSU then I don't know what I can tell you, maybe this just isn't the game for you. And that's before we even get to "better season" versus "better team". Both are factors in the equation, always have been.

Jon,

I'm not going to get into a gigantic debate on this, but I'll just say they shouldn't have played the game. Living in Stillwater and knowing the culture, especially after the previous crash, that took A LOT out of the entire OSU program. If you watched the game, you could see OSU wasn't there mentally. Even when they were up big in the 3rd, they were not sharp and were not themselves.

You want to make the case Bama deserves to beat LSU after losing to them on their home field once? Fine. I can understand it. If you want to pretend that the plane crash didn't have a huge effect on the outcome at Iowa State a couple of Friday's ago, you'll be wrong. I'll leave it at that.

[JonInMiddleGA]

In the old system, they would have had a tie. Bama wouldn't. Who would have finished 2nd? OT loss is better than regulation loss -- no matter who it's against and especially if on the road and other team's is at home.

Again, complete bullshit.

A regulation loss to LSU is a hell of a lot better than losing to 90% of the teams in 2011 in a bazillion overtimes on a blown call made by officials that were alumni of the winning team & related to the winner's head coach. And I absolutely despise LSU (UGAg is pretty much the only team I can pull for LSU over) and ain't real fond of roughly half the SEC, but that's the way it is.

"Everything that is right" must not include watching the teams play. I'm honestly beyond bewildered that anyone believes there's a team in the country other than Alabama that would stay within two TD's of LSU at this point. Beating up Oklahoma is nice & all, but it's not as impressive as even being competitive against LSU. The gap between the two opponents is simply too big for the comparison to be meaningful.

[JPhillips]

I don't think you should get to the championship without at least playing in your conference championship game. Yeah that might not be fair in a year like 2011.

Life's hard and then you die.

[JonInMiddleGA]

If you want to pretend that the plane crash didn't have a huge effect on the outcome at Iowa State a couple of Friday's ago, you'll be wrong. I'll leave it at that.

We'll just agree to disagree, very strongly. {shrug}

[sterlingice]

Also, we can ignore Stanford, too, btw, because, again, all losses- even to good teams- eliminate teams from the national title hunt. Unless it's to LSU.

SI

[bronconick]

Also, we can ignore Stanford, too, btw, because, again, all losses- even to good teams- eliminate teams from the national title hunt. Unless it's to LSU.

SI


Every game matters! The whole season is a playoff!

(Except for the game hyped as the "Game of the century". The irony is palpable)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Also, we can ignore Stanford, too, btw, because, again, all losses- even to good teams- eliminate teams from the national title hunt. Unless it's to LSU.

Anybody that saw Stanford's loss should understand completely why they aren't in the conversation at all.

It's also why Luck doesn't belong in a serious Heisman conversation either.