Will There Ever Be Another FOF?

[Kodos]

Well?

[tald]

Let's hope so!!

[Icy]

Hope i'm wrong, but i see the whole text sims scene slowly dying against console games, besides some hardcore players like FOFCers and of course all the FM horde that is the exception.

Lately I find myself playing more sport games in my PS3 than PC text sims, as my playing time is more limited so i look for a more casual approach, even when it frustrates me a lot to see how simple and half done are most of sport console games franchise modes. Again FM is the exception and the only text sim i play at least once per week.

It has forced most of the text sims developers that we love to take a another job, limiting their free time to code new games (and i'm not talking about Jim here as i know little about his personal life).

On the other hand, i think that text sims could do very well on smartphones and tables.

[tald]

Hope your wrong....but what you write is true. FOF football for me has been on of the greatest games. I would pay twice the price to have a new one. I guess we can only hope that Jim sees all that is written and the loyalty people have to FOF.

[Yoda]

I believe there will be. I seem to remember Jim saying something like he wanted to put out a new version last year, but ran out of time. In light of that, I feel there will be at least 1 more.

[Steel]

I believe there will be. I seem to remember Jim saying something like he wanted to put out a new version last year, but ran out of time. In light of that, I feel there will be at least 1 more.

He said that back in '09. Even with the new patches, the game is still out of date. Some penalties for example, and end of half logic, as well as overtime logic is still screwy.

[strickzilla]

On the other hand, i think that text sims could do very well on smartphones and tablets. :+1:


this is an intresting idea! if jim is listening an android/ios "bridge" version of the game would do well, where i can set my roster watch solevision and maybe gameplan too. but still be able to do stuff like Grep from home and intergrate the home/mobile. i catch the bus to work so if i could watch solevision on the bus instead of have to wait to i get home it would enrich my experiance.

[Dutch]

The other night I had a dream that TCY2 was released...but it was called FOF 8.0.

[Tempest56]

I expect if another one is going to be released, it won't be until after the current labor dispute is settled. That's going to change a lot of how the league works, and the next FOF will need to account for all of that.

[Marc Vaughan]

Hope i'm wrong, but i see the whole text sims scene slowly dying against console games, besides some hardcore players like FOFCers and of course all the FM horde that is the exception.
I disagree hugely with this - if you look at the text sim scene its taken some 'hits' on the commercial front and there are less sims in retail now (in Europe) than there were 10 years ago, thats mainly because of the increased cost and risk in game development these days.

However that being said there's a huge market there - not just for FM PC, but FMH on PSP and iOS devices has done very well also .. and its not just FM, if you look at OOTP thats making a nice niche for itself and with the recently released iPhone version of that game its attracting a far more 'casual' customer than ever before and expanding its user base considerably.

[TheFoosballWizard]

I dunno, I played console games and when I found text simulators on PC I thought to myself "Ah! This is what I've been looking for!"

[StLee]

I dunno, I played console games and when I found text simulators on PC I thought to myself "Ah! This is what I've been looking for!"

I agree 100% with this statement. I play console football and baseball games, but I never feel the immersion I do with a text sim where I like to develop histories and legacies. I'm glad there are always newer baseball sims available. I just wish the same would apply for football sims.

WANT MORE FOFC + TCY!!!!

[Johninja]

Yep i do think there will be. Would be awesome if it was picked up by someone like sports interactive, Jim has said he is open to it and i have tried to do my bit on the FM forums. An NFL+College game would be sweet. The interface realy needs some cleaning up.

[Izulde]

...The last time SI took over a franchise, it killed any long-term interest in the series for me. I never went back.

[Gallifrey]

The other night I had a dream that TCY2 was released...but it was called FOF 8.0.

I am having that same dream right now...

[ShaneTheMaster]

The question should read will there ever be ANY viable football game made for the PC again? (Which still boggles my mind why there isn't one)

[BYU 14]

I am having that same dream right now...

I dream of TCY2 frequently :)

[spleen1015]

I don't have my hopes up that there will be another FOF or TCY. I think Jim has moved on to something else, maybe even gone back to corporate America.

[jwarner]

I think Pro Football Simulator will eventually grow into the market leader. It's pretty basic right now, but the creator is dedicated to improving the game in the long run. He envisions an OOTP-like development span.

[sidthelid]

I think the game has become pretty stale and i am hearing that more and more now. But we keep playing it!

[NawlinsFan]

Not trying to create any turmoil but was wondering if Jim ever thought about teaming up with any of the current small publishers to use what resources they may have to update/upgrade FOF. Seems that many want to develop some form of football game but have made little progress.

[Raiders Army]

I have lost all hope.

[Fonzie]

The reason that I have hope for a new version is because Jim has been silent on the matter. I believe (and maybe I'm wrong, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt) that Jim would have the decency to come right out and tell us if he was done with FOF. He knows there's a large community just sitting here and waiting. And waiting. And waiting. I doubt he'd keep us waiting so if he knew FOF had several forks stuck in it.

And if he were truly done with FOF I suspect he'd give some serious thought to releasing the source code. With the bright folks around here, we'd have a new version of the game in no time and the legacy of Gindin would live on.

[Dutch]

The reason that I have hope for a new version is because Jim has been silent on the matter. I believe (and maybe I'm wrong, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt) that Jim would have the decency to come right out and tell us if he was done with FOF. He knows there's a large community just sitting here and waiting. And waiting. And waiting. I doubt he'd keep us waiting so if he knew FOF had several forks stuck in it.

And if he were truly done with FOF I suspect he'd give some serious thought to releasing the source code. With the bright folks around here, we'd have a new version of the game in no time and the legacy of Gindin would live on.

It's doubtful that Jim would ever have the heart to retire FOF...at least officially. It's his baby afterall.

[weboes]

I dont see how new game could have been made the past couple years because of the nfl labor situation. Thats been up in the air for awhile and would you want to put a lot of time into making a game only to have the league come to an agreement with changes that make your game out of date

[sidthelid]

We all know Jim says nothing until a new game or update comes out but if he is working on FOF7 I would think he would at least be raising the profile of Solesismic again somehow to help the initial sales. I'd also think the best time to release a new Football Game is around the start of a new season or before Christmas. If that is the case and FOF7 is on the way you would think Jim would be starting to pop his head up again. So my view for what it's worth (which is not alot) is there is no new game on the way.

[NiteMaestro]

i kinda have to agree with sid on this one... but for different reasons...

given how things are up in the air with the NFL (or not, it weird...), this would be an opportunity for jim to take advantage of us football starved to make some sales, get betatesters, etc.

most of us want ANYTHING football we can get our hands on, and even if it means alot of patches, he'd be wise to release/announce something asap to placate the loyal and entice the new.

the new folks brought in are wouldn't mind alot of patches (too much), and us oldies have been patient for so long already.... I think those of us that are/were gonna leave have/would have already.

[MizzouRah]

Baseball and Pro Football are the only two text sims I play on the pc and I love both of them.. I really hope all this silence from Jim means he's been hard at work on a new FOF.

[scorp]

Once the full details of the new CBA are out, what are the chances of a patch for those changes. Looks like QB3 is more usefull now, and rookie salaries will be more set in stone making holdouts less common.

[Izulde]

Once the full details of the new CBA are out, what are the chances of a patch for those changes. Looks like QB3 is more usefull now, and rookie salaries will be more set in stone making holdouts less common.

Considering how complex the financial changes are (such as the salary floor), I'd highly doubt this could be covered in something as minor as a patch.

[A-Husker-4-Life]

When you don't hear from Jim that's a good thing, this means he's creating some magic in his workshop.

[Senator]

Patience.......grasshoppers.

[Icy]

Patience.......grasshoppers.

Do you know anything we don't? (yeah like if you were going to say yes if you do :) )

[AgustusM]

I think Pro Football Simulator will eventually grow into the market leader. It's pretty basic right now, but the creator is dedicated to improving the game in the long run. He envisions an OOTP-like development span.

spent about 10 minutes with the demo today and I liked what I saw, but I would need to spend a lot more time with it to be sure. But at least it is another potential option.

[Antonin]

spent about 10 minutes with the demo today and I liked what I saw, but I would need to spend a lot more time with it to be sure. But at least it is another potential option.

I agree that that's a nice potential option, but for now PFS is oriented mainly toward online leagues rather than solo play. Plus, there's no in-game play calling. Those two things are deal-breakers for me--I have no interest in online leagues.

I played around with the demo too, a few months back.

[AgustusM]

I agree that that's a nice potential option, but for now PFS is oriented mainly toward online leagues rather than solo play. Plus, there's no in-game play calling. Those two things are deal-breakers for me--I have no interest in online leagues.

I played around with the demo too, a few months back.

bleh, bad news both - I don't have time or interest in online leagues, and no play calling is a deal breaker.

back to FOF, Madden 11 and Head Coach 09 for now enjoying parts of each but wishing for a great mash up of all 3

[Epi_862]

I agree that that's a nice potential option, but for now PFS is oriented mainly toward online leagues rather than solo play. Plus, there's no in-game play calling. Those two things are deal-breakers for me--I have no interest in online leagues.

I played around with the demo too, a few months back.

All the best to people who enjoy PFS, but when a football game thinks it can simulate the game with what, five shared attributes? I really dont even want to give it a shot.

[Ben E Lou]

... five shared attributes...huh?

[Epi_862]

huh?

Well yeah, there's about 10. But when they are stuff like "hands" which tells a players skill in catching and blocking, it's pretty strange.

Been a while since i gave the game a shot, but i remember the dev saying hes happy with the system he has for ratings. I just dont see how.

[aston217]

I just don't see PFS beating FOF in depth, interesting-ness and enjoyability.

I do hear good stuff about the developer's dedication, but that honestly only goes so far. And it won't last forever.

The weirdest thing is, PFS doesn't even beat FOF in user interface, which is just mind-blowing to me, because FOF's interface is butt ugly.

[BighouseBrock]

dreaming of the day...

i too can't believe there is not much competition. you would think that ootp would jump on it. anyone try "bowl bound college football"?

[aston217]

We have a BBCF league over at SGN where the OSFL (FOF) is hosted.

It is a cool game, neat interface, and fun to play - but not as complex as FOF, especially with player development, which is disappointing.

[BighouseBrock]

We have a BBCF league over at SGN where the OSFL (FOF) is hosted.

It is a cool game, neat interface, and fun to play - but not as complex as FOF, especially with player development, which is disappointing.

lacks player dev huh? too bad, thats a huge part in any sports sim, from the screen shots i've seen the interface blows fof away. but maybe its all style and no substance???

[Joker]

I think the first clue, that he doesn't have a full time job is:
Go read the guys posts...He posts at 1:44am then during a week day the guy posts at 3:45am. These post-times certainly suggest he's still living the dream.
I certainly wish I could stay up late play me some FOF and post at FOFC about the Big East...
He also said, "My dad told me never fight a guy with big forearms."
Maybe we should just drive over to his house and beg for a autograph and perhaps a small peek at his many notebooks he keeps by the tv while watching NFL...Lets all do it today.

[RedKingGold]

You first.

[conception]

dreaming of the day...

i too can't believe there is not much competition. you would think that ootp would jump on it. anyone try "bowl bound college football"?

There has always been a lot of talks at the OOTP forums about making an American football game (note, not from the developers) but aside from market considerations, I really don't think the development team has either the understanding of the sport or the desire it would take to program the game. In the end, I don't think the potential income they would get from the game (which would be a mere fraction of those from baseball, which has a much more dedicated stathead base) is enough to offseat the tremendous amount of work involved.

[Joker]

You first.
Your life is too busy for fof.

[stevew]

I was kind of hoping for a minor 2011 roster update. It seems that the previous one came out in early October, so hopefully one is planned this year. Although free updates are, of course, generous and not expected.

[RedKingGold]

Your life is too busy for fof.

I know, that's why I want you to lead us.

[Yoda]

I was kind of hoping for a minor 2011 roster update. It seems that the previous one came out in early October, so hopefully one is planned this year. Although free updates are, of course, generous and not expected.

I thought the one last year came out at the end of October, like the 27th or so?

[Yoda]

Your life is too busy for fof.

Want to see a magic trick?

http://youtu.be/P2ABvkq62sk

[MizzouRah]

Last Update:


On October 13, 2010, we updated Front Office Football 2007 to Version 6.4. You may download the update through the support page (http://www.solecismic.com/support/index.php). It's at no cost to existing Front Office Football 2007 customers.

[cankles]

I don't know, but I hope one day there's a version of the game where the Load and Save Game buttons aren't crowded next to each other. I just saved over yet another game that I was intending to reload.

[Illinihopefull]

I would say not, what is it now 5 years since a new game, and just a couple of years of "so called updates". Half way through this season and not even an update. I hate to say it, but Jim is kind of like EA sports, both have the only football game product of this type. EA by buying the NFL license and Jim because he has no competition. Everyone thinks Jim is football god and Jim is buying into that. His website is so outdated like his game.. Do not get me wrong I love the game, but I do not play it that much because it is so outdated. It is time for a new release or just state that there will not be one, so nobody is left hanging.... He is not as big as EA, so just say if you got one in the works or your done.. I do not see the big deal..

[Dutch]

What if he's not sure?

[Nemesis]

I don't know, but I hope one day there's a version of the game where the Load and Save Game buttons aren't crowded next to each other. I just saved over yet another game that I was intending to reload.
I do that in test leagues all the time. Pisses me off.

[sidthelid]

I am of the opinion if Jim throws a 1, 2 or 3 on a 6 sided dice we will not get a new game, if it's 4 or a 5 we will get an update and a 6 we get a new game.

[Chubby]

Jim takes his Bill of Rights seriously...

From: Jim Gindin
To: HQ.DCMAIL3(TSR)
Date: Thu, Mar 2, 2000 4:04 PM
Subject: Telemarketing Review--Comment. FTC File No. P994414
To the FTC,

Please consider revising the Telemarketing Sales Rule to allow consumers some sort of method to block all sales calls. The current system simply doesn't work. AT&T, for example, has called my home nearly 20 times in the last two years. Each time, I've asked to be placed on a "no-call" list. A couple of times, I've asked to be transferred to a manager. Each time, the phone was hung up on me.

AT&T is probably the biggest abuser, in my case. They contract dozens of companies to call for them, thinking they're complying with the letter of the law.

But local companies have joined the fray as well. For some reason, every auto window glass company in the area calls repeatedly. Some callers just hang up when I ask to be placed on a "no-call" list. The Seattle Times brags in public about its "guerilla marketing" campaign to add subscribers. They've called six times in the last two years, ignoring no-call requests. Two Times employees have roamed my neighborhood after dark, banging on doors. I wrote to the DMA to have my phone number placed on a global no-call list, and that didn't stem the tide of phone calls at all.

I work at home, and my time is valuable to me. I consider the Bill of Rights to be the most important document ever written, and I love this country, but the First Amendment does not apply inside the boundaries of my own home. Because of the intrusive nature of sales calls, I believe consumers should have the right to ban these calls entirely.

Again, the current system doesn't work. Large companies like AT&T simply ignore the rules. Small companies simply laugh at them. Only a complete ban, either through technology created by the phone companies or with ALL companies required to access a global list before calling, will help remedy the problem.

And anything less than severe penalties for every violation will only ensure that companies continue to scoff at the rules.

This has become a serious situation because companies won't adhere to self-policing rules. It's time for the government to step in with a coherent plan.

thank you,

-Jim Gindin

[Rizon]

11 years later, AT&T still does this.

[dave731]

I'm on the verge of breaking down and buying FOF2007 as it looks like there won't be a new version anytime soon...one question though. Can FOF:TCY be used as a feeder for FOF2K7? In other words, can I pull draft files from TCY and insert them into the pro game? I figure if the games are both great, I might as well go ahead and get both to get the full experience if that is the case.

[dzilla77]

Yes, but I believe you end up with some talent level issues (too high) after several seasons of feeding FOF with TCY players.

[dave731]

Yes, but I believe you end up with some talent level issues (too high) after several seasons of feeding FOF with TCY players.
Thanks, took the plunge on FOF2K7 today...got to get modded up now with the logos and rosters. I'm holding off on TCY...

[tald]

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Accent 5"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid Accent 5"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="60" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Shading Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="61" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light List Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="62" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Grid Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="63" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 1 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="64" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 2 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="65" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 6"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" 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mso-para-margin-left:0in; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-theme-font:minor-fareast; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;} </style> <![endif]--> I think this is one great game!! However I am sadly disappointed at no response as to a new game or update the present game. Perhaps Jim could pass on all the codes etc. to some of our really computer geeks and they could design a new game or update the present. I still play the game weekly and am looking forward to something happening in the future.

[sidthelid]

Come on Jim, Santa needs something to put in my Christmas stocking. I have a credit card waiting to pay for a new game.

[tald]

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I have looked at the other games being marketed and none of them play like FOF. My hope is that Jim looks at this site and sees the continued interest in his game and is compelled to market a new game!! :)

[Illinihopefull]

Here is what bothers me about silence from Jim. A biggest majority of fan base here have stayed strong and true.. some of the supporters on here have provided Jim his financial freedom, at least in the early days. If a lot of people can provide Jim the support of buying his game over the years, why can he not provide the same support and stating if he is retired or at least working on a new version.. I know a lot will argue, but he owes the people who have bought every version of the game to come and at least state what the future is. If he does not, then he used us all....


...
Let the flames begin.:devil:

[A-Husker-4-Life]

Here is what bothers me about silence from Jim. A biggest majority of fan base here have stayed strong and true.. some of the supporters on here have provided Jim his financial freedom, at least in the early days. If a lot of people can provide Jim the support of buying his game over the years, why can he not provide the same support and stating if he is retired or at least working on a new version.. I know a lot will argue, but he owes the people who have bought every version of the game to come and at least state what the future is. If he does not, then he used us all....


...
Let the flames begin.:devil:

Douche, he doesn't owe us anything..

[mtolson]

I don't think he owes us anything either and I think many already suspect Jim has moved on to greater endeavors. I can't imagine him thinking that THIS much silence is good for his customer base. I went from visiting this site quite often to now almost never. I come here more often to get Pumpy's bowling update more than anything else at this point. I would think quite a few of his potential customers have stopped visiting and lost interest.

It would be nice if he got on and stated he was working on something or he has moved on but I don't think he owes it to anyone other than himself.

[Chubby]

FOF 7

The next great vaporware

[sidthelid]

15 months without a word is not good.

[Karim]

I was shocked to see Jim post (in the following thread):
Game Development Question - Data storage - Front Office Football Central (http://operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?t=83190)

At this point, I'm just glad to see he's still visiting FOFC...

[MizzouRah]

I will say, it's amazing I can still fire up FOF 2007 and get countless hours out of it.

I still see things that make me say, wow.. Jim is quite the genius.

[SFL Cat]

Moved along to other things. I do check in three or four times a year to see if anything is new. If a new FOF or TCY came out, I would probably purchase it, though.

[Chubby]

well now that Diablo 3 is coming out May 15th Jim should have some free time to finish up FOF 2012 :D

[Dutch]

I thought it was once Baldur's Gate 3 was released?

[Yoda]

I thought it was once Baldur's Gate 3 was released?

Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition News (http://www.baldursgate.com/news/language/en/)

[twomnybilz]

I check these boards about once or twice a year in hopes of something. But I do find it odd that he wouldn't say anything. But I will hold out some hope. Honestly I think he can make a decent amount of money by just updating the look of it and maybe a few other things that have changed over the year. Essentially a big patch. But what do I know?

[Dutch]

Well, I've always figured a FOF 6.5 Enhanced MP Edition might generate some interest....but perhaps not...I think ultimately, Jim will need to collabrorate with a team to get this thing back on track.

[booradley]

Look, I pop in and out, in and out, so I don't mean to ruffle feathers with a dumb question ... But honestly, does anyone here think Gindin will come forth with another FOF? I really hope so, but as far as I can tell FOF development has been dead for a long, long time without any official comment from The Man Himself. Where do you place the odds on a new game? 10%? 20%? Do i hear 30%+?

[molson]

I remember when these kinds of threads used to be all epic and result in name-calling, suspensions and bannings. Moderators would get all pissy at anyone who even suggested there might not be another game.

But anyway, no, nobody knows, though I remember some rumblings that he was doing other stuff now. It's been about 6 1/2 years. I guess its always possible, since it's a single person operation as opposed to something that's in the intellectual property basement of a big company. But not even a hint of anything in all those years.

[hitmanwa]

The problem is that kids these days are lazy and don't want to have to work at anything, much less a game. They'd rather mindlessly button smash or play twitch games like Modern Warfare. The greatness of games like FOF and Football in general is the strategy of the game. I think that sort of thing is lost when it comes to the newer generation of gamers, unfortunately. I tried playing Madden some the other day but I was like meh, this sucks and came back to FOF.

I've bought this game 4 times now, I'll buy it again if I need to. I'd love another release but I'm still happy with this one none the less.

[aston217]

hey, I play Modern Warfare too....it's fun, in a different kind of way. Plenty of room for both.

I think it's worth mentioning that this game last received an update not so long ago, in October of 2010. Some more minor tweaks wouldn't be too surprising. On the whole the game still has a tremendous following and has really stood the test of time. It's created an enriching experience to the point where another game isn't needed yet.

Of course if Jim has a lot of nice new ideas he could bring them to the table, but if I were in his shoes, periodic tweaks and patches are all that's needed for the foreseeable future.

[Chubby]

I remember when these kinds of threads used to be all epic and result in name-calling, suspensions and bannings. Moderators would get all pissy at anyone who even suggested there might not be another game.

But anyway, no, nobody knows, though I remember some rumblings that he was doing other stuff now. It's been about 6 1/2 years. I guess its always possible, since it's a single person operation as opposed to something that's in the intellectual property basement of a big company. But not even a hint of anything in all those years.

umm WHAT ABOUT ETHAN!!!

[Templar]

Hope your wrong....but what you write is true. FOF football for me has been on of the greatest games. I would pay twice the price to have a new one. I guess we can only hope that Jim sees all that is written and the loyalty people have to FOF.
I completely agree! And I hope we have many more hours of fun with FOF (I've just signed up in an online league).
But if Jim does not want anymore, than he does want not want anymore.
FOF is and remains an excellent, outstanding game. And it's still the reference!

Perhaps there is now a rising star on the horizon.
The Professional Football Simulator, short PFS.
I have found PFS in early 2011 and did not like it.
In the meantime, however, PFS become very playable. PFS is still far from where FOF stands today.
But now everyone should download the demo and give it in a serious and honest try.
The gruesome documentation does not help much. If you resumee the time and read through the Forum you will recognize PFS now so has a lot of depth.

The very dedicated (unlike Jim) developer Brooks is every day, sometimes several times a day, attended the forum and answered questions.
Especially reported bugs Brooks takes very seriously!
Although PFS is still not in the highs FOF is but give the current version a fair chance.

Maybe the upcoming star on the horizon.

[AnthonyL]

I hope there will be another FOF, whenever that might be.

Most of the fanbase is still intact and from what I know it's a dedicated fanbase.

Maybe one last go with FOF 2013?

That would be awesome, because there is nothing on the market that comes close.

I've bought everything that has 'Football text-based Sim' written on it. Nothing provides what FOF 2007 provided.

PFS might come close one day, but it's still a looong way to go for that game. As things stand it doesn't even feature play calling which is an integral part of text-based Football sims in my oppinion.

Let's just hope there will be another FOF one day, although it seems to be highly unlikely....:(

[Kozure]

The very dedicated (unlike Jim) developer Brooks is every day, sometimes several times a day, attended the forum and answered questions.
Especially reported bugs Brooks takes very seriously!
Although PFS is still not in the highs FOF is but give the current version a fair chance.

To say that Jim isn't dedicated is a little unfair. From what it seems, PFS isn't a finished product, so this dedication Brooks shows is a bit misleading since he is still addressing issues and adding features. I understand that people are saying the game has a great deal of depth, but it also seems that those playing the game now are basically beta testers and he is constantly seeking input from then to make the game better, which is great.

Jim releases finished products. That is my definition of dedication. Finishing what you've started is one of hardest things to do in any creative environment. While I wish he was more upfront on how exactly some aspects of gameplanning functions, it isn't necessary to enjoy or even become good at the game.

That being said, I think it is great that Brooks communicates and hope he keeps it up since someone will need to keep simulated football franchises on our computers longterm in the event that FOF2007 is the last that we see of the GindinSims. :)

[Templar]

To say that Jim isn't dedicated is a little unfair. From what it seems, PFS isn't a finished product, so this dedication Brooks shows is a bit misleading since he is still addressing issues and adding features. I understand that people are saying the game has a great deal of depth, but it also seems that those playing the game now are basically beta testers and he is constantly seeking input from then to make the game better, which is great
That's the view of things from a different perspective. I can understand and accept this. And I say you are also right.


Maybe I chose unfavorable words.
On the one hand I'm like so many disappointed and angry that we had been heard from him.
He could show up and say, folks, I'm not working on, I now have other interests, I guess maybe at a later I will continiue my work , or simply: I'm tired, or, or, or.
Jim tells his FOF followers nothing. Nothing at all - We have to accept this. We have to life with it. Personally I think it's not the best way to say farewell.

On the other hand, English is not my native language. It happens that I do not choose the best words.

Early 2011, I once downloaded the demo for PFS. Oh my God, I thought, for this something I should spend my money and spend my little free time?
Then last week I loaded out of curiosity and boredom once more the demo and tested it.
Incidentally, I'm stumbling around a lot in the PFS forum.

My momentary conclusion on the current version: Release - 1.1.94/1.1.95

The developer Brooks Piggott shows a love for his product and a customer care which is unique.
Unfortunately, Brooks worked mainly alone on PFS so that the progress is quite slow and we must have patience.
However, the Professional Football Simulator is after the last update on 05/21/2012, Release - 1.1.94/1.1.95, worth in any case his money.
Who, at least for the moment, still can dispense on some feature and is patient wil find in Brooks Piggott's PFS a decent alternative to Front Office Football.
Brooks Piggott has acquired the right to be mentioned in the game. :)

Under these circumstances I am not feeling used as beta testers.
PFS is, despite its bugs, playable.
Will you turn each screw then select Front Office Football.
Do you want a quick game in which you have to invest less time, but you still want to insist on the minimum acceptable depth, then select Professional football simulation.
But keep in mind here: the Professional Football Simulation is constantly evolving.

Both are good. Both are fun. One is fantastic. And one could be a future contender for the Heisman trophy.
Personal preferences decide.

So this is not a war between fanboys.

Go on! :popcorn:

[aston217]

You guys probably missed a number of posts Jim has made within the past month or two in the thread about 3rd down running.

PFS has an active developer right now in its early stages - how many years can that be expected to continue? The number of one-man operations that fizzle out. Every show has great dedication at the beginning. Not to knock on those guy(s), but they could be doing it for ten years and still not reach the time of dedication that Jim has had with FOF.

I love communication as much as the next guy, but it takes a level of super devoted football geekdom, the kind that Jim has shown a knock for over an incredibly long span of time, to create a masterpiece football sim like FOF and not a bunch of random number generators wrapped in a pretty interface. That's always been FOF's greatest asset, his mind.

If he ever steps away from the football sim scene, what will be needed to replace him is not a guy who will talk to customers and put lots of time into something, we'd need another Jim.