A Memory of Light - The last WoT book

[spleen1015]

The Prologue was released a few days ago and today TOR has released Chapter 1. The book is due out 1/8/2013.

Since these 2 items have been released, I have started to read some of the various things around the interwebs and I am seeing a lot of Brandon Sanderson hate. Many feel like he has done a ppor job finishing the series.

Did folks really believe that he was going to be able to write like Robert Jordan? I'm just happy that we're getting the end of the series.

[Coffee Warlord]

Did folks really believe that he was going to be able to write like Robert Jordan? I'm just happy that we're getting the end of the series.

One might question whether or not RJ would have finished in 3 books were he still around.

People seem pissy about Sanderson's writing of Mat. I say he's just fine. And hell, we've had far less descriptions of teacups and dresses lately, which is just fine in my mind.

[Eaglesfan27]

One might question whether or not RJ would have finished in 3 books were he still around.

People seem pissy about Sanderson's writing of Mat. I say he's just fine. And hell, we've had far less descriptions of teacups and dresses lately, which is just fine in my mind.

Agreed with all of this. Can't wait for the last book.

[bronconick]

Those people complaining are idiots.

1. It's actually being finished.
2. The plot is being advanced, something Jordan struggled with especially from books 8-10 and only recovered from in Knife of Dreams when he realized his time was numbered.
3. I give Sanderson credit for knowing he can't emulate another man's style and just wrote his own way.
4. Despite #3, he still got most of the characters pretty well.

A lot of those people will likely experience the other end of the stick in 10-15 years when Martin leaves ASOIAF unfinished with not much in the way of notes or tapes to finish with.

[BrianD]

I thought Sanderson was saving the series. The last few books have been as good as the first few books. Way better than the mess from the middle.

[Glengoyne]

I thought Sanderson was saving the series. The last few books have been as good as the first few books. Way better than the mess from the middle.

This is how I felt as well. I had read some complaints about Mat, but really Sanderson got Mat out of that God forsaken town he had been languishing in since book seven. Book Seven!

I think Sanderson has saved the Wheel of Time, and he certainly treated it better than Jordan himself in books seven or eight through ten or eleven.

[cschex]

Totally agree with all points. I hadn't purchased a new WOT book since Vol 8, checking them out and skimming through them at the library because of how boring 8-11 were. Sanderson made the endgame visible and, while I still think there is a hell of a lot to wrap up in one book, I'm actually anticipating a WOT release for the first time since book 7

[Glengoyne]

... I'm actually anticipating a WOT release for the first time since book 7

+1

[spleen1015]

I know this is going to be like it was for me with Lost, The Sopranos, & The Wire.

The journey has been amazing and once it is over, I am going to wish I was still looking forward to more books. I've realized that it is not the end that matters, but the journey.

[Vince, Pt. II]

I don't at all understand any Sanderson hate. He's been incredible for the series. Him taking over has also led me to the Mistborn series which was phenomenal.

[Autumn]

I've realized that it is not the end that matters, but the journey.

Apparently Jordan felt the same way.

[Autumn]

Yeah, if you complain about Sanderson you can go jump off a bridge. Even if Jordan hadn't died I'm not sure he ever would have finished the series at the rate he was going. And it's not like Jordan was producing fine writing at the end there.

[Glengoyne]

I don't at all understand any Sanderson hate. He's been incredible for the series. Him taking over has also led me to the Mistborn series which was phenomenal.


And the Stormlight Archive, which is just as big an undertaking as WoT.

Now I hope he sees what Jordan and Martin have done in allowing their success to slow down the prolific writing that led to their success in the first place. I don't want Sanderson's epic to die the slow lingering death that WoT did or that Song of Ice and Fire is going through.

[Autumn]

Let this be a lesson to us. Pretend indifference to fantasy series until they're completed, then start reading them!

[spleen1015]

Let this be a lesson to us. Pretend indifference to fantasy series until they're completed, then start reading them!

Sadly, I lack the patience for that. I'll read his Stormlight novels as he releases them and I'll still be waiting in 20 years for the last one.

[bronconick]

Let this be a lesson to us. Pretend indifference to fantasy series until they're completed, then start reading them!

I'm kind of glad that it's led to an increase of actual trilogies and the rare stand-alone book. For a while there, every idiot had to have their dozen book magnum opus and I only have the patience for a couple at a time (WOT, Dresden, ASOIAF every 5 years when he publishes) so I'd ignore the rest.

[spleen1015]

Tomorrow is the day. Some folks have been saying online that they have been finding the book early at Walmart. I am going to check one at lunch today.

Excited and sad that the end is near.

[Coffee Warlord]

I have a feeling it's going to be a late, late night for me tomorrow. And the next day.

[Eaglesfan27]

Can't wait to get the book, but I have to wait a few days to read it as this is a very busy week for me. But, I'll be flying on Sunday and the book is going to help the time fly on the plane.

[Glengoyne]

I'm just finishing my Audible edition of Red Country, and I'm hoping the Audible version of this is also available tomorrow. That is how it seems to work most often with this sort of release. So I'll be taking my time listening to the final book.

Note: If you are stuck trying to get through books eight through ten, I found them to be much more bearable in their audio versions.

[Coffee Warlord]

Wow did I stay up way too damn late mowing through this book.

[spleen1015]

I'm through chapter 20. I'm a slow reader I think. I am reading about 60 pages and hour.

Some of my thoughts so far.


Morraine's return was really disappointing to me. It didn't seem like people were all too surprised that she was alive. I expected more emotion, more reaction from Rand. Also, there wasn't even a scene with the reunion between her and Lan. It is pretty lame.

The banter between Rand & Mat in chapter 17 when Rand and Tuon make their peace, I thought it was way out of character for both of them. It was humorous, but I don't think it fits them at all.

Lastly, the Sharans showing up and kicking the shit out of Egwene's army pisses me off. Yeah the Sharans have been mentioned here and there, but to have them show up now, I don't like it.

I am worried that I am nitpicking the hell out of the book. I am still anxious to keep reading it though.

[Coffee Warlord]

Finito.

Good. Not great, but good.

[Vince, Pt. II]

It's really, really weird to be finished with the Wheel of Time.

Really, really enjoyed the final book. Disappointed with the very end - the epilogue was completely freaking awful - but the journey there was phenomenal.

I think the problem was that the series had grown far too large to be able to neatly wrap it up and give every character their due without adding another 200 pages to the already 900 page book.

Edit: I find it humorous that it turns out the Epilogue was written by Jordan years ago before he passed. And that's the only part of the new book I don't like.

[Coffee Warlord]

It's really, really weird to be finished with the Wheel of Time.

Really, really enjoyed the final book. Disappointed with the very end - the epilogue was completely freaking awful - but the journey there was phenomenal.

I think the problem was that the series had grown far too large to be able to neatly wrap it up and give every character their due without adding another 200 pages to the already 900 page book.

Edit: I find it humorous that it turns out the Epilogue was written by Jordan years ago before he passed. And that's the only part of the new book I don't like.

Totally in agreement with the epilogue. There were other parts I found odd/disliked as well, but like I said. It was good enough. Certainly not perfect, but good enough.

[Eaglesfan27]

I just finished and agree with the epilogue as a disappointment. The rest of the book was very good and I savored every page. Odd not to be looking forward to any more of the series.

[Autumn]

I just finished the book. I felt it was decent, but at this point that is a triumph. Sanderson really saved this series, and I think he did the best he could with what he was handed. I almost wish he had stepped in earlier. I think most every complaint I have about how the story ends has its origins way back in Jordan adding more into the series than he could possibly have addressed well. There was so much in earlier books that led to waste, and I wish a lot of it could have been used to address more interesting themes that got dropped.

I don't understand some choices like to spend so much time on Androl in the last book of this series. We see him more than we see Moraine, and yet we spent a billion books with her return foreshadowed, and no reason to care about him. They really lost a chance to build up a Black Tower character we could have followed and cared about long ago. Logain would have been a great choice since he just felt forced in at the end, with all these prophecies but no reason for us to care or understand why he was the way he was. That really fell flat for me.

The Sharans bothered a lot of people, but I didn't mind that reveal so much. We knew Demandred was up to something Rand couldn't figure out so that was a good surprise. Having a POV character involved in that might have helped though.

So much stuff would have been more powerful if it had been built up in previous books. Egwene's counter to balefire felt rushed rather than something that had been coming and coming. The red-veiled Aiel should have been a great reveal but again I think needed some buildup beforehand. We've been waiting and waiting to find out why the hell Olver was in the book, but it seemed it was simply to do something anyone else could have done. That was a letdown to me.

The idea of Perrin countering Slayer was kind of cool, but Jordan/Sanderson never convinced me why I should care about Slayer. I kept expecting a big interesting something to happen there but it never did.

Mostly the good points of the book to me were that the writing was solid. Unlike Jordan's last few I never found myself annoyed by what I was reading, even if I didn't care so much about some plot choices or whatever. I enjoyed watching Mat work against Demandred. I like that Rand figured a way to prevent a new taint, but I wish more time had been spent on that plan, and on finding the strength to oppose the Dark Lord, and less on wondering about killing him. It was obvious to me that was a bad idea, and instead I would have liked to see the battle between despair and hope as he watched the shadow seeming to win.

I wish Moraine had had some sort of big role at the end. I think Jordan really dropped the ball there -- I think Cadsuane's role in the series was basially meant for Moraine, but he waited too long to bring her back. Having Moraine return to remind Rand he was human would have been perfect.

I'm not sure how I feel about the very end. It seemed obvious ever since Rand started being sure he would die that he would not. Having him swap bodies was a clever idea, though that whole twin thing was another thing I felt was never really addressed well. But it just seemed kind of weird how it ended, kind of unemotional.

I could go on and on about this. I probably have over the last 20 years. The best thing though is that Jordan created a world and a story that has had me thinking and talking and wondering and wishing for that long. Back in the days of USENET I spent a lot of time discussing theories and guesses and prophecies about the books, and it was probably a given that the books could never hold up against all the thought and anticipation that fans like that could generate.

[Glengoyne]

I just finished the book. I felt it was decent, but at this point that is a triumph. Sanderson really saved this series, and I think he did the best he could with what he was handed. I almost wish he had stepped in earlier. I think most every complaint I have about how the story ends has its origins way back in Jordan adding more into the series than he could possibly have addressed well. There was so much in earlier books that led to waste, and I wish a lot of it could have been used to address more interesting themes that got dropped.

...


I recall way back in the day while waiting for book seven or eight I believe posting in a thread comparing the WoT to Tolkien's works. I said something along the lines of the end of book six being such a high point in my fantasy reading that I believed it, the WoT, to be better than LoTR, my concession being that Tolkien was finished writing and that Jordan still had a long way to go to sustain that level. In the end, the WoT finished well, but those middle books really hurt the series as a whole.

[Autumn]

Yeah that early promise really petered out. These guys could take a lesson from Tolkien -- even with the ridiculously large and bloated vision Tolkien had, he put together a trilogy out of it. Maybe your fantasy series doesn't need a dozen books.

[Thomkal]

Saw this news today-did you know the channel FXX aired a Wheel of Time pilot late last night? I certainly did not, and apparently neither did Robert Jordan's wife or the lawyers running his estate. Anyone happen to see it?

The Real Story About That Wheel Of Time Pilot That Aired Last Night (http://io9.com/the-real-story-about-that-wheel-of-time-pilot-that-aire-1684773094)

I am close to finishing Book 11? the one right before Sanderson takes over. I have never felt so annoyed and frustrated while reading a series, and yet still want to read more of it.

[Coffee Warlord]

Wheel of Time TV pilot: "Winter Dragon" - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvNYIEN1vIg)

The CGI is awful, but, up until Lews Therin realized he killed everyone, it wasn't bad. The wooden acting from Lews Therin after that was pain.

[terpkristin]

The article from the Wertzone at the end of the io9 article is the best reporting on it, IMO.

I'll give them this. For a couple of days work with a director that was apparently on death's doorstep, it could have been (should have been?) much worse. But it will be interesting to see what comes of this, as it's totally skeezy to pitch it in an infomercial slot...and Jordan's widow is PISSED.

/tk

[Thomkal]

Wheel of Time TV pilot: "Winter Dragon" - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvNYIEN1vIg)

The CGI is awful, but, up until Lews Therin realized he killed everyone, it wasn't bad. The wooden acting from Lews Therin after that was pain.

ah I should have thought to check You Tube, thanks CW

[Alan T]

Thanks for posting that link CW! I've been dying for some kind of tv series/movies or something ever since finishing these books.

Hopefully if nothing else, out of this some perceived interest will be shown to get someone to legitimately create a series/movie or something out of this for us.

[Autumn]

Yeah, seems like an easy call given the success of Game of Thrones and Hobbit, to put something out with Wheel of Time. It's actually finished, unlike GoT, has a big fanbase among the fantasy crowd, features a lot of characters which could easily be a diverse cast. Best of all, the fans would not complain when they cut shit out of the books. I think I'll go write the screenplay now!

[Desnudo]

I can't wait for the extended episode on dress selection.

[Autumn]

Normally the problem with adaptions is how do you condense it to work in a film or TV format. Here, if you cut out all the dress selections and braid tugging, it's probably down several books already.

[Coffee Warlord]

Potential female cast members will be thoroughly drilled on dramatic sniffing.

[Thomkal]

Normally the problem with adaptions is how do you condense it to work in a film or TV format. Here, if you cut out all the dress selections and braid tugging, it's probably down several books already.

There may not be enough left for a full season! :)

[spleen1015]

Turns out RJ told a little fib. I figure he just changed his mind when everyone figured it out.

Signings and Secrets - Theoryland of the Wheel of Time Forums (http://theoryland.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=8767)

[Autumn]

Yeah, I think RJ changed his tune several times over the course of the series. One of the first authors to be writing a series like this when the Internet was exploding and I think he really responded to the fan theories, and wanting to keep people guessing.

[Thomkal]

some news on the WoT

TV Rights to The Wheel of Time Optioned by New Studio, With Jordan Estate’s Approval | Tor.com (http://www.tor.com/2016/04/28/tv-rights-to-the-wheel-of-time-optioned-by-new-studio-with-jordan-estates-approval/)

[bronconick]

Even if you gut whole chunks where nothing happened in some of the middle books, it's still too big and too long to turn into a TV show.

[IlliniCub]

Just finished the series a few hours ago. It's going to be weird waking up tomorrow knowing there's no more Wheel of Time to read.

[RomaGoth]

Potential female cast members will be thoroughly drilled on dramatic sniffing.

This received no response but easily the best post in this thread.

+1 Sir

[RomaGoth]

I actually felt like going back and reading this series again. Then I remembered the 6 books in the middle of the series that nearly caused me to burn my retinas with a blowtorch.

Now I'm sad with nothing to read. But at least I still have my retinas.

[Mota]

I got stuck on book 8. The slog which was 6-8 was too much for me. I loved the first 5 books though. I just have better things to do than read 850 pages of nothing before 150 pages of cool stuff for another 6 books.

[The Jackal]

I only felt like there was one book that really lost me. There are other long series I would re-read first (GoT, Dark Tower, Harry Potter come to mind), but I definitely enjoyed the overall experience. Was worth it at the end.

[The Jackal]

This received no response but easily the best post in this thread.

+1 Sir

Have to agree. Just seeing you quote it makes me visualize the sniffing.

[Vince, Pt. II]

I only felt like there was one book that really lost me. There are other long series I would re-read first (GoT, Dark Tower, Harry Potter come to mind), but I definitely enjoyed the overall experience. Was worth it at the end.

I'm in this line. I agree that it was crazy slow and not very good in the middle, but I still enjoyed the read.