Soccer Thread 2015-16

[flere-imsaho]

As I think Marc pointed out (perhaps in this thread), EPL prize money now exceeds UCL prize money. If that continues (and I see no reason why it wouldn't), we're going to have an interesting dichotomy where EPL owners prioritize the EPL over the UCL while their fans (ostensibly) look for more balance.

[flere-imsaho]

Here's some data, at least:

UEFA Champions League Prize Money 2015-16 Breakdown (http://www.totalsportek.com/money/uefa-champions-league-prize-money/)

Premier League Prize Money Table 2015 (Confirmed) (http://www.totalsportek.com/football/premier-league-prize-money-table-2015/)

But basically, QPR, who finished 20th in last year's EPL and were relegated, made 65M (pounds) from prize money & tv money.

Barcelona, for winning last year's UCL, made 58M (euro) from prize money & shared tv money (Juventus actually made more - 64M (euro).

At current exchange rates 58M euro is roughly 42M british pounds.

[MIJB#19]

Nice work, MIJB! :DActually, it looks even better now after adding colors. ;)

[BishopMVP]

As I think Marc pointed out (perhaps in this thread), EPL prize money now exceeds UCL prize money. If that continues (and I see no reason why it wouldn't), we're going to have an interesting dichotomy where EPL owners prioritize the EPL over the UCL while their fans (ostensibly) look for more balance.Well, a lot of the owners that actually compete in the CL are in it for prestige instead of being concerned about the most fiscally responsible path. And I don't think an EPL title will ever be more prestigious than a CL one.

Like most have pointed out, it's not the CL performance that's going to cost England a spot, it's Europa League performance, which doesn't have much prestige at all.

[ISiddiqui]

It's not necessarily all about prize money, of course. Champions League gives you a much greater impact in terms of worldwide recognition and has great impacts on merchandising and the tons of money made there.

[Ryche]

Garry Monk officially fired from Swansea.

Swansea City part company with Garry Monk (http://www.swanseacity.net/news/article/swansea-city-part-company-with-garry-monk-2843467.aspx)

[murrayyyyy]

Garry Monk officially fired from Swansea.

Swansea City part company with Garry Monk (http://www.swanseacity.net/news/article/swansea-city-part-company-with-garry-monk-2843467.aspx)

Not pleased about this but looks like the old girlfriend will be back in town. I think they locked up Brendan Rodgers before they made the move.

[Ryche]

Not pleased about this but looks like the old girlfriend will be back in town. I think they locked up Brendan Rodgers before they made the move.

Sounds like he has a big money offer from somewhere in the middle east so probably won't be him. No idea who I want that's realistic

[MIJB#19]

Euro2016 draw is in.

Group A: France, Romania, Albania, Switzerland
Group B: England, Russia, Wales, Slovakia
Group C: Germany, Ukraine, Poland, Northern Ireland
Group D: Spain, Czechia, Turkey, Croatia
Group E: Belgium, Italy, Rep. Ireland, Sweden
Group F: Portugal, Iceland, Austria, Hungary

I'm still working on a Euro2016 modification to my World Cup/Euro spreadsheet. Complicated part being the various possibilities for the four best third placed teams placing orders.

[MrBug708]

Group E...uggh

[bob]

It seems like Poland always gets drawn into the same group as Germany.

[miami_fan]

I wish we could see what the great managers of the past and present (Fergie, Busby, Shankly, etc) would do with this Aston Villa squad for the rest of the season. They might be in 18th place right now. Brutal

[flere-imsaho]

Here's the full draw for the first knockout round of the Europa League:

Valencia v Rapid Vienna

Fiorentina v Tottenham Hotspur

Borussia Dortmund v FC Porto

Fenerbahce v Lokomotiv Moscow

Anderlecht v Olympiakos

Midtjylland v Manchester United

Augsburg v Liverpool

Sparta Prague v Krasnodar

Galatasaray v Lazio

Sion v Braga

Shakhtar Donetsk v Schalke

Marseille v Athletic Bilbao

Sevilla v Molde

Sporting Lisbon v Bayer Leverkusen

Villarreal v Napoli

Saint-Etienne v Basel

[flere-imsaho]

Here's the draw for the knockout round of the Champions' League:

Ghent v Wolfsburg

Roma v Real Madrid

Paris Saint-Germain v Chelsea

Arsenal v Barcelona

Juventus v Bayern Munich

PSV Eindhoven v Atletico Madrid

Benfica v Zenit St Petersburg

Dynamo Kyiv v Manchester City

[flere-imsaho]

Given that Manchester United fluffed a very easy group, I'm looking forward to them getting knocked out 0-1 on aggregate in Denmark.

[flere-imsaho]

I feel bad for Arsenal. Having a pretty good season, and it's going to come to an end against the MSN juggernaut.

[flere-imsaho]

Zlatan 8 - 0 Chelsea, anyone? :D

[ISiddiqui]

Soo... what's exactly going on with Newcastle right now? I'm pleasantly shocked... though I imagine that won't last long.

[BishopMVP]

I feel bad for Arsenal. Having a pretty good season, and it's going to come to an end against the MSN juggernaut.

I guess the best news for England is that Juve drew Bayern. That Fiorentina-Spurs draw also could be really huge now - I'm sure somebody somewhere actually has started breaking down coefficients and figuring out exactly what England needs vs. Italy's results going forward.

[miami_fan]

Soo... what's exactly going on with Newcastle right now? I'm pleasantly shocked... though I imagine that won't last long.

Talent wise, there is no reason why Newcastle should be in the relegation zone.

Now Chelsea on the other hand...:D

It really is startling to see that the defending champions of England are one point above the relegation zone. The transfer window is going to be very interesting.

[sovereignstar v2]

Mourinho to United is starting to align perfectly.

[TroyF]

Talent wise, there is no reason why Newcastle should be in the relegation zone.

Now Chelsea on the other hand...:D

It really is startling to see that the defending champions of England are one point above the relegation zone. The transfer window is going to be very interesting.


I think you meant:

It really is wonderful to see the defending douche bags of England are one point above the relegation zone. The transfer window is going to be very interesting.

[TroyF]

Mourinho to United is starting to align perfectly.


I would so love to see that train wreck happen.

Mourinho is a fantastic manager who is melting down this year. On the other side, what would he do that is all that different than their current manager? Park the bus, play boring football and lack weapons needed to really win the title. Most United fans would vomit at that thought.

They want Pep. (I know you want Pep too and I'll admit that I would like him too) If not Pep, they want someone who will play decent football.

[AlexB]

I missed the game today (in New Zealand for a while) but catching up on the live reporting I'm actually welling up a little! Still unbelievable, but sooner or later it can't be seen as a coincidence that almost every team seems to have an off day against us, maybe just maybe it is as much to do with how we play... Not sure I believe it myself just yet, but it's certainly not all one way.

[Marc Vaughan]

Mourinho is a fantastic manager who is melting down this year.

I thought his tactical switch was a good one and it definitely got them back into the match - unfortunately they were two down and it was too little too late ...

That being said Leicester deserved the win, they worked immensely hard defending from the front and played some really nice football at times - I love the way they run at defenses its refreshing to watch :D

[flere-imsaho]

They want Pep. (I know you want Pep too and I'll admit that I would like him too) If not Pep, they want someone who will play decent football.

The better manager for United would have been Klopp - much closer in alignment of philosophy to Ferguson than Van Gaal (or Mourinho, for that matter). Yes, eventually Van Gaal will turn over enough of the playing and non-playing staff that his philosophy will sink in, but will he get enough success in the meantime to actually stick around?

[Marc Vaughan]

The better manager for United would have been Klopp - much closer in alignment of philosophy to Ferguson than Van Gaal (or Mourinho, for that matter). Yes, eventually Van Gaal will turn over enough of the playing and non-playing staff that his philosophy will sink in, but will he get enough success in the meantime to actually stick around?

Klopp is potentially perfect for United, however the Liverpool fans will adore him also if he brings any semblance of success to the club and his personally meshes well with the English soccer attitude generally imho.

[TroyF]

I thought his tactical switch was a good one and it definitely got them back into the match - unfortunately they were two down and it was too little too late ...

That being said Leicester deserved the win, they worked immensely hard defending from the front and played some really nice football at times - I love the way they run at defenses its refreshing to watch :D


The problem with that is he's used many of the same tactics the entire year and it is still not working.

At any rate, his meltdown has little to do with tactics. We are watching a guy with a large ego simply break down mentally before our eyes. He demotes the team doctor because she went onto the pitch and said nothing about the player who requested medical help.

Then we get into his conspiracy theories with the refs. (Seriously, the only reason they beat Arsenal was because the ref didn't do his job and didn't send Costa off 3 different times before he finally sent Gabriel off. It was the single worst mistake any EPL ref has made this year)

He's a brilliant manager. . . but he is seriously losing it and has been all year. His paranoia is catching up to him. I can't even imagine what it is like to be in the Chelsea facility now. Part of what makes him good is his refusal to fail, but the same part causes him to go off a cliff anytime that failure happens. (see locking a reporter in a room for hours at Real Madrid for further proof of this)

[flere-imsaho]

In manager news:

Guardiola to confirm his future by next week, but reports indicate he won't be re-signing with Bayern and the long-held rumors of a move to Man City will be confirmed. Ancellotti in the frame to take over at Bayern.

Bielsa to Swansea? Woah.

No shocker Benitez likely to be sacked at Real Madrid. Back to Mourinho?

[flere-imsaho]

The problem with that is he's used many of the same tactics the entire year and it is still not working.

As you say, though, it's not really to do with tactics.

I think what's happened is pretty straightforward. He wore the team out physically and then mentally.

In 2014/15, basically 19 players (including Cech & Courtois) played all the league games: 2014–15 Chelsea F.C. season - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014%E2%80%9315_Chelsea_F.C._season#Appearances)

That's simply not sustainable, especially for an EPL club that's also competing in 3 Cup competitions.

Once the performance dipped, Mourinho kept the pressure on his team, belatedly realized they needed a break (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3344700/Diego-Costa-trains-Chelsea-just-nine-hours-spotted-leaving-London-nightclub-Ramires-boxing-champion-James-DeGale.html), and has now doubled-down on the pressure (http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2015/dec/15/chelsea-players-betrayed-jose-mourinho), and appears to have lost the team in the process.

While this seems like a surprise for a manager with such a reputation for motivating players, it's not unlike the breakdown he had at Real Madrid where he lost the locker room.


Assuming he gets sacked (and I think it's a given that any manager of the EPL's "Big 4" gets sacked if they can't even qualify for the Europa League), the more interesting question is who picks him up. He has a deserved reputation as a title-winner. He figures out how to win fast. But at this point any appointment is for the short-term. There are plenty of owners out there who will take that, of course.

[miami_fan]

There are rumblings of a managerial change at Stamford Bridge

[flere-imsaho]

Chelsea sack manager José Mourinho after disastrous start to title defence | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/dec/17/chelsea-sack-jose-mourinho)

[flere-imsaho]

I would imagine both Guardiola and Ancellotti's phones are blowing up right now.

[kingfc22]

Booooo. I was really enjoying watching this pompous ass make a fool of himself.

[ISiddiqui]

Men in Blazers is agitating for a new USMNT manager:

https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xal1/v/t1.0-9/12376460_1011712152225110_5821022347175129211_n.jpg?oh=d65c5cd28096e82d8cc4384c605aea75&oe=570FCA42

;)

[sovereignstar v2]

I would imagine both Guardiola and Ancellotti's phones are blowing up right now.

I would imagine that both already know where they are going.

[sovereignstar v2]

Assuming he gets sacked (and I think it's a given that any manager of the EPL's "Big 4" gets sacked if they can't even qualify for the Europa League), the more interesting question is who picks him up. He has a deserved reputation as a title-winner. He figures out how to win fast. But at this point any appointment is for the short-term. There are plenty of owners out there who will take that, of course.

1. PSG
2. United

[Marc Vaughan]

I'm expecting Chelsea to announce Guardiola as the new manager in the next day or so ..

[sovereignstar v2]

I'm expecting Chelsea to announce Guardiola as the new manager in the next day or so ..

Yeah right. He wouldn't touch that job with a 10 foot pole.

[sovereignstar v2]

The only appealing thing about that job to Pep would be that it's in London. Brentford is in London too.

[BishopMVP]

USA playing in Santa Clara, Chicago and Philly for this summer's Copa America. Couldn't find the date for when the rest of the draw happens.

https://ca2016loc.app.box.com/s/2ia2r07k999oos3af8xc75lldgkgai6f

[miami_fan]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/ChelseaFC">@ChelseaFC</a> We've received a CV from Mr Jose Mourinho. He's applied for a job as pizza chef. Please can you send through a reference. Thanks.</p>&mdash; Pizza Hut UK (@pizzahutuk) <a href="https://twitter.com/pizzahutuk/status/677513949538091008">December 17, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

:lol:

[MIJB#19]

Guus Hiddink has been spotted in London...

[flere-imsaho]

Guus Hiddink holding talks with Chelsea over caretaker role | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/dec/18/guus-hiddink-chelsea-talks-jose-mourinho)

[ISiddiqui]

Is it just me, or does Guus Hiddink sound like a character from Harry Potter? Or is that just all Dutch names? :D

[miami_fan]

With Mourinho gone, the focus goes back to the squad. I am assuming they are going to want to play a bit more of an open style similar to the one they played at the beginning of last season. However, that back four has not shown an ability to cope on their own or just with Matic in front of them.

[MIJB#19]

Is it just me, or does Guus Hiddink sound like a character from Harry Potter? Or is that just all Dutch names? :DRidikkulus!

[MizzouCowboy]

Chelsea couldn't have asked for a better start.

[sovereignstar v2]

Hire Mourinho United. Do it.

[sovereignstar v2]

OptaJoe ✔ @OptaJoe
7 - Manchester United have hit a total of seven shots on target in their last four Premier League home games. Dour.
10:54 AM - 19 Dec 2015

[miami_fan]

Hire Mourinho United. Do it.

But they said Giggs would be the next manager.

Maybe he should go to Salford City with the rest of the Class of 92.

[flere-imsaho]

Well, the Nevilles are managing Valencia, so....

[sovereignstar v2]

Rumor is Ancelotti will be confirmed as Bayern's next manager tomorrow.

[sovereignstar v2]

Pellegrini: "I am sure Pep Guardiola will work here some day. I even hope he will have the opportunity to work at Manchester City too..."

[AlexB]

And it goes on :party:

No-one is quite sure what's going on! Like I said in a post last week I was welling up a little when reading the reports of the Chelsea match, this fella obviously has the same emotions.

Leicester fan cries on BBC radio after Everton win (Audio) | 101 Great Goals (http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/leicester-fan-cries-on-bbc-radio-after-everton-win-audio/)

Magic stuff, top for Christmas, if City and Arsenal draw we'll be four clear and guaranteed another week at the top at least. Unbelievable stuff.

[sovereignstar v2]

Press release: Guardiola not extending stay - Ancelotti named new FCB coach - FC Bayern München AG (https://www.fcbayern.de/en/news/news/2015/press-release-guardiola-not-extending-ancelotti-new-fcb-coach-201215.php)

Pep Guardiola (44) will not extend his contract with FC Bayern München. The German record champions’ new coach from 1 July 2016 will be Carlo Ancelotti. The 56-year-old Italian will receive a three-year contract expiring on 30 June 2019.FC Bayern München chairman Karl-Heinz Rummenigge commented: “We are grateful to Pep Guardiola for everything he has given our club since 2013. I am convinced that Pep and our team will now work even more intensively towards achieving our major sporting goals – especially as it is now confirmed that Pep is to leave FC Bayern.”“Carlo Ancelotti has enjoyed success everywhere as a coach and has won the Champions League three times,” continued Rummenigge. “Carlo is a calm, balanced expert, who knows how to deal with stars and favours a multifaceted style of play – we were looking for this, and we have found it. We are looking forward to working with him.”Carlo Ancelotti commented: “I am very honoured that I will be coach of the great club FC Bayern from next season.”

[Marc Vaughan]

Really impressed with Liverpools post-match interviews, both Klopp and the keeper owned up to things and seemed positive about moving forward ... nice to see, I think they'll come good :)

[Solecismic]

Seems that FIFA has suspended Blatter and Platini from all football-related activities for eight years.

No update on what seems like many months ago when they said the 2018 and 2022 World Cup venue awards would be canceled if there was evidence of bribery.

[miami_fan]

Kind of anti-climatic at this point.

[flere-imsaho]

Seems that FIFA has suspended Blatter and Platini from all football-related activities for eight years.

Well, there'll be an appeal.

No update on what seems like many months ago when they said the 2018 and 2022 World Cup venue awards would be canceled if there was evidence of bribery.

This would require FIFA to have a review process with actual teeth, which seems unlikely.

I very much doubt Russia will lose 2018, but I could still see a path whereby Qatar loses 2022, if only because the major Euro leagues still don't like the timing.

[ISiddiqui]

Seriously way too soon to cancel Russia 2018, also Europe doesn't want a UEFA World Cup to be canceled. They'll be perfectly happy to screw over AFC though.

[The Jackal]

Nice to see Arsenal close that out. And from the postgame, assists this season:

Ozil: 15
Manchester United: 12
Chelsea: 11

[sovereignstar v2]

Probably about as official as it will get before it's actually official.

City Watch ‏@City_Watch 5h5 hours ago
Reliable German sports magazine Kicker 'confirm' Pep Guardiola will coach Manchester City.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CW6mOpwWcAAhsbP.jpg

[miami_fan]

There is something unsettling about Stoke City playing such open football.

[britrock88]

There is something unsettling about Stoke City playing such open football.

Heh. I'm still thinking that it's unsettling for Stoke to give up 3 goals in a match.

[miami_fan]

Rafa out, Zidane in for Real Madrid.

[ISiddiqui]

No shock there. Will be interesting to see where Rafa ends up.

[flere-imsaho]

I'll laugh if it's Chelsea again. :D

Wonder if Zidane will have a longer leash at Madrid due to his history at the club.

[Alf]

Rafa out, Zidane in for Real Madrid.

No shock there. Will be interesting to see where Rafa ends up.

I'll laugh if it's Chelsea again. :D

Wonder if Zidane will have a longer leash at Madrid due to his history at the club.

Zidane is a "soft" power guy. He never was a leader or captain for the french National team, Didier Deschamps (current French National Tranier) and Laurent Blanc (current Paris SG trainer) were . I am intrigued to see how he handles his first coaching experience. Actually, for him, it might be easier to manage stars (and adjust to the pile of egos) than really build tactical options. We will see. But it is definitely a move towards "offense" compared to Rafa "Defense" Benitez.

[Katon]

I'll laugh if it's Chelsea again. :D

Wonder if Zidane will have a longer leash at Madrid due to his history at the club.

I'd be astonished if it was Chelsea - the club needs to replace Mourinho with somebody the fans can get excited about, and Benitez wasn't popular even before doing a C+ job as caretaker.

[ISiddiqui]

Y'all can have Jurgen Klinsmann ;)

[flere-imsaho]

I still can't believe they got rid of Ancelotti. Well, I mean I can - it's Perez & Real Madrid, after all. But there's a guy who's respected and gets along with the star players, figures out how to shove every attacking player Perez buys into a formation that doesn't completely shit the bed defensively, and plays exciting attacking football with said formation.

Best I can tell Perez wants a manager who will:

1. Win La Liga & the UCL each and every year.
2. Play with 6, preferably 7 attack-minded players each game.
3. Crush Barcelona the 6-10 times they play each other each year.

And he'll keep sacking managers until he gets this mythical person.

[flere-imsaho]

I just had an idea....

Guardiola to Man City and... Pellegrini to Man Utd.

:D

[MIJB#19]

I still can't believe they got rid of Ancelotti. Well, I mean I can - it's Perez & Real Madrid, after all. But there's a guy who's respected and gets along with the star players, figures out how to shove every attacking player Perez buys into a formation that doesn't completely shit the bed defensively, and plays exciting attacking football with said formation.

Best I can tell Perez wants a manager who will:

1. Win La Liga & the UCL each and every year.
2. Play with 6, preferably 7 attack-minded players each game.
3. Crush Barcelona the 6-10 times they play each other each year.

And he'll keep sacking managers until he gets this mythical person.I think he's also capable of selling Cristiano Ronaldo because of not scoring enough goals.

[sovereignstar v2]

I just had an idea....

Guardiola to Man City and... Pellegrini to Man Utd.

:D

Probably would've worked out better than LVG.

[bhlloy]

It's really upsetting to me that Vincent Tan is the co-owner of LAFC because this could be something I get seriously into. But I just can't give that utter wankstain any of my money on principle.

[Critch]

It's really upsetting to me that Vincent Tan is the co-owner of LAFC because this could be something I get seriously into. But I just can't give that utter wankstain any of my money on principle.

It's Will Ferrell that puts me off, for much the same reason.

[bulletsponge]

vincent tran? where have i heard that name before?

[whomario]

Yaya Toure upon loosing out to Aubameyang for Africas Footballer of the Year:

Yaya will take care of Yaya and let Africa take care of itself.

He ought to have his own reality show ...

[AlexB]

Pretentious? Moi?

[sovereignstar v2]

He is definitely an odd duck. Always been pretty surprised that he's captain when Kompany is out.

[The Jackal]

Aubemayang is awesome and deserves it.

[whomario]

Anybody checked if there is a relation to Kanye ? :)

[flere-imsaho]

Klopp is potentially perfect for United, however the Liverpool fans will adore him also if he brings any semblance of success to the club and his personally meshes well with the English soccer attitude generally imho.

Read this and thought of your comment here, Marc: The Question: Klopp v Van Gaal … has Manchester United’s manager been left behind? | Jonathan Wilson | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2016/jan/15/jurgen-klopp-louis-van-gaal-manchester-united-liverpool)

[AlexB]

So the Stripey Nigels are looking at signing Adebayor. Not sure that will work well for them, can't imagine him and Pardew getting on at all.

[MrBug708]

I'd imagine it would be for the rest of the season. Hard to really pay for a quality striker during this transfer window without overpaying.

[HomerSimpson98]

Any thoughts about the beatdown FIFA gave the Madrid clubs? That seems rough.

[MIJB#19]

Any thoughts about the beatdown FIFA gave the Madrid clubs? That seems rough.Much deserved and long overdue.

[whomario]

Much deserved and long overdue.

and yet FIFAs argument is still full of holes and the Execution sucks. From what i could gathered, the real victims of the Barca ban were the youth players involved (who were not allowed to play to, what ? Punish the club ?).
And if the rules were well thought out in the first place, they would certainly not prevent Zidanes sons to play for Madrid. 2 transfered when he was playing for Real and the other 2 when he was employed otherwise by Real. The wording in most articles is a bit unclear (if they were investigated and cleared or among the failings leading to the ban), but seems pretty straightforward in any case that there is no reason why they should not be allowed to move even when underaged.

Also i still am a little confused as to how the transfers were approved in the first place and now are disputed under the same rules they were initially approved ?

[MrBug708]

That was an ass kicking.

[MizzouCowboy]

Happy with the 98th minute equalizer, but John Terry may have been just a little offsides. Either way I'm glad to steal a point.

[BYU 14]

Happy with the 98th minute equalizer, but John Terry may have been just a little offsides. Either way I'm glad to steal a point.

I swear Chelsea plays with a horseshoe in their asses sometimes. Can't remember how many of these last moment of stoppage time wins/draws I have seen them pull out over the years.

[sovereignstar v2]

That just might be the difference between getting 10th place or 9th place. Amazing!

[AlexB]

We were awful today, lucky to get a point, but still top until tomorrow

[miami_fan]

Really liked that camera angle from high up above the pitch.

[miami_fan]

Manchester United today remind me so much of Chelsea at the end of last season

[flere-imsaho]

Well, except that Chelsea had already won the league.

[britrock88]

Stoke and Arsenal draw at nil, but a pretty fun match nonetheless.

[flere-imsaho]

LOLOLOL: Manchester United deny meeting with Pep Guardiola in Paris | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jan/22/manchester-united-pep-guardiola-meeting)

[TroyF]

I swear Chelsea plays with a horseshoe in their asses sometimes. Can't remember how many of these last moment of stoppage time wins/draws I have seen them pull out over the years.

This describes pretty much all "great" soccer teams. ManU, Arsenal, City, Real Madrid, Barca. . . They have so much talent and are so far above the teams they face in that area that they wear teams out. When a team is trying to hold on in tne final minutes against these guys, they are exhausted, amped and frightened. They then make a mistake and the talented team pounces.

It is why scoreboard watching is so frustrating when you need one of the big giys to lose.

[flere-imsaho]

See also: Switching to "contain" strategy in FM during the last 5 minutes of a game against superior opposition and letting in a game-winner in the final minute.

[MrBug708]

This Jurgy-Feilhaber war of words is showing what an asshat hypocritic Jurgy is

[ISiddiqui]

This Jurgy-Feilhaber war of words is showing what an asshat hypocritic Jurgy is

Yep.

Also what is with this being "thrilled" about Jordan Morris joining the Sounders when he spurned a European club in doing so (Werder Bremen)? Is he just sucking up to a future (potential) mega-star?

[MIJB#19]

This describes pretty much all "great" soccer teams. ManU, Arsenal, City, Real Madrid, Barca. . . They have so much talent and are so far above the teams they face in that area that they wear teams out. When a team is trying to hold on in tne final minutes against these guys, they are exhausted, amped and frightened. They then make a mistake and the talented team pounces.

It is why scoreboard watching is so frustrating when you need one of the big giys to lose.Perception in the Netherlands is that there's the Eredivisie and there's "Lucky Ajax". It's anecdotal, but they're said to be the team most likely to score a game winning goal in the final minutes.

[sovereignstar v2]

LOLOLOL: Manchester United deny meeting with Pep Guardiola in Paris | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jan/22/manchester-united-pep-guardiola-meeting)

In other words, don't link us with him because it will make us look like we were passed over. Pep just doesn't fit in with our club and we're not interested.

[flere-imsaho]

Nah, I expect it's because they don't want to piss Van Gaal off.

Although I read another rumor that Van Gaal's considering leaving at the end of the season of his own accord.

[Ajaxab]

Liverpool-Norwich. Wow, just wow...

[miami_fan]

Liverpool-Norwich. Wow, just wow...

That was definitely an amazing game. Klopp is going to drive the traditionalists mad with his antics (passion?). ;)

I am beginning to turn on Roberto Martinez as being a good manager. The continuous struggle with defensive tactics is becoming a thing. And I am not even an Everton fan. The excuse of style of play does not hold water either.

[miami_fan]

Might be time to switch over to a La Liga or Bundesliga game.

[TroyF]

Might be time to switch over to a La Liga or Bundesliga game.


I just shut the TV off. Every single Fing time we play that team, they get every break in the universe. It was a red, but Costa wasn't even touched. He dove like he'd been shot and then of course the human scum bag scores.

The fact that it's the single team and player I hate the most in all of sports is what gets me. They are owned by a murdering oligarch. Their ex coach was one of the worst excuses of a human being in the entire sport which is only surpassed by the human piece of garbage that is Diego Costa. Were Arsenal or any team I like to ever sign him, I would cease to become a fan of that organization in about .3 seconds.

I've said all of that and I haven't even mentioned John Terry. Ugh. F my soccer life.

[MizzouCowboy]

^^^
I thoroughly enjoyed the first half.

[rowech]

I just shut the TV off. Every single Fing time we play that team, they get every break in the universe. It was a red, but Costa wasn't even touched. He dove like he'd been shot and then of course the human scum bag scores.

The fact that it's the single team and player I hate the most in all of sports is what gets me. They are owned by a murdering oligarch. Their ex coach was one of the worst excuses of a human being in the entire sport which is only surpassed by the human piece of garbage that is Diego Costa. Were Arsenal or any team I like to ever sign him, I would cease to become a fan of that organization in about .3 seconds.

I've said all of that and I haven't even mentioned John Terry. Ugh. F my soccer life.

At least you don't root for the Bengals too. Between Arsenal-Chelsea and Cincinnati-Pittsburgh, it's just an instant replay. I don't understand the decision to foul 17 minutes into the game. Just give up the goal and fight another day.

[rowech]

That was definitely an amazing game. Klopp is going to drive the traditionalists mad with his antics (passion?). ;)

I am beginning to turn on Roberto Martinez as being a good manager. The continuous struggle with defensive tactics is becoming a thing. And I am not even an Everton fan. The excuse of style of play does not hold water either.

How about the excuse of a washed up keeper?

[miami_fan]

How about the excuse of a washed up keeper?

If you are going to keep putting him out there...

[TroyF]

^^^
I thoroughly enjoyed the first half.

I'm sure you did. Sure you enjoyed the first time too when Arsenal were royally screwed out of the game by the refs and Mourinho defended Costa afterward.

Let me say this, just so everyone is perfectly clear: If Arsenal needed a Chelsea win on the final day so they could avoid relegation, I would still cheer for the team going against Chelsea.

Simply wouldn't matter to me. Human garbage is human garbage.

At least I get to wake up tomorrow and I know my team isn't owned by a murderer. Don't have titles in a long while, but at least I have that going for me.

[MizzouCowboy]

You could have saved a lot of words and just posted. "Waaaah".

[TroyF]

You could have saved a lot of words and just posted. "Waaaah".

Waaaah. (good win and it was deserved today, unlike last time when it was totally undeserved) Enjoy your relegation battle.

[bulletsponge]

I'm sure you did. Sure you enjoyed the first time too when Arsenal were royally screwed out of the game by the refs and Mourinho defended Costa afterward.

Let me say this, just so everyone is perfectly clear: If Arsenal needed a Chelsea win on the final day so they could avoid relegation, I would still cheer for the team going against Chelsea.

Simply wouldn't matter to me. Human garbage is human garbage.

At least I get to wake up tomorrow and I know my team isn't owned by a murderer. Don't have titles in a long while, but at least I have that going for me.


http://xtupload.com/image.php?id=379B_56A52325&jpg (http://xtupload.com/share.php?id=379B_56A52325)


sorry i couldnt resist

[TroyF]

http://xtupload.com/image.php?id=379B_56A52325&jpg (http://xtupload.com/share.php?id=379B_56A52325)


sorry i couldnt resist


Zero offense taken. I about vomited at pictures of Romanowski winning the Super Bowl and he was on my favorite team. So there is no way I could stomach Diego Costa, I don't care how many goals. Add in Abromovich? No, just no.

Then you add in that Arsenal seem to either lose in amazing ways against them or the refs cost us games and it is absolute butthurt. Absolute anger. (and again, the refs didn't cost us the game today, we just found another way to lose. Karma should indicate Chelsea should at some point get screwed out of a win at Arsenal at some point.

I guess I'll just have to enjoy their relegation battle more.

[ISiddiqui]

After losing the Rams, it seems like St. Louis is regrouping around an MLS team:

New plans for MLS stadium near Union Station | kplr11.com (http://kplr11.com/2016/01/25/new-plans-for-mls-stadium-near-union-station/)

A stadium next to Union Station in St. Louis, right on a train line, a mile from Busch Stadium. That's not bad at all. However, who is the ownership group for a St. Louis team... that's always really been the major stumbling block for a team there.

[whomario]

Wow, both Ramires (for 28 mio €) and Guarin (13) go to China while still in their 20s. Gervinho as well.

[ISiddiqui]

Looks like Matt Miazga of the NY Red Bulls (and USMNT, well at least one match anyways) is going to Chelsea (for $5mil):

Matt Miazga set to join Chelsea of the Premier League - ESPN FC (http://www.espnfc.us/new-york-red-bulls/story/2795020/matt-miazga-set-to-join-chelsea-of-the-premier-league)

Hopefully he gets some playing time... but I think that CB is going to be opening up for Chelsea in the next few years ;).

[flere-imsaho]

Oh just do it already: Louis van Gaal’s Manchester United position to be reviewed match by match | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jan/26/louis-van-gaal-manchester-united-position-match-by-match-derby-county)

[bulletsponge]

Guarin goes to china? he was always one of my favorite FM players back when he was still in colombia

[miami_fan]

Oh just do it already: Louis van Gaal’s Manchester United position to be reviewed match by match | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jan/26/louis-van-gaal-manchester-united-position-match-by-match-derby-county)

Are we sure that Ryan Giggs is ready to take over as manager and guarantee a top four spot or is just an Anybody But Louis situation?

[flere-imsaho]

I don't expect they'd appoint Giggs as anything other than a caretaker manager right now.

If they're even remotely smart about this (and I wonder), they'll wait until a more seasoned manager has stabilized United and brought it back to success before moving on to Giggs. Initially, this is why the Van Gaal appointment made sense, since he appeared to be at the end of his career anyway. He'd do 3-5 years, right the ship, and by then Giggs would be ready to take over.

[sovereignstar v2]

*cough* Mourinho *cough*

[bulletsponge]

i remember when LVG would solve all their problems and right the ship

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

The six-time All-Star looks awfully good in KC blue......

https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/12565462_10153930349882042_6556536298057934417_n.jpg?oh=45d6ca068f24722fb507a964a34626fb&oe=5723A1BF

[miami_fan]

Man, what a horrible way to start off a FA Cup Match. Two players injured within a minute.

[whomario]

Should interest some here that (barely) 17 year old american Christian Pulisic just made his Bundesliga Debut for Dortmund as a 68th minute substitute. Was 0:0 at that point, too (ended 2-0 with Aubameyang scoring twice) Couple injuries (and the sale of Hoffmann as well as the cancelled loan of Januzaj) contributed, but he had one heck of a winter camp and has looked outstanding in all his friendly appearances.
Had a few good moments and should definitely get some more oportunities this season, especially since CL qualification will likely be wrapped up pretty soon. There is of course still an outside shot at the league title but in that case thisll mean lots of (early decided) wins maybe ...

Kid has some special talent, uses both feet really well, great acceleration/agility/speed combined with killer technique, first touch and even a decent shot. Kinda like a cross between Reus and Kagawa in terms of playstyle. Hard worker and smart kid, too. Already speaks pretty decent german, which is not an easy feat after about a year here.

[AlexB]

Tottenham reportedly signing the Fulham striker Mousa Dembele... They already have a midfielder called Moussa Dembele, so there will be a new chant at the Lane.

'Two Mousa Dembeles, there's only two Moussa Dembeles...'

[bulletsponge]

and the sale of Hoffmann as well as the cancelled loan of Januzaj

why did they cancel Januzaj's loan? did man u call him back or was he a bust in Dortmund?

[sovereignstar v2]

Barely played at Dortmund.

[whomario]

Barely played at Dortmund.

and when he played, he was a "bust" or at least had very little impact. Very limited tactical understanding and looked pretty lost at times. Of course, being loaned out abroad and to a stacked team was weird to begin with and surely not easy on him. Not to mention he had no preseason with the team to get acclimated to the routes and style of play. Never really made sense for any of the 3 parties (there was apparently no agreed fee for a transfer)

[MIJB#19]

Tottenham reportedly signing the Fulham striker Mousa Dembele... They already have a midfielder called Moussa Dembele, so there will be a new chant at the Lane.

'Two Mousa Dembeles, there's only two Moussa Dembeles...'From a coaching perspective, it's a horrible decision to have two players with the same name on the same team. "Mousa, more pressure on the right back. No, not you, Moussa. I meant the other Mousa!"

[bhlloy]

Given the relative strength of the two squads available this is another shit performance from the US.

[SirFozzie]

I tend to disagree, this was an experimental setup, and we're seeing what works and what doesn't. Iceland may not have their super-A team, but they have some pretty good players.

[bhlloy]

Sorry, an experimental US team with Bradley, Jones, Altidore and Zardes should absolutely destroy an Iceland select team from the Scandinavian leagues. Most of those guys would be struggling to get into an MLS team

[flere-imsaho]

Iceland did beat the Dutch 2-0, and not in a friendly.

Also: Volcano! The incredible rise of Iceland's national football team | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jan/30/volcano-iceland-national-football-team)

[bhlloy]

Go to Wikipedia and look at where the roster came from. I know they all have funny looking names but still. That was a garbage Iceland roster with a 48 year old Gudjonsen, and everyone else came from the Scandinavian leagues. The actual Iceland team plays in other European leagues that don't have a break

[whomario]

These games are glorified scrimmages, can´t read anything out of them. Just as you couldn´t read anything out of (f.e.) the US win over Germany in one such game a while back.

On another note i just realized that AC Milan is starting a 16 year old in Goal for most of the season already. Damn ...

[bhlloy]

These games are glorified scrimmages, can´t read anything out of them. Just as you couldn´t read anything out of (f.e.) the US win over Germany in one such game a while back.

On another note i just realized that AC Milan is starting a 16 year old in Goal for most of the season already. Damn ...

Yeah, he's got a chance to be the Italy keeper for the next 20 years, he's already one of the best goalies in Serie A. The only thing that could possibly derail his career is if he grows too much, he's alread 6'5+ at 16

[flere-imsaho]

Go to Wikipedia and look at where the roster came from.

Wow, didn't realize that. My bad.

[sovereignstar v2]

This is how it feels to be City, this is how it feels to be small...

aka Pep Guardiola is going to be managing City next season.

[HomerSimpson98]

That Vardy goal was ridiculous

[AlexB]

Jamie Vardy's having a party (again) :D

I'd take a point off City at the weekend right now, and then we can afford to lose to Arsenal the game after and worst case be joint top.

Huge result today - pressures off a little bit now for the next two.

[whomario]

Jackson Martinez to Guangzhou Evergrande for 42 mio euros. Holy Shit :o

[Easy Mac]

There's a perverse symmetry with LA announcing the signing of Nigel de Jong the same day Stuart Holden retirees. Hopefully someone can sign him to a one game contact for a game against the Galaxy so he can end de Jong's career.

[sovereignstar v2]

There's a perverse symmetry with LA announcing the signing of Nigel de Jong the same day Stuart Holden retirees. Hopefully someone can sign him to a one game contact for a game against the Galaxy so he can end de Jong's career.

Get a fucking grip. :rolleyes:

[sovereignstar v2]

I'm guessing you know the actual story and are just being ignorant, but for anyone else.

U.S. midfielder Stuart Holden retires from football - ESPN FC (http://www.espnfc.us/united-states/story/2800292/us-midfielder-stuart-holden-retires-from-football)

Holden, 30, was ravaged by injury during his 10-year career, especially during the past six years. Holden suffered a broken leg in a friendly against the Netherlands in early 2010, shortly after leaving Houston and signing with Bolton, but recovered in time to play in that summer's World Cup.

He was one of the best midfielders in the English Premier League during the 2010-11 season, according to the Guardian. But the Scotland-born, Texas-raised Holden was never the same after injuring his knee in a match against Manchester United in March of 2011.

[flere-imsaho]

De Jong is widely accepted as one of the most violent players in European football (at least at the top league levels). I don't understand how anyone can take issue with this.

[Easy Mac]

He played for Man City, ergo, he's a saint.

[ISiddiqui]

Jackson Martinez to Guangzhou Evergrande for 42 mio euros. Holy Shit :o

Chinese league is throwing ridiculous amounts of money around. I read that it is the result of a massive TV contract, where the country's biggest private TV network outbid the state TV company - resulting in a huge inflow of cash.

[whomario]

Chinese league is throwing ridiculous amounts of money around. I read that it is the result of a massive TV contract, where the country's biggest private TV network outbid the state TV company - resulting in a huge inflow of cash.

Many of the teams are also owned by very rich companies, the TV contract is just icing on the cake for those (but obviously huge for some lesser-funded teams).

Its definitely not a novelty effort. Attendance is also steadily rising for the last couple years and is now at over 22k as of last season (which is right around the level of the Serie A, btw), although admittedly most of the stadiums are either old dumps or semi-old non-football stadiums (as in still sporting Tracks around), which i guess will be the next step in adition to increased money flowing into Youth Academies due to the strict Foreign Player Restrictions (domestically as well as for the CFA Champions League) as well as the nature of the Chinese country, still.

[miami_fan]

Jose appears to be heading Manchester United next season. I can't wait to see the free flowing attacking play that he is known for to Old Stafford.

[rowech]

Essentially, Leicster are one win, next Sunday, away from wrapping this up.

[whomario]

Huuuuuuuth :)

[MrBug708]

Palace has been decimated by injuries this year. Such a shame too

[AlexB]

I have 36 years worth of memories supporting Leicester: we've won promotion a fair amount of times, been relegated a fair amount of times, been to Wembley a few times, won a couple of League Cups, played in Europe, beaten most of the big teams every now and again (can't remember beating Arsenal off the top of my head tbh) and I was happy. More than happy.

The Martin O'Neill years in particular were amazing, still one of my favourite memories in when we beat Sunderland and Stan Collymore scored a hattrick before the team started to break up. The losing made the occasional small victory all the more special.

Right now I don't know how to react. It's too surreal. We are right now favourites to win the Premier League. After 25 games. This is not in my frame of reference: I'm confused. Genuinely torn: 13 games is a long time, 39 points, 5 points is not a lot over 13 games. But we keep winning...

I'm beginning to hope. Dare I believe?

[MIJB#19]

I have 36 years worth of memories supporting Leicester: we've won promotion a fair amount of times, been relegated a fair amount of times, been to Wembley a few times, won a couple of League Cups, played in Europe, beaten most of the big teams every now and again (can't remember beating Arsenal off the top of my head tbh) and I was happy. More than happy.

The Martin O'Neill years in particular were amazing, still one of my favourite memories in when we beat Sunderland and Stan Collymore scored a hattrick before the team started to break up. The losing made the occasional small victory all the more special.

Right now I don't know how to react. It's too surreal. We are right now favourites to win the Premier League. After 25 games. This is not in my frame of reference: I'm confused. Genuinely torn: 13 games is a long time, 39 points, 5 points is not a lot over 13 games. But we keep winning...

I'm beginning to hope. Dare I believe?As long as the players keep believing in it, there's a chance it'll happen.

[ISiddiqui]

New MLS rumor... it appears 3 MLS teams are interested in Fernando Torres:

Transfer Watch: Fernando Torres reportedly has offers from three MLS clubs | MLSsoccer.com (http://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2016/02/08/transfer-watch-fernando-torres-reportedly-has-offers-three-mls-clubs?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=referral&utm_content=News&utm_campaign=Unpaid)

Well, he's only 31, has talent, and is out of favor with his club. It wouldn't be a bad pickup at all.

[BYU 14]

Man I wish Aaron Lennon still played for Spurs. I know he has moments of inconsistency and is somewhat injury prone, but when he is healthy and on, it is sheer joy watching him pick apart defenses with his speed and quickness.

Everton should have 3 goals in this match with WBA by now as well.

[MrBug708]

Palace is in the Pardew funk right now. Can't really blame him with the injuries and a refusal by Parish to spend money in the window. Adebayor did manage a goal tbough, which was just the second all year by a striker

[MizzouCowboy]

Foxes never quit but that was one devastating result.

[rowech]

Foxes never quit but that was one devastating result.

The schedule is still very much in their favor having already played Arsenal, Tottenham, and City.

[AlexB]

Gutted. At least we have two weeks to get over it.

Marcin Wasilewski is a cult hero, but not too sure what he was thinking charging into Monreal at the end there.

Ref seemed to have a funny 10 minutes at the start of the second half in terms of bookings, but even though Simpson didn't deserve a red (second one was a booking, first one was never a booking) Drinkwater was lucky not to be sent off a bit later so the pattern of the game would probably have been similar.

Still top though, so could be worse :)

[miami_fan]

Liverpool should be embarrassed to be playing this game with the CPU difficulty level at semi pro.

[MizzouCowboy]

Maybe AV should be relegated to L1.

[sovereignstar v2]

Shocking decision by twattenberg.

[sovereignstar v2]

Daft English referees making sure they make the headlines again.

[kingfc22]

What a game. Thank goodness for DVR's as that 4am start would have been tough to make.

[Landshark44]

Anyone find that PK that Messi took in poor taste?

Lionel Messi Suarez penalty assist kick pk barcelona . In honor of cruyff penalty kick - YouTube (https://youtu.be/eqqSbkGxIzY)

Or am I missing something here?

[bhlloy]

Considering it was very likely a tribute to Cruyff who is battling cancer and the other team has already said they didn't have a problem with it, absolutely not

Why would a legal play be in poor taste anyway?

[Landshark44]

I don't know the Cruyff storyline....

I'm just a casual watcher of international soccer.. But up 3-1 it just seemed a little over the top.. kind of needlessly rubbing it in, it seemed to me... (that's why I'm asking about it)..

But if it's some sort of tribute, I get that... And if the other team didn't have a problem..

[The Jackal]

I don't know the Cruyff storyline....

I'm just a casual watcher of international soccer.. But up 3-1 it just seemed a little over the top.. kind of needlessly rubbing it in, it seemed to me... (that's why I'm asking about it)..

But if it's some sort of tribute, I get that... And if the other team didn't have a problem..

My visceral reaction would have been that it was an unsportsmanlike move for sure

[claphamsa]

teams never hold back in soccer...it was a great display of talent, if anyone could do it they would.

[The Jackal]

teams never hold back in soccer...it was a great display of talent, if anyone could do it they would.

I mean, for sure it's on the defending team for not reacting more quickly - you should technically always be ready for it, like an onsides kick.

[ISiddiqui]

I thought it was quite a fantastic play. Didn't have any notions of it being unsportsmanlike. And it is true that soccer is different - there really aren't many notions of "not pouring it on".

[Katon]

I don't know the Cruyff storyline....

I'm just a casual watcher of international soccer.. But up 3-1 it just seemed a little over the top.. kind of needlessly rubbing it in, it seemed to me... (that's why I'm asking about it)..

But if it's some sort of tribute, I get that... And if the other team didn't have a problem..

Short summary of the Cruyff context: Johan Cruyff was involved in the original version of that penalty as a player back at Ajax, then went on to play a major role in turning Barcelona into its current form both as a player and as the manager of the 91-94 serial champions who won the club's first CL. Copying one of his tricks as a high-profile tribute while he's fighting cancer is a reasonable gesture, the penalty's the easiest one to get on camera in a planned way, and everyone in Spanish football is familiar enough with all of this to read it as a tribute rather than meaningless showboating.

Also, as ISiddiqui says, La Liga doesn't exactly have much of a tradition against Real and Barca rubbing it in.

[whomario]

I mean, for sure it's on the defending team for not reacting more quickly - you should technically always be ready for it, like an onsides kick.

to be fair: Even if you suspect this is coming, there isn´t a damn thing you can do about it by the rules. No one is allowed in the area until the ball is kicked (Suarez was slightly in btw, making this technically ilegal ...), you are not allowed to "box out" a player and unlike an onside kick the attacking teams head start is not mitigated by the ball having to be kicked X yards and in the direction of the other team ;) The only guy who can actively do anything here is the GK and even if he knows it is coming and does not commit to a side (which is literally the only way to save a normal PK, you can´t merely react to a shot), he would not be allowed to move off his line before the ball is kicked, by which point it´d be to late, again due to the running start of the attackers who also have fewer yards to go to reach the ball.

Without the Cruyff connection my verdict would be based on what i always base these things on: Would all the players escape the game unscathed if you´d do this in amateur play with only one referee ? If not, it´s propably rubbing it in. Let me tell you, we would have kicked the living shit out of the other team for the remainder of the game. "Oh, is that you foot i´m stepping on ? Wait, that´s your ribs ? Scuse me, move along now" :)

It´s of course brilliantly executed and of course it does not violate any rules, but you are kidding yourself if you think this is not considered rubbing in. It is also assinine and there is a reason it happens once a decade all over the globe. You are giving up the safest scoring chance in any sport here. That´s like trying to make a 5 yard pass to an open receiver in the NFL but doing a 360 beforehand or deliberately missing a FT to get a chance at a putback dunk.

[AlexB]

to be fair: Even if you suspect this is coming, there isn´t a damn thing you can do about it by the rules. No one is allowed in the area until the ball is kicked (Suarez was slightly in btw, making this technically ilegal ...), you are not allowed to "box out" a player and unlike an onside kick the attacking teams head start is not mitigated by the ball having to be kicked X yards and in the direction of the other team ;) The only guy who can actively do anything here is the GK and even if he knows it is coming and does not commit to a side (which is literally the only way to save a normal PK, you can´t merely react to a shot), he would not be allowed to move off his line before the ball is kicked, by which point it´d be to late, again due to the running start of the attackers who also have fewer yards to go to reach the ball.

Without the Cruyff connection my verdict would be based on what i always base these things on: Would all the players escape the game unscathed if you´d do this in amateur play with only one referee ? If not, it´s propably rubbing it in. Let me tell you, we would have kicked the living shit out of the other team for the remainder of the game. "Oh, is that you foot i´m stepping on ? Wait, that´s your ribs ? Scuse me, move along now" :)

It´s of course brilliantly executed and of course it does not violate any rules, but you are kidding yourself if you think this is not considered rubbing in. It is also assinine and there is a reason it happens once a decade all over the globe. You are giving up the safest scoring chance in any sport here. That´s like trying to make a 5 yard pass to an open receiver in the NFL but doing a 360 beforehand or deliberately missing a FT to get a chance at a putback dunk.

This has saved me a lot of typing. Spot on.

[Critch]

It doesnt always work though, as Arsenal showed a few years ago:

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/_-ajDTudr3c" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Landshark44]

thanks for the context,

much appreciated

[whomario]

Most spectacular Freekick curve ever ?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/9wig_7n6WuQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

This might be more insane than anything Roberto Carlos ever did :eek:

[AlexB]

Sorry, not even a patch on Roberto Carlos's free kick. Much easier to fade a ball when higher and with more air time, and the keeper should be dropped for his 'effort'. I'll even go as far as to say i'm not actually that impressed

[ISiddiqui]

How in the world does Van Gaal still have a job?

[rowech]

How in the world does Van Gaal still have a job?

I just don't see them having a lot of talent. He will take the blame and lose his job but not sure where anybody is seeing that this is a great team.

[flere-imsaho]

In reality, both Woodward & Van Gaal need to lose their jobs. There may not be a lot of talent there, but there's also been 250M (pounds) spent. Many people in the Man Utd hierarchy have made a series of bad decisions and the trend shows no sign of reversing itself.

It's clear now that the only thing keeping Man Utd from becoming the EPL's version of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers was, in fact, Sir Alex.

[ISiddiqui]

I just don't see them having a lot of talent.

Isn't that partially his fault?

[bhlloy]

A team with Mata, Martial, Blind, Herrera and Memphis should still be absolutely rolling teams like Sunderland and Mityjilland. I don't buy the argument he doesn't have enough talent. Plus as noted, he's hardly not had money to spend.

[sovereignstar v2]

Keeping it classy.

https://www.facebook.com/bewarmers/videos/917527965024312/

And what goes around comes around.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CbiUXmHVIAA-cy7.jpg

[flere-imsaho]

How in the world does Van Gaal still have a job?

My guess is that it's a combination of a) no obvious top-tier replacement available who isn't Jose Mourinho and b) a power struggle amongst the directors over a potential path forward.

On the first, the question is who is reasonably available who would be a clear upgrade (as opposed to a chance)? Candidates:

Mourinho - but Ferguson, Gill and Charlton are on record as not being fans, and I'm sure other parts of the hierarchy are, too. That would have to be overcome, but who would spend the political capital to overcome it?

Simeone - rebuffed likely Chelsea overtures (though discussions could still be going on, though - again - he was very clear publicly), plus there's the issue of his part in one of the club's heroes' worst moments (though for England, not ManU).

Pellegrini - well, he's available. Has a good record of success at various stops in his career but a) can ManU bring themselves to take a City castoff and b) does Pellegrini even want to work/stay in England after May?

Brendan Rodgers - he's also available, but does ManU take a Liverpool castoff?

There are others, and if ManU had the clout as a destination that it once did (and bear in mind that ownership plays into managers' decisions) you could be looking at other folks like Conte & Pochettino, but these days you have to wonder if they could be landed, given the mess.


On the latter issue (from way above), there's speculation that the Ferguson faction on the board is pushing for Giggs while the, I don't know, "conservative" faction merely wants anyone who can guarantee regular UCL football. I, personally, would hate to see Giggs become full-time manager at the end of this season, as I expect he isn't ready yet, and it would be painful to see a club legend slowly crater. It's not an easy job - look at Gary Neville in Valencia, for instance.


It's easy to think that, eventually, ManU will be OK because of their huge revenues. But what people (especially, IMO, Woodward & the Glazers) forget is that ManU became a worldwide phenomenon not only because of the titles, but because of the style of play. A style of play that's being dismantled by Van Gaal and certainly wouldn't be returned by Mourinho. A few more years of UCL struggles (or no UCL), and ManU's commercial success starts to recede.

[ISiddiqui]

Though, I'd imagine that winning a trophy or two would be an easier path to a return to 'phenomenon'-ness than playing a more attractive attacking style. The style can follow after the titles. Of course management did really silly things to the style by going after Moyes and then Van Gaal - Mourinho, ironically enough, may play a more attractive style than those two ;).

[flere-imsaho]

In reality, both Woodward & Van Gaal need to lose their jobs. There may not be a lot of talent there, but there's also been 250M (pounds) spent. Many people in the Man Utd hierarchy have made a series of bad decisions and the trend shows no sign of reversing itself.

To wit, after Ferguson's retirement, going into 2013, you could have (barring injuries) started something like this:

GKs: De Gea, Lindegaard
Fullbacks: Rafael, Evra, Buttner
Centerbacks: Vidic, Ferdinand, Smalling, Jones, Evans
Central Midfielders: Giggs, Carrick, Cleverley, Fletcher, Kagawa, Januzaj
Wide Midfielders: Young, Nani, Valencia
Strikers: Van Persie, Rooney, Welbeck, Hernandez

Yes, it needed a significant overhaul, but then again 250M+ was available to spend. Consider:

GK: De Gea
RB: Debuchy (signed in 2014 for roughly 12M)
CB: Jones/Smalling
CB: Seamus Coleman (worth 15M now, presumably less in 2013)
LB: Blind (13.8M)
DM: Carrick
DM: Schneiderlin (24M)
AM: Kagawa
AM: Januzaj
AM: Mata (37M)
S: Rooney

That's an outlay of 102M. With the "leftover" 150M+, plus coming off of an EPL title, one could conceivably gone after players like Hummels (~30M), Gotze (31M), Benatia (11M), Strootman (15M), Christian Eriksen (11.5M), Navas (15M), Pedro (20M), Vidal (37M), Fabregas (33M)

[flere-imsaho]

Though, I'd imagine that winning a trophy or two would be an easier path to a return to 'phenomenon'-ness than playing a more attractive attacking style. The style can follow after the titles.

IMO, at the club level a coherent style, correctly implemented as well as suited for the club in question, is a key prerequisite for success, barring outliers such as having more money than the rest of the league (PSG, Bayern, Celtic).

[ISiddiqui]

I think that's a bit too simple. I mean while Chelsea and Man City had an infusion of cash, they didn't win by simply having more money than everyone else in England (& if it was just money, Liverpool would be doing much better than they are).

[AlexB]

To wit, after Ferguson's retirement, going into 2013, you could have (barring injuries) started something like this:

GKs: De Gea, Lindegaard
Fullbacks: Rafael, Evra, Buttner
Centerbacks: Vidic, Ferdinand, Smalling, Jones, Evans
Central Midfielders: Giggs, Carrick, Cleverley, Fletcher, Kagawa, Januzaj
Wide Midfielders: Young, Nani, Valencia
Strikers: Van Persie, Rooney, Welbeck, Hernandez

Yes, it needed a significant overhaul, but then again 250M+ was available to spend. Consider:

GK: De Gea
RB: Debuchy (signed in 2014 for roughly 12M)
CB: Jones/Smalling
CB: Seamus Coleman (worth 15M now, presumably less in 2013)
LB: Blind (13.8M)
DM: Carrick
DM: Schneiderlin (24M)
AM: Kagawa
AM: Januzaj
AM: Mata (37M)
S: Rooney

That's an outlay of 102M. With the "leftover" 150M+, plus coming off of an EPL title, one could conceivably gone after players like Hummels (~30M), Gotze (31M), Benatia (11M), Strootman (15M), Christian Eriksen (11.5M), Navas (15M), Pedro (20M), Vidal (37M), Fabregas (33M)

Debuchy is not top tier (the only offer he had in the window was from Villa which tells its own story), and Coleman is a right back and only a right back (a very good one, but can never play CB).

Kagawa failed at MU - never looked close to the part.

I don't get Schneiderlin - don't see what he does to affect a game.

Hummels is considered too slow to do well in England, Navas and Pedro have been average at best since they have arrived.

No-one thought di Maria was a bad signing at the time, overpriced admittedly, but most thought he was a really good player and just the inspiration that MU needed - just didn't work with van Gaal's restrictive management..

[flere-imsaho]

I think that's a bit too simple. I mean while Chelsea and Man City had an infusion of cash, they didn't win by simply having more money than everyone else in England (& if it was just money, Liverpool would be doing much better than they are).

I don't think we're disagreeing? I said outliers like PSG or Bayern, who can simply outspend their domestic competition and win. That's not the case in England.

Debuchy is not top tier (the only offer he had in the window was from Villa which tells its own story), and Coleman is a right back and only a right back (a very good one, but can never play CB).

My point was just an exercise. The money could have been spent many other ways, presumably more successfully.

[ISiddiqui]

I don't think we're disagreeing? I said outliers like PSG or Bayern, who can simply outspend their domestic competition and win. That's not the case in England.

Yeah, but you don't really need a coherent style either. I mean does Mourinho even have a coherent style from season to season?

[flere-imsaho]

Yeah, but you don't really need a coherent style either. I mean does Mourinho even have a coherent style from season to season?

Yep.

Formation wise he morphed from a 4-3-3 to a 4-2-3-1 between his first and second times at Chelsea, but the style of play remained the same in that:

1. Primarily compact and counter away from home with the four most forward players doing the majority of the attacking.

2. Higher line with pressing at home, with more license for fullbacks and centre mids to attack.

3. Wide midfielders drift inside to attack while the fullbacks fill into their positions to provide width. On defense, wide midfielders expected to retreat to help with defense.

4. At least one holding midfielder, usually paired with a deep-lying, more creative midfielder or a more active "runner". The former more at home, the latter more away.

5. A hard-working, bullying centre forward who creates chaos for the highly technical wide midfielders to exploit on attack.

[bhlloy]

Yeah, I was going to say that the Mourinho template is probably the greatest example of what you are talking about. Main reason that he never fit in at Real despite not getting terrible results. He absolutely has a way he wants to play.

Van Gaals style just doesn't fit the premiership. He's had some bad luck with injuries but ultimately the way he wants to play just isn't a good fit

[flere-imsaho]

Yeah, specifically the problem with Mourinho at Real* was that his system really only has roles for 4 primarily attack-minded players (which Perez won't condone, he wants 6+) and even then he still wants them to contribute on defense (which Ronaldo simply won't do).

*Well, the other problem** was that he has this persistent need to create conspiracies and in so doing and involving Casillas as the focus of his ire, he lost the team.

**Well, and the other, other problem is that he was operating against a historically good Barcelona team.

[ISiddiqui]

Mourinho may have tendencies, but plenty of players have mentioned that he changes his tactics depending on who he is playing, and it can be a completely different gameplan from week to week. And, of course, a lot has been said about last season where Chelsea in the 1st half of the season were a completely different squad from Chelsea in the 2nd half (they went from an attack focused team scoring tons of goals to a heavily counterattacking squad that was more that content to go 1-0).

In essence, a coherent style is overrated. Managers that are able to adapt is where it is at, and that is the opposite of Van Gaal.

For example:

Jose Mourinho's tactical adaptability, nuance make Chelsea a contender | SI.com (http://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2015/02/04/chelsea-jose-mourinho-tactics)
Chelsea’s pragmatism personifies manager José Mourinho’s ability as a master of preparation. He sees style of play situationally and according to the opponent.

The video in this link shows it as well (how Mourinho switches systems on the fly reacting to what is going on in the match and the opponent):
Pat Nevin analysis: Why Jose Mourinho is 'the Radical One' - BBC Sport (http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/25380991)

Though, regardless, if you are saying a team needs a coherent style and Van Gaal's defensive style doesn't fit the attacking style of Sir Alex and that's an issue holding them back, I'm sure that you'd agree that Chelsea under Ancelotti played differently than they did with Mourinho (the first time) and that wasn't a barrier to success.

[SirFozzie]

We have a soccer version of "I will not accept a banning".

Leverkusen against Dortmund halted after manager refuses to accept red card | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/feb/21/bayer-leverkusen-borussia-dortmund-match-suspended)

[flere-imsaho]

In essence, a coherent style is overrated. Managers that are able to adapt is where it is at, and that is the opposite of Van Gaal.

You're missing my point. In the article you quote, the point is made that Mourinho's system has some fundamentals, especially in how they build defensively, that remain the same from game to game. Maybe "coherent style" is the wrong phrase, and "system" is the correct word. Most good managers have a coherent system around which the team is built, but that can, yes, also be flexible in application depending on factors such as the opponent, the needs of the match (i.e. protecting a lead from the away leg), the weather, the players' condition, etc....

I outlined the fundamentals of Mourinho's system that have largely stayed the same (and coherent) over the years, even as elements of it have morphed, such as pushing a player like Oscar into the AM strata to work as an advanced destroyer.

Basically tactical adaptability can and should be part of a good, coherent system.


Though, regardless, if you are saying a team needs a coherent style and Van Gaal's defensive style doesn't fit the attacking style of Sir Alex and that's an issue holding them back,

What I'm saying is that you don't take a high-energy, attack-minded system, especially one that had been in place for almost 27 years, and replace it with a defensive-focused system that aimed to opportunistically nick goals (Moyes) and then a hyper-possession-focused system (Van Gaal), all the while turning over most of the players while also not necessarily bringing in players fit for either of the replacement systems and expect it to work.

I'm sure that you'd agree that Chelsea under Ancelotti played differently than they did with Mourinho (the first time) and that wasn't a barrier to success.

Not to cop out but Ancelotti, to me, is one of those outlier managers who's just really good at taking the players he's given and creating a system for them. Good international managers (i.e. of national teams) also tend to need to be this way. I give him a ton of credit, for instance, for finding a system that would work at Madrid where he was more-or-less required to play 6 attack-minded players each and every game.

[Easy Mac]

How about 17 year old American Christian Pulisic getting the starting nod for Dortmund today. Can't say that a lot of Americans have started for one of the best 5 teams in the world, let alone at 17. Tim Howard starting a few games for Man U might be the only other instance I can think of.

[SirFozzie]

When you play FIFA and you have the cheat codes...

beIN SPORTS USA on Twitter: "GOOOOOAL!!
Bend it like @22mosalah! A brace for Egyptian! 4-0 for @ASRomaEN. #SerieA https://t.co/6qmNJlBlBZ" (https://twitter.com/beINSPORTSUSA/status/701514823041810432)

[kingfc22]

Ended up with some great games to see live at Levi's for the Copa. US/Columbia, Argentina/Chile, Uruguay/Jamaica and a QTR final.

[miami_fan]

2016 COPA AMERICA CENTENARIO GROUPS
GROUP TEAMS
A United States (A1), Colombia (A2), Costa Rica (A3), Paraguay (A4)
B Brazil (B1), Ecuador (B2), Haiti (B3), Peru (B4)
C Mexico (C1), Uruguay (C2), Jamaica (C3) Veneuzuela (C4)
D Argentina (D1), Chile (D2), Panama (D3), Bolivia (D4)

[bhlloy]

Brutal group for the US. Other than avoiding Chile, they probably got the toughest team in each pot.

[whomario]

Bayern up 2:0 at Juventus with 70% posession, playing without a real CB. They are starting Alaba and Kimmich, a 21 year old 5´9 player who played 2nd division up until last summer. It´s basically the equivalent of the Warriors small ball lineup. Not that Pep has much choice (all CBs out injured), but it´s still impressive.

Hah, as i type this Juventus gets onje back, 1:2 Dybala.

[BishopMVP]

Ended up with some great games to see live at Levi's for the Copa. US/Columbia, Argentina/Chile, Uruguay/Jamaica and a QTR final.Yeah, that's a murderer's row. Chile/Bolivia and Brasil/Peru (and a QTR) at Foxboro don't quite hold the same appeal.

[cartman]

I guess LvG got them really horny

[SirFozzie]

Well, you know those 18 year olds.

[SirFozzie]

Big night for England, they may have just done enough to keep them ahead of Italy on coefficient (to keep the fourth Champions League Spot)

[ISiddiqui]

Seems like USSoccer is backing Prince Ali for FIFA's President Vote tomorrow. Prince Ali appears to be running a distant 3rd, but he seems more preferable to Sheikh Salman (running 1st, and most troubling) or Infantino. I'd like to see UEFA and Infantino offer support for Ali after the first round of voting (mostly because even though Infantino will ask Ali to drop out - a lot of Ali's supporters in Asia or Africa may decide to go for Sheikh Salman instead - the US's 2nd choice is definitely Infantino, I'd think).

[SirFozzie]

Yikes. I don't think it could've gotten much tougher for England in the Round of 16 draw for the Europa League

Tottenham vs Dortmund
Liverpool vs ManYoo

[cartman]

The guy with one of the great names in the sports world, Tokyo Sexwale, announced at the end of his candidate's speech for FIFA president that he no longer was going to run for the position. Interesting timing considering the voting was going to occur after the speeches.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-soccer-fifa-sexwale-idUSKCN0VZ1OF

[ISiddiqui]

The reforms passed overwhelmingly (22 voted no... weirdos).

And just in, Gianni Infantino is the new President of FIFA... so the Presidency stays in Switzerland (but a bit cleaner part of it) ;).

[bhlloy]

Allegedly, considering he comes from the next village over

[miami_fan]

Great to see Sir Alex back on the bench and having the team in attack mode again.;)

[Sublime 2]

Spurs keep pace with a come from behind 2-1 win, making it 6 straight in the Barclays. Loving this young team!

[Young Drachma]

Fucking Swansea. A good effort until they just stopped. Can't expect the keeper to stop everything forever.

[law90026]

That was a spectacularly bad Arsenal performance. Choking again.

[sovereignstar v2]

English refs missing obvious penalties in cup finals. Nothing new here.

[kingfc22]

That was a spectacularly bad Arsenal performance. Choking again.

I would much rather of had us play our B-team against Barcalona as there was no way we were going to beat them in the Champions League and have the #1 squad as rested as possible for this Man U game since the league is something we have an actual shot at. Not sure it would have made a difference, but ya never know.

[law90026]

I would much rather of had us play our B-team against Barcalona as there was no way we were going to beat them in the Champions League and have the #1 squad as rested as possible for this Man U game since the league is something we have an actual shot at. Not sure it would have made a difference, but ya never know.

Probably not since the team last night was so missing in terms of ideas and passion. It was pretty much the first team and the Barca loss should have pushed them to do better, not just roll over and die.

[bhlloy]

Wenger has to be done after this season if he can't deliver the title. I'm a big fan and he's still a good manager but to not be able to go on and win it from here with 2.5 of the big 4 completely out of it would just be more validation that he can't win the big one and he's not longer among the elite.

[AlexB]

I was saying earlier today that I think Wenger is encouraged to walk by Arsenal after this season regardless: if they win the league it's a glorious end to a fantastic spell; if either us or Spurs win it shows exactly what you've just said.

Regardless, Arsenal won't win the league next year under Wenger: Man City, Utd, Chelsea will all be spending mega-bucks, maybe Liverpool too, maybe Everton as well, while Spurs and Leicester might be able to use this as a platform.

Wenger just won't spend as much as the big boys so will lose out on the top talent, and doesn't seem to scout as well any more compared to Spurs or us so loses out on that side too: he even poached the wrong scout from us :D

[cartman]

I'm a little underwhelmed by the new US soccer crest.

https://usatsbi.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/us-soccer-crest-2016.jpeg?w=1000&h=500

[Marc Vaughan]

I'll never understand the people who rabble rouse for Wenger leaving Arsenal - he does a fantastic job there and yes he's not won the league for a long time, but he keeps them in contention and their supporters BELIEVING they should be winning the league consistently year after year ... despite not actually spending money hugely ...

Yes it'd be lovely if they did win the league etc. ... but honestly do you expect the Arsenal board to suddenly transform into spendthrifts if another manager takes charge? ... all I envision is a slow decline for the team until they're bought out by a mogul who turns them into a replica of Chelsea/Man City etc. ... if that comes in time and they don't turn into Leeds ...

PS - I'm REALLY pleased to see Leicester topping the Premiership and proving that soccer is still a game where money alone doesn't determine results :)

[flere-imsaho]

In the Premier League era, the following teams have won the league: Manchester United, Blackburn Rovers, Arsenal, Chelsea, Manchester City.

Also in that time frame, the following teams have finished 2nd or 3rd (if not listed above): Aston Villa, Norwich City, Nottingham Forest, Liverpool, Newcastle United, Leeds United.


In the OMG MONEY era (following Abramovich's purchase of Chelsea in 2003), the following teams have won the league: Arsenal, Manchester United, Manchester City, Chelsea.

Also in that time frame, the following teams have finished 2nd or 3rd (if not listed above): Liverpool


Of the basically 5 consistently realistic contenders (being generous to Liverpool here), 2 have mogul owners and 1 is a commercial juggernaut. The fact that Wenger has kept Arsenal highly competitive among those 3 (and done considerably better than Liverpool) is a testament to his skill. As Marc points out, unless they a) turn into a commercial juggernaut like Manchester United or b) get bought by a mogul, they're always going to be at a disadvantage to City & Chelsea.

[bhlloy]

Isn't the point that none of those teams are going to win it this year and Arsenal still look like they aren't going to able to deliver a title? It's also quite debatable whether he doesn't have the money to spend or if he chooses not to spend because he has his favorites. There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that they would be points clear if he'd found a more consistent goal scorer than Giroud, as an example

Like I said I'm a huge fan of Wenger. I was at Highbury in 98 when they beat Wimbledon 5-0 and they were on another planet. I'd never seen anything like it and he was miles ahead of the curve. That being said, he should be delivering a title this year. If he fails to do it I don't see how that isn't the end of the road.

[rowech]

Isn't the point that none of those teams are going to win it this year and Arsenal still look like they aren't going to able to deliver a title? It's also quite debatable whether he doesn't have the money to spend or if he chooses not to spend because he has his favorites. There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that they would be points clear if he'd found a more consistent goal scorer than Giroud, as an example

Like I said I'm a huge fan of Wenger. I was at Highbury in 98 when they beat Wimbledon 5-0 and they were on another planet. I'd never seen anything like it and he was miles ahead of the curve. That being said, he should be delivering a title this year. If he fails to do it I don't see how that isn't the end of the road.

Exactly. They beat Leicester twice and will still lose the title to them. That's a major problem.

[Marc Vaughan]

That being said, he should be delivering a title this year. If he fails to do it I don't see how that isn't the end of the road.

If you look at the two teams in pole position at present - Leicester have had a near idyllic season, very few injuries and a team which works hard and is very well organised along with a striker who has hit a rich run of form. To me this season is the equivalent of Greece when they won the European Championship - I can't see it being repeated in a hurry, but I'll be ecstatic if they pull it off.

With regards to Spurs they've been gambling somewhat that they WILL achieve this level of success for a while now, its been partially hidden by some very successful sales (Bale for instance) - but their spending is sixth highest in the league over the last five seasons. They will either make the leap up or risk the chance of becoming the new Leeds at some point if they continue their current spending pattern.

[flere-imsaho]

This is what happens when journalists have too much time on their hands: José Mourinho and Louis van Gaal could work at Manchester United together | Barney Ronay | Football | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2016/mar/01/jose-mourinho-louis-van-gaal-manchester-united-together)

[flere-imsaho]

If you look at the two teams in pole position at present - Leicester have had a near idyllic season, very few injuries and a team which works hard and is very well organised along with a striker who has hit a rich run of form. To me this season is the equivalent of Greece when they won the European Championship - I can't see it being repeated in a hurry, but I'll be ecstatic if they pull it off.

When I looked at the history from 1992 to compose my post above, I was going to posit that to win teams either needed money or "lightning in a bottle" (or both) and was going to find other examples to add to Leicester.

But there aren't any, arguably since 1992, but definitely since 2003.

I mean, yes, some small sides have had great runs in the EPL, but not all the way to title contention like Leicester.

[flere-imsaho]

Isn't the point that none of those teams are going to win it this year and Arsenal still look like they aren't going to able to deliver a title?

In the last 10 seasons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Arsenal_F.C._seasons), Arsenal have finished 3rd or 4th each year. In the 8 seasons before that, it was 1st or 2nd each year.

As you point out, despite some outlier point totals (such as finishing 3rd in 07/08 with 83 points), the main difference between the two "eras" is the slotting of Chelsea & Man City above them due to money.

I did some math on the current table and, not looking specifically at their remaining matchups, Arsenal are on track to finish the season on 72 points, consistent with their performance pretty much since Wenger took charge. They may still end up third even though their usual challengers (Chelsea, Man Utd, Man City) are having off years, mainly because Tottenham & Leicester are having "lightning in a bottle" years.

So, OK.

There's certainly an argument to be made that this was Arsenal's year, given the (relative) faltering of the other Big 3. But I think there's a stronger argument to be made that Arsenal are simply unlucky in that The Faltering was combined with two breakout teams.

It is what it is, essentially. More fertile, from a discussion standpoint, is this:

It's also quite debatable whether he doesn't have the money to spend or if he chooses not to spend because he has his favorites. There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that they would be points clear if he'd found a more consistent goal scorer than Giroud, as an example.

I'll admit I don't follow Arsenal all that closely, so I can't say how much money Wenger is leaving on the table, regarding players. This is probably an argument I can back, however.

[Marc Vaughan]

I mean, yes, some small sides have had great runs in the EPL, but not all the way to title contention like Leicester.
There are next to none in 'Premiership' history but there are quite a few in the years before the formation of that, Norwich and Ipswich being the teams which I recall most vividly ...

Norwich in 86/87 had been promoted from Division 2 (the equivalent of the Championship at that time) and finished 5th in the top division after flirting with the title at around this point in the season if I remember right.

Ipswich between 79-82 came 3rd and second twice, including winning the EUFA Cup.

I'll admit I don't follow Arsenal all that closely, so I can't say how much money Wenger is leaving on the table, regarding players. This is probably an argument I can back, however.
This is impossible for anyone to know really - Wenger has always spent fairly frugally and developed potential where possible, but whether thats purely by his own choice I have no idea ... I do hugely respect his performance as a manager and the fact that he sticks to his tactical principles even when in the short term they might sometimes falter.

[whomario]

For an international perspective, Leicester actually reminds me a little of Dortmunds rebirth-run with 2 championships. Somewhat similar playstyle and also roster makup IMO. The biggest suprise champion in Germany has been Kaiserslautern though (1998)

They won it straight after promotion with a somewhat aging squad.

Had a few things going for them though. They had vast experience in their roster and several big time internationals who stayed after relagation(which would not happen nowadays). They had 2 members of the runner-up Czech National Team of 1996 (Pavel Kuka and Miroslav Kadlec), Ciriaco Sforza (who also had stints with Bayern Munich and Inter Milan) a couple former or current (at the time) German NT players and a young Michael Ballack in a supporting role. Heck more than half the rotation players finished 2nd and won the cup in 1996.

Also, the godfather of surprise-championships himself as coach, Otto "Greece actually won a European Championship, i am not kidding here" Rehagel

[SirFozzie]

Just think, this could have been YOUR division 1 league in america. Eight Colored Zones on the field (with players limited to the zones they could be in), two goalmouths on either side.. The scary thing isn't that someone pitched this to the US Soccer Federation and it got a positive response. The scary thing is that this got a positive response from FIFA.

Three points for a goal? League 1 America: the soccer revolution that never was | Football | The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2016/mar/02/league-1-america-soccer-revolution-never-was?CMP=share_btn_tw)

[law90026]

The issue with Wenger is that you get the same shit every season. A lot of talk, a little run to make people think they are for real and then the wheels falling off when the pressure hits.

With a new manager, it's possible things could go wrong. But it's also possible things go right.

Quite frankly, Wenger's repeated insistence on bringing out the 4th place trophy whenever he is attacked shows how low the standards are.

[Easy Mac]

Just think, this could have been YOUR division 1 league in america. Eight Colored Zones on the field (with players limited to the zones they could be in), two goalmouths on either side.. The scary thing isn't that someone pitched this to the US Soccer Federation and it got a positive response. The scary thing is that this got a positive response from FIFA.

Three points for a goal? League 1 America: the soccer revolution that never was | Football | The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2016/mar/02/league-1-america-soccer-revolution-never-was?CMP=share_btn_tw)

Paglia’s work began to pick up attention in the summer of 1993. Whether fans would later decide that the ProZone was a bastardization or an improvement on conventional soccer, League 1 America’s proposals did grab the attention of Fifa, who invited Paglia to their headquarters in Switzerland to discuss his vision, in September 1993. On his return, Paglia, who had been told by Fifa officials not to discuss the meeting, was greeted by calls from reporters who had been tipped off (some reports since have suggested that this was an attempt by Fifa to hurry the USSF into making decision.)

This had no chance and there was no mention of positive responses from anyone.

[Marc Vaughan]

Quite frankly, Wenger's repeated insistence on bringing out the 4th place trophy whenever he is attacked shows how low the standards are.

LOL :D

So a manager who manages to achieve a continuously high placing in one of the most competitive soccer leagues in the world with a budget a fraction of the clubs competing against him isn't good enough? ... :confused:

Who do you think would do better in his place with the same budgets available?

[chesapeake]

LOL :D

So a manager who manages to achieve a continuously high placing in one of the most competitive soccer leagues in the world with a budget a fraction of the clubs competing against him isn't good enough? ... :confused:


Ultimately, it isn't enough if he cannot close the deal in a season like this one, where the stars have aligned so that teams richer that yours have tripped up. His budget for this season was certainly bigger than the $10 million he spent. I grant you, it was a well-spent $10 million. Cech has been great. But the side has obvious weaknesses that it had identified and was only able to fill one of them.

Now, with Leicester's draw yesterday and Spurs coming up this weekend, Arsenal have the opportunity to change the narrative dramatically. Wenger's coaching for his legacy.

[SirFozzie]

Does anybody want to win the Premier League? Anyone?

[kingfc22]

Seriously??? :rant::rant::rant:

Hey Arsene, when the door opens, you're supposed to go through it. Not run into the wall that is supporting it.

[chesapeake]

Losing to the ManU U21s and then at home to a team battling relegation with your season on the line? Really?!!

[bhlloy]

LOL :D

So a manager who manages to achieve a continuously high placing in one of the most competitive soccer leagues in the world with a budget a fraction of the clubs competing against him isn't good enough? ... :confused:

Who do you think would do better in his place with the same budgets available?

In the spending table over the last five years Arsenal are fifth and have been the fourth most successful (I'm assuming) team. He's hardly pulling off a Herculean feat or winning while having to sell his best players. He's outperforming Liverpool - fine, but hardly first ballot HOF material.

Also today's result. Oops, but sadly not surprising