How would you rate FOF8 now?

[Kodos]

Now that the game has been out for a while, how would you rate it? (Poll to come.)

[Subby]

1 star for the mandatory playbook and having to enter FTP credentials a minimum of twice per MP team.

[A-Husker-4-Life]

9 star, I love the new gameplanning and I'm starting to understand the defensive side of the ball. The no playing time was a problem in the beginning but now I've understood what Jim was going for so now I like it better.

Can't wait for the next patch and TCY2..

[Ben E Lou]

I think it's a 7.5ish for me right now and could go as high as 9.5 for me with another patch or two. Jim would have to shock me by getting rid of those rollover popups for it to get a 10, though. Even if the game itself works perfectly, having to masterfully manipulate the mouse through the menu minefield makes me melancholy.

[Kodos]

After sitting on the fence for a while, I read enough negative things to remain on the sidelines until TCY2 comes out.

[yabanci]

9 star, I love the new gameplanning and I'm starting to understand the defensive side of the ball. The no playing time was a problem in the beginning but now I've understood what Jim was going for so now I like it better.

Can't wait for the next patch and TCY2..

This sums it up for me as well. At this point I give it 7 with +2 after the patch.

One sign I like it so much is I bought FM17 over the holidays but won't load it up. I did that after FOF7 and never came back. I want to get deep into FOF8.

[Hammer]

Despite my negative comments my rating could jump from a 6 to a 9. I would want to see the defense actually doing something in TC. Offense made less time consuming, without losing the great new features. Big ask maybe. A few little minor things cleared up, a little polishing. Above all defense needs the TLC offense has been given. Right now you can't write a defense that responds to down and defense situations like you could in FOF7.

[SocratesJC]

Despite my negative comments my rating could jump from a 6 to a 9. I would want to see the defense actually doing something in TC. Offense made less time consuming, without losing the great new features. Big ask maybe. A few little minor things cleared up, a little polishing. Above all defense needs the TLC offense has been given. Right now you can't write a defense that responds to down and defense situations like you could in FOF7.

Giving the defense the same depth as the present offense and my rating goes up 4 points.

I bought the game, played the SP (single-player) preseason, and refuse to start playing through the regular season until something is done to fix the defense.

[chinaski]

Have to go with 5 for now. The UI, the game plan screen etc is just such a mess, I cant go much higher until that changes. But if not, oh well, I can live. Still the best (accurate) football sim out there.

[AlexB]

I gave it a 4: UI is much worse than FOF7, no substitutions of players when tired or in blowout situations, game plan/depth chart control is a mess.

Tried again for a couple of evenings, and then played a bit of FOF7 to compare, and came to the conclusion that I plain don't like the new game as is, although having two player cards open at the same time is very nice, and the history generator would be good too I'm sure.

Even some of the better aspects (penalties attributed to players, +/- ratings on each play, etc) are essentially cosmetic right now, as they're not collated on the player cards, and as thus become meaningless in evaluating players at the end of the season, in FA, etc.

Very disappointed in current state, and although there are some good ideas, i sense a change in direction from Jim that means that many of the aspects that I consider to be issues are programmed as such and likely working as intended.

[Hammer]

Interesting post Alex. 4 seems harsh as the game does still have a lot to offer, perhaps we have been spoilt. We are still here afterall, which says something.

You bring up some interesting points though. The word "cosmetic" was well choosen I think. The flaws in the game don't inspire confidence that everything is working under the hood. Traditionally there have been a lot of things in the game that are cosmetic, or close to it. Creating an illusion of depth. At least in my opinion. For example some bars are worthless in comparison with others.

For this reason I would like to see more specific guides as to what playing a player with low endurance regardless does. The same with weight too. Tiredness, rust, red flags. It all just sat there in FOF7, what did it really do. Is there any point in designing your own plays?

Is it all cosmetic, or worthwhile?

[AlexB]

The rationale for 4 was:

6 is the benchmark: if it's better than FOF7 it would get higher than 6, worse than FOF7 less than 6.

Initial thoughts were that it was a 5 as IMO FOF7 is better, but decided I really didn't like it for the reasons above, and with that and the UI, it deserved a further point drop.

But at the same time it's not a car wreck or anything, so no worse than a 4

[Hammer]

Fair enough. I had FOF7 as an 8. I think it was real solid. FOF8 has some improvements but more weaknesses for me. It could hop right over FOF7 but I also have it comfortably behind right now.

[ezlee2]

I gave it a 5 with the idea it could jump up to a 7 or 8 with a few updates. I really hate the new layout as it seems like you need to take 2-3 steps to get to things that you could do with one click. That being said, I do like having multiple screens open at the same time and I think the game planning is a great leap forward to give GMs control. I agree with Hammer about the lack of control on the defensive side. Lastly, I was hoping for a tweak in how the game handles the coaches. I hate the staff draft as it really doesn't give enough control over your staff. This is a major flaw IMO as the staff are more crucial than ever. I miss the old days of where you could fight for coaches against the other teams just like UFA.

[Ned Doolittle]

I like the staff draft as it rewards/punishes the GM side of running a team with fiscal responsibility.

[TAFIV]

I hate the staff draft as it really doesn't give enough control over your staff. This is a major flaw IMO as the staff are more crucial than ever. I miss the old days of where you could fight for coaches against the other teams just like UFA.

the only way i see that working is if you had a staff salary cap as well, with there being no cap then you could just take whoever you wanted

[Abe Sargent]

It's a 6 for me. As a Gm-only guy with no desire to be a coach, it's more fiddly in that area than I'd prefer, and feels like as tep back from 7 for someone who doesn;t care for, or want, teh coaching side fo things.

[Gallifrey]

Only playable on one PC, the rollover popups keep it from functioning on other laptops/PCs with Win 7 so I really didn't have a rating. I travel too much to really spend any time on it.

[QuikSand]

It's a 6 for me. As a Gm-only guy with no desire to be a coach, it's more fiddly in that area than I'd prefer, and feels like as tep back from 7 for someone who doesn;t care for, or want, teh coaching side fo things.

I'm interested in this. What do you mean by that? I assume in FOF7 you would just set the switches to have the staff reset the gameplan each week. Now I assume you'd do the same with both the playbook and gameplan. How do you feel that you have lost ground?

Not attacking, I'm genuinely curious.

[NawlinsFan]

This was intended as a response to QS below, sorry, quate didn't attach.

One part that stands out for me is having to adjust my 46 active player roster. Functioning solely as a GM the coaching staff should do this but the game forces you to do it for the staff.

[Sweed]

I give it a 7. My only gripe is still having to leave my best players totally out of packages as a way to rest them. I don't understand the thought process of that decision. Let me put them in all packages and have the game sub them out when they are tired.

No matter how much fun I have with fof8 this is always in the back of my mind. I could gameplan around the issue on offense by removing plays using the package I choose to leave my stars out of and make the game work the way I want but I shouldn't have to. But defense the package is dictated by the offensive set which leaves my defense hitting the field without my best player against at least one package.

If this is changed in a patch my rating goes to 8-9.

[Young Drachma]

I'm interested in this. What do you mean by that? I assume in FOF7 you would just set the switches to have the staff reset the gameplan each week. Now I assume you'd do the same with both the playbook and gameplan. How do you feel that you have lost ground?

Not attacking, I'm genuinely curious.

It's just frustrating if you want to play GM only, you can't delegate to the staff at all, you have to manage depth charts and deal with the active roster and injuries and stuff. It's just very tedious if you don't care about any of that an want to sim forward.

Makes the game a slog.

[henry296]

It's just frustrating if you want to play GM only, you can't delegate to the staff at all, you have to manage depth charts and deal with the active roster and injuries and stuff. It's just very tedious if you don't care about any of that an want to sim forward.

Makes the game a slog.

I'm confused. On the Single Player Options you can get Game Plan, Depth Chart and Playbook to AI control Are you saying those aren't effective?

[AlexB]

One example: even when delegating depth charts to AI control, you have to select the 46 active players - surely this should be part of the AI running the depth charts?

FOF8 just seems very muddled to me, to the point where I've deleted it, restarted an FOF7 career and really enjoying it - literally the only thing I'm missing is having multiple player cards open at one time. And I would quite like to run a few seasons history which was a cool feature of FOF8

Literally everything else is, for me, either the same or superior with FOF7 (with the caveat I've always left gameplanning to the AI)

[perez24]

6. Don't like the playcalling.

[Ned Doolittle]

Fun game but it looks like crap. But the stats and game results are Uber realistic so you gotta take the good with the bad.

[Ben E Lou]

One example: even when delegating depth charts to AI control, you have to select the 46 active players - surely this should be part of the AI running the depth charts?You should turn on the automatic signing option during the season if that's your issue. It handles the active roster piece.

[AlexB]

You should turn on the automatic signing option during the season if that's your issue. It handles the active roster piece.

Thanks Ben - that does solve the active/inactive issue.

However that in itself was something I discovered trying to work around my main gripe, which is the depth charts and substitutions.

I figured if I could use Rex to run the 53 players + IR that I give him, I might get some enjoyment out of just being the GM. But if I set the AI to sign FA players too, that takes away half of the GM role as well, leaving me just to draft and watch basically. And that's not enough to get or keep me hooked.

The active/inactive thing might be linked to letting the AI sign players in FOF7 too, but as I like the depth charts and substitutions in that game, I enjoy fully managing the roster and only ignoring game planning. You can't do this in FOF8 without using the formation screens, which I dislike intensely (I understand others like it, YMMV, etc)

[Ben E Lou]

But if I set the AI to sign FA players too, that takes away half of the GM role as well, leaving me just to draft and watch basically. That's why I only turn it on during the season. It takes care of those inconsequential pickups of some 32/32 FA to be your third TE when your #2 guy gets a 3-week Out injury. That's nowhere near "half the GM role" to me. When I play SP with injuries on, I just turn on that setting after the preseason, and turn it off once the season is over. It's really great at shielding me from the mundane stuff that I don't want to do.

[AlexB]

That's why I only turn it on during the season. It takes care of those inconsequential pickups of some 32/32 FA to be your third TE when your #2 guy gets a 3-week Out injury. That's nowhere near "half the GM role" to me. When I play SP with injuries on, I just turn on that setting after the preseason, and turn it off once the season is over. It's really great at shielding me from the mundane stuff that I don't want to do.

Fair play - I enjoy trying to find a little diamond in the rough in those situations. From reading your posts over the years, I get the impression that a season can take minutes, at the most, once you hit week 1 of the regular season - it takes me 3-4 separate sessions for a season.

Everyone plays the game differently, enjoys different aspects. What works for me isn't for you, and vice versa. It's a shame FOF8 doesn't work for me, but looking at the scores it works for most. No worries: it's reinvigorated my love for FOF7 so its not all bad!

The other thing that probably is worth mentioning is FOF7 is the nth generation of that platform, so is pretty fine tuned - FOF8 is pretty new and relatively untested in comparison. That's why I keep looking at the form, for news of a patch that might address some of my issues, at which point I'll give the game another crack.