2017-2018 College Basketball Thread

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

I'm never around, but this should definitely be a reason to start a thread on this board. I have little doubt this will lead to a renewal of the rivalry on an annual, regular-season basis. The two head coaches were the ones that hatched this idea.

Mizzou, KU discussing exhibition basketball game | The Kansas City Star (http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/article178506671.html)

[MrBug708]

While it's cool to see it back again, it probably won't be much of a game

[Logan]

UNC skates.

[molson]

Pretty simple blueprint to make sure athletes don't need to know how to read to be able to play. Fake no-show classes that don't require work don't violate NCAA rules as long as you offer them to all students.

We knew sports were the most important thing at these schools, but it's still always kind of surprising how much even academically "prestigious" schools like UNC are totally cool with whoring out the academics and devaluing that side of things for everyone in the name of sports.

Edit: And it's kind of sad they picked the African-American studies department to be the centerpiece of these fake academic programs. What a great message for the students. They present it as a real department with real professors and a real curriculum. But the athletic department and, I guess, the academic leaders at the university and in that department, collaborate to make sure it's true purpose is to ultimately assist in exploiting young people (many of whom happen to be African-American) for their athletic talent so they can make big bucks, and all they have to give up in exchange is no-show degrees, and of course, the academic integrity of the school. Imagine a sincere student studying African-American studies in that department having his degree tainted by all this.

[bronconick]

Next week, UNC will force the NCAA to call themselves "Reek".

[molson]

And how can the NCAA and these schools continue to justify not paying the players on the ground that they are "student athletes" while at the same time collaborating and legitimizing these elaborate fake degree programs that are intended to ensure that the athletes do not actually have to be students?

[digamma]

#twobidivy

[Logan]

And how can the NCAA and these schools continue to justify not paying the players on the ground that they are "student athletes"

I mean they haven't actually been able to justify this for years, but that hasn't and won't stop them from trying.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Reading more about the ruling, it actually makes a perverse amount of sense.

Basically, the NCAA doesn't have a rule against a member institution providing a shitty sham education. A member just can't provide one solely for athletes or for athletic purposes.

[Ksyrup]

I'm sure they'll spin that into some sort of non-discrimination policy. Equal access and opportunity to get educational credit you don't deserve!

[Arles]

NCAA:
You fly a kid home to see a family member's funeral inseason - that player is ineligible and you have to vacate wins if he plays.

You offer sham classes to allow a kid to stay eligible without studying, you get our endorsement!

[CU Tiger]

Reading more about the ruling, it actually makes a perverse amount of sense.

Basically, the NCAA doesn't have a rule against a member institution providing a shitty sham education. A member just can't provide one solely for athletes or for athletic purposes.


I still want the full class rosters revealed.
I dont buy that it was truly open for everyone.
I suspect you will see athletes and privileged students only.

[panerd]

While it's cool to see it back again, it probably won't be much of a game

Because it's an exhibition or because you think KU will wallop Mizzou? Mizzou could actually be borderline top 25 this season and even in their down years generally play KU well. They have the best record against them in the big 8/big 12 one of the better records of any team. (Still under .500 but pretty much everyone is)

[tarcone]

Mizzou is at least a sweet 16 team. Probable elite 8.

They will give Kentucky a run for their money (pun intended) this year.

[MrBug708]

Because it's an exhibition or because you think KU will wallop Mizzou? Mizzou could actually be borderline top 25 this season and even in their down years generally play KU well. They have the best record against them in the big 8/big 12 one of the better records of any team. (Still under .500 but pretty much everyone is)

Because KU is a world better. Prior records don't mean much in the slightest

[JonInMiddleGA]

I still want the full class rosters revealed.
I dont buy that it was truly open for everyone.
I suspect you will see athletes and privileged students only.

The sheer numbers of those involved seem to suggest that it was the course program that was the joke rather than being invented for athletes. And that's a too politically correct issue to touch most likely.

[JPhillips]

I still want the full class rosters revealed.
I dont buy that it was truly open for everyone.
I suspect you will see athletes and privileged students only.

Maybe you can release athletic student rosters, but FERPA wouldn't ever let you make public a full class roster.

[britrock88]

Edit: And it's kind of sad they picked the African-American studies department to be the centerpiece of these fake academic programs. What a great message for the students. They present it as a real department with real professors and a real curriculum. But the athletic department and, I guess, the academic leaders at the university and in that department, collaborate to make sure it's true purpose is to ultimately assist in exploiting young people (many of whom happen to be African-American) for their athletic talent so they can make big bucks, and all they have to give up in exchange is no-show degrees, and of course, the academic integrity of the school. Imagine a sincere student studying African-American studies in that department having his degree tainted by all this.

The issue here is the "they." The narrative I understand to describe the classes involved the department secretary deciding to help kids (yes, student-athletes) out by having her department chair establish and "administer" these courses while she did the "work" of grading "papers." It was only after this was established that athletic department academic advisors caught on and recommended the classes to student-athletes. All along, enrollment in these courses was available on the same basis to athletes and non-athletes alike, and a majority of the enrollments were non-athletes (a lot of fraternity brothers, purportedly--interesting because they're required to maintain minimum average GPAs for chapters to be recognized as official campus organizations at UNC).

The whole thing sucked. UNC deservedly got put on probation by its accreditor--it could have been worse had the scheme not already been discovered and ended (via the retirement/resignation of the secretary and chair and enactment of new policies meant to limit the use of independent study classes these were classified as). Student-athletes did benefit disproportionately (35-45% of enrollments, ~5% of the student body)... but it wasn't an exclusive benefit. There's the loophole.

[Buccaneer]

During my days as a graduate RA/TA at UNC in the mid-1980s, the preferable treatments given to athletes were obvious, sought after (i.e., geography was a jock major) and bragged about by some professors because of their rooting interest. This includes basically handing MJ a degree from my department and automatic A's to athletes if they just showed up regularly (which was Dean Smith's and AD Swofford's policy). But..I have to admit that preferable treatment did extend to at least two other grad students, one was a retired millionaire and the other was a high-ranking Army officer scheduled to teach at West Point once he was done. At least they worked for their grades but prestige and alumni donations were really all that mattered, which was the deal with MJ (he got a degree that he promised his mom and the department got the $$$).

[dawgfan]

Yeah, as much as it looked ridiculous for UNC to skate on this one, it was really the only way they could rule on it given that it wasn't strictly for athletes. The proper punishment is what has already happened, which is folks devaluing the prestige of a degree from UNC.

On a different note, it's going to be interesting to see if Washington was wrapped up in the AAU/sneaker-company/etc issue. Lorenzo Romar has generally been considered a "clean" coach, and in fact insiders always claimed that he missed on some guys because he wasn't willing to delve into that cesspool. But the struggles he had his last few years with the Huskies could have provided the motivation to hold his nose and dive in, and I'm sure it looks awfully suspicious to outsiders that he landed Markelle Fultz.

[Kodos]

Sounds like Archie Miller is closing in on commitments from top 10 players Romeo Langford and Darius Garland. Here's hoping that Christmas comes early for the Hoosiers!

[CrescentMoonie]

North Carolina Tar Heels guard Joel Berry breaks hand after punching door (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/21154348/north-carolina-tar-heels-guard-joel-berry-breaks-hand-punching-door)

[mauchow]

Wisconsins young squad beat the Porter boys and Missouri tonight in a closed scrimmage.

[tarcone]

Wisconsins young squad beat the Porter boys and Missouri tonight in a closed scrimmage.


Tjhats good for the B1G Mizzou is a swet 16 team at least

[mauchow]

Tjhats good for the B1G Mizzou is a swet 16 team at least

:devil:

Dude, I had to pick from the Badgers/Iowa game or Badgers/Michigan game. I really hope the Hawkeyes don't end the Badgers dream of the CFB playoffs...I chose the Michigan matchup in anticipation of it being a College Game day location along w a night game.

[pbot]

Hoping Penn State wins enough that Pat Chambers doesn't get fired. Not because I think he's a great coach or anything but they are finally starting to pull some talented kids out of Philly, and hopefully he finally has things trending upward (in year six). Probably needs an NIT berth to save his job.

[tarcone]

:devil:

Dude, I had to pick from the Badgers/Iowa game or Badgers/Michigan game. I really hope the Hawkeyes don't end the Badgers dream of the CFB playoffs...I chose the Michigan matchup in anticipation of it being a College Game day location along w a night game.

Probably more offense.

This one could be a 10-6 affair

[digamma]

Has anyone here been to Rupp Arena as a visiting fan and if so, is the upper deck there as bad as I seem to be reading elsewhere online?

[panerd]

Has anyone here been to Rupp Arena as a visiting fan and if so, is the upper deck there as bad as I seem to be reading elsewhere online?

Depends on your purpose. Is it as good a view, as comfortable a seat, as the more modern arenas? Definitely not. But if you there for the atmosphere and "history" then absolutely. I have also been to games at Nebraska, Wrigley, and Allen Fieldhouse and would say the same answer for all three. (I've heard Fenway is maybe the worst of all) None of them compare to the amenities/comfort that a modern stadium like Cowboy's Stadium or the new Atlanta staidum offer but I wasn't at any of them for that purpose.

[digamma]

Maybe I wasn't as specific. The threads I've read say it is worth it to spend up for lower level seats because the upper deck at Rupp isn't very friendly to visitors.

[MrBug708]

DeAndre Ayton is going to be the first pick of the draft, over Marvin Bagley

[panerd]

Maybe I wasn't as specific. The threads I've read say it is worth it to spend up for lower level seats because the upper deck at Rupp isn't very friendly to visitors.

Ah I think I see. Do you mean hostile fans? What is your school? I went as a Mizzou fan (when we were actually decent a few years back) and didn't catch any more flack than I have playing against Illinois, at Kansas, or at Oklahoma. I guess if you are a Louisville fan or something it may get more shady but I don't think UK has any more or any less moron fans than any other fanbase.

[Logan]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">BREAKING: UCLA frosh LiAngelo Ball, Cody Riley &amp; Jalen Hill arrested for shoplifting in China, sources told ESPN. Bruins play Ga Tech Friday <a href="https://t.co/k64IDyO81E">https://t.co/k64IDyO81E</a></p>&mdash; Jeff Goodman (@GoodmanESPN) <a href="https://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN/status/927997664750460928?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 7, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[MrBug708]

Lavar may literally disown Gelo over this.

[tarcone]

Holy crap! I think it would be really bad to get arrested in China.

On another note, Iowa is being under rated. ranked #52 by SI and to finish 9th in the B1G by the B1G media.

We will be much better than that. I cannot wait for this season.

[cartman]

LiAngelo is already leading UCLA in steals.

[JonInMiddleGA]

LiAngelo is already leading UCLA in steals.

Hi-yooooooooo

[MrBug708]

Police: "What were you trying to steal?"

LiAngelo Ball: *Looks away*

*One tear rolls down cheek*

*Whispers*

"Attention"

[Chief Rum]

I hope his lawyer plays better defense than he does.

[CrescentMoonie]

These 3 could be stuck in China for months.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-ucla-china/ucla-basketball-players-arrested-in-china-could-stay-for-months-espn-idUSKBN1D83A9?utm_campaign=trueAnthem%3A+Trending+Content&utm_content=5a03b7d104d3017f8acaa7e1&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=facebook

[tarcone]

Iowa signs Joe Weiskamp out of Muscatine Iowa and CJ Frederick from Cincinnati.

Great gets for Iowa.

[MizzouRah]

I'm never around, but this should definitely be a reason to start a thread on this board. I have little doubt this will lead to a renewal of the rivalry on an annual, regular-season basis. The two head coaches were the ones that hatched this idea.

Mizzou, KU discussing exhibition basketball game | The Kansas City Star (http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/article178506671.html)

Good to see you back!

First time I've been excited for MIZ BBALL in a LONG time!!! Excited for tomorrow! MIZ!!!

[MrBug708]

UCLA no longer leads the nation in steals

[Chief Rum]

It is hilarious that one of the primary sponsors of UCLA's (now infamous) trip to China goes by the acronym FUSC.

[cartman]

Went to the Longhorns opening night game, and they were a lot better than I was expecting. They scored 62 in the first half, and there were 7 games last year where they never made it to 60 for the entire game. Bamba looks to be the real deal.

[stevew]

If Ball gets banned from China, I'm not sure what other professional League he can play in

[MrBug708]

Pretty sure Gelo probably doesnt have professional basketball in his future anyways

[mauchow]

Badgers get Xavier on Thursday for our first test of the year for our young squad.

[Kodos]

Sounds like Archie Miller is closing in on commitments from top 10 players Romeo Langford and Darius Garland. Here's hoping that Christmas comes early for the Hoosiers!

Uh oh. The grinch had his way, and Garland is going to Vanderbilt.

Darius Garland commits to play with Vanderbilt Commodores (http://www.espn.com/college-sports/recruiting/basketball/mens/story/_/id/21400490/darius-garland-commits-play-vanderbilt-commodores)

Also, looks like there will be a lot of growing pains for IU this year as Archie Miller implements his system. But hopefully we'll see the team progress as the season unfolds. Good year to pick Iowa in the Iowa-Indiana series. Tarcone will be happy!

[jbergey22]

Nice little early season matchup between Minnesota and Providence tonight. Both were tourny teams last season with numerous starters back. Looks like Providence will be playing without one of their better forwards tonight.

[MrBug708]

Super Trump saves the UCLA basketball players.

Trump owes China a favor for doing what they were going to do next week

Pick your title

[Butter]

At the Charleston Classic this weekend to watch Clemson and Dayton.

We are about 7 rows up behind the Clemson bench on the aisle. I'm the lone red shirt in among the Clemson fans.

[MizzouRah]

What a butt whoopin by Utah!

[panerd]

What a butt whoopin by Utah!

My Tennessee friends tried warning me. I still think this team is young and without Porter Jr. obviously but a few of my Mizzou friends with final four dreams in their minds are about to see the ceiling of a fantastic recruiter when he isn't really that great of a coach. (See Martin UT, Martin Cal, Romar Washington, Romar SLU...)

[mauchow]

Wisconsin looked young last night but had a lead w a few minutes to go. With two minutes to go the game was tied and then Xaviers experience and Wisconsin inexperience showed up. Wisconsin legitimately looks to be an 8-10 seed this year (unlike last year). Lots of ups and downs for them this year.

[MizzouRah]

My Tennessee friends tried warning me. I still think this team is young and without Porter Jr. obviously but a few of my Mizzou friends with final four dreams in their minds are about to see the ceiling of a fantastic recruiter when he isn't really that great of a coach. (See Martin UT, Martin Cal, Romar Washington, Romar SLU...)

I agree we are very young and it's really early and Utah is no slouch. Now, we are not even close to the bigs yet like Kentucky.. but I think this team will really grow this year.. unlike the past few seasons. Having a healthy Porter Jr. will also help a TON.

[Edward64]

Dad's a great role model. What an ass.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/18/politics/lavar-ball-donald-trump/index.html
LaVar Ball told ESPN he was happy to have his son back, and also seemed to downplay his alleged crime.

"As long as my boy's back here, I'm fine," he said. "I'm happy with how things were handled. A lot of people like to say a lot of things that they thought happened over there. Like I told him, 'They try to make a big deal out of nothing sometimes.' I'm from L.A. I've seen a lot worse things happen than a guy taking some glasses."

All three players have been suspended from the UCLA basketball team indefinitely.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Dad's a great role model. What an ass.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/18/politics/lavar-ball-donald-trump/index.html


What's a little thievery, right?

Dad is an utter garbage excuse for a human being ... but we already knew that.
And I seriously doubt the apples are falling far from the tree.

[tarcone]

Gee, I wonder why his son was stealing?

[MrBug708]

Dad's a great role model. What an ass.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/18/politics/lavar-ball-donald-trump/index.html

What better way to get into the news but to call out the president of the United States and get him going in a twitter feud.

[CraigSca]

How is Bucknell 0-4?

[CrescentMoonie]

Who the hell is Don Coleman and why is he scoring 30+ in 3 of the first 4 games for Cal?

[Atocep]

Well the Michael Porter era at Mizzou lasted 2 minutes.

[Logan]

Well the Michael Porter era at Mizzou lasted 2 minutes.

At least he can now focus on finals.

[tarcone]

Iowa showing its youth )I hope). Lose to Louisiana-Lafayette and then South Dakots State in the Cayman Island Classic.

Not looking good for the home team.

[MrBug708]

Well the Michael Porter era at Mizzou lasted 2 minutes.

Wasn't the the sole purpose of hiring Martin? Oof

[dawgfan]

Wasn't the the sole purpose of hiring Martin? Oof
Plus they have to carry Porter Sr. on the staff for another season too.

[Young Drachma]

The brother that reclassified isn't bad and got a bit of run, I guess he'll move up the seating chart.

[panerd]

Yeah this team will still double/triple last years win total but porter jr was the big hual. Kind of a look at what next year was going to look like after porter left for the NBA a year early. Some mizzou fans delusionally think porter jr will return next year. Hoping for NCAA but at least we are winning games. Already a 37.5% of the way to last seasons win total!

[hoopsguy]

"We Are Mizzou" Music Video - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vMfqosdDbY)

[sovereignstar v2]

Alabama just had their entire bench get ejected in the 2nd half for leaving the bench during an altercation on the floor. Nice work, Avery!

Edit: One of the five players left has 4 fouls with 13 minutes to go.

[sovereignstar v2]

And that dude just fouled out. 4 players for 'Bama with 11:37 left.

Edit: Bama player hurt, down to 3 with 10:28 left.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I thought, in the absence of five players, players who foul out are left in the game but any personal fouls against them also count as technical fouls?

[sovereignstar v2]

So hilarious, two Gophers just shadow Alabama's best player, Sexton, on defense. He is just gassed.

[tarcone]

Why does Alabama have so few players? I know its a football school, but doesnt the basketball program get any money?

[sovereignstar v2]

Wow, the Gophers have been terrible since they got the 2 man advantage.

[tarcone]

Outscoring minny 24-16 3 on 5

[JonInMiddleGA]

Bama cut a 14 point lead down to 4, while shorthanded.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Why does Alabama have so few players? I know its a football school, but doesnt the basketball program get any money?

Read back up the thread: the entire bench was ejected for entering the court during a fight.

[sovereignstar v2]

Bama cut a 14 point lead down to 4, while shorthanded.

Don't think Pitino had any idea of what to tell his players to do.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Don't think Pitino had any idea of what to tell his players to do.

Well whatever he did, I'd advise against it if the situation ever arises again.

[jbergey22]

Outscoring minny 24-16 3 on 5

Bama cut a 14 point lead down to 4, while shorthanded.

So Alabama had 3 players on the court and the Gophers(a top 25 team) got outscored? Seriously, how did the Gophers not score every time and how did Alabama even put up points? Very strange.

[JonInMiddleGA]

So Alabama had 3 players on the court and the Gophers(a top 25 team) got outscored? Seriously, how did the Gophers not score every time and how did Alabama even put up points? Very strange.

Maybe this will help

@franfraschilla
Alabama only down 7 with 4 to go. Might be a Collin Sexton movie in the works if he pulls this off. Minnesota has been going through the motions.

Sexton would finish with 38 points


“We don’t practice much 5-on-3 offense.” - Richard Pitino.

I guess that Avery Johnson 1-2 zone is a tough one.

[Atocep]

Is he under the impression Alabama had been practicing 3v5 for that very moment or something?

[CrescentMoonie]

Pretty bad day to be a Bama fan, but probably the best day possible for the basketball team to do that and have it largely ignored.

[Izulde]

Brandon McCoy is amazing. Jordan Johnson shows what a terrific, true point guard does for a team, and Shakur Juiston was on fire all night. Things got scary in the second half, but UNLV pulls away for the 101-82 victory over Southern Utah, and we're now 6-0 on the season.

If you'd told me at the beginning of the year we'd start off looking this incredible, even with all the talent infusion, I've have said you were full of shit. Figured there'd be some chemistry kinks to work out. But nope!

Easily the best team we've had since the Tark era.

[Atocep]

Bob Huggins coached his ass off tonight.

[Logan]

Yikes

Former St. John's basketball walk-on arrested after serial killings (http://thecomeback.com/ncaa/former-st-johns-basketball-walk-on-arrested-after-serial-killings.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

[Thomkal]

wow certainly unexpected result there

[jbergey22]

Brandon McCoy is amazing. Jordan Johnson shows what a terrific, true point guard does for a team, and Shakur Juiston was on fire all night. Things got scary in the second half, but UNLV pulls away for the 101-82 victory over Southern Utah, and we're now 6-0 on the season.

If you'd told me at the beginning of the year we'd start off looking this incredible, even with all the talent infusion, I've have said you were full of shit. Figured there'd be some chemistry kinks to work out. But nope!

Easily the best team we've had since the Tark era.

Some of their warts showed up late in the game tonight. They were up 5 with 3-4 minutes left and they started jacking up stupid shots and let UNI come back in win in overtime. Such an obvious talent level disparity so UNI should have lost by 10.

[JonInMiddleGA]

GT loses to Grambling at home 64-63 ... by knocking a loose ball into the basket for Grambling.

Yes, Tech just lost on an own goal #smdh

[bhlloy]

The old 21 point basket? :D

[jbergey22]

GT loses to Grambling at home 64-43 ... by knocking a loose ball into the basket for Grambling.

Yes, Tech just lost on an own goal #smdh

Umm, how does an ACC school lose to Grambling? Josh Pastner wont last long if this happens again.

[Izulde]

Some of their warts showed up late in the game tonight. They were up 5 with 3-4 minutes left and they started jacking up stupid shots and let UNI come back in win in overtime. Such an obvious talent level disparity so UNI should have lost by 10.

Yeah, TBH this is the kind of thing I expected more of this year because so much of the roster is new. That said, I'm not too concerned. After all the blowing out of people they've done, letting a non-conference game get away like this is a good wakeup call.

[jbergey22]

Yeah, TBH this is the kind of thing I expected more of this year because so much of the roster is new. That said, I'm not too concerned. After all the blowing out of people they've done, letting a non-conference game get away like this is a good wakeup call.

They had such an advantage in the post and the guards just didnt have the patience to get it there. It was surprising considering the point guard that used to play at Milwaukee is such a good passer. I like your team this year, and agree when they play together for awhile they should be peaking around tourny time.

[bob]

Umm, how does an ACC school lose to Grambling? Josh Pastner wont last long if this happens again.

We are already paying two other basketball coaches - I can't see Tech firing anyone soon barring major scandal.

[ntndeacon]

Another ACC school has lost to Drake, Ga. Southern, and Liberty. It might be a long spring.

[Kodos]

Iowa visits IU tonight, tarcone. Neither team is setting the world on fire. Hopefully we play better than we did at Michigan on Saturday.

[digamma]

We are already paying two other basketball coaches - I can't see Tech firing anyone soon barring major scandal.

Pastner's doing his best to get there on that front too!

[JonInMiddleGA]

We are already paying two other basketball coaches - I can't see Tech firing anyone soon barring major scandal.

Well, depending upon who you believe in a recent controversy ...

[JonInMiddleGA]

The old 21 point basket? :D

I literally JUST now caught that typo

[stevew]

Breaking news. Cooper Ball withdrawing from UCLA

[JonInMiddleGA]

Breaking news. Cooper Ball withdrawing from UCLA

You mean Liangelo?

(Or am I missing something here?)

[Shkspr]

Breaking news. Cooper Ball withdrawing from UCLA

This should probably go in the 2017-2018 College Rowing thread.

[tarcone]

Iowa and Indiana tonight in the "Has Been" game.

Go Hawks!

[BYU 14]

This should probably go in the 2017-2018 College Rowing thread.

:lol: :lol:

[tarcone]

Oof. Iowa is terrible. We dont play defense and we cant score. Its going to be a long season.

Not a great time to be a Hawkeye fan.

[Arles]

Big win for Arizona against Texas A&M. While Arizona is 6-3, they are 6-0 in the US :D

[Logan]

Rutgers fought hard against Michigan State, but came up short when they just couldn't hit any shots down the stretch. Considering how they beat the hell out of some highly ranked teams recently, I continue to be impressed by the job Pikiell is doing.

[JonInMiddleGA]

3rd straight loss for Florida, this time to Loyola-IL.

Gators loss a close one to Duke, got routed by FSU while shooting just 25% from 3, then shoots only 10.5% tonight (2-for-19).

[dawgfan]

Washington now owns the best win in the Pac-12 this season as they knock-off #2 Kansas, 74-65. Huge win for new coach Mike Hopkins and the Huskies.

[jbergey22]

3rd straight loss for Florida, this time to Loyola-IL.

Gators loss a close one to Duke, got routed by FSU while shooting just 25% from 3, then shoots only 10.5% tonight (2-for-19).

Washington now owns the best win in the Pac-12 this season as they knock-off #2 Kansas, 74-65. Huge win for new coach Mike Hopkins and the Huskies.

Two of the biggest upsets we will see all season. Washington was a 22 point underdog while Loy-Chi was a 17 point underdog. From looking at the game flow chart it looked like Kansas went down at home without even putting up a fight late. Great job by the Huskies.

[Kodos]

LiAngelo Ball's career stat line at UCLA: 0 points, 0 rebounds, 1 steal

[Eaglesfan27]

LiAngelo Ball's career stat line at UCLA: 0 points, 0 rebounds, 1 steal

:D

[Chief Rum]

LiAngelo Ball's career stat line at UCLA: 0 points, 0 rebounds, 1 steal

3 steals. He reportedly stole from all three stores.

[Shkspr]

He's three times the player Kodos thought he was!

[Kodos]

He'll be the steal of the NBA draft!

[mauchow]

Badgers on the verge of missing their first NCAA tournament in nearly 20 years.

The youngsters will need to learn to close out games if we are going to Dance. 6 games with a 3 or less deficit/lead with less than a few minutes to go and Losing all but one.

[dawgfan]

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2017/12/07/dana-altman-oregon-kavell-bigby-williams-investigation

Normally I'd assume Altman would slide, but we're in a new era now. I would imagine there's going to be a lot of pressure on the Oregon campus to take this seriously and consider firing him.

[Thomkal]

Well it had been 24 years since Coastal and South Carolina played each other in basketball due to bad blood after Coastal left SC's university system. but the reunion was well worth it.

Coastal had the lead for 10 of the last 12 minutes, and lead by four with a minute left, but South Carolina would not go down without a final fight, including a blocked dunk. They came back to lead with time running out, but USC transfer Jaylen Shaw nearly was the ironic hero with a 3-pointer that barely missed. Coastal tried to tip that in, but failed. :(

Nonetheless, it was a great return to what hopefully will be a yearly game now (it's scheduled for the next two years at least)

[MrBug708]

Looking like Hurley is going to be the Dukie to replace Coach K. ASU looks really strong right now

[Atocep]

The Big 12 is going to be interesting this year.

[HerRealName]

I thought tarcone would appreciate these tweets.

https://twitter.com/jjones_74/status/949115937688465408

[tarcone]

I thought tarcone would appreciate these tweets.

Jamarco Jones on Twitter: "I know what you mean😒😒😒 https://t.co/ILgrhjHpdA" (https://twitter.com/jjones_74/status/949115937688465408)

Thanks.

I need a little lift suffering through this basketball season after that football season.

[Atocep]

Trae Young is difficult to like on the court. He got his points tonight, but 3-12 from 3 with a career low 5 assists and career high 8 turnovers.

[tarcone]

Man, I just witnessed the worst reffing job I have seen in awhile. Iowa just got jobbed. Not sour grapes, we wouldnt have beaten Maryland. But my lord, it was horrible.
One of our guys took an elbow to the back of the neck on a screen at the top of the 3 point line. Nothing. Phantom calls. Pushing, nothing.

It was brutal.

[cartman]

Andrew Jones, the leading scorer for the Longhorns, was diagnosed with leukemia.

[sovereignstar v2]

Brightest season in a long time for the Gophers, so naturally their returning B1G DPoY is going bye bye due to sexual assault allegations and their 3rd leading scorer could be done as well with a shoulder injury. :banghead:

Edit: Forgot to mention they lost their best bench big before the season even started.

mckerney, what was your favorite 17/18 gophers basketball moment?

[cartman]

Texas gets a big double OT win over #16 TCU in their first game since the Jones announcement

[MrBug708]

How in the world did Fisher miss that layup?!?

[HomerSimpson98]

Anyone catch the DePaul-Providence game tonight on FS1? Both coaches were mic'd up and no commercials. So badass.

[MizzouRah]

HUGE win for the rebuild of the Missouri program!

[miami_fan]

Larry Eustachy is not worth TWO internal investigations.

[cartman]

College GameDay came to Austin for the first time in a while for the Texas-OU game. The Longhorns didn't disappoint, overcoming a 10 point deficit in the 2nd half to win 79-74. They did a good job of keeping Trae Young off balance, holding him to 7 for 22 shooting. He did have 14 assists, but also had 5 turnovers.

[dawgfan]

I never would have expected it this season in his first year on the job, but Mike Hopkins has Washington squarely in the NCAA Tournament picture after their win over Arizona tonight. Check out the ending:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Dominic Green…<br>Not once BUT TWICE TONIGHT! <br><br>This man is ❄️❄️ <a href="https://t.co/x148hQUHgD">pic.twitter.com/x148hQUHgD</a></p>&mdash; NCAA March Madness (@marchmadness) <a href="https://twitter.com/marchmadness/status/960025804599169024?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 4, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Atocep]

Trae Young pulling a Grayson Allen. No call.

<blockquote class="twitter-video" data-lang="en"><p lang="und" dir="ltr"> <a href="https://t.co/uFNerXTsC7">pic.twitter.com/uFNerXTsC7</a></p>&mdash; Ham N' Egger🇺🇸👌🏻 (@NotoriousCWD) <a href="https://twitter.com/NotoriousCWD/status/960725092580974592?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 6, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[JonInMiddleGA]

Time to break up St. John's ... or something.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Michael Porter Jr. said in a news conference today that it's likely that he will play for Mizzou this year. Meeting with doctor next week in hopes that he'll be cleared to play.

****drools****

Mizzou is a 7-9 seed without him. They're a nightmare second round NCAA matchup for the higher seed with him in the lineup.

[MrBug708]

It's like quin Snyder redux

[Young Drachma]

Michael Porter Jr. said in a news conference today that it's likely that he will play for Mizzou this year. Meeting with doctor next week in hopes that he'll be cleared to play.

****drools****

Mizzou is a 7-9 seed without him. They're a nightmare second round NCAA matchup for the higher seed with him in the lineup.

dat draft stock tho

[BishopMVP]

dat draft stock thoYeah, but while many years he'd still be locked in the top 3 I have no clue where his stock is right now. It is undeniable that Ayton, Bagley, Jaren Jackson and Trae Young's stock have only gone up this year, Doncic is still playing well in Europe, and even Mo Bamba (who I'm pretty sour on compared to the others) has had his moments, but unlike some I'm not going to say Porter woud be picked 7th since I think some teams might fall back in love with him during workouts even if he didn't play a minute for Mizzou. There's also the chance to play with his brother for likely the last time, and oh yeah, playing college basketball and in the NCAA tournament might actually be fun too!

I do think it's a mistake for him to say anything publicly before the doctors have cleared him and his return is imminent. Now if he doesn't come back it's "a setback" and he risks the chronic injury/injury prone label, while if he never creates that expectation and the doctors say no it's just "yeah, it's a back injury and he wasn't ready yet." instead of feeling like multiple ones. But a lot of that blame goes to Missouri - I get that there is media curiosity, and you can't do anything if the kid is posting on social media or telling people on campus he'll be back, but why you sticking an injured freshman in front of the media to answer questions at a press conference?

[digamma]

Fun day today in the Ivy League. Harvard and Penn play for first place, which two years ago would have been the only significant game on the slate. Now with the four team tournament every game today has huge implications. Cornell, Yale, Columbia and Brown are all 3-4 and Cornell plays Yale and Columbia plays Brown. Princeton is also 3-4 and plays last place Dartmouth. After today, we'll have at least two teams at 4-4 and two more at 3-5, with Princeton a toggle to join either group.

[tarcone]

I know this isnt college basketball, but thought you guys would enjoy. We had a local girls HS team break a 109 game losing steak a couple days ago. Hadnt won a game since 2012.

[MizzouRah]

Mizzou really needs to work on being able to get the ball in when the other team presses. How can you allow a team go on a 12-0 run at home when you have a 12 point lead with a minute or so left in the game?

We got lucky in OT...

[Young Drachma]

I know this isnt college basketball, but thought you guys would enjoy. We had a local girls HS team break a 109 game losing steak a couple days ago. Hadnt won a game since 2012.

That's an insane losing streak.

[JonInMiddleGA]

That's an insane losing streak.

Eh, we had a football team down here lose 82 straight, narrowly avoiding going a decade without a win. (streak began late in 1990, ended in 1999)

The same school also suffered a 62 game losing streak in boys basketball.

[MrBug708]

Cal Tech basketball

[miami_fan]

What the hell is going on at Colorado State? First Larry Eustachy is suspended and he will be fired at some point. Today, CSU suspended the interim coach Steve Barnes.

[digamma]

Fun day today in the Ivy League. Harvard and Penn play for first place, which two years ago would have been the only significant game on the slate. Now with the four team tournament every game today has huge implications. Cornell, Yale, Columbia and Brown are all 3-4 and Cornell plays Yale and Columbia plays Brown. Princeton is also 3-4 and plays last place Dartmouth. After today, we'll have at least two teams at 4-4 and two more at 3-5, with Princeton a toggle to join either group.

Harvard wins to tie Penn at 7-1 at the top.
Brown and Yale hold serve at home to fill the "if the season ended today" 3 and 4 slots (I *think* Brown would have the tie breaker right now, but it goes down pretty far on the list).
Dartmouth upset a very off Princeton team who now is in a real fight to make the tournament with 4 of its last 6 on the road. Princeton missing the Ivy League tournament would have been an unfathomable thought 9 days ago.
Columbia and Cornell are also at 3-5 with the Tigers.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Hoops corruption case may take down players, coaches, programs (https://sports.yahoo.com/sources-college-hoops-corruption-case-poised-take-hall-fame-coaches-top-programs-lottery-picks-224417174.html)

“This goes a lot deeper in college basketball than four corrupt assistant coaches,” said a source who has been briefed on the details of the case. “When this all comes out, Hall of Fame coaches should be scared, lottery picks won’t be eligible to play and almost half of the 16 teams the NCAA showed on its initial NCAA tournament show this weekend should worry about their appearance being vacated.”

[Kodos]

Was just coming to post that same article. It'll be interesting to watch.

[MrBug708]

UCLA isn't going to escape this round I think

[miami_fan]

“If the NCAA is going to get Andy Miller’s bank records, God bless them, I don’t know what they’re going to do,” said another source with direct knowledge of the situation, chuckling at the thought. “You are better off changing the rules. The crazy part of this business is none of the kids are free.”

I am not sure "crazy" is the word I would use.

[BishopMVP]

Considering the punishment the NCAA gave Penn State & UNC in those huge cases, I'm betting against this being CCNY part 2.

But for fun, let's look at those top 16 teams (https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/bracketiq/2018-02-11/college-basketball-top-16-reveal-what-sundays-rankings-mean) on the list. Auburn & Arizona we know about. I think Kansas is the only other Adidas school on the list. It's borderline profiling, but I just assume Cincinnati, Clemson and Tennessee are dirty. Texas Tech seems like a good candidate - you'd need to pay me to spend college in Lubbock. I assume Duke and UNC are dirty, but I also assume they'll skate on any real punishment. The one school on that list I would be absolutely shocked by is Purdue.

It will also be quite amusing when/if all these high profile schools and coaches are getting busted except Calipari & Kentucky :) If they could actually get things to stick against Boeheim & Kryszewskyi I would love it.

[Butter]

But for fun, let's look at those top 16 teams (https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/bracketiq/2018-02-11/college-basketball-top-16-reveal-what-sundays-rankings-mean) on the list. Auburn & Arizona we know about. I think Kansas is the only other Adidas school on the list. It's borderline profiling, but I just assume Cincinnati, Clemson and Tennessee are dirty.

Clemson? The "hasn't been to the NCAA tournament in 7 years" Clemson? I guess we'll see, but I'd be surprised.

I would go:
Auburn
Kansas
Duke
Michigan St.
UNC
Arizona

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Could be the last straw for Izzo. Can't believe he had the balls to make the comments he has made over the last few months while he's know about this situation since last year.

Michigan State basketball player under criminal investigation for sexual misconduct (http://thecomeback.com/ncaa/michigan-state-basketball-player-criminal-investigation-sexual-misconduct.html)

[Kodos]

Very disappointed in MSU. I'd really grown to like both the football and basketball teams, but that's out the window at this point.

[miami_fan]

Not that I agree with this but doesn't Izzo have to say the things he said to preserve the privacy of the investigation and protect the player?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Clemson? The "hasn't been to the NCAA tournament in 7 years" Clemson? I guess we'll see, but I'd be surprised.

Kinda my thought largely about Tennessee as well. If they spent big bucks, they sure didn't have a lot to show for it.

Bruce was stupid, but the program never felt like it was spending big bucks (hence the need to do sketchy bbq dinners at his house)

[JPhillips]

I don't expect much in the tournament, but Holtzman has done a tremendous job at OSU.

[BishopMVP]

Clemson? The "hasn't been to the NCAA tournament in 7 years" Clemson? I guess we'll see, but I'd be surprised.

I would go:
Auburn
Kansas
Duke
Michigan St.
UNC
ArizonaKinda my thought largely about Tennessee as well. If they spent big bucks, they sure didn't have a lot to show for it.

Bruce was stupid, but the program never felt like it was spending big bucks (hence the need to do sketchy bbq dinners at his house)In both cases it's less the coach or program itself and more what they're surrounded with (SEC(ish) football). A lot of this scandal is less coaches directly paying players and more the parents/uncles/hanger ons around recruits asking for money and getting it from interested parties. Just like when Marcus Camby was getting paid at UMass, it certainly wasn't by us to get him to go there, but we got punished nonetheless.

[Atocep]

Playing at Kansas is always entertaining.

Three throw disparity:

WVU: 2
Kansas: 35

[JonInMiddleGA]

Auburn: nobody will have a worse loss in the conference than us this weekend

Tennessee: hold our beer

[MizzouRah]

Playing at Kansas is always entertaining.

Three throw disparity:

WVU: 2
Kansas: 35

I would have been thrown out as well.

[MizzouRah]

Mizzou can't hit free throws and lose to LSU. Not a good loss.

[Atocep]

I would have been thrown out as well.

Putting last night into perspective:

Kansas was 316th in the country at 16 free throw attempts per game.

WVU was 115th with 20.6

That is the largest free throw disparity Kansas has ever had in a Big 12 game and the largest they've had in over 20 years in any game.

Before last night, WVU had shot 2 free throws or less in a game 1 time since 1906.

It's always bad at Allen Fieldhouse, and that's probably why Kansas has lost in the 1st or 2nd round of the NCAA tournament 8 times in 20 years, but last night was the worst free throw disparity in over 110 years of WVU basketball and the worst ever for Kansas against a major conference opponent.

[MizzouRah]

Putting last night into perspective:

Kansas was 316th in the country at 16 free throw attempts per game.

WVU was 115th with 20.6

That is the largest free throw disparity Kansas has ever had in a Big 12 game and the largest they've had in over 20 years in any game.

Before last night, WVU had shot 2 free throws or less in a game 1 time since 1906.

It's always bad at Allen Fieldhouse, and that's probably why Kansas has lost in the 1st or 2nd round of the NCAA tournament 8 times in 20 years, but last night was the worst free throw disparity in over 110 years of WVU basketball and the worst ever for Kansas against a major conference opponent.

:eek:

[miami_fan]

NCAA denies Louisville's appeal, rules Cardinals must vacate 2013 national title (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/22513517/ncaa-denies-louisville-appeal-rules-cardinals-vacate-2013-national-title)

[Kodos]

NCAA denies Louisville's appeal, rules Cardinals must vacate 2013 national title (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/22513517/ncaa-denies-louisville-appeal-rules-cardinals-vacate-2013-national-title)

Couldn't happen to a nicer team.

[JPhillips]

Has any program punched above its weight longer and more consistently than Xavier?

[Warhammer]

Has any program punched above its weight longer and more consistently than Xavier?

I have always had a soft spot for Xavier for precisely that reason.

[Butter]

Xavier can go fuck themselves.

[Kodos]

Tell us how you really feel!

[Butter]

<========== Note location

[MrBug708]

Gonzaga has been pretty good for a while too

[Butter]

Clemson? The "hasn't been to the NCAA tournament in 7 years" Clemson? I guess we'll see, but I'd be surprised.

I would go:
Auburn
Kansas
Duke
Michigan St.
UNC
Arizona

I said this, then I saw 3 Clemson player names come up in an article yesterday. So. Maybe they were just really bad at it.

[panerd]

Fingers crossed. This team seems to have hit a brick wall this could hopefully give us a shot in the arm for a serious tournament run. Don't know when (or if) he will play but looking more likely!

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2018/02/22/michael-porter-jr-return-missouri-freshman

[MizzouRah]

Fingers crossed. This team seems to have hit a brick wall this could hopefully give us a shot in the arm for a serious tournament run. Don't know when (or if) he will play but looking more likely!

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2018/02/22/michael-porter-jr-return-missouri-freshman

They need 20 wins to make me feel comfortable we would be in.

Getting PJ would definitely give them a shot in the arm!

[Kodos]

Hoops corruption case docs list players involved, payment amounts (https://sports.yahoo.com/exclusive-federal-documents-detail-sweeping-potential-ncaa-violations-involving-high-profile-players-schools-103338484.html)

[cartman]

Hoops corruption case docs list players involved, payment amounts (https://sports.yahoo.com/exclusive-federal-documents-detail-sweeping-potential-ncaa-violations-involving-high-profile-players-schools-103338484.html)

Looks like Texas got caught in the net. Current player Eric Davis, Jr. got $1,500 from ASM, and former player Prince Ibeh met with associates of ASM.

[Kodos]

Yep. A lot of schools involved.

[murrayyyyy]

The NCAA Says Student-Athletes Shouldn’t Be Paid Because the 13th Amendment Allows Unpaid Prison Labor (https://theintercept.com/2018/02/22/ncaa-student-athletes-unpaid-prison/)

Take all the money you want, after all the NCAA claims you don't deserve any since they don't pay prisoners for their work in jail.

[MrBug708]

Couldn't have been Alford, sadly

[CU Tiger]

I said this, then I saw 3 Clemson player names come up in an article yesterday. So. Maybe they were just really bad at it.


Shut the program down. Close it. Demolish Littlejohn and add football parking. Clear how I feel?

[Atocep]

As I've said on here before, pretty much all 5 star recruits and some 4s get some pretty serious money or benefits. If you think your school landed a 5 star recruit without him getting something you're delusional. College basketball was a ticking time bomb for probe like this.

[MizzouRah]

As I've said on here before, pretty much all 5 star recruits and some 4s get some pretty serious money or benefits. If you think your school landed a 5 star recruit without him getting something you're delusional. College basketball was a ticking time bomb for probe like this.

Exactly.. it's in ALL of college sports too, not just basketball.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Exactly.. it's in ALL of college sports too, not just basketball.

Yes, however the wage scale drops to roughly a BOGO coupon at Taco Bell (valid Mon-Thu) for a lot of sports.

[Atocep]

Well Sean Miller is done at Arizona.

[JPhillips]

How is the NCAA going to minimize this? They can't suspend all these coaches and programs can they?

[cartman]

How is the NCAA going to minimize this? They can't suspend all these coaches and programs can they?

Poor Grand Valley State is going to get the death penalty.

[Chief Rum]

Well Sean Miller is done at Arizona.

Couldn't happen to a better guy.

[MizzouRah]

Yes, however the wage scale drops to roughly a BOGO coupon at Taco Bell (valid Mon-Thu) for a lot of sports.

Agreed.. but it's still a violation of the NCAA rules. I wonder how this will stop? I highly doubt it ever does..

[MrBug708]

Sean Miller has a buyout clause of 85% of the remaining balance. So his buyout amount is 10 million if Arizona fires him. Richrod got pretty much all of his money as well when he was fired. I can see the other reasons why Greg Byrne left to Alabama when he did.

[miami_fan]

Agreed.. but it's still a violation of the NCAA rules. I wonder how this will stop? I highly doubt it ever does..

Change the rules.

[BishopMVP]

Sean Miller has a buyout clause of 85% of the remaining balance. So his buyout amount is 10 million if Arizona fires him. Richrod got pretty much all of his money as well when he was fired. I can see the other reasons why Greg Byrne left to Alabama when he did.There's nothing in there about firing with cause? Because offering bribes on a wiretap and getting the program heavily sanctioned would seem to justify a firing. :)

A lot of the schools/players listed are really minor things (getting meals/flights to meet with an agent), so I can't wait to be outraged when Duke isn't punished as hard as UMass was when that same thing happened with Camby. :)

[molson]

I think the NCAA is just going to try to let this all blow over like they always do (a small handful of coaches will take the fall and then we'll move on like nothing happened), but I wonder when the I.R.S. is going to becoming interested in these payments, as they get higher and higher.

[MrBug708]

There's nothing in there about firing with cause? Because offering bribes on a wiretap and getting the program heavily sanctioned would seem to justify a firing. :)

A lot of the schools/players listed are really minor things (getting meals/flights to meet with an agent), so I can't wait to be outraged when Duke isn't punished as hard as UMass was when that same thing happened with Camby. :)
Sorry, his buyout clause with cause is 85%

[kingfc22]

Sorry, his buyout clause with cause is 85%

Yeesh. You’d think these universities would have better legal departments. That’s laughable.

[JPhillips]

Why do they care? The athletic director and President may be gone before it matters and even if they aren't basically nobody at that level suffers professional consequences for spending too much in an effort to win.

[molson]

They have a game in about 8 hours - are Miller and Ayton just going to show up like nothing happened?

Emmert said that it's up to the school what they do and no NCAA process has been initiated.

[miami_fan]

They have a game in about 8 hours - are Miller and Ayton just going to show up like nothing happened?

Emmert said that it's up to the school what they do and no NCAA process has been initiated.

I don't see why not even if they are guilty. The NCAA will wipe it all out later and then try to convince us that what we see tonight did not happen.

[MrBug708]

Why do they care? The athletic director and President may be gone before it matters and even if they aren't basically nobody at that level suffers professional consequences for spending too much in an effort to win.

The AD is brand new. It sucks for him but he was just hired like 4 months ago

[JonInMiddleGA]

Sorry, his buyout clause with cause is 85%

Whaaaaaat !?!?!?!

You have GOT to be kidding.

Anybody that agreed to that sort of thing ought to be hoping THEY have a prohibitive buyout clause, 'cause that's grounds for dismissal right there.

Reason For Separation: Being a $#%@#$ idiot.

[dawgfan]

Whaaaaaat !?!?!?!

You have GOT to be kidding.

Anybody that agreed to that sort of thing ought to be hoping THEY have a prohibitive buyout clause, 'cause that's grounds for dismissal right there.

Reason For Separation: Being a $#%@#$ idiot.

Yup. Greg Byrne should be packing his bags. That is some mind-boggling idiocy right there. Makes you wonder if he has some kind of under-the-table kick-back arrangement with Miller...

[JonInMiddleGA]

That is some mind-boggling idiocy right there.

That's the sort of "deal" that makes you wonder if they piss-tested the AD lately.

[MrBug708]

Yup. Greg Byrne should be packing his bags. That is some mind-boggling idiocy right there. Makes you wonder if he has some kind of under-the-table kick-back arrangement with Miller...

Bryne is at Alabama now

[molson]

Sorry, his buyout clause with cause is 85%

Might as well just keep him then.

Edit: Looks like he's not coaching tonight. No word on Ayton.

[murrayyyyy]

I'm just waiting for one of these coaches to point the finger at the NBA for it's one year rule.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I'm just waiting for one of these coaches to point the finger at the NBA for it's one year rule.

Hopefully, if one goes that route, somebody will hit them over the head with a heavy object.

[RainMaker]

That's the sort of "deal" that makes you wonder if they piss-tested the AD lately.

I'd look more at extortion of the school.

[JPhillips]

There's a big chance Rovell is wrong, but if he isn't...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">JUST IN: Sean Miller’s contract, as written, somehow pays him more for getting fired with cause than without cause. So if Miller is fired with cause, Arizona will owe him approximately $5 million more ($10.3 million versus $5.15 million) than if they fired for no reason.</p>&mdash; Darren Rovell (@darrenrovell) <a href="https://twitter.com/darrenrovell/status/967444771580121089?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 24, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[JonInMiddleGA]

There's a big chance Rovell is wrong, but if he isn't...


If he isn't wrong then I gotta wonder if the same person that wrote the City of Miami deal with the Marlins might have also been involved here.

[dawgfan]

Bryne is at Alabama now

Good move Bama! Can't wait to see what kind of deal Saban can extract out of this idiot...

[dawgfan]

There's a big chance Rovell is wrong, but if he isn't...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">JUST IN: Sean Miller’s contract, as written, somehow pays him more for getting fired with cause than without cause. So if Miller is fired with cause, Arizona will owe him approximately $5 million more ($10.3 million versus $5.15 million) than if they fired for no reason.</p>&mdash; Darren Rovell (@darrenrovell) <a href="https://twitter.com/darrenrovell/status/967444771580121089?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 24, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Is there any reason they wouldn’t just fire him ‘without cause’ given this bizarre buyout structure?

[molson]

Is there any reason they wouldn’t just fire him ‘without cause’ given this bizarre buyout structure?

That's be a fun legal battle. Miller would have to prove he did things worthy of being fired and that the school acted on it. Maybe there's some logic to that from the school's perspective - that he would basically have to concede wrongdoing to get the higher payout, and maybe such a concession would negatively impact him in some other way.

I don't really trust a college basketball reporter's interpretation of an employment contract though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I don't really trust a college basketball reporter's interpretation of an employment contract though.

fwiw, Forbes has a similar take, going on to say that it looks like there's a missing section in the contract.

Now either whatever has been obtained through public records is incorrect / incomplete and corrections were made but aren't turning up or ....

[murrayyyyy]

Hopefully, if one goes that route, somebody will hit them over the head with a heavy object.

Didn't take long for me to find a taker and it's who I expected it to be.

Boeheim: "Everybody knows for 30 years agent have been involved with players' families. This is nothing that would surprise anybody in coaching. Agents are trying to get clients. When you have the one-and-done factor, they need to get them early. They can't wait four years. They have to go after them. That's not surprising."

[MizzouRah]

Mizzou looks like a tired basketball team. We have such a short bench. Next two games are must wins and a shot of MPJ would be an awesome welcome.

:)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Didn't take long for me to find a taker and it's who I expected it to be.

Boeheim: "Everybody knows for 30 years agent have been involved with players' families. This is nothing that would surprise anybody in coaching. Agents are trying to get clients. When you have the one-and-done factor, they need to get them early. They can't wait four years. They have to go after them. That's not surprising."

Well you certainly know how to pick a source that has no influence on me. One of the slimier characters I've seen in college hoops, certainly one that I believe would know about all manner of improprieties.

I simply don't believe that restraint of trade is the way to go in this deal. College really isn't "for everybody"

However, if you want the same impact, how about this: the NBA sets up a fwe companion rules, and you're only eligible in the league if you aren't subject to an NCAA suspension. Get caught signing while still enrolled, you're barred from the NBA for the remaining length of your eligibility.

Problem solved.

[tarcone]

On a bright note, at least for Iowa BB. Maybe not the NCAA. But posting here to get off the ugliness.

Iowas was leading by 8 with about 1 minute left in the game. Jordan Bohannon had tied the consecutive made free throw record set by Iowa legend Chris street who died tragically in a car accident in 1993. He got run over by a snow plow after a team dinner. He was what Iowa basketball was all about. Small town Iowa kid playing for the home team. A gamer. Great kid. Lost during the season. Devastated the state of Iowa.
Bohanbnon goes to the line and misses the front end of the one and one.
Keeps Streets name on top of a record. By the way, Street was in the middle of the record when he died.
Bohannon went to Streets parents after the game and gave them a tearful hug.

Good stuff.

[Logan]

Well you certainly know how to pick a source that has no influence on me. One of the slimier characters I've seen in college hoops, certainly one that I believe would know about all manner of improprieties.

I simply don't believe that restraint of trade is the way to go in this deal. College really isn't "for everybody"

However, if you want the same impact, how about this: the NBA sets up a fwe companion rules, and you're only eligible in the league if you aren't subject to an NCAA suspension. Get caught signing while still enrolled, you're barred from the NBA for the remaining length of your eligibility.

Problem solved.

What is the benefit to the NBA for doing that? Why limit their pool of talented players to draw from?

[miami_fan]

At what point does basketball move closer to the baseball model than the football model? Players can be drafted out of high school. If a player decides to go to college, there is a mandatory time commitment. The G League becomes a true development league etc. The one thing I am not sure about is the role agents/advisers play in baseball at the high school/college level. I am under the impression that agents act as advisers for high school/college players, and then become their agents when they turn pro. Again, I am not sure about that part though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

What is the benefit to the NBA for doing that? Why limit their pool of talented players to draw from?

Oh, I didn't say it was a great idea. I merely offered something better than coaches whining about something they can control if they had the stones.

[MrBug708]

Sounds like there are some holes in the Sean Miller story, but the AD and President are still in a pickle

[Arles]

yeah, this is kind of odd.

https://247sports.com/Article/Sources-Conflicting-information-in-ESPNs-report-involving-Arizona-star-DeAndre-Ayton-coach-Sean-Miller-115594868

I just wish we knew when it actually happened and what was said. If Miller said "Hey, I just paid him 100K to come here" when that was going on (or even shortly after), it would be a lot more damning than if it turns out to be some hypothetical about what a payment could be.

Either way, the damage has been done to Arizona. Even if Miller is somehow found innocent, the team will have no recruiting class for the next two seasons and the stink will be on. I just wish ESPN could have gotten their ducks in a row a little better before dropping this. I talk with a bunch of UofA alumns (myself included) who were ready to kick him out on Saturday - but now are just confused on what actually went down with these retractions/corrections by ESPN. The Ringer sums this up pretty well:

For starters, Schlabach’s story provided zero direct quotes from the wiretap, suggesting that he hasn’t listened to the recording or even seen a transcript of the call. Also, Schlabach said in a televised interview that the wiretapped call took place in the spring of 2017, which would mean that the discussion over payments to guarantee Ayton’s commitment took place after he had signed his national letter of intent in November 2016. ESPN issued a correction to its story and said that the alleged call took place in “spring of 2016,” a timeline that was later corrected yet again to read simply “2016.” But even that doesn’t completely clear up the time-frame issue when you consider that a 247Sports report from Monday includes this passage: “Sources say that the U.S. Attorney’s office notified multiple parties who had conversations with Dawkins that their phone calls had been recorded specifically during the dates of June 19, 2017 and Sept. 25, 2017.”

Further complicating matters is that, as CBS Sports’ Gary Parrish pointed out on Twitter, those who closely follow recruiting seem to think that Ayton and Dawkins never had much of a relationship, casting doubt on the notion that Dawkins would have been in position to “sell” Ayton’s services in the first place. And let’s not forget that there’s likely a specific reason this piece of information about the wiretap call was leaked to the media.

There are two questions surrounding Miller that keep tripping me up:

- Why would the head coach of Arizona handle his dirty business himself and not have an assistant serve as his fall guy, especially when the person on the other end of the purported interaction (Dawkins) was in his 20s?
- If the FBI had stone-cold proof that Miller offered a $100,000 bribe to land a sought-after recruit—which is what the public has been led to believe—why wasn’t Miller arrested along with the rest of the guys whom the FBI threw cuffs on in September?

[Arles]

To pile on a bit, ESPN is also wrong in their story that Arizona would have to pay Miller more if he was fired (as referenced above by many including Rovell):

University officials said they recognize there might be some ambiguity in the contract language. But they said the intent of the parties is clear, and intent has consistently been upheld in Arizona courts.

"Base Salary and any Additional Compensation are payable only to the date of termination," the university said in a statement issued to The Arizona Republic and azcentral.com.

In other words: No, Miller wouldn't get more money if fired with cause.
https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-investigations/2018/02/25/university-says-sean-miller-would-not-get-more-money-if-fired-cause/371709002/

[Arles]

Here's a good story recapping all the Yahoo and ESPN reports:

https://www.theringer.com/2018/2/27/17058026/fbi-investigation-college-basketball-recruiting-reports-sean-miller

[Butter]

Wasn't Book Richardson an assistant at Arizona? That makes the case a lot more likely to me, despite the reporting inaccuracies.

Let's not try to start spinning this as Miller was clean and is getting railroaded.

[Arles]

That's part of what is confusing. He had a dirty assistant in Richardson. So, according to this wiretap, he goes to a guy who can't even deliver Ayton (according to CBS) and tells him directly that he's offering $100K for Ayton? Why not send Book to tell him - why do it directly? Then you have the original report that this discussion happened months after Ayton already enrolled (which they quickly backtracked to a year before - when no wiretap was running).

There's just a lot of oddities in this report. I fully believe Miller is somewhat dirty, I just am interested in the actual facts the FBI have here.

[MrBug708]

There is so much misinformation out there, but Arizona is in a huge bind either way. They should just roll with Trier, Ayton, and Miller and see if they can win it. But hinestly, Millet isnt worth the problems at this point

[Arles]

Miller just spoke at Arizona and said he never paid a player (or helped pay a player) to come to Arizona. He also said that he had never met or talked to Dawkins when Ayton committed. He did say that Dawkins did contact him about a player that did not come to Arizona.

So, if you put all the tea leaves in order, the most reasonable explanation here is this: Dawkins called Miller about Brian Bowen, said it would cost $100K to get him, Miller declined and nothing happened after that. That explanation meets the original timeline (call was June 2017), the wiretap was in effect and Dawkins was the key guy for Bowen (as opposed to not being associated with Ayton). If this is actually what happened, ESPN butchered this beyond belief. There's really no way Ayton could be the player on the wiretap if you look at all the information. And, if Miller did agree to pay $100K, I'm guessing the FBI would have arrested him with his assistant (Richardson) as that is more damning than anything Book ever did.

[MrBug708]

Chances are Miller is lying and is buying time for this tournament. Arizona is probably his last college job either way so he might as well roll with a team with top 3 talent.

This is the best summary I could find.
------------

Now the Arizona administration apparently feels it's had time to examine the allegation, consult with their attorneys, boosters, etc., and Miller himself, and they've decided based on subsequent articles written and questions raised about, the ESPN article, that it isn't credible -- at least to the extent they can use it as justification to fire Miller.

I think Miller is dirty as all-get-out, but it's shady that ESPN ran with a story that it subsequently had to correct multiple times. Also shady that the writer of the article has gone MIA since these questions were raised (presumably under legal advise to do so). Legitimate questions were raised about the accuracy of the article, and ESPN and the article's writer have gone silent in answering those questions.

It seems to me like there may have been some basis for that article, but ESPN and the writer rushed it to publication before giving it the necessary vetting. They could have easily looked at the date of Ayton's public commitment and seen that it contradicted the date that Schalbach's source gave him and questioned the source about it, which you would think have had a major impact on whether ESPN decided to publish it or not. They also could have better researched the nature of Miller's relationship with Dawkins. A week later, they don't even appear to be sure whether the alleged conversation was about Ayton or Brian Bowen.

You add it all up, and Arizona would have opened itself up to a potentially very costly wrongful termination suit had it fired Miller now. Apparently they couldn't come to a negotiated settlement either. And Arizona's boosters and fan-base desperately want to keep Miller. You add all that up, and it just makes sense that they continue the status quo, at least for the time being. I don't think this is over by a long-shot, but I would expect Miller to at least coach his team through the remainder of the season.

[Arles]

But what is he lying about? You really think that he went on record on a public phone to a guy he barely knew and say "Yeah, I'll pay you $100K"? Then, once the FBI had this information, they chose not to arrest him - but did his assistant?

This just doesn't pass the smell test. I don't think Miller is the coach at Arizona next season, but I don't think this ESPN report will be the reason. It would have to be something from the Richardson investigation. My issue from the start is that how does Miller no know his longtime assistant was dirty? And even if he didn't, that's almost as bad in terms of managing your program.

But, all this doesn't excuse what ESPN did to Arizona and Ayton.

[Arles]

Well, ESPN is doubling down. Here's their rebuttal to Miller's conference:
Sean Miller, Arizona Wildcats coach, denies report he discussed paying recruit (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/22616244/sean-miller-arizona-wildcats-coach-denies-report-discussed-paying-recruit)

Sources told ESPN's Mark Schlabach last week that FBI wiretaps intercepted phone conversations between Miller and Christian Dawkins, an employee for ASM Sports agent Andy Miller. According to sources familiar with the government's evidence, Sean Miller and Dawkins discussed paying $100,000 to ensure that Deandre Ayton would sign with the Wildcats.

Miller and Dawkins had multiple conversations about Ayton, sources told ESPN. When Dawkins asked Miller if he should work with assistant coach Emanuel "Book" Richardson to finalize their agreement, Miller told Dawkins he should deal directly with him when it came to money, the sources said.

The Arizona coach did not mention ESPN by name in his comments Thursday and did not take questions after making his statement.

ESPN stands by its reporting on Miller and the FBI investigation.

The bolded part is just crazy. Why would any coach ever say that??!

[Arles]

SI is now calling out ESPN as well:

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2018/03/01/arizona-sean-miller-deandre-ayton-espn-report

According to the source, relevant FBI wiretaps in the investigation did not begin until 2017—months after five-star recruit Deandre Ayton had already committed to Arizona in Sept. 2016. This account is consistent with reporting by Evan Daniels of 247Sports. The recruitment of Ayton, therefore, would have not been at issue in an intercepted phone call that occurred in 2017. To that end, the source told SI what Miller clarified for the first time Thursday: Ayton is not the player on whose behalf former ASM Sports employee Christian Dawkins allegedly sought a payment from Miller, and Miller never pursued or made any payments to a recruit associated with Dawkins.

This account depicts Miller as complying with both the law and NCAA recruiting rules. The same holds true of Ayton, whose compliance with NCAA rules would ensure that he remains eligible to play for the final month of his freshman year.
Wow, if this is true, ESPN is in trouble.

[MrBug708]

Dave Bliss was denied everything, until the tapes came out.

At this point, and ESPN messed up, is just wait until the FBI is done.

[Arles]

True, we don't know. But this story is clearly not true (Miller offered $100K for Ayton) and that's a shame as a ton of damage has been done to Arizona, Miller and Ayton.

[Young Drachma]

Players in all sports should be able to benefit from their likeness. And pros should still not be allowed to play college sports. The Olympic model is the best idea.

[tarcone]

Players in all sports should be able to benefit from their likeness. And pros should still not be allowed to play college sports. The Olympic model is the best idea.

I agree. Its BS that EA and the NCAA made tons of money off of college players and they got nothing. Just wrong.
When it comes to jerseys, dont put names on jerseys, then the colleges can sell them without paying the players. Otherwise, they should pay the players.

[BishopMVP]

Dave Bliss was denied everything, until the tapes came out.

At this point, and ESPN messed up, is just wait until the FBI is done.I don't think Miller is clean, I definitely don't think Arizona is clean, but I'm with Arles (& SI, etc) that I really doubt Miller talked to Dawkins about Ayton, I really doubt he'd tell Dawkins to deal directly with him instead of the known dirty assistant, and I think if the FBI had him on a wiretap saying that he'd have been arrested for tax evasion/money laundering along with all the other people the FBI charged.

[tarcone]

Iowa soph forward Tyler Cook may be transferring. He was asked after the loss today and gave a non-answer.
Mizzou is the probable landing spot if he goes. Which I think is most likely.

Good player from about 10 feet in. But lacks a lot of skills right now.

[Butter]

Best theory I have heard is that this is coming from Richardson's lawyer to start throwing Miller under the bus. They're some of the only people that would be privy to any actual info for this investigation.

[Arles]

Best theory I have heard is that this is coming from Richardson's lawyer to start throwing Miller under the bus. They're some of the only people that would be privy to any actual info for this investigation.
I don’t think that’s right as someone close to Book told the Arizona Daily Star on Monday that Ayton wasn’t the player on the tape and said the call was about Bowen.

For the conspiracy nuts, a better answer is a source from another program involved wanted to either damage Arizona for recruiting or take some of the upcoming heat off them and put Arizona in the fire. Still, I'm not sure this was a pure malice play (but I could certainly be wrong). I just think that a source told the ESPN reporter that Miller was on a wiretap discussing a top prospect (and floated out Ayton). ESPN had just been majorly scooped by Yahoo on the documents - so the powers that be said “F it, let’s run with this” and they didn’t do the proper vetting.

[Logan]

I wonder what the "proper vetting" even is in that case? They didn't claim that they heard the alleged tape so they would need a way to verify that their source had access to sealed FBI evidence. That's rough going, especially for ESPN to then come out after the fact and say that they stand behind the reporting.

[Arles]

Well, the damage has been done to Arizona. Their final top 100 recruit just decommitted in Brandon Williams. Even if the FBI tapes come out tomorrow and completely exonerate Miller, this team has been completely neutered for the next two seasons.

[Thomkal]

Sadly the season is over at Coastal Carolina after losing in the first round of the Sun Belt Conference Tourney. :( They had their moments, but they were few and far between. Mostly made up of newcomers, they just were not ready for the "big leagues" this season. They end play at 14-18. Good luck to "your" team in the various tournaments this season.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

He's back.

Missouri freshman Michael Porter Jr. plans to play Thursday in SEC tournament (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/22679863/missouri-freshman-michael-porter-jr-plans-play-thursday-sec-tournament)

Should be really interesting to see how he does. Nice thing is that he's entering a good situation and doesn't have to be the focus of the attack, but he will open up the defense and ease some of the double teams simply by being on the court.

Mizzou's got a real chance to make a run with MPJ being back and the easier top seeds (IMO) of Kentucky and Auburn on their side of the bracket. Won't hurt that Mizzou should have a good crowd on hand in St. Louis, especially with MPJ back.

[MrBug708]

Enjoy him for the rest of the season before he's off to the NBA for the 2018-2019 season

[Izulde]

Typical UNLV in the first round of the MWC tournament. Playing an inferior opponent in Air Force and winning pretty much the entire game, then get sloppy down the stretch and have to win in OT. This is an exciting game and team, but man, those second half mental screwups drive me insane.

UNR tomorrow and I want so badly to kick their asses. We beat them at their place and they embarrassed us in Las Vegas. In order to win, we're going to have to play a *lot* better than we did today.

[tarcone]

I wonder why the B1G tourney is a week before everyone else. Rest before the big dance?