Congressional Sexual Harassment Thread (Al Franken & Co.)

[Edward64]

FWIW, I think there will be bombshells coming out on Congressional harassment.

[BishopMVP]

FWIW, I think there will be bombshells coming out on Congressional harassment.No doubt. Can't wait!

[ISiddiqui]

Al Franken was the first shoe to drop it seems like.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/16/politics/al-franken-sexual-harassment/index.html?adkey=bn

[albionmoonlight]

Damn. I really like Franken.

Hope he resigns.

We have a real opportunity to change the zeitgeist here regarding sexual assault by powerful men.

[mckerney]

Damn. I really like Franken.

Hope he resigns.

We have a real opportunity to change the zeitgeist here regarding sexual assault by powerful men.

Yeah. He was great as a legislator but should resign.

[CrescentMoonie]

Franken feels like proof that this actually is an SNL skit.

[Noop]

I am thoroughly enjoying watching these corrupt people be exposed.

[bronconick]

We should just put women in charge of Congress, Hollywood, and most of America until men learn to keep their hands to themselves.

[Atocep]

I'm really surprised that the people that create and push for laws and legislation that shows a lack of respect for women actually don't respect women.

[Ben E Lou]

Created new thread for current members of Congress, as I'm assuming more are to come. Moore keeps his own thread.

[Noop]

We should just put women in charge of Congress, Hollywood, and most of America until men learn to keep their hands to themselves.

Would it surprise you to know that women are as equally capable of being sexual predators?

[panerd]

Would it surprise you to know that women are as equally capable of being sexual predators?

Yeah men just brush and laugh it off though. In fact there is a whole thread admiring female pedophiles on this site.

[Edward64]

Would it surprise you to know that women are as equally capable of being sexual predators?

Actually yes, it would surprise me.

I'm sure it happens but "equally"?

[Edward64]

So far only 1 for Franken right?

I think we should give benefit of doubt. If there are multiple/pattern then all bets are off.

[Kodos]

Wow about Franken. Very disappointing. Thought he was one of the good guys.

[panerd]

Actually yes, it would surprise me.

I'm sure it happens but "equally"?

As mentioned... Al Frankin grabs a woman 10 years ago and he should resign. Hot female teacher rapes 14 year old. Atta boy! Wish she was my teacher when I was a kid.

[panerd]

So far only 1 for Franken right?

I think we should give benefit of doubt. If there are multiple/pattern then all bets are off.

If you read the story there is a picture of one of the incidents and him talking about the other incident years later using her name in a speech. Hard to say he doesn't know her.

[panerd]

Wow about Franken. Very disappointing. Thought he was one of the good guys.

It's very disappointing and not an excuse but I can only imagine the SNL culture even with strong female comedians. I pretty sure he is closer to the norm than we would like to think.

[Kodos]

My first thought when I saw the picture was that it was posed as a joke (e.g., she was in on it). But sadly, not so much.

[Edward64]

As mentioned... Al Frankin grabs a woman 10 years ago and he should resign. Hot female teacher rapes 14 year old. Atta boy! Wish she was my teacher when I was a kid.

So you do think this occurs "equally" or close to "equally"?

I'm not saying he is not guilty. I'm saying there's only 1 accuser so far and he deserves the benefit of doubt right now.

[molson]

As mentioned... Al Frankin grabs a woman 10 years ago and he should resign. Hot female teacher rapes 14 year old. Atta boy! Wish she was my teacher when I was a kid.

The fact that society is more forgiving of female child molesters doesn't mean that there's more of them than male molesters.

And I think if a female congresswoman had sex with a 14 year old she'd have to resign, if the accusations were generally considered credible. (Though plenty of people on the internet would think she was awesome, if she was hot).

[digamma]

I think he's a great Senator. Unfortunately he should resign.

[Edward64]

I think he's a great Senator. Unfortunately he should resign.

You think for that one incident (assuming only one)?

I would do a sincere apology and ask for forgiveness first.

[digamma]

Absolutely. He needs to live his apology. And his more recent statement and apology is fantastic.

[Edward64]

Absolutely. He needs to live his apology. And his more recent statement and apology is fantastic.

He's pretty much admitted the groping occurred (but not the kissing).

To me this was a pretty stupid jackass move. I do think people make stupid mistakes and should be given a second chance. If it was rape or a pattern emerges, its clear cut.

[digamma]

I think you're missing the point. It's not really about him right now. That may or may not be fair. Further, he purports to be a champion of women's issues. He's now lost all credibility with a significant number of influential women on those issues.

[Atocep]

I'm sure Franken could find a Bible verse that would make 40% of the country more likely to vote for him now.

[ISiddiqui]

I don't know if it's true or not, but people on Twitter are claiming the photographer has come forward and said the picture was staged and the anchor was awake/not sleeping while it was happening. That would complicate matters in that case.

[SirFozzie]

He's admitted to it. Or at least pretty much so in his statements.

I think he should resign.

[JonInMiddleGA]

idle musing: I wonder if we'd see half of Congress turnover if everyone who ever did anything that qualifies as sexual harrasment / misconduct today was run through the magical truthtelling machine?

I don't know if they'd be able to seat a quorum.

[RedKingGold]

Let's just elect women from now on, OK?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Let's just elect women from now on, OK?

You better pick some old as hell ones then, 'cause the younger they get the less squeaky clean they're gonna be either.

[CrescentMoonie]

I don't know if it's true or not, but people on Twitter are claiming the photographer has come forward and said the picture was staged and the anchor was awake/not sleeping while it was happening. That would complicate matters in that case.

Can't find that anywhere other than a deleted thread on democratic underground.

[RainMaker]

I want to know more about the settlements that were given out with taxpayer money in the House.

[cuervo72]

I don't know if it's true or not, but people on Twitter are claiming the photographer has come forward and said the picture was staged and the anchor was awake/not sleeping while it was happening. That would complicate matters in that case.

This in no way excuses Franken (you don't force yourself on anyone), but as an aside - I am still having to pause to mentally process "anchor" as opposed to Hooters/Frederick's/fitness model or Poker After Dark hostess.

[Thomkal]

You better pick some old as hell ones then, 'cause the younger they get the less squeaky clean they're gonna be either.

So you'd vote for Hillary then? :D

[JonInMiddleGA]

So you'd vote for Hillary then? :D

Not every old bag has clean hands either ;)

[JPhillips]

idle musing: I wonder if we'd see half of Congress turnover if everyone who ever did anything that qualifies as sexual harrasment / misconduct today was run through the magical truthtelling machine?

I don't know if they'd be able to seat a quorum.

I'm certain this is the reason that McConnell so quickly advocated for the ethics investigation. Both he and Schumer have to be aware that there's no telling who and how many will be exposed if all the lights are turned on.

As for Franken, oh well. Let's clear out everybody while we have the opportunity.

[molson]

It's kind of interesting that the Franken and Moore allegations are these huge deals that plenty of people on both sides think should disqualify them from office or from seeking office, but that we kind of forgot that Donald Trump himself has 16 accusers, there's detailed accusations of rape and child rape made in lawsuits and depositions, and he even made admissions on audio recordings. Maybe Trump wouldn't be president if that article about Weinstein came out last year.

[thesloppy]

I don't know if it's true or not, but people on Twitter are claiming the photographer has come forward and said the picture was staged and the anchor was awake/not sleeping while it was happening. That would complicate matters in that case.

I'm more confused by the fact that nobody else seems to notice/care that the shadows imply he's like a foot away from that woman. Unless I'm seeing some other photo.

[chinaski]

Calling this sexual assault is a god damn insult to those who have truly suffered it. What a farce. Incredibly poor taste yes, but that is it.

[PilotMan]

Calling this sexual assault is a god damn insult to those who have truly suffered it. What a farce. Incredibly poor taste yes, but that is it.

What do you mean? This is totally the same as a girl being raped with a loaded gun.:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[bhlloy]

idle musing: I wonder if we'd see half of Congress turnover if everyone who ever did anything that qualifies as sexual harrasment / misconduct today was run through the magical truthtelling machine?

I don't know if they'd be able to seat a quorum.

Among males in congress? I’d be stunned if it’s not way more than half.

Politics attracts scummy people with a penchant for power for a reason.

And yes, it can be an issue with women as well, especially powerful women so maybe it’s not even fair to limit it to just the dudes in Congress.

[CrescentMoonie]

It's kind of interesting that the Franken and Moore allegations are these huge deals that plenty of people on both sides think should disqualify them from office or from seeking office, but that we kind of forgot that Donald Trump himself has 16 accusers, there's detailed accusations of rape and child rape made in lawsuits and depositions, and he even made admissions on audio recordings. Maybe Trump wouldn't be president if that article about Weinstein came out last year.

I think it's the opposite. If Trump isn't elected, Weinstein is still just the guy that women in Hollywood know they have to put up with to get ahead.

[cuervo72]

It's kind of interesting that the Franken and Moore allegations are these huge deals that plenty of people on both sides think should disqualify them from office or from seeking office, but that we kind of forgot that Donald Trump himself has 16 accusers, there's detailed accusations of rape and child rape made in lawsuits and depositions, and he even made admissions on audio recordings. Maybe Trump wouldn't be president if that article about Weinstein came out last year.

I doubt it. On the whole, I would assume that this would hit politicians like Franken harder because a) Republicans would want to get rid of him anyway, and b) his constituency is naturally more attuned to this being a problem. They are going to be less forgiving. Essentially it's another case of one side applying a moral standard that the other is going to shrug off. The kind of thing that the Jons of the world are going to chuckle over for the other side not being willing to play dirty over (ye old "evil will always triumph, because good is dumb"). Dems will be willing to eat their own over something "dumb."

[DanGarion]

Wow about Franken. Very disappointing. Thought he was one of the good guys.

Well...

He's Good Enough, He's Smart Enough, and Doggone It, People Like Him...

[DanGarion]

So you do think this occurs "equally" or close to "equally"?

I'm not saying he is not guilty. I'm saying there's only 1 accuser so far and he deserves the benefit of doubt right now.

https://i.imgur.com/xVZw9gg.png

[Edward64]

I saw the picture. So if this was a one time incident, you think he should resign from the Senate?

Or are you also agreeing that harassment occurs "equally"?

[RainMaker]

Here's the way I judge these things. If this happened to your GF/wife, sister or daughter, what would your reaction be?

Looking at that picture, if that was my girlfriend, I'd need bail money.

[CrescentMoonie]

Looking at that picture, there's no physical contact. You can see the gap between his hands and her body, as well as the shadows. He's apologized for the forced kiss and should step down, but that picture is the least damning thing in any of the recent allegations.

[JPhillips]

He forcibly kissed her and then humiliated her for days. And I'll be shocked if this is a one time only thing. He deserves what he gets.

[corbes]

It's kind of interesting that the Franken and Moore allegations are these huge deals that plenty of people on both sides think should disqualify them from office or from seeking office, but that we kind of forgot that Donald Trump himself has 16 accusers, there's detailed accusations of rape and child rape made in lawsuits and depositions, and he even made admissions on audio recordings.

+1!

[molson]

I've been spending way too much time staring at Franken's hands and that lady's boobs, but it looks to me like he's making contact with some of fingertips, but that it's not a full "grab." And that's it's pretty likely he was making more physical contact immediately before or after the photo was taken. Because he's RIGHT there. It'd take some serious hand dexterity to get that close and not touch or grab on the way in or in the way out, and it would be some serious bad luck if this split second captured the very closest his hands got.

[tarcone]

Clean out congress. They are fat cats that only think about themselves and are drunk with power.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Clean out congress. They are fat cats that only think about themselves and are drunk with power.

To do what exactly? Replace them with identically self-interested power drunk folks?

Not sure that going to accomplish much other than creating more work for the pages/guides who have to explain where the bathrooms are.

[Warhammer]

Clean out congress. They are fat cats that only think about themselves and are drunk with power.

That's what led to Trump getting elected.

[BishopMVP]

He forcibly kissed her and then humiliated her for days. And I'll be shocked if this is a one time only thing. He deserves what he gets.Yeah, I'm torn here. I'm not sure this picture and the accusations described are disqualifying "sexual assault" as opposed to just douche-y (and I hate the internet lynch mob because there's an important delineation between something like this and actual rape or whipping your dick out and masturbating in plants), but I can guarantee this isn't the only time Al Franken did something like this. The female's response to it may have varied, but that's kind of how I expect many powerful men act. I said as much during the Trump "Locker Room" talk - it's not locker room talk, it's country club talk. I don't think every or even most rich/powerful man acts like that, but power and prestige in any profession and especially Wall Street, Hollywood, Capitol Hill & athletics, has enabled that behavior forever from any narcissist or sociopath or predator who enters the field.
It's kind of interesting that the Franken and Moore allegations are these huge deals that plenty of people on both sides think should disqualify them from office or from seeking office, but that we kind of forgot that Donald Trump himself has 16 accusers, there's detailed accusations of rape and child rape made in lawsuits and depositions, and he even made admissions on audio recordings. Maybe Trump wouldn't be president if that article about Weinstein came out last year.Yeah, and there's no way Roy Moore will still be elected after this either!

I just don't really know where things are going politically. Trump did much worse than this, Clinton did much worse than this, even George H.W. Bush has been accused of stuff while in his wheelchair... it's good the pendulum has swung in this direction, but it's gone so far in the opposite direction that you see that huge bifurcation and backlash. No room in the internet/twitter echo chamber to try and make any nuanced argument at this point, it's just one people in the middle sit out and let the crazy people on both sides go to extremes.

[CrimsonFox]

I have no doubt that Moore will win his election.

[RainMaker]

I have no doubt that Moore will win his election.

If there was ever going to be a state to elect a pedophile, it would be Alabama.

I want to know more about this.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/16/politics/settlements-congress-sexual-harassment/index.html

[PilotMan]

I've been spending way too much time staring at Franken's hands and that lady's boobs, but it looks to me like he's making contact with some of fingertips, but that it's not a full "grab." And that's it's pretty likely he was making more physical contact immediately before or after the photo was taken. Because he's RIGHT there. It'd take some serious hand dexterity to get that close and not touch or grab on the way in or in the way out, and it would be some serious bad luck if this split second captured the very closest his hands got.

On top of that, he's doing it in front of a bunch of people, like the skit that he wrote for the tour. It's all in front of a bunch of people. He's not parking a car behind a dumpster. While he's guilty of the act, the context couldn't be further apart.

[Edward64]

... then humiliated her for days.

I actually did not read this. I thought it was a one shot deal and then they toured together.

More to come from the investigation.

[JPhillips]

On top of that, he's doing it in front of a bunch of people, like the skit that he wrote for the tour. It's all in front of a bunch of people. He's not parking a car behind a dumpster. While he's guilty of the act, the context couldn't be further apart.

Taking advantage of her in a rehearsal like that is waaaay out of line. He isn't the first to do it, but it's almost always a way for an older, more established actor to take advantage of a younger, inexperienced actress. It happens because the woman will probably be too scared to say anything, and if she does the man can always claim he was just really into the scene. It's predatory, plain and simple.

[miami_fan]

Here's the way I judge these things. If this happened to your GF/wife, sister or daughter, what would your reaction be?

Looking at that picture, if that was my girlfriend, I'd need bail money.

It has been fascinating to see what the reaction has been to these incidents from friends and acquaintances while comparing it to their past reactions to real or perceived incidents of harassment involving their significant others. It makes sense I guess but still kinda fascinating.

[Arles]

I think it's the opposite. If Trump isn't elected, Weinstein is still just the guy that women in Hollywood know they have to put up with to get ahead.
I think this is spot on. Hollywood spent 18 months railing on Trump for (rightly) being a powerful sleazebag in regards to treating women. At some point, I think even some in Hollywood have a bit of a conscience and say "Wait, if we are clamoring for women's rights with Trump, how can we keep turning a blind eye to this perv Weinstein".

If Trump isn't the republican nominee, I'm not sure any of this stuff ever sees the light of day.

[PilotMan]

Taking advantage of her in a rehearsal like that is waaaay out of line. He isn't the first to do it, but it's almost always a way for an older, more established actor to take advantage of a younger, inexperienced actress. It happens because the woman will probably be too scared to say anything, and if she does the man can always claim he was just really into the scene. It's predatory, plain and simple.

It was a completely bullshit thing to do, no question. And if you're going to clean house in all of Congress he is free to go, but behaving like a jackass is the sort of thing I'd expect to see in a comedy tour. It crossed a line and he should have realized then. It's still not parking behind a dumpster.

[cuervo72]

Maybe the USO can get rid of the eye candy/sex object role?

[NobodyHere]

Maybe the USO can get rid of the eye candy/sex object role?

Why?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/u4SdcfA33E0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[JonInMiddleGA]

Maybe the USO can get rid of the eye candy/sex object role?

Yes, let's replace it with, I dunno, some nice family board games or something.
That'll put butts in seats.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I have no doubt that Moore will win his election.

Oh I have doubts. Then again, with any electorate, I always have some degree of doubt.

[cuervo72]

Yes, let's replace it with, I dunno, some nice family board games or something.
That'll put butts in seats.

I dunno - I'm thinking Steve Harvey putting on Family Feud would probably beat out some skit with an old SNL alum and an aging model/poker hostess.

I guess what I've wondered for a while - and not having served, I have no idea, so any input from vets is appreciated - is how effective USO tours are for morale. Are they (like variety shows, telethons, etc) an entertainment format which has outlived its usefulness. Has communications and the ability to access other entertainment (including, oh, porn) obsoleted much of the content. I mean, I don't know if we're still in the era where troops are lusting after Betty Grable's legs taped to the top of their foot locker.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I dunno - I'm thinking Steve Harvey putting on Family Feud would probably beat out some skit with an old SNL alum and an aging model/poker hostess.

Can't have that.

Harvey uses suggestions of lechery as part of his humor after all.

[BBT]

I dunno - I'm thinking Steve Harvey putting on Family Feud would probably beat out some skit with an old SNL alum and an aging model/poker hostess.

I guess what I've wondered for a while - and not having served, I have no idea, so any input from vets is appreciated - is how effective USO tours are for morale. Are they (like variety shows, telethons, etc) an entertainment format which has outlived its usefulness. Has communications and the ability to access other entertainment (including, oh, porn) obsoleted much of the content. I mean, I don't know if we're still in the era where troops are lusting after Betty Grable's legs taped to the top of their foot locker.

USO tours haven’t been like what you see in movies for a long time now. Closest I saw to anything like that over my career (1998-2016) was about 4 Redskins cheerleaders coming over with some former NFL players (Darren Woodson and 3 others) in 2012. They basically ran a “training camp” and signed some autographs. Otherwise, it’s mostly celebrities coming over to give a quick speech, bands/cover bands/military bands, or a few lower-rung comedians doing stand-up routines. The WWE does a show over there as well.

Military has been hammered by sexual assaults over the past few decades so the culture is completely different than the days when you’d see Playboy playmates or “eye candy” at the shows. Even still, just about anything draws as there isn’t much else to do when you aren’t working or sleeping.

[mckerney]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">.<a href="https://twitter.com/BillForOhio?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@BillForOhio</a>, a sitting Ohio Supreme Court justice and Democratic gubernatorial candidate, apparently posted on Facebook about his sexual escapades.<br><br>&quot;In the last fifty years I was sexually intimate with approximately 50 very attractive females.&quot; <a href="https://t.co/TUNT2IVbTt">pic.twitter.com/TUNT2IVbTt</a></p>&mdash; Eric Heisig (@eheisig) <a href="https://twitter.com/eheisig/status/931569176338141185?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 17, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Uhh... wow.

[JonInMiddleGA]

See, you had to know that bragging was going to eventually begin ;)

[albionmoonlight]

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

[Coffee Warlord]

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

You'n me both.

[panerd]

I thought that as well. I like this guy.

[PilotMan]

4th'd

[ISiddiqui]

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

That may have scored a lot of votes in Ohio though...

[cuervo72]

Eh, not so sure!

A Republican 'Family Values' State Legislator Quits After Having Sex With a Man in His Office (http://www.newsweek.com/republican-family-values-state-legislator-quits-sex-man-713821)

[mckerney]

Eh, not so sure!

A Republican 'Family Values' State Legislator Quits After Having Sex With a Man in His Office (http://www.newsweek.com/republican-family-values-state-legislator-quits-sex-man-713821)

To be completely fair to him, he only said his marriage was "natural," he didn't say his extramarital affairs were as well.

[stevew]

Trickle down economics at work, people.

[Edward64]

It was a completely bullshit thing to do, no question. And if you're going to clean house in all of Congress he is free to go, but behaving like a jackass is the sort of thing I'd expect to see in a comedy tour. It crossed a line and he should have realized then. It's still not parking behind a dumpster.

:+1:

[Thomkal]

So I think by the time this is over, all sitting representatives and senators will have allegations about harassment against them, and none will be left to run the government. One way to clean up the swamp I guess.

Honestly I can see these things used in just about every election from now on whether its true or not. Sad.

[BYU 14]

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

I went back and had to do the same thing, thinking Bob Taft is an attractive female??

[thesloppy]

Count me in as another who read that as sexin' up Bob Taft....and reading it that way made me think the dude was being sarcastic and I was practically laughing along with him....until I was forced to re-read it and realize it was actually just some weird version of entirely humorless bragging.

[Eaglesfan27]

I had to read that, like, three times to realize that he wasn't bragging about making passionate love to Senator Bob Taft.

Same here. I was questioning my knowledge of Bob Taft until I re-read it the 3rd time.

[Chief Rum]

I don't know if Bob Taft is still around, but methinks if he is, he probably picked up a few votes for being so damn attractive.

[Noop]

Actually yes, it would surprise me.

I'm sure it happens but "equally"?

I would guess that if they were properly prosecuted and the victims would speak up the numbers would far out pace men.

I know it sounds like hyperbole ...

[tarcone]

I was thinking Bob was an unusual name for a woman.

[ISiddiqui]

Bob Taft will be whoever the fuck you want him to be!

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[Ben E Lou]

We have another accuser of Franken.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/20/politics/al-franken-inappropriate-touch-2010/index.html

[Kodos]

He needs to go.

[Jas_lov]

Franken shouldn't resign unless Trump does. Trump and the Republicans have no moral authority on this issue.

[JPhillips]

Franken shouldn't resign unless Trump does. Trump and the Republicans have no moral authority on this issue.

My sins are still my sins regardless of the degree of your sins.

I expected more shoes and drop, and Franken needs to go.

[molson]

I hope in Franken's next apology he says he's groped far less woman than Donald Trump so we really shouldn't worry about it

[Marc Vaughan]

My sins are still my sins regardless of the degree of your sins.

I expected more shoes and drop, and Franken needs to go.

This is my perspective - I actually like(d) Franken a lot and he talks a lot of sense generally, however this undermines his influence and as such he'd be better off to leave with what dignity he has left.

That Trump and some others don't do the right thing doesn't excuse him from doing so ...

[cuervo72]

I hope in Franken's next apology he says he's groped far less woman than Donald Trump so we really shouldn't worry about it

Do you mean fewer women or smaller asses?

[Edward64]

My sins are still my sins regardless of the degree of your sins.

I expected more shoes and drop, and Franken needs to go.

I think degrees of sins do factor in. However, a pattern seems to be emerging here but lets have it play out a little longer to see what (if any) additional things pop up.

[Ben E Lou]

Isn't that a safe Dem seat in a state with a Dem governor? What's the downside for the Dems of losing Franken and putting someone else in?

[JPhillips]

I think everyone, including the GOP, is scared to create a precedent of resigning when we know there's been some unknown amount of harassment settlements and a number of accusations against sitting congressmen.

Once the light is turned on, who knows how many men will get caught up in this.

[thesloppy]

It'll be interesting to see if this shift in attitudes towards sexual abuse ends up being an/the impetus to clear the boomer generation out of positions of power, both in government and industry. Plenty of folks want to dismiss this stuff as merely a difference in culture between generations, and if that's true it just goes further towards showing why a group of 70-80 year olds shouldn't be in charge of determining the terms & laws of our current culture.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Plenty of folks want to dismiss this stuff as merely a difference in culture between generations, and if that's true it just goes further towards showing why a group of 70-80 year olds shouldn't be in charge of determining the terms & laws of our current culture.

Why? They've got more sense overall than the following gens of snowflakes. I'd sure as hell take the failings of the older one over the comic/tragic uselessness that seems to be prevalent in the younger gens.

[Edward64]

It'll be interesting to see if this shift in attitudes towards sexual abuse ends up being an/the impetus to clear the boomer generation out of positions of power, both in government and industry. Plenty of folks want to dismiss this stuff as merely a difference in culture between generations, and if that's true it just goes further towards showing why a group of 70-80 year olds shouldn't be in charge of determining the terms & laws of our current culture.

I really don't think its just the boomer generation. I think there are plenty of Gen X that are in positions of power that also abuse their authority.

[thesloppy]

Why? They've got more sense overall than the following gens of snowflakes. I'd sure as hell take the failings of the older one over the comic/tragic uselessness that seems to be prevalent in the younger gens.

Based on what? The younger generation hasn't had the same chance to govern (and fail) yet, as far as I'm concerned. It also seems worth pointing out that if we likewise judged the Boomer generation against the stereotypes of their youthful ideals then we'd expect the complaints today to be about their unchecked feminism, civil rights concerns and sexually liberated attitudes, rather than the exact opposites.

[thesloppy]

I really don't think its just the boomer generation. I think there are plenty of Gen X that are in positions of power that also abuse their authority.

For sure, but in those cases it's usually regarded as a failing of the individual, rather than excused as a leftover response from a bygone era.

[digamma]

Isn't that a safe Dem seat in a state with a Dem governor? What's the downside for the Dems of losing Franken and putting someone else in?

It was a safe seat for Franken. As an open seat I think it is very much an open race. HRC won the state by less than a point. D governor right now and the Ds are likely to keep the governorship next year really based on the current candidate crop, but both houses of the state legislature are safely Republican.

[mckerney]

Franken shouldn't resign unless Trump does. Trump and the Republicans have no moral authority on this issue.

No. Franken should resign and the Dems shouldn't hold themselves to a lower moral standard just because the other side does.

[NobodyHere]

I'm all for letting the voters decide who their senator should be, not the parties.

But the Democrats should get rid of Bill Clinton's superdelegate status.

[JPhillips]

I would agree that he shouldn't be expelled. I'm very uncomfortable with the idea of expulsion in all but extreme crimes, and, yes, that includes Roy Moore. They should both leave voluntarily, but if they don't it will fall to the voters.

[Jas_lov]

And now Charlie Rose goes down. Suspended by CBS.

[Autumn]

It'll be interesting to see if this shift in attitudes towards sexual abuse ends up being an/the impetus to clear the boomer generation out of positions of power, both in government and industry. Plenty of folks want to dismiss this stuff as merely a difference in culture between generations, and if that's true it just goes further towards showing why a group of 70-80 year olds shouldn't be in charge of determining the terms & laws of our current culture.

That would be fantastic. I'm so tired of being held hostage to a whole series of really outdated approaches to life. I think it's pretty safe to say that if all the sexual misconduct comes to light, there won't be many of these guys left in power, and good riddance. There's nothing fundamentally better about any one generation over another, but the fact is that the bulk of the rest of us are ready to move on to a more enlightened approach to life, and it's these guys clinging on to their power and their secrets that are slowing us down.

[Sweed]

So power only corrupts boomers? yeah, ok :lol:

Here's a news flash for you.... It won't get any better when the next generation takes over.

[QuikSand]

So, this $15m in taxpayer money that has apparently been handed out secretly in settlements arising from members of Congress accused of harassment and the like... that's all coming, out publicly, pretty soon, right?

I'm not sure they'll pass the big reform bill that's been filed...but airing out "the list" is such an obvious thing for the gathered throngs to seek, isn't it? And if a few heads have to roll along the way, so be it.

[PilotMan]

So, this $15m in taxpayer money that has apparently been handed out secretly in settlements arising from members of Congress accused of harassment and the like... that's all coming, out publicly, pretty soon, right?

I'm not sure they'll pass the big reform bill that's been filed...but airing out "the list" is such an obvious thing for the gathered throngs to seek, isn't it? And if a few heads have to roll along the way, so be it.

No question that should be the goal and down with them all.

[JPhillips]

I'm a little torn about the list being public. It wouldn't be hard to match names and dates to when people left employment, thereby exposing victims. I don't want any of the victims to face an army of on-line detectives trying to prove they lied.

[Autumn]

So power only corrupts boomers? yeah, ok :lol:

Here's a news flash for you.... It won't get any better when the next generation takes over.

A) I don't think this is only a matter of power. In these particular cases we're talking power combined with cultural attitudes around sex and gender. And I'm talking more generally simply about attitudes and openness towards race, sexuality, gender, etc. I think that younger generations start from a different default position there.

B) Taking out a calcified layer of powerful old rich white guys means real opportunity for diversity. As we see in every layer of society, even when nods towards diversity are made, they rarely make real headway because the folks at the very top don't give up their power. We get female actors, but very few directors, for example. Little change in diversity in corporate America because hiring new diverse employees doesn't trickle up into management. Clear these people out and suddenly there's opportunity to put a black female at the top of a studio or a company. Unless there's wholesale change at the top, it will take forever for minorities to move up into positions of power, just as we've seen in the world of football where it took forever to even get African-American coaches, and how much longer until the owners look like modern America? I'd like to see the equivalent of the owners turned over and those opportunities go to a more diverse, openminded crowd. Will they eventually be corrupted by power? Sure. But then we'll have new problems to deal with rather than the same old ones.

[Ben E Lou]

9 Democratic Senators (and counting) are calling for Franken to resign.

[Ben E Lou]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Senator Franken will be making an announcement tomorrow. More details to come.</p>&mdash; Sen. Al Franken (@SenFranken) <a href="https://twitter.com/SenFranken/status/938462834597548032?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 6, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Jas_lov]

I think Franken should resign but I like how the GOP is actively promoting a pedophile and nobody seems to care anymore. Moore will just get elected and go on like nothing happened.

[CrimsonFox]

yup. Franken should say he'll resign if Moore and Trump do. Only fair

[Kodos]

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-democrats-are-finally-pushing-franken-to-resign/

[JPhillips]

I did not anticipate conservatives and Fox News coming to the defense of Franken.

[cuervo72]

Wait, they are? Though if so, he IS a man (vs Gillibrand, who is setting herself up as the leader here), and if they generally don't agree with whatever D leadership does...I guess I can see that.

[NobodyHere]

I did not anticipate conservatives and Fox News coming to the defense of Franken.

Most likely they want to create division in the Democratic base.

[Ben E Lou]

I did not anticipate conservatives and Fox News coming to the defense of Franken.Why wouldn't they? Is there any downside, especially if--as many suspect--the decision is already made? They get to claim consistency on not calling for the heads of Moore/Trump, and it reinforces the anger for some of the far left who are already angry at the Dems over this. ("SEE!!! EVEN FOX NEWS UNDERSTANDS!!!") I'd think that the Republican/Fox response could help push a few more far lefties to vote for third parties or sit out elections.

[mckerney]

I did not anticipate conservatives and Fox News coming to the defense of Franken.

They want sexual assault and harassment to be something they can attack Democrats over but they don't want an environment where Republicans might get punished or be expected to resign for it.

[PilotMan]

They want sexual assault and harassment to be something they can attack Democrats over but they don't want an environment where Republicans might get punished or be expected to resign for it.

It's this all day long. They don't want the D's to have the high road in 2018 and what may come with Trump down the road. They don't want this to become a 'thing'.

[JPhillips]

To be clear, I understand why, I just didn't see this course of events playing out. Can you imagine the odds on a bet in 2012 of Franken resigning whilst the GOP defends him?

[Ben E Lou]

Wow. Watching his speech now. If he's resigning, he ain't going down quietly.

[Ben E Lou]

"Some of the allegations against me simply aren't true. Others I remember quite differently."

[Ben E Lou]

Wow. He basically said that the ethics committee would have exonerated him, but he's resigning anyway.

[Ben E Lou]

Yeah..this is pretty accurate:
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Kind of an odd resignation speech:<br>I have promoted women's issues.<br>The allegations are not true.<br>I'm leaving.<br>Trump and Moore are worse.</p>&mdash; Jon Ralston (@RalstonReports) <a href="https://twitter.com/RalstonReports/status/938814477486534656?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 7, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[ISiddiqui]

Holy crap!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">SOURCES: <a href="https://twitter.com/CNN?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@CNN</a> and <a href="https://twitter.com/washingtonpost?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@washingtonpost</a> working on exposing 20-30 congressional members 4 sexual harassment. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/DC?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#DC</a></p>&mdash; Michael Trujillo (@mikehtrujillo) <a href="https://twitter.com/mikehtrujillo/status/938815136571129856?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 7, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Ben E Lou]

Holy crap!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">SOURCES: <a href="https://twitter.com/CNN?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@CNN</a> and <a href="https://twitter.com/washingtonpost?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@washingtonpost</a> working on exposing 20-30 congressional members 4 sexual harassment. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/DC?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#DC</a></p>&mdash; Michael Trujillo (@mikehtrujillo) <a href="https://twitter.com/mikehtrujillo/status/938815136571129856?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 7, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>Only 20-30? (Seriously, I'd assume that number would be higher...)

[JonInMiddleGA]

Only 20-30? (Seriously, I'd assume that number would be higher...)

Those are just the ones they're choosing to go after.

[bronconick]

I did not anticipate conservatives and Fox News coming to the defense of Franken.


I did notice a conservative on the Washington Post suggest Clarence Thomas step down, since they could replace him with a 32 year old clone

[ISiddiqui]

Only 20-30? (Seriously, I'd assume that number would be higher...)

Maybe those are the numbers they have proof about. As the WaPo showed recently, they go through some lengths to verify their exposes.

[RainMaker]

Those are just the ones they're choosing to go after.

It's the one's that received taxpayer settlements from what I gather.

[RainMaker]

Down goes Harold Ford Jr.

Exclusive: Former Congressman Harold Ford Jr. Fired For Misconduct By Morgan Stanley | HuffPost (https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/harold-ford-fired-morgan-stanley_us_5a29743ee4b0b185e53a0ce6?psa)

[Kodos]

Is anyone else waiting for Mitch McConnell to be accused? Tell me that guy doesn't do creepy stuff.

[RainMaker]

I don't even know anymore. McConnell seems like the boringest person on the planet.

Then again so does Joe Barton and he was sending pics of his junk to women.

[I. J. Reilly]

I don't even know anymore. McConnell seems like the boringest person on the planet.

Then again so does Joe Barton and he was sending pics of his junk to women.

With all the shit going down dick pics are kind of boring. At this point if she's over 18 and he didn't touch her it's almost chivalrous.

[miami_fan]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/07/politics/trent-franks-resigns/index.html

Arizona GOP Rep. Trent Franks will resign, sources say

[RainMaker]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/07/politics/trent-franks-resigns/index.html

Arizona GOP Rep. Trent Franks will resign, sources say

Supposedly this is for asking two female staffers to be surrogates for a child. And not in the "we'll have a doctor do this" sort of way.

[CrimsonFox]

Is anyone else waiting for Mitch McConnell to be accused? Tell me that guy doesn't do creepy stuff.

he's a '"puts the lotion on its skin or it will get the hose again" type of guy hands down

[stevew]

McConnell has definitely told a young staffer to go get the butter* at one point in time.



*Nobody is going to get this Last Tango in Paris reference.

[NobodyHere]

But I'mm sure he's told some female staffer to get the TurtleWax

[JonInMiddleGA]

But I'mm sure he's told some female staffer to get the TurtleWax


Thanks a lot. Now I've got the damned TurtleWax jingle stuck in my head.

[RainMaker]

This is the weirdest approach to getting laid I've seen in awhile.

Female aides said Franks suggested intercourse to impregnate them - POLITICO (https://www.politico.com/story/2017/12/08/trent-franks-sex-surrogacy-impregnate-287808)

[Chief Rum]

This is the weirdest approach to getting laid I've seen in awhile.

Female aides said Franks suggested intercourse to impregnate them - POLITICO (https://www.politico.com/story/2017/12/08/trent-franks-sex-surrogacy-impregnate-287808)

To be fair, that's how it works (headline).

[tarcone]

I guess this is one way to clean out congress.

[Edward64]

I think he could have found many surrogates for alot less than $5M.

Something doesn't seem right with the story.

[JPhillips]

He wasn't offering 5m for a surrogate, he was trying to get them to agree to sex for a promise of money. Money that I bet he would have never produced.

[Edward64]

The article said this?

Also on Friday, the Associated Press reported that Franks offered to pay an aide $5 million to carry his child and pressured her relentlessly on the matter.

[stevew]

Family values!!!

[molson]

Probably the right thread for this, but nobody in the 9th Circuit legal community is surprised about Alex Kozinski.

[RainMaker]

Probably the right thread for this, but nobody in the 9th Circuit legal community is surprised about Alex Kozinski.

Ha! My good friend went to law school with people in that circle and was texting saying it was widely known he was a huge pervert. He also said that a bunch of judges are but it's really hard to speak out against it because of judicial confidentiality (I think that's what it's called?). Plus they can basically destroy your career with a phone call.

[BYU 14]

Ha! My good friend went to law school with people in that circle and was texting saying it was widely known he was a huge pervert. He also said that a bunch of judges are but it's really hard to speak out against it because of judicial confidentiality (I think that's what it's called?). Plus they can basically destroy your career with a phone call.

I can't even fathom the depth that some of this shit runs at this level of power.

[RainMaker]

Pervert train continues to roll on.

Trent Franks rescinded my internship when I wouldn’t come to his house - The Washington Post (https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trent-franks-rescinded-my-internship-when-i-wouldnt-come-to-his-house/2017/12/15/7972ed14-e1ba-11e7-bbd0-9dfb2e37492a_story.html)

[Thomkal]

So, if God tells her to, considering a run for Franken's seat is none other than one of my least favorite people on this earth....

Bachmann considering running for Franken's seat | TheHill (http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/367069-bachmann-considering-running-for-frankens-seat)

[larrymcg421]

So, if God tells her to, considering a run for Franken's seat is none other than one of my least favorite people on this earth....

Bachmann considering running for Franken's seat | TheHill (http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/367069-bachmann-considering-running-for-frankens-seat)

Maybe Marcus will finally come out of the closet and run against her.

[Ryche]

Bachmann almost lost her last election in the most Republican district in Minnesota.

[CrimsonFox]

So, if God tells her to, considering a run for Franken's seat is none other than one of my least favorite people on this earth....

Bachmann considering running for Franken's seat | TheHill (http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/367069-bachmann-considering-running-for-frankens-seat)

just threw up in my mouth a bit

[RainMaker]

So, if God tells her to, considering a run for Franken's seat is none other than one of my least favorite people on this earth....

Bachmann considering running for Franken's seat | TheHill (http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/367069-bachmann-considering-running-for-frankens-seat)

The Democrats pray she wins the primary.

[larrymcg421]

The Democrats pray she wins the primary.

They are Akin for it.

[Thomkal]

heh

[CrimsonFox]

The Democrats pray she wins the primary.

They said that about Trump :P