A Wererolf, a Vampire, and a Villager Walk Into a Bar (Game Over, Vampires Win)

[EagleFan]

Welcome to town... allow me to show you around. You will find that we have a wonderful little village with all of the normal sites that any quaint countryside village may have. Your local general store, a doctor's office, a post office, a sheriff's office, school, library, pub, full moon lock down cell, tailor, barbershop... pretty much everything that any small town will offer.

What's that you say? Barbershop? That's where you get a haircut... oh, not that one... tailor? No? Oh, you mean the full moon lock down cell? That's where the town goes during every full moon to spend the evening to prevent any injuries from occurring because of transformation.

Okay, there may be one thing we left out. Everyone in town is also a werewolf. We use the lock down cells to keep everyone safe.

You'll find we are pretty much like any community.... OR we used to me.

An evil force has infiltrated our town. We are not sure what the force is yet but if has been randomly killing off our good people and we are trying to find out who, or what, is behind it.

That leads me to our next request before you move in... We need you to prove your true nature. We need to verify that you are a werewolf, just like us...

[EagleFan]

Rules

General
Number of deadlines: 1 deadline per day

Deadline: 10:00 PM EST - 10:00 posts count, 10:01 and later is too late

Outside Contact: Please, no contact outside of the game other than using PM's (if you are on a team that is allowed PM rights)


Voting
Voting - Bold your vote in this format Vote EagleFan to allow your vote to stand out.

Voting - Please either put your vote in a post of it's own or on a separate line within your post so that the vote will stand out easily.

Unvoting - To back your vote out use the same rules as for voting but use this format Unvote EagleFan

Ties - We never like ties... what will happen in the event of a tie? Try one to find out... :D


Winning the Game
Werewolves - Eliminate all of the enemy (enemies?)
Villager - Achieve even numbers with the Werewolves and eliminate any other entity
Vampires - If they really exist, eliminate villagers (and any other entity) and achieve even numbers with the Werewolves
Others - Conditions will be defined in your role PM

Order of Actions
1) Any Watch/Scan
2) Count conversion
3) Villager Attack
4) Vampire Attack
5) Heal
6) Convert Action


Roles (possible)
Doctor - Can heal a fellow wolf who was attacked.

Town Watch - Will watch over a player to see if any action was performed by that player, or against that player.

Brutal - If attacked, there is a 50% chance of also killing the attacker.

Wise Wolf - Can perform a seer ceremony to discover the true nature of their target.

Vanilla Wolf - Average werewolf.

Recently Converted Wolf - There maker is still around and will be converted back to a villager if their maker dies at the hands of the village. Has a secret ability that only they will know about.

Villager Seeking Revenge - Had a loved one killed by a werewolf and wants revenge. If taken out by a wolf will fire off a silver bullet at a target to eliminate them as well.

Vanilla Villager - Part of the villager team.

Contained Wolf - A villager who was scratched by a werewolf as a child but never turned, has werewolf DNA and will scan as a wolf.

The Count - Leader of the Vampires; chased from his home many miles away and had to choose this town to settle in. Can convert a werewolf to a killing machine.

Vanilla Vampire - Your average every day vampire.

[EagleFan]

Signup

1) britrock88 - Vanilla Villager (night 3 kill)
2) bhlloy - The Count (night 3 kill)
3) timmae - Recently Converted Wolf (day 3 lynch)
4) henry296
5) GoldenEagle
6) LoneStarGirl
7) Telle
8) RendeR
9) Autumn - Vanilla wolf (night 2 kill)
10) Chief Rum - Vanilla Wolf (day 2 lynch)

[EagleFan]

Will have more details posted later tonight. It will be a 3 team game (if we have enough signups), if not it will be basic two teams... with one difference... The Werewolves are the good guys...

[britrock88]

In.

[bhlloy]

Seems like the absolute perfect time to get back into this... I’m in

[Poli]

Hopefully this takes off!

[timmae]

I may have time for this!!

[henry296]

In

[GoldenEagle]

in.

[EagleFan]

We're slowly getting there. I'll bump the thread in OT.

[LoneStarGirl]

Count me in!

[EagleFan]

Will send out a few more feelers to see if we can get this into double digits.

[Telle]

So is this likely to happen or no? I'm in if it gets off the ground.

[EagleFan]

I'll add Telle's name to the mix. Would like a couple more but if not I'll adjust accordingly.

[RendeR]

Fuck yeah, count my dumb ass in, I'm sure I'll die fast.

[EagleFan]

Fuck yeah, count my dumb ass in, I'm sure I'll die fast.

Your dumb ass is in... :D

[EagleFan]

I'll give the signups until Saturday and we'll get it started next Monday with rules based upon number of players.

[Autumn]

I'd love to get back in a game. I'm worried that my schedule right now is so crazy, but I'll do my best.

[EagleFan]

Welcome Autumn

[RendeR]

I'll give the signups until Saturday and we'll get it started next Monday with rules based upon number of players.

:popcorn: :) :eek: :D :D :cool: :popcorn: :) ;)

[timmae]

Ready to rock this!!

[Chief Rum]

It's technically Sunday morning, but I haven't gone to sleep from "Saturday" yet. Does that count?

In if you got room.

[Telle]

I'd love to get back in a game. I'm worried that my schedule right now is so crazy, but I'll do my best.

Yeah my work load is a level of magnitude above what it used to be, so playing is going to be tough for me. Not likely to be able to maintain my detailed spreadsheets like I used to! Hoping to have some fun regardless.

[EagleFan]

Welcome Chief

[EagleFan]

Sorry all, was a rough weekend. This morning I said "crap, I think it's later than Saturday"

[EagleFan]

The evening was eerily silent as the sound of the rain could be heard almost echoing off the ground. No birds chirping, no crickets, not a frog to be heard. The once beautiful and peaceful village has been turned into a killing field but what triggered it?

The quaint village is much different than other villages in that all residents are werewolves who have moved away from the rest of civilization to live out their lives in peace, though each night they lock themselves away to protect everyone in the village from what will happen when the moon is full. The problem is, as they have learned, a full moon happens EVERY night, just because one cannot see the entire lit side of the moon does not mean it is not there.

Their system of checks and balances had worked for years, what happened last night? What was this cruel hand of fate? A malfunction of a lock? Of several locks?

All they knew is that this morning a blood bath happened and now the town is full of additional people trying to find out what happened. They claim to all be wolves but something is off, something is not right.

A howl breaks the silence, not one of confidence and grandeur but one of pain and suffering. A shot rings out, silence has returned. This is far from over...

As the daylight returns everyone returns from their locked up state to find that EagleFan has been shot, a silver bullet sealing his fate. You are no longer safe. You must find out who these new people are. The ten newest members of the village are gathered together and locked into the mansion at the center of town. There are enough safety cages for each member to safely lock themselves in during the evening but that is not why they were locked away in the mansion. They were locked away to find out which one of them is the evil that has entered the village, or is it worse than just one... more than one? ALL of them?

The gate closes and the lock clicks loudly. You must determine your own fate now.

You come together, many arguing as a newly formed feeling of resentment swells over the group. Who is the evil? Who must go?

[EagleFan]

Tuesday night at 10:00 PM (EDT) will be the first deadline.

Use this time to discuss who you think should be brought up on charges first.

Use the voting system detailed in the rules to cast your vote.

Please ask me anything that you have questions about either in thread or through PM.

[EagleFan]

Game On

[Autumn]

Glad to be back for game on, everybody. Chances we lynch someone for mistakenly calling themselves a villager or calling the bad guys wolves?: 98%

[EagleFan]

Glad to be back for game on, everybody. Chances we lynch someone for mistakenly calling themselves a villager or calling the bad guys wolves?: 98%

Might take the over on that... ;)

[EagleFan]

It was weird writing up the PM's. Had to keep rechecking the wording. Plus, way out of practice for this so I hope this goes well.

[Chief Rum]

Yea this is a bit weird, on top of not playing in forever. I'm sure we'll deal with it.

[henry296]

I'm a wolf, but this time I'm a good guy.

[Telle]

So the first game back in forever, and you have to make it even more difficult for everyone? Well, at least we get to play again :)

[timmae]

Yep, this is weird but just happy to be playing again! How many baddies (vamps/villagers) do we think we have? 2 out of 10? Man I am rusty. Happy to be a wolf!

[Telle]

So we have 11 possible roles and only 10 people playing. I'm a vanilla wolf, and I imagine there has to be another vanilla wolf or two just because I refuse to believe that with all those roles I alone managed to draw the most boring one among them.

So how many of the possible roles do we think are actually in play? I'm thinking 2 each of vampires and villagers? That or the vampires are a red herring and there's 2 or 3 villagers.

[henry296]

I can't imagine just 1 vampire, so either 2 and 2 or probably 3 villagers if no vampires.

[timmae]

The fact that both villager roles and vampire roles are listed leads me to believe they are likely both included. Is 4 out of 10 a crazy ratio? Villagers and vampires both have to have equal numbers to wolves in order to win. Does a 2-2-6 split make sense overall? Then 4 wolves would need to be voted off for either sanction to possibly win.

[Autumn]

I'm guessing vampires were a possibility if our numbers were larger, but with such a small game, I doubt we see that. It's already hard to balance a 10-person game. Two-three villagers I would guess. Maybe three if we have some good wolf roles.

[Chief Rum]

I think the baddies have to be two or three. Four is way too much.

I suspect there are two villagers, if the Count is in the game. Three if he is not. Maybe still two without the Count if there is a recently converted wolf in the game.

I am thinking maybe half the roles will be in the game at most. And I assume the more basic WW roles are here, the seer, the bodyguard (guess that's the doctor), brutal, cunning, etc.

My bet is the Count might be able to expand his group. Not sure if the killing machine part is that, or if it is a separate ability.

[Telle]

But the definition of "baddies" is murky. The villagers and vampires are against each other as much as they are against the wolves. So two of each is reasonable.

[Autumn]

Killing machine not the words you want to hear in a WW game.

[Autumn]

So, do we have a deadline tonight, in 3.5 hours? If so, we better start voting!

[Telle]

So, do we have a deadline tonight, in 3.5 hours? If so, we better start voting!

Nope. First deadline is Tuesday night.

[Autumn]

Oh phew. That was going to be a madhouse. In that case, relax everyone! No one will die for a while.

[Chief Rum]

But the definition of "baddies" is murky. The villagers and vampires are against each other as much as they are against the wolves. So two of each is reasonable.

Yea you make a good point. I could see two of each, given the "competition" element.

[Chief Rum]

Lol... I swear I was thinking the same thing. Yay for Tuesday.

[GoldenEagle]

So, I guess I shouldn't say vanilla villager checking in......

But looking forward to this. The last WW PM I had was over 5 years ago. I am not sure when the last game ran.

[RendeR]

Hey folks, sorry I'm late, took a long nap before work tonight then stared at my phone for a couple hours (blame the guys that found retro-bowl!!!)


as some have mentioned there are a ton of roles and only so many people, so either everyone has a vital role and choosing to kill someone is going to either make or break this game on night 1 or as someone said its a smoke screen and we have a typical 2-3 wolves and ton of villagers.

having not been playing in awhile I'm reticent to throw out an opinion but I think EF would include as much variety as possible, so I'm thinking there are very few vanillas and only 1 or 2 of anything else.

[Telle]

as some have mentioned there are a ton of roles and only so many people, so either everyone has a vital role and choosing to kill someone is going to either make or break this game on night 1 or as someone said its a smoke screen and we have a typical 2-3 wolves and ton of villagers.

Psssst... other way around.

[RendeR]

Whateva :P

[RendeR]

Please remember everyone, telle and I are married and we've been locked down together for over a month now. Anything she says can and should be used against her.

[EagleFan]

Hey folks, sorry I'm late, took a long nap before work tonight then stared at my phone for a couple hours (blame the guys that found retro-bowl!!!)


as some have mentioned there are a ton of roles and only so many people, so either everyone has a vital role and choosing to kill someone is going to either make or break this game on night 1 or as someone said its a smoke screen and we have a typical 2-3 wolves and ton of villagers.

having not been playing in awhile I'm reticent to throw out an opinion but I think EF would include as much variety as possible, so I'm thinking there are very few vanillas and only 1 or 2 of anything else.

I stumbled upon retro bowl recently too, that was where some time this morning went.

[EagleFan]

As of Post 54

...

[EagleFan]

Unaware of the potential horrors that await, each and every one of you feel quite uneasy. Why did you come to this village? Safety? To join others of your kind? Revenge? World Domination? Whatever the motive, you are questioning your decisions now.

Those from the village walk around the perimeter of the mansion's grounds, trying to get a look at these "creatures" on display. Either the horrors they have seen shook them to their core or maybe, just maybe, they are toying with you for a twisted reason of their own.

You must control your own fate, you must make the right moves and show that you are worthy to return to the village with the rest of "your kind"... doubt begins to creep into your mind... will you ever see the world outside of this makeshift dungeon you have been placed in? The paranoia is already starting to take over as everyone eyes each other very suspiciously.

Who are you? You just showed up 3 days ago? I have the scratches to show what I have been through out there, before I found what I hoped would be home... What about you?!?! I saw the look in your eyes when you saw a werewolf lifeless on the ground. That almost looked like a sense of pride. Is this some game to you? A hunt for sport perhaps?

Then you notice the crowd outside the fence has grown larger, and much more fierce... "Just kill them all!!!"

"No!!! That is not what we built this village on. We must allow this to play out. We know our true brothers will come out of this unharmed and will have removed the evil from our midst."

"Silence!" The elder of the village speaks, he has remained silent for years. The sound of his voice didn't exactly thunder through the village, much more squeaky than anticipated... "This day was foretold by our ancestors. The coming of a great evil would also be met by the arrival of a great savior. One that will purge the village of this evil and will rise to lead us to our rightful place in society. This day of reckoning is near."

[RendeR]

ruh roh raggie.....

[timmae]

Ok, so we have abit more info perhaps?

"Who are you? You just showed up 3 days ago? I have the scratches to show what I have been through out there, before I found what I hoped would be home... What about you?!?! I saw the look in your eyes when you saw a werewolf lifeless on the ground. That almost looked like a sense of pride. Is this some game to you? A hunt for sport perhaps?"

Scratches to show... possibly a 'Recently Converted Werewolf'? That means we have a maker also.

A hunt for sport perhaps... Does this allude to a vampire in our midst maybe?

I have a few more thoughts but will wait until later on in the day to mention as I'd like to see a few more check-ins first. Here's a list of status for each of us;

1) britrock88
2) bhlloy
3) timmae Posted
4) henry296 Posted
5) GoldenEagle Posted
6) LoneStarGirl
7) Telle Posted
8) RendeR Posted
9) Autumn Posted
10) Chief Rum Posted

I think we are waiting on 3 to post yet if I have back checked correctly.

[timmae]

I have the scratches to show what I have been through out there, before I found what I hoped would be home... Maybe this could be a 'Contained Wolf' instead of a 'Recently Converted Wolf'.

Arrival of a great savior... what the heck is that about?!

[timmae]

Please remember everyone, telle and I are married and we've been locked down together for over a month now. Anything she says can and should be used against her.

lol, nice you 2! It would be quite interesting if both of you were villagers or vamps!

[Telle]

Please remember everyone, telle and I are married and we've been locked down together for over a month now. Anything she says can and should be used against her.

Vote RendeR

[Telle]

1) britrock88
2) bhlloy
3) timmae Posted
4) henry296 Posted
5) GoldenEagle Posted
6) LoneStarGirl
7) Telle Posted
8) RendeR Posted
9) Autumn Posted
10) Chief Rum Posted

I think we are waiting on 3 to post yet if I have back checked correctly.

That matches what I have too.

[Autumn]

All right, not to be a cliche, but i had a Zoom meeting last night. But I am now ready to go. Let's get a check-in from everyone and figure out which of you is a nasty villager.

[henry296]

Given the delay between sign-ups and starting, I'm going to wait and make sure everyone checks-in as I think it is likely someone doesn't.

[Telle]

How have no-shows been handled in the past? Would they just be removed? Voting them out doesn't really get us any data and basically just delays everything a day.

[Autumn]

We typically have just argued about them for days. Towards the end as GM I started putting in rules about removing them after X days because it can become such a thorny issue.

In a new game after so long gone, I have to assume some won't notice it started until late in the day. Hopefully they will jump in actively once they get here.

[Autumn]

I'm not sure what role a great savior of the werewolves would hint at. Maybe something not even in the ruleset, as a Seer doesn't really seem like a savior that would be foretold. Might be more flavor than anything.

[timmae]

I'm not sure what role a great savior of the werewolves would hint at. Maybe something not even in the ruleset, as a Seer doesn't really seem like a savior that would be foretold. Might be more flavor than anything.

Could be... we'll see how this unfolds. I am hoping my hunches pay off. So far, I have a few likes/dislikes that are starting to emerge! Anyone else have some thoughts as to possible roles and how to snuff them out?

[henry296]

How have no-shows been handled in the past? Would they just be removed? Voting them out doesn't really get us any data and basically just delays everything a day.

Day 1 is just a random guess anyway. I'd like to know if a potential no-show has a valuable role so we can move on and realize we don't have that person rather than guessing.

[Telle]

Day 1 is a random guess for the "good guys". The groups that have communications privileges are not guessing randomly, and retrospective analysis can be useful. If there's agreement to just vote out a no-show, then there's no analysis to be done.

And at this point we have no idea which roles are actually in the game, so learning that we don't have a role because a no-show had it isn't as useful as it might be in different games.

My preference at this point is to just play as normal and ignore the no-shows for now. Give them a day to arrive.. and if they don't then see if EagleFan has a plan for that contingency or if we have to handle it ourselves. Putting off doing much in the way of voting until this evening in case they arrive by then makes sense, other than my vote for my husband for being an ass ;)

[timmae]

Let's get some discussion going...

Vote RendeR

[LoneStarGirl]

It’s been 5+ years since I’ve been involved in a werewolf game so it’s going to take a day or two to knock the dust off! Also keep in mind GoldenEagle and I are married but we’ve been quarantined together far too long so I’m going to use this game as an excuse to avoid talking to him. ��
I’m excited to be back!

[EagleFan]

As of post 72

RendeR 2 - Telle (61), timmae (71)

Yet to vote: britrock88, bhlloy, henry296, GoldenEagle, LoneStarGirl, RendeR, Autumn, Chief Rum

Yet to check in: britrock88, bhlloy

[timmae]

A pair of co-habitators! This will certainly be interesting if /when they flip! Let's see how good each of them is at reading their loved ones..errr... spouses!

[EagleFan]

A pair of co-habitators! This will certainly be interesting if /when they flip! Let's see how good each of them is at reading their loved ones..errr... spouses!

Great... I don't want to be partly responsible for tearing families apart... ;)

[timmae]

Yep, it's all EF's fault!

[EagleFan]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/XInWCDAcgek" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[henry296]

Day 1 is a random guess for the "good guys". The groups that have communications privileges are not guessing randomly, and retrospective analysis can be useful. If there's agreement to just vote out a no-show, then there's no analysis to be done.


It is a random guess for me then.

[britrock88]

I'm a wolf, but this time I'm a good guy.

This guy has it figured out... suspiciously quickly??? ;)

[britrock88]

Let's get some discussion going...

Vote RendeR

First second vote! :eek:

[britrock88]

Yet to check in: britrock88, bhlloy

To be contrarian, I will apply pressure to the absent! Maybe it will act as a summoning device.

VOTE bhlloy

[Autumn]

Pretty much everyone here, good.

I agree with Telle, since we don't know exactly what, or how many, roles are included in the game, we don't learn anything much by getting rid of someone who is a no-show or not active. And the information gained by voting out an inactive player and discovering their role is potentially more useful to the bad guys. It is to the wolves' benefit to keep the villagers in the dark and let our roled players do their thing. I'm therefore going to throw out a Day 1 not-much-there vote on Henry for his suggestion.

vote henry296

[timmae]

Things are starting to get interesting now! Down to 1 no show...

Not sure I like Henry's thoughts in posts 69 and 78 either. Care to expound on your thoughts Henry?

[EagleFan]

As of post 83:

RendeR 2 - Telle (61), timmae (71)
bhlloy 1 - britrock88 (81)
henry296 1 - Autumn (82)

Yet to vote: bhlloy, henry296, GoldenEagle, LoneStarGirl, RendeR, Chief Rum

Yet to check in: bhlloy

[henry296]

If we have someone inactive (which we probably won't) the speculation about that person's potential role as a villager would be distracting. While it would be bad to kill off a good guy role, it wouldn't help us since they didn't submit a night action. Since we likely don't have all of the roles, there will be speculation that causes confusion.

[timmae]

Lot's of confusion for sure! T'is why we love the game so..

[Chief Rum]

I'm going to put in a vote to bhlloy for now. I would rather have the role certainty if he doesn't show up.


VOTE BHLLOY

[LoneStarGirl]

I am confident bhlloy is going to show up and knock our socks off with his insight into this game thus far so I’m going to refrain from voting for him until he emerges. But if it’s not soon he’s getting my vote!

[britrock88]

Ain't no party like a D1 party!

[britrock88]

With only 5 of 10 votes cast and a 2-2-1 tally, this could unfold any which way between now and nightfall.

[EagleFan]

As of post 90:

RendeR 2 - Telle (61), timmae (71)
bhlloy 2 - britrock88 (81), Chief Rum (87)
henry296 1 - Autumn (82)

Yet to vote: bhlloy, henry296, GoldenEagle, LoneStarGirl, RendeR

Yet to check in: bhlloy

[EagleFan]

The crowd outside is growing restless. Their seems to be a collective blood lust beginning to grow. Something has been changing this once peaceful society. What happened the night EagleFan was killed? What dark cloud enveloped the village?

"We must be patient. The time has not yet arrived... but it nears..."

[timmae]

unvote RendeR

vote henry296

[Telle]

What is the point in voting for the person who hasn't checked in yet (bhlloy)? Having some default voting target like that just muddies the water. I question if those voting that way (or indicating they will) are villagers or vampires who KNOW that bhlloy isn't one of them and thus a good target for them.

[RendeR]

Maybe I'm forgetting a rule or something, but since day 1 is kind of a crap shoot, is there any benefit at all to simply....NOT killing anyone tonight? can we vote to "VOTE NO ONE"?

And if that is possible, could that help us in ANY way?

[britrock88]

Maybe I'm forgetting a rule or something, but since day 1 is kind of a crap shoot, is there any benefit at all to simply....NOT killing anyone tonight? can we vote to "VOTE NO ONE"?

And if that is possible, could that help us in ANY way?

A few concerns...

1) The village (so to speak) forfeits its opportunity to keep up with the bad guys' abilities to kill/take actions.
2) It might require 100% participation, depending on EF's interpretation of a single vote to lynch a player v. votes not to lynch. That would be susceptible to last-minute defection.
3) It could trigger a tie, which we have reason to be leery of.

[Telle]

Wouldn't having no lynch today just make Day 2 into Day 1? Eventually we gotta break the ice and kill someone, and until we do there's not much information to go on.

[RendeR]

A few concerns...

1) The village (so to speak) forfeits its opportunity to keep up with the bad guys' abilities to kill/take actions.
2) It might require 100% participation, depending on EF's interpretation of a single vote to lynch a player v. votes not to lynch. That would be susceptible to last-minute defection.
3) It could trigger a tie, which we have reason to be leery of.


Excellent points, thank you for the response!

I honestly don't have a feel for anyone at this time. But we have about 4.5 hours to figure one out.

[timmae]

The Recently Converted Wolf (Has a secret ability that only they will know about) and the Count (can convert a werewolf to a killing machine) seem to be the only roles with a dynamic that may be able to kill without a lynch. Not sure what the converted wolf ability would be so maybe not something that kills. Also not sure what a Killing Machine is.

[timmae]

Wouldn't having no lynch today just make Day 2 into Day 1? Eventually we gotta break the ice and kill someone, and until we do there's not much information to go on.

If we have a Wise Wolf we may get a look at one player's allegiance. However, if the Contained Wolf is in play it could come back as a bad reading (would that be a false negative?).

[Chief Rum]

unvote RendeR

vote henry296

Unwarranted vote switches without explanation strike me as being off. Why did you switch from Render to henry?

[timmae]

Unwarranted vote switches without explanation strike me as being off. Why did you switch from Render to henry?

Chief, you know better... I have my reasons. Let's see how this unfolds. Lot's to learn yet. Let's just say my vote on RendeR was going nowhere for a bit and the other voter on him was just an initial throw in vote by his better half. Some movement after jumping off RendeR may be telling. Maybe not. We'll see.

[Chief Rum]

I'll let it sit for now, but that's not really an explanation. It's also a second vote on someone whose first vote came from Autumn, who basically said he picked henry out of a hat.

In any case, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for the moment. But you should also know how terrible it looks to drop a vote switch with no explanation.

The only people that know anything right now are baddies.

[britrock88]

The Recently Converted Wolf (Has a secret ability that only they will know about) and the Count (can convert a werewolf to a killing machine) seem to be the only roles with a dynamic that may be able to kill without a lynch. Not sure what the converted wolf ability would be so maybe not something that kills. Also not sure what a Killing Machine is.

I don't know either, but I do know it's that much scarier when you capitalize it into being a Killing Machine. :D

[britrock88]

Roles (possible)
Doctor - Can heal a fellow wolf who was attacked.

Town Watch - Will watch over a player to see if any action was performed by that player, or against that player.

Brutal - If attacked, there is a 50% chance of also killing the attacker.

Wise Wolf - Can perform a seer ceremony to discover the true nature of their target.

Vanilla Wolf - Average werewolf.

Recently Converted Wolf - There maker is still around and will be converted back to a villager if their maker dies at the hands of the village. Has a secret ability that only they will know about.

Villager Seeking Revenge - Had a loved one killed by a werewolf and wants revenge. If taken out by a wolf will fire off a silver bullet at a target to eliminate them as well.

Vanilla Villager - Part of the villager team.

Contained Wolf - A villager who was scratched by a werewolf as a child but never turned, has werewolf DNA and will scan as a wolf.

The Count - Leader of the Vampires; chased from his home many miles away and had to choose this town to settle in. Can convert a werewolf to a killing machine.

Vanilla Vampire - Your average every day vampire.

Some interesting roles in here. Everything's a little confusing because of the reversal of villager/wolf dynamics.

The wolf roles have either been explained or make sense enough. As for the baddies...

The Vengeful Villager (EF, not sure how you missed that opportunity ;) ) appears to be a brutal. The Vanilla Villager is ... vanilla. There is no hint as to what the Villagers' actions might include.

The Count has a conversion mechanic, like a cult leader. Any converted wolf (cultist) would appear to be super-powerful. No clues as to any ability a Vanilla Vampire might have.

So, reading through this, I'm not sure how powerful the bad-guy teams are...

[Telle]

I'll let it sit for now, but that's not really an explanation. It's also a second vote on someone whose first vote came from Autumn, who basically said he picked henry out of a hat.

In any case, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for the moment. But you should also know how terrible it looks to drop a vote switch with no explanation.

The only people that know anything right now are baddies.

So you're one of the ones who has voted for the no-show, which is almost a meaningless vote, and yet you're actively criticizing someone else's vote that doesn't have much of an explanation behind it. Being overly suspicious like that can be an attempt from a "bad guy" to steer the voting away from another "bad guy".

[Chief Rum]

So you're one of the ones who has voted for the no-show, which is almost a meaningless vote, and yet you're actively criticizing someone else's vote that doesn't have much of an explanation behind it. Being overly suspicious like that can be an attempt from a "bad guy" to steer the voting away from another "bad guy".

It provides us with information about a role we may not end up having (if he has one) and removes an inactive player from the game.

You know there is good reason for the vote. Plenty more sound than any other reason I have seen so far. Or no reason at all, like you and timmae.

[henry296]

Vote Bhlloy

[timmae]

Ok... getting a bit late as I am away from my phone for a few hours. Here are my thoughts in case I am not here to defend myself tomorrow (forgive my typing as I am on my phone);

Likes - autumn as his entrance and subsequent posts seemed truthful, henry joking about wolf but good guy, britrock seemed fine with being a contrarian, render sounding ok

Not a huge fan of; Chief not diggin into to much detail, telle exposing she is vanilla wolf so that baddies can hunt elsewhere

Neither good nor bad; goldeneagle hasnt provide much, lonestar hasnt said much. Bhlloy has nothing.

Baddies at this point... chief, telle, GE and lonestar. Please note that this could be way off and I could look like an idiot real soon.

[timmae]

Darnit... maybe swap chief and henry now. Arghh.. how I hate thee game!

[timmae]

I probably will leave my vote on henry. We do not want.to vote off a no show tonight. Tomorrow night is a different story.

[GoldenEagle]

VOTE bhlloy

I just can't vote for anyone else at this point. I think some of the movement and early votes can still provide us information down the road.

I am willing to change this vote if he checks in.

Plus, you never know, we may get really lucky and hit a villager.

[Chief Rum]

A runaway vote on bhlloy doesn't give us much voting information to go on. And I would prefer to have that info over what we gain from killing off an inactive player.


UNVOTE BHLLOY


VOTE HENRY296

[Chief Rum]

Unless my math is off, that creates a tie.

[Telle]

A runaway vote on bhlloy doesn't give us much voting information to go on. And I would prefer to have that info over what we gain from killing off an inactive player.
[/B]

That's what I've been saying. And it's not unlikely that EF will figure out what to do with an inactive player so that we don't waste game time doing it ourselves.

And yes, Chief's vote switch to henry296 creates a tie. Three have not yet voted: LoneStarGirl, RendeR, and bhlloy (of course)

[RendeR]

VOTE bhlloy

I just can't vote for anyone else at this point. I think some of the movement and early votes can still provide us information down the road.

I am willing to change this vote if he checks in.

Plus, you never know, we may get really lucky and hit a villager.

I'm going to agree with this thought process for the time being. Its the best we have to work with without losing someone whose at least here and active.


VOTE BHLLOY

[Autumn]

The Recently Converted Wolf (Has a secret ability that only they will know about) and the Count (can convert a werewolf to a killing machine) seem to be the only roles with a dynamic that may be able to kill without a lynch. Not sure what the converted wolf ability would be so maybe not something that kills. Also not sure what a Killing Machine is.

Sorry just getting back on and catching up ...

I assume that though the bad guys are villagers in this game, they still will have a night kill. It would be quite a change if there is no regular bad guy kill in the game, or that the vampire has one but the villagers don't.

Killing machine ... no real idea. Two kills in a game this small seems like it would be too powerful. Maybe can get a kill even if the person is protected?

[Autumn]

i don't have a vote count but sounds like bhlloy is in the lead by one vote. Has anyone not voted yet?

[RendeR]

Lonestargirl and bhlloy

[GoldenEagle]

That would be an interesting twist that villagers couldn’t make night kills but had some other kill mechanisms.

[Autumn]

actually rereading, sounds like LSG and bhlloy (of course, duh) are missing votes still.

I don't like to vote no-shows for the reason Telle and now Chief have said, that it limits our information and gives an easy vote to the bad guys if the no-show is not one of them. So I will stick on Henry for now. Henry didn't do himself any favors by showing up and voting bhlloy without explanation. Maybe just saving his neck, but you still need to put the work in.

[Telle]

i don't have a vote count but sounds like bhlloy is in the lead by one vote. Has anyone not voted yet?

Yes, bhlloy is in the lead by one vote with henry296 in second. LoneStarGirl and bhlloy have not yet voted, and I have the lone vote on RendeR.

I'm thinking of switching to henry296 since obviously nobody else is interested in voting for RendeR, but that puts us into a tie, at least temporarily.

[GoldenEagle]

It seems like LSG is waiting to vote which is note worthy.

[Autumn]

Yes, bhlloy is in the lead by one vote with henry296 in second. LoneStarGirl and bhlloy have not yet voted, and I have the lone vote on RendeR.

I'm thinking of switching to henry296 since obviously nobody else is interested in voting for RendeR, but that puts us into a tie, at least temporarily.

Do you have an argument for voting RendeR?

[LoneStarGirl]

I thought I voted earlier but I forgot the whole bold thing

Vote bhlloy

[henry296]

I made that vote for the same reason I stated earlier. Essentially right now we really have a game with 9 people and if we vote someone else off besides bhlloy it is down to 8. Since he can't post to provide information, I think we should kill him to get information.

[Autumn]

I thought I voted earlier but I forgot the whole bold thing

Vote bhlloy

I don't see an earlier vote post from you, just one with you saying you will vote him later if he doesn't show up.

[RendeR]

Do you have an argument for voting RendeR?

She's married to me....nuff said LOL

[Telle]

She's married to me....nuff said LOL

Starting to question that decision. It's ruining werewolf for me :)

[Telle]

I'm really against voting for the inactive player, for reasons I've stated multiple times. In an effort to prevent him from being the lynch, I'm moving my vote to henry296. This still leaves bhlloy in the lead with one vote, though.

unvote RendeR

vote henry296

[RendeR]

so its even again.....

[RendeR]

err no bhlloy is ahead 5-4 right?

[Chief Rum]

I don't think so. I think bhlloy has 5 votes and henry 4

[Telle]

I don't think so. I think bhlloy has 5 votes and henry 4

Correct. And I really question the thinking of the five people with votes on bhlloy. I've already explained my thoughts on that extensively. If bhlloy comes back being a good guy, his voters are doubly suspect for not only voting for a good guy but also defying logic.

[RendeR]

How is it logical go go after and lower the number of active players in such a small game when an inactive still gives us information but doesn't really hurt anything?

We at least learn what isn't in the game without damaging the active player base on, lets face it, a pretty shot in the dark day 1 vote.

lowering our available sources of input on day 1 is the illogical choice here.

[britrock88]

As of post 90:

RendeR 2 - Telle (61), timmae (71)
bhlloy 2 - britrock88 (81), Chief Rum (87)
henry296 1 - Autumn (82)

Yet to vote: bhlloy, henry296, GoldenEagle, LoneStarGirl, RendeR

Yet to check in: bhlloy

unvote RendeR

vote henry296

bhlloy 2, henry 2, render 1

Vote Bhlloy

bhlloy 3, henry 2, render 1

VOTE bhlloy

bhlloy 4, henry 2, render 1

UNVOTE BHLLOY


VOTE HENRY296


bhlloy 3, henry 3, render 1

VOTE BHLLOY

bhlloy 4, henry 3, render 1

Vote bhlloy

bhlloy 5, henry 3, render 1

unvote RendeR

vote henry296

bhlloy 5, henry 4

---

All this puts bhlloy in a position to vote to tie it up. Are we settling on henry as the only other option at this point?

[Telle]

I've already explained it multiple times. Maybe you should begin reading things thoroughly in this game.

1. If everyone just jumps on the inactive person then that tells us absolutely nothing. We've essentially lost a day of voting and the analysis it can provide.

2. We don't know if EF has a plan/mechanism for handling the inactive player. If he does, it's likely to be a much more balanced outcome than us blindly voting the player out.

[Telle]

Forgot to quote RendeR on that response. To be clear, my #137 is in direct response to his #135.

[GoldenEagle]

All this puts bhlloy in a position to vote to tie it up. Are we settling on henry as the only other option at this point?

I don’t think that glvote is walking through the door.

[Telle]

All this puts bhlloy in a position to vote to tie it up. Are we settling on henry as the only other option at this point?

I'm open to options but we're running out of time. I'm still good with voting for RendeR :)

[GoldenEagle]

I've already explained it multiple times. Maybe you should begin reading things thoroughly in this game.

1. If everyone just jumps on the inactive person then that tells us absolutely nothing. We've essentially lost a day of voting and the analysis it can provide.

2. We don't know if EF has a plan/mechanism for handling the inactive player. If he does, it's likely to be a much more balanced outcome than us blindly voting the player out.

We still have roughly a 10% chance of hitting a villager and that’s not nothing.

[britrock88]

I'm open to options but we're running out of time. I'm still good with voting for RendeR :)

Let's make it funky!

UNVOTE bhlloy
VOTE RendeR

[RendeR]

Its s day 1 vote, there is no voting analysis there. Day one we have nothing to go on, like ever.

You believe its likely to be a more balanced outcome, thats pure speculation on your part, there is no logic in that belief, no evidence to support it.

the Facts we have:

Day 1 vote, we know absolutely nothing about anyone specific.
We have 10 players, almost all with roles of some sort.
1 inactive player, with no input at all, so nothing is lost if we vote them off.
We gain the knowledge of their role so we know going forward what NOT to worry about.

Nothing speculative there. Flat facts.

For the whole group, the safest route is learning as much as we can without taking away from the group as a whole.

[RendeR]

ugh, sorry folks, was responding to Telle's 2 point "logic"

[Telle]

It is NOT true that we don't know anything day 1. Yes the good guys don't know anything, but the bad guys DO. A retrospective analysis can be very useful. If everyone bandwagons on the inactive player we completely lose that.

unvote henry296
vote RendeR

[britrock88]

As of #143:

bhlloy 4 (henry, GE, render, LSG)
henry 4 (autumn, timmae, CR, telle)
render 1 (britrock)

[LoneStarGirl]

Are we at a tie now? I see what Telle is saying but what are the odds of Bhlloy magically appearing tomorrow to play??

[Telle]

As of #145:

bhlloy 4 (henry, GE, render, LSG)
henry 3 (autumn, timmae, CR)
render 2 (britrock, telle)

[britrock88]

As of #146:

bhlloy 4 (henry, GE, render, LSG)
henry 3 (autumn, timmae, CR)
render 2 (britrock, telle)

[GoldenEagle]

Wait, what’s the vote count?

[LoneStarGirl]

Bro trick your vote is wasted don’t you think?

[Telle]

Are we at a tie now? I see what Telle is saying but what are the odds of Bhlloy magically appearing tomorrow to play??

If he never shows up and EF doesn't do anything about it, we always have the option of taking him out later. Doing it now makes no sense.

[britrock88]

Wait, what’s the vote count?

:lol:

[RendeR]

currently with Telle leading the bandwagon on me its bhlloy 4 and 2 for me.

[GoldenEagle]

Ok, sorry. I missed the fact that britrock switched his vote.

[britrock88]

Not laughing at you GE; just laughing at that post sequence.

[GoldenEagle]

Not laughing at you GE; just laughing at that post sequence.

No I was just confused. Pretty rusty hand all.

[RendeR]

TIme.......

[Autumn]

Missed the last half hour due to kids. But I feel good about my vote on Henry. The push to make a move away from him was suspicious in my mind. If no one knows nothing, why not simply vote Henry and avoid a tie, rather than pushing Render?

[Autumn]

Are we at a tie now? I see what Telle is saying but what are the odds of Bhlloy magically appearing tomorrow to play??

And to answer this question, I would say odds are pretty good. Fairly common in my experience for someone to miss Day 1 and then show up saying they hadn't realized we'd started.

[RendeR]

Missed the last half hour due to kids. But I feel good about my vote on Henry. The push to make a move away from him was suspicious in my mind. If no one knows nothing, why not simply vote Henry and avoid a tie, rather than pushing Render?

This is also a valid point.

[Telle]

I don't remember.. is it ok to discuss the vote between when voting ended and when the result is posted? And is the night kill posted at the same time as the vote result, or is that the next morning? Just can't remember if we're supposed to wait to see who's still alive to discuss such things :)

[Chief Rum]

Missed the last half hour due to kids. But I feel good about my vote on Henry. The push to make a move away from him was suspicious in my mind. If no one knows nothing, why not simply vote Henry and avoid a tie, rather than pushing Render?

I say this as someone who also has his vote on henry. But there is value in a close vote, if not a tie. The voting information we gain is potentially invaluable.

I'm not even really against a tie on a Day 1 where we know nothing.

[Telle]

Well since everyone else is talking about the vote still, I guess it's ok.

Missed the last half hour due to kids. But I feel good about my vote on Henry. The push to make a move away from him was suspicious in my mind. If no one knows nothing, why not simply vote Henry and avoid a tie, rather than pushing Render?

Well once britrock moved there then was a tie. My moving back over to Render removed that possibility. I don't have any idea one way or the other on henry yet, but don't have a good feeling about Render.

[RendeR]

don't have a good feeling about Render.

You might have mentioned this 17 years ago....

[Telle]

You might have mentioned this 17 years ago....

The feeling just arose over the past day or so.

[RendeR]

I always thought my randomness intrigued you?

[henry296]

If Bhlloy turns up bad, it makes telle look really bad.

[Chief Rum]

Shoot, was hoping to see something by now. I have to go on my walk before the sun is completely gone. See you guys in an hour.

[Telle]

If Bhlloy turns up bad, it makes telle look really bad.

I'm doubting he will, only because the push for the illogical action of voting for him seemed a bit much for me.

[RendeR]

I'm doubting he will, only because the push for the illogical action of voting for him seemed a bit much for me.

You need to stop using the word logic, there is nothing logical in your choices, I've already shown that.

[Telle]

You need to stop using the word logic, there is nothing logical in your choices, I've already shown that.

No, you've shown your ability to try to steer people away from logic.

[Autumn]

I don't remember.. is it ok to discuss the vote between when voting ended and when the result is posted? And is the night kill posted at the same time as the vote result, or is that the next morning? Just can't remember if we're supposed to wait to see who's still alive to discuss such things :)

This is a good point. I don't think EF specified in the rules, but it's probably good form not to either way.

[RendeR]

I think he forgot us.....

[Chief Rum]

Hmm... hope EF is okay.

[EagleFan]

I apologize. Was a weird night, my mother is back in the hospital with bad creatinine (sp?) levels. Was with my brother and sister much of the evening then it was late and this slipped my mind.

Can we push day one back to Wednesday evening?

[RendeR]

Speaking for myself, absolutely my friend. Take care of you and yours. Hope she gets better quickly.

[timmae]

@Eaglefan: Not a problem at all... hope things improve on your side. I can't imagine. Thoughts are with you and your family. Take the time you need.

[henry296]

No worries. Hope your mom gets better soon.

Maybe that will give Bhlloy a chance to show up.

[Telle]

Yes, definitely. Real life is way more important than werewolf. Healing thoughts to your mom and much love to you and your family.

[britrock88]

Of course, EF.

Just to be clear, we're interpreting this to mean that last night was not the deadline? (The alternative would be that we're waiting 24 hours for night processing.)

[LoneStarGirl]

Good luck Eaglefan!

[LoneStarGirl]

Good luck EagleFan!

Or are you stalling so our 10th player has a chance to arrive? :cool:

[Autumn]

No worries, EF.

So this should be interesting to analyze. Everyone assumed that was a real deadline so we'll get two deadlines of data out of this day.

Now that we know how the vote ended up, what do we learn (granted we don't know anyone's allegiance yet). I felt there was some reluctance to go to Henry as an easy way to avoid a tie. I always feel like votes for inactives are good places for bad guys to bury a vote, though not necessarily lead that charge. It really depends a lot on the roles in game. If there's only 2 bad guys, or there are more than two but on separate teams, it's hard to find evidence in the vote.

[Telle]

Just to be clear, we're interpreting this to mean that last night was not the deadline? (The alternative would be that we're waiting 24 hours for night processing.)

The title of the game was updated to include "(Day 1 - 4/29 10 PM EST)", so that should mean that yes we have a new deadline for Day 1.

[timmae]

No worries, EF.

So this should be interesting to analyze. Everyone assumed that was a real deadline so we'll get two deadlines of data out of this day.

Now that we know how the vote ended up, what do we learn (granted we don't know anyone's allegiance yet). I felt there was some reluctance to go to Henry as an easy way to avoid a tie. I always feel like votes for inactives are good places for bad guys to bury a vote, though not necessarily lead that charge. It really depends a lot on the roles in game. If there's only 2 bad guys, or there are more than two but on separate teams, it's hard to find evidence in the vote.

I second this thought... any push to lynch bhlloy is very suspect in my mind. Those pushing thoughts, feedback, conclusions, hypothesis, etc are many times those working in favor of the ?good" team. Obviously using implied thinking the "baddies" would use that to their advantage also but that can only be sussed out on later days.

There may be a connection between Telle and Henry but I need to dig into it more.. going off of my recollection it may have seemed too obvious in my first pass through.

[britrock88]

As of #146:

bhlloy 4 (henry, GE, render, LSG)
henry 3 (autumn, timmae, CR)
render 2 (britrock, telle)

This remains true as of #183.

bhlloy 4 (henry, GE, render, LSG)
henry 3 (autumn, timmae, CR)
render 2 (britrock, telle)

[Autumn]

I'm open to options but we're running out of time. I'm still good with voting for RendeR :)

I can't remember how to multiquote so i'm doing this manually. But this is what I find unusual. Here Telle points out that time is limited--her vote is on Henry at this point but she is reminding that RendeR is an option.

Keep in mind that Telle only voted RendeR in the beginning as what I took to be a joke Day 1 vote. There's no particular reason to go back to him, no one has noted anything suspicious about him. if Telle is a good guy she knows nothing more about RendeR than the rest of us, nor about Henry, so is suggesting moving off of one unknown to another unknown, to avoid a tie with an inactive unknown.

Let's make it funky!

UNVOTE bhlloy
VOTE RendeR

Britrock then quotes Telle's post above and moves off of bhlloy for RendeR, who at that point has 0 votes. If the goal is "making it funky" that certainly works in that it confuses the matter near deadline rather than consolidating. If the concern is not voting off an inactive player, this doesn't necessarily help as no one is voting RendeR. However, Brit knows Telle seems eager to switch, and she does.

All of this seems unusual for people who if good guys know nothing about any of these targets. Now, I will grant that A) there is no significant reason to vote Henry, as I started the vote on him only due to the slightest suspicion and B) there is probably 0 chance that Telle, Henry and Britrock are all on the same bad guy team given our numbers, so some percentage of this between 33 and 100% is coincidence. But it's what's interested me so far.

[EagleFan]

On for a few. Thanks for all the kind words.

We still have no idea what is going on. The nurse keeps giving us positive sounding messages but the test results aren't positive sounding so I don't know if we have an overly optimistic nurse that we are talking with or if they were told to be extra positive during this quarantine when talking to families.

The test results show what would be considered a 90% kidney failure and the options listed for that are dialysis or transplant but that isn't the way the nurse is making it sound. Also, the idea that they had someone stationed with her through the entire evening doesn't sound like something they would do if things were fine. She also wouldn't have been rushed to the hospital and pre-admitted if things were fine.

Sorry, just running through all the thoughts in my head. We have seen a major mental and physical decline in her over the past year so we are generally mentally preparing ourselves for worst case scenario so hearing positive news is good but we don't want it to be false positive news and then have the rug pulled out from under us.

Sorry, rambling a bit.

[timmae]

My gut tells me one of render/telle are on the "bad" side of the ledger. If one flips good the other is likely bad. It could be their assertive stance towards each other. Is something truly there? Or did one forget to take the wash out of the washer yesterday?! Or, maybe they are both on the evil side. Who knows.. it's early yet.

[EagleFan]

As of post 190:

bhlloy 4 - henry296 (108), GoldenEagle (112), RendeR (116), LoneStarGirl (125)
henry296 3 - Autumn (82), timmae (93), Chief Rum (113)
RendeR 2 - britrock88 (142), Telle (145)

Yet to vote: bhlloy

Yet to check in: bhlloy

[EagleFan]

Posted the order of actions in the rules as well. For the night actions they will be as follows (if the associated roles exist):

1) Any watch/scan
2) Count conversion
3) Villager Attack
4) Vampire Attack
5) Heal
6) Convert Action

[timmae]

"if the associated roles exist"... darn you EF!

[bhlloy]

Sorry guys, I had no idea this was going on. Checking in and getting caught up now.

[EagleFan]

As of post 194:

bhlloy 4 - henry296 (108), GoldenEagle (112), RendeR (116), LoneStarGirl (125)
henry296 3 - Autumn (82), timmae (93), Chief Rum (113)
RendeR 2 - britrock88 (142), Telle (145)

Yet to vote: bhlloy

[bhlloy]

Some interesting roles in here. Everything's a little confusing because of the reversal of villager/wolf dynamics.

The wolf roles have either been explained or make sense enough. As for the baddies...

The Vengeful Villager (EF, not sure how you missed that opportunity ;) ) appears to be a brutal. The Vanilla Villager is ... vanilla. There is no hint as to what the Villagers' actions might include.

The Count has a conversion mechanic, like a cult leader. Any converted wolf (cultist) would appear to be super-powerful. No clues as to any ability a Vanilla Vampire might have.

So, reading through this, I'm not sure how powerful the bad-guy teams are...

This strikes me as the best analysis so far. I'm not sure how it makes me feel about BR, because it's the kinda post that can have a nugget in that if it exposes something true about the baddies helps build trust and can be pointed , but I think I agree with it. Feels like the Vampires have to be in the game because otherwise I don't see a path to much happening in terms of NKs.

I'm around, feel free to ask me questions. I've got no incentive to tie it up, but would like to see the votes move around a bit more.

No reason for this, other than not tying it up and being the other option right now

vote RendeR

[bhlloy]

sorry, hit post too soon - meant to say "can be pointed to later"

[bhlloy]

"Ties - We never like ties... what will happen in the event of a tie? Try one to find out... " - I'm good with staying away from this given the wording, even if it was to save me from the vote. Doubly so given the unique setup and the presence of a Vampire team

[Telle]

My gut tells me one of render/telle are on the "bad" side of the ledger. If one flips good the other is likely bad.

My gut tells me similar, and I know I'm on the side of good.

[EagleFan]

As of post 199:

bhlloy 4 - henry296 (108), GoldenEagle (112), RendeR (116), LoneStarGirl (125)
henry296 3 - Autumn (82), timmae (93), Chief Rum (113)
RendeR 3 - britrock88 (142), Telle (145), bhlloy (196)

[timmae]

The people currently voting bhlloy is a good start for a bad role list. Maybe only 1 or 2 out of the 4 currently voting him may flip bad but that would be a decent shot in the dark percentage for a D1 lynch.

[bhlloy]

Feels like a stretch. Typical wolf (villager in this case) behavior would be to split the vote and be as quiet as possible day one. There’s no value in them piling on, especially on something as obvious as “Lynch the guy who hasn’t checked in” because if that person turns up good it looks terrible.

If it was a runaway and I turned out to be bad then I would look to see who switched on to me late in the day, because that’s very wolfy behavior (give yourself a wolf vote and don’t get stranded) but unfortunately that’s not going to turn out to be the case

[bhlloy]

I have to say that post has kinda piqued my interest in you though. A villager trying to influence the n1 lynch is interesting. Almost feels like you have some insight into where you’d like to see that go?

[timmae]

I have to say that post has kinda piqued my interest in you though. A villager trying to influence the n1 lynch is interesting. Almost feels like you have some insight into where you’d like to see that go?

Not sure I follow the N1 influence or reference. Just saying that list of people is on my "watch" list.

[timmae]

And by 'villager' I think you meant 'wolf', correct?

[timmae]

Or did you mean vampire? Now I am confused. I'll shut up for a bit..

[britrock88]

Or did you mean vampire? Now I am confused. I'll shut up for a bit..

We are going to have so much fun with this, I can already tell.

[bhlloy]

As of post 199:

bhlloy 4 - henry296 (108), GoldenEagle (112), RendeR (116), LoneStarGirl (125)
henry296 3 - Autumn (82), timmae (93), Chief Rum (113)
RendeR 3 - britrock88 (142), Telle (145), bhlloy (196)


And by 'villager' I think you meant 'wolf', correct?

Yes, sorry. “Good guys” - and yeah this is going to take a lot of getting used to (and potentially some fun metagaming)

[bhlloy]

So this has gone quiet, even adjusting for folks who may be at work. I'm actually going to switch things up a bit... definitely won't leave it tied if it comes down to it, but try to get some movement going.

unvote RendeR
vote henry296

[bhlloy]

Not sure I follow the N1 influence or reference. Just saying that list of people is on my "watch" list.

I realised I said n1 lynch rather than n1 NK, so that was probably pretty confusing.

Reading the rules again, it's interesting that there isn't a mentioned NK ability. Do we presume that the Vampire can convert a wolf (good guy) to a vampire with NK, and then what does the vanilla vampire do? I can't imagine in such a small game there's possibility of multiple NK's on the vampire side, would seem too easy to get the win. Does the village (bad guys) get a NK ability that isn't mentioned?

I'm feeling pretty lost on the mechanics of this game to be honest, but maybe it will be clearer once we see a couple of nights.

[timmae]

Agreed bhlloy. We have a lot of information that we do not yet know. Several different roles could affect the balance as well as night actions, none of which is clear to the wolves. There are a lot of quiet people out there that may know more than most of us at this point. I am hoping we can start to game the system come D2 and know even more D3. Not sure when the tipping point for game over may be... somewhere around D4? Both villagers and vampires need equal numbers to wolves AND to get rid of any other entity (note "any other entity"). A lynch and a NK of some sort along with conversions and secret abilities and this could all happen pretty quickly.

[henry296]

unvote bhlloy

As I stated, I was only voting for him because he was inactive. I'm actually now leaning Telle since she was violently opposing me which makes me believe we are on opposite sides. To me, the showdown should be between us because we pushed the opposite agenda which means that one of is likely bad and it isn't me.

[LoneStarGirl]

Sorry guys, I had no idea this was going on. Checking in and getting caught up now.

I knew the extended day was a ruse! Welcome to the game Bhlloy

[LoneStarGirl]

unvote bhlloy as well.

[Autumn]

I realised I said n1 lynch rather than n1 NK, so that was probably pretty confusing.

Reading the rules again, it's interesting that there isn't a mentioned NK ability. Do we presume that the Vampire can convert a wolf (good guy) to a vampire with NK, and then what does the vanilla vampire do? I can't imagine in such a small game there's possibility of multiple NK's on the vampire side, would seem too easy to get the win. Does the village (bad guys) get a NK ability that isn't mentioned?

I'm feeling pretty lost on the mechanics of this game to be honest, but maybe it will be clearer once we see a couple of nights.

My first guess would be that the night kill is assumed, and doesn't need to be mentioned in the rules.

Therefore, I would assume if there is a vampire or vampires, they don't have their own night kill but probably a conversion of some type, and not one every night. That would be overkill.

However, my second guess would be that there have been some games we've played where the bad guys don't start with a kill and then have to gain one as the game goes on. That's always a lot of confusion but I could see EF doing something like that.

Now, my question is about the healing action EF mentioned. Going back to the roles to check what that might be.

[Autumn]

Okay, I glossed over this the first few times reading through

"Doctor - Can heal a fellow wolf who was attacked."

I know this is often a role in regular Werewolf, but not one we typically had in our games here. I don't remember how this mechanic typically works, but it might suggest that kills are not instantaneous? Or it's basically a bodyguard block that happens after the attack? I'm not sure. Not much use speculating but good to keep in mind as we go forward.

[Chief Rum]

Posted the order of actions in the rules as well. For the night actions they will be as follows (if the associated roles exist):

1) Any watch/scan
2) Count conversion
3) Villager Attack
4) Vampire Attack
5) Heal
6) Convert Action

FYI.. regarding the what kills exist discussion.

This seems to suggest both the conversion, villager attack and vampire attack are things.

[britrock88]

Okay, I glossed over this the first few times reading through

"Doctor - Can heal a fellow wolf who was attacked."

I know this is often a role in regular Werewolf, but not one we typically had in our games here. I don't remember how this mechanic typically works, but it might suggest that kills are not instantaneous? Or it's basically a bodyguard block that happens after the attack? I'm not sure. Not much use speculating but good to keep in mind as we go forward.

The doctor is a variant on a bodyguard--I'm not sure if they're different in anything other than name, typically.

With the kill and conversion mechanics potentially in play here, I wonder whether this power to "heal" applies to one, the other, or both.

[EagleFan]

As of post 219:

henry296 4 - Autumn (82), timmae (93), Chief Rum (113), bhlloy (209)
bhlloy 2 - GoldenEagle (112), RendeR (116)
RendeR 2 - britrock88 (142), Telle (145)

No current vote - henry296, LoneStarGirl

[Chief Rum]

We need conversation, so I am going to even things up a bit. Runaway voting gives us no help.

UNVOTE HENRY296

VOTE RENDER

[bhlloy]

The doctor is a variant on a bodyguard--I'm not sure if they're different in anything other than name, typically.

With the kill and conversion mechanics potentially in play here, I wonder whether this power to "heal" applies to one, the other, or both.

Yeah, I'm trying to think of the nuances of Town of Salem without booting it up in the middle of the work day. I think BG can only block certain types of attack whereas Doctor can heal any kind of attack, but maybe I have that backwards. And of course, there's no evidence we are playing by those rules anyway.

[bhlloy]

FYI.. regarding the what kills exist discussion.

This seems to suggest both the conversion, villager attack and vampire attack are things.

The "if the associated rules exist" puts that in doubt I think. I think if EF had left one of those out, it would have been a confirmation that a certain role or mechanic wasn't in the game - I'm not reading too much into it.

I still think if all those things are in a 10 person game with 3 teams, this is going to last like 3 days tops. After such a long hiatus, that would be a shame :D

[Chief Rum]

The "if the associated rules exist" puts that in doubt I think. I think if EF had left one of those out, it would have been a confirmation that a certain role or mechanic wasn't in the game - I'm not reading too much into it.

I still think if all those things are in a 10 person game with 3 teams, this is going to last like 3 days tops. After such a long hiatus, that would be a shame :D

I agree with you in general, but only on the non-usual things. A "wolf" kill is pretty much standard in WW. Since we see it in EF's order of events and it being so common, I think we can presume the villagers have a NK.

[timmae]

I'd prefer to hear more from some of the quiet players... who do you like for villagers/vamps all? Any thoughts on roles from a meta perspective? Any meal time arguments over werewolf?!

[EagleFan]

As of post 225:

henry296 3 - Autumn (82), timmae (93), bhlloy (209)
RendeR 3 - britrock88 (142), Telle (145), Chief Rum (221)
bhlloy 2 - GoldenEagle (112), RendeR (116)

No current vote - henry296, LoneStarGirl

[henry296]

Since heal happens after both attacks I think it would help against either villager or vampire. For now I’m assuming we have both.

I’m wondering if going back to bhlloy could work because trying to understand if telle was trying to protect him or render was throwing him under the bus was part of the strategy last night. I realize the same could be said of me, but I’m not voting for myself.

[Chief Rum]

If this ends up henry vs Render, the final vote will come down to GoldenEagle and LSG.

[bhlloy]

I’m away now until about an hour before deadline. Just gave a quick reread of the thread, nothing really stands out about the 2 up there. I’d like to go in the direction of the more inactive members, I know that is rich coming from moi. GE and Lonestargirl - the latter has been active enough but not really saying much, it’s a potentially problematic approach.

[GoldenEagle]

Since heal happens after both attacks I think it would help against either villager or vampire. For now I’m assuming we have both.

I’m wondering if going back to bhlloy could work because trying to understand if telle was trying to protect him or render was throwing him under the bus was part of the strategy last night. I realize the same could be said of me, but I’m not voting for myself.

This is similar to what I am thinking. I will obviously move my vote if bhlloy is not a candidate but I am not sure why everyone moved off of him so quickly.

[bhlloy]

Unvote Henry296
Vote Lonestargirl

[LoneStarGirl]

Unvote Henry296
Vote Lonestargirl


I guess it makes sense that you would vote for me when I have been relatively quiet today and I voted for you when you were MIA for the day... but the vote for me doesn't make sense. We have a tie and the fact you wanted a throw away vote instead of putting the pressure on the Henry or Render.

so again vote Bhlloy

[EagleFan]

As of post 225:

RendeR 3 - britrock88 (142), Telle (145), Chief Rum (221)
bhlloy 3 - GoldenEagle (112), RendeR (116), LoneStarGirl (231)
henry296 2 - Autumn (82), timmae (93)
LoneStarGirl 1 - bhlloy (230)

No current vote - henry296

[EagleFan]

I guess it makes sense that you would vote for me when I have been relatively quiet today and I voted for you when you were MIA for the day... but the vote for me doesn't make sense. We have a tie and the fact you wanted a throw away vote instead of putting the pressure on the Henry or Render.

so again vote Bhlloy

I'll accept this one but next time please leave the vote on a line of its own. If this wasn't the very last post before my update I may have missed the vote while skimming over the posts.

[EagleFan]

1:36 until the deadline...

[EagleFan]

This time I am leaving this screen up and barring any surprise calls from the hospital with a bad update I will be here for 10:00.

[RendeR]

OK so Bhlloy has arrived, my vote for him was purely to eliminate a non entity, but since that is no longer the case.


UNVOTE BHLLOY

[RendeR]

I am seriously impressed with just how easily telle got the bandwagon on me today.

She was intensely defending Bhlloy yesterday based on nothing more than speculation as to game mechanics we know nothing about. And now that her defended has come around he throws a vote on me then changes again later.

Trying to cover a mistake on his part? I dunno, but it makes me suspicious.

If all else fails I will vote to defend myself. Putting that out there now.

And of course we're now back to a more typical "we know very little Night 1 vote"

[henry296]

I’m with RendeR. Willing to vote for Telle but we will need one more or he will be voted off.

[Telle]

I am seriously impressed with just how easily telle got the bandwagon on me today.

She was intensely defending Bhlloy yesterday based on nothing more than speculation as to game mechanics we know nothing about. And now that her defended has come around he throws a vote on me then changes again later.

Trying to cover a mistake on his part? I dunno, but it makes me suspicious.

If all else fails I will vote to defend myself. Putting that out there now.

And of course we're now back to a more typical "we know very little Night 1 vote"

What did you know before that you don't know now? That someone hadn't shown up yet and was thus an easy way to place a vote without drawing suspicion? Except that didn't work.

Btw, good job trying to spin stuff and spitting out meaningless jabber. You'd make a good press secretary for a head of state.

[Telle]

As of #239:

RendeR 3 - britrock88 (142), Telle (145), Chief Rum (221)
bhlloy 2 - GoldenEagle (112), LoneStarGirl (231)
henry296 2 - Autumn (82), timmae (93)
LoneStarGirl 1 - bhlloy (230)

No current vote - henry296, RendeR

[RendeR]

Meaningless Jabber?

Did you not state that you based your choices on the BELIEF that eaglefan would have a "more balanced and fair" way of handling ties?

thats not meaningless, thats a fact. None of us have a clue, especially with his response to that specific question. So call it what you want, tis a fact that you're going off speculation and guesswork, not facts or logic.

I'd like to think your hounding of me right from the get go is little more than being a snarky spouse, but frankly you're too good at this game to assume silliness from you. Everything you do in game is planned. Which makes me even more suspicious.

Nice try

[bhlloy]

Can I really not get anyone to come with me on LSG? Quiet as hell, lots of posts saying stuff but not really saying stuff. Unvoted me with the herd after I showed up but didn't really explain it. Defensive when I just put the first vote on earlier today?

I'm not feeling RendeR particularly, but I'll switch in a bit unless the situation changes. Sorry buddy. I'd rather be on LSG or GE.

[RendeR]

What did you know before that you don't know now? That someone hadn't shown up yet and was thus an easy way to place a vote without drawing suspicion?



I stated my reasons from the beginning, killing a non active player saves the majority of the village for a night AND gains us knowledge of whatever role they played NOT being in the game.

He returned, I no longer had a reason to vote that way, so I took off my vote.

Transparency darling, its something you should try. You're argument reeks of deflection and confusing the facts.

No logic needed there.

[Telle]

I stated that a wait-and-see approach made a hell of a lot more sense than wasting the day's vote. If we just vote out the inactive player then the bad guys have an easy place to hide their votes if that person isn't one of them, so we learn little to nothing from that vote; there was a chance the inactive player could still show up, WHICH HE DID; we didn't know if EagleFan would be taking care of the issue himself, so why not give it a day or so to find out?

The fact that you keep trying to spin what I'm clearly stating should be telling to everyone else here.

[LoneStarGirl]

The fact that Telle was adamant that we don’t vote for Bhlloy and that Bhlloy did a throwaway vote against me makes me think one (or both) are on the bad side of this one.

I am seriously impressed with just how easily telle got the bandwagon on me today.

She was intensely defending Bhlloy yesterday based on nothing more than speculation as to game mechanics we know nothing about. And now that her defended has come around he throws a vote on me then changes again later.

Trying to cover a mistake on his part? I dunno, but it makes me suspicious.

If all else fails I will vote to defend myself. Putting that out there now.

And of course we're now back to a more typical "we know very little Night 1 vote"

[LoneStarGirl]

It’s day 1. What is there to conclusively say?

Can I really not get anyone to come with me on LSG? Quiet as hell, lots of posts saying stuff but not really saying stuff. Unvoted me with the herd after I showed up but didn't really explain it. Defensive when I just put the first vote on earlier today?

I'm not feeling RendeR particularly, but I'll switch in a bit unless the situation changes. Sorry buddy. I'd rather be on LSG or GE.

[Telle]

I wasn't adamant that we don't vote for bhlloy. I was adamant that we don't default-vote the inactive player. I didn't care who it was. As a good guy, I have no idea whatsoever which side bhlloy is on. He very well could be a villager or vampire. Now that he's here, please feel free to vote for him!

[GoldenEagle]

I stated that a wait-and-see approach made a hell of a lot more sense than wasting the day's vote. If we just vote out the inactive player then the bad guys have an easy place to hide their votes if that person isn't one of them, so we learn little to nothing from that vote; there was a chance the inactive player could still show up, WHICH HE DID; we didn't know if EagleFan would be taking care of the issue himself, so why not give it a day or so to find out?

The fact that you keep trying to spin what I'm clearly stating should be telling to everyone else here.

It wasn’t exactly a run away vote on him at any point though.

[RendeR]

What you're clearly stating is what makes no sense, you'd rather kill off an active player than someone who was not.

If in fact Bhlloy had never shown up you'd have lost us a 2nd player out of 10 instead of just 1, we'd still not know what bhlloys role was so that variable remains.

assuming there are multiple factions at work here and possibly 3 kills a night, had bhlloy NOT returned YOUR plan would have us down to 6 players after night 1 with no more information than we started with.

again, you're defended has returned, so now you get to act all high and mighty as if what you were saying had any merit to begin with.

and as stated, I have followed my statements to the letter, he's back, I changed my vote.

if I didn't have to save my own to defend myself thanks to you, I'd be moving my vote your way.

convenient how that works in your favor, hm?

[Telle]

It wasn’t exactly a run away vote on him at any point though.

If my spreadsheet is accurate.. 6 of the first 10 votes were for bhlloy, with the other 4 votes split on 2 people.