A Fool And His Money - A Real-life Poker Dynasty

[TredWel]

Talk of poker on the general discussion page (that unfortunately never materialized) inspired me to put up some of my spare capital on online poker. I had been interested in poker for quite a while, had read a book or two, and had been making a killing at the play money tables. It’s only play money though – I wanted to be up against the serious players with actual money on the line. I wanted to know where I stood, how my skills, wits, instincts, and knowledge compared to others, and if I won a few bucks along the way, all the better.

The following real-life dynasty will chronicle my sessions of poker. I only hope to spark discussion about the game and exhibit either my poker prowess or lack thereof to a large dynasty-reading audience. I also know that there are a few people on this board who play poker, most likely better than I, so if I could get a few pointers along the way, so much the better.

<b>NOTE: I do not advocate nor advertise gambling in any way, and hope that if you decide to gamble online, you are of age, you understand the risks, and only wager the money that you can afford to lose. </b>

[TredWel]

The story thus far:

I deposit $50 into an account on Party Poker, where I played most of my play money poker. The interface is among the simplest I’ve tried, and the games (from what I hear) are among the easiest to beat, so I decide to go that route.

I decide to play mostly one-table Hold ‘em and Omaha tournaments. They run $6 tournaments where Third place is $10, second is $15, and first is $25. I was very good at them at the play money tables, and I think they’d give me the most play for my money. A few wins, and more than a few losses later, I’m down to about $30.

Most of what is written and what I’ve been following only applies to ring games. A whole different approach is needed for the tournaments, where chip position is the most important factor. I decided to leave tournaments for later, and try to rebuild my bankroll at the place where I’ve read most about, the cash tables.

I tried playing play money cash tables (oxymoron alert!), and the quality of play has been terrible. Calling and raising all over the place, nobody folds, leading to the point where the winner is the luckiest SOB at the table, not the player with the best betting and reading skills. I said to heck with it early, and concentrated on my tourney play. And we know how that went.

Party Poker has $.50/$1 tables, the cheapest they go, and the amount of money I still have in there is about equivalent to the bankroll I’d like to have to play in these games. My experience not quite being up to snuff in cash games either; I decide this has to be the place for me for a while. I set out two fail safes for losing money:
- If I lose more than $10, I quit immediately. If I’m playing badly, I don’t want to continue my bad luck streak.
- If I am behind after one hour of play, I quit. If it’s a slow losing streak, it’s still a losing streak.

So, I’m off to the tables. Prior to this dynasty, I had put in 3 ½ hours at the table at varying times of day in four sessions over the course of three days, and had shown a profit of $11.50. This was after the latest play – an hour where I lost $9, my one losing session so far. It was a period where I could pick up no power hands, and my drawing hands weren’t drawing. The ultimate insult came when I had an Ace-high flush made on the turn, and lost to a baby full house that made when the board paired on the river. That one hand alone would have let me show a profit on the day.

Still, I continue undaunted, looking for my luck to change…

[TredWel]

June 1 – 10:15 pm

This dynasty will chronicle my thought processes in most hands that I am in past the flop on (save a few on the big blind where I have crap, and I fold right after the flop). You’ll notice one thing about me – I‘m a very tight, very aggressive player, which is the opposite of those found at the tables (at least, at this level), and which seems to be the best way to play in order to make money.

<b>Hand #1</b>: I'm in the Big Blind (as is customary to start in), and pick up Qc Jh for my first hand. Not too shabby, although I'm going to have to hit a nice flop to win. 5 people limp in, and I’m not raising, so I get to see the flop for free, essentially.

As 9h 6h is the flop, and I only have a few long shot chances. My Jack is a heart, so I can pick up a flush with two more hearts. A running K-T would give me a straight. Not much to hang my hat on. The action is checked around to the last player, who bets into the pot. There are a few calls, but you couldn't get me any more into this pot. I make the obvious fold.

<b>Hand #7</b>: Ks Th is my hand, fourth to act. The first three players fold (an uncommon occurrence at this table), and I have a borderline call. I threw this exact hand away 5 hands ago on the button with only two limpers, as I wasn't getting good enough odds to call then. Still, I think I'm in a decent position to call, so I limp in, something I hate to do. When I'm first in, I like to raise rather than call. When you have a strong hand, it helps to knock out borderline hands that will make amazing draws to beat your strong hand later on. I end up getting odds here, as five other people are in the hand with me

The flop is 7h 6d 2s. Talk about your ugly flops. Nobody bets as the table checks. Somebody probably flopped a low pair, but I can’t imagine anybody having anything better.

Fourth Street brings the 9c. This gets the attention of the small blind, and the first actor bets into the pot. If he just has a pair of nines, I have draws to beat him, but he could even have T-8, in which case I'm drawing dead. Since even the best-case scenario is unpalatable, I lay down.

<b>Hand #16</b>: I'm under the gun, and I pick up Ac 9c. Suited Aces are good hands, and the 9 is just barely a good enough kicker. As is my style, I make what has to be a borderline raise. I'm really only trying to improve my table image with this as an aggressive player. My raise is rather spit upon, as 5 people call me.

The flop comes Qh Th 9s. I don't know if I could pick a worse flop for me. I have bottom pair with an Ace kicker, so I almost feel obligated to continue in this pot, even though there are flush draws and straight draws out the wazoo (not to mention the not-so-outside chance of K-J already beating me). Still, when the blinds check to me, I bet. I only want to know where people are. I expect K-J to raise me (in which case I turn tail), and people with on of the many draws or a pair to call. Turns out a lot of people have a piece of this pot, as only one person drops out of the race.

The turn is 8d. While this card doesn't scare me much (7-6 should have folded ages ago), I still only check. It'll take a miracle for me to invest any more money into the pot. Everybody else at the table checks, no doubt still waiting on their draws.

Fifth Street shows the 2h. The flush draws are rewarded. When the small blind bets, I toss my cards away quickly. The winner indeed had Ace-small of hearts for a nice pot, and leaving me still in my rut.

<b>Hand #17</b>: The next hand I am in the big blind, and have the ragtag assortment of Qh 2c. Only two late position players come into the pot, and the join me on the flop.

The flop is Ac 7c 3c. I have the worst flush draw, but who knows? With only two players, it might be the best hand. The small blind checks, and I try a semi-bluff. It goes by the boards, as both players call.

The 7s rears its ugly face on Fourth Street. With so few players, I'm not getting good odds on my flush draw (especially as one of a possible 8 cards could beat me), so when the small blind bets, I fold. The small blind eventually wins the pot with triple sevens.

<b>Hand #23</b>: I keep turning down garbage, sighing about my luck to myself, until I pick up Ks Qc in second position. The under the gun player limps, and I just limp in. We've got five players in for this hand.

Js 6h 5s is one of the most uninspiring flops I've seen tonight. I've got the backdoor straight and flush draws, but nothing worth betting. The rest of the table echoes the sentiment, as the turn card comes free.

The turn is 2c, even more uninspiring. Three checks precede me, and it's obvious that I'm going to have to bet at this pot to win it. I bet, and whittle the field down to one caller. I'm guessing he's picked up a 6 or 5, and those kinds of pairs are not smart to bet before finding out whether or not they're beat by a pair of jacks.

The 8h is the river, and I'm caught. I've advertised my hand as either 4-3 straight or a pair of deuces or some other small pair. And if this person is attentive (and I think he is - he's been a consistent winner over the last half-hour), he can throw out 4-3 as a hand I'd play in early position. So he'll probably think that I have a low pair or, even worse, a failed spade draw. So, I just check. He bets, and I have no option than to fold. I don't think he'd call on the turn and bluff the river. And the losing streak goes on...

<b>Hand #28</b>: A few hands later, I pick up an old adversary, Kd Td. Suited this time. There are 5 callers before me in seventh position, and so I call. I could raise, theoretically, but my luck lately doesn't exactly give credence to that line of play. Everybody behind me calls, so 9 of 10 people are playing.

The flop is Kh Qd 9s. Finally, a decent flop for my drawing hand. If it didn't carry the heavy threat of straights, I'd be ecstatic. There's a bet in middle position, and I'll call. If it's a straight I can tie by pulling a Jack, and if it's not, my King could be the best hand. Several others meet this call, and we're down to six players.

The 2s is the turn card, and it's no help to anybody, I imagine. We have the same results as last betting round, as the same middle player bets, and is called by everybody.

The 8h is the river card, and the action is checked around to me, a move I can't fathom. No flushes are made, and no more straights are made, either. I can't imagine why the bettor who has been gung-ho about this pot suddenly stopped firing. It may be foolish, but I bet into the pot. The bettor probably has the same pair of kings, in which case I'm probably dominated, but maybe he was on a failed straight or ace draw and wasn't smart enough to check the turn when nobody else seemed interested in raising him.

Four people call this bet. As the bettor of the round, I turn up my cards. Four people muck their hands!!! The dealer read-out said that I won the pot with a pair of Kings with a ten kicker, so that implies that somebody else had a pair of kings with a weaker kicker. I still can't figure out what the middle player had. Maybe A-Q, but that’s a lot of chutzpah to be betting with second pair. The $17.50 I rake in more than recoups my losses in this session, and leaves about $7 ahead. It’s nice to be back in the positives.

<b>Hand #34</b>: I sit back until my next time in the big blind. I get Ah Td, not a bad hand, but still require a good board to make anything. There are 5 limpers in the pot before me, and I won't raise with a hand of questionable power.

Tc 9c 8h is the board's beginning. I have top pair with top kicker, normally a very good hand, were it not for the obvious straight staring me in the face. Still, I have to ask. I bet the flop, trying to feel where people are. Four out of the five call, but at least I'm not raised.

6h shows up on the turn. Now only a seven is necessary to complete the straight. I figure that this must have hit somebody, so I check, ready to lay down if anybody bets. Nobody does. Guess nobody hit the straight.

5d is the river card, and I am very relieved. Both the heart and the club flushes failed to make, and no more straights made. I don't have any reason to believe that my top pair still hasn't been beaten, so I bet. I get one caller in late position, who turns over 7-4 on the showdown. Can't say as I agree to his methods (playing 7-4 in late position, calling an open-ended straight draw with a club draw on the board, not betting when he makes his flush, and not raising me when he's got me completely fooled on the river), but he's the one raking in the chips. Oh well.

<b>Hand #35</b>: The poker gods smile upon me for my travails last hand, as I get dealt Ac Ad the very next hand in the small blind. 3 limpers come in before me, and I make the obligatory raise. No slow-play for me. At this level, there's no need for it. The Big Blind and all of the limpers call, making it five in.

The flop holds good news and bad news: As 6s 3s. I have trips, but there's a spade flush out there as clear as day. Still, unless someone shows me a flush, I've got to think I have the best hand. I'm under the gun, and gladly bet. 2 people call, and I get a raiser! That can't be good news. I shift my focus from being aggressive to being passive. He still might not have the flush made, and I still have the chance of the board pairing up so I could beat a flush with either a full house or quads. I, and everybody else, call the raise.

2c comes the turn, an utterly boring card. I still haven't made a flush-killing hand, so I pass, but more than willing to call any bets. Surprisingly enough everybody else checks too! What does the raiser have??

The Qh is the river card, so if there's a flush out there, he's got me. I check, and there's a bet, but not from the raiser! Funny enough, the raiser folds right after him!! I don't know what he was doing, but that's water under the bridge now. I call the bet.

This is my biggest mistake of the session. Had I thought about the hand a bit, I would have realized that I must <i>raise</i> at this juncture. Let's analyze what this person could be holding:

In order to beat my trips, he must have either a flush or a straight.

If he has a flush, he's got to be among the worst players in the world. He only calls my bet on the flop, and calls the raise after him. There is an argument for not raising my bet (not wanting to scare out players yet to call), but after everybody calls the raise, he's got to raise again with a flush. We've already proven ourselves more than happy to spend whatever it takes to see the turn, what's another 50 cents between friends? Then he checks the turn! After we've spent so much to see one card, we're likely to spend more to see the last card. If he has a flush, he deserves to be rewarded for his play. Like I say, I'm happy to lose money to poor play. It makes them think that they're doing something good with that poor play, and won't change.

If he has a straight: In other words, he has 5-4. He's called the blind and stayed in under heavy betting to draw to a straight that's probably beaten by a flush! And then, checked the turn when he made said straight! Nope, I don't think anybody could be that bad.

So, I must be beating him, and I should raise the bet. But, I instead call, and he indeed shows A-Q. I pick up $10.50, but should have squeezed that extra dollar out of him.

No more hands come around this orbit, so I cash out before the blinds hit me again, and I am a big winner for this session. I sat for 42 hands, played in the blinds 5 times, played 5 hands out of the blinds, and won two pots. I come out ahead $13.50.

[SplitPersonality1]

Hiya TredWel. Like the thread.

I too freqent PartyPoker (as SplitP1, what else), and I noticed many of the same things you did about the play money tables. Your best bet for a decent poker experience at play money tables is at the 50/5 tourny tables. The player make-up is usually 3-4 complete morons, 3-4 semi-decent players that make simple, exploitable mistakes, and 3-4 "quality" players, people looking to hone up there skills in-between real money sessions.

Morons drive me nuts. I hate losing with a decent hand because some idiot hit a straight on the river because he was fortunate/stupid enough to hang on to a 9-6 offsuit. Arrgh.

My best tourneys are those played very late at night after the kiddies go to bed.

I have tried my luck on the real money tables as well (the very same $.50/$1 tables) and usually do okay. I probably average something like +$4-5 per hour played and only occasionally have losing sessions. I probably won't move up to the better tables until I consistently get $7-8 per hour.

Good luck to you and maybe I'll see you around.

[TredWel]

Originally posted by SplitPersonality1
Hiya TredWel. Like the thread.

I too freqent PartyPoker (as SplitP1, what else), and I noticed many of the same things you did about the play money tables. Your best bet for a decent poker experience at play money tables is at the 50/5 tourny tables. The player make-up is usually 3-4 complete morons, 3-4 semi-decent players that make simple, exploitable mistakes, and 3-4 "quality" players, people looking to hone up there skills in-between real money sessions.

I gained most of my live experience at the play money tournament tables. It was nice, as the absolute morons would take themselves out of the running early, leaving only a few real players there. It's a good way to learn, but as I
found out, it in no way reflects your abiility in actual one-table tournaments.


Morons drive me nuts. I hate losing with a decent hand because some idiot hit a straight on the river because he was fortunate/stupid enough to hang on to a 9-6 offsuit. Arrgh.

I don't really mind it too much. Yes, it's annoying when they suck out to imppossible draws, but most of the time they don't get the draw, and you'll win the pot. Mathematics is always a comfort to me. :)

I have tried my luck on the real money tables as well (the very same $.50/$1 tables) and usually do okay. I probably average something like +$4-5 per hour played and only occasionally have losing sessions. I probably won't move up to the better tables until I consistently get $7-8 per hour.

My current average is $4.50 an hour, but that was with limited playing time. I don't expect to get much better, and 4-5 BB/hr is more than the classical 2 BB/hr that is expected by good players. Once I build my bankroll up a bit at the $0.5/$1 tables, I'll move up in class to the $1/$2. By that time, I'll expect to be doing well enough to survive.

[primelord]

I am curious what you guys use to cash in. Do you just use credit cards or accounts on sites like FirePay and Netteller. For some reason those sites like FirePay just make me nervous.

[TredWel]

Originally posted by primelord
I am curious what you guys use to cash in. Do you just use credit cards or accounts on sites like FirePay and Netteller. For some reason those sites like FirePay just make me nervous.

I used Citadel to write a check. Seemed to be the easiest and most secure option they offered, since they stopped accepting PayPal.

[TredWel]

June 2 – 10:00 pm

Sat at a very interesting table tonight. There was a lot more chatting going on than usual, and I think I benefited from it a lot. I learned that two of the players normally played at higher stakes, and it showed in their play – much more aggressive than I’m used to. There was another player who advertised that he subscribed to the “No Fold Em Hold Em” strategy – playing everything to the flop, at least. Between the time I started and the time I ended, he had lost something around $20, so draw your own conclusions. The table started to turn back to the usual loose-passive conditions near the end of the session.

<b>Hand #2</b>: After being raised out of my first Big Blind, I pick up Qd Td in the small blind. There are 5 limpers as the action comes around to me, and I complete. The Big blind taps the virtual table, and we’re off!

The flop comes Kh Jd 3h. I like my draw chances, open-ended straight draw with a backdoor straight flush chance. The action moves to the player on the button, who finally bets into the pot. I’m getting good odds, so I continue in the pot. Three others share my sentiment, and call.

The turn is Kd. This is an interesting development, as I now have a royal flush draw. But the normal straights or flushes may be worthless, as the board has paired. Once again, the first person in the pot this round was the last actor, and I think awhile before I call. There’s no guarantee he has a King, and even with a King he has to have a Jack or Three to make my hand worthless. The added glory of a royal flush keeps me in the pot. I’m the only other player in, though, so we’re heads-up.

The river is a disappointing 4s. I check, as well as the bettor. His Ac Jc second pair hand is enough to beat my bust, so I lose my first showdown.

<b>Hand #11</b>: Boring hands seemed to be the order of the day so far, and I get a chance to play in the Big Blind with 8d 6c. Only three other limpers are in this pot.

The flop shows us the Ad Kc 4c. You’d think this flop would hit somebody, but everybody checks.

The free turn card is the Qh. Now somebody else should bet, but nobody does. Odd.

The river is the 2c. If I had a single Jack, I’d be happy to bet, but my eight isn’t going to win anything if its called. I check, and one of the higher-stakes players next to me bets. Everybody folds, and he rakes in a pittance. He even goes so far to show us the T6o he bet on, and chats smugly about his bluffing skills. :rolleyes:

<b>Hand #14</b>: A nice hand comes my way, in the form of Ad Kh. I’m in sixth position, so imagine my surprise when nobody comes into the pot before me! That shows what a weird table this was. I make an obligatory raise here, and get called by two other players, including the “play anything” player in the big blind.

The board starts on Ah 5h 5s. If I dodge a 5, I’m gold. The blind checks to me, and I bet. The player on the button calls, and the blind raises! While it’s not a lead pipe cinch that he has a 5, I feel that I’m probably behind in this hand. Still, I call, and the button drops, leaving us one-on-one.

The turn card is my savior, the As! He’s got fives full of aces, but I’ve got aces full of fives! I’m glad I’m at home and don’t have to keep up the poker face – it would have been obvious three tables over that I had an Ace in hand. Having tipped the strength of his hand, he bets, and I quickly raise. He still calls.

The river card is the icing on the cake – the Kd! I don’t need the stinking pair of fives. He checks, and I bet. He just calls. My Aces full of Kings is the obvious winner. He later chats that he, indeed, had three fives. I pick up $10.75 for my luck.

<b>Hand #19</b>: After folding some decent hands due to bad position, I pick up 8c 7d in the big blind. Once again, the table goes cold, and the only player calling the blind is the “No Fold Em” player. I check, and we’re off.

The flop is Ah 5d 4c. Knowing his penchant for playing any old crap, I bet under the gun, hoping for a fold. Nope, I get called instead.

The turn is the 9c. I repeat the maneuver, at the very least hoping to sell a pair of Aces. He still calls.

The 3d comes sailing down the river. I’ve bet twice into the pot already, and he’s called smoothly both times. I admit defeat when I don’t catch anything, and check, he bets, twisting the knife, and I fold. This was an interesting exercise of poker psychology, as I made what had to be poor bets trying to move an ultra-loose player off his hand.

<b>Hand #20</b>: The next hand arrives and I’m in the small blind with the Qs Th. Four early callers give me enough odds to complete the blind, so there are six players in this pot.

The flop is unfortunate, as it gives me Ad Jd 8d. The double gutshot draw I have is no consolation to the made flush. When the button bets, I gladly fold my hand.

<b>Hand #22</b>: I’ve been playing hands a bit more frequently than I’m used to, and when I get the 9c 8c in third position, with nobody in the pot yet, I decide to limp in. The blinds are the only other players to be in the pot with me.

The flop is Qc 6d 3d. Not particularly enthralling, though I have more than a few backdoor draws. Nobody else seems interested, and we quickly move on to the turn.

Fourth Street is the Qs, turning my hand into wonderful waste paper. The big blind bets, and he buys the pot.

<b>Hand #24</b>: In second position, I get dealt the As Qh. The game is getting shorthanded as of late (both aggressive players have since moved on), so the value of high cards become inflated. I open the pot with my trademark raise, and only get one caller, which is fine by me, really.

The flop is Ad Tc 2h. There’s more than a fair share that I have the best hand here, and when my opponent checks, I bet. He calls, and we move onward.

The flop is the 6h. He again checks, I again bet, and he again calls me. He could have a myriad of things, from a pair of tens or a pair of aces with a bad kicker to a straight draw, possibly a backdoor flush draw. One thing I don’t think he can have is an AK or AT or something else that beats me.

Fifth street is the 7h, and we have a making flush. He checks, and in case he’s setting me up with a heart flush, I check as well. I’ve been bitten before by impossible suckouts followed by cheeky check-raises. He turns up Qd 6d. The program pauses for a few seconds (no doubt speechless about my opponent’s play), but then awards me $5 with top pair. The scary thing is, he almost got the draws with the last two cards to go from nothing to cracking my hand.

<b>Hand #27</b>: That eventful orbit ended, putting my in the big blind again with a good hand, Jd Jc. There are four limpers to me, and I make the Foolish Mistake of the Session ™ by checking, letting them see the flop for free. I should try to knock out a few of the draws here before the flop is shown. With the present opposition, it may not matter, but it’s still probably the proper thing to do.

The flop comes Ad 2d 4s, a very scary flop indeed. The action is on me, and I bet, possibly making up for my failure to raise pre-flop. I immediately get raised, and have another person call the raise. I decided I’m probably facing a pair of aces from one of these two players, and am not getting good odds on drawing a set. I lay down. The eventual winner indeed had a pair of aces.

<b>Hand #35</b>: The next orbit goes around with me getting a few hands that were just slightly unplayable, and annoyingly so. I don’t like laying down Ac Tc just because I’m in bad position, but I do it anyway, knowing it’s the best thing in the long run.

Anyway, this hand I pick up 6s 5c in the big blind, and 7 people before me have bought their way into the pot. I have nothing, and only check.

The flop is 9c 5d 3h. This is a good flop for me, as there are very few profitable draws, and no high pairs have made. If anybody bets, I’ll gladly call. Nobody does, however.

The turn card is the 9h. If nobody bet the flop, I’m going to work off the assumption that nobody has a nine. Given that, I have the next best pair, and despite the fact that I have a crappy kicker, I bet the pot. I hope that the momentum this gives me will knock other second-pair holders out of the pot that may have better kickers than I. I get only two callers, so I like my chances.

The final community card is the 7c. An overcard, so I just check. Everybody else checks, and I turn up my cards. Interestingly enough, another player turns up 65o as well, and we split the pot. I earn $3.25 for my play.

<b>Hand #37</b>: On the button, in favorable position, I pick up As Jc. Finally, after throwing off like hands because I was too near the under-the-gun position, I get to play one of these hands. Three people limp in, and as I’m not strong enough to raise, I call. The blinds both come in, and we’re six strong in seeing the flop.

The first board cards are the Kd 4h 2h. Not exactly a good hand right now, and my check echoes five other previous checks.

The turn card is the Jd, and I’ve picked up a hand to play with. There’s a call by the player to my left, and I and one other person stay in to see the river.

The river is the Kc, and I have two pair with an ace kicker. The first person checks, and the previous bettor bets out again. I make up for my folly last night by not betting my triple Aces on the river, and raise here. The only hands that could beat me are a King or pocket Jacks, fours, or twos. The only one of these hands that’s even a remote possibility is the pocket Jacks (checking the overcard on the flop, then betting when picking up trips is a possible way of playing that hand), but that hand is a strong favorite for a pre-flop raise. I decide I’m probably winning, and stake an extra dollar to that effect. The ploy works, as both remaining players drop out of the pot. I pick up $8.50 for my lesson learned.

<b>Hand #39</b>: I’m in middle position, and get Th 9h. It’s a borderline hand, but there are three callers before me. That gives me the odds I need to call, so I do. In total, six other players are in for the flop with me.

The flop is Jc 5d 2h. There’s a bet in front of me, and I make the apparent laydown, as the flop missed me. As does happen in poker sometimes, the turn card is a Queen, and the river is a King. I would have picked up a backdoor straight, and would have won a sizeable pot. It’s mildly annoying, but I know that I made the absolute correct move, and that, oddly enough, more than comforts me.

That’s my last hand of the night, as I check out after this orbit is over. I’m finding that I’m good for about an hour before I start to tire a bit, and play a bit weaker than I’d like.

I played 44 hands. I saw 7 flops outside the blind and 4 flops in the big blind. The total number of hands is about correct (I see about 25% of the flops overall), but I called more hands tonight pre-flop than usual. I won 3 pots and shared 1 pot. Despite the adverse table conditions at the beginning of the session, I still cashed out a winner, showing a profit of $6.75.

[QuikSand]

At this low level, it seems that people do not raise enough... based on your notes above and my own impressions.

I always find poker interesting when it's played at a point insufficient to generate any genuine pain for the losers. Anyone with a computer and an internet hookup good enough to play poker online shouldn't have any trouble covering a $10 loss for the night, nor a $3-4 combined bet for a given hand. That's not pain.

On Hand #35 - that's a nice narrative, and your readers appreciate your taking the time to go through the analysis after the fact. Yes, you should have raised with your pocket rockets on the last round. In fact, some would argue that under the conditions, you should have raised all along - even to the guy showing the possible flush. A fairly likely situation is that he (and others) are playing a draw hand, and a raise shakes out those hands (all of which are designed to beat your trips). I'm of a split mind on that myself - especially in an environment you don't know well yet.

[TredWel]

Originally posted by QuikSand
At this low level, it seems that people do not raise enough... based on your notes above and my own impressions.

Absolutely. Maybe one hand out of six or seven is raised by a player other than myself, and you almost never see a re-raise. It means that if you have drawing hands, you get to see the last two board cards cheaply.

I always find poker interesting when it's played at a point insufficient to generate any genuine pain for the losers. Anyone with a computer and an internet hookup good enough to play poker online shouldn't have any trouble covering a $10 loss for the night, nor a $3-4 combined bet for a given hand. That's not pain.

Playing at low levels covers up losses. Losing 5 BB a night or so is pocket change at this level. That's why there may be so many bad players who never seem to improve, the amount of time over which they lose a decent amount of money is so great as to dull the pain.

On Hand #35 - that's a nice narrative, and your readers appreciate your taking the time to go through the analysis after the fact. Yes, you should have raised with your pocket rockets on the last round. In fact, some would argue that under the conditions, you should have raised all along - even to the guy showing the possible flush. A fairly likely situation is that he (and others) are playing a draw hand, and a raise shakes out those hands (all of which are designed to beat your trips). I'm of a split mind on that myself - especially in an environment you don't know well yet.

If he was trying for a free card at the river, he succeeded. I can see now how it would be possible to make that play with Kx of Spades, hoping to scare away baby flushes from bidding again, and hoping for a fourth spade to hit the board on a free card. But that kind of play is a bit too complicated at this level, in my estimation. I'll take these reraises at this level at face value, until proven otherwise on a case-by-case basis

[TredWel]

June 5, 7:00pm

I’ve come home late these last couple of nights, not in any sort of mindset to play any decent poker, so I haven’t had the chance to play any. I’m hoping to fix that tonight, and get in two sessions worth. One now, and one during my more customary playing hour around 10:00pm.

The table I’m at tonight is a couple of players short, and the players who populate it seem to know each other and are pretty good. Let’s see what this means for me.

<b>Hand #3</b> – After being raised out of my first big blind, I pick up Qs 7s on the button. With three callers before me, I’m just getting enough odds to play this hand in my estimation. The small blind completes and the big blind checks, so I’m going to see my first flop of the night.

It comes As Ks 5d. Jackpot. I’ve got a draw to the nut flush. The action is checked around to me, and I bet as a semi-bluff. With so many players and an A-K on the flop, I expected more hands to be hit by this flop, and my estimation becomes correct, as I am check raised. I call the raise, and there are four people around for the turn.

The turn keeps me hoping, as the blank 3d comes off. The check raiser, with his cover now blown, now bets out. Everybody calls, including me. I still have hope.

The river is the 6s! That’s exactly what I was looking for. The check raiser again bets, and there’s a raise before me. I’ve got no reason not to raise, and I do. The check raiser folds, assuming he is outclassed. The new raiser caps the betting at four bets, and I happily call. He had a baby flush, and I show the nuts. The $19.50 I win is the largest pot I’ve won to date.

<b>Hand #9</b> – Good luck continues, as I get the rockets, Ac Ah in the under the gun position. I open with a raise, and I am reraised two-players down. The action continues around the table, and the pot is again reraised. Hold a pair of aces, I’m still the favorite to win the hand, and I cap the betting. The three of us get to see the flop.

The flop is Qd 2d 6h. Though the flop missed me, being so aggressive before the flop almost demands a bet on the flop. I bet, and only get called by my opponents.

The turn is a good news, bad news situation. The Ad comes off the deck. The good news is that I now have trips. The bad news is that the diamond flush just made. Fortunately, the best hand that could have made a diamond flush is K-J, and I don’t think that hand would have been played so vigorously pre-flop. I bet again, and get called twice. That seems to imply that there are no flushes out there.

The river card takes the wind out of my sails as only a river card can. The 7d comes off, and any single diamond can now crack my set. I check in despair, and the table checks as well. The showdown comes, and my Aces are shown. The original re-raiser shows pocket queens, and the other re-raiser mucks. Looks like there were no diamonds out there, and I take home $10.25 and a few more gray hairs.

<b>Hand #13</b>: After another uneventful big blind, I pick up Ac Kh in middle position. Everybody limps in before me, and I raise to shake the pack down. There are 5 others who call the raise to see the flop.

The flop isn’t too bad: Ah Js 8s. The action is passed to me, and this is a hand that must be bet aggressively. I bet out, and only one person drops out of the running.

The turn is a very nice card, the Kh. The action checks to me, and I bet out again. A later player raises me. I would think that pocket Kings would have been reraised pre-flop, so I’m inclined to put him on two pair (which makes me the heavy favorite) or Q-T (which makes me the heavy underdog). I call him, and the number of players is reduced to three.

The river is the 7c, and the table (including me) checks to the raiser, who bets. I think back, and the chance that he has Q-T or hearts or Q-T of spades is too good. I only call instead of check raising, and my fears are confirmed, as his Q-T of hearts takes the pot.

I sit for nine more hands (and one more uneventful blind) before the software has an aneurysm and craps out on me. I’m still trying to get back on to check the status of my account. This is one of the big dangers of online poker, and I hope that my account is safe. I’m sure it is, but if it isn’t, I’ve heard horror stories about Party Poker’s live assistance. Things will be set right, but it may take a while.

Assuming all things go right, I cash out after 22 hands a big winner, up $13 for a half-hour session. I played two hands in of the big blind, and three out of it. I won two pots.

Update: The site came back online, an my $13 is safely credit to my account. According to rec.gambling.poker, the site has been up and down a lot lately.

[TredWel]

June 5 – 9:30pm

So, I sit back down and try to continue my winning streak. A new table is starting, and I’m quick to grab a seat at it before it fills up – the site is crowded tonight.

<b>Hand #1</b> – With so many new players, I forgo waiting for the big blind and post my 50 cents. I am rewarded with a decent hand, Kd Jh. There are 6 other limpers along with me, technically sitting in late position. If I were to raise, it would be borderline, and I decide not to make it.

The flop for all of us pre-paying customers is Js 7h 5h. Not bad. The under the gun player calls, and he is raised. I make another borderline decision, and call here. I probably have the best hand with top, but can’t feel too good about all of the straight and flush draws out there.

The turn does nothing to soothe my pain, as the 6h makes the straight flush a possibility. As before, the pot is bet and raised before getting to me, and I lay down promptly. I figure I have to be beaten by now. I was, as an Ace-high flush takes the first pot.

<b>Hand #9</b> – Almost a full rotation goes by me without an interesting hand until I get the button and the 9s 7s to go along with it. It’s a drawing hand that might be folded, but when six people in front of me limp in, I have to call as well. The odds I’m getting are fantastic.

The flop is the Kc Js 7d, not exactly what I was looking for. The small blind bets, and I fold, as I only had longshot chances of drawing something strong.

<b>Hand #14</b> – I’m in the big blind here, and I pick up a nice hand, Ah Qd. There are four limpers before me, and I raise here, trying to shake a few loose. No dice, as all four call.

(An aside here: I picked up Sklansky & Malmuth’s “Hold ‘Em Poker for Advanced Players” today. Quite a tome, and I haven’t even begun to digest the information I read today. I did remember after the fact that they specifically stated not to raise in the big blind with A-Q offsuit when there are many callers. Heh.)

The flop is Ks Ts 8c. I check, and the fellow next to me bets. All players call, and I have a decision to make. I’m getting 14-1 odds on what amounts to a gutshot draw here. It’s just barely good enough to call, and I do.

The 9c comes on the turn. I check again, and a late bettor bets into the pot, and the next player raises him. I quickly fold, as my odds suddenly took a turn for the worse.

<b>Hand #23</b> – I’m getting a bunch of yawners tonight. Guess I’m paying for my quick run of good luck earlier today. This hand is in the big blind again, and I get the 5s 3d. Whoopie. When I only get two limpers, I’m slightly surprised. Some people may want to raise here, try to set up a bluff later on against these player’s implied weakness, but I’m not about to do that with such a crappy hand. I just check.

The flop comes Qs 4c 3h. The small blind checks to me, and I have no idea what to do. I don’t know the strength of these players’ hands, and if neither of them has caught a Queen, I may be able to bet them off their hands here. But there’s a player yet to act, so I just check to him, and he checks as well.

Fourth Street is another Queen, the Qc. The Small blind bets, and I think about this hand a little. I can’t in good conscience put the small blind on a queen here. In that case, I think the proper thing to do here is raise. There’s a decent chance that my pair of threes are the best hand here, where he’s just betting on two overcards or a small straight, and even if they aren’t, the small blind still has to call my bet here. Hopefully he’ll think I have a small pocket pair or something. The third player folds, and the small blind calls me.

The river is a big card, the Kh. My opponent checks, and I’m not betting again. Any hand that he’ll call me with will beat me, so I’m just checking down. He shows A-J offsuit, and my threes do indeed hold up. I pick up $5, and I’m happy with my decisions here.

No more interesting hands come up, and the server crashes again. I ended up playing another half hour, and giving back a little. I’m happy though. Under good conditions, I make almost 5 times as much profit as I lose under bad conditions. I just consider this session paying back a little of the luck that I got earlier this evening.

The stats: I sat for 27 hands. I played 4 hands in the blind and 2 hands out. I won only one pot, and notched a small loss of $2.75 in the shortened session.

[MJ4H]

Fascinating reading. I am just getting into poker, but I only play with fake money or preferably in tournaments. Since I'm so knew to the game, the insight into how a good player thinks and plays is very valuable to me. Please keep it up!

[Radii]

I'm enjoying the read as well. Coupla comments:

PartyPoker's live help is horrible. I was playing there in a multi table tournament when the server crashed. It came back up and we heard nothing for about 15 minutes, so I'm wondering what the status of the tournament is, I go get help and ask, the response to my question of "Will the tournament continue or will we be refunded in some fashion?" is "we're having some technical difficulties right now." Wow. Pure genius.


To Quiksand's comment:

"At this low level, it seems that people do not raise enough... based on your notes above and my own impressions."

This is definitely true, and in ring games I know I'm guilty of this myself, but I think at low limits it doesn't carry the same weight that it does at higher limits. One of your hands mentioned having JJ from a blind and not raising it. At a low limit, and as the last to act pre-flop, will a raise push anyone out anyway? One of the purposes of a raise in such a position would be to push out marginal hands. You would hope to force out 76s and A4o and hands like that so you have less chances of being outdrawn. But at a low limit, your raise is not likely to push any of these hands out at all, so the value of the raise pre-flop at lower limits isn't as great as it would be at higher limits. It's still valuable without a doubt, but I think there are numerous cases at low limit(espicially ones like the .50/$1 tables at party) where you wouldn't raise with hands like that.


Are you TredWel on party? I am almost certain I've played in single table tournaments with you. I'm radii there and play a fair number of $5 and $10 single table tournaments in the evenings. I've found that I have much more success in the tournaments than in the ring games personally. I think it suits my style a lot more though, unless I get a monster hand in the first orbit or two I can just play extrodinarily conservatively until there are 5-6 people left and really only need to hit one hand to make the final 3 for the money.


Great read, I'm enjoying it :)

[Radii]

dola, the tourneys I play are always the $5 and $10 no limit tourneys. If I've seen your name around that would have been where

[TredWel]

MattJones4Heisman: Thanks! I don't know if I'm that good of a player yet, but if you're learning something by the way I play my hands and why, I can only be satisfied.

Radii: Yep, I'm TredWel over at Party Poker, and I used to play solely in the $5 NL tournaments. I probably didn't wow you with my tournament skill. I have one bad habit in poker, if I think I'm beat, but there's still a slight chance my read is wrong, I call. This isn't bad in limit games with a functionaly infinite stack size, but in no-limit, where you've already invested half your stack and are forced to go all in on a hand that may have been outdrawn at the river... well, let's just say I may be a richer man if I had learned some restraint.

I've tried the strategy of waiting around, playing ultra tight and ultra agressive early, and then in the late going stealing blinds and looking for a chance to double up. I always seemed to be short stacked when we're down to four players. I have to go all in on a mediocre hand, and get beaten just outside the money. I only tried a couple of times, so my sample size isn't quite large enough to give conclusive results.

[TredWel]

June 6 – 9:20

I sit back down. The table seems typical for Party Poker, but I’m concerned by the player to my left, who had $270 in front of him, normally not a stack size found at the cheap tables.

<b>Hand #1</b>: My first hand is all right, the Qd Js. Five people limp in, and I won’t raise or try any fancy. My hand isn’t likely the best hand at the table, and raising in this position doesn’t seem to shake players loose.

The flop is Kd 6s 3c, and I can’t take much solace from this flop. Nobody bets.

The turn is the Th, and I now have an open-ended straight draw. I check here, though I’m not sure why. I probably have the best draw on the hand, and nobody’s making any noises to make me question the fact that I’m the favorite. I should bet on a semi-bluff, hoping to knock some people out of the pot. Nobody else bets.

The river is the 2h, so my straight is not made. Nobody bets again, and somebody shows a pair of deuces, which wins the paltry $3 pot.

<b>Hand #8</b>: Only playing one missed drawing hand on the button last orbit, I look at my cards in the big blind. 7s 7c. Five callers to me, and I check. Once again, not strong enough to raise and take all comers.

The flop is three overcards: Kh Qc 8c. The small blind bets, and I figure I’m either beaten or an underdog to the number of outs in the deck. I fold.

<b>Hand #12</b>: Kh Js. There’s one caller before me, and I limp in as well in middle position. The button raises. I’ve picked him up as an aggressive player. He’s on the button against two players who just limped in – I think he could have anything. I call the raise.

For my buck, I get the 7c 7h 3h. Not nice at all. I check, and the button bets. This is a borderline call, but my other opponent makes my life easier, and raises. I don’t have enough to cold call two bets, and I’m out.

<b>Hand #13</b>: The shuffling software hiccups, and I get Kc Jd. There are two callers before me, and I’m calling again. By the time the dust settles, there are 6 limpers besides me.

The flop is all rags: 5s 3c 2d. The action is checked to me, next to last to act. I have enough to bet at this pot, in my estimation. I do so, and five of the six people in the pot call.

The 7h is the turn, a dangerous card. I’m sure that somebody is on a baby straight draw, and they just made it. The table checks to the button, who bets. He is promptly check raised and the check re-raised. I don’t need a sledgehammer to the face to know I’m beat. I get out quickly.

<b>Hand #15</b>: I have to sit out a few hands due to a phone call, and when I return, I’m in the seventh position, just ahead of the button, with Ks Th. I limp, and 7 others see the pot with me.

The flop is the first nice one I’ve seen all night: Kd Td 4c. If I dodge a flush here, I should be the high hand. There’s an early bet, and I gladly raise, trying to knock out draws behind me. Another person re-raises me, and the action comes around to me with three others looking to stay in the pot. I honestly can’t place pocket kings or pocket tens on anybody, so I have to cap. There are three others in the pot with me.

The turn is the Qc, checked around to me in now-last position. It’s a slight scare card, but I would have thought A-J would have dropped out a while back. Not A-J of diamonds, though. I bet out, and everybody calls me.

The river is a horrible 3d. So much invested in this pot to have it all fall apart. There’s got to be a diamond flush out there, that’s one of the only things people could have been betting on. The action is checked around to me. Gee, you think there’s going to be a check raise if I bet? I check as well, and lose to J-4 of diamonds.

I really don’t think I played that hand wrong at all. I shouldn’t raise pre-flop, as my hand isn’t close to being that strong. I played aggressively while I still had the big hand. I was just outdrawn. It’s the nature of poker, but it still annoys me from time to time.

<b>Hand #22</b>: I'm in the blind again, and I get Ks 9d. Not a bad hand to be forced to play with. There are five limpers, and I just hit the table.

The flop comes Ad Kd 8d. Talk about your booby prizes – second pair in this sort of flop. I check, and the table checks as well.

The turn is the 8s. With no action on the flop, I’ve got to think that maybe I’ve got a chance to win this thing. There are only $3 in the flop, and my $1 bet would produce poor odds for single diamond draws and straight draws. I bet, and hope for the best. I don’t get that, as I am raised. It could be a flush, or triple eights. Or it could be a ploy. Whatever it is, I judge my hand to be losing at this juncture, and fold.

Two more drawing hands that are mucked on the flop (A-To and A-Jo) are played, and after 24 hands, I hit my failsafe limit of $10 lost (I’m actually $10.25 in the hole). I get up, and evaluate my session. I could have played things differently, but the combination of lots of drawing hands that didn’t hit and the one hand I got sucked out on big time meant for a quick and heavy loss tonight that I probably couldn’t have avoided. I ended up playing 6 flops, not including 3 seen from the blinds. 38% of flops seen is unheard of from me, and shows the kind of hands I got tonight. Unfortunately, none of them panned out, and I won diddly beans.

[TredWel]

June 10, 9:15pm

I’ve been away from the tables since my last big loss, playing in some freeroll multi-table tournaments. While I still don’t think I did anything egregioously wrong last session, taking my first big loss may shake me up a little the next time I sat down. I wanted to regain confidence in myself – that’s the most important factor when playing.

So, feeling good about my ability to play poker, I sit back down at the cash tables.

<b>Hand #2</b>: Being raised out of my big blind was not an auspicious start, so my first hand in the small blind is the 3d 2d. There are five limpers, and these are the sorts of hands that are nice to play once in a while. They can get pretty good draws, and opponents have a hard time placing you on them. The fact that I only need to spend a quarter to see the flop adds to its value, so I complete the blind.

The flop is Qs Jd 5d, not a bad flop for me. Runner draws for a straight and an outright flush draw. I check, and when the pot is bet at, I think nothing of it. When the bet is raised, however, I have to stop and think. I come to the conclusion that I’m not getting good odds on this call, so I fold at my turn to act. I would gladly have put in one bet, but not two.

<b>Hand #6</b>: I get Kd Ts in middle position, and call the one limper already in the pot. The bet is not raised, and there are 5 others in to see the flop.

The flop is quite boring, as the 8c 3h 2d come off the deck. When it’s checked to me, now one off the button, I have to think. This is a classic “hit no-one” flop, and I probably have as good a draw to make anything as anybody else. I bet. There are three callers and two folders.

The turn comes 4h. Now I don’t know how to play this hand. It’s checked around to me, and I check as well, hoping my ploy on the flop may have bought me a card. Not so, as the button bets. I’m not in control of the situation anymore, and I fold. Quite frankly, I’m not pleased with my play this hand. Maybe I shouldn’t have bet the flop. Maybe I should have bet the turn. I just can’t say.

<b>Hand #19</b>: The next big blind hand isn’t interesting, and I get nuttin’ as the blinds come round to me again. When I post my 50 cents, I get rewarded with As Js. There are 7 limpers to the small blind, who raises. I’ve got a very nice hand, but I just call. No sense in tipping my power just yet. Everybody who limped in calls the raise, and the pot is huge – 9 players in it.

The flop is huge as well, Ad Kd Th. I have top pair with decent kicker, but with nine players each in for two bets pre-flop, I’m not expecting it to be a winner. The SB checks, as do I. The next player bets. Some people call, some fold to me. I consider the action, and decide to be a little fancy. I check raise. Two reasons for this action: 1. Nobody’s jumped up and screamed that they enjoy this flop, save for the original bettor. If I’m raised, I’ll know I’m beat. 2. Try to show a bigger hand than I’m actually got. How often do you bluff with top pair and good kicker? 4 people call my raise.

The turn is the very definition of a blank card – the 2c. Keeping up the illusion of a strong hand, I bet, and get 3 callers.

The river is also uninspiring. The 8h comes off. I’ve done enough betting for one hand. The 8h is unhelpful to anybody, most likely, and if I’m called here, I’m almost certainly beat. We’re checked around, and my pair of Aces wins the pot, somewhat surprisingly. The program didn’t even call my kicker into consideration, which means that nobody else even had a single Ace. BTW, The Small Blind had a pair of Jacks in the hole. I take in $17.50.

<b>Hand #26</b>: Once again, I’m in the big blind, and I pick up Qc Jd. A nice hand, but don’t let the excess of ink on these cards fool you – It’s not that good. There are 7 limpers, and I want to see the flop before putting any more money in.

The flop is interesting: Jh Th 9d. The Small blind bets, and I decide to take the coward’s way out, and fold.

I want to look at this fold, and see whether or not it was a good play. I estimate the SB to have one of the following: KQ, 87, Q8, Ax of hearts. Between that and the 6 random hands yet to act, the poker calculator program I have says that I am around a 12% favorite to win the hand. To factor in the times that this player has a significantly worse hand, I will estimate that I have about a 15% chance of winning the hand. There was $4 in the pot before the flop, and the bet by the SB made it $4.50. Actually, my bet would take the pot above $5, where Party Poker starts their flat rake of 50 cents. So, functionally, there is $4 in the pot. I am getting 8-1 odds on my money. I would only need to be an 11% favorite to make this call. So, pot-odds speaking, I made the wrong decision. I think I must have been thinking that with the heart draws and straight draws out there, I’d only be playing to tie the pot, not win it.

<b>Hand #41</b>: I don’t want to give the impression that I’m not playing any hands between then and now. I actually saw two more flops between then and now, but they amount to drawing hands that didn’t hit the flop at all and folded to a bettor. Just to clear that up.

I’m under the gun, and pick up Ac Qd. This is a hand that’s not strong enough to raise under the gun here, but I can certainly limp in. There are no raises, and there are 5 people limping in.

The flop is golden: Ah Qs 3d. I won’t chase everybody out of the pot if I bet here, so I indeed bet out when it is checked to me. I get two callers.

The turn is not as exciting: 6h. With the heart draw out there, I bet again, and thin the herd again, down to one caller.

The river is a slight scare card, but only slightly. The Jd is the final community card. I check, maybe to give the impression of a failed drawing hand. The other player takes the bait, as she bets. I check raise. I still think AQ is the best hand here. I am called, and she turns up AQo as well! We split the pot, $5 each.

I check out after this hand before the blinds get to me again, and I am pleased. I won $10.25 in 1½ pots, which, if you recall, was the exact amount I lost last session. I sat for 41 hands, saw 8 flops, and 4 for free.

[thealmighty]

TredWel, just wanted to let you know I enjoy this immensely. In fact, I get a bit broken-hearted when I check the Dynasty Reports and don't see this in the new post area.

Keep it up.

[Radii]

Originally posted by TredWel
<b>Hand #26</b>: Once again, I’m in the big blind, and I pick up Qc Jd. A nice hand, but don’t let the excess of ink on these cards fool you – It’s not that good. There are 7 limpers, and I want to see the flop before putting any more money in.

The flop is interesting: Jh Th 9d. The Small blind bets, and I decide to take the coward’s way out, and fold.

I want to look at this fold, and see whether or not it was a good play. I estimate the SB to have one of the following: KQ, 87, Q8, Ax of hearts. Between that and the 6 random hands yet to act, the poker calculator program I have says that I am around a 12% favorite to win the hand. To factor in the times that this player has a significantly worse hand, I will estimate that I have about a 15% chance of winning the hand. There was $4 in the pot before the flop, and the bet by the SB made it $4.50. Actually, my bet would take the pot above $5, where Party Poker starts their flat rake of 50 cents. So, functionally, there is $4 in the pot. I am getting 8-1 odds on my money. I would only need to be an 11% favorite to make this call. So, pot-odds speaking, I made the wrong decision. I think I must have been thinking that with the heart draws and straight draws out there, I’d only be playing to tie the pot, not win it.



I think you made the right move here. In these kinds of low limit games, you can often safely assume that anyone that has any sort of drawing hand will not fold, all the way to the river at this point. The Small Blind coming out betting on the flop with 6 people behind him is scary too. He may well only have a pair, or 2 pair, or he may have made a straight, 87s vs a lot of callers isn't a bad hand to play from the small blind.

Additionally, you're right about getting 8-1 pot odds on a call, but, something else to consider is if you make your hand, will it be a winner? I would think your queen is dead. If a queen appears on teh turn you've "made" your hand but you almost certainly are facing a straight, so your number of outs is maybe 6(J or 8) or maybe just the 8s if someone else has a made straight, or, if someone has KQ you're drawing for a miracle full house... even if you made your hand you wouldn't be willing to raise up the pot because of all the possibilities, so, I'm thinking good fold.

Great reading, keep it up! :)

[Radii]

dola, I didn't even think about the king when I was making that post heh. A king would give you a nice straight as well, and may be the best card you could see, but I think it falls under the same category, with 7 callers, there's so much on the board, does someone have AQ? The "ideal" tight-agressive style seems hard to accomplish on this hand, there's nothing that would come up that would let you be properly agressive, so the best move is probably to get out.

[John Galt]

Originally posted by thealmighty
TredWel, just wanted to let you know I enjoy this immensely. In fact, I get a bit broken-hearted when I check the Dynasty Reports and don't see this in the new post area.

Keep it up.

I agree. This is a very good read and I look forward to more.

[Butter]

This thread has got me into the PartyPoker site, and I've been doing quite well at the Play Money tournament tables. Those people are some raising fools, though. If you bide your time through the first couple of circuits, that usually thins the idiots out a good bit. I'm having a lot of fun, and it's largely thanks to this thread.

And it's an enjoyable read. Thanks, TredWel.

[NevStar]

I also got into PartyPoker because of this thread. I haven't played a play money tournament yet, mostly because there are far too few tables open, and can never get in one that's just opening.

[Airhog]

Dont even try to play one during prime time from probably 6est to 11est


I can usually find one later on about 1 or 2 am cst and in the mornings around 11am or noon.

[TredWel]

the_almighty, John Galt: Thanks. It's good to know that people are enjoying reading this. Beats a few dynasties I've written that got no feedback at all. I'll be sure to keep it up.

Butter_of_69, NevStar: Sounds like I'm getting a lot of people onto the PartyPoker site. They should start paying me a commission. :) Maybe I'll see you around there sometime.

Radii: I'm not ashamed of the laydown I made. It's a type of hand where, If my hand gets hit, I would still be unsure about whether I had the best hand. Better to get out early.

Nevstar, Airhog: You can get into tournaments during peak hours if you're really quick and refresh the tournament screen a lot. That seemed to work for me.

[TredWel]

June 11, 11:30pm

I get home from my visit to the bridge club, and am oddly in the mood for poker, usually I am too tired. But the cards fell my way tonight, and I'm hoping that that luck trancends over modem and phone line.

So I sit at a table, and wait my turn for the big blind. Just as I am abbout to post my entrance fee, the software goes wonky. Still won't let me back in. So, no ring game for me tonight. I try to go over to DynamitePoker (they have a nightly 11:45 freeroll of both Omaha and Hold 'em, and they are usually good games) but I can't get onto their server either.

Looks like my poker experience tonight will amount to watching the tape of tonight's World Poker Tour. (Ironically enough, PartyPoker's Million Dollar tournament) I'll try again tomorrow.

[primelord]

I'll just echo the thoughts of others that this is a very interesting read. I also find myself a bit disappointed when I check the dynasty section the next day and there hasn't been an update. Keep up the great work!

[RPI-Fan]

Was playing in a $10 buy-in live NLHE tourney with 4 buddies tonite, and got REALLY pissed at one point.

Me and this other guy are the final two, and I get QQ. I go all-in - he calls with KQs(diamonds). Flop comes XhXsXd. At this point I'm starting to count his chips. Turn is Xd. Still counting...

River is...

Xd!!! WTF!!! River flush draws are redonculous. It's a LOT harder to have happen in person than online.

Regardless, I pushed him into the short stack soon after, and from there fucked around with him until I could won (A6x to his K8s).

~rpi-fan

[SunDancer]

Originally posted by TredWel


I have one bad habit in poker, if I think I'm beat, but there's still a slight chance my read is wrong, I call. This isn't bad in limit games with a functionaly infinite stack size, but in no-limit, where you've already invested half your stack and are forced to go all in on a hand that may have been outdrawn at the river... well, let's just say I may be a richer man if I had learned some restraint.

I've tried the strategy of waiting around, playing ultra tight and ultra agressive early, and then in the late going stealing blinds and looking for a chance to double up. I always seemed to be short stacked when we're down to four players. I have to go all in on a mediocre hand, and get beaten just outside the money. I only tried a couple of times, so my sample size isn't quite large enough to give conclusive results.

Tred,
That is one tendency I have. I tend to get tied into playing to see the flop when the final three/four players left standing. However, I personally try to play ultra tight early on to allow some of the money flow out, get a read, and maybe one or two guys to fall out. I try to get alittle more aggressive to hit a pot. I always seem to win if I can score late, allowing me to play tight, and not the stragety I usually get into. Any advice on reading players, and any advice on my playing style.

[Airhog]

Someone once reccomended this strategy for playing in online single table tournaments. Buy in, but dont play a hand the first three times around the table. This will allow you to see how the other people are playing, and also allow the idiots to loose all their cash. Then start playing. Also, you will have a slight advantage mentally, since no-one will know your style of play. OTOH you will have lost a few chips, but it is a good compromise.

[RPI-Fan]

But what do you do if you get QQ, KK, AA? Muck it?

When I'm playing, I'll be very tight (AT or higher, or TT or higher) through at least the half way point of the game, but you can't just say you'll throw away EVERY hand. To do so is unprofitable, both in the short and the long run.

[TredWel]

I’ve been away from the cash tables for a while – I’ve been bitten by the multi-table tournament format lately. I’ve hit on a nice strategy, and it’s carried me far.

This whole thing started when I place 20th in a $1 PartyPoker Hold Em multiplayer tournament – one place out of the money, but still my best place in a multi table tournament for some time.

Since then, I’ve been doing fine, reaching as high as second place in a Popular Poker freeroll, which gave me enough “Loyalty Points” :rolleyes: to participate in one of their money tournaments.

I never had the intention of documenting these tournaments, because my play is so fiercely tight that it barely resembles poker. You need a good amount of patience to play it correctly, but it seems to be working for me. I’ll start to write about them here, since it may be interesting, and people may learn better strategies for playing multi-table tournaments.

My strategy can be broken down into two stages. Play this until you’re down to the final table, with maybe four or five players left:

Stage 1: Normal Mode. Play ONLY Group 1 and 2 hands (AA, KK, QQ, JJ, TT, AKs, AQs, AJs, KQs, AK). In late position, with no callers as of yet, you can also play Group 3 (99, JTs, QJs, KJs, ATs, AQ). Almost always raise, and play strong post-flop, unless there is good enough reason to let off the gas.

Stage 2: Panic Mode. You should only be in this mode if you can count the number of hands you have left to play before being blinded off. At this point, stick all of your chips (If you’re playing Limit, and can’t do that, you shouldn’t be in Panic Mode) with anything like small pocket pairs, suited connectors, or two face cards.

Simple as that. I looked to play that strategy today at the 3:00 NL Hold Em Freeroll at Popular Poker, the tournament I finished 2nd at yesterday.

[TredWel]

There were 114 people playing this tournament. Each player starts with T1500, and the starting blinds are 20/40, with level increases every 10 minutes, which means that these tournaments don’t last too long, about two hours for this number of players. The schedule for breaking down tables is random.

Hand #1: I get put into the big blind the first hand, and I get T♣ 5♣. There are three limpers before me, and I just check.

The flop comes T♠ 7♠ 5♥. Flopping two pair to start the tournament is nice, but I’ve got to be careful, as the spade flush is threatening. The small blind checks, and I bet out 40. I get two callers, with the small blind dropping out.

The turn card is the Q♦, now giving me an overcard to worry about. I bet 40 again, and get calls from both players.

The river is a blank just when I needed it: the 6♣. This only hurts if one my opponents has 98, a distinct possibility. I bet out again, and both players fold. I guess they were both on flush draws. I pick up T460 for my first pot.

No more hands come to me at this level. The next level is 30/60. That early pot gave me T1720. I’m currently 22nd out of 93 remaining players.

Hand #9: I’m under the gun, and get A♦ K♥. I’m allowed to play this hand, and I come in for a raise to 120. I get four callers, no reraisers.

The flop doesn’t help much: Q♠ 7♦ 6♥. Then again, I figure that it helped nobody else, either. Considering the fact that I’m advertising a big hand with my raise pre-flop, I bet out again for 60. I only get one caller.

The turn still doesn’t help: 2♠. I bet again, and get called again.

The river pairs the board: 6♦. I doubt I’m in the lead here, but the only way I’m going to win this pot is by betting again. Since I didn’t let off the gas for the entire way here, I can still scare my opponent off his hand. I bet 60, and my gambit is again rewarded, as he folds. I rake in T840, taking my total to T2320

Hand #10: Out of the big blind, I get Q♣ J♣. The under the gun player raises the bet to 120, with three callers. I only need to put 60 into this pot to keep playing, and this hand is good enough to keep. I play.

The flop is the 9♦ 8♦ 7♣. We check to the original raiser, who bets T111 (one of the biggest problems about Popular Poker’s interface, is that there is no way to enter in exactly how much you wish to bet in NL, only a slider. Thus, you get some weird bets, like that one). I fold here. While I have a stack that can put in another 111 without losing much, it’s still early. It’s not wise to play follow the leader at this level of the tournament.

Level 3 comes, with blinds now 50/100. I have T2170, in 19th place out of the remaining 74 players.

Hand #19: Playing again in the big blind, I get 7♦ 4♦. Three limpers seem to be the order of the day here, and I check with my garbage.

My garbage is looking a bit nice: K♦ 9♦ 3♠ is the flop. The action is checked around.

My flush completes on the turn with the Q♦. I see no reason not to bet here, and lay out 100. I get one caller.

The river is the very scary Q♣. Now I can be beaten. I don’t expect KQ, but Q9 is a possibility. I check, and my opponent folds!?! It would be free to check here, so I guess he just pressed the wrong button. I still get the T600 in the pot.

The blinds now increase to level 4: 100/200. That last pot puts me at T2570, a comfortable 17th place out of 57.

Level 4 comes and goes, and I play no hands. I only lose T100 to the big blind, so I am standing still at T2470, or 22nd out of 45.

Hand #27: In the small blind here, and I pick up the rockets, A♣ A♠. Three limpers are before me. There’s a school of thought that says I should just limp here, but I’m raising. I rarely see players who put in one bet refuse to put in two bets pre-flop at this level. I raise, the big blind calls, as well as all of the previous callers.

The flop is nice, as the 6♦ 4♣ 4♦ starts the board. I’m first to act, and I go all in. The pot is about the size of my stack right now, and I’m hoping that somebody has a 6 and calls me. Nobody does, however, but I don’t mind. I almost double up to T4870.

Hand #29: In middle position now, I pick up my second nice hand in three tries: the Q♦ Q♠. Three people limp in before me (I swear these are different people every time), and I raise again. The big blind calls as does the rest of the limpers. This bet puts one other opponent all-in.

The flop is very nice: 7♦ 4♦ 2♠. If I don’t have the best hand here, I’ll eat my hat. I’m going all in. Nobody calls again (maybe I’m playing too hard?), and I beat the all-in player as well when the flop only hits one of her cards – an eight. I rake in to a total of T7285.

Hand #30: I’m on a roll. I pick up K♣ K♦ the very next hand. Only one limper this time. I’m threatening to tip my strategy here, but I raise again. I get both blinds and the previous bettor to call.

The flop comes J♣ 3♣ 9♦. The Big blind bets. I’m not happy about that, but I call.

The turn is the nondescript 8♥. The big blind bets 1710, which is about one-sixth my stack at the moment. I think he’s got two pair here, and if so, I have 12 outs to beat him. I have good odds, so I call the 1710.

If I needed a scare card to get me away from this pot, I got it on the river: the T♣. Now we have a straight and a flush made, and my cowboys look pretty puny in comparison. When the big blind goes all-in, I don’t need any more big hints to tell me I’m outclassed. I’m out quickly. I lose about a third of my stack in that debacle, as I am down to T4675.

The next level starts, and the blinds are 200/400. Despite losing a bunch of chips, I’m still in nice position – 11th out of the remaining 30 players.

Hand #35: We’re getting down to the nitty gritty here, and I get K♥ J♥ in the big blind. Only the small blind stays in the pot, and I see no reason to raise. I want to see a flop first.

The flop looks serviceable: the T♣ 3♦ 3♣. The kind of flop I like to bluff with in good position, which I have. When the small blind bets out, however, I like the hand a lot less. Either an Ace or Ten will beat me here, and I have but six outs to improve here. I choose to fold and find a better place to stick my money.

The competition is getting fiercer, and the air thinner at Level 7. The blinds are 300/600, but with T4075 I’m in no immediate danger of being blinded out. I am pretty low on the totem pole here though, 15th out of 20.

Hand #39: I’m in late position, and get another premium pair, the Q♦ Q♥. Two limpers come in ahead of me, and I do my customary raise. One player cold calls behind me, and the big blind and the two callers put in one more bet.

An aside here: I would bet more than 2BB when I raise if it were not for the clunky interface PopularPoker uses. I prefer a bet of 3-4BB when raising pre-flop in no limit, depending upon your stack size.

So, with four other players in the pot, we see the flop: A♦ J♦ 4♠. When the pot is checked to me, I decide to put it all in. I dare a player with a blank Ace to call a player who raised pre-flop and went all in on that flop.

My tactic works, as the only person who calls me is a player with fewer chips than me. He shows 5♦ 2♦. All I have to do is dodge a single diamonds – if either no or two diamonds come off, I win. No diamonds come off, and I have more than doubled up. My new stack is T11171, and I am now among the chip leaders.

Level 8 comes up quickly, and my T11171 is good enough for 5th among 18 players. I’ve got a good shot to make the final table.

Hand #44: The big blind is mine again, and I have a nice hand, the A♦ Q♥. There are three limpers to me, and I just check. This hand isn’t good enough for a raise here just to put money in the pot – not to drop any of the players.

The flop is quite nice: Q♥ 7♠ 5♣. I’m first person in the pot with a bet, and I get two callers.

The turn is a slight scare: 6♦. I don’t think anybody would have the 98 at this juncture, but you can never tell. I just check, just in case, and the button bets. I and my other opponent call his bet.

The river is the 3♦, and I’m still not sure where I stand. The pot is sizeable, and I’d be happy with it, so I check, as does everybody else. The button shows pocket Kings, and wins the pot.

You know, folks, there’s a great difference between slowplaying a hand and no-playing a hand.

That knocks me down a bit, to T8771.

Hand #50: I’m in the big blind again, and I get K♠ 4♥. My only competitor is the small blind, who just completes his bet. I check.

The flop is T♥ 6♦ 2♠. We both check.

The J♥ is the turn, and neither of us want to put any more money in the pot.

The river brings me a little help, the 4♣. Now, the small blind bets somewhere around T1000. Am I beating him here? Probably, though a 6 or a T has shown up here in the past to beat me. Is it worth my time? Probably not. I would be putting up 1000 to win 2600. The odds that I’m winning are pretty good, but I’d be down to a short stack, and with another blind increase coming very shortly, I need all of the chips I can get. I decide to fold, albeit a cowardly one. You have to pick your battles at this level, and this one is not important enough to get into.

The blinds escalate to 600/1200 at this point, and I am down to T7371. The final table is soon formed, and I am placed 8th at the moment.

No interesting hands are dealt to me, and the stakes increase again to 800/1600. I haven’t had a single blind in that last level, so I still have T7371, and am seventh out of the remaining nine.

Hand #62: Things are getting slightly desperate, as I am the short stack of the remaining seven. I get a life preserver, though, in the form of T♠ T♦. There’s one limper to me in third position, and I’m in panic mode. I move all in. I get two callers, so I better hope for a ten on the board to keep me alive.
The flop does not disappoint: T♣ 3♦ 4♦. The two live players check through the flop, turn (7♥), and river (8♣), and my trips win the pot, a nice T18113, and that takes me off of the ropes.

The blinds keep escalating, now taking the leap to 1200/2400. After uneventful blinds, I’m left with T15713, fourth out of the remaining six.

Hand #71: I’m in the small blind, and get the A♠ J♦. There’s one limper before me, and I raise, more in an attempt to get the big blind out of the hand. He complies, and I’m isolated with the original bettor.

The flop comes 9♠ 9♦ 4♦. The pot is nice, T12000 strong, and I want to win it. I’m probably in the lead here – a 9 or 4 is doubtful, and I go all in immediately, putting my sole opponent to the test. I get called.

The last two cards aren’t helpful, the K♠ 4♠. I just have to hope that he doesn’t have a King.

He doesn’t. Instead, he has A♣ 4♣, and he shows an unwelcome full house. I go out in sixth place.

Not a bad showing, if I do say so myself. After careful reflection, I’m not ashamed about my play that last hand – I’m not looking to get called there, just win the pot and buy a few more orbits. I was hoping my raise pre-flop and the subsequent all-in on what looked like a garbage flop would win the pot then and there.

I’ll continue to report on any tournaments I enter, and I hope to make a return to the live games soon.

[TredWel]

June 28 – 8:50 pm

All right, let’s resurrect this thing.

I finally hit the cash tables again after a long absence. I found a nice table, and sat down. Nobody looked to be too strong, lots of calling stations – about what you find at the online cheap tables. This session would prove interesting, as the table would dwindle in size, eventually reaching four and five-handed poker for a while.

Hand #1: In the big blind, I pick up a nice hand to resume my poker playing: A♦ Q♥. There are five limpers prior to me, and I just check. I’d want a bit stronger of a hand to raise here, since all my bet is going to do is double the pot size. I’d want to be surer of the fact that I’m going to win the hand.

The flop is T♠ 6♥ 4♣, and it’s checked around.

The turn is the 7♠. Maybe I’m just rusty, but I’m sure the proper play here is to bet. With two overcards, you still have a chance against anybody who would call with a low pair. I just check, as does the rest of the table.

The J♣ completes the board. I should bet here, but a Jack is much more likely to show up in someone’s hand compared to, say, a three. I check, and eventually fold to a bet on my left. I’m a little out of practice.

Hand #10: Once again I am in the Big Blind, and I get a slightly less powerful hand, the J♣ 7♠. There are only two limpers, and I check.

The flop is interesting: the K♣ T♠ 8♥. A nine, or an A-Q running would give me a nice straight. Unfortunately, there’s a bet on my left, and I am faced with a decision, which I want to work out statistically before I reveal what I did.

The flop is a rainbow, so I don’t have to worry about a flush. I have 7 ½ outs with the nine, 1 ½ outs for the A-Q. The bettor might not even have a King, I’m going to estimate another 3 outs in the case I can grab a Jack and beat his pair. All told, I have about 12 outs, or a 3-1 chance to win this pot.

There’s $2 in the pot right now, and I would have to put up 50¢ to stay in the pot. I am being offered 4-1 odds on a 3-1 proposition. I should call.

Unfortunately, I choose to fold.

Hand #16: Big Blind time again, and I get another mediocre-crappy hand: J♦ 8♥. There’s only one limper before me (the table started to get a little light around now), and I just check.

The flop is a monster. A♣ K♠ Q♣. And it misses me completely. My opponent obviously bets, and I get rid of the hand quickly. It’s possible he’s bluffing me, but I am almost always the underdog in this situation.

Hand #22: Only six hands, and I put up the big blind again. I need to start winning some of my money back quickly, and it’s tough in this setting. I get A♠ 4♦ in the blind, supposedly a good hand in short-handed play. I check as two limpers volunteer money to the pot.

The flop is interesting: Q♠ Q♣ 7♠. When the small blind checks, I decide to make a ploy here. I’m going to play as if I have a queen.

I bet, and only the non-blind calls, the small blind fleeing.

The turn is the 2♦, no help for my hand, but I bet again. He calls again.

The flop is the 8♥. I still have a “Queen”, and I bet, hoping he had a flush draw. Since I didn’t get any play back during the hand, I doubt he has a queen (maybe a seven), and he folds rather than put in another dollar. That rather large bluff nets me my first pot of the night, worth $5.50.

Hand #23: I have a nice hand in the small blind, the Q♠ J♠. There’s an early raise, and I am the only player who calls him.

The flop is the A♣ 9♥ 5♣. I check, and he bets out. I could play as if I had a club draw here. Play passive until (hopefully) the third club falls, at which point bet strongly. That might not work, depending on what he has. I take the coward’s way out, and fold, though the more I think about it, I should have played like I had a club draw there.

Hand #24: I own the button now, and I pick up an interesting hand: T♥ 8♥. This is borderline, but I limp in with position favoring me. Three others are in this pot.

The flop seems to reward my play, as I get the nice A♥ T♦ 5♥. Flush draw with second pair to fall back on. They check to me, and I like betting my draws. I bet, and only one player calls.

The turn gives me nothing, the 6♠. I bet again, and he calls again.

The river gives me what I needed in the form of the J♥. I almost certainly have a lead pipe cinch here, and I bet again, he calls again. My flush takes the $6.75 pot.

Hand #25: As the table gets smaller and smaller, my action gets larger and larger. We’re four handed for this deal, and under the gun, I get the A♣ 8♣. A very nice hand to have four-handed, no doubt about that. I raise, and get calls from the two blinds.

The flop hits my hand with the A♥ Q♦ 5♥. I’m last to act, and they check to me. I’m solidifying my table image as an aggressive player, and I bet out. Both players fold, so I’m glad I raised pre flop. I take in $4.

Hand #26: I barely have time to breathe here, and I find myself in the big blind again. I pick up the Q♦ 5♣. Not the best of hands, but I get to see a free flop as two players call the blind. Note that I was not raised out of a blind for the entire session so far.

The flop hits me again. Q♣ 7♣ J♦. Isn’t this game easy when you keep flopping good hands? The small blind checks. I see no reason not to bet, and I do so. This scares the small blind away, but I still have one fish on the line.

The turn makes things even nicer, the Q♠! I bet again, and I think that things might be too nice for my opponent, who drops his hand quickly. I pick up my fourth straight pot, another $3.25.

Hand #28: Finally I fold a hand from the small blind, and I get the A♠ Q♠ on the button, five handed. The first player is forced in (his first hand at the table), and the second player folds to me. I don’t consider that player to have opened yet, so I open with a raise with my nice hand. I get two callers, including the UTG player.

The flop hits me again (it’s too easy this way): Q♣ J♠ 4♣. They check to me, and I bet again (am I the only player left to bet out at this table?) UTG is the only caller.

The turn is a scare card, with the 8♣ dropping. UTG checks, and I have a problem. Two clubs or a T9 are problem hands now, and he could feasibly have either. I decide to keep up the strong play, and bet out again. If I’m check raised, I’ll know I’m beat. He simply calls.

The 3♦ is the turn, and UTG checks again. I decide to check down here – don’t want to risk going to the well once too often. He turns up 9♠ 4♠, and I win another $5.50.

The table becomes three handed at this point, and despite the fact that I have ripped up this competition short-handed, I think that three is too short-handed to be played profitably. I leave the table after a half-hour’s worth of play, up $9.50. Sat for 29 hands, 5 plays in the big blind and 5 out of it. I win 5 pots, a very large number for me.

[thealmighty]

Welcome back. :)

[RPI-Fan]

I don't know about others, but my browser doesn't display those suits very well (clubs, diamonds, etc.). I liked it just fine without them, but if they work for other people, and they enjoy them, then of course ignore this.

~rpi-fan

[TredWel]

the_almighty: Thanks, it's good (and profitable) to be back.

RPI-Fan: I started using the suit symbols because it was hard for me at a glance to see the suits when I read my write-ups before. I can change from the ASCII suits to small gifs of them that I have handy:

<img src="http://www.gg.caltech.edu/~jeff/gifs/s.gif" alt="s"> <img src="http://www.gg.caltech.edu/~jeff/gifs/h.gif" alt="h"> <img src="http://www.gg.caltech.edu/~jeff/gifs/d.gif" alt="d"> <img src="http://www.gg.caltech.edu/~jeff/gifs/c.gif" alt="c">

I'd rather not fall back on using text characters again, but if it'll be the easiest way for people to read it, then it's fine.

[thealmighty]

Those gifs look really good, TredWel.

[Radii]

the diamond shows up as a square in my browser, but the other 3 work, I like the read either way :)

[TredWel]

Got a double update for you today. I played two times yesterday – once in the morning, and once in the afternoon. I thought the only time that I could rake in the money is at night, and I wanted to test that hypothesis.

BTW – the board won’t let me put so many images into one post, so I’m going back to letters to represent the suits.

June 30 – 10:00am

<b>Hand #1</b>: I’m playing in third position, and I get a fairly nice hand: Tc 9c. The two people before me at the table limp in, and I do likewise. We go around the table, and the small blind raises. Everybody calls, and there are 5 other players in with me for a buck each.

The flop is quite nice, Jc 5c 2s. I would normally bet this pot, but the small blind beats me to it, and bets first. 4 others and myself all call.

The turn isn’t what I’m looking for – the 3s. Everybody checks.

The river finally hits me, but not in the way I want. The Ts comes off the deck. We check around to a bettor in late position. I smell a bluff attempt, and I call. Imagine my surprise when he turns over two spades, claiming the pot with his flush. I would have thought most spade flushes would not have stayed in thanks to the strong betting of the small blind. Oh well.

<b>Hand #8</b>: In late position, I get a nice hand, but one of my least favorite “nice hands”: Ts Td. This pocket pair is nice, and will win its share of pots, but at these low levels when people are calling your raises with crap, you’re more likely to be beaten by a person who hung on to their face card for dear life. When four players before me limp in, I can’t raise. That won’t drive anybody out of the pot right now. I just call. The blinds are in as well.

The flop comes complete with the requisite scare overcard. Qd 8h 3s. There’s an early bettor and several calls before me, and I get away from this hand. I’m almost positive I’m beaten by a pair of queens, and I have but two cards in the deck to improve my hand, save for a running jack-nine. I’m out of here.

<b>Hand #29</b>: A boring and unprofitable session so far, but these things have a history of turning around big time, so I persevere. I’m in the big blind, and I get a fairly nice hand, Ah 9s. Three limpers come into the pot before a late position player raises. I have enough to contest this raise, and call the extra four bits. My call makes 7 players in and a nice pot forming.

The flop hits me well, the Ad Jc 6d. If it weren’t for that diamond flush, I’d be ecstatic. Still, top pair is nothing to sneeze at, and I want to make people with draws pay. I bet, and everybody at the table calls.

The turn card lets me get out early, as the 3d hits the table. We check around to a late bettor, who manages to scare away some players, including me. He did have the diamond flush, by the way.

<b>Hand #36</b>: In the big blind again, and I need to win fast before I hit my lower limit for the session. My hand doesn’t provide much hope for change here, the Js 6d not looking too strong. Only four limpers come in before me, and I get to see a free flop.

The flop gives me less reason to be happy, as the Jd 7d 4d form a fairly scary flop. Nobody likes this flop too much, so we all check.

The turn makes my hand a little better, as the 6c turns up. I bet at the pot, figuring that even if someone is slowplaying their flush, I at least won’t be drawing dead. I get three callers, and no raisers.

The river is the 6h, providing insurance against the flop flush that appears to not exist. What I wouldn’t give to exchange the 6d in my hand with the 6h on the board – what a coup that pot would be. Anyway, back to the present, where I bet at the pot once again. Two people pay off my full house. and the $10 pot I win takes me back to near even money for the session.

<b>Hand #40</b>: I’m in middle position when I pick up a nice hand, Kd Qd. There are two limpers in front of me, and I decide to try and buy the button by raising. The button as well as the small blind and the two limpers call me. So much for that tack.

The flop comes Jh 6h 4c. It checks to me, and I might have the best hand here. Let’s make the flush draws pay, and I bet. We have three callers.

The 5h comes off the deck, and I’m done with this hand. Everybody checks.

The 6c comes next, pairing the board. Everybody checks down, and the button shows off AKo. Nobody shows any other better combination of cards, and he takes the pot.

<b>Hand #42</b>: I’m in second position with a hand that’s not too bad, the Qs Ts. UTG folds, and I open with a raise. I get two callers.

The flop keeps me hoping: 5s 5h 2s. I’m first to act, and I bet my draw. Both players call me.

The turn is the nice Qd. My hand becomes stronger, and I bet again. This time, I get raised by one of my opponents. The other folds, and I call. I’m thinking that he has a queen, and there’s a good chance that his kicker beats mine. I still have a flush draw to fall back on here.

The river is the blank 3c. I check, as does he. He’s got Ah Jh, and I guess he was bluffing me. I rake in another $8.25.

<b>Hand #45</b>: After putting up the small blind, I get to play a nice hand, the Ac Th. After four people call the big blind, I put in a quarter, and the BB checks. Raising in late position gets you nowhere in this game.

The flop hits me pretty well. Tc 7d 4d. That damn flush draw again. Well, under the gun here and I must bet. I get one person to fold, 5 to call.

The turn is the 7h. I’ll bet again, though there’s no guarantee that there isn’t a 7 lurking out there somewhere. One more dropout, bringing the total to four.

The river is the 8s, and it’s about damn time the flush doesn’t make when I’m playing against it. I bet again, and get called by one person. He doesn’t have a seven, and my top pair-best kicker hand wins $12.50.

<b>Hand #48</b>: Middle position again, and I get a nice pocket pair in the form of Jh Jc. There are three limpers before me, and I raise. This time I buy the button, and get four others into the pot with me.

The flop is the Ts 8c 3s. The SB bets, and I expect him to have a ten. All others call, and I (on the button) raise. I’m in the lead here, and I want the others to pay for the privilege of playing, which that all do.

The turn is the 9h, making a straight possible. The SB bets again, and everybody else calls. The SB most likely doesn’t have a straight, and nobody else is playing like they have a straight either. I only call this time, though, just in case.

The river is a Th, and it’s not the card I wanted to see here. The small blind bets again, and there’s a raise before the action comes to me. I have to fold here. I’ve been playing the SB for a ten since the flop, and either he or the raiser must have trips by now. It turns out they both had a ten.

I check out soon after, up $9.50 for the hour. This is what I make at nights, which is good. It means I can play more often.

[TredWel]

Had a database problem come up when I posted - gues the post came up anyway.

This thread now appears to be one off in it's post count on the front page.

[Alf]

FYI "Hand" reads much easier than "Hand"

Anyway, I am glad you are on a winning streak !

[TredWel]

Originally posted by Alf
FYI "Hand" reads much easier than "Hand"

I've just been forgetting to bold the start of each hand lately. Thanks for reminding me.

[TredWel]

Second part of a doubleheader.

June 30 – 3:00pm

<b>Hand #2</b>: In the small blind, I get a very nice hand: Js Jd. I’ve got three limpers behind me, and I decide to raise here. I want to pump up the pot, but also I want to establish myself as an aggressive player early. The BB and all other limpers call.

The flop is nice: 9h 9s 4d. When the board flops a pair, and you have an overpair, bet heavily. There are only two cards that can beat you, and plenty of other players will stay in on hands that can’t beat you. I bet UTG, and all four players call.

The turn brings another pair to the board with 4s. I have three pair (woo), but still have the overpair. I bet, and get raised! I and one other player call the raise. I guess the raiser has a four, and thus has a full house. I still have four outs to beat her hand in either a jack or nine.

The river fails to disappoint, as the Jh comes up! Only pocket nines and fours can beat me, and I can’t read that in anybody. I bet again, and the previous raiser raises again. I reraised her, and she caps the betting at $4. I call, and hope my read is right. She turns over 5c 4c, and my perseverance and tons of luck pay off. The pot I rake in is one of my biggest to date, $21.50.

<b>Hand #8</b>: I pick up another pocket pair in second position. This time it’s Ad Ah. :D UTG limps in, and I make the compulsory raise. There are four callers.

The flop is even nicer, as As 8s Td makes me trips. I’m the first bettor, and there is only one caller, probably on a spade draw.

The turn is a blank, the 2c. I bet again, and she contributes another buck into the pot.

The river is the 5c, and the spade flush doesn’t make. I bet again, as I can’t see how I could be beat. I expect her to fold, but she calls me. I show my pocket rockets, and she mucks. I take in $9.50, and my stack is looking impressive in a short amount of time.

<b>Hand #10</b>: I’m in the pot with the big blind, and I pick up Jd 9h for the inconvenience. There are 5 limpers before me, and I check.

The flop is 9s 5d 3d, and I’ve got top pair again. The small blind checks, and I go gung-ho into the pot. Two of the five limpers call me.

The turn is 3s, board pairing threes now. As long as nobody has a three, I should still have the best hand. I bet, and both players call.

The turn is the Qd. Now not only is there an overcard, but there’s a flush chance with the diamonds. I’m now doubtful about my chances, so I check. Both opponents check, and I show my nine. Nobody else shows, and I pickup up another $7.

<b>Hand #14</b>: I’m just picking up the hands here today. I get Ad Kd in middle position. There’s a limper before me, and I look to isolate by raising. Only the BB and the original limper call the raise, so my raise appears to have succeeded.

The flop is the Js Th 9s, giving me a gutshot straight draw. The BB is first to act, and bets. Limper calls, and I have just enough chance to win this pot to call, in my estimation.

The turn card is the 9c, making me think twice about my chances here. The BB bets again, and I’m contemplating another borderline call, when the limper raises the bet. I know I’m beat here and don’t have the odds required to call anymore. I mentally thank the raiser for making my lay down easier.

<b>Hand #17</b>: What can you say? When you get the hands, you’ve just got to play them well. I get Ah Ks in early position. There’s one limper, and I make an isolation raise. This time, the small blind and the limper call.

The flop hits me better than the last time I had Slick. As Jc 8c. The action checks to me, and I bet out. Both players stay in to see the turn.

The turn is the 7d. This time, the SB takes the lead, and bets out. The limper folds. He has a seven, does he have anything else? I don’t think so, and I call.

The river is the Qs, and the SB bets out again. I call, and am faced with Js 7s.

In retrospect, the call on the river was not good. I’ve shown a strong hand, and I doubt that the play at these tables is so awful that a player could call pre-flop and flop, then hit bottom pair on the turn and carry the betting from that point onward. I should have realized he has at least two pair, and folded accordingly.

Between a few hands here, one of the players at the table asks: "What's the point in raising before the flop in a 50 cent table?" I don’t know about you, but I got a good laugh out of that.

<b>Hand #28</b>: My hand cools off, and the next time I see significant action, I’m in the big blind with 7s 4h. Four people limp, and I check (surprising, I know. I’m sure moat of you would have raised here :D)

The flop is disgusting: Ac Qd 8c. My hand is poised over the fold button if there is any wagering here, but everybody checks.

The turn hits my hand, but I’m not too happy about it. The turn is the 7d. SB checks, and I guess I’ll bet here. I wouldn’t be surprised in the least if I was beaten here, but betting here seems to be the right thing to do. Everybody folds. I’m a little shell-shocked, as anybody with an A, Q, 8, JT, two clubs, two diamonds, etc would have a good call here. I take in $3.50.

<b>Hand #30</b>: I get my first decent hand in a while, in Ad Qc. There are four limpers in front of me, and I call on the button. SB completes, and BB checks.

The flop is Ts 7c 3d. There’s an early bettor, and a bunch of others call. I only have overcard draws, but I have decent odds here. I call, but don’t expect much.

The turn is the 4s. The same bettor fires out again. I’m not getting good odds here with the big bet now in action, and fold gratefully.

<b>Hand #31</b>: The very next hand gives me another decent hand, with the Kd Qs. There are two limpers before me, and I limp as well. Button folds, and the SB and BB are the other two people in this pot.

The flop is Js 7s 4h. Not exactly exciting stuff here, and my check echoes the sentiment of the table.

The turn is the Ac giving me a straight draw. With an Ace up, I don’t want to bet the draw, so I check, as does everybody else.

The river comes Ad, and I don’t know what to think. In my notes that I take while playing, this card is associated with the note, and I quote, “FINE!! I’LL BET!!” Since nobody tried to show a good hand, I throw in a buck to try and win the pot, and everybody complies by folding. I pick up another $3.75.

<b>Hand #34</b>: I’m under the gun here, and I get Kc Kh. I open with a raise. I’m scaring everybody here, I feel, and the small blind is the only caller.

The flop is 9s 7h 2s. The SB checks, and I figure to be in the lead here. I bet, and he calls me.

The turn is the 6s, and he checks. Now with the flush on the board, I feel a little skittish about this hand. I check as well.

The river is the 6c, and when the SB bets, I’m feeling even more skittish. Still, there’s a good chance I’m in the lead, good enough that I still have to call here. I call his bet, not knowing what to expect. He has Jd 8s, and was blowing smoke up my ass. I win $5.

<b>Hand #39</b>: In early position, I get the Ad Jh. Everyone to my left folds, and I open with a raise. Isolation isn’t the result here, as four people call the raise behind me.

The flop is the Ah 9d 6h. With top pair, I can’t see not betting, and I get the chance when the blinds check. I get two callers.

The turn is the Th, making the heart flush. This appears to be a problem for me – I have no problem betting strongly when there’s a flush draw, but as soon as the flush makes, I’m a scared little bunny rabbit. I’m surprised people don’t pick up on this and start betting when flushes make to move me off my hands. This is part of my strategy that I have to work on. Anyway, I check, as does everybody else.

The turn is a blank, the 4d. The SB bets, and I figure he’s bluffing me off my hand. I call, and he shows 9s 4s, making two pair. Guess that last 4 wasn’t a blank at all. Note that if I had bet the turn, there was a good chance that he would have let that hand go.

<b>Hand #43</b>: In the big blind now, and I have a mediocre Qd 8d. There are four limpers in this pot as well.

The flop comes As Qs 7c. Yuck. I check, as does everybody else.

The turn comes Jc. This gets the small blind’s attention, and he bets. Well, if he has a pair of jacks, the I’ve got him beat. I call him, as does two other players.

The river is the Ad, and he bets again. I can’t put him on an Ace, so I think he’s got Aces and Jacks, which my Aces and Queens beat. I call him, and I stand alone in that regard. He turns up A7o. He slowplayed his flopped two pair perfectly, and he got me big time. An excellent play, and though I lost the hand, I respect his play big time. This was one of the first good pieces of play I’ve seen at this level.

<b>Hand #46</b>: I get another high pocket pair, with Qd Qc in late position. There are two limpers before me, and I raise to try and buy the button. No dice, as the dealer calls. The BB also calls, giving me four other hands to worry about.

The flop is the 8h 8c 6d. Keeping in mind my advice from hand #2, I bet out. The button raises me. Not a happy time here, as he’s probably got an 8. The BB calls the raise, as do I, the two limpers getting out now.

The turn is the Td, and we check to the button, who bets again. The BB calls, and I call. I may be wrong on my read of the eight, and he might only have a six. Even if he has an 8, I still have two queens in the deck that can beat him.

For the second time in the session, I make a big suck out on the river. The Qh comes off the deck! Now only pocket eights can beat me. It’s a possibility that the button has 88, but it’s not feasible enough to stop betting. The BB checks, and I check, setting the trap. The button bets, and the BB raises! That was unexpected. Maybe he has J9. At any rate, I re-raise, and dealer quickly caps the betting at four bets. The big blind folds now (after contributing another $2 to the pot). I call the bet, and he shows 85o. My full house nets me $19.25.

I leave the table after that one, hardly believing my luck for the session. I’m up $31, by far my best hour ever.

[Bee]

I think this dynasty has helped my play more than anything else. It's good to see how someone else thinks and plays the game. I've modified my strategy somewhat and my winnings have increased dramatically. :D

[thealmighty]

TredWel, when I play PartyPoker for free, it seems like 75% of the players haven't much clue what they are doing. I have never had a losing session yet.

Ssooooo, how much better are the cash table players? I realize free poker is an oxymoron kind of deal, when losing has no meaning, but what % of cash players know how to play at the .50/$1 level, iyho?

[Bee]

At the low money tables it's more like 65% don't have a clue. :D

[RPI-Fan]

I haven't myself played a cheap table, but I've 'coached' someone at a $1-2 table at Pokerroom (we're both decent players, but my credit cards don't work for the online poker [to the extent that I've tried]). I just chip in my advice based on the board and other bets etc. (I'm watching the whole time), so I get a good read on the players.

I'd say 25-40% are (edited to:) "not awful" players at the $1-2 level at Pokeroom (their lowest limit). They have stats for each table, which gives a good indication of when you're at a strong table, and a weak table.

When you play a loose table like most of the $1-2's are, you must play tight-aggressive like TredWel. If you adjust your style to be loose, you will simply get too many bad beats to recover in terms of bankroll and mentally (it's just so damn frustrating).

If you're at a tighter table, you still don't want to loosen up too much. Maybe just the difference between calling or folding in late position with A3s.

Also, I've been playing the freeroll tournaments at Pokerroom a lot. They have them at 9am and 3pm (though you have to sign up at 8am and 2pm, respectively). I've found them to be good practice, and when I do get some money into my account, they'll have been good practice for adjusting my style to be tighter. I'd definitely recommend checking them out.

~rpi-fan

[TredWel]

Bee: I'm glad to know people are benefitting from my advice. My bill will be in the mail soon. :D

thealmighty: I'd say a bit more than half of the low-money cash table players are too loose for their own good and don't know when to lay down a hand. I beleive that a player could break even on those tables by just playing tight enough. You increase your edge when you play aggressively and thoughtfully.

RPI-Fan: I agree that freeroll multi-table tournaments are a lot of fun and are better practice for money games than free tables. Quite often the entry fee for these tournament are quite expensive (I think PartyPoker's cheapest entry fee for a multi-table tournament is $22) so that you'll get a good amount of players who may play for money but can't afford the entry fee into higher stakes tournaments and wouldn't play free games otherwise. Plus, bad maniac players are knocked out early, leaving you to fend against those who know how to play. These games can be some of the best practice you can ask for.

[sabotai]

Guess I'm going back to the books and play money for awhile. Tried my hand at some real money play tonight and lost $21 over the course of 2 1/2 hours at the $0.5/$1 table.

I was up $8.50 at one point, then I just lost it. Five times I got an AK and once it was suited. I call to see the flop and everytime, nothing. I watched for over 40 minutes pots being taken on pairs and two pairs. So when I get a straight, of course someone has a hand to beat it. I got dealt a pair ONCE in 2 1/2 hours. And on the one hand, I won a $10 pot.

Maybe it was a string of really bad deals. But I do know I made at least several big mistakes that I will not make again.

And for now one, I follow Tred's rule. Once I go down $10 on the night, I'm gone. :)

[RPI-Fan]

One amateur mistake I tend to find is overplaying of suited cards.

I believe these are the stats on such hands.

Preflop, you have a 3% chance that the 5 community cards will complete your flush when you have suited cards. If you have 4 to the flush postflop, there's a 45% chance you'll hit it on the turn/river.

I've noticed people seem to overplay suited cards.

(For example, one time I had KK, and someone else had AQx or AKx or something like that, and we capped the betting preflop. There was one other caller along the way - a guy with A3s. After 2 threes hit on the flop, and the hand was over, I asked him why he would possibly call with Ace-Three.

His answer...

"Ace-Three _Suited_")

WTF...

~rpi-fan

[TredWel]

sabotai: Yes, strings of bad luck can and do happen. That's why I implemented the $10 rule. It just becomes so frustrating that you just want to recoup your losses quickly, which isn't how to play poker. It's better to step away from the table, gather your thoughts, and come back to the table with a clean slate.

Easy for me to say - I've only hit that barrier once.

But, as long as you were learning some things about the experience, then consider it money well spent. You'll win it back soon enough, I'm sure.

RPI-Fan: Now that's funny. He must be an Omaha player, where any suited ace is an almost-always playable hand.

Yes, I've noticed a lot of times that when players show down with low crap, it's almost always suited crap.

Relax your starting hand quality a little for suited hands (I usually play things as weak as KTs under the gun, while just throwing away unsuited kings), but don't completely throw away the opening requirements.

[sabotai]

Yeah, I don't try to let suited cards blidn me. I know making the flsuh on the flop is low.

The not-so-funny thing is, twice I folded preflop with suited cards (Once it was a K2s and another was 62d). Twice I would have gotten the flush on the flop. Sometimes when you do the right thing, it sucks. :)

[RPI-Fan]

sabotai: I know you can't really do this at ring games when you should be observing etc., but when I play the freeroll multitable, I literally minimize the window after I fold. I have _no_ interest in seeing what sort of cards hit, and what other people play with.

I often find myself making bad calls later on based on that info, so I just don't expose myself to it.

I try and immediately block out any cards that I folded preflop, and that's probably something that might be useful for you to do.

[sabotai]

dola,

You want to hear a couple of funny stories. The $21 I spent for the 2 1/2 hours of comedy was worth it. :)

One person betted, not checked, not called, but bet-raised all the way to a showdown....with nothing. With just an Ace. No hand whatsoever. All I can think of is the person was trying to bluff. But that's just stupid.

I also saw someone throw away $75 easy. In fact, I was in a showdown with the guy. I had an 8-Q straight. The only way he could have beat me was if he had KJ. But since I knew how this guy played, and how he was just giving out money, I took him on and won. One of the very few pots I won. (I won 3. One for $10. One for $7. And one for $1.50...yes a $1.50 pot. Lots of checking in that hand. :) )

The rest were either bad mistakes or just horrible luck.

EDIT: Definatly noted RPI. In fact, for a lot of the night, I was chatting in IRC. When I was doing that, I was either winning or hovering on even. It was when I started paying attnetion that I started losing. So maybe for the time being, I just ignore the game like you suggest.

[RPI-Fan]

At the lowest limits, that's probably not a bad idea.

Otherwise, your play is likely to get too 'fancy', and you'll make silly mistakes (I often have a problem with this in live games).

[TredWel]

I often browse FOFC while waiting for my next hand when I fold pre-flop. I can still tell who's the calling station and who's tight, but it might take me longer to make that tell. Just sitting there and watching cards falland seeing what I could have made is just too boring for me to sit for.

[TredWel]

Back to the tables after my big payout of yesterday.

<b>Hand #10:</b> Absolutely no hands played before this point, I am in the big blind with Qh 6s. I am not raised this time, in fact only two limpers come into the pot this time. Earlier hands were punctuated with a maniac player, calling and raising with anything. God bless them, they make my life so much richer.

The flop is of little help, with the Ad 9s 6h coming off the deck. I check bottom pair, and the other two limpers check as well.

The turn is the Qc, now giving me two pair. I bet here, and my action scares both players away. Maybe I should have checked here, letting them bluff at the river. I still win $2.50.

<b>Hand #21:</b> Normally, I just skip over hands here when I’m in the Big Blind with garbage, see a free flop that misses me, and fold. This is not the case. In the previous 20 hands, I have played once, and I was in the big blind without a quality hand at the time. You just run cold sometimes.

This hand is my first good hand of the session, Ks Qs in the small blind. There are five limpers before me. I put in the last quarter, and the BB checks.

The flop is pretty bad, the 9s 7h 5d. I check, and the BB bets. There are four callers after him, and I’m last to act here. With my backdoor spade draw and two overcards, I have a little better than 4-1 odds here of improving my hand. I’m getting 9-1 odds on my money. I knew I was getting good odds when I called, but I didn’t think I was getting as good odds as this. I’m glad I called, or else I would have had some nice tap dancing to do here to explain how I could have missed this proposition.

The turn rewards the call, as the Kh hits the table. I check again, deciding to see what the rest of the table is going to do before I act. There’s one bettor, not the BB here. One person calls before me, and I call as well.

The river is the 3h, hitting the backdoor heart flush. I check again, and the turn bettor bets again. The other player folds, and I’m left with a decision. I’m definitely going to call, the question is, should I raise? I decide not to. There’s the flush and plenty of straight draws. All I have is top pair. While that may win, it’s definitely not a must win. He bet the turn as well, so I don’t think he’s bluffing. I call, and he turns up Kd 6c. My Queen beats his 6, and I collect $11.

<b>Hand #25:</b> Qs 8s is the hand in late position. There are four limpers before me, and because I’m in good position with many callers, I limp as well. If I was earlier or fewer people came into the pot, I would fold. The SB and BB make it six others to go against.

The flop is the Jh 5c 2s. There’s a bet in the middle, and I raise here. I’ve got a decent draw, and I’m going to have to see the river in order to make sure that my draw is secured. I want a free card on the turn, so I raise. There are three callers of my raise.

The turn is the Ks. So far, so good. Even better, everybody checks to me, and I check as well.

The river is the 3h. No dice. There’s an early bet, and I fold, my hand not worth anything.

<b>Hand #30:</b> Big Blind time again. I get Qs 9c, and only two limpers are in this pot.

The flop is the blasé Ah Ts 4c. Nobody bets at it.

The turn is the Qh. I’m checking here, learning my lesson after Hand #10. Nobody bets here either.

The river is the 9c. Now somebody should have been hit somewhere along the line, but I’ve got two pair. I check, intending to raise whatever bet comes down. Instead, nobody bets for the third time. My two pair wins the King’s ransom of $1.50.

<b>Hand #31:</b> The next hand, I put up the small blind, and catch Qc Tc. Again, there are two limpers before me, and I call the blind. The big blind completes.

The flop is As Jh 4s, giving me a straight draw. I check, as well as everybody else.

The turn is the Kd, giving me the nuts. I bet here, and I get raised! This is an interesting predicament, but I’ve got the best possible hand. Only an A, K, J, 4 or a spade can beat me if it comes on the river, meaning I’m about a 50/50 shot at keeping the nuts safe. I re-raise, and two people have the fortitude to call $3.

The turn is the Th. I still have the nuts, though anybody with a queen has that claim to fame as well. I bet out, and only get called by the two players left. I show my queen, and nobody else can match it. I cull $13.50 for that performance.

The table gets quite shorthanded very quickly, so much so that I am under the gun in a fourhanded game four hands after that hand. I get out quickly, not wanting to be blinded in an extremely short handed game.

While my night was not as profitable as my last foray, I’m still up $16.25 for the half-hour’s work. Not bad at all.

[Airhog]

Originally posted by sabotai
I was up $8.50 at one point, then I just lost it. Five times I got an AK and once it was suited. I call to see the flop and everytime, nothing. I watched for over 40 minutes pots being taken on pairs and two pairs. So when I get a straight, of course someone has a hand to beat it. I got dealt a pair ONCE in 2 1/2 hours. And on the one hand, I won a $10 pot.


What was your position on the table when you called AK?

A good strategy with good holecard, and you have the second best set of Holecards, is to bet pre-flop. You dont want guys limping in on the pot to see a flop and get lucky. You want to try and drive out all the weak hands to improve your chances of winning. The best position to do this from of course, is when your sitting on the button. Just sit back and take their money.

Of course it is possible to just not have the cards fall your way. But I tend to think of poker as a marathon rather then a sprint.

[sabotai]

I had to do it. I just had to try my luck at a different table. I knew I should just give it up for the night and not risk more bad luck....but the hell with it.

And after about 20 minutes, I win back $8.75 so now I'm 12.25 in the hole overall.

Just as I had bad luck, I get good luck. I get dealt QQ on my first hand and win the pot with Queens and Fives.

My second I get delt a T9. I ended up winning the pot and splitting it with someone else. We both had Nines full of Threes.

I just fold until the bind gets to me again and I quit. So atleast I got some of it back. :)

[sabotai]

Tred, a couple of questions I hope you don't mind. Remember, I'm still pretty much a n00b, so some of them may seem silly to you. :)

"The flop is pretty bad, the 9s 7h 5d. I check, and the BB bets. There are four callers after him, and I’m last to act here. With my backdoor spade draw and two overcards, I have a little better than 4-1 odds here of improving my hand. I’m getting 9-1 odds on my money."

I'm wondering how you came up with these odds. I could probably go look it up but basically what I'm asking is how do you determine what the odds are quickly? How quickly do you usually take to figure odds?

"The flop is the Jh 5c 2s. There’s a bet in the middle, and I raise here. I’ve got a decent draw, and I’m going to have to see the river in order to make sure that my draw is secured. I want a free card on the turn, so I raise. There are three callers of my raise."

You had a Qs and an 8s. I'm wondering why you raised here. How is this a decent draw?

[sabotai]

"What was your position on the table when you called AK?"

I have the logs from Party Poker. I don't remember where I was all the times. I think once came when I was on the big blind.

But anyway. I'll start my own thread soon and stop taking over Tred's. But unlike his thread where most people are probably learning, my thread will hopefully be people teaching me. :D

[RPI-Fan]

With regard to that raise...

He raised on the flop, for $.50, and thus on the turn everyone checked to him, expecting a raise. When he checks, he sees the river card for free.

So he got two cards for $.50, where he otherwise would have gotten two cards for $1.50 in all likelihood.

[TredWel]

Originally posted by sabotai
Tred, a couple of questions I hope you don't mind. Remember, I'm still pretty much a n00b, so some of them may seem silly to you. :)

Not at all. These questions are perfectly legitimate, and I'm happy to answer them. The answers (especially to the second question) are not exactly intuitive.

I'm wondering how you came up with these odds. I could probably go look it up but basically what I'm asking is how do you determine what the odds are quickly? How quickly do you usually take to figure odds?

I usually don't figure out the odds immediately at the table - I just knew from previous experience that two overcards on an otherwise worthless flop is a good drawing hand.

To determine the odds after the fact, I used <a href="http://www.posev.com/poker/holdem/strategy/outs-abdul.html">this</a> useful little guide. After the flop, I had a nonpaired hand drawing to a higher pair (11 1/2 outs), and a 3-flush drawing for a flush (1 1/2 outs). 13 outs out of 47 cards, and I approximated that to 4-1 for easy comprehension.

You had a Qs and an 8s. I'm wondering why you raised here. How is this a decent draw?

J52 rainbow is not exactly a powerhouse flop. I only had a single overcard and a backdoor flush draw, which was just barely good enough to call the bet and stay in the hand.

Here's the problem. If a person is willing to bet on the flop, he's most likely going to bet on the turn as well. If I want to see the river (and I would in case I make my spade flush, or need an extra chance to grab a queen), I'd end up paying $1.50.

Now I'm in last position here, so I'm last to act on any betting round. What I do here is raise on the flop, letting whoever who wants to call me. Now that they're scared of my hand, they might just check to me on the turn, when I can then check and see the river for no additional cost. This strategy only costs me two bets on the flop, before the cost of calling doubles. I only pay $1 to see the river, saving me money on this borderline draw.

This tactic doesn't always work. There's the risk of being reraised on the flop or a person still betting on the turn, but it's a good tactic to try out when the time is right.

[Radii]

I have to brag just a little, playing a no limit $25 table at party last night, I ended up winning about $120. I slowly worked my way up to about $80, and then it got very short handed. I consider myself to be an above average short handed no limit player, at least at these stakes. Plus the two guys I was up against had about $25 each, and I had an $80 stack, a huge advantage. I ended up cleaning them both out and the table broke up. :) I was rather pleased with myself.

Tonight I sat at another $25 NL table and walked away with $90 after about 3 hours. The best thing about that table was that there was one big stack of $190 at the table when I got there. That guy busted out and lost all $190 in about 2 hours.

I'm becoming more and more convinced that this is the most profitable way to play online. Of course, you can lose $25 on one hand if you make a mistake, and I have done that 2 or 3 times, but I'm up about $250 in the last 2 weeks playing off and on.

Ok Tred, you can have your thread back :) I'm really enjoying the reading here, keep it up!

[sabotai]

"He raised on the flop, for $.50, and thus on the turn everyone checked to him, expecting a raise. When he checks, he sees the river card for free."

"Now I'm in last position here, so I'm last to act on any betting round. What I do here is raise on the flop, letting whoever who wants to call me. Now that they're scared of my hand, they might just check to me on the turn, when I can then check and see the river for no additional cost. This strategy only costs me two bets on the flop, before the cost of calling doubles. I only pay $1 to see the river, saving me money on this borderline draw."

Ahhhhhhhh, I see. Thanks for the answers Tred and RBI. And Radii, I hate you. ;)

[sterlingice]

You know, it may just be because it's 5am, but this is really interesting. Could you give a little help on terminology for those of us not so up on the gambling scene?

SI

[TredWel]

There's a good glossary to be found <a href="http://conjelco.com/pokglossary.html">here</a>. I think most of what I say can be found in it, but if it can't, tell me and I will be happy to define.

[TredWel]

I’m ready to play again, so I fill out a table with one open seat.

July 4, 1:30pm

<b>Hand #9</b>: I’m in the small blind here, and I get the Kd Jc to play with. Four people enter the pot before me, and I complete the blind.

The flop is garbage, 8c 7c 2d. Nobody bets out.

Fourth street is the Kh. With top pair, I want to set a trap here. I’m checking this, expecting somebody to bluff at this pot. Nobody does.

The river is a blank, the 3d. I bet out now, since I can’t rely on anybody else to do that. There’s one caller, and my kings win my first pot of the day, worth $4.50.

<b>Hand #14</b>: I get another nice hand here under the gun, in the Ah Jh. I open the pot for two bets, and the player two hands down makes it three bets. There are 3 calls before I play again, and I just call.

The flop is all undercards, with the Th 5d 2s hitting the table. It gets checked around.

The turn is the 9d, and again nobody bets. For such action pre-flop, nobody’s saying anything afterwards.

The river pairs the board with the 9s. The BB bets, and I can tell it’s a bluff a mile away. I think my Ace-high might be good, and I call. Two others call. The BB shows garbage, I show my Ace, the re-raiser mucks, and this player who came in out of nowhere shows a ten. He never let out to bet, and his stealth wins him the pot.

<b>Hand #19</b>: Ah Kh is the hand in late position. All five people before me call, and I call as well. The two blinds make it eight total people seeing the pot.

The flop is the Jd 6s 4d. The action gets checked around to me, and I’m stuck with another garbage flop. I bet out here, and get four callers.

The turn is more junk, as the 9d hits. People check to me again, and I bet again, trying to scare away low pairs. Three people call me.

Fifth street is the 6h, and there’s suddenly action. One person bets, and another raises. Now looking at possible trips, I get out now. Both bettors had a 6.

<b>Hand #21</b>: I’m in second position with a suited connector, the Ts 9s. UTG folds, and since the game is only 7 handed, I open with a raise. There’s only one caller, the dealer.

The flop is the Ad Jh 5h. I bet out, hoping to scare him away from the pot. He calls me.

The turn is the 5h. I bet again, he calls again.

The river is the 6h, and I don’t know what to do. If he’s got me beat, and he almost certainly does, chances are I’ve got to bet here to win the pot. I bet again. He pauses for a while, and calls my bet. He shows KQo, and wins the pot.

Yep, King-Queen offsuit. He called a hand who has raised to pot every time possible, when there are both and Ace and Jack on the board with a King-high hand. Normally, that kind of call is ill advised. Here, it wins him the pot. That’s poker, I guess.

<b>Hand #23:</b> In the big blind without much of a hand, just the Tc 3h. There are six limpers before me, i.e. everybody at the table, and I check.

Flop is Jc Ts 4d. I have second pair and no way to escape the hand. I check, and nobody bets at the pot.

The turn is the 4h, pairing the board. The SB bets out, and I call, not expecting him to have trips just yet. When the pot is raised, however, I can sort of guess. I have a two-outer in the case of triple fours, but I still call. Possibly I was influenced by the fact that this would be my last hand if I didn’t win this pot thanks to the $10 rule.

The river is the 7h, and I’m stuck on two pair. We all check around to the raise, who bets again. I drop out now, with no practical way of winning this pot. The raiser indeed shows a four when she picks up her pot.

So, I’m down $10 on the session, but I’m not too ashamed of my play. Maybe a little too aggressive in spots, but that’s the way to play, IMO.

I’m only left to think that if Hand #21 would have played out differently, with him folding his king high, I would have probably broken even on the afternoon.

[RPI-Fan]

Tred: I'm surprised you bet into that pot on #21. You know the people on these tables who call all along are going to showdown.

But other than that, you stayed in a tad too long a couple times. Still, not all that bad.

Just get 'em next time, tiger.

~rpi-fan

[sabotai]

Hand 9: If someone would have put down a bet with that garbage flop, whould you have folded or called? What if someone raised the bet?

Hand 21: I feel your pain. :)

[TredWel]

RPI-Fan: Yep, I made a few too many calls, and that was my downfall.

Hand 21 was an aberration. I wasn't getting any playback, and this player had proved to be a passive player in the past - he was the one who checked the top pair on Hand #14 all the way to the river. I was thinking that I would be able to scare him off on that flop, and when that didn't worked, I guess I got a little crazy.

I look back on my successes, and found that I rarely, if ever, bet on a complete bluff. Semi-bluff, yes, but not a time where I had absolutely nothing. I've learned my lesson, and that kind of play is not a winning one at this stakes level.

sabotai: Thanks, man.

If someone bet into that flop on Hand 9, I would have called. It's unlikely that somebody caught a master hand with that flop. I would expect either a small pair that I can draw to beat with my overcards or a player with four to the flush or an open-ended straight draw.

If somebody raises, then I won't know what to think. I know that my draw, while it may not be drawing dead, is not the best draw out there. If there's a raise, I would fold.

[TredWel]

Back to the tables to try again. They won’t get rid of me that easily.

July 4, 7:00pm

<b>Hand #3</b>: I get a small pocket pair on the button, the 6d 6c. Normally I don’t play these hands, but when I get five callers to me, I put in half a dollar. I can’t ignore those odds.

The flop is pretty good, the Kh 5c 3s. The action checks to me, which is a good sign. With only one overcard to worry about, and such a big disparity between top and second pair, I think that a person would have bet with a King. I therefore throw out a bet, and reduce the flock down to 3.

The turn card is the 3h. The action again checks to me. I don’t like the pairing of threes on the board, because it is possible that a 3 still lurks out there somewhere. I bet anyway, and get check-raised. If he indeed has a three, then I am reduced to a two-outer. Conceivably I should pass, but fold to a check-raise sets a dangerous precedent, especially early in a session. I call

I don’t get the joker on the river. I get the 2s. The raiser bets out, and I get out now. He indeed shows trip threes to win the pot.

<b>Hand #16</b>: No hands played between then and now, but that changes as I am on the button with the Ad Jd. Three people call the blind before me, and I call as well. Both blinds are in as well.

The flop is the Ks Th 4c. Nothing hit yet, but I have a decent draw. There’s a bet on my immediate right. Presuming he has top pair, I can draw and Ace or Queen in two cards to beat that hand. I have about 9-2 odds on that proposition, so I’m good enough to call.

The turn is the Jh, now adding another Jack to the list of cards I could draw. The same bettor bets, and I have 4-1 odds here, still enough to call with.

The river is the 6h, and there’s a bet and raise before me. I recognize that my pair is beat, and get out now. The winner has pocket queens. There was no king, and no flush.

<b>Hand #18</b>: Things are still looking grim, but immediately pick up in the big blind, as I am graced with Ah Ad . Three limpers bet before me, and I take advantage of the fact that a raise is always called before the flop at the level. I raise and squeeze another fifty cents out of three fish.

The turn is the Jd 7s 5s. I’m first to ac, and I bet. I get two people calling me.

Fourth Street is the 8c, and I’m not too concerned. I bet again, and get two more calls.

The river is the Th. I should have paused here, but I did not realize that a nine is needed for a straight. I foolishly bet again, but both players fold. “Fools and little children”. I pick up $9 for my first pot in a long while.

<b>Hand #23</b>: In the first seat, I pick up Js Ts. This is about the lowest hand I will open with, and as is my custom, I raise with it. A player a few seats down who has established himself as a maniac reraises me, and the BB and myself call this three-bet.

The flop is the Ah Th 4c. Second pair might be good here, as the reraiser could have anything. I check to him, and he bets out. Both BB and I call the bet.

The turn comes 9h, and the maniac bets again. He might have an ace, but I highly doubt it. We both call him.

The river is the 6c, and he bets out again. The BB drops out here, but I’m not going away. I want to see what he reraised with, and I call. He shows Ad 3c. He made it three bets with an Ace-three offsuit. He wins the pot.

<b>Hand #24</b>: The very next hand, I’m in the pot for a full bet before seeing my cards. Four limpers let me see the flop for free, which is a good thing – I’m not investing any more money for 5c 3c.

The flop is the Jd 4d 2h, giving me an open-ended straight draw. We check to the maniac, who predictably bets out. I have a good draw, and I call, as does one other.

The turn hits my draw – the 6c comes off. I gleefully check to the maniac, who bets right into my straight. I check-raise here, and he calls me.

The 8h comes off now, and I check. A slip of the mouse, as I obviously meant to bid. He gets a free showdown as a result, but my straight still takes the pot of $7.50

<b>Hand #27</b> I’m one seat in front of the button as I pick up the ladies, Qh Qs. There are three limpers, and I raise in an attempt to buy the button. The button unfortunately decides to call. All other limpers call as well.

The flop is the As 7d 5h. The action checks to the player to my right, who bets. It’s likely he has an Ace, but he may be on a draw or have a lower pair. I call, though probably only to stay around until the next card.

The turn comes the 5c, pairing the board. A bet and raise later, and I can see I’m down to a two-outer. Not enough money is in the pot for this draw, and I fold.

<b>Hand #33</b> Back with the button by my side, I get the Js 9s. There’s only one limper before me, and I just call as well with my borderline drawing hand. The small blind raises, however. The limper calls. Possibly I should fold, but I’ll call as well. I do realize I’m doing nothing but perpetrating the idea that everybody calls raises pre-flop at this level.

The flop rewards my call, as I get the Qd Jh Jc. The action checks t me, and I check me trips. SB raised pre-flop, and I expect him to fire out again soon. With reason to believe that another player will bet, I’ll check and hope for a trap.

Fourth Street is the 5c, and SB indeed bets out. The other player in this pot calls, and I raise. The SB calls the raise while the limper folds, leaving the two of us.

The river is the 4c, and SB checks to me. He might have made a club flush, but I doubt it. I bet again, and he just calls me. My trips hold up, and I win the $10 pot.

I stand up soon afterwards; party due to the fact that the game was getting short handed, and partly because my dialup connection kicked me off. I did manage to make it a winning session thanks to that last hand. I come out ahead $3, back on the right track.

[RPI-Fan]

Wow, it seemed to me like you'd won more than those $3. Guess you really are in some sort of slump. Though that last hand gets you out on a good note, and hopefully you'll carry it to your next session.

Good luck!
~rpi-fan

[TredWel]

Originally posted by RPI-Fan
Wow, it seemed to me like you'd won more than those $3. Guess you really are in some sort of slump. Though that last hand gets you out on a good note, and hopefully you'll carry it to your next session.

Thanks. I don't know if that session could be attributed to a lump entirely. I think the table was harder than normal, with a lot more raising happening than is normally found at that level. I was raised out of most of my blinds, for example.

Still, I will perservere. Thanks for your support.

[grim]

Long time FOF forum lurker here. Since my interest in internet poker was inspired by this thread, and it has been successful so far, I'll share my story with you.

I had played some free hold'em on AOL a few years ago, so I knew a little about the game. But that was about it. After reading about partypoker here, I decided to give it a try. I played in quite a few free money no-limit hold'em tourneys there and had some success. I kept track of my results and of the last 30 that I played in I had finished in the top three 19 times, including 10 wins. I felt I was ready to play for real money.

So this past Sunday I got up the courage to throw $75 away. First try was a $5 no limit tourney, which I won. Probably the worst thing that happened to me. After that I went out early or midpack in the next six tourneys that I played in. Didn't win a damn thing.

So by Tuesday I'm down to about $60. I decided to try the ring games, so I picked a $25 NL table because I was most familiar with NL. Won a couple of $40-50 pots, which was nice, but my heart couldn't handle losing $25 bucks on a hand, so I decided to try the $.5-1 tables. At this point I think I was at $70.

Now I'm wishing that I would have just started at the $.5-1 tables. I don't keep records of my hands, so I can't share any hand history with you. Wednesday I won $30 over three hours. Didn't play Thursday. I played for about four hours Friday morning and won $70.

Yesterday I started playing at 9am, jumped tables about 5 times, and by 11am was down $30. Then I found the mother lode. Found a table where almost everyone was calling before the flop, even calling raises. That hallelujah song started playing in my head. I was getting great hole cards and fabulous flops. I won almost $75 in about an hour and a half before the table broke up. One poor bastard there had $80 when I got there, was calling everything, and left with about $20. Unbelievable. I almost felt sorry for him.

Played until about 5 PM and ended up being up about $100 for the day. Went to eat with the girlfriend, she dropped me off afterwards, and she went to the store and to get a movie. So I decide to get on and play until she gets back. One hand made it worth it.

I get AQ spades on the small blind. A very loose player raises early, almost everyone calls, and I reraise. We cap out the betting with about $13 in. Flop comes two spades and an ace (hallelujah song plays again). So we cap the betting again, about $20 in the pot now. Spade on the turn. Got the flush. I check, my betting buddy bets, a couple calls, I reraise, and we cap out the betting with about $33 in the pot. River comes, another spade. No chance for a straight flush, so I'm sitting on the nuts. I bet, my betting buddy reraises, someone is still calling, we cap it out, and I win about $45. Amazing.

[grim]

Here is a simple breakdown of my strategy. Comments are more than welcome. All of the real money poker that I've played in my life other than nickel and dime stuff with family has come in the last week, at one website, so I am fairly new at this. I'm not suggesting anyone follow this, just looking for feedback.

1. Location, location, location!

Most important thing in my mind. Pick a table with only one or two empty seats and with decent size pots, sit down, wait for the big blind(!), and watch people betting before the flop. If half the table or more usually calls before the flop, you are in the right place. Sometimes I'll sit at 4 tables before even paying the blind. If only 3 or 4 people are seeing the flop every hand, find another table immediately. If the table tightens up to that point after you've been playing for a while, find another table ASAP no matter how well you are doing.

2. Fold crap

Obvious. You need a reputaion as a relatively conservative player in order for the rest of this to work.

www.lowlimitholdem.com is a great site. I pretty much follow his recommendations under the "starting hands" link, except for pairs. I will usually fold any pair under JJ before the flop unless I'm in a late position, because at very loose tables there will be a lot of face cards seeing the flop, and I don't want to pay $2 while holding a pair of 5s.

3. If you get good hole cards, make people pay to see the flop

I'll raise any Ace/face card combo before the flop most of the time if no one else has raised yet. Position doesn't matter. If you are seeing only a quarter or less of the flops, and almost everyone else is seeing everthing, you'll scare some people off. If anyone reraises, call.

I've stolen plenty of pots with a AJ in the hole and KXX on the board because others are positive that I have K with a high kicker in the hole. Of course, this bluff only works once if others call you to the showdown and they find out you were bluffing. Don't try it twice then.

4. If someone reraises on you, proceed with A LOT of caution

You should have a reputation as a conservative player, and others will think that if you are betting you aren't bluffing.

Good luck and I hope I never see any of you at a table. ;)

[Airhog]

Originally posted by grim

Yesterday I started playing at 9am, jumped tables about 5 times, and by 11am was down $30. Then I found the mother lode. Found a table where almost everyone was calling before the flop, even calling raises. That hallelujah song started playing in my head. I was getting great hole cards and fabulous flops. I won almost $75 in about an hour and a half before the table broke up. One poor bastard there had $80 when I got there, was calling everything, and left with about $20. Unbelievable. I almost felt sorry for him.


There is a good term for this. I believe it is called pot odds.

Anyways, you make think this is the motherload, but It looks like a good way to lose your cash. I would rather play in a ring game that doesnt have people calling all pre-flop raises. It makes it harder to read a person, because you never know if they have the goods, but it also makes it harder to win.

For example with 2 people in the pot unsuited AK is a pretty good starting hand, but with 6 people in the pot, you still have a pretty good hand, but the odds increase of someone making a hand that beats yours is even better.

I think the true goal of betting pre-flop is to drive out all of the weak hands, and maybe a strong hand or two. In the long run I think you will be much more profitable when you have a strong hand if you dont get too greedy, and only try to beat one or two people.

[RPI-Fan]

Airhog: I couldn't disagree more.

It may <i>seem</i> like you're winning less, but even though you'll take less pots, you do get more money.

Here's an example...

I'm at said loose table, and 7 other players call my preflop raise. I have AKx (and we'll assume it's the best hand at the table - no one has a high pocket pair). That makes the value of the pot 16b (b = big blind).

Now say only two others call my raise, and again I have the best hand. The value of the pot is 6b.

Now consider this - in the 2nd pot, the remaining hands are presumably stronger in the first pot. So we'll give you a 35% chance of winning the first pot, and a 50% chance of winning the 2nd pot.

When you work out the mathematics in the long run, the first pot is much more profitable. Obviously, it's impossible to accurately model this without intense statistical analysis, but I've done my best with a simple example.

Does that makes sense?

~rpi-fan

[Airhog]

It makes sense yes, but I think the math is flawed. You cannot just imply that AK will win 35% of the time in situation A and 50% of the time in situation B. If that was the case, then Poker would be a whole lot easier :D

I think the only thing we can say is that you have a better chance to win a 3-way pot with a good starting hand, then a 6-way pot, because you have cut the number of starting hands in half.

One of the real challenges in poker, is that alot of stuff you cant just slap a number on. Sure you can calculate the odds of getting a needed card, or If you have good pot odds. But it still doesnt help you know if that guy sitting to the left of you has KK.

[RPI-Fan]

Yea', exactly, you can't slap a number on it.

But it's been proven in the field of battle as more profitable to play a really loose table.;)

[Airhog]

Hmmm, I wagree with you there, but only if we are talking about the same number of people going into each pot.

[TredWel]

I've had a busy week over the last few days at the tables. I have five more sessions to transcribe to this thread, which I will do tonight.

What I do have time for is to write up this afternoon's short session right now.

July 11, 12:00pm

<b>Hand #12</b>: Not much action in the first few hands. I've been raised out of the big blind, and the one hand I did play I dropped at the river for lack of good pot odds. I'm in middle position when I get Js Ts, arguably one of the best suited connectors. There are two limpers before me, and I call as well. The button and the blinds make it five other people to see the flop.

The flop is Jd 7h 2h. The action is checked to me, and I bet my top pair, in an effort to knock out people with borderline drawing hands. The herd thins considerably, as only two people call my bet.

The turn is no help, as the 6c comes onto the table. The action checks to me again, and I still have what appears to be the good hand. I bet again, and reduce the field to one opponent.

The river is an overcard, the Ac to be exact. He checks, and I know players who call to the river on a blank Ace. In case this card hit him, I'm going to check as well. He shows T8o, and was drawing to an inside straight. My pair of Jacks wins the $6 pot.

<b>Hand #15</b>: Under the gun here, and I get a good hand, the Kh Jh. This is openable under the gun, and I bet my customary two bets when opening. I get three callers.

The flop is rather nice, as the Ah Th 8c come off the deck. The SB checks, and I bet my gutshot royal flush draw. All 3 people call me.

Guess what the turn was. Yep, the Qh! I've made a royal flush. Suprisingly enough, the SB bets into me! I consider the situation, and since there are two people yet to act behind me, I just call instead of raise. I want them to call with nebulous draws, rather than scaring them out now with gross displays of power. Only one calls the dollar bet.

The river is the Qc, but it doesn't matter since everybody is drawing dead. The SB bets again, and it's time for the thumbscrews. I raise the bet. The other player calls the $2, and I'm hoping beyond hope that the SB will raise again. Nope, he just calls the extra buck. My first ever royal flush nets me a nice $15 pot.

I see one more flop in the Big Blind before I have to leave the table. I don't play much, only seeing four flops, but I make the most of them, netting $12.25 for my best showing in a while.

[Radii]

Nice hand :) Its always nice to get a couple of people to call you all the way down when you have the nuts too, very nice.

[Malificent]

Is anyone playing enough hands to get in on Sunday's freeroll tournament?

[Radii]

Is that the 1500 hands at partypoker.com? I did last week. I don't often though(I'd guess 1 week in 3). Lately when I sit down to play I find two good looking $25 NL ring games and play them both simultaneously.

I only played about 300 hands this week though and i'm going out of town so no Saturday session. The reason I hit the 1500 hands last week is that I played a *ton* on Saturday. I got up to $75+ at both of my tables and since stack size is so critical in no limit, I didn't want to leave either table and stayed for quite some time.

I had a pretty crappy go of it in the freeroll itself, I think I went out like 175th or so.

[sterlingice]

Awesome!

SI

[TredWel]

Here’s my first report on the last few days:

July 5, 11:30am

<b>Hand #14</b>: I get my first legitimate hand of the day in very late position with As Kd. With three people behind me, I decide just to limp in. The small blind completes the bet and the big blind checks.

The flop is the Th 9s 4s, nothing helping my hand. There’s a bet before me. This may be a small pair or even a straight draw. With two overcards I call the bet, as do two others.

The turn is the 5h, and the same person bets out again. I’m getting 5-1 odds on my overcard draw – and it isn’t even a guarantee that what I’m drawing to will be good enough, with flush and straight draws to worry about as well. I decide to let go of my hand at this juncture.

<b>Hand #21</b>: I pony up the small blind, and get a half-decent hand for my troubles: the Kc Jd. There are four limpers, and I throw in the extra quarter to see the flop.

The flop is the Ac Qc 4s. I’m first to act, as I am the SB, and I bet my nut straight draw. Maybe this isn’t the best play here, but it’s not such a bad try. There are two callers

The turn is the 8c, making the flush. However, I still hold the Kc, meaning I have a nut flush draw if another club hits the table. I check the betting, and the two remaining players both check.

The river blanks with the 3h. I’ve got King-high, and I don’t think I should bet here in a bluff. I check, as does everybody else. I lose the pot to a pair of queens.

<b>Hand #24</b>: Middle position this time, with a medium pair, the 9h 9s. With three limpers behind me, I’m barely getting the odds to call. The blinds make it 5 total opponents in the pot.

The flop is the Td 3s 3d. When everybody checks to me, I make the assumption that there is not another ten out there. I bet, and only get one caller.

The turn is the 6c. She checks to me, and I check as well. In retrospect, the 6c couldn’t hurt me, so I should bet again here.

The river is the Ks. She checks again. I should bet again, but I can’t find the courage too. Too bad, as she only has Q-Jo, meaning I win the measly pot of $4.

<b>Hand #29</b>: The big blind gives my Presto, 5c 5s. With three people in before me, I hit the table and see the free flop.

The flop is garbage, as the 8d 3h 2h form the first community cards. With one middling overcard on the board, I bet out. This reduces the field down to 2 players.

The turn is the 4s. This gives me an open ended straight draw. I figure it is unlikely that another bet will win the pot here, so I check. The button bets out, and I still have enough odds to call and play my draw.

The last card is the Qh, and I’m on shaky ground. I check, and the button bets again. I figure him for an 8, and that I’m probably beat. I refuse to pay him off, and I fold.

<b>Hand #56</b>: Nothing interesting comes up for a while, and I’m eventually back in the big blind with the 6d 5d. There are 4 callers, and I let them see the flop.

The flop is the Kd Jd 4h, giving me a flush draw, which I promptly bet. I get two callers from that.

The turn is the Ts. I check now, and there’s a bet in middle position. I call the bet, still looking for the flush, and we’re heads up for the river.

I win the struggle, as the Ad hits the table. I bet out, and he raises me! Since he bet the turn, I’m inclined that he doesn’t get the flush. Save for a Q-T of diamonds, I think I have the best hand. I reraise the bet up to $3, and he calls me. I show the flush, and he mucks. I suck out to the tune of $11.50.

I leave soon afterwards. After 62 hands of poker, I’m down $1.25, which is fine by me. I haven’t been doing that well lately, and a small loss is better than a big loss.

[TredWel]

I sit down later that day, attempting to recoup my small loss.

July 5, 4:00pm

<b>Hand #10</b>: The big blind gives me a good hand, with the As Tc as my hole cards. There are six players before me, and rather than making them call a raise, I let them see a flop.

The flop is the 8d 7c 2d. I check, and there is a bet on my left. After four people call, I ascertain that I’m getting good enough odds on my overcard draws to call the bet.

The turn is the 2c. This time, the SB leads out, and I’m stuck for a decision. Trip twos would not be out of the question, and even if there isn’t another duck out there, I’m still drawing for my hand. I fold now rather than put a dollar or even more into this pot.

<b>Hand #12</b>I’m on the dealer button, and I pick up another nice offsuit hand, the Qh Js. With two limpers before me, I call, and the blinds come into the pot as well.

The flop is the Qd 8d 6h. The small blind takes the initiative by betting, and there’s a raise by a middle limper before the action gets to me. I have top pair with a very good kicker, but is that enough? There’s a diamond flush draw to worry about, the 8-6 gives people some straight draws, and there’s always pocket queens, eights, and sixes to worry about. Considering that Q-8 or Q-6 isn’t entirely out of the question with this clientele either, I decide to fold. A wise decision, as the raiser had Q6 offsuit.

<b>Hand #13</b>: The very next hand, and I get dealt a similar hand: the Kd Qc. Two limpers come in again, I call. The button and the blinds also show interest in winning this hand.

The flop is garbage: 8c 6d 4d. There’s a middle bettor, and my overcards as well as close-to-nut backdoor flush draw keep me in this pot. 3 others call as well.

The turn makes my hand, as the Ks hits the board. People check to me, and I’m not going to let those diamond draws go unpunished. I bet my hand, and get all three to call.

The river is the 6c, pairing the board. People might play a hand containing a six very passively, just calling, so I can’t rule out the fact that somebody may have a six. People check to me, and I check as well. The button checks, and my pair of Kings hold up to the tune of $9.

<b>Hand #20</b>: Back with the button again, and I’ve got the Ad Qh. There are two limpers before me, and I raise and try to knock out the blinds. Both blinds call, unfortunately, but one of the limpers refuses to call my 50-cent raise.

The turn is the Jc 9h 7h, no help so far. Nobody bets.

The river is the 5h, completing the heart flush. Once again, nobody owns up to having a hand worth betting on.

The river is the 8h, giving me the Queen-high flush. Unfortunately, there’s the King, Ace and six to worry about. When the action is checked to me, I check the hand down rather than risk the check raise. The Ace of Hearts is out there, and wins the pot.

<b>Hand #23</b>: Sometimes you get a good hand in the Big Blind, and sometimes you get Qd 2s. There are only two limpers though, so that gives me hope that there isn’t much better out there.

The flop is the 5c 2c 2h, and suddenly my hand isn’t looking too bad. The SB bets as well, and I place him with a five. I’ll let him lead the hand. I call, as does the other person in this pot.

The turn is the Jh, and the SB unfortunately checks. I guess that means I’ll have to bet in order to make the pot larger, and I do so. The other limper drops out, and the SB calls me.

The river is the Qh, improving my hand from a probable winner to a near-cinch. SB checks, and I bet again. He pays off my boat, and I collect $6.50.

I leave right afterwards, happy to be up $6 for the half-hour, and positive on the day.

[TredWel]

I’m feeling rather bullish about that last session, and decide to continue to let my luck ride.

July 5, 6:00pm

<b>Hand #5</b>: I’m in early position here, and squeeze out Kd Jd to play with. There are no limpers before me, so I perform my standard open-raise. Only the Big Blind calls.

The flop is nice, as the Qh Jc 2c hits the table, giving my second pair heads up. BB checks, I bet, and he calls me.

The board pairs on the turn with the 2d. The BB checks to me again, and I continue to bet at the pot. He continues to call.

The river is the 2s, meaning that I have a fairly common full house. The BB checks, and I bet again. I have no idea what he has. He calls, and shows J9o. We end up splitting the pot, and I get $3.25 of my $3.50 invested, thanks to the rake. :)

<b>Hand #10</b>: After throwing away a useless big blind, I put up a quarter in the small blind to see Ah Jc. There are two limpers, I call, and BB checks behind me.

The flop hits me rather nicely, as the Ac Ad 9s gives me triple aces. I check choose to and slowplay here, hoping somebody has a nine. The BB right after me bets out, and I am the sole caller.

The turn is the blank 2s. I check, BB bets again, and the trap is sprung. I raise. He reraises me, giving me pause. I figure he has an Ace. An AK or AQ would be unwelcome, but anything else I should deal with. In the off chance that he did pick up one of those hands, I’ll just call here instead of capping the betting.

The river is the blank 4d, and I check to BB’s bet again. I like this hand less and less as a big favorite, but it’s still probably going to win. I call. The BB shows an A4o. I had him to a three-outer at the river, and he picked up the full house. I’m glad I took pause before raising madly, because this was an annoying loss.

<b>Hand #21</b>: After that hand, my mood and my hole cards both soured, to the point of not playing a hand until now with the suited connector 8d 7d. Three people come in before me in fifth position, and I’m just about getting the odds necessary to call. There are a bunch of players calling after me, and there end up being 7 other people in the pot with me to see the flop.

The flop is the Ad Kd 8h, not bad really. I like seeing a lot of high cards when I have a flush draw. Not only does it mean that the chances that I will lose to a higher flush are smaller, it means there will be a lot of callers with high pairs should I make the flush. There’s a bet in middle position before me, and I call it. The 7 opponents I started with are reduced to three.

The turn is the 9s, making me wait longer for a better hand. The same bettor bets again, and I am the only caller left.

The river hits me, but not necessarily in the way I want to. The board gets the 7h, giving me two pair. He bets again, and I place him as only having a high pair. He really hasn’t been tested yet in this pot, so he could have more, but I’ve got to like the chances of two pair here. I raise him, and he just calls me. I show the two pair, and my read is correct as he just mucks. I win $11.50.

<b>Hand #27</b>: I’ve got the button here, and pick up pocket nines, 9h 9d. With four limpers already in the pot, I call. The BB is the last person in the pot.

The flop is the Qh 9s 2s, giving me a ready-made set. There’s a bet on my right, and I raise, trying to muscle out whatever spade draws there may be. My raise gets three callers.

The turn is the 4s, completing the spade flush. They all check to me, though. I bet out again. One player drops, and two stay in.

The 5d hits the board to complete this hand. They both check to me, and I bet again. Only one person calls me. He doesn’t have a flush, apparently, as my trips hold up, and I collect $11.75. My mood presently brightens.

<b>Hand #36</b>: Again, I’m in last position, and I collect Qc Td. I’ve got 4 limpers to worry about, and I call. The blinds make it 7 people playing this pot.

The flop is the Ts 7d 3d. The BB makes the first bet, which three people call before me. I just call with top pair as well.

The turn is the Jh, and the action checks to me. I read BB as having a ten and being scared by the overcard. If that’s the case, then there’s a good chance that my Queen will beat his kicker. I bet out, and get two callers, including the BB.

The river is the blank 4c, and the action checks to me again. I bet again, half expecting BB to fold. Instead, he calls, with the other player dropping. He turns over J7 of spades. He has two pair, and takes the pot. His check on the turn fooled me.

<b>Hand #42</b>: The table is losing players fast, and now I’m in the small blind, playing heads up. I have Jd 5h. I normally would not call here, but I am playing heads up, after all, and this is a decent hand heads up. I call, and he checks.

The flop is the Js 9h 2c. I bet the top pair, and he quickly folds. I win the whopping pot of $1.50.

I leave the now defunct table. It’s a good thing that I called that last pot, as my profit for the session is $1.50 :D

With that, I call it a day, notching a small profit over three different small sessions of poker.

[TredWel]

There’s nothing like Monday morning poker.

July 6, 11:00am

<b>Hand #1</b>: I see action the very first hand, as I get Ah 2s in my come-in big blind. There are 6 limpers to me, and I want to see the flop.

The flop is golden, as the 4s 2c 2h comes off. Hey, with trips and an Ace in the hole to boot, I’ll bet. I get three callers.

The turn is the 5c. I continue to bet, not seeing the danger in that card, and quickly get raised. Now I see the danger. This looks like either slowplay trip twos, A3 making drew a bike, or, heaven forfend, 2-4 or 2-5 making a full house. Or it could be some clown with a 5 thinking she’s got the best hand. I don’t like situations like this, as I almost have to stay in and passively call in case this woman is crazy. I and one other player call.

The river is the Ks, and I let the raiser go first. She calls, and I’m the sole caller. She’s for real, as she shows A3o. I end up paying off her bicycle.

<b>Hand #20</b>: I’m picking up more than my share of drawing hands this session, but letting them all go after the flop refuses to fill them out. Finally, I pick up a good hand. With the dealer button, I get the Ad Qd. I get two limpers, and I raise on the button to isolate the limpers. Both blinds acquiesce by folding, and the two limpers call me.

The flop is the Jh Jd 9c, and when second of the limpers bets out, I’m not too happy. I call the bet reluctantly, and the other limper calls as well.

The turn is the 2s. Now I’m down to picking up an Ace or Queen to better my hand. Even if I notch top pair, that still doesn’t guarantee the hand, as a player with trip jacks is more than a good possibility. Last round’s opener bets again, and I fold the hand here.

I play 27 hands, and never win a pot, even after seeing 8 flops. I hit my $10 limit, and promptly get out of the room.

[primelord]

TredWel,

Not trying to thread jack your thread here, but it seems to be a good place for some strategy discussion too. :)

It became pretty clear to me why you should always raise high pocket pairs such as pocket Kings. I was playing a hand earlier and I was in the big blind and I got dealt 89s. An ok hand, especially in the big blind since I had already out my bet in. However if someone raised the pot I was planning on dumping my cards figuring they had high pocket pairs or an AKs. No one raises and I get to see the flop for free. The flop comes up 9 9 9. So unless someone pulls out a straight flush I am gold here. With 6 people left in the game a check figuring someone will bet at that, and they do so I of course raise when comes back around. Everyone calls and the next card is a 2. So I now have the nuts and just bet out. I get called by two players on both the turn and river. Of course I won the pot and one of the guys calling me tells me he had pocket Kings and figured he was golden when he flopped the full house. I asked him why he didn't raise those kings and he said it was because he was tring to keep people in the pot. Always raise those Kings. :)

[TredWel]

primelord:

No threadjack at all, strategy discussions are mroe than welcome here.

I will always, always, always raise with pocket Kings and Aces, but not much else - at least at this level. You'd like to push out the players who limped in in early position with A5 suited, but if they're going to call with that hand, they're going to call your raise. You might get one player out of twenty (and that's probably being kind) who will toss their hand away after a raise when they limped in. I only raise with Kings and Aces because I know that my chances of winning the pot are so much greater than anybody else statistically that it's worth letting them call me - I just want to make my edge worth more.

To try and spin off a side note, 98s in the big blind is a good hand, and I would call a raise in the big blind. If the flop hits you, you stay in, and if not you can eject without too much loss. You can even make the case to call a raise in the big blind with hands like 65s, but that's a bit towards the extreme side.

[thealmighty]

TredWel, just wanted to let you know I am still loving your dynasty. Keep it up. :)

[TredWel]

I’ve been hitting the tables pretty hard lately, and as a result my updating of this dynasty is suffering. Not to worry, as I have been keeping records of every hand I’ve played (probably over 1300 through the last week) and will eventually do write-ups on all sessions I’ve played.

July 10, 12:00

<b>Hand #3</b>: On the button, I get a decent hand, Kh Qs. There are three limpers before me, and I call as well. Both blinds are in on this pot as well.

The flop is the Qd Jc 7s, giving me top pair. There’s a bet two players to my right, and a call in between us. I raise, attempting to isolate these two players, and knock out any straight draws. This tactic achieves its goal, as the two callers to my right are the only players remaining.

The turn is the 4c, and the remaining players check to me, I still have a good hand. I bet, and only get one caller.

The river is the 4h, and he checks to me. I have an all right hand, but it hasn’t improved since the flop. I check as well, and he shows Qc Tc. My king kicker is worth $7.50.

<b>Hand #18</b>: I’m half in the pot for this hand, and I get Ah Qs. I’m more than willing to throw in the extra half, and have 5 others who concur.

The flop is rags, the 6c 4s 3s. I bet here, for some reason. Perhaps I was afraid of spade draws, but no matter. This was not a good bet. With this many people in the pot, bets like these reward people with the best draws. With flush draws and straight draws out there, my draw is far from best, having 5 outs (I wouldn’t want to see the As). Still I bet, and four people call me.

The turn is the 9d, and I’m not fool enough to fire another shell. There’s a late bet, and I fold the souring hand.

<b>Hand #26</b>: The button moves around the table, and put me in the big blind for my next hand. I get Ah Qh, and check when 4 people limp in.

The flop is the Kd 8h 3c, giving me runner draws at best. I check, as does everybody in front of me.

The turn is the Th, a very nice card. I have a strong draw here, and I decide to bet it. It’s questionable as to whether anybody’s actually made anything here. When only one person calls me, it appears that these board cards aren’t helping many other people here.

The river is the 6s, foiling my draws. Still the pot’s not bad, and I’m heads-up here. I bet out, hoping that he folds. If he has an 8 or a 3, and places my on a ten when I bet on the river, he should fold. Thankfully he does, and my bluff on the end is worth $5.50.

<b>Hand #28</b>: After not catching anything in the small blind, the very next hand I get As Tc on the button. With three people in before me, I limp in as well. The small blind completes, the Big Blind checks, and we’re off.

The flop comes Ac Kh 3c, no bad. There’s a bet before me, and I call it along with another player.

The turn pairs the board, as the Kd comes off. The same player bets, and I’m the only person to call it.

The river card is the 7h, leaving me with two pair. She bets again, and I’m left to think. I think I can place her on an Ace, and that if it comes down to that, my kicker should be good. I’ve seen people call with Ace-rag so many times it gets a bit tedious. I call the bet.

I’m way off on my estimations. She has K3o, flopped two pair and caught a boat on the turn.

<b>Hand #36</b>: In the small blind again, and I pick up a decent suited hand, the Ks 7s. There are 3 limpers before I and the big blind both let the action go for 50 cents.

The flop is the Th 8d 7d, and there’s a middle bet. For some reason, I call. This is the problem of doing recaps a week after playing the hands. I’ve come to the realization that if a player at this level bets at the flop, they most likely have <i>at least</i> top pair or a very good draw. Staying in with bottom pair, with 3 cards that could improve my hand, against straight and flush draws is a surefire way to lose money.

The turn is the Qs. The same player bets, and I come to my senses enough to get out quickly.

<b>Hand #42</b>: I’m in third position at a full table, and pick up Ad Qh. When both players before me fold, I get the chance to open-raise. I only get one caller.

The flop is the Ah 8d 4d. Not bad, but that flush draw is worrisome. But, with top pair, I bet out, and my one adversary calls me.

The turn is the 4s, pairing the board. If she has a pocket pair or an eight, that makes my hand all the better. I bet again, and she folds now. It’s not much but the $4.75 I pick up puts me back in the black.

And I leave soon afterwards, up a measly $1.75. Still up, though.

[TredWel]

I’ve been all around the poker world lately. I played higher stakes, and I played a bunch of single-table tournaments. I ended up not doing so hot, and my confidence (and bankroll) suffered. As a result, I hadn’t played for real for quite some time.

So, I decided to go back to basics. I refocused on refining my selection of starting hands, and trying to play smart, aggressive poker after the flop. I’m starting to regain my form back at the small stakes of $.5/$1.

I decided to bring this dynasty back from the dead. I learned a lot while doing it, and received a bunch of good advice and sparked some conversation. I’m confident enough in my play now to display it again for the world to see, and for it to be dissected.

1/4/04 – 12:00pm

Hand #4: One off the button, I pick up my first hand, 8d 8h. Two people have limped to me, and I raise. This isn’t a raise I used to make, but I recognize the necessity to knock out the blinds whenever possible. The button folds, the small blind folds, and the BB and previous 2 limpers call.

The flop is Jc 6d 4d. When it’s checked to me, I really have nothing much to worry about. I bet out, and only get the BB to call me.

The turn is the As, a bit of a scare card. Of course, it could easily be a scare card for him as well. He checks to me, and I continue my strong show of betting. He’s had enough, and folds. I pick up a quick $5.75.

Hand #35: Not many cards to play this session, and I’m happy to get Ad Jc in the Big Blind. There are four players limping to me, and I just check. No need to raise – I won’t knock anybody out, and I’m in poor position for the rest of the hand.

The flop fits my hand, with the Jh Td 8d. The flush is an obvious threat, and a possible Q9 or 97 gives a straight. There are possible pitfalls, so I bet early. If I’m raised here, I can hit the brakes early enough to stop the bleeding. Only two players call me – no raise.

The Tc on the turn increases the scare potential. I continue to bet though – I’ll can’t know that I’m beat until I see it. Both players just continue to call.

The river brings me relief in the form of the Ah. The flush missed, nobody’s showing a straight, and I have two pair higher than the pair on board. I’d be surprised if I’m beaten here. I bet, and both players call me. My high two pair wins the pot of $9.75. One player shows me A4o, for some reason. Maybe to establish himself as an poor player who’ll call anything with Ace high.

Hand #42: In the Big Blind with an interesting hand, the 6h 4h. 2 limpers and the small blind have already paid their money, and I’m willing to see a free flop.

The flop gives me reason to hope: Tc 8h 3h. SB checks, and I’ll bet on a semi-bluff. The limpers call, and the SB gets out.

The turn keeps me waiting with the Kc. I continue to bet (I think this is the correct move), and both guys continue to call.

The flop hits me, but not the way I wanted. The 4d comes off the deck. I end up with a pair of fours, the fourth best pair. I just check, and fold to a late bet. I should possibly call here.

Hand #44: Presto - 5c 5d. Three people limp in, and I call on the button. Both blinds call as well.

The flop is awful: Kd Td 8c. I’ll stay in with one overcard, possibly with two overcards, but I’m most likely way behind here. I fold to the first bet.

Hand #47: I’m in middle position, and pick up Ah Tc. Everyone folds to me, and I raise, trying to isolate one or two other players. Hah. Two players before the blinds call me, and both blinds decide their hands are worth another bet.

The flop isn’t too bad, with the Ac Jc 9s hitting the table. The action is checked to me, and I bet out. All four players stick around to see another card.

The Qc gives the possibility of a flush. Everybody checks, including me. C’mon, Kc!

Nope. The river is the 6h, a blank looking card. The Big Blind bets this card, and I call, thinking it a 50-50 shot that I’m beat, unless someone raises. Nobody else calls. The BB shows J6 of spades. He hits two pair on the river, and takes the pot. I possibly should have bet the turn here – maybe that would knock him out with a third-best pair of jacks.

I continue to play, but get no more interesting hands. I finish a session of 64 hands, up a measly dollar. Hey, I’m happy to be up.

[TredWel]

1/4/04 – 8:30pm

Hand #1: First hand in the big blind, and I get the 6c 3c. Only three people come in for a bet here, and I check.

The flop doesn’t give me much hope, as the Ks Qc 8s come off the deck. I check, as does everybody else. Interesting.

The turn is the 5c, giving me a club draw. I decide to semi-bluff, and bet. I only get one caller.

The Fifth street is the Jd, another unfortunate high card. I check my bust, and the only onther player checks, and shows the 95s. He takes the minor pot.

Hand #2: No time to rest, as I pick up As Kd in the small blind. Four player call the blinds, and I just complete. Too many players limped in for me to consider a raise. I’d be giving quite good odds for some long draws later in the hand if I raise. The BB checks, and we’re 6 strong in seeing the flop.

The flop is nice for me, giving me a pair: Kh 7d 3d. I bet, having to play this hard to hurt the flush draws. Two players fold, and three players call my bet.

The turn is the Tc, which isn’t much to worry about. Again, I bet, and two ore players fold. I’m heads up going into the river.

The river is the 5d, and the diamond flush makes. I check this disturbing news, and my lone opponent checks as well. I show big slick, and I outkick his pair of Kings. +$6.50.

Hand #4: Just a couple hands later, and I’m still in good position, and get Ac Js. Only one player comes in before me, and I raise with my decent but not spectacular hand. The BB calls me, as well as the limper. At least I scared off the small blind.

The flop doesn’t really help me, with the Kc Th 3h. Only a gutshot draw. Both players check to me, and I continue to put up the strong front by betting. Both players decide to fold, and I can’t really complain, seeing as how I had no real future with this hand. A small pot at $3.75, but a pot I’m happy to win.

Hand #28: Yep, a fairly boring set of hands, and when I pick up the 8s 3s in the Big Blind, I’m not seeing much of a change for the future. Three people limp in, and I don’t want to lose any more money to this hand right now.

The flop is not helpful, with the Kh Jh 5s hitting the table. I check, as does everyone else.

The turn is the 2d. If I was in later position, I would play the players and bet as a bluff here, but I’m under the gun. I check, and nobody else bets either.

The river is the Kc, pairing the board. Now I know nobody has anything useful. But, should I bet here? I’m getting 3:1 odds here, and I decide that the chance tha somebody calls with a stray five or deuce are too good. Once again, maybe if I was in later position. Everybody checks, and the winning hand was Queen high. It was clear that anybody who bet would have won the hand.


Hand #30: The table is thinning out, so when I’m on the button, and everybody folds to me, it’s not too surprising. I pick up Kh Jh, and open the betting with a raise. Both blinds call – the Big blind having to go all-in to do so.

The flop is very nice: Ah Qd 8h. Four flush and gutshot straight. SB checks, and I gladly bet. The Small Blind calls.

The turn pairs the board with the Qh. I have my flush now, and now I’ve got to worry about the full house. SB checks again, I bet my flush, and he calls.

The river card is as scary a card as can come off at this point: the 8c. When the Small Blind checks again, however, I can’t think he’s got either a Queen or an Eight. At best, he’s got an ace and has three pair. I bet out to test my read. I get called, and my Flush indeed is boss, beating both the Small Blind and the Big Blind. I’m up $7 dollars.

I leave the thinning table after that hand, and I’m up $6 for the half-hour’s worth of work.

[MJ4H]

Cool one of my favorite dynasties!

[TredWel]

1/5/03 2:00pm

Hand #3: First hind I play is on the button, with the Ad Qh. There are three limpers, and I raise to knock out the blinds. Both blinds fold, and the three limpers meet my bet.

The flop hits me, with the Ac Ks 8c. The first player checks, and the second bets out. The third player calls, and I decided to raise. I feel pretty good that I’ve got the best hand, and I want to soak any club draws or gutshot straight draws that might be out there. The first player, who checked before, folds, and the remaining two players call.

The turn is a blank, the 3s. The flop bettor bets again, and the last player left folds. Didn’t this guy get the message that I’m the hand leader? It’s doubtful that the three helps him, but I’m jarred by the fact that he’s willing to bet into a player who’s raised him the last two turns. I just call, conservatively.

The turn is the 9h. He again bets into me, and I timidly call him. I still think I’m best, but this aggressiveness is a bit disturbing. He shows AJo, and I’m able to outkick him. +$11.25

Hand #13: I’m in late position when I get a nice pair of red queens. There are three limpers before me, and I happily raise. The button calls, the blinds both fold, and the three limpers match me.

The flop makes my hand gold: Qs 4c 3c. The limpers check to me, and I bet. Had the flop been a rainbow, I probably would have checked to try and let a player catch a second-best hand. But, the club draw forces my hand. Two of the four players left call me.

The turn is the Jh, and the two remaining players both check. I continue to fire at the pot, and am rewarded when both players fold. I pick up the pot, worth $7.75

Hand #20: In the small blind this time, with As Kh. Three players limp to me, and I raise. (Is this correct? My blind play is not exactly the sharpest part of my game). The Big Blind folds, and the other three players call me.

The flop is the Qh Td 7h. I bet out in first position here, and get two players to follow.

The turn pays me off: the Kc. I’m now justified in betting, and do so. This brings us down to me and one other player.

Fifth street pairs the board, with the Qs. Well, a queen is a distinct possibility in my opponent’s hand, so I’m slowing things down. I check to him, and he bets out. I just call, as I can’t get away from this hand. He shows QJs, and takes the pot from me.

Hand #25: In middle position, four off the button, I pick up Ah Ts. After only one player limps in before me, I go ahead and make a very aggressive raise. Only the two blinds call me, along with the original limper, so my raise has thinned things out here.

The flop is 9h 8c 6s. The BB bets out, and the limper calls, so I’m getting at least 10:1 on my money to see the turn. Since there are 7 cards I can catch (three aces, four sevens) to make me feel better about my hand, I’ll call.

The turn hits me with the Tc. Is this good? If there’s a seven out there, I’m in trouble. The Small Blind bets out here, the big blind calls, and the limper folds. I’m sort of committed to this hand now, so I call.

The river is a blank 3s. The SB bets again, and the BB raises here. I now know that I’m beat, and can get away easily enough. After a couple more raises, the small blind show QJs (again!) and takes the hand with the master straight.

I’m out of there soon afterwards. 27 hands, and only +$3 thanks to those two late losses.

I feel that I didn’t make too many mistakes this session, and I’m starting to get the feel of the game back. I’ll probably be moving up in class to $1/$2 again soon.

[RPI-Fan]

I'm reading. Good stuff.

[dixieflatline]

Hand #20: In the small blind this time, with As Kh. Three players limp to me, and I raise. (Is this correct? My blind play is not exactly the sharpest part of my game). The Big Blind folds, and the other three players call me.

I would definitely raise here. AK even unsuited is a powerful hand. You really were a 60% favorite over QJs so even though he won the pot over the long run he is losing money on this (preflop) call. Like you earlier people at this limit tend to call a preflop raise so the more money you can get into the pot the better.

Good read BTW.

[TredWel]

Originally posted by dixieflatline
I would definitely raise here. AK even unsuited is a powerful hand. You really were a 60% favorite over QJs so even though he won the pot over the long run he is losing money on this (preflop) call. Like you earlier people at this limit tend to call a preflop raise so the more money you can get into the pot the better.

Good read BTW.

I figure that, in the small blind, I should raise with the most powerful hands, and just call unraised pots with any two decent cards.

In low-level, my thinking is that raises should be used to push players out of the pot rather than to get money into the pot. People are going to call and suck out on the weirdest hands at this level, so I'd rather exploits larger edges later in the hand than slim edges earlier in the hand. Since the pushing out of players really isn't possible in the small blind, I'll only raise with the hands that I know I must have an edge with.

Oh, and thanks to everybody who's responded since I picked this dynasty up again. I forgot how much fun it was just to think about poker.

[TredWel]

1/5/04 4:45pm

Hand #14: First good hand I play, is pocket kings (hearts and clubs) two off the button. There are 2 limpers, and I predictably raise. The small blind and the button call me, and I have four total opponents.

The flop are small cards: 5s 4h 3h. The SB bets out, and I have no reason not to raise and feel out where people are. There are three callers, no reraise coming from the opener.

The turn is the 9d. Everyone checks to me, and I bet out. This drops another player out of the running. Down to 2 now.

The river is a scare card, 6s. Now only a 2 or 7 would beat my overpair. I check this board, and the button bets out. I’m the only caller (can’t give up the hand now), and he’s got J7s. He chased the gutshot, and got paid off.

Hand #20: Another decent hand: Ac Tc. I’m on the button, and all 6 players come into the pot before me. I raise the bet, and succeed in dropping the blinds out. Only 6 adversaries.

The flop is the 6h 4d 2h, nothing too exciting. Or useful, for that matter. There’s a mid bet, but I’m getting amazing pot odds. 18:1, to be specific. I’ll take those odds, and called.

The turn is the 7d, and now I don’t have much hope left. The odds are still good, but I really can’t chase here, with maybe only two good outs. Maybe.

Hand #30: Not seeing much here, so when I get Qd Th on the button I’m happy for the opportunity. After two people limp in (does no one raise at this level?), I follow suit. The small blind completes, and the big blind checks.

The flop hits me, but I’m not happy. As Ts 5s. After a bet to my right, I have to fold. Forget the spade flush. When an Ace hits the board at low-level poker, you have to assume it hit somebody. People here will play Ax regardless of position or odds, more often than not. I have a pair, but I’m not happy with it. I fold.

I play 34 hands, and just didn’t get the breaks. Days like this happen, and poker players have to get used to it. -$9.25.

[dixieflatline]

Tred,

Sorry about the latest round. I liked the way you played the first two hands and you were probably right with so many other players left in hand #20 there was a good chance people were on a flush draw cutting down your outs..

I was wondering about the last hand #30. You were in good position but with two limpers already and the blinds left to act I am not sure if I would have called with QT unsuited. Even if you get a queen on the flop there is a good chance you will be out kicked. At this level though with people calling with anything maybe it was the right play.

So in an effort to get some strategy talk going in this thread(I hope that is ok with you I don't want to threadjack) I have a couple general qustions.

Would you have called if one of the blinds had raised?

If a Queen had come on the flop how would you bet this?
What is someone had bet/raised to you in you late position?

[TredWel]

dixie,

Don't worry about the threadjack. I definitely want to encourage strategy discussion.

Yes, the call on Hand #30 is a petty loose call. It's definitely not a money making hand, since I can never be sure I have the best hand unless it's blindingly obvious. Still, with only two limpers, me having the benefit of position, and a run of bad cards, I thought it would be worth a shot.

If a blind had raised, I would have probably let go of the hand. At this level, when the blinds raise, they've got something. AK at least, most likely a big pair. A measly QTo won't get the job done enough times to make the call profitable.

If the flop had been As Qs 5s instead of the ten, I still would have folded. I still have second pair, with a very dangerous flush possibility staring me in the face.

Now, if the flop wasn't one suited, my strategy would be to bet if the action was checked to me. I have a pretty decent hand which might be high, especially if nobody bets. I don't want people to draw to the flush for free. This bet won't cause a better hand than mine to fold, but it could knock out Kx or JT, hands that can cause me problems in the future.

If a player bets to me, I would most probably fold. They might be semi-bluffing on a spade draw, or I might outkick their second pair, but more likely they are outkicking me or have Ax. I'd only be getting 5:1 on my hand going into the turn, where I would get at best 4:1 on my money to see the river. I don't feel confident enough that I will have a winning hand at the end to lay those odds.

[TredWel]

1/5/04 10:30pm

Hand #1: Starting out in the big blind, and I’ve got the 8d 5d. 5 players limp in, and I’ll see a flop.

The flop gives me a couple of diamonds: Ks Qd 7d. Well, I’m in bad position, but I’ll still make a semi-bluff bet. This takes it down to two players.

The turn is the Ah. Now with a bunch of high cards and a broadway possibility, I’m going to give up betting. I check, and there’s a late bet. I’m still getting good odds, so I’m still calling.

The river is a mixed blessing: Ad. I’ve got the flush now, but the board has now paired Aces. I check to the late bettor, and he bets out. I decide to go for a check raise. Since he didn’t raise, I can’t read AK, AQ, KK, or QQ. If he had 77, he might raise. A7 is the only hand that he might have that could hurt me by the way he played. Oh, and a bigger flush. I think I’m in good standing here. He reraises. When he reraises, I have to think twice about this wager. I just call instead of capping. This saved me a bet, as he turns up AK. A lightly played AK.

Hand #3: Still rather annoyed about the first hand, I pick up two queens on the button. Five players have already paid a small bet, and I have to raise them. The Big Blind calls, as well as four of the five limpers.

The flop is all rags: 8c 5s 3d. Everybody checks to the button, and I continue to play aggressively and bet. Everybody calls.

The turn is another rag: 4h. Once again, everyone checks to me. Once again, I bet. Once again, all five players call me. I’m seeing a lot of high cards and small pairs. I can’t see anybody beating me right now. Only a 76 or A2 can really beat me. If someone has a small two pair, I have a ton of outs.

The river is the Kh, and once again every player checks to me. Once we have an overcard and a lot of hangers-on, I’m not feeling too confident. Rather than face the check raise, I check the hand down. The small blind shows a pair of fives, and nobody else shows their hand until my pocket queens. Strange game, this poker. My aggressiveness has built a nice pot for me to take: $15.

Hand #11:

I’m only shortly into my second orbit of the session, and I pick up what will be my third hand of action. I’m in the small blind, and I pick up Ac Kh. After four players express interest in their hands and bet, I raise them. The Big Blind calls, and one of the limpers reraises! I call the reraise, and the BB caps the betting behind me. So, to recap, I and five other players have four-bet the first round of betting, building a huge pot.

The flop is the Qd Td 9h. I check, and the BB bets out. The limp reraiser raises the bet. I have to call (I love the odds I’m getting here). The BB makes it three bets, and that makes the limp-reraiser slow down. He just calls, and I’m the last person to call the last bet. Still four people.

The turn is the 8h. I check, and the BB bets again. Everyone calls up to me. I’m getting 23:1 odds to hit my Jack for the nut straight, so I’m still getting good odds to call.

The river is the 5d. This time, when the BB bets, I get out. The BB shows the QJo, and wins the huge pot. The limp reraiser has the T8 of spades.

Hand #12: The next hand is the Ah Qh, and I’m certainly getting the starting hands here. Three people limp to me on the button, and I raise again. The blinds only call this time, so there are five people paying a buck each to see the flop.

The flop is all low: 4s 4d 2h. There’s a bet to my right, and I call the hand. I’m getting 13:1 right now. This might be a loose call, but I think the odds are still in my favor. Only one other player calls the bet.

The turn rewards my doggedness (or stupidity, depending upon how you look at it), the Qc! The same guy bets, and I just call. The other guy calls as well.

The river is the Kc, and the same guy bets again. I feel that I’m up against trips, but the pot and my hand (late-second pair with top kicker) forces my hand to keep me in. I call. Imagine my surprise when the bettor turns over the AQ of spades! We split, and I get $5.75 for my half of the pot.

The table suddenly thins, so I call it a night after 19 hands. Lots of action, but only +$4 net gain.

[Subby]

Did you move up to the $1/$2 tables?

Updates!

[Subby]

No, really...I'm interested :)

[primelord]

No, really...I'm interested :)

As am I! :)

[dixieflatline]

me too!

[jaeenox]

Stage 1: Normal Mode. Play ONLY Group 1 and 2 hands (AA, KK, QQ, JJ, TT, AKs, AQs, AJs, KQs, AK). In late position, with no callers as of yet, you can also play Group 3 (99, JTs, QJs, KJs, ATs, AQ). Almost always raise, and play strong post-flop, unless there is good enough reason to let off the gas.



I agree. The only strategy that most online players seem to know is slowplay everything and check raise. I like to force them to put money in the pot against my strong hands, so that while they are slow playing JJ, I am collecting their chips with a better hand. The best tourney result I've ever had was top 20 in a PokerStars $10 NL Hold'em tourney. I played only 8% (!) of the flops and finally lost with a AAA66 full house to AAATT.