Thanks!

http://www.getgamesgo.com/little-big-bunch

Pay what you want bundle with
Frozen Synapse
New Star Soccer 5
Explodemon
Serious Same Double D
Munch's Odyssey

Save 75% on LIMBO on Steam

Limbo is $2.50 today only on Steam.



Demigod is now on Steam and on sale, but do not be tempted by the price. It was the first attempt at a stand alone Dota-clone and it is a horrible, horrible game. If you are tempted at all you should go play Heroes of Newerth, League or Legends, or sign up for the Dota 2 beta instead.

Downloading Frozen Synapse now! Excited.

DJ Hero 2 bundle for $10. You can get the original DJ Hero game used for around $5 at Gamestop and have both games with a turntable for $15. Lots of gaming at that price.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Activisi...ndle&cp=1&lp=1

As much as I appreciate the postings here (and the DJ Hero 2 bundle looks great), I keep hoping that each bump announces the start of the Steam holiday sale.

December 19th.

Yep, always 12 days and ends on December 31st.

D minus 3 days

Here's a sale I posted in another thread:

GDS $5 off sale - Front Office Football Central

With GOG's huge sale I picked up SimCity 2000. Ahh the fun and memories. Easily can play this game for hours. 2.99 is a steal.

Just a little heads up advice/thought that I am sure you've heard before. Have you thought about slashing deeper than that on sales? At a time where lots of well crafted indie games start at 20 bucks, and routinely go down to as low as a couple of dollars, it can be hard to justify buying and storing a 25(on sale) dollar game on the hard drive. There are only so many games one can get around to playing, and I know lots of us have a backlog of them on our harddrives these days. Even a well crafted indie game, even one that speaks to some of our core interests, it can be hard to justify purchasing it and putting it on our free time queue when so many other fantastic games can be had for much cheaper. Ah well, just a thought. I love sports sims, but I love other games too. I wish I could justify buying sports related sims more often, but....

For me, $5 off isn't enough to make me jump at any game since that is so minor. If I missed the sale, I wouldn't care since I know all I would be out is $5. If they really want to entice people and get impulse buyers like me to bite, has to be much more drastic like everyone else is doing at this time of year.

I think the market has changed alot for text sims over the past 5 years too. I think there are more people they could potentially tap into, more people interested in deep low production games, but a lot of those potential customers will be missed with all the good games to be had cheap off of Steam, DtD, GG, GOG, ect, ect. Even outside of these holiday sales, that is the new reality.

I have no idea what their constant overhead is when they sell a game, but given the market conditions, I find it hard to understand why you keep a game that has been on the shelf for years at around the same price, when potential buyers are being lost to cheaper, newer games. (Or to games of the same age that are well discounted.) Maybe the text sim companies out there are already pricing as low as they can survive on though. I have no idea what their business models look like.

+1. Case in point, TEW 2010 and 2008 being $29.94 and TEW 2007 being $24.95. I can't imagine dropping $24.95 for a game when the more current version by three years is $5 more. The $5 off deal does so little to make me want to buy a 2007 game for that price considering what else is out there. I would do something like $19.99, $14.99, and $9.99 price breaks and then do deals on top of that.

So much of the Steam deals are based on what I call "The Economy of Someday," ie "Someday I'm going to play this and it will be awesome." The low price point makes a customer feel like they have to get it now even if they don't play it right away. I spent $60-$80 on last year's Steam deals(let that sink in). I think I played 3-4 of them briefly. Someday though...:lol:

Magicka is now the daily deal at 75% off($2.49). You can get the complete pack for 75% off as well, which means it's for $6.24.

Exactly, and that is probably very common.

If you don't sell your 2009 game somewhat cheaper now, you may lose potential consumers that won't go above dirt cheap in another year or two. Because why would they if they have a stockpile of already bought games that are as new if not newer? You have to make the most of your opportunities to be competitive.

I think that's true if you market to a real broad audience. But, non-graphical sports games are kind of a nitch fan base. I'm not sure more people would buy BBCF at $20 than would at $35. Either it's something that interests you or it's not. Plus, most of the text-based football fans probably won't sweat $30 for a game they will probably get 100+ hours from by the time it's said and done.

I guess if I had faith that more than twice the people would buy it at $17 than 35, I'd probably take the plunge. I'm just not sure that's true (or bold enough to find out :) ).

There's not a ton of top competition for TEW, WMMA or BBCF (TCY not withstanding). It's not like this is a console wrestling game with 5 other similar games out there for cheaper. Plus, and this is probably more applicable to Adam's games, but each of his games is pretty solid. So, if he releases TEW2012 for $35, but TEW 2009 is just $10 - a lot of new buyers might decide to forgo the newer version and buy the 09 one (which was a very good game in it's time).

I don't know that there's an exact science to pricing in this market. My approach has been to keep a consistent price with a few sales every now and then, but most of the people that try the demo and like the game don't seem to be swayed a ton by price. We like to throw sales like these out once in a blue moon to see (BBCF has changed price temp or for good just 3 times since 2005), but I'm not sure it helps us if we go from $35 to $20. But, I'm always open to new ideas and my theories certainly aren't the gospel when it comes to this :)

I can tell you I would have likely jumped right on the sale if it was more in the $15-$17 range for BowlBound :) But as I mentioned above, with only $5 off, really no incentive to jump on it anytime soon since really not that much cost savings. In fact, it will make me defer my potential purchase even longer because I will likely spend my immediate money on really good sales that are going on and if I still have interest in the new year, then I might pull the trigger on BowlBound, but no real hurry for me with that cost....the downside for you might be the fact I never decide to pull the trigger....at the $15-$17 price, you would have minimally gotten an impulse buy from me:) I also think another important factor is we are also talking a game that really isn't supported anymore with patches or new versions.

I just look at all of the posters we have on this board as an example, and how many of them take the plunge on indie steam games, and know that most of them don't own Game X that you might be selling, (although a lot of them may own at least one of your games) and might be willing to take the plunge on Game X at a cheaper price point. For instance, a lot of them might find a super hero sim interesting, but taking the plunge at 20+? Or they might like sims of one sport, but buying them for a secondary sport at 20+ when there are so many other great cheap games out there, in genres that are also interesting....?

So the question is, have you milked the informed public enough into taking the plunge on the games they haven't bought? And isn't appealing to that a better idea than hoping that someone will suddenly realize they like text sims, seek your label out, and buy it at that full price?

If I were you I would aim at further milking those who already know your games, but for whatever reason haven't bought more of your library. But, then again, what do I know about game marketing? Nothing. And my livelihood certainly isn't invested in it!

I think you would be surprised. Just speaking for me (and I bought the game a long time ago) if I really want a game at release, I'll pay full price.. but if I'm only slightly interested, I'll wait until much later when it gets a good price cut.

I just purchased LA Noire for $18 and when it came out, I told myself I'd revisit it once it dropped below $20. Heck, you can get ootp12 for $20 now.

:)

This is going to sound bad, but I have trouble paying more than $10 for ANY game nowadays. With all the huge sales on Steam or the iOS app store, I have a large backlog of games that are still unplayed and it continues to grow, and for most of those games I payed in the $1-5 range. I held firm on Civ 5 for months and just got it on Gamers Gate last month for $7. 7 bucks! I was never bored in that time because I had a bunch of other indie games etc to keep me busy. And now that game will keep me busy for weeks/months while I stock up on more super cheap games on various sales.

That's basically where I'm at. My video game dollars are fixed. If I can spend $30 a month on video games I can either buy one brand new one every 2 months or I can buy 3 a month. I end up hanging on to my money and waiting for sales on Steam and Gamestop/Impulse.

I've basically come to the conclusion, despite the 100+ hours I'll get out of it, that I'll wait for FM12 to drop to 19.99 before buying it. And that's a game with much higher production values than TEW or BBCF.

That said, FM doesn't treat itself like a niche game. By not being on steam or one of the other leading download services the pricing strategy Arles has articulated is probably correct. I'd be curious to see what would happen if a product were put on Steam and priced aggressively.

Here's another anecdote that must mean something but I don't really know what: I only want to buy computer games from Steam. Or, at worst, I want a game like Civ 5 that I can buy from somewhere else, but then use a key to download into Steam. I have outright avoided buying games like Dragon Age from other sites even if they were a good price simply because I'd rather wait for Steam to have a sale on it so I can get the proper Steam version with it's achievements, etc.

I still buy the titles I love at full price. (Skyrim, FM, or developers like GaryG, etc.) But the rest, I just wait. and wait, and wait. I impulsed purchased The Witcher 2 this week on Steam for 23 bucks and I was mad at myself afterward. I'm sure it'll be on the Steam Christmas sale list. I have at least 15 games in the Q right now after I finish Skyrim and get bored with FM. After the Steam Christmas sale, I'll probably have another 10 or 20.

If it isn't either an AAA title or something I must have, I rarely look at anything over 15 bucks at this point.

You make some very good points. Other more mainstream text sims like OOTP and FM always provide much lower prices. I am guessing their buyers are more plentiful. But, at least both of those also continue to release new versions and patches. That is one of the big problems with BBCF and paying that high of a price right now. The game is like 6 years old, developer no longer actively supports it with new patches/releases, so kind of a dormant game. The official forums are all but dead. So to me a game like that has run its shelf life and better to put at a really low price to either stimulate more interest or at least bring in more sales. If there were new releases/patches and some sign of active life, I may think differently.

You guys make good points and it's something to consider (esp for older versions). The problem I have is that the older games (esp BBCF) still sell at a decent clip at $25-30, so my skepticism is that cutting the price won't result in enough sales to cover for the lost revenue on the current sales.

Again, as I get closer to a new version, another cut may make some sense to see as the company won't be quite as dependent on the revenue from BBCF and I can risk it a bit :)

Just so you know, that was a general post from me. I honestly can't remember if I purchased BBCF or not. You could put it at 15 bucks and I likely wouldn't buy it right now because:

1) too many games in my Q
2) I prefer professional based text sims. One of the things I like doing is drafting a top notch player and watching him excel throughout his career. I can only keep that guy four years in a college game and that's only if I prevent guys from leaving early.

I really wish there were another FOF type pro sim out there. It's been so damned long. . . :)

Thanks Arles and I am mostly talking about the older unsupported games like BBCF. However, if your business model is working for you, who am I to say it should be any different if your selling well:)

If you would release one update to the current version of BBCF, I would likely buy it right now at the current price. I don't like the fact that I have to have my coach start with a random age that is often 55 years old and 20+ years of experience. I want to set my own age and experience. Any possibility of releasing a quick patch that as part of the coach creation process, you simply allow us to choose random (like it is today) or allow us to input the age/experience level? With this, I would like buy right now:)

I wonder if there is any chance Skyrim will have a discount on Christmas Eve or Christmas day?

There is.. and it's coming along nicely.

Professional Football Simulator by Barcode Games

FWIW, There's a blog I read by the developer of Spiderweb Games (he makes very ugly, niche RPGS and has done so successfully for 10+ years.). The Bottom Feeder

He's made several good posts over the last few years that are worth digging up on the topic of pricing indie games. Some specifically on his games, others in general about the pricing of niche games vs. the pricing of casual games, etc. To sum up some of them, he'd probably tell you to keep your price where it is. At least for now.

FWIW, BBCF, is one that I have been interested in for a long time. It's in the same boat as Adam's new game CBH, but with the Steam HOliday sale, and my backlog of games, my money will go farther other places. A price point closer to 15 would likely get me right away though.

I know a long time ago Mac (SAAP) experimented with drastically dropping the price, and found that people equated quality with cost for a new game. He wanted to drive sales, but it really didn't affect the number of games he sold.

humble text sim bundle

Valve has probably done more research than anyone on how sales can drive sales, and here's what they've found with Steam sales.

But then we did this different experiment where we did a sale. The sale is a highly promoted event that has ancillary media like comic books and movies associated with it. We do a 75 percent price reduction, our Counter-Strike experience tells us that our gross revenue would remain constant. Instead what we saw was our gross revenue increased by a factor of 40. Not 40 percent, but a factor of 40. Which is completely not predicted by our previous experience with silent price variation. …

Then we decided that all we were really doing was time-shifting revenue. We were moving sales forward from the future. Then when we analyzed that we saw two things that were very surprising. Promotions on the digital channel increased sales at retail at the same time, and increased sales after the sale was finished, which falsified the temporal shifting and channel cannibalization arguments. Essentially, your audience, the people who bought the game, were more effective than traditional promotional tools. So we tried a third-party product to see if we had some artificial home-field advantage. We saw the same pricing phenomenon. Twenty-five percent, 50 percent and 75 percent very reliably generate different increases in gross revenue.

Though the problem for Grey Dog and SAAP is partially niche market, but moreso that their sales have no where near the market visibility that sales on the front page of Steam have.

It would probably help, but one problem indie developers have is that just planning to get into a Humble Indie Bundle or onto Steam isn't so easy. The only sports text sims right now on Steam have major publishers behind them. Even developers who have a few games that have been well recieved aren't able to get on Steam, and starting your own Text Sim Bundle wouldn't be cheap and wouldn't guarantee visibility with all the other pay what you want bundles that have been popping up.

I added Planescape Torment. A game I've heard so much about and never played.

I had a several games download updates and add new achievements on Steam yesterday, looks like they're going to be doing something similar to the Summer Camp Tickets for the Xmas Sale.

If we had the following and "foot traffic" of steam, I'd definitely consider a bigger price cut. But, if we had that traffic to begin with, I think we'd be pretty happy with sales at the current price. :)

I just think people are making Steam a mega-success....the 12 days of holidays coming up? People are just ready to dump money on something...anything. As long as it's ON SALE. Times are tough out there and PC Games are getting killed as it is.

I wonder if Steam would share indie sales figures with you if you asked?

Have you considered trying to make your games available through Steam? See what hoops need jumping through?

If you can get access to their traffic footprint, lowering the prices to the point where you can expand your own audience may make sense.

The Sports selection on Steam sucks. It seems like the perfect outlet for the small Text-sim market to better push their product.

If everytime somebody on Steam picked a sort order based on "Sports" and FOF2k7, BBCF, DDS:Basketball (Pro and College), and the soccer, mma, and hockey titles started showing up there...and then random deals on top of that, how does that not make money while everyody else is clamoring to get their brand out there via that same outlet?

preach it brother

Just FYI (I didn't see this above):

NBA2k12 PC Download is 9.99 on Amazon right now.

The next step is for these indie developers to do some research and talk to Steamworks. :)

Steamworks - FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS

I totally agree.

Over the last three years, I think I have bought all but 3-4 PC games off Steam and I currently have around 75 or more games in my Steam library. If some of these text sims that I am just vaguely aware of were to show up on Steam and be available during one of these sales, I would definitely pick them up. I've bought plenty games that I am much less interested in simply because the prices were so good.

We currently aren't able to use Steam because of the way we develop our games (doesn't allow for them to wrap it). We would have to significantly change the development environment and methods we use to use them. That said, we are considering it :)