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That is if Bug was indeed protected, which I think it was mistake to protect if it happened. A seer is nice, but who knows if his scans were good or he is even the seer. Additionally, he can survive and the wolves still win, the exorcist and minister survive, wolves lose. |
Well but if he is the seer he's going to keep scanning people and by the end of the game we'll know if he was good or not and a COT like that is tough to overcome.
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I can see it being a villager kill for this reason, but I looked at the roles after the death, the only things I saw were Martyr, and Keeper of the Flame. However neither fit as a night kill or the description of what happened. Additionally reading this post I got to thinking about the life giver. If you are in this game, DZ might be the person to bring back. |
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I'm holding my vote until later in the day unless EF comes in and wants to clarify his vote. I also passed an item last night that I had held since day 1. I will not say who I passed it to and I don't want the person I passed it to to admit it yet in the off case it is a powerful item. I know little about it so now that it is gone I think we should talk about it publicly that way the new owner can get some sense of what it might be able to do. The item was "Lantern of Substance." I asked Abe on D2 if I could use it and he said it is more of a passive item. Any clue what this item could do? |
Yeah, I didn't remember a villager role with the ability. I kinda thought this might be the work of some sort of item.
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Wait, what? What other way is there to get an item? |
Vote Narcizo
I still think Bug is likely converted and Narc could be good, but I really don't want to risk the seer on that feeling. |
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The problem is he doesn't really clear anyone. Any or all of the people he has said are good can now be bad because of conversion or he got an incorrect reading to begin with. I'm starting to think I'd rather vote Bug today to end this debate once and for all getting a good voting history to review over the weekend and also let the sheriff protect McKerney, or who ever announced as the Minister. Otherwise maybe CR or who ever else Bug scanned to see what his scans are really telling us, but preferably Bug. |
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Is Chief saying he's the scientist here? |
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Well, assuming a lanteran of substance provides "substance", it must fight against a "lack of substance". So perhaps it protects against noncorporeal spirits? Or perhaps is a one time save from a kill (a fall into a "lack of substance", depending on your perspective)? Or perhaps, as a lantern, it sheds light on things that lack substance. So it could uncover noncorporeal spirits (i.e. Servants of the Dead maybe). But if it is a passive item, this is probably not the case. |
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Yes, I am the Scientist. Good pull, mckerney. |
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Yeah I can't figure why a corrupt Bug would point a finger at Narc, unless he thinks Narc has a role, maybe. But it seems like a bold play. If Bug had only pulled it before he got fingered as corrupt, I would feel a lot stronger about it. But now you can interpret it as a save-his-ass move. |
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Yes, but all it takes in a NK to get the items back. That is if they are useful to begin with. |
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Oh, man, of course. I had forgotten about the gadget roles. I was just looking at that this morning too, but I was thinking maybe they weren't in the game. |
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A baseball bat is likely to be a protective item. Why would you pass a protective item to someone and then attempt to NK them? |
Clearly you gave the hints we needed, Chief, yeah. I was just being dense. Do you have control over what you invent, or clues as to what they do?
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Well CR just revealed as the scientist so I won't be voting for him. But I really don't think we should start by voting out the seer, any further scans he's able to get helps, you take the risk of him "clearing" someone that is unscannable for him to find a wolf like he may have last night. We test bug by voting either EF or Narc today. |
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But killing Bug won't make anything any clearer. As you said his scans could have been converted already. I suppose we could then guess who he might have lied about. But lynching Narc provides the same data. And unless Narc has an important role, at less cost. Unless we think Bug is offering up a wolf, which would be a crazy move. |
And as for bug's other scans (me and mau), we're obviously not 100% in the clear if bug is telling the truth. But if he's hit a wolf in Narc and has a chance at hitting more with each scan, it's worth keeping him around.
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C'mon EF, you can't just leave us hanging with a phrase like "I found a convert" when there is no role that I can see that has that ability, and you don't link it to an item, hidden ability, or anything. Sketchy when you knew you'd be on the block today to begin with, and hurting our ability to make a good decision here.
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I started with a baseball bat as my opening item. As the Scientist, I have the ability to create items. Keep in mind, we started with 24 items in this game, assuming everyone had one. So this is not as powerful as you might think.
On Night One, I was unfortunately sick (as was well documented) and was not able to get a night action in, so I did not create an item. I was however passed a baseball bat, and it's pretty clear from discussion that that was from hoopsguy. On Night Two, I made my first item. It was the sprig of holley I passed to Commo. On Nights Three and Four, I made two new items which I still have in my possession, and I believe they are the more powerful. They are why I am pretty well protected from wolves the next couple nights, besides the bat. For now, I am keeping those items a secret, and we can see if the wolves want to waste a NK attempt on me for a couple nights. I passed one of the bats to Thomkal last night, and the holly to Commo. I attempted to move an item to CF, but of course, it was not able to be delivered. I attempted to pass a bat to Lathum on Night Two and Danny on Night Three, but their NKs prevented delivery. |
What does the sprig of holley do, was that discussed before?
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Btw, Abe accepts conditional item passes. The item I passed a couple nights ago was going to go to Danny before he was NK'd, so it went to the backup I had listed.
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I was told that inventing is sometimes rather unfocused, more or less, which suggests that I don't have much control over what I can make. That said, I have not tried a specific request. I have only asked to Make "a Gadget" and waited to see what came of it. I am only told what the item is, not what it does. |
Alright, that makes sense. Lunchtime for me, back later.
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I was trying to think of all the possibilities and while I think I would have been left alone another day, I dont think revealing that I lied about a scan would be too endearing to you guys. Especially when I still seem to be in the cross-hairs of a few people. I also think had I lied about Narizco, the wolves would have killed me, I would have been verified as to who I was, and he gets a free pass. I'm not going to lie though. I'm curious as to why EF came out as a Seer. It's obviously a risk, despite there being the chance for two Seers (Or Seer-like?) in the game. I also wonder if there is an item that blocks scans. A few people have seemed to be trying too hard to get me to scan them and this move would certainly be a way to focus on my scan on a particular person. |
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Good point. Forehead slap moment. I should have thought to do that. |
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I threw out some ideas on the last page. But I have no real idea. |
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Dun Dun Dun |
I am also going to lunch now. I'll be back in about a half hour.
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Vote Narcizo
I still think that MrBug is more likely to be telling the truth here. EF was a likely lynch candidate after yesterday and already had the vote lead, claiming a scan is a likely desperation move to make in that situation in hopes to both buy one more day and have us do the work of killing the seer. Bug could obviously be lying too, but what decides it for me is that there's more risk in lynching Bug today in that we'd be doing the wolves a favor in killing the seer for them. I could also see EF being a wolf and Bug being converted last night with the two of them hoping that we'd lynch a villager Bug lead us to in Narc today, then lynching Bug tomorrow. EF comes out looking good from it without losing much because the longer Bug stays around the more suspicious we become of him even if EF doesn't claim he's a convert. Something to consider if things do come back Narcizo villager/Bug convert, but for now I'd rather hope that we can trust Bug's scan. |
I would imagine Holley (Holly?) is used as some kind of truth or protection mechanism
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Well, if Chief is good, and so far I buy his reveal, then that means EF is likely bad just based on that itself. Hard to believe there were no wolves at all on Thomkal. Although I guess it's nearly as odd that there would be only one. Time to look back at timing and scans and see if maybe one of those semi-cleared people might have been converted at that point.
Combine that with a strange reveal, and I'm fairly certain he's bad. It seems a bit too good to believe that we'd catch two bad guys on the same day. If Chief is Good and EF bad, yesterday's vote should tell us something. |
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Any consideration to voting EF today then? I think I'd prefer to leave my vote on Narcizo, though as I said even if Narc comes back as good and Bug bad I still don't think EF is cleared in that situation. |
still my same vote from yesterday
vote eaglefan he's one of just a few I don't have cleared/rolled |
I'm leaving my vote on Narc, hoping that I'll hear more from EF later today when he has some time.
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I definitely want to hear his explanation on the scan for converted, as it seems like it has to be a Lightbringer role that isn't listed or an item. |
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I'm expecting him to say he had an item that let him make a scan for a convert. |
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If he's a wolf, I would expect them to make a run at me tonight for conversion |
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Yes, this is very interesting, and I still think quite possible. Quote:
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So you think about lying, what good does that do? Then you said something about waiting to reveal until you got your first vote. What I think is happening here is this. Narc is probably a wolf. That buys you trust, but you were thinking about lying because well, it helps to keep your wolf buddies alive. You realized however that if we lynch him and he is a wolf we probably keep you alive and this gets you all the trust you need to stay alive for the near future. As others stated, why Narc though? I'll have to go back and check, but at no point do I recall you ever suspecting him as a wolf. It does help though to out a fellow wolf with a bad voting record, limited availability, and a target as it is to gain trust. This may buy you today, but I really am not sold on you. Quote:
To me if it does come up as Bug becoming a wolf you are the next person I lynch. I'm strongly recommending again that Bug be left out to dry. The wolves need to lynch the minister and he has already come out, the seer, not so much. Vote Narc |
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So, even if I throw out an off the wall name like Narizco, and is a wolf, you STILL won't believe that I am good? Or that I have been anything BUT a convert from day 1? What's the angle I'm missing? Quote:
When Narizco is lynched, I would imagine the wolves won't be too happy with me |
Bug has no reason to give us a wolf if he was converted. If he's alive in two days he'll still probably get lynched even if he gives us a wolf today.
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I would have expected them to make a run at you every night since you revealed. |
Just to add to the sprig of holly discussion. I started the game with a sprig of holly and passed it to Dzilla on night two after he revealed as the Exorcist. I had hoped it provided some type of protection. Not sure if it did or not. But it obviously did not help him last night.
At this point I’m probably going to go with Bug and vote Narc. Vote Narc |
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Yeah that doesn't seem like a good explanation to me. Waiting to reveal a scan until you get votes ... why would you do that unless you wanted to use your scan to defend yourself? I can't figure out why Narc, in that case, but I also can't figure out why the seer would be holding onto a scan for defensive purposes. |
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It's not like there has been a lot of nights since my reveal though either |
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I would have liked to have seen where early votes went on and who cast them. It might not be the best course of action, but what do we learn when I announce my scan at 1130pm last night and everyone votes with me? Wasted day of voting. It did lure out EF into make a proclamation, even if it was about me in a role that I already am. I will admit that I didn't think that would happen and in that exact scenario, but that is hindsight now |
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Seems like a long time ;-) WAht day did you reveal? It's two nights, right? |
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Luring out votes makes sense, and what i would expect. But what did you mean you were waiting until you got a vote? |
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I still am not 100% sold. You said you were pondering lying about it, that is ludicrous. Not to mention if you are a wolf it greatly helps out your case. Quote:
I'm not sure if we lynch him though, I kind of want to to end speculation and get a voting history for who voted for him and who not. I'm curious though why I've mentioned you being the minister and BGing you at night, but you have not corrected me. I just went back to see who was the minister and I misread that you were the Martyr and we were speculating a minister was in the game. That changes everything for who to BG, the obvious choice that DZ is dead now is Bug. |
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