At this point I don't see how we're going to avoid a cronin lynch, for good or evil. I suspect this is a dogpile oncoming.

there is only one person that hasn't checked in correct, bullett?

I would prefer to get to a two horse race here. I've already noted that I think Cronin has a higher chance than the average player to be a Umbrella/Zombie so I'm pretty comfortable with him being one of the two players. Of the other candidates with votes I guess I would have Bullet (no appearance in thread) a little ahead of the others at the moment.

VOTE BULLETSPONGE

damn that's where I was going to go...now it would look like a pile on or forcing a tie.

On Lathum, I suggested that he may exaggerate his time away from the computer. But I strongly doubt he is doing so in this case, with his favorite band in town and posting about it within the GD board.

SnDvls, I think it is a little early in the day to be too concerned about forcing a tie. Still eleven votes to come and six hours to break a tie ...

This is where I planned on going as well. Hoops voting for him doesn't change that for me.

VOTE bulletsponge

I will say for the record that if anyone ties the vote at deadline accidentally or otherwise, I'll vote you tommorrow for lynch just for wasting a day for us.

My biggest concern of a close two person race is someone messes with the vote at the end. I dont mind if someone messes with it to lynch someone last minute, because we have a voting record of that. To me in this game voting to tie it will be unexecusable, so be warned!

maybe bulletsponge is still drunk...

in the last game "Saw" I thought it was a little early for everyone to jump on Tryth (sp?) and it still happened.

with everyone over analyzing at times I just don't want to be dragged down that route since I saw what it did in the last game.

it's still where I'm leaning if he doesn't check in. I just want to give him a chance to say something first.

That is exactly why I voted now. I don't want to get it in in the last hour and have that become suspect.

sorry Tyrith I forgot your "i" in my last post.

I would prefer to have a vote in earlier in most cases in order to give the recipient an opportunity to respond. Just as I would prefer to have the opportunity to respond if I am the target of votes in a game.

Tyrith loves it when people butcher his name. It is a promise that if (when?) I vote for him this game that I will drop two random letters in the mix.

But by that logic Lathum should be your vote, right? I'm trying to figure out where you're going here and the best I can come up with is that you're hypothizing that Lathum is the police chief and voted first for someone not on his list -- but that's a really bold play for day 1 IMO.

Whatever huupsgye

I guess we differ here. I like to get more information before putting a vote out. See if someone comes out with info or like in the tombstone game people adding to other's info or refuting info. I guess you could call it blade-itis. :)

See if I talk to you anymore :P

I guess I really didn't need to appoligize as I've seen my name spelled so many different ways in WW games anymore too.

so has anyone ever googled their name and werewolf I.E.

Lathum werewolf

it's kind of weird

I think I was pretty fair in how I handled my vote. I waited until noon today, and 12 hours after the roles actually went out before I put the vote on him. I stated earlier in the thread he would likely be my target and gave the reasons why.

It wasn't a suprise when this game was going to start or what the deadline was. His not being here to refute anything that was said just reinforces my reasons for voting him in the first place.

I'm not championing a bulletsponge vote here among the masses, but what I am trying to champion is perhaps this game we should change things a bit and not vote for someone who is a valid contributer on day 1 and give them a bit more rope to either free themselves or hang themselves.

I don't remember the last time we had a day 1 bad guy lynched that didn't involve a night 0 seer getting lucky. So this time I'm interested in us trying things a bit differently.

We know who want to eliminate the people who will be contributing to analysis, so why do we want to help them on day 1 with a gut feel?

mine isnt as cool :(

I'm conflicted here. I want UTR to die, but I also have to go with the logic that cronin has a better chance of being a bad guy. However, cronin's play seems highly, well, stupid for that. It's one of those things that a wolf would have to think that there is a high probablity of getting him lynched.

I really doubt cronin is a zombie, this play is just too nuts for a three man team. He could be an umbrella with a bad role, which would allow him to take some risks. I can't imagine an umbrella with a powerful role doing something this brazen. So even if we lynch him and he's bad, he's not going to be a powerful bad guy unless he just went totally psycho.

I really, really want to enforce the kill the UTRs plan. I'm sick of lynching people for having independent thoughts. So, for now, I'm going to go on the bullet side, even though cronin could very well be bad.

VOTE BULLETSPONGE

SnDvls, I agree that you want to collect enough information for a solid vote. That usually means giving people time to post after Night PMs have been sent, see if anything comes into play, etc. On Day 1, with that information not in play I think it puts people in a tough position to delay on votes until the final hour or two.

Getting a vote out early (relative term) gives the recipient a bigger range of time to be in the thread and realize their situation. It allows people an opportunity to respond in whatever manner is appropriate based on the circumstances. The most annoying time to collect votes, in my experience, is a end-of-day shift. Because, in many cases, you are stuck. No time to mount a defense, maybe enough time to reveal info that can be used after your death, etc.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=AlanT+werewolf


alan, look about halfway down the page

vote bulletsponge

you can see my reasons in post #252, 254 & 260

5 - bullet - alan (180), hoops (253), sndvls (276), spleen (257), tyrith (273)
3 - cronin - anxiety (235), fouts (120), lathum (246)
1 - hoops - cronin (125)
1 - fouts - ntn (184)
1 - brian - kwhit (190)

NO VOTE: brian, bullet, chief, glen, LSG, Wednesday, path, saldana

I like the way the vote is going. I think either BS or StC would be a good choice for lynch tonight (for different reasons, as others have already stated). So I'm going to move my vote to one of the 2 candidates. At this point, I don't have a problem voting for either one, so just to keep things close and possibly put pressure on the bad guys' votes...

Unvote BrianD
Vote St. Cronin

I'll get an early vote in and keep it between the two for now, but for the record I am nowhere near sold on this vote and am very willing to move it:

Vote st.cronin

I like the two horse race we have going, so long as we can narrow it down to one person and get 2-3 extra votes on them before deadline so we can avoid screwiness. Just a note.

I will not be around for lynch, I suspect. I'm gonna be leaving around 6 EST and if I'm back it's gonna be right at the deadline, so I probably won't be able to move my vote at that point.

I was going to vote st.cronin to keep from a runaway bandwagon on Bullet, but since it is about tied up now, I'll vote for the less active...

Vote Bulletsponge

Votes as of Post #281:

(6) Bulletsponge - Alan (180), Hoops (253), Spleen (257), Tyrith (273), SnDvls (276), BrianD (281)
(5) St.Cronin - Fouts (120), Anxiety (235), Lathum (246), KWhit (278), Path (279)
(1) Hoopsguy - st.cronin (125)
(1) Fouts - Ntndeacon (184)

vote bulletsponge

i spent the rest of the day at work contemplating things, and i am relatively sure that cronin is a good guy. i have no take on bullet at this point, but unless i am way off base, cronin and i are on the same team...my vote is to keep him alive.

The probelm with that is my nick is actually a realy word, so when you google Anxiety Werewolf you get anxiety disorders where people think werewolves are after them and that sort of thing.


-Anxiety

with the deadline being as late as it is, i will be back before the end of the day, but i will be out for the evening...going to a buddy's to drink beer and watch baseball.

Having been on the wrong side of one of these before, I sympathize with bulletsponge, but it's approaching the point of being too late for him to show up.

I plan to be around approaching the deadline to change my vote if needed.

VOTE bulletsponge

(1) Hoopsguy - st.cronin (125)
(5) St.cronin - Fouts (120), Anxiety (235), Lathum (246), KWhit (278), path12 (279)
(8) Bulletsponge - Alan (180), hoopsguy (253), spleen (257), tyrith (273), SnDvls (276), BrianD (281), saldana (283),
Mr Wednesday (286)
(1) Fouts - Ntndeacon (184)

Out until around lynch.

Wow, some good reading for today. I like the 2 lynch candidate option. You can tell alot from somebodies vote in a close race between 2 candidates.

Especially when they all come one after the other.

(This is assuming they aren't both STARS)

Damn, now i am in a predicament. I know how you guys think. When day 4 or 5 comes around you are giong to look at these voting records and see who just snuck in and added a vote to avoid attention. I know bullet hasn't been around much, but i dont feel like voting for him.
So
Vote St. Cronin

That was my first thought. I enjoyed wastching the sudden run all on bulletsponge, followed by the sudden run all on St.cronin. At first it felt a bit off to me. I have since reconsidered that some thinking that it also could be due to people wanting to keep things closer and push the issue some. So they would vote for the person further behind to try to keep it close.

I am not sure yet if its vote manipulation or not, but I guess if someone turns up bad tonight, its something to consider.

One other thought popped into my mind on the way home that has not been brought up today. We know that some people have the lucky "Trait" which can affect the voting. One thing that I think has to be kept in mind that even though one person might have a 2-3 vote lead over another, the "true" total might be much closer or further apart due to the lucky voters.

Those people voting for the person behind the vote should probably keep that in mind somewhat. My guess is that on day 1, no one is lucky since no one has voted for the opposite faction the day before. I however am just guessing at that, it could start the other way around where everyone who is lucky starts with it enabled and keep it enabled until they vote poorly.. That seems far less to make sense or practical though.

My guess is tonight no one who is lucky has it enabled, however those who voted for the opposite faction tommorrow might have it kick in.

Those that push for a close vote need to remember that it could inadvertently get us a tie one of these days.

I'm wondering how I would react if I was the Police Chief at this point and saw a two-horse race between people who are both STARS? The person cannot reveal their identity and their value only increases over the game. Do you think this person would sigh and move on to day two, hoping that we do a better job of picking up on their thoughts tomorrow or would they try to move today's action behind the scenes?

Alternatively, how giddy must that individual be if we have two non-STARS in the cross-fire here? If there is one from each faction then party lines should be getting drawn pretty clearly here. IAs of right now I'm thinking this is not the case because it hasn't seemed like there has been much in the way of impassioned defense on the behalf of either candidate. If the zombies were in position to lose one of their own I would expect at least a token effort to move the vote. Probably the same would hold true for Umbrella, although the suspicion is that they have better numbers ...

If I was the police chief and it was a run off between two Stars, or 1 stars and someone else, I say nothing.

The importance of the police chief isn't in one person on their team, its in the collective CoT that they can develop. Its pretty important that the police chief lasts till day 4-6 somewhere with visible proof once they are dead to who -not- to trust. If they push their role too much early on, they likely will either draw suspicion and end up a possible lynch choice, or they will get attention from people who will kill at night.

Its a long game, its important for them to keep the big picture in mind and not just the short term.

As for impassioned defense, part of my gut told me that since I couldn't get anyone to vote for the only person who hadn't shown up yet, who was a newer player and not as established as some that i was on to something.

I could be wrong, but in day 1 I read as much into inaction as I do into action at times. If I couldnt convince anyone else to vote for someone thats that much dead weight on a day 1 vote for 75 posts, and 5 votes for other people it made me feel that people were trying to avoid that selection.

Couple thoughts;

Alan - After seeing the 2 different runs, I am pretty sure they both can't be STARS. I also think some of the late voters are trying to hide in there (probably obvious).

hoops - The Police Chief could come out and name all the STARS members, but that would pretty much kill the game. Is this a flaw in the game mechanic? I'm sure Chubby is relying on the Police Chief to be honorable.

He said in the game rules that there is some mechanic built in that revealing such would be severe consequences. I have no idea what that would be, but can imagine such a critical thing to get across would likely be game dooming for the STARS if the chief did that.

The ability for the chief to form the CoT is going to lie in looking at his actions post-mortem I think more than anything else.

I'm not advocating any kind of information leak from the Police Chief - just trying to envision what the game must be like for that role. I concur with Alan that they have to ride today out even if there are two STARS colliding here, although I would imagine that is pretty frustrating.

Alan, I held off on voting for him because I wanted to give him a chance to show up before the bandwagon picked up steam. As I said, I've been on the wrong side of that before... I forget which game it was, but I was busy on the weekend and didn't check in until something like 5 pm on Monday, only to find that a big enough bandwagon had piled up on me that my appearance was too late to move enough people off.

Exactly why I placed an early vote. If you miss day 1 or even forget to vote, people will lynch you. I like it as it encourages participation early in the game, even if we are wrong.

While I voted for st.cronin as a revenge type vote, I think its interesting how fast bullet piled up the votes.