Well said.

The IDF clearly states the baby atrocity story is true. See starting at about 2:30.

Yes, one can still dispute the IDF account as propaganda/lies, and I'd still want a more independent report (e.g. western reporters). But for me, this has moved the dial some clicks towards being true.

https://x.com/IDF/status/1712282365924343910?s=20

It might have happened but Biden did lie about seeing photos.

Still annoyed that any news story involving "babies" is somehow worse. It isn't. It's more a troll to get people "madder" as if killing a baby is worse than killing anyone else. It isn't.

I don't know, man. Beheading a baby is a special kind of sickness. There are levels of evil when it comes to murder. A soldier who has been through many conflicts and witnessed many deaths would still balk at that. It would be hard to get a reasonable person to do that.
There is still the fair contention that Israel is killing babies as well, just with bombs. That is still on the evil scale. Sadly, we accept collateral deaths in war because it is almost impossible to prevent.

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I will respectfully disagree with you, it is much worse. People should get "madder".

There is always degree, scale & context to a "crime". Using 2 extremes ... intentionally killing and beheading an Israeli baby is far worse than killing an Israeli soldier in combat.

I'm a both sides person. So yes, I agree we should always look at/evaluate both sides in degree, scale & context.

Hate to say it, but I agree with Bernie in principle.

I won't say I agree with it being a war crime (need to read up more). Although cutting off food, water & fuel will degrade the Hamas' combat effectiveness some, IMO that benefit is far outweighed by the cons to the innocent Palestinians.

Maybe if there was an escape valve (e.g. Egypt), or it was clearly short term at the start of the offensive (e.g. < 1 week?), or there are UN delivered provisions to non-combatants etc. But as far as I know, none of those are realities right now.

Okay, nvm then.

Israeli official says government cannot confirm babies were beheaded in Hamas attack | CNN

I've created below. Thought it was time for a dedicated thread.

No problem if you want to continue using this Politics thread. I can delete the new one.


Israeli-Hamas War (Oct 2023) - Front Office Football Central

Exactly!

This is just a way to excuse one side from committing the same crime. You view dropping a bomb as "cleaner" because the pilot doesn't get dirty when the child is obliterated. I'm sure Hamas would prefer bombing people if they had the military capability.

Whether it's by knife, gun, bomb, etc, killing children is abhorrent and there isn't really a scale of acceptable ways to do it vs unacceptable ways.

A person targeting a missile to hit an enemy does not have in his purpose to kill a baby. A person with a knife in his hand will only kill the baby if he has that purpose. It is a special kind of psychopath that would be able to do that to a baby. Even harden killers would balk at such. There is even in legal terms escalators to the charge of murder based on the how and who.
It also doesn't justify the same crime at all, just as nothing Israel has done justified it happening to the baby. It does prove Hamas is a terrorist organization, and anyone cheering them on has blood on their hands.

Let's not forget that Hamas uses children as human shields as well. They routinely conduct military operations from schools and hospitals and use children to shield their conduct. They also have no problems with strapping bombs to children as well (when they are not teaching them to hate and kill Jews).

Incredibly naive to think the bombs leveling residential neighborhoods would somehow avoid children. They know exactly what they're doing and they know people in the West will downplay it because it's done from a distance. You're just compartmentalized which methods of murdering children is acceptable.

Its like saying what Timothy McVeigh did was more acceptable than Adam Lanza. Both are unrepentant psychopaths who had different means at their disposal.

I condemn the acts of Israel. I do believe they go too far in their actions against the Palestine people. I have no problem in doing that. I just believe most reasonable people can see beheading a baby as a level of extreme that is beyond the pale.

Lets not forget that's a common excuse used by the West when bombing civilians. Each time the US would drone strike a hospital, they'd conveniently excuse it as enemies using human shields.

It's 2 million people stacked in a 25 mile radius. There aren't a lot of places that don't contain civilians.

I think imprisoning people with little to no access to basic resources or clean water is a level of extreme that is beyond the pale. Rationing out how many calories they are allowed and blackmailing them into providing intelligence to get basic health care for their children is depraved. Then getting blown to smithereens whenever Israel decides it wants to.

The beheading story is abhorrent if true (not sure why people like Biden felt the need to lie about it). But the conditions in Gaza over the past 20 years is some of the most depraved shit we've seen since the Holocaust. Seriously, you should read about what life is like in Gaza from one of the reporters who have had access (even the ones that were murdered for reporting on it).

I agree.

Edit: Just to add that I don't believe that in anyway justifies terror. Hamas is a terrorist organization that should be torn down. I also believe in the necessity of a Jewish state and there should also be a Palestinian free state.

His staff came out and said he lied about it right after.




Argentina just elected Javier Milei, an "Anarco-Capitalist" who promises to slash the Federal government to nothing. A "Libertarian" that is for banning Abortion and curtailing the press.


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The first time I saw that guy, I though Boris Johnson has gone undercover into hiding in Buenos Aires.

Early exit polls in the Netherlands are pointing to a landslide extreme right victory in the elections that will lead to our new government. Personally, I can't understand why we're doing this to our own country. Kind of gutted am I at the moment.

I think there is some understandable backlash to NATO and the Ukraine War in some of these Western European countries. Italy, Finland, and Sweden already went to the right. German polls are looking like we'll see similar results.

Fighting proxy wars from the other side of the globe is easier than when you live right next to it.

Can you explain why you think the Russian invasion of Ukraine would in any way make people feel like siding with Russia or voting "right"? Or did you mean the opposite here?

For example, the general public here in the Netherlands sees the NATO as being overrun and dictated by the USA, with the perception of the USA being a country with only right wing politics (yes, even the Clintons, Obamas and Bidens). Voting anti-NATO would mean a shift to the left, no?



What I'm sensing is that people in the Netherlands (in particular, I just have no idea how it is in Finland or Sweden or Italy) are sick of hearing how we need to solve the climate change problems all by ourselves, the general public feels (spearheaded by Wilders) it is time that big countries like the USA and China stop sabotaging things and start being part of the solution. Which makes it kind of weird that the social media established in those 2 countries help(ed) popularity of the right wing politics with their own algorithms.

A large group of people have voted for anti-EU sentiments, sick of us being a EU sponsor, while extreme right wing lead countries like Poland and Hungary get that money. Which makes it super weird that the Hungarian president is happy about the right wing move here, he should count his money better and actually pray for the left wing in the Netherlands. Not to mention the migration problem (which has been cause to fall of the government and requiring new elections only 2 1/2 years after the previous elections), which is big issue in the entire EU.

And in particular in the Netherlands, there's some local stuff going on that helped shake things up. The traditional establishment in the Netherlands has been caught backstabbed a popular hard working politician (Omtzigt) shortly after the previous elections in 2021, trying to politically eliminate him, right after during the campaigns proclaiming to stop being backstabbing politicians. He's still standing strong now, having the 4th biggest party from out of nowhere, while those parties got the judgement from the electorate.

Rainmaker can speak for himself but I would say that voting anti-NATO is more of a right wing talking point than a left wing one here in the U.S. I also saw that Wilders's position on Ukraine is "the Netherlands should stop providing arms to Ukraine, because it needs them to protect itself." Again more of a right wing though that has begun to change recently. Now I am not saying there are not those that voted in a manner to side with Russia. But I know from talking to family and friends in Germany and Italy there are people who are voting for not being forced to side with Ukraine.

According to wiki, we are friendly with Guyana. No idea what that would translate to if Venezuela got too touchy-feely.

Essequibo: Venezuelans approve takeover of oil-rich region of Guyana in referendum | CNN

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The least racist guy in Poland.

No idea if this will work, but interesting economic experiment.

Ecuador is #6 for Best Places to Retire 2024

Best Places to Retire in 2024: The Annual Global Retirement Index


Bad timing all things considered.

Good luck in your elections tomorrow, Taiwan. You basically have to pick being your own country or move towards China.

Either way, you are going to be less important to the US and rest of world in about 20+ years when you won't have the monopoly on chips & foundries. So, figure it out.

Taiwan votes for a new president against a backdrop of growing China threats | CNN

The DPP incumbent party is leading in the presidential elections. So more tense relations with China.

Right now DPP, KMT and TPP are 41% - 33% - 25%.

Iran-Pakistan increased tensions are interesting. Never knew about the tension at the border area.

Iran missile attack: Pakistan condemns deadly strike on its territory as tensions spike across region | CNN
Shia vs Sunni stuff.

Pakistan has responded by bombing inside Iran with missiles and planes. Who had shooting war between Iran and Pakistan on your bingo card for 2024?

This should be interesting. No idea who to root for.

:popcorn:

Pakistan has its problems, but Iran has been the chief destabilizing force in the region for decades. Likely this goes no where further than a couple of air raids (hopefully), but remember that Pakistan is a nuclear power and I don't think they would be as hesitant to use nukes if really provoked.

Country relations are so weird. Like I watched the 50 over Cricket world cup last year that was held in India. Since Pakistan was in it, their games had to be held near the border for safety reasons. Like it just seems weird that relations are so hostile that cricket players aren't safe in the other country. And to think that could have possibly been avoided if a bunch of tea drinking cousin fuckers hadn't hastily drawn an arbitrary line on a map 75 years ago.

Basically, the Myanmar military junta has been experiencing defeats on the battlefield. Won't be surprise if it all collapses.

Myanmar belongs to China's sphere of influence and I've read in other articles that China has been somewhat supporting the rebels. The US doesn't really have much strategic interest. No idea what a post-junta will look like.

Myanmar's army is losing - and facing fire from a militant monk


And just for some comic relief, if you haven't seen the video yet ...

NPR had a clip about Mexico elections in June. Essentially, only a small % of legal/illegal immigrants in the US vote in the Mexico elections. And they could impact elections if they voted in greater numbers.

Looks like current party will win the Presidency. Article polling shows big double digit leads right now. She'll be the first female President.

Poll Tracker: Mexico's 2024 Presidential Vote | AS/COA

Have no idea who to root for, no idea who is the lesser to two evils. I don't think either are that friendly to the US.

Pakistan election: Final results give Khan-backed candidates lead
If guess this shows it was a relatively free & fair election?

Assuming the opposition is more moderate, good news for Turkiye. Erdogan seems to have moderated some from several years ago, but yeah, dictator for life isn't good for a NATO member.

Turkey election results: Opposition to retain key cities in blow to Erdogan | AP News

It was a rigged election. They locked up Khan on bogus charges and banned a large number of candidates. Violent assaults on political gatherings and making it really tough to vote in certain areas. Plus, there is a thing called a Form 45 which is essentially the results from each poling location that were put online and showed PTI winning a large majority of the seats.

The whole thing was a mess because Pakistani military didn't think Khan and PTI had a shot to win. Locking everyone up and spreading a ton of propaganda seemed to secure victory. But Khan and his party had a strong presence online and with younger people that they didn't expect. It's why after the results started leaking, they shutdown the internet. The Intercept did great reporting on it and got their hands on the Form 45s from election day showing Khan and PTI winning.

The United States supported and helped facilitate the coup. They are on the side of the Pakistani military, ISI, and the new dictator. Khan is pretty moderate and not really a bad guy for America, but it came down to Ukraine. America loves democracy so much that they have to install dictators in certain countries to preserve democracy in the white country that isn't even really a democracy anymore either. At some point they'll explain what the actual goal is here I'm sure (it's making defense companies money).

Do we know that the charges against Khan are bogus?

The United States sent a cypher to Pakistan asking the military to remove Khan from power. Khan simply told everyone about the cypher and that the US was trying to have him illegally removed. They claim him referencing that cypher compromised intelligence or whatever. All absurd since he was the acting Prime Minister. The western media got a hold of an internal ISI document saying it was total bullshit.

They're trying to tack on some other stuff like saying his marriage violated Islamic law because he didn't wait long enough to marry his wife (he got 7 years I think for that). They also went after him and his wife for selling a watch and not declaring it. Although the person they claim bought the watch denies he ever bought the watch.

In a nutshell, Khan was the democratically elected leader of the country and America had him removed from power by the military because he wasn't subservient enough for us on Ukraine. There's some other shit about us covering for a billion dollar IMF loan as payment for his removal, but it just gets real complicated.

I don't care for Khan or anything but he was the choice of the people and if we're going to pretend to care about democracy, we should abide by that. He also really wasn't bad or anything. He's pretty moderate for Pakistan.

Indian elections, planned to take 44 days to finish.

My pure guess is Modi will win a third term.

India election 2024: A visual guide to voting in the world’s largest democracy | CNN

A helicopter carrying the President of Iran and the Foreign Minister has "suffered a hard landing" in bad conditions in a region bordering Afghanistan. Rescuers have yet to find the site. It sounds like they might be dead.

This article puts the hard landing on the other side of the country

MSN

The fog in the videos of the search is crazy thick. They are looking on foot because they can't see anything from the air.

That's correct. The report I was referencing had it wrong.