Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648260)

I think the Lay Healer is a secret tank of massiveness and bhlloy was realizing it. Expertise and Toughen make clerics able to solo things, and the Lay Healer with Expertise and the armor of a Myrmidon doesn;t even need Toughen, which is subtly what makes them so good - able to use max armor and shield. Lay healer doesn;t waste a turn to heal, and has the HP and Attack ability of a fighter. I almost dropped Expertise from the cleric list because of the Lay Healer's ability to break it, and even though a lot of clerics went in that direction, I don't think it was that bad.

Originally Posted by bhlloy (Post 2648296)

This is true, but I would bear in mind that I wouldn't have even have been able to take expertise but for the free two levels I got from hoops drinking the potion. If you could get past level 6 quick enough you might have a shot at winning but it's pretty tough to do on your own. Even with the two free levels I still didn't really get close to winning.

I think if I could do it again I might try and stick to a two person party but beggars can't be choosers, when Zinto and Julio came along I was barely scraping by the level 1 battles I was fighting. And honestly, I can think of one battle at least we may not have won if there were only two of us. There's very little room for error with that class.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648294)

One change I want to make for next time, and I will come back to tis thread and check it out, is that I want assassins to have 8 hp/level

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648043)

He will act all cocky when he comes here, but he was sweating it ;)

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648166)

And you would have gotten it had JAG or Darth used the ARENA - so don't yell at me.,...

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648321)

Trow Beserker would have been interested lol

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648320)

Surprised no one took a Taurian Myrmidon, seemed like a powerful combo, though maybe a bit boring

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2647237)

You have achieved a major victory, not you can win the dungeon for the minor victory.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648134)

I never fudge rolls. Death is meaningless if I don't. Then Kwhit and Thomkal and mckerney and all of the rest would be quite upset at me, and understandably so.


Sometimes I change what is in a room based on situation, if a creature was super easy to kill maybe it won't has as many items, or putting 6 items in that chest seemed like a good idea at the time, but now. Or if a creature was really hard to kill maybe there's more gold or something, but I never cheat combat rolls.

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648356)

Yoou post too much

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648020)

Originally Posted by The Jackal (Post 2648273)

I had fun playing the bard, but I'd definitely try something different next time.

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox (Post 2648363)

whatever you choose, Jack, you MUST put the word "Drunken" in your name

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648249)

I told people to go heavy potion / horse figurine. I just never had the means to do so myself.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648262)

And Sorcerer counters that by having no issues with spell selection. A Sorcerer with Magic Missile can kill a few small creatures, level up, take the powerful Cure, and you are in the money, you know?

I want to give the back three more power with more spells next time. I already know a few more classes I wanna add.

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox (Post 2648346)

Autumn and KWHIT I was really sad you guys didn't find me. After Kwhit killed Autumn I took the TUrn Undead spell and was cackling with glee at the thought of you guys fleeing the dungeon. :)

Originally Posted by dubb93 (Post 2648387)

Who really wanted a level 9 dead dubb roaming level 4?

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648243)

Jag how many spells did you actually get from drops?

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648255)

If I had to choose my class/race, knowing everything about the game and my own personal style

Human Sorcerer
Sis'Sharr Lay Healer
Flame Kin Artificer

Would have been my choices. Prolly Sorcerer or Artificer. Prolly Human Sorcerer. Human XP advantage fights your slow XP chart. Then combined the awesome power of healing with the awesome power of beating. RAR!!!

Originally Posted by dubb93 (Post 2648385)

Limiting potions may make it impossible to solo. I literally popped 10 pots and my self heal on some fights. If it becomes a party game then so be it, but no one is going to solo very many level 4 rooms with potions, unless they are some sort of powerful solo class. At that point you may have a game of 20 sorcerers and battle mages.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648453)

The Ghoul Class


Rules for the Ghoul Class

You begin at the same level as you died. You fight with no weapons, but your claws give you two attacks, each dealing damage equivalent to a short sword.

As you move through the dungeon, you may not attack monsters, and will not even be given descriptions of them. Instead, your task is to find a player, and attack and kill them

You attack as if you were a warrior of the same level. You have no special abilities beyond normal undead immunities, and take no actions in rooms, cannot be given actions in rooms, cannot collect items, and so forth. You just move and attack.

You move once during the movement phase, and then again during the night phase.

You may not post in the thread until you have been discovered by a player, then you may speak and discuss as much as you want.

When you kill a player, you gain a level. When those ghouls who rose from the dead also kill player, you both gain a level.





The bolded part was only for the first few ghoul, because I wanted their first attack to be a surprise. Later ones didn;t get that rule.

Originally Posted by hoopsguy (Post 2648372)

If I'm thinking about how to tweak the game, this would be where I would do it. Don't make the monsters harder, just make potions and horses more scarce to limit the players ability to get early gold, load up on these, and roll through every battle.

That would result in a greater risk aspect, balancing out the obvious reward, of pushing for non-stop battles.

I would also suggest that there should be some element of healing overnight to balance this out, maybe 10% of health, to ensure someone isn't stuck without healing or potions and stuck sitting for 5 days.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648450)

Oh, and the ghouls almost won this. They were right beside danny/TJ and hoops for the days when that party broke up. If they had gone in two of the three directions available other than back, they hit your split u p party and add members and level up. But they didn't. They went the one other direction and tried to track down Thommy.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648450)

Oh, and the ghouls almost won this. They were right beside danny/TJ and hoops for the days when that party broke up. If they had gone in two of the three directions available other than back, they hit your split u p party and add members and level up. But they didn't. They went the one other direction and tried to track down Thommy.

Originally Posted by Autumn (Post 2648451)

If I had realized the change in trading rules I wouldn't have taken assassin. i chose between bard and assassin specifically because I saw how their skills would be useful. I figured it would be a great way to make money, IDing items or picking locks, and that there would be places only the assassin could go. Granted, I died quickly, but I never got any use out of the assassin skills, and not being able to trade items across the dungeon meant I wasn't going to be able to help anyone out but my party. I might have just fallen back on a Taurian Myrmidon in that case.

I liked the fact that the ghouls still had a chance of winning the game, that was a fun wrinkle. I don't know how they did after I died, but it was surprisingly hard to track anyone down. Thomkal mentioned a room I had been in so we were able to track him down, and I thought it would get easier as time went on and we knew more rooms. We could move twice a day which should have made it very hard to get away from us.

Originally Posted by dubb93 (Post 2648386)

Even with potions and a self heal I came within a roll of dieing at level 8 and then again at level 9.

Originally Posted by dubb93 (Post 2648387)

Who really wanted a level 9 dead dubb roaming level 4?

Originally Posted by JAG (Post 2648435)

Maybe 12 or so? I know ID was a drop, I bought oracle and mirror image, but I seen to remember Icy Blast being a drop (unless it was a store purchase). Stone to flesh was a drop (though never used), true sight was a drop, and I had a 5 or so level 4 drops, including Divinity 2 or 3 times.

Originally Posted by JAG (Post 2648443)

I liked the changes to the trading system this game. Fewer trades for you to have to process as a result but I rarely felt like I had something I wanted to trade to someone and didn't have an opportunity to do so.

Originally Posted by Autumn (Post 2648511)

Abe, what was the deal with the layout of the dungeon? I know you don't want to give away anything, but it seemed in several cases that rooms were not where it seemed they must be. Was there something that caused rooms to shift or the like?

Originally Posted by hoopsguy (Post 2648503)

Thomkal, we were about 2-3 days apart if we backtracked. As I started getting further with the mapping we could probably have met in 2 if we took a leap of faith to hit a room neither of us had seen, assuming we got an exit that allowed you to cut across.

Originally Posted by hoopsguy (Post 2648372)

If I'm thinking about how to tweak the game, this would be where I would do it. Don't make the monsters harder, just make potions and horses more scarce to limit the players ability to get early gold, load up on these, and roll through every battle.

That would result in a greater risk aspect, balancing out the obvious reward, of pushing for non-stop battles.

I would also suggest that there should be some element of healing overnight to balance this out, maybe 10% of health, to ensure someone isn't stuck without healing or potions and stuck sitting for 5 days.

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox (Post 2648345)

Congrats DV You spent a lot of the game invisible. I frequently forgot you were playing. Please regale us with tales and stories of your epic quest.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2629213)

Rules Post #9 - The Dungeon


Nothing happens in corridors, all of the action is in rooms. You can only move during the move action, but you are not required to move, should you desire to stay in room you are currently in. After the move action, all automatic combat is resolved with monsters. Most combat is automatic. You enter a room, there is a troll here, so you and the troll tussle. Results come to you in your pm. Some combat is by choice. As an example above, I gave the sleeping giant that could be attacked or circumvented.

The dungeon is all one big map, but there are more difficult areas of the dungeon. The bricks in the rooms in which you begin are Tan. The next level has Burnt Sienna bricks. The third level has Raw Umber bricks. The final, most dangerous areas of the dungeon have Black bricks. If the brick color changes, I will tell you in the pm. Otherwise, there is no change. The darker the color, the more danger you face, but the better the treasure.

You begin on the outskirts of the dungeon, and as you move towards the middle, the bricks will darken. No two players will begin in the same room. When two or more players are in the same room, you will be told in a pm, since some things (like spells) affect them.

If two or more players enter a room, there are several possibilities for combat. If there are multiple monsters in the room, each player will take a share of the monsters to fight, so you will divvy them up. If you arrive with one monster and multiple players, one player will fight the monster at a time, until the monster is killed (unless you are a team). The player with the lowest level will fight first. If tied, Fighters go first, and if two of the, are in the room (or two non-Fighters) then it will be random. So, if Bob and Steve arrive to find a Grizzly Bear, Steve will fight it since he is level 3 and Bob is level 5. If Steve wins, he gets the XP and any treasure the Bear had. If Steve runs away or dies, then Bob fights the Bear.

If multiple players are in a room with a curious object, such as a chest, then priority is given to investigate in the following order – Lower level character first, Assassins second, roll off third.

Many rooms are created in such a way as to have multiple encounters over time, but many rooms may have just one monster, one treasure, and will be vacant later in the game. Thus, it may behoove you to move deeper into the dungeon.

There are some rooms that are only accessible by various things. Some rooms or areas will not be accessible to Taurians. Others may only be guzak and dvergr sized. Others may have locked doors that are best picked by Assassins. There may be other restrictions to places you may go.

It is possible for you to leave the dungeon through magical means, or by retiring. There are no exits. Not in the usual sense.

Every player will see the dungeon from their own perspective. In order to give you a sense of direction, every starting room will have the ability to move forward (some may have additional options). Forward from all starting vantage points will be towards the center of the dungeon. That’s my little help for you. I recommend using a map if you want to keep track of where you have been, in order to ensure you will not get lost. A quick map on a sheet of paper should suffice.

The Dungeon! is magical, and may do unusual and nasty things. That’s my warning….

Originally Posted by JAG (Post 2648569)

I also strongly preferred the djinn system this time where lower level players got dibs on the limited items.

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648558)

a 4 person party would not work. I think its clear you need 2 at the most here for a chance to win.

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648552)

Wow, Abe likes you more then me!

Originally Posted by Danny (Post 2648581)

I actually had access to biy lightning bt for 400 gold i a provate sale, bit it was shortly after my almost death amd i had mo gold. I migjt habe been able to push a lotlr beyyer if i got it

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648599)

Brainstorm example:

You get 10 XP for each HP you heal with spells or abilities
You get 100 XP/level for a spell cast to defeat an enemy or further goals
You get 250 XP for disarming trap, picking lock
You get 200 XP for detecting something with an ability - such as Paladin
You get Gold Value/10 for auto-IDing something with Bard or Artificer ability

Etc.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648604)

i'ma delete all of my pms in an hour - does anyone want me not too?

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648599)

Brainstorm example:

You get 10 XP for each HP you heal with spells or abilities
You get 100 XP/level for a spell cast to defeat an enemy or further goals
You get 250 XP for disarming trap, picking lock
You get 200 XP for detecting something with an ability - such as Paladin
You get Gold Value/10 for auto-IDing something with Bard or Artificer ability

Etc.

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648599)

Brainstorm example:

You get 10 XP for each HP you heal with spells or abilities
You get 100 XP/level for a spell cast to defeat an enemy or further goals
You get 250 XP for disarming trap, picking lock
You get 200 XP for detecting something with an ability - such as Paladin
You get Gold Value/10 for auto-IDing something with Bard or Artificer ability

Etc.

Originally Posted by ntndeacon (Post 2648463)

I almost thought it worth it to go back to level 3 when we knew we were right next to mckerney. just because it would have been fun to kill another player.

Originally Posted by Darth Vilus (Post 2648614)

Wouldnt you need something for the warrior classes to balance it out though?

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent (Post 2648453)

The Ghoul Class


When you kill a player, you gain a level. When those ghouls who you slew rose from the dead also kill player, you both gain a level. When a ghoul they made slays, all of you gain a level.