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-   -   Werewolf 40,000: The Horus Heresy CHAOS DEFEATED; MUTANTS SURVIVE (http://forums.operationsports.com/fofc//showthread.php?t=52084)

Abe Sargent 08-30-2006 05:40 PM
path, this is very damning evidence, but does it point to saldana or AlanT?

st.cronin 08-30-2006 05:41 PM
path: no, I'm not chaos. I'm loyal to the emperor. I'm actually a very good candidate for jailtime, since we don't really know what will happen if I"m not around to run the Golden Throne, and I have no night actions that I'm aware of.

As for my vote on grey: It seems to me most likely that there was a conversion attempt last night. I can construct a plausible game mechanic where grey went to convert GE, and was somehow able to override the guards. It's possible that there are multiple "protectors" and each bad guy has the ability to trump a particular one ... I don't know. It's just a guess, really.

Abe Sargent 08-30-2006 05:41 PM
In fact, I'm leaning towards saldana over AlanT

Vote Saldana

Blade6119 08-30-2006 05:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fouts
What bothers me is - blade denies going out for quite awhile, and all of a sudden he is the bodyguard guarding GE in his chambers. When reminded of not going out, now he can send his soldiers out and stay in bed with his comlink.

Very very hard for me to buy this story.
I never went out, not once...i have not changed my claim on that at all. I claim to have guarded GE with my Space Marines, and grey verifies they were there. I am the head of the military, also known as the Imperial Guard. That should ring a bell about my role.

path12 08-30-2006 05:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fouts
What bothers me is - blade denies going out for quite awhile, and all of a sudden he is the bodyguard guarding GE in his chambers. When reminded of not going out, now he can send his soldiers out and stay in bed with his comlink.

Very very hard for me to buy this story.

Actually, I believe he has never claimed to be outside at all. He said that he ordered his men to guard GE, and that Grey talked his way in. Which Grey confirms, IIRC.

Fouts 08-30-2006 05:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blade6119
I never went out, not once...i have not changed my claim on that at all. I claim to have guarded GE with my Space Marines, and grey verifies they were there. I am the head of the military, also known as the Imperial Guard. That should ring a bell about my role.

Here's the deal. Grey's move is suspicious, but he confirmed your story. Using Grey as cover doesn't help you.

It is possible that blade, grey and twothree are one faction attempting to convert GE.

SirFozzie 08-30-2006 05:44 PM
The thing I'm fearing most right now is we are in a good guy slapfight. Blade and crew has to know that if we do take down Saldana and he turns out to be a good guy, that him and his backers have to be next. If we take him down and he's good as well We could be handing the baddies the game on a silver platter. And it works vice versa as well.

If I had to assign % on who's evil right now.

Blade 40%
Saldana 35%
Neither 25%

path12 08-30-2006 05:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anxiety
path, this is very damning evidence, but does it point to saldana or AlanT?

Well, I guess it points to both of them rather than toward Blade as I read it. I just really found Alan's initial comment which was his usual measured self transitioning to saying there's no doubt where the vote should go to be, well, jarring......which is why that pinged me more.

Fouts 08-30-2006 05:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by path12
Actually, I believe he has never claimed to be outside at all. He said that he ordered his men to guard GE, and that Grey talked his way in. Which Grey confirms, IIRC.

Come on, using his men to be The Bodyguard while staying in bed is just a load of BS.

path12 08-30-2006 05:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fouts
Here's the deal. Grey's move is suspicious, but he confirmed your story. Using Grey as cover doesn't help you.

It is possible that blade, grey and twothree are one faction attempting to convert GE.

It just seems odd for three to come out for one conversion. But then, it seems odd for two to come out for one kill also. There are plenty of red herrings here.

path12 08-30-2006 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fouts
Come on, using his men to be The Bodyguard while staying in bed is just a load of BS.

Then he foreshadowed it nicely yesterday by stating a couple of times how he hated having the desk job, no? This game is unpredictable enough that I rarely see a lot of foreshadowing for an accusation down the road.

path12 08-30-2006 05:49 PM
Dola, just for the record I'm not claiming to have any special insight on anybody. I'm just going off of my rereading and notes on today.

SirFozzie 08-30-2006 05:50 PM
Also.. i hate to put this out here, but we're so confused right now, it has to be done.

We need the bodyguards, the holy healers etcetera to keep GoldenEagle in the game if his role is similar to mine. My role helps us win a major victory, but if Chaos wins, doesn't matter how many heretics there would be left, unfound and unpurged.

But there is likely a role that can find the Chaos, and if there's no Chaos "group", just one or maximum two bad guys trying to hide amongst us all, would it be better to go for the minor win, rather then start searching for circles which might not exist?

The important part would be to keep the finders of Chaos alive, and less important to deal with the mutants.

bulletsponge 08-30-2006 05:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyroofoo
I am curious what exactly the argument is against me as well.
why did you go to visit Golden Eagle last night? the truth this time

path12 08-30-2006 05:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bulletsponge
why did you go to visit Golden Eagle last night? the truth this time

Hear hear!

SirFozzie 08-30-2006 05:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blade6119
I never went out, not once...i have not changed my claim on that at all. I claim to have guarded GE with my Space Marines, and grey verifies they were there. I am the head of the military, also known as the Imperial Guard. That should ring a bell about my role.

And take two steps forward on the suspect list, Mr Blade.

The Imperial Guard and the Space Marines (the Adeptus Arbites) are two different forces. You'd have no command over them.

path12 08-30-2006 05:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirFozzie
We need the bodyguards, the holy healers etcetera to keep GoldenEagle in the game if his role is similar to mine. My role helps us win a major victory, but if Chaos wins, doesn't matter how many heretics there would be left, unfound and unpurged.

You're right IMO. I could not vote GE (even though I have many questions about him) without 100% certainty that he is Chaos.

Greyroofoo 08-30-2006 05:54 PM
Food for thought for some Warhammer Scholars:

I had to talk through SPACE MARINES in order to get to GE. Would blade even have command of space marines? Are space marines part of the imperial guard?

bulletsponge 08-30-2006 05:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyroofoo
Food for thought for some Warhammer Scholars:

I had to talk through SPACE MARINES in order to get to GE. Would blade even have command of space marines? Are space marines part of the imperial guard?

grrrr answer me! why did you go to visit Golden eagle?

Fouts 08-30-2006 05:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blade6119
Alan met up with saldana, then saldana went out and used his "spy/witness" role to follow someone to a meeting with me(yet doesnt know who it was), where saldana believes me to be converted.

I, THE BODYGUARD, order my troops to guard GE's house last night...i wake up in the morning and comlink the captain of the guard to ask if all went smoothly. He says it did, excecpt for the fact that sometime around midnight the Ecclesiarch himself requested entry into GE's chamber(not house like i had said before). My captain explained his orders were rather clear, but after much conversation grey talked in way into the house, becuase, i mean, who could refuse someone of his position in our empire. I get really pissed, inform the captain that he is being permanently transfered to an ice planet(somewhere named jektar), and promote my second officer into his former position.

Is that outlined enough for all of you?

I went back to find this post. This is similar to the hoops move from a couple games ago. He did some background research into theme of the game to come up with some information to beef up his story. Which is what blade is doing with the iceplanet named jektar. I haven't looked it up, but I'm sure it's mentioned in blades link somewhere.

blade's story is just too fishy, and I didn't trust him yesterday when he pushed for killing realdeal.

vote blade

SirFozzie 08-30-2006 05:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyroofoo
Food for thought for some Warhammer Scholars:

I had to talk through SPACE MARINES in order to get to GE. Would blade even have command of space marines? Are space marines part of the imperial guard?

Points you at my post two minutes before mine :D

SirFozzie 08-30-2006 05:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirFozzie
Points you at my post two minutes before mine :D

Dola Before yours. I hate no editing. :)

Greyroofoo 08-30-2006 06:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirFozzie
Points you at my post two minutes before mine :D

bah, the second time this has happened today!!!!!


Anyways bulletsponge, I fear revealing the nature of my visit is not helpful to the Emporer and the Imperium. However if you (and others) really want me to reveal the nature of my visit I will.

st.cronin 08-30-2006 06:04 PM
Wait, I'm confused. I thought greyroofoo was CLEARING Blade? Now it sounds like he's accusing him.

path12 08-30-2006 06:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fouts
Which is what blade is doing with the iceplanet named jektar. I haven't looked it up, but I'm sure it's mentioned in blades link somewhere.

For the record, I just went back to the link Blade referenced and searched for jektar. No results.

Just like GE as seer, the fact that Blade claims bodyguard at this time makes it hard to vote for him. You have to be sure about a vote like that.

I understand your suspicions even though I read the situation differently. I just can't risk losing a major role like that without being more certain.

I'm very tempted to leave my vote on Grey and let the Blade/Saldana/Alan thing play itself out at night.

Mustang 08-30-2006 06:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyroofoo
Food for thought for some Warhammer Scholars:

I had to talk through SPACE MARINES in order to get to GE. Would blade even have command of space marines? Are space marines part of the imperial guard?

Imperial Guard is separate from Space Marines. Space Marines would not be commanded by the Imperial Guard.

Mustang 08-30-2006 06:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by st.cronin
Wait, I'm confused. I thought greyroofoo was CLEARING Blade? Now it sounds like he's accusing him.

You said it first.. I'm not sure what angle Greyroofoo is going on here now.

??

Greyroofoo 08-30-2006 06:08 PM
i'm confused too.

My PM makes no mention of Blade or anyone else. I just assumed GE would have guards with him.

Blade commanding Space Marines does seem odd from my very limted knowledge of the Warhammer Universe.

Even if those guards were blade's: IMO that neither clears him nor damns him.

st.cronin 08-30-2006 06:10 PM
I'm so confused, I can't even remember who I voted for.

Greyroofoo 08-30-2006 06:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustang
Imperial Guard is separate from Space Marines. Space Marines would not be commanded by the Imperial Guard.

Thanks for clearing that up.

So either tanglewood made a mistake or blade is lying.

path12 08-30-2006 06:12 PM
I'm keeping my vote on Grey. He was seen going into GE's quarters and neither one has been very clear as to why.

I would strongly urge us not to lynch our potential bodyguard without more proof.

Out until after lynch.

saldana 08-30-2006 06:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greyroofoo
Thanks for clearing that up.

So either tanglewood made a mistake or blade is lying.


ding ding ding ding...winner

Alan T 08-30-2006 06:14 PM
path, you've seen me in many games as both a wolf and a villager. I have never ever come out and said I believe 100% in someone.

Even in last game, the Circle of trust that I started that others hopped on, remember I said I trusted schmidty 90% there and not 100%.

This is my first time I can remember in WW games that I have ever said I trust someone is on the emperor's side 100%. Think through the scenerios why that might be.

Like I have said all day, I don't know anything about Blade, what I do know though is if you do what he is asking you to do (lynch Saldana), it is a big mistake and you lynch our witness role.

Im just asking people to think this through a little bit. I don't come out every game ranting or raving or making accusations like some players. I have a reason for it this time.

SirFozzie 08-30-2006 06:15 PM
The problem is.. now that Blade's revealed himself as the "bodyguard" (putting quotes around it because I'm not sure of it). wouldn't he be the next night's target anyway?

Fouts 08-30-2006 06:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by path12
I'm keeping my vote on Grey. He was seen going into GE's quarters and neither one has been very clear as to why.

I would strongly urge us not to lynch our potential bodyguard without more proof.

Out until after lynch.

With a jail cell, what need is there for a bodyguard? I submit there is no bodyguard.

saldana 08-30-2006 06:16 PM
i will say it one more time for those that are voting for me....

i am not sure that blade was converted....

i am 100% sure blade spoke to someone in person last night...a fact he 99.99% denied...

i asked him for a better choice and he didnt give me one, so my vote stands where it is.

st.cronin 08-30-2006 06:17 PM
Fouts makes a good point. I think there are enough holes in Blade's story to

UNVOTE GREYROOFOO

VOTE BLADE

I think I have now voted for everybody today.

Mustang 08-30-2006 06:17 PM
Does it do any good to try to vote for Sal or Blade? Seems there are 2 groups, those sticking up for Sal and those with Blade. Personally, I think either both groups are good or 1 good/1 mutant. Although, if one of them is bad and we hit upon it.. seems likely that the forces sticking up for them would be chaotic too..

Pretty risky move though and I'm not sure I would agree with this course so, I'd rather have that scenario play out more so..

Vote Greyfooroo

Only one right now that can avoid Sal or Blade getting the ax and I'd just assume avoid that right now.

Unfortunately, have to vote now as I'm heading out in a few to have dinner.

(Birthday dinner at my favorite chinese place so... :p )

Mustang 08-30-2006 06:18 PM
I don't even have a count right now...

tanglewood 08-30-2006 06:24 PM
Current Vote Count Day 2

saldana 5 - kingfc, Blade, twothree, bulletsponge, Anxiety
Blade 5 - saldana, AlanT, SirFozzie, Fouts, st.cronin
Greyroofoo 2- path12, Mustang
kingfc 1 - BrianD

Not Yet Voted: GoldenEagle, Greyroofoo, Chief Rum, Swaggs

Mustang 08-30-2006 06:27 PM
Hmm.. well, I personally don't have a strong feeling on either Sal or Blade.

Personally, wouldn't want either to die at this present time so..

Guess I believe them both currently.

I'm out.. I'll read up later.

Fouts 08-30-2006 06:28 PM
I can understand the votes on grey, but saldana? Somebody explain why they are voting that way?

Fouts 08-30-2006 06:29 PM
FWIW, after playing with Alan in previous games, there is no way he would back somebody this hard unless he knew he was good.

saldana 08-30-2006 06:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustang
Imperial Guard is separate from Space Marines. Space Marines would not be commanded by the Imperial Guard.


interesting...went and did a little wikipediaing myself

Quote:
Originally Posted by wikipedia entry for space marines
The Space Marines
The Space Marines are one of the most commonly played forces in the game of Warhammer 40,000. Each individual Space Marine is a hardy warrior, with superior firepower, close-range combat ability and baroque powered armour. They are considered to be the finest warriors of the Imperium of Man; elite supersoldiers who can be counted on to win almost any war.

They are a unique section in the Imperium in that they are independant of Imperial law, even an Inquisitor of the Imperium, whose power and authority is unlimited (even to the point of destroying worlds), is unable to commandeer a Space Marine chapter, although on special occassions they are given command of a single squad up to an entire company. Like the Adeptus Mechanicus, the Adeptus Astartes are independent. Because of this they are viewed as dangerous, although valuable allies.

The Space Marines are heavily inspired by earlier works of science fiction, especially the Mobile Infantry from the novel Starship Troopers, and the Sardaukar from the novel Dune - and seem to have inspired later super-soldiers; notably the Spartans from Halo and the Marines from StarCraft.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wikipedia entry for Imperial Guard
The Imperial Guard
The Imperial Guard is a colossal organisation, consisting of billions of men and women from millions of different worlds and systems within the Imperium. Each regiment is a force of between three and ten thousand fighting soldiers, supported by a dazzling array of light and heavy armoured vehicles. Each regiment also has its own entourage, consisting of support staff, camp followers, suppliers, tech-priests, doctors, religious leaders, and the like.

The Imperial Guard are far more numerous than the Space Marines, for while there are only a thousand Chapters of a thousand Marines each, the contributions of some planets to Imperial Guard regiments over the ten thousand years of the Imperium runs into the billions. The Imperial Guard are constantly at war, freeing worlds from Chaotic or alien influence, or defending them from the same.

saldana 08-30-2006 06:30 PM
dola, blade commands the imperial guard, but only a primarch can command the space marines....thats another lie

saldana 08-30-2006 06:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fouts
I can understand the votes on grey, but saldana? Somebody explain why they are voting that way?
because blade says i have to be bad if i am voting for him, and people are believing it.

Swaggs 08-30-2006 06:36 PM
Time for quite a bit of catch up...

GoldenEagle 08-30-2006 06:43 PM
Grey came to me last night and we discussed Blade. I do not know why he came to me. He told me Blade was not chaos and I have every reason to believe him. Blade may be human or he may be a mutant, but he is not chaos.

I have a theory that both Grey and Blade may be mutants and they are possibly trying to pull the wool over everyone's eyes. But our targets are not mutants. We are trying to kill off chaos right now.

I do not know what to think of saldana and Alan T being buddies. If we kill saldana and he is clean, then it is going to look very bad for Blade and very good for Alan T.

But as of right now, this is my vote.

Vote saldana

Greyroofoo 08-30-2006 06:44 PM
vote blade

seems he's been caught in a little bit of a lie

Fouts 08-30-2006 06:46 PM
Interesting that you two both post simultaneously, again. What I don't get is the opposite votes.


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