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Originally Posted by jbergey22
Great conversation you guys are having.
I am a little more sensitive about Bonds & Clemens because as many of us growing up around the same age these guys along with Griffey and a few others were the greatest of our generation. Also, I am probably a bit stubborn about this but Bonds was just that much better than any other hitter I have ever seen. The PED's didnt give him the best hand/eye coordination to ever play, it didnt give him the best ability to know the strike zone of his time, it also didnt make him one of the most intelligent baseball players to ever play.
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But it did give him the unnatural strength to put more balls in the Pacific Ocean than he otherwise would have. Having said that, he's a HOF without the HR record. But again, do y'all remember all of the denials and bullshit surrounding him? He willingly, admittedly, knowingly lied and rubbed it all in our noses. Over and over and over again. Despite everyone knowing the bastard was doing it. He helped cheapen the game of baseball, which again, goes back to the integrity of the game question.
Same with Clemens. He was one of my favorite pitchers growing up. Incredible fastball and you never knew what you were going to see when he was on the mound. But again - same thing with the denials. I remember clearly when the Mitchell Report came out. One observer said "watch this. Andy Pettitte will own it immediately and admit it. Rocket will never do that even though it was common knowledge he did." Or something to that effect. And thats exactly what happened.
Regarding Pete Rose - I dont see how anyone can say he belongs in the HOF. Youre taking the essence of sport and wiping your ass with it. If you compare it to PEDs then at least those guys were trying to gain a competitive advantage and blurred the lines of acceptable behavior. Charlie Hustle compromised the integrity of potentially every game he managed.
Not sure why I'm getting so invested in this, but here we go. In the end, the HOF means jackshit (Billy Wagner close to getting in??! WTF). But it does lead to interesting discussions. I do think Bonds and Clemens get in eventually. Schilling's numbers arent as glowing, and with him being a Grade A Dickbag, I wouldnt be surprised if he never got the call.