Steve Entman- unfair rap

[waltwal]

i just saw a vote on ESPN.com listing 5 players as the worst #1 pick in draft history. One of the players listed was Steve Entman. As i recall Entman was off to a very good start with the team that drafted him until he sustained a very serious knee injury and was never the same player after that. I think it is extremely unfair to label a player as a bust due to a major injury.

What if Jamarcus Russell is the #1 pick but before he plays a game he dies in an effort to save someone's life- would this mean that he would be one of the biggest draft busts.

I am not a fan of the Huskies or of Steve Entmann but this label on him has always struck me as really unfair.

[dawgfan]

Couldn't agree more. Emtman's status as bust wasn't due to lack of ability or even performance, at least prior to the injury - his bust was all about the severe knee injuries he suffered as a pro.

Now, that certainly doesn't make the Colts feel any better about having spent the #1 overall pick on him - it really didn't matter to them why they didn't end up getting much value out of that pick, just that they didn't.

So, in that respect, I'm OK with labeling that pick a bust so long as it's stated that it was due to injury. I have no doubt that Emtman would've been a very good pro player had he stayed healthy (and he was off to a good start his rookie year before his first injury), as opposed to Ryan Leaf who was a bust mainly for reasons other than health.

[QuikSand]

Agreed.

[Honolulu_Blue]

At least he could fall back on his family's very delicious and successful line of boxed baked goods.

MmmMmm Good!

[stevew]

Refresh my memory....what was it, something like the Colts traded Chandler to the Bucs for their future #1, and it ended up being the #2 pick overall? So they had 1 and 2 that year, and went with Coryatt and Entman? Injury busts are way different than "you fucking suck busts" like Akili Smith or Tim Couch. I'm sure Ki-Jana Carter is on that list too, he had all those serious knee injuries. Couple that with playing RB at Penn State, and it was not suprising he busted.

[Warhammer]

Emtman even played better coming back from one of his injuries and I remember people saying he would be comeback player of the year, then he busted his knee again.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by stevew

Refresh my memory....what was it, something like the Colts traded Chandler to the Bucs for their future #1, and it ended up being the #2 pick overall? So they had 1 and 2 that year, and went with Coryatt and Entman? Injury busts are way different than "you fucking suck busts" like Akili Smith or Tim Couch. I'm sure Ki-Jana Carter is on that list too, he had all those serious knee injuries. Couple that with playing RB at Penn State, and it was not suprising he busted.

Was that the "who the hell is Mel Kiper?" draft?

[Ksyrup]

Dola.

Looks like it was the Trev Alberts draft. Mel Kiper must have known what an arrogant prick Alberts would sound like as an announcer. Good call, Mel.

[QuikSand]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Dola.

Looks like it was the Trev Alberts draft. Mel Kiper must have known what an arrogant prick Alberts would sound like as an announcer. Good call, Mel.

Yes yes - Mel insisted that the Colts needed to draft Trent Dilfer, when they took Alberts, he went off (something like "this is why the Colts are here picking in the top five every year," and then they dished back. Great stuff.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

At least he could fall back on his family's very delicious and successful line of boxed baked goods.

Doggone it. I was abouthisclose to making a similar joke but wasn't sure how many people would get it.

[stevew]

In retrospect, Kiper probably was right on that one....it took the Colts like 15 more years to win a title(at least).

[Izulde]

I still have nightmares about Entman intercepting the ball and returning it all the way back for a TD to win the game against Miami.

He was damn good before he got hurt and I wouldn't call him a bust.

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

At least he could fall back on his family's very delicious and successful line of boxed baked goods.

MmmMmm Good!

Heh. Emtman actually invested his money very wisely and has his hands in a number of ventures currently. He was (and may still be) running a business that reps FieldTurf, he's involved in commercial real estate, he runs a health club/gym, and he's had a stint as an assistant strength and conditioning coach at the UW when his buddy (and former teammate) Pete Kaligis was the head strength and conditioning coach.

[Pumpy Tudors]

I can only speak about the past 20 or 25 years, but if you're going to talk about #1 overall draft busts, Steve Emtman's name has to be included, especially if you want to make a "top 5" list. I mean, bigger busts are Aundray Bruce, Tim Couch, and Ki-Jana Carter, but what else do you have to choose from? Maybe Courtney Brown? Maybe Dan Wilkinson?

I mean, I get the point of the original post here. A lot of people do talk about Steve Emtman as if he was some horrible bust, and he wasn't, particularly when you factor in his injuries. Compared only with #1 overall picks, though, his career doesn't look very strong.

Now, if there were some real #1 busts before, say, 1980 or so, then sure, include them over Emtman. I just can't address that because I don't know anything about it.

[SFL Cat]

Nice to hear. It still amazes me how some of these players blow all their money and wind up as penniless destitutes when their playing days are over.

[SFL Cat]

Originally Posted by Pumpy Tudors

I can only speak about the past 20 or 25 years, but if you're going to talk about #1 overall draft busts, Steve Emtman's name has to be included, especially if you want to make a "top 5" list. I mean, bigger busts are Aundray Bruce, Tim Couch, and Ki-Jana Carter, but what else do you have to choose from? Maybe Courtney Brown? Maybe Dan Wilkinson?

I mean, I get the point of the original post here. A lot of people do talk about Steve Emtman as if he was some horrible bust, and he wasn't, particularly when you factor in his injuries. Compared only with #1 overall picks, though, his career doesn't look very strong.

Now, if there were some real #1 busts before, say, 1980 or so, then sure, include them over Emtman. I just can't address that because I don't know anything about it.

I'd say Courtney Brown was a bigger bust than Entman. At least Entman showed some talent before injuries robbed him of his game. Brown, it seems, was pretty much a pro bust from day 1.

[cougarfreak]

To include Steve Entman, and not Akili Smith shows you the IQ of the writer of the story.

[JHandley]

In what year do you think Akili Smith was the #1 overall draft pick?

[rowech]

Akili Smith is easily the worst #1 pick of all time...unless you count David Klingner. God, I love being a Bengals fan. It's unfair to put Ki-Jana in there. He busted his knee out the first or second play he ever ran from scrimmage.

[timmynausea]

Looking back, I am actually sort of glad that Emtman wasn't successful just because it reduces the frequency with which I have to see people spell his name wrong. Now, if I could just find a way to ruin Matt "Leinhart" I'd be all set.

[Warhammer]

On one of the local sports shows in town they were talking about the E man being one of the 5 biggest busts of all time. I just don't get that.

[cthomer5000]

if you are talking strictly #1 overall picks (which Akili Smith was not), i understand how Entmann enters the discussion, though i agree it's a bit unfair.

[dawgfan]

Point of clarification - the name is Steve Emtman. Two "m's", one "n".

[Rizon]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I still have nightmares about Entman intercepting the ball and returning it all the way back for a TD to win the game against Miami.

He was damn good before he got hurt and I wouldn't call him a bust.

I have no doubts he had at least 5 pounds of stickem on his gloves on that BS play.

[Greyroofoo]

Hell all I know is that the Colts are pinking 32nd this year, and you can never argue picking 32nd

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by rowech

Akili Smith is easily the worst #1 pick of all time...unless you count David Klingner. God, I love being a Bengals fan. It's unfair to put Ki-Jana in there. He busted his knee out the first or second play he ever ran from scrimmage.

No, seriously, this is about #1 overall picks. It really is.

[st.cronin]

Ryan Leaf has to be the biggest #1 bust, no?

[SFL Cat]

^^^I would agree.

[cartman]

Originally Posted by rowech

Akili Smith is easily the worst #1 pick of all time...unless you count David Klingner. God, I love being a Bengals fan. It's unfair to put Ki-Jana in there. He busted his knee out the first or second play he ever ran from scrimmage.

1st play from scrimmage....

IN PRESEASON!!!

It set in motion the long line of busted Penn State backs in the NFL.

[SFL Cat]

Courtney Brown had the misfortune to be picked first by a brand new franchise. He didn't live up to that billing. Then, injuries did him in.

[bulletsponge]

What if Jamarcus Russell is the #1 pick but before he plays a game he dies in an effort to save someone's life- would this mean that he would be one of the biggest draft busts.

nope. Russell will bust for other reasons

[JeeberD]

Originally Posted by SFL Cat

Courtney Brown had the misfortune to be picked first by a brand new franchise. He didn't live up to that billing. Then, injuries did him in.

Wasn't Couch the first pick for the new Browns? I think Brown was the next season...

[EagleFan]

Overall a bust is a bust, injury or talent. If you don't end up with the expected return from your pick it's still a bust no matter what the reason is.

The question comes down to if you are calling something a bust in terms of expected return or not. It's like if you sit down to 2 different poker tournaments and get knocked out of the first one before being in the money because you played poorly and then getting knocked out of the second one before being in the money even though you played right but someone played a stupid hand and hit a very lucky draw. Your result is the same and you are out the money no matter what.

[Pumpy Tudors]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Ryan Leaf has to be the biggest #1 bust, no?

Originally Posted by SFL Cat

^^^I would agree.

Guys, seriously...

[Logan]

I vote for Yancey Thigpen.

[st.cronin]

I don't know how you leave Rick Mirer off this list, too.

[JPhillips]

Why isn't Reinard Wilson on that list?

or Dasagana Diop?

[Ksyrup]

That Darko guy was the overall #1 pick of the Texans a few years back, right? Man, he sucked.

[Desmond]

How about that year that Donovan McNabb and Rickey Williams went #1. I'm glad the Eagles didn't end up trading the #1 spot and picked McNabb instead. A little later on the Saints traded their whole draft to move up to #1 and picked Williams, whom although having a good career while in there, has to be considered some sort of a bust. For a #1.

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Ryan Leaf has to be the biggest #1 bust, no?

Maybe if he was a #1 pick

[EagleFan]

Originally Posted by Desmond

How about that year that Donovan McNabb and Rickey Williams went #1. I'm glad the Eagles didn't end up trading the #1 spot and picked McNabb instead. A little later on the Saints traded their whole draft to move up to #1 and picked Williams, whom although having a good career while in there, has to be considered some sort of a bust. For a #1.

Tim Couch was #1 that year. McNabb went #2. Eagles wouldn't have needed to trade up to get Williams. That's where the whole booing of the non-pick of Williams came in by the "idiot 30".

[Desmond]

Originally Posted by EagleFan

Tim Couch was #1 that year. McNabb went #2. Eagles wouldn't have needed to trade up to get Williams. That's where the whole booing of the non-pick of Williams came in by the "idiot 30".

I know Tim Couch went #1 too.

[daedalus]

Originally Posted by waltwal

i just saw a vote on ESPN.com listing 5 players as the worst #1 pick in draft history. One of the players listed was Steve Entman. As i recall Entman was off to a very good start with the team that drafted him until he sustained a very serious knee injury and was never the same player after that. I think it is extremely unfair to label a player as a bust due to a major injury.

2 different things:

1) Given that Emtman was a #1 with a shortened career, albeit due to the misfortune of injury rather than any fault of his own, I don't think it's unfair to label him a "bust". What else could it be considered?

2) Labeling the selection as "the worst #1 pick in draft history", on the other hand, is likely relatively ridiculous. Up until his injuries, he looked to have become a solid to very good player. How could it be considered a bad pick?

[st.cronin]

I mean, for that matter, Quentin Coryatt was just as much a bust at #1 as Entman.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by Logan

I vote for Yancey Thigpen.

Dude Thigpen was an amazing closer in his day!

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Desmond

How about that year that Donovan McNabb and Rickey Williams went #1. I'm glad the Eagles didn't end up trading the #1 spot and picked McNabb instead. A little later on the Saints traded their whole draft to move up to #1 and picked Williams, whom although having a good career while in there, has to be considered some sort of a bust. For a #1.

That was when th Bengals picked Akili. If they would have made that trade they would have gotten the first pick and all the rest of the Saint's picks. Then they could have picked Pervis Ellison and and Alexandre Daigle number one.

[st.cronin]

Wait, I thought it was the 49ers that picked Axeli Smith?

[Greyroofoo]

All I know is that the Colts are frickien awesome!!!!

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

ade they would have gotten the first pick and all the rest of the Saint's picks. Then they could have picked Pervis Ellison and and Alexandre Daigle number one.

Hah!