Obama versus McCain (versus the rest)

[Buccaneer]

Not to mention actual physical violence and having to put family members into hiding. Actually, I wasn't going back that far - just read about 1968. But I do agree that 2000 was much worse than 2008, except some people can't even remember back that far.

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

More than that.

Flasch, you really don't have much perspective do you? Do you realize how myopic you sound?

Well I havnt lived as long as you so I guess my opinion shouldnt count unless of course it agrees with you, than it's fine. And please find where I used the word 'ever'...I didnt. So Myopia is an absolutely ridiculous thing to debate when I wasnt comparing my statement above to anything other than my statement above but thanks for throwing that out there Bucc. You do realize how trollish you sound?

[Big Fo]

Someone posted a link to a site with that kind of stuff many pages ago, it was ridiculous.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

You do realize how trollish you sound?

You realize how ignorant you sound?

[Flasch186]

oh look a Duckman sighting. Lets see what he has to say. And he apparently hit macro 4 on his keyboard.

[Flasch186]

the best part about Duckman's relationship to me is that it gets traced back all the way to his support for Rumsfeld (and W) and my lack of support for Rumsfeld (and W). Crazy how that transitioned out of politics and into his psyche in regards to other things involving me at FOFC (and Real Life for him). Strange to me but that's Duckman's world.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

oh look a Duckman sighting. Lets see what he has to say. And he apparently hit macro 4 on his keyboard.

Got anymore pictures of you and your friends to show how wonderful you are?


What a giant piece of shit you are!

[duckman]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

the best part about Duckman's relationship to me is that it gets traced back all the way to his support for Rumsfeld and my lack of support for Rumsfeld. Carzy how that transitioned out of politics and into his psyche. Strange to me but that's Duckman's world.

Show me a fucking quote that I explicitly supported Rumsfield, POS.

[Flasch186]

not worth my time.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

not worth my time.

So says the hypocrite.

[Flasch186]

how are you and your friends doing on your Facebook page that has pictures on it of you and them? BTW that's not a bad thing in my opinion and Im glad you have a ton of friends who support you in your pursuit of being a teacher (there was a thread about that I think) and helping out kids.

[Flasch186]

DOLA

You know in retrospect it probably wasnt our differences on Rumsfeld (youre right), I believe it was your condonement of the behaviour(s) in Iraq and support of the war (and my attacks on the field manual in regards to torture). I think, IIRC, that to boil it down to the differences on Rumsfeld would be inaccurate and wrong but than somehow you twisted it into me being a liar and living a lie and stuff and being different on here than I am in real life. Good times.

Anyways, no need to hijack the thread as the debate about one of the worst run campaigns ever (myopic, perhaps, but W's 2 campaign's were 2 of the best run ever), Obama's patriotism, and polling....is very interesting stuff. At least more interesting than your hatred for a person youve never met.

[Crapshoot]

Flasch, you're looking stupid. I disagree with Duckman on plenty, but he's been fairly intellectually honest as long as I can recall here, and has admitted when he has been wrong on the issues.

[Flasch186]

I didnt say he's wrong, just silly for hating me for the reasons he does and pointing out the history of it which I again think is silly to actually have hatred for. Needless to add, I dont hate him by any means or anyone on the FOFC for that matter.

Edit to add: BubbaWheels did get on my nerves but i still didnt hate him.

[Flasch186]

back on track:

McCain draws bipartisan criticism for 'robo calls' - Yahoo! News

It seems the robocalls ARE something that the parties can reach across party lines on.

LAS VEGAS – Two senators in opposing political parties asked Republican presidential candidate John McCain to stop the automated phone calls that link Democratic candidate Barack Obama to a 1960s radical.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, a Nevada Democrat, and Sen. Susan Collins, a Maine Republican, made separate appeals to McCain on Friday. Collins faces a tough race for re-election and serves as a co-chairwoman of his Maine campaign.

"These kind of tactics have no place in Maine politics," Collins spokesman Kevin Kelley said. "Sen. Collins urges the McCain campaign to stop these calls immediately."

In Nevada, a four-page campaign flier mailed this week by the state Republican Party also focused on Obama's past relationship with former Weather Underground leader Bill Ayers, calling the college professor a "terrorist, radical, friend of Obama" and featuring several images of Obama and Ayers.

Reid told reporters at a news conference in Las Vegas that he's surprised at the "scummy" tactics employed by McCain's presidential campaign and "can't believe John McCain knows what's going on."

The McCain campaign says the calls are warranted because Obama's connection to Ayers — the two met many years after Ayers' anti-Vietnam War activities had ended — raises questions about the Democrat's judgment and record.

"This is an association that is highly questionable and not out of bounds," McCain spokesman Rick Gorka said.

The automated calls in Maine, Nevada and other states — they are commonly known as "robo calls" — say Obama "has worked closely with domestic terrorist Bill Ayers, whose organization bombed the U.S. Capitol, the Pentagon, a judge's home and killed Americans." The charge is misleading: The bombings, which took place more than 35 years ago, didn't result in fatalities and the group didn't claim responsibility for the attack on the judge's home.

Obama has condemned Ayers' radical activities, which took place in the late 1960s and the 1970s, when Obama was a child. In the debate Wednesday with McCain, Obama said Ayers played no role in his presidential campaign.

Ayers, an education professor at the University of Illinois at Chicago, lives in Obama's neighborhood in Chicago. In 1995, he hosted a meet-the-candidate session at his home as the young Harvard Law School graduate prepared to run for the Illinois Senate. The two also worked with two nonprofit charitable organizations in Chicago.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

back on track:

McCain draws bipartisan criticism for 'robo calls' - Yahoo! News

It seems the robocalls ARE something that the parties can reach across party lines on.

I just love the whole "Obama has never answered the questions on this relationship" when he has many times and been collaborated by many sources. What they mean to say is "Obama hasn't answered the questions the way we like."

[Arles]

Yeah, McCain's on the ropes and I cringe at what the next 3 weeks will be like.

[Flasch186]

Originally Posted by Arles

Yeah, McCain's on the ropes and I cringe at what the next 3 weeks will be like.

you and me both and you know the strangest part is that I dont think it had to be anything like this. It's as if the week in which he chose Palin was the beginning of some sort of bizarro world. His management team truly have been exposed as inept IMO and it's a shame because it truly seemed to go down a path it didn't have to for his campaign.

[rowech]

Let's say that all undecided votes go to McCain and somehow McCain wins. Or, worse yet, suppose Obama wins the popular and loses the electoral...

How bad would Obama supporters be? Will we literally see rioting throughout the country?

[Flasch186]

I hope not, my view is that whomever gets the most votes deserves to be the President (obviously I was a bit upset with how Florida turned out last time with the whole stop the count stuff) but when all is said and done and all the votes are counted (accurately) whomever wins deserves it.

[molson]

Originally Posted by rowech

Let's say that all undecided votes go to McCain and somehow McCain wins. Or, worse yet, suppose Obama wins the popular and loses the electoral...

How bad would Obama supporters be? Will we literally see rioting throughout the country?

This came up a couple of times in this thread, but I don't think there'd be any kind of unrest if Obama wins the popular but McCain clearly wins the electorate.

However, if there's a deciding state decided by >1000 or so votes, there will be talk of things not being on the level, and that's where I think we'd see some issues in some parts of the country.

[Flasch186]

you could have mini-riots anywhere though for any reason. A convenience store runs out of a slurpee and someone could get shot, you never know these days.

[larrymcg421]

McCain is gaining some ground in the national trackers. The RCP average is now +6.5 for Obama. However, what's interesting is he hasn't made much headway in the battleground states. He's still getting hammered in PA and WI. The latest Rasmussen polls show Obama actually gaining ground in Colorado, Nevada, and Missouri.

It seems that McCain's recent strategy may only be paying off by running up the score in his solid red states. I do wonder about his strategy. He's still contesting Iowa and Pennsylvania for some reason. He's got these robocalls in Maine that were even denounced by Susan Collins. Why is he even making them in Maine in the first place?

Likewise, the GOP Senate Chair John Ensign has made some bewildering decisions. He announced they were pulling ads out of of Louisiana, then changed his mind. Then he announces they're gonna pull ads in Colorado, then changed his mind. So all he does is guarantee at least a full day's worth of bad press for his candidates that are already struggling.

[Flasch186]

Can it get any more divisive? I honestly dont understand McCain's strategy right now:
McCain aide says he's strong in 'real' Virginia - Yahoo! News

McCain aide says he's strong in 'real' Virginia


By GLEN JOHNSON, Associated Press Writer Glen Johnson, Associated Press Writer – 3 mins ago
Featured Topics:
Republican presidential candidate Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., waves to supporters AP – Republican presidential candidate Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., waves to supporters as he leaves his headquarters …

WOODBRIDGE, Va. – A top aide to John McCain said Saturday the Republican presidential nominee still has a strong chance of winning the state because of his support in "real Virginia," the downstate areas far removed in distance and political philosophy from the more liberal northern part of the state.

"As a proud resident of Oakton, Va., I can tell you that the Democrats have just come in from the District of Columbia and moved into northern Virginia," McCain senior adviser Nancy Pfotenhauer said on MSNBC. "And that's really what you see there. But the rest of the state, real Virginia, if you will, I think will be very responsive to Sen. McCain's message."

Program host Kevin Corke asked Pfotenhauer if she wanted to retract the comment, prompting her to reply, "I mean 'real Virginia' because northern Virginia is where I've always been, but 'real Virginia' I take to be the — this part of the state that is more Southern in nature, if you will. Northern Virginia is really metro D.C."

Earlier this month, McCain's brother, Joe, told those at an event for the Republican nominee that two Democratic-leaning areas in Northern Virginia, Arlington and Alexandria, were "communist country." He quickly apologized and called the remark a joke.

The senator's campaign headquarters is in Arlington, as is the home he uses while in Washington. McCain also attended high school in Alexandria.

Northern Virginia is the most populous in the state, so if McCain considers it enemy territory, he would have to run up large margins in the Hampton Roads and less populated areas of Virginia to win on Election Day. During a rally in the Washington suburb of Woodbridge, Va., on Saturday, McCain noted that his first posting in the Navy was in coastal Norfolk.

Democrats not only control the Virginia governor's office, but Democrat Jim Webb succeeded in 2006 in ousting Republican Sen. George Allen. Veteran Sen. John Warner, R-Va., is retiring this year and former Democratic Gov. Mark Warner is vying with former Republican Gov. Jim Gilmore to succeed him.

The popularity of Mark Warner has led some to suggest he may boost Democrat Barack Obama's chances, rather than the opposite.

One recent poll showed McCain trailing Obama by up to 8 percentage points in the Old Dominion, but political analysts believe the race may be closer. McCain was making a push to hold onto Virginia, which President Bush won in 2004.

Besides his rally in Woodbridge, McCain's campaign was launching a downstate bus tour on Sunday with Todd Palin, the husband of his running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.

One of those attending McCain's rally said she wasn't sure about the geographical split of the state.

"I just hope that the state of Virginia will continue to support and continue to be a red state," said 45-year-old Diane Fuller of Manassas.

[Daimyo]

Palin's been using "real" as well... are they trying to bait the race-card to be played?

[Flasch186]

dunno, im baffled.

[larrymcg421]

Not only have they been saying "real Virginia", but Palin was recently talking about "pro-America" parts of the country. Glad the "OMG the other side is unpatriotic" crap we've had to endure the last 8 years from Bush is going to continue if McCain gets elected.

[JPhillips]

Got my first polling call of the season. It came out of Princeton for "a major newspaper". My guess is USA Today. The demo questions that I'm sure were geared towards the likely voter screen were interesting. There was also a section of religious questions that included asking the religion of Obama that included Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist and Christian.

[Tigercat]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

There was also a section of religious questions that included asking the religion of Obama that included Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist and Christian.

They will never get accurate answers if three of the options mean the same thing.

[Young Drachma]

Sarah Palin On SNL With Tina Fey, Weekend Update's Alaska Rap, Baldwin And Wahlberg (VIDEO)

Amy Poehler did good work in video 2.

[Flasch186]

Sarah Palin did a very good job!

Those were great and Palin dancing is a classic moment on SNL. If on ly they could get us to watch the whole show.

[JPhillips]

Damn.

Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama reports raising more than $150 million in September in an unprecedented eruption of political giving.

[Big Fo]

More W.Va. voters say machines are switching votes

WINFIELD, W.Va. -- Three Putnam County voters say electronic voting machines changed their votes from Democrats to Republicans when they cast early ballots last week.

This is the second West Virginia county where voters have reported this problem. Last week, three voters in Jackson County told The Charleston Gazette their electronic vote for "Barack Obama" kept flipping to "John McCain".

...

WVGazette.com

Things might turn ugly on Election Day. In Wisconsin it already has:

Obama Campaign Worker Allegedly Attacked

CALEDONIA, Wis. -- Police in Caledonia are investigating the assault of a campaign volunteer as she was canvassing for Senator Barack Obama Saturday afternoon.

In an exclusive interview with 12 News, 58 year-old Nancy Takehara of Chicago says she was going door-to-door when she came across a disgruntled homeowner.

“The next thing I know he’s telling us we’re not his people, we’re probably with ACORN, and he started screaming and raving,” Takehara said. “He grabbed me by the back of the neck. I thought he was going to rip my hair out of my head. He was pounding on my head and screaming. The man terrified me.”

...

wisn.com

Assaulting a 58 year old woman... wow. Unlike the Republicans' economic policies it looks like their hate-filled rhetoric does have a trickle-down effect.

[Jas_lov]

Colin Powell is supposed to announce that he's endorsing Barack Obama on MTP today.

[Big Fo]

It happened a few minutes ago for those on the East Coast.

[Flasch186]

Boo yah, Game set match:

Colin Powell endorses Barack Obama for president


By STEPHEN OHLEMACHER, Associated Press Writer Stephen Ohlemacher, Associated Press Writer – 19 mins ago

WASHINGTON – Former Secretary of State Colin Powell has endorsed Democrat Barack Obama for president, describing the Illinois senator as a "transformational figure."

Powell says both Obama and Republican John McCain are qualified to be commander in chief. But, in an interview Sunday on NBC's "Meet the Press," he said Obama is better suited to handle the nation's economic problems as well as help improve it's standing in the world.

Powell expressed disappointment in the negative tone of McCain's campaign, as well as in his choice of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as the Republican vice presidential nominee. Powell says he does not believe Palin is ready to take over as president, if necessary.

Colin Powell endorses Barack Obama for president - Yahoo! News

I sincerely hope that this moment, which I think is a game changer, allows McCain (Palin) to run a campaign that takes a positive tone until the end (whatever the end is). I hope but I know I may be naiive.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

It happened a few minutes ago for those on the East Coast.

Unless you're in Atlanta I guess. It still has 10 minutes before coming on. Thanks for the spoiler. Gosh!

[Big Fo]

Huh, I thought Meet the Press was 9 a.m. local time across the country. Anyway it's all over the cable networks and internet by now.

The Drudge Report is so subtle:

[sachmo71]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

Things might turn ugly on Election Day. In Wisconsin it already has:



Assaulting a 58 year old woman... wow. Unlike the Republicans' economic policies it looks like their hate-filled rhetoric does have a trickle-down effect.

more likely you will run into these isolated cases as the "get out the vote" continues. more door to door = more exposure to crazies in their lairs. it's hard to blame either party for the actions of one person.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by sachmo71

more likely you will run into these isolated cases as the "get out the vote" continues. more door to door = more exposure to crazies in their lairs. it's hard to blame either party for the actions of one person.

But they do it all of the time. It's so easy to stand apart and point a finger at a bad action and say "see, that's what all of you are like".

By the way, I can see Powell's reasons being persuasive.

[Big Fo]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

But they do it all of the time. It's so easy to stand apart and point a finger at a bad action and say "see, that's what all of you are like".

By the way, I can see Powell's reasons being persuasive.

I never implied that all Republicans are hate-mongers that assault 58 year old women.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

I never implied that all Republicans are hate-mongers that assault 58 year old women.

I did not imply that you did. Sach was just making a general observation that I agree with.

[CamEdwards]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

Assaulting a 58 year old woman... wow. Unlike the Republicans' economic policies it looks like their hate-filled rhetoric does have a trickle-down effect.

Pajamas Media » Obama Supporter Assaults Female McCain Volunteer in New York

Looks like a middle aged female McCain supporter was attacked by an Obama supporter. Too bad it happened in New York City, far away from the networks and major media outlets that could report on such a story.

There are nutjobs on both sides... in fact, isn't that part of the problem these days? Too many nutjobs in general?

[SirFozzie]

Obama campaign to announce that they raised over $150 million in September Holee shit. The previous high was like $87 million in one month.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Big Fo

Huh, I thought Meet the Press was 9 a.m. local time across the country. Anyway it's all over the cable networks and internet by now.

The Drudge Report is so subtle:

I was joking about the spoiler. I have no idea why Atlanta has it on later.

[Buccaneer]

I would think all that money being raised by the political parties could go to better use instead of paying for commercials and buy time that everyone is sick of (not to mention the junk mail), as well as to bribe the population to do their duty. But money talks and all is fair in the war for political supremacy.

[Flasch186]

isnt it possible neither were attacked actually?

[sachmo71]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

isnt it possible neither were attacked actually?

of course it is, but I don't doubt this will happen. The fact is, as far as politics, it should be irrelevant. unfortunately, it won't be.

[Flasch186]

BTW in agreement of Bucc somewhat I wonder if the long Obama TV "ad" could result in a bit of fatigue. The whole ROI theory which truly was proven by Palin in this campaign as valid. If the 'ad' isnt done well it could result in a bit of that 'Im sick of this crap already' attitude.

[Buccaneer]

I actually go one step further in saying the better use should not go to political campaigning but to the many needs in this country and world.