WW XCIV Group Therapy - Game Over!

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Nope, and I'm not sure what you can do to help me get to trusting you either given the game setup.

.

You'll know when the time comes

[Poli]

Godspeed, Pass.

VOTE TELLE

[claphamsa]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I resent the implication I would hump Hoops, now Clap on the other hand...

O.0

[claphamsa]

why telle poli? is this one of those crazy roll things you cant tell us about?

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Poli

Godspeed, Pass.

VOTE TELLE

Is this a "settle the question now" vote or based on something more than that?

If the latter, why do you think that the wolves let you live after your post last night clearly indicated that you had already determined she was your course of action for today after voting for her the last couple of days?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

OK, time for a modified trust list. Might as well pass the time while waiting for morning to come around. I've excluded myself from the list; put me where you think I should be slotted.

High Trust = well, probably not anyone right now. I listed four names two nights ago and they are all still alive. I don't get it.

Medium Trust = Dubb, Autumn

Low Trust = MartinD, PackerFanatic (want more from both those guys beyond just D2 vote)

Neutral = Chief Rum, Abe, TheJackal, Poli. Some are based on suspected seer scans, some are based upon guesses to what they are trying to do in the thread.

Moving towards Distrust = Lathum (lack of understanding on role), MommyTorgo (creeps me out, have seen multiple posts that just scream wolf trying to pair people up)

Distrust = Clap, Saldana, Telle

don't trust me despite my being there at deadline last night and sniping for us to net us the sympathizer and prevent any funny-business?

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Is this a "settle the question now" vote or based on something more than that?

If the latter, why do you think that the wolves let you live after your post last night clearly indicated that you had already determined she was your course of action for today after voting for her the last couple of days?

that's actually a good point

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

don't trust me despite my being there at deadline last night and sniping for us to net us the sympathizer and prevent any funny-business?

Why woudln't the wolves also be glad to snipe the Sympathizer. 1. They may not have had any idea he wasn't a plain villager. 2. If they did it still helps them out to knock off a villager count and perhaps garner trust.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Is this a "settle the question now" vote or based on something more than that?

If the latter, why do you think that the wolves let you live after your post last night clearly indicated that you had already determined she was your course of action for today after voting for her the last couple of days?

There are a bunch of people, including me, who have been casting votes at Telle, putting her high on the distrust list, and likely to vote for her again. I don't see why we would assume the wolves wouldn't "let him live" just because he's likely to vote her.

[Autumn]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

So, 14 players left.

I think it might be time to open things up a little bit here, as I'm guessing we have three wolves left, with a brutal and a cunning.

I still don't get why we aren't all assuming there are 4 wolves left. Danny made clear before the game that he needed 21 players to get ALL the roles in, and he added in an extra wolf role obviously with EagleFan's. Shouldn't we therefore be assuming there were 5 wolves? And that the ones remaining are all 4 revealed wolf roles?

[Autumn]

What I'd like to unpack, but won't have time to do until this afternoon, is what went on with other candidates yesterday. I seem to recall clap, hoops and pass all kind of voting at each other and I'm wondering what was going on there.

[Autumn]

I'll be out for a while. I need to look over my distrust list again, we really must nail a wolf today. Telle is on my list but I need to examine a few others.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Autumn

I still don't get why we aren't all assuming there are 4 wolves left. Danny made clear before the game that he needed 21 players to get ALL the roles in, and he added in an extra wolf role obviously with EagleFan's. Shouldn't we therefore be assuming there were 5 wolves? And that the ones remaining are all 4 revealed wolf roles?

I'm fine with assuming 5 wolves + Sympathizer for purposes of worst-case scenarios, but i personally think we started with 4 + Sympathizer because those numbers make more sense to me in a "straight" game. Maybe 5+S was appropriate with everyone having roles, but with the amount people seem hamstrung in talking about their roles I'm not sure just how much of an edge that may be.

I suppose that will make interesting post-game conversation. But for now I'll go with thinking we are 10-4 at this point because it is probably better from a risk management perspective.

[hoopsguy]

The only voting record really worth analyzing from yesterday was Lerriuqs. The villagers were voting for who they thought was a wolf. The wolves were voting for who they thought was a villager.

[Danny]

Pass, your PM box is full

[claphamsa]

Originally Posted by Danny

Pass, your PM box is full

good thing hes dead then huh?

[claphamsa]

I got shit tonight, but I SHOULD be home by 8. Im gonna go ahead and kick off the voting, simply becasue I dont want to forget

vote telle

[Passacaglia]

I cleared some space.

[Danny]

I can chat about the game with the dead fellas

[claphamsa]

no! you might give them info :P

[Passacaglia]

Don't worry clap -- I won't tell him anything I know.

[Lathum]

Well I think we need a couple of candidates otherwise we risk a run on Telle.

Vote Hoopsguy

If I am Lerriqus Hoops is one of my first scans and the vote yesterday came at a time when it looked like he may be trying to save Hoops.

[hoopsguy]

Lathum, I'm not sure that I had any reputation to speak of with Lerriuqs prior to this game. I wouldn't make this argument with the majority of us who have played these games (I know I get scanned a lot) but I think it harder to guess who Lerriuqs would have scanned compared to someone like you.

Also, do you have any reason to think that Telle is more likely to be good than me? I understand the risk of a villager runaway, but right now the vote is 1-0 and you are already looking for backup options.

[Telle]

Actually hoops, there are two votes on me. Poli and clap.

[Abe Sargent]

Agreed that either hoops or telle (or both) look like wolves. Not sure whioch to push though

[hoopsguy]

Well, if you think we are both wolves then it doesn't matter, right? That would be incorrect, but if it represents your viewpoint then it really does not matter what lane you pick.

I can tell you that it is infinitely more likely to be villager/villager (me vs Telle) than wolf/wolf, but that does not hold any water since I'm not in a position of being trusted.

Bottom line, I do not know about Telle but I'm still working with the idea that Clap is certainly a better candidate (barring some meaningful info from Poli) and probably Saldana is as well.

VOTE CLAP

[claphamsa]

I R not wolf!

[Telle]

So what's the case against hoops other than the potential for Lerriuqs to have been trying to save him yesterday? Why was he getting votes yesterday?

[hoopsguy]

Telle, I think it is because we are not catching enough wolves, that I bear a bigger role in that as a guy who posts a fair amount of strategy, and finally that I'm still alive on Day 5.

If I'm missing any points (beyond Lerri trying to "save" me?) I'm sure others will chime in.

[Telle]

Well if that's it then that's not a very convincing argument.

[Lathum]

Unvote Hoops
Vote Saldana


looking back through the votes I think Saldana is a better candidate. Really poor voting record and his attempt at setting me up yesterday. Plus I do think we learn a little about Hoops with a Saldana lynch.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Unvote Hoops
Vote Saldana


looking back through the votes I think Saldana is a better candidate. Really poor voting record and his attempt at setting me up yesterday. Plus I do think we learn a little about Hoops with a Saldana lynch.

What do we learn, exactly?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Abe Sargent

What do we learn, exactly?

Day 3 Hoops cast a vote on Saldana when at the time the vote was still very much in doubt. If Saldana is a wolf I don't think that's a move hoops makes. He could just as easily gone Telle or PB.

[hoopsguy]

Yep, I'm curious on the "linkage" discussion with me and Saldana. If there is anyone that I think makes sense to suggest I've been trying to "save" it would be Telle. I have no idea about either of them, but I think I've posted a lot more stuff suggesting a gentler viewpoint on Telle (not scheming on D1) than I have Saldana (not as bad a player/wolf as his voting record looks).

[Lathum]

I also don't like the way Saldana kept coming at me yesterday. I think it is something he would do as a wolf to create a distraction. He knows I am a target that will fight back and knows I can't say much about my role and will try to twist things to make me look manipulative.

He realizes people are becoming increasingly distrusting about my role, and I see why but I assure you my role will be known when the time comes.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Day 3 Hoops cast a vote on Saldana when at the time the vote was still very much in doubt. If Saldana is a wolf I don't think that's a move hoops makes. He could just as easily gone Telle or PB.

That definitely makes more sense to me than the idea that I would be supporting Saldana.

[Danny]

Lathum, you're up in history draft.

[The Jackal]

FWIW, 5 wolves + sympathizer seems like a lot in a 21 person game. I'd guess we had 4 + sympathizer to start and have 3 wolves left. Either way, we need to make sure we're getting lynches right here.

[hoopsguy]

Just out of curiosity - am I the only one with a seer theory?

To clarify, I've made a couple of different moves in terms of trust/voting based on seer assumptions. Has anyone else been doing this along the way or are people just reacting strictly on their own perceptions of play?

[The Jackal]

I haven't felt strongly enough about anyone being the seer to base votes on it; credit to them, they've hidden themselves well.

[The Jackal]

Been a while since we've heard from CR, eh?

[Telle]

Yeah I don't have any seer theories either.

[claphamsa]

sooner or later the seer has to find SOMETHING. I just hope scanns werent wasted on PB and EF

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I also don't like the way Saldana kept coming at me yesterday. I think it is something he would do as a wolf to create a distraction. He knows I am a target that will fight back and knows I can't say much about my role and will try to twist things to make me look manipulative.

He realizes people are becoming increasingly distrusting about my role, and I see why but I assure you my role will be known when the time comes.

again...you posted links to all the posts i made about you, but what is missing is the time stamps from them...with one exception, they are all from the hour long window otherwise known as my lunch break.

why are you continuing to exaggerate the truth?

1 hour hardly equals "all day" or "kept coming at me"...hoops asked me if i had any theories or analysis, and i gave it to him....your over the top defensiveness is actually more suspicious to me than my own theory was

i doubt i will get any backing with this, but i for one have had my fill of lathum jumping all over people with his "how dare you suspect me" attitude, and his unconfirmed triggered mechanic....i feel like i am playing with blade again.

vote lathum

[hoopsguy]

Saldana, the thing I worry about with Lathum is that we are playing with Fouts back in the day with his "my role will come in soon and it will blow your minds" = wolf.

[The Jackal]

I agree with sal that he's been hyper-defensive, likely because of what he can and can't say. Not sure he's the best target at this point, I think the chance of him being a wolf is less than some of the others.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Saldana, the thing I worry about with Lathum is that we are playing with Fouts back in the day with his "my role will come in soon and it will blow your minds" = wolf.

wasnt it the survivor game where blade kept making up ridiculous powers the whole game that basically scared everyone away from lynching him?

[saldana]

Originally Posted by The Jackal

I agree with sal that he's been hyper-defensive, likely because of what he can and can't say. Not sure he's the best target at this point, I think the chance of him being a wolf is less than some of the others.

but is it really what he can or cant say, or is it what he wants us to believe he can or cant say?

no one else's private role to this point has has required public action that they werent allowed to talk about.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by saldana

but is it really what he can or cant say, or is it what he wants us to believe he can or cant say?

I've thought it more likely he was a villager than wolf most of the game, but the longer he stays alive the higher he shoots up the suspicion charts.

Originally Posted by saldana

no one else's private role to this point has has required public action that they werent allowed to talk about.

That's very true. It seems possible Danny only included one role like that, but yes, he could be lying.

I just think at this point there's a higher probability we hit a wolf on someone else - if Lathum is alive as we near the end of the game and he hasn't used any sort of ability, I'm sure he'll get lynched.

[The Jackal]

Also, the chance that he has a beneficial ability for us is something we can't ignore, as the numbers are getting close and if we don't hit on a wolf today we could be looking at some trouble.