OT: Boston trip - last minute tips?

[sterlingice]

I'll reply to Bishop's post in a second (ok, hours or possibly may have to wait until this weekend) as it's the most detailed and will take some time. But I want to speak to the other points first.

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I'm just going to take all of Bishop's hard work and +1 it. Much easier that way then actually putting in the effort myself. Haha.

Well except Six Flags, which is just another amusement park really.

You absolutely need to hit the North End, if the weather is nice (read: not too windy/cool) you want to hit up the roofdeck of the Legal Seafood's in the Seaport because it's pretty cool, otherwise you can eat inside and get the same view from a couple floors down. It is sort of one of the "trendy" places though, so be aware of that.

Beehive indeed is a great live jazz / good food spot in the South End.

http://www.legalseafoods.com/restaur...gal-harborside
Is this the Legal Seafood you're mentioning?

Bizarro (Six Flags New England) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Yeah, Six Flags New England looks pretty pedestrian, on the whole. However, there's Bizarro. Since it's been built, it and another awesome Intamin coaster (my personal favorite that I've been on: Millennium Force at Cedar Point) have swapped the ranking of #1 steel coaster in the world. If I could just ride this about 5 times, I'd probably be happy. We have season passes so getting in isn't so much but if we're already there and paying for parking, we might as well ride some other rides. Unfortunately, in September, it's only open weekends which means shorter lines but harder scheduling. That explains the "fan out to the west and then swing south before returning to Boston" part of the planning. If I were going to scrap a portion of the trip, this would probably be it but there is a significant draw there for my wife and I, weather permitting.

Also, I think we end up in the North End as part of the Freedom Trail. The Paul Revere House is up there, iirc.

SI

[Ronnie Dobbs3]

Legal Seafood sucks there are at least a hundred better seafood joints in Boston let alone surrounding areas

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs3

Legal Seafood sucks there are at least a hundred better seafood joints in Boston let alone surrounding areas

The food is nothing special (and yes, is somewhat corporate). But the view from Legal Harborside - either up on the bar (preferable because then you can save the food experience for elsewhere), or inside (if the weather isn't great) is pretty nice.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

SI, your itinerary reminds me of the one I put together for Mrs. Bucc and I in 2001 (except for the Cape Cod part). We were scheduled to leave 9/13 but obviously had to cancel. We rescheduled for 2003 but had planned a much better trip because covering so much ground in 7 days would have been way too taxing. What I rearranged was staying more than one day/night at a place to help with the pacing. We flew into Albany and spent most of the day driving across Northern NE to Portland, then up the coast to Camden for a couple days. From there it was to the White Mountains and that was a long drive. By the time we got to Franconia, we were tired. Then was did the ice cream/cheese/syrup thing in Vermont but despite its small size, it can take all day to wind your way down the state. By the end of that day (in Arlington), we were wiped out. The moral of the story is that you want to explore the land like I spent most of my life doing road trips (remember, I collect counties). You have to pace yourself and be able to spend some time to get the sense of a place, even if that means not covering all of the ground you desire. Despite growing up in that region, I had made five more trips back there (including one just for Boston - Freedom Trail/Fenway) just to cover more ground at my pace.

That's the delicate balance: see what you want to see but be able to do it at a pace you're comfortable at. I wholly understand what you are talking about as we had a trip to New York (and then Philly, DC, and Baltimore) a few years ago that was described as "tourist boot camp". I still feel I need to go back to the Met to fully appreciate it. However, since then, I've gotten a lot better about pacing for our trips - pretty much all of our recent trips have been the appropriate speed. Here's some trips we've done recently and what we've seen:

• Fri-Sun (8 tourist days) Arizona this February - over 500 miles of driving, hiking in and out of the Grand Canyon, hitting up 5 other national or state parks, and 3 Spring Training games
• 2 1/2 weeks in Russia last year that I pretty much planned from scratch and we felt that we saw everything we wanted and then some
• Fri-Sun (again, 8 days) covering Detroit, Cedar Point (spontaneously went back for a 2nd day), Pittsburgh, and Cleveland a couple of years ago
• And then a plethora of 3-5 day weekends

We go at a pretty good clip but we run a little late into the evening and sleep in a little. But we also don't like idle time on vacation- we just don't end a day at a hotel at 4 in the afternoon. I try to balance out the early mornings with the early nights and the late nights with the late mornings and that works for us. I also split up driving days. But I haven't really had to do much beyond that other than build in the appropriate amount of "squishy" time - items I can cancel or switch up without minding.

One of the things that I'm pretty set on here is that we are going to visit all 6 states, even if it briefly (CT, RI). There's no telling when (if) we might get back. Also, I think the odds are much greater that I might be back to Boston (business trip, three day weekend, etc) so if I miss something in the city proper, it's not as big of a deal.

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs3

Legal Seafood sucks there are at least a hundred better seafood joints in Boston let alone surrounding areas

Ah, a touchy religious debate (see also: Kansas City BBQ thread). I don't need to know the hundred better but I'll take, say, your top 3 under advisement

SI

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

That's the delicate balance: see what you want to see but be able to do it at a pace you're comfortable at. I wholly understand what you are talking about as we had a trip to New York (and then Philly, DC, and Baltimore) a few years ago that was described as "tourist boot camp". I still feel I need to go back to the Met to fully appreciate it. However, since then, I've gotten a lot better about pacing for our trips - pretty much all of our recent trips have been the appropriate speed. Here's some trips we've done recently and what we've seen:

• Fri-Sun (8 tourist days) Arizona this February - over 500 miles of driving, hiking in and out of the Grand Canyon, hitting up 5 other national or state parks, and 3 Spring Training games
• 2 1/2 weeks in Russia last year that I pretty much planned from scratch and we felt that we saw everything we wanted and then some
• Fri-Sun (again, 8 days) covering Detroit, Cedar Point (spontaneously went back for a 2nd day), Pittsburgh, and Cleveland a couple of years ago
• And then a plethora of 3-5 day weekends

We go at a pretty good clip but we run a little late into the evening and sleep in a little. But we also don't like idle time on vacation- we just don't end a day at a hotel at 4 in the afternoon. I try to balance out the early mornings with the early nights and the late nights with the late mornings and that works for us. I also split up driving days. But I haven't really had to do much beyond that other than build in the appropriate amount of "squishy" time - items I can cancel or switch up without minding.

One of the things that I'm pretty set on here is that we are going to visit all 6 states, even if it briefly (CT, RI). There's no telling when (if) we might get back. Also, I think the odds are much greater that I might be back to Boston (business trip, three day weekend, etc) so if I miss something in the city proper, it's not as big of a deal.

SI

ahhh

life before children

[sterlingice]

Also, on the seafood front or food front, in general (recommendations warmly welcome as food is important to a trip like this but with the caveat that we may get diverted by friends we're visiting to their favorite spots). I'll give some points to something that's "an institution" even if the food is slightly below the absolute less place.

Also, I would not be opposed to a mini FOFC Boston meetup Saturday night (Sept 27) if anyone's interested.

SI

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Bizarro (Six Flags New England) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Yeah, Six Flags New England looks pretty pedestrian, on the whole. However, there's Bizarro. Since it's been built, it and another awesome Intamin coaster (my personal favorite that I've been on: Millennium Force at Cedar Point) have swapped the ranking of #1 steel coaster in the world. If I could just ride this about 5 times, I'd probably be happy. We have season passes so getting in isn't so much but if we're already there and paying for parking, we might as well ride some other rides.

If you are going mainly for Bizarro, make sure to get the fast pass then. I have season passes and go with the kids several times a year, but we almost never go on Bizarro because the lines often are two hour long (or longer). Unless you happen to get to go during a Wednesday morning or such when the park is less busy (but as you mention by the time you come, the park is only doing weekends at that point)

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Lathum

ahhh

life before children

My wife has accused me trying to cram in too much vacation before we have kids. She may be right.

We have the following on the calendar between now and the end of the year: weekend to Dallas, weekend to San Antonio (new nephew's baptism), tagging along with her on a business trip to Memphis, destination wedding of one of my friends in Jamaica, this trip, and a week in Illinois and Iowa visiting family at Christmas.

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Alan T

If you are going mainly for Bizarro, make sure to get the fast pass then. I have season passes and go with the kids several times a year, but we almost never go on Bizarro because the lines often are two hour long (or longer). Unless you happen to get to go during a Wednesday morning or such when the park is less busy (but as you mention by the time you come, the park is only doing weekends at that point)

That's what I'm curious about- how are the lines in September? Particularly for a Sunday? The reading online said they were pretty light but I know that can vary.

Also, I loathe the Flash pass - it's so "undemocratic" (don't wait in lines with the plebes! pay more to avoid it!) I guess I'm not above getting it but it would have to be a pretty significant circumstance

SI

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

That's what I'm curious about- how are the lines in September? Particularly for a Sunday? The reading online said they were pretty light but I know that can vary.

Also, I loathe the Flash pass - it's so "undemocratic" (don't wait in lines with the plebes! pay more to avoid it!) I guess I'm not above getting it but it would have to be a pretty significant circumstance

SI

I don't get the fast pass myself, but was just saying if you want to ride Bizarro five times, you'll be spending a ton of time in lines otherwise.

As for the September crowds, it really depends on the weather to be honest. At that point it is weekends only, and if the weather is chilly or not great, it is pretty easy to get through most rides in the park without many lines. If the weather is beautiful, on weekends we've had huge crowds there at times even into September, or during the fright night weekends in October even.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Also, I would not be opposed to a mini FOFC Boston meetup Saturday night (Sept 27) if anyone's interested.

SI

I'm game!

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Also, I would not be opposed to a mini FOFC Boston meetup Saturday night (Sept 27) if anyone's interested.

SI

Is that the only time you're in Boston? I ask because I would love to make it and I'm not sure if I'll be out there quite yet on the 27th.

[sterlingice]

First, thanks for the great response! I'll try to break these down into small pieces for answers and then build it back into a whole.

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Flipped and added a couple things in here to see how I would do it. What's set in stone? Need to be in Boston Friday night, Tuesday night and Sunday? Echo Logan's question - are you meeting these friends Tuesday during the day on the cape, or back in Boston for the Sox game? You want to be comfortably back in Boston by at least 5pm. Trying to rush anywhere downtown or near Fenway (the Back Bay) is not going to happen between like 4 and 7pm, so just go hang out near Fenway for an hour or so and relax with some food and drinks at one of the many restaurants near there instead of trying to pack too much in.

Actually, I saw what I thought was a reasonable deal on Hotwire for Fri-Sun (26-28) for Lexington so I jumped on it a while back so I have to be back there Friday night (non-refundable hotel). But otherwise, the assumptions are dead on: must be there to fly in Friday/Saturday morning, be there Tuesday night for the game, and Saturday night/Sunday to fly out. Tuesday's the one day that has "hot steaming mess" all over it as there are a number of things that could go wrong and where I think I need to pivot around in my planning. I think I'm going to end up shorting the Cape. I have some tinkering in mind below but I'm also really open to the idea that I don't have a good sense of times and distances.

Is there any reason you actually want to go to Connecticut other than thinking it'd be cool to see "all of New England" in one trip? It would make more sense to combine Springfield with VT and then go east 2nd half of the week, and if you want to see anything in RI (maybe Newport to see all the mansions?) you could just combine that with your cape plans.

As mentioned in one of the aforementioned posts, the motivation is indeed "going to see all 6 New England" states. The only thing that has really jumped out at me for either CT or RI is the Mark Twain House in Hartford. Honestly, I was only half joking about the taking pictures of the "Entering Rhode Island" and "Leaving Rhode Island" signs. We'll probably find a quaint place to eat lunch and that will be our RI experience.

There are always other options for Boston depending on the weather. If bad weather, the Science Museum and its Omni Theater is a great option. Good weather, maybe riding bikes along the Charles, see Harvard/Central Square/MIT/stop by the North End.

Maybe I'm getting confused about what constitutes the North End. Isn't that across the river? I'd like to see the two colleges but, currently, I think those plans will fall by the wayside, something for a potential future visit. I could see us walking down by the Charles if it's a nice day when we're going to Fenway. However there are still a lot of moving parts in that plan.

Up in Maine or possibly western mass, rafting down a river like the Kennebec could be an option if you want something a little more active. Along those lines in NH, climbing a mountain like Mt. Washington is always an option.

I think we'll do the cog railway at Mt. Washington. Weather could make things really interesting there to plan a hike. I wonder if it's possible to hike up and ride back. That would definitely be our speed. It looks possible but, again, weather:
Mount Washington Observatory (MWOBS) – Methods of Ascent - Summer Visits to Mount Washington

They do Sunset Cruises in both Boston and Portland that are really nice - if you're doing a whale watch though, that could pretty much cover it.

Once I get the days and locations locked down, this will be the first thing I figure out as it sounds like a lot of fun to me.

The Northampton/Amherst area is beautiful in the fall, and has a number of great restaurants and little places to stay. Plus that way you could drive back roads to Vermont and see more foliage instead of just taking I-90/91.

I think we'll end up heading north out of boston on 89 to get to Vermont unless I'm mistaken.

I've heard of Concord once or twice - the North Bridge is a must regardless of weather, and Walden Pond (and Thoreau's Cabin) is great if it's good weather. Not sure if something like the Alcott House or the Old Manse would interest y'all. There is another house in Lexington I'm blanking on the name, but it's where Revere spent the night under house arrest after getting caught by the British.

North Bridge is the Minute Man site, right? That was the plan for Lexington. Completely spaced on Walden and that seems like a "must" as well, again, weather permitting.

A few places in Boston I'd try to hit up at night other than Fenway are the North End (not sure if there's a night a festival's going on, but it's always a walking around scene) - I'm sure everyone here has a different favorite restaurant there - you can't go wrong, plus it's right next to Fanueil Hall so you can walk around there after. The Top of the Hub at the Prudential Center for a view of the city (very expensive I think if you get food/sit down, but drinks at the bar are normal priced, and you can look out the windows at the city from there.) Legal Seafood's opened a Seaport location with a great outdoor roofdeck, although you probably want to avoid it after like 9-10pm on Thursday/Fri/Saturday night's (unless that's your scene!) The Beehive (I think) in the South End has some pretty good food and great jazz to go along with it.

Saw the prices on Top of the Hub. If I can convince myself that part of that ticket is for the view, I might do it. That said, I'm having a hard time finding nights in Boston proper that aren't spoken for. Friday night is the plane flight so it's out. Saturday evening might be a travel day. Tuesday night is the game. The next Friday evening will probably be a travel day back. That pretty much leaves the next Saturday night which I've thrown out as a potential FOFC meetup (though I think I'd prefer Friday after looking at the logistics).

Fri Arrive PM
Sat Freedom Trail: USS Constitution side, ideally
Sun Boston- Lexington/Concord, Faneuil Hall side of Freedom Trail
Mon Maybe stop by Newport, RI on way to Cape Cod, MA, stay on Cape Cod
Tue Cape Cod AM, Meet up with friends: TBY @ BOS 7:10p
Wed Springfield - Six Flags if weather good, otherwise basketball HoF. Hit up Northampton/Amherst for the evening.
Thu Vermont (ice cream, cheese, syrup day)
Fri New Hampshire (National Forest/cog ride if weather good, Laconia if bad), drive to Maine (lobster/lighthouses), take a Sunset Cruise in Casco Bay if weather good (will see couple lighthouses including Portland Headlight)
Sat Maine lighthouses along the coast and back to Boston; PM Boston sightseeing?
Sun Boston AM, Fly back PM

What's in Newport, RI?

Here's what I'm currently kicking around. Unfortunately, I can't move things up a day like you had proposed with hotels for Fri/Sat in Lexington.

Fri Arrive PM
Sat Freedom Trail: USS Constitution side, ideally; potential whale watch or potential drive to Springfield (2 hours)
Sun Drive to Springfield (2 hours), Six Flags if weather good/if bad, basketball HOF and Mark Twain House in Hartford (stay there)
Mon Drive to Cape Cod (3 hours from Springfield, less from Boston but swing through CT/RI; +1 hr at Mark Twain House), Cape Cod PM - beach, eat, stay somewhere at Cape Cod
Tue Drive back to Boston AM (2 hours), Faneuil Hall side of Freedom Trail with friends, Red Sox game (TBY/BOS at 7:10)
Wed Late start, drive to Vermont (3 hours): Ice cream, cheese, syrup day
Thu New Hampshire (National Forest/cog ride if weather good, Laconia if bad), drive to Maine, eat lobster, potentially take a Sunset Cruise in Casco Bay if weather good (will see couple lighthouses including Portland Headlight)
Fri Maine lighthouses along the coast and back to Boston; potential whale watch and/or nice dinner
Sat Boston- Thoreau/Walden, Minuteman Park; potential whale watch and/or nice dinner and/or FOFC meetup
Sun Good scenery breakfast AM, Fly back PM

I've pretty much pared down potential items on Monday so that Monday afternoon is locked up as being for Cape Cod (still deciding what to do there) and not deluding myself into thinking Tuesday morning we'll do much there besides grab breakfast. That way we're in Boston and puttering around downtown from late morning until game time. No traffic fuss or mess and we'll be near stuff to see, or at least a subway stop or two from anything.

I know the easy answer is just to cut out Six Flags which gives more time in Boston on Sunday and all of Monday for Cape Cod. The question is basically "which would we rather do: MIT/Harvard/something else in Boston and a few more hours at Cape Cod or Six Flags/Mark Twain House plus the driving to get there and back". As it stands right now, I feel like if the weather is park closing awful, we stay in Boston and do indoor items. If the weather is unseasonably warm and great, we do some little loop that gets us into Connectictut and Rhode Island so that we have visited those two states and then go do things at the beach. If the weather is perfect "meh" - cold and/or cloudy, but not rainy- we head to Six Flags as the crowds will be chased off but we don't care about that and we'll get to do lots of rides over and over again.

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Is that the only time you're in Boston? I ask because I would love to make it and I'm not sure if I'll be out there quite yet on the 27th.

I can't really move that. We have the plane tickets and the car for the 19th-28th. Had those for a while, actually.

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

I'm game!

Looking at our potential schedule, the evening of Friday the 26th would be better but I don't know what anyone's schedule looks like. We'll have a rental car so we can go where we need to but the harder part will be getting together a bunch of people in a larger city where it's convenient to those of you who actually live there

SI

[DaddyTorgo]

North End isn't across the river. North End you can hit sort of "wrapped in" with the Freedom Trail as long as you're not rush-rush-rush from point-to-point. Walk around and see the neighborhood, eat some good food, and you've done it. Actually since they finished the "Big Dig" and everything, the North End is like...1,000 times more accessible to visitors. One could say it's lost a bit of its "hidden away" charm, but I think having it be totally pedestrian-accessible to get there makes up for that in some ways.

It's cool to walk around Harvard and Harvard Square with out-of-towners, and potentially even MIT (never done that).

Unless you're an uber basketball fan you could always "flex" out of that day to do more in the city. But then again part of that is me just thinking that Springfield isn't exactly a "pretty tourist city" as much as it's a "blech"-inducing wasteland in my experiences (few as they may be).

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I can't really move that. We have the plane tickets and the car for the 19th-28th. Had those for a while, actually.



Looking at our potential schedule, the evening of Friday the 26th would be better but I don't know what anyone's schedule looks like. We'll have a rental car so we can go where we need to but the harder part will be getting together a bunch of people in a larger city where it's convenient to those of you who actually live there

SI

Hah - I'm game for either time.

i THINK most of us actually live outside the city-proper to the West (unless I'm forgetting someone like castlerock or something, or did jeff move into the city?). I can't speak for everyone obviously, but meeting up outside the city to the West closer to where you're staying (in Lexington) probably makes even more sense for a number of us I'd imagine.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

What's in Newport, RI?

I'm not huge on the whole tourist thing (as an illustration, many of the things you mention I've never been to despite living here now for 15 years in new England).. but as for Newport, RI my wife really liked the mansion/cliff walk there. It usually has pretty nice scenery and has a historic feel for the area. Some pretty nice older mansions there too if you are in to that sort of thing.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I can't really move that. We have the plane tickets and the car for the 19th-28th. Had those for a while, actually.



Looking at our potential schedule, the evening of Friday the 26th would be better but I don't know what anyone's schedule looks like. We'll have a rental car so we can go where we need to but the harder part will be getting together a bunch of people in a larger city where it's convenient to those of you who actually live there

SI

If it stays on the 27th there's a 60/40 chance I can make it (did some investigating since my first post). If it's on the 26th it's zero since I will either be flying in that night or early on the 27th.

[Castlerock]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Unless you're an uber basketball fan you could always "flex" out of that day to do more in the city. But then again part of that is me just thinking that Springfield isn't exactly a "pretty tourist city" as much as it's a "blech"-inducing wasteland in my experiences (few as they may be).

Just say it: Springfield is a dump.

[Castlerock]

If you do climb Mt Washington, be prepared for VERY different weather on the summit. I have climbed it in July when it was 80-something degrees and sunny at the base and the summit was 33 degrees, pouring rain and 100+ mph winds.

Those are conditions ripe for hypothermia if you are not dressed appropriately.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Castlerock

If you do climb Mt Washington, be prepared for VERY different weather on the summit. I have climbed it in July when it was 80-something degrees and sunny at the base and the summit was 33 degrees, pouring rain and 100+ mph winds.

Those are conditions ripe for hypothermia if you are not dressed appropriately.

It sounds like it's about a 4 mile hike using the most common trail. Any idea what elevation that starts at? We made the 10 mile hike up from the Grand Canyon from in about 6 hours but that was in great weather.

I'll put both options in front of my wife but unless things have gone really well, we'll probably just take the train instead of hike.

SI

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Castlerock

Just say it: Springfield is a dump.

I was trying to be politically correct.

But yes...Springfield is a dump.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

It sounds like it's about a 4 mile hike using the most common trail. Any idea what elevation that starts at? We made the 10 mile hike up from the Grand Canyon from in about 6 hours but that was in great weather.

I'll put both options in front of my wife but unless things have gone really well, we'll probably just take the train instead of hike.

SI

Yes, the most common route is a little more than 4 miles up and the same back down. Because of the last half of the climb up, the steeper elevation usually requires about 3 hours - 4 hours up and about 2 1/2 - 3 hours down. That path is an elevation gain of around 4000 ft so it starts somewhere around 2000 ft of elevation and ends a bit more than 6000 ft or somewhere around that.

There are some slightly less steep trails, but they are longer to make the elevation less. So even though you go about a mile further, the round trip time is roughly the same depending on your conditioning.

As for the weather.. I've actually never heard of it not being somewhat cold at the top, even during the summer.

[Buccaneer]

Or windy

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

North End isn't across the river. North End you can hit sort of "wrapped in" with the Freedom Trail as long as you're not rush-rush-rush from point-to-point. Walk around and see the neighborhood, eat some good food, and you've done it. Actually since they finished the "Big Dig" and everything, the North End is like...1,000 times more accessible to visitors. One could say it's lost a bit of its "hidden away" charm, but I think having it be totally pedestrian-accessible to get there makes up for that in some ways.

It's cool to walk around Harvard and Harvard Square with out-of-towners, and potentially even MIT (never done that).

Unless you're an uber basketball fan you could always "flex" out of that day to do more in the city. But then again part of that is me just thinking that Springfield isn't exactly a "pretty tourist city" as much as it's a "blech"-inducing wasteland in my experiences (few as they may be).

Unless you've got the basketball hall of fame on your bucket list, there's no compelling reason to visit western mass and a lot of compelling reasons not to. You can easily fill a week in Boston with things to do.

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Unless you've got the basketball hall of fame on your bucket list, there's no compelling reason to visit western mass and a lot of compelling reasons not to. You can easily fill a week in Boston with things to do.

That's a very PC way to put it.

Unless you want to go out to like the Berkshires or something. But out there you're just getting the same sort of "nature" vibe as NH/VT.

[Alan T]

I heard Sturbridge Village is kind of neat on the way out to Springfield....


Of course, I've never been there and I've lived here 15 years now. (including 3 of those years 4 minutes away from it)

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Castlerock

Just say it: Springfield is a dump.

Oh, come on, it's not Holyoke or Lynn! I'd say it's like Lowell - large parts of it aren't great (although that's still true even in Boston - Boston just does a better job segregating the bad neighborhoods and driving those people to the southwest where no tourist or even suburban visitor would ever go), but a decent downtown revitalization where you can go for a night out without feeling unsafe.

Originally Posted by Desnudo

Unless you've got the basketball hall of fame on your bucket list, there's no compelling reason to visit western mass and a lot of compelling reasons not to. You can easily fill a week in Boston with things to do.

I know the area better than most because of the time I spent at UMass, but I think Alan T hit it - if you're already going to be in Western Mass or Vermont, the Pio Valley and specifically Amherst and Noho are great places for the "fall in New England" vibe, and have a lot of good restaurants and some historical stuff. You'd still have to hit up Vermont for your maple syrup and covered bridges, but I don't know that state past a couple of the ski areas.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Ah, a touchy religious debate (see also: Kansas City BBQ thread). I don't need to know the hundred better but I'll take, say, your top 3 under advisement

Not really. I'd put Legal Seafood well above the Long John Silver's of the world, but it's still a chain. I don't think anyone would claim it as a top seafood spot, but it's pretty good, reasonably priced and has that great ambiance/view. But hey, I don't eat seafood, so I'd look to others for seafood recommendations - I'm not sure there's really one standout I've heard of actually in Boston; most of those people swear by seem to be South Shore, on the Cape or in RI.

Originally Posted by sterlingice

As mentioned in one of the aforementioned posts, the motivation is indeed "going to see all 6 New England" states. The only thing that has really jumped out at me for either CT or RI is the Mark Twain House in Hartford. Honestly, I was only half joking about the taking pictures of the "Entering Rhode Island" and "Leaving Rhode Island" signs. We'll probably find a quaint place to eat lunch and that will be our RI experience.

What's in Newport, RI?

It's the cliff/mansion walk, and I'm sure they have a bunch of outdoor food spots that would be appealing. If you do Western Mass through to the Cape, it's right in the middle and breaks it up to give you no more than like 120 minutes driving at once. (And it's only about 5 minutes extra if you want to go through CT and Hartford on the way. I-90/the Mass Pike is pretty much required when driving from Boston-Springfield, but I'd skip it unless you're doing that exact route; it's not very scenic.)

I've never been to the Mark Twain house in CT. I've got nothing against Connecticut - it's always perfectly pleasant to be in, but other than checking off the state on a map if you're trying to do all 50 I don't see any reason to go to it.

Maybe I'm getting confused about what constitutes the North End. Isn't that across the river? I'd like to see the two colleges but, currently, I think those plans will fall by the wayside, something for a potential future visit. I could see us walking down by the Charles if it's a nice day when we're going to Fenway. However there are still a lot of moving parts in that plan.

The North End is right next to Fanueil Hall and City Hall Plaza at what I assume is one end of the Freedom Trail (The Old North Church is in the North End). I guess it can be fun to walk around at (it's a very small area) if they've got a festival going on or you want to play some bocce, but the real draw is the food. Both Italian restaurants and the Pastry shops are top-notch. That's probably like KC BBQ - all the "connoisseurs" will profess to have a favorite, I've found anyone I try to be really good.

I think we'll end up heading north out of boston on 89 to get to Vermont unless I'm mistaken.

It depends on where in Vermont you're going. Anywhere from Hanover, NH (Dartmouth College, right on the NH/VT line) north, 89's your best bet, anywhere in southern VT, Rt. 2 to either I-91 if you want to keep it simple or 2 to 140 etc if you have a GPS and want the scenic route.

North Bridge is the Minute Man site, right? That was the plan for Lexington. Completely spaced on Walden and that seems like a "must" as well, again, weather permitting.

The North Bridge is officially Minute Man National Park, and is where the British were defeated (the British fired on colonial's first in Lexington, but those farmer's just ran and scattered. The actual fighting back happened in Concord, and then during the whole retreat back to Boston.) But they've got more than one thing called Minute Man something around here. Concord does do some 2-hour guided tours, and has a good list of the possible historical destinations - if you see which ones appeal to you, I can let you know which are walkable, which you need a car to get between, and if it's worth going on a guided tour or just doing it yourselves. Biking is another option. I'd say Minute Man park, Walden Pond (weather permitting), the Lexington Town Green, the Minute Man Visitor Center and maybe Hartwell Tavern are the 4 places I'd definitely try to hit up.

Saw the prices on Top of the Hub. If I can convince myself that part of that ticket is for the view, I might do it. That said, I'm having a hard time finding nights in Boston proper that aren't spoken for. Friday night is the plane flight so it's out. Saturday evening might be a travel day. Tuesday night is the game. The next Friday evening will probably be a travel day back. That pretty much leaves the next Saturday night which I've thrown out as a potential FOFC meetup (though I think I'd prefer Friday after looking at the logistics).

There is no need to look at prices or set aside a whole night for Top of the Hub. Don't do dinner there, just do like an hour at the bar and have a drink or two (which are normally priced - well, Boston normal which is probably a little higher than KC prices) - you can wander around and look out the windows while there, and it won't cost you more than $25-$30 combined. Depending on where your hotel is, you could easily do it after flying in or after the Red Sox game (Fenway is 1/2 mile walk away.) I'd think it would be a perfect relaxing nightcap for a busy day that's been filled with travel or walking around.

Here's what I'm currently kicking around. Unfortunately, I can't move things up a day like you had proposed with hotels for Fri/Sat in Lexington.

Fri Arrive PM
Sat Freedom Trail: USS Constitution side, ideally; potential whale watch or potential drive to Springfield (2 hours)
Sun Drive to Springfield (2 hours), Six Flags if weather good/if bad, basketball HOF and Mark Twain House in Hartford (stay there)
Mon Drive to Cape Cod (3 hours from Springfield, less from Boston but swing through CT/RI; +1 hr at Mark Twain House), Cape Cod PM - beach, eat, stay somewhere at Cape Cod
Tue Drive back to Boston AM (2 hours), Faneuil Hall side of Freedom Trail with friends, Red Sox game (TBY/BOS at 7:10)
Wed Late start, drive to Vermont (3 hours): Ice cream, cheese, syrup day
Thu New Hampshire (National Forest/cog ride if weather good, Laconia if bad), drive to Maine, eat lobster, potentially take a Sunset Cruise in Casco Bay if weather good (will see couple lighthouses including Portland Headlight)
Fri Maine lighthouses along the coast and back to Boston; potential whale watch and/or nice dinner
Sat Boston- Thoreau/Walden, Minuteman Park; potential whale watch and/or nice dinner and/or FOFC meetup
Sun Good scenery breakfast AM, Fly back PM

Looks pretty legit. The only thing I'd say is figure out where you going in VT and on the Cape because you might have to adjust the driving time - they don't look big compared to a Kansas or Texas, but the Cape can take an hour to drive all the way from the bridge to places near the end like Provincetown, and how to get to VT depends on where in the state you'll be.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

I-90/the Mass Pike is pretty much required when driving from Boston-Springfield, but I'd skip it unless you're doing that exact route; it's not very scenic.)

What do you mean not very scenic? It goes right past my house. I would think that would be a must visit on any FOFC trip!

[corbes]

Let me know if you need any input for Vermont day. Not sure where you are planning on going but this is my neck of the woods.

On your Tuesday drive from the Cape to Boston I recommend veering north off of Route 3 to World's End in Hingham for a leisurely pastoral walk with the misses with great coastline views of Boston Harbor.

[Desnudo]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Oh, come on, it's not Holyoke or Lynn! I'd say it's like Lowell - large parts of it aren't great (although that's still true even in Boston - Boston just does a better job segregating the bad neighborhoods and driving those people to the southwest where no tourist or even suburban visitor would ever go), but a decent downtown revitalization where you can go for a night out without feeling unsafe.I know the area better than most because of the time I spent at UMass, but I think Alan T hit it - if you're already going to be in Western Mass or Vermont, the Pio Valley and specifically Amherst and Noho are great places for the "fall in New England" vibe, and have a lot of good restaurants and some historical stuff.

I graduated from UMASS. There's nothing exceptional there except a lot of smelly hippies and the realization that New England has banjo players too. Really no reason to intentionally go there.

[Ronnie Dobbs3]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Ah, a touchy religious debate (see also: Kansas City BBQ thread). I don't need to know the hundred better but I'll take, say, your top 3 under advisement

SI

The No-Name for fried cheaper stuff (http://www.nonamerestaurant.com though I haven't been in years)

Neptune Oyster if you want to spend some money (http://www.neptuneoyster.com)

East Coast Grill (In Somerville/Cambridge, famous for "Hell Night" Sep. 30 - Oct 1 (reservations mandatory), a midrange optionhttp://eastcoastgrill.net)

[Autumn]

East Coast Grill is fantastic.

[Autumn]

The days of driving up to VT, to NH, and then to ME might be really tight, depending on where exactly you're heading. Map those out well--outside of the one or two big highways, there are not fast roads at all, so it's very possible for a trip to take twice as long as you think it should if you stray from them.

[Barkeep49]

So is there any momentum towards the FOFC get together? If so will it be on the 27th? I am going to have to book travel next week and will align my dates on the front end (rather than the back) if this is occurring.

[DaddyTorgo]

I'm down for a meetup on the 27th or whenever else.

Anybody else???

[sterlingice]

I'm having some scheduling at work get a little in the way right now- I'll know next week if there are any issues where I have to change anything but, if not, I'm up for doing something the evening of the 27th.

SI

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I'm having some scheduling at work get a little in the way right now- I'll know next week if there are any issues where I have to change anything but, if not, I'm up for doing something the evening of the 27th.

SI

Well that's done an over with- they're taking much too long at work to decide on what a training class is going to be and now it won't even be until September 12th that it will be paid for so the odds of it happening the next 2 weeks after that are slim to none

So? September 27th evening meetup at somewhere on the west side of Boston? Should I make a separate thread?

SI

[DaddyTorgo]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Well that's done an over with- they're taking much too long at work to decide on what a training class is going to be and now it won't even be until September 12th that it will be paid for so the odds of it happening the next 2 weeks after that are slim to none

So? September 27th evening meetup at somewhere on the west side of Boston? Should I make a separate thread?

SI

Sounds good. Sure - throw a separate thread up. I'm game.

[Galaxy]

Originally Posted by Castlerock

Just say it: Springfield is a dump.

Even the Simpsons won't live there.

[sterlingice]

Ok, here's a thread about the September 27th meetup. Looking for suggestions for where to go and RSVP:

FOFC Meetup in Boston: September 27th PM - Planning and RSVP thread - Front Office Football Central

SI

[sterlingice]

So here's the quick trip rundown now that we're back

Fri Arrive PM
I liked JetBlue - cheap, good entertainment options, free food, and a good flight attendant. Only got lost once on way to hotel. This would happen. A lot. I think this is the hardest city to drive in I've been to in the US- drivers seem fine but, well, it's roads are set up for horses not cars.
Sat Freedom Trail: USS Constitution side, ideally; potential whale watch or potential drive to Springfield (2 hours)
We did a bit of an audible here. First, we met a former coworker of my wife and a friend at Top of the Hub for brunch after wandering around Boston Common, waiting for them to open. The friend we were meeting with on Tuesday is ex-Navy and wanted to visit the USS Constitution so instead we did one of the guided tours of the other side of the Freedom Trail, starting at Boston Common through Fanueil Hall. We walked through the rest of it before meeting back up with the former coworker and a different friend, got Italian in the North End, going to a pastry place, and visiting the friend's sister who lives in the North End and hanging out with them.
Sun Drive to Springfield (2 hours), Six Flags if weather good/if bad, basketball HOF and Mark Twain House in Hartford (stay there)
Drove to Springfield in the morning since Six Flags opens at noon on Sunday. Rain was threatening early in the day and Big E, Sunday, and time of year kept crowds to a minimum. Rode Bizarro 11 times including front row to start and end the day (best non-Millennium Force coaster I've ridden, I think), rode everything else we wanted to in the park a couple of times- all worked well and the weather cooperated. They also had the Halloween stuff set up so zombies and demons were chasing you through the park, they had the greatest silly teacups ride ever (with industrial music and strobe lights), and then the fog rolled in and it was great to ride Bizarro going in and out of clouds.
Mon Drive to Cape Cod (3 hours from Springfield, less from Boston but swing through CT/RI; +1 hr at Mark Twain House), Cape Cod PM - beach, eat, stay somewhere at Cape Cod
We took the tour at the Mark Twain House in Hartford and The Breakers in Newport. We walked for about a half mile on the trail behind the mansions but we didn't think you could really see much from there so we went on our way. As somewhat expected, we shorted Cape Cod so everything else fit. Talking to one of the Bostonians on Saturday, I started to feel like I got more of a sense of what Cape Cod was and why it's significant to locals but just wasn't going to mean much for us. She said that to her it was a place to go and reset your clock and just get away from the pace of Boston- we were already doing that since we were on vacation.
Tue Drive back to Boston AM (2 hours), Faneuil Hall side of Freedom Trail with friends, Red Sox game (TBY/BOS at 7:10)
We stayed in Chatham and enjoyed the little motel there, then we went down by the harbor and watched the fishing boats come in with seals chasing them, seagulls hunting crabs, and cormorants going after the giant schools of tiny fish. We headed back to Boston, met up with a friend and his family for the USS Constitution, ate at Jerry Remy's, and then went to a Red Sox game.
Wed Late start, drive to Vermont (3 hours): Ice cream, cheese, syrup day
Cabot creamery was not making cheese that day so we instead substituted Lake Champlain chocolates. This made the day a bit longer as Burlington is another half hour past Waterbury. Still, we visited chocolate, ice cream, and syrup- went on tours at all 3, and got a good sugar buzz along with injecting about $500 into the Vermont economy, mostly for Christmas presents but also for personal use. Stayed at a B&B just across the border in New Hampshire.
Thu New Hampshire (National Forest/cog ride if weather good, Laconia if bad), drive to Maine, eat lobster, potentially take a Sunset Cruise in Casco Bay if weather good (will see couple lighthouses including Portland Headlight)
Hiked Mount Washington as we had great weather: high of about 50 at the top and partly cloudy- got to watch some of those clouds pass below us. The trail that we took was the Amonoosac(sp?) because it's on the same side as the Cog Railway. That was a bit of a rough climb as the trails are quite rocky and there are a lot of times when you're just walking on slanted rock faces. Took us about 5 hours, an hour longer than expected, but we were able to buy cog railway tickets and took the train back down. Drove to Maine, ate lobster at the Portland Lobster Co- which seemed like the correct level of touristy for what we wanted.
Fri Maine lighthouses along the coast and back to Boston; potential whale watch and/or nice dinner
The couple of lighthouses we saw had a bit more traffic getting to them than expected and my wife fell going towards one of them so we weren't moving too quickly. I might not have always observed posted speeds heading to Gloucester, perhaps by a wider margin than I am comfortable. But we made it with 10 minutes to spare, which was great as the whale watch was great. We were on the boat about 4 1/2 hours, saw a humpback and calf and then as we were leaving, saw another really large humpback. Ate a nice dinner in Gloucester before going to Boston.
Sat Boston- Thoreau/Walden, Minuteman Park; potential whale watch and/or nice dinner and/or FOFC meetup
This day I botched a bit. The first audible was good- went to Sam Adams brewery for tour at 10. I think I prefer nighttime brewery tours but they don't offer one. This was fun and the only bummer is that they don't really sell beer in the gift shop so I couldn't get my final Christmas shopping done. The second audible was awful- Harvard just wasn't worth the time it took to get there. We took the T there and back and it was basically 3 hours of time to see maybe an hour of a pretty college campus, but, well, a college campus nonetheless. Maybe we should have done a tour (my wife just wanted to go). Really, we just shouldn't have gone. We scratched Walden off the list, but it didn't sound like there was all that much there. But the problem was that it caused us to really short Minuteman NHS. That's a shame since the intro presentation at the visitor's center was good, the conversation we had with the historical interpreters at the tavern was really good, and the North Bridge is, of course, a huge part of hour history. However, we missed some of the ranger presentations I would have really enjoyed. That said, the night ended on a great note: meeting DT (but none of the rest of you slackers) for dinner and hanging out with him for at least 2 hours. He can now attest to what some of the others on the board like PM and tk can attest to: I might be a bit of a talker (the verbose posts are, well, just an extension of how I am in real life).
Sun Good scenery breakfast AM, Fly back PM
Just had breakfast and headed out. Was fearing for getting lost in city again.

Overall, except for Cape Cod and maybe another hour in Maine, I think we did all the surrounding states justice. Boston, we knew we were shorting but I suspect we'll be back. I really enjoyed the city except for the navigation and there is certainly more than enough to see on the next visit, I know it would start with the JFK library, Fine Arts museum, Boston Pops, and some more time at Minuteman NHS.

SI

[Blackadar]

Sounds fun!

[Buccaneer]

Your trip brings back a lot of memories. Glad you saw a fair bit of New England.