The Trump Presidency – 2016

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Kodos

I wouldn't give us great odds of making it out of this century.

We need the baby boomers and depression era folks to die off.

It sounds harsh, but they are the biggest group that support the lunacy. My 88 year old dad the other day was claiming global warming isn't real, and every 11,000 years the planet goes through this cycle.

He actually believes this shit, and as long as his retirement account grows he doesn't give 2 shits about the planet, the wall, or the perversion of the constitution.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Kodos

I wouldn't give us great odds of making it out of this century.

And we've got a backup plan in case climate change doesn't do the job, we'll just kill all the insects and make it impossible to grow food.

[Thomkal]

Trump's pick to replace Nikki Haley as UN Ambassdor withdraws her nomination:


https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/16/polit...dor/index.html

[Brian Swartz]

I think we overvalue our own intelligence compared to other generations. Guarantee our children, grandchildren, etc. will be saying the same exact stuff about us, in a 'how the heck do you believe that crap/you embarrass me to my core/etc. type of way'. It's just the way things are.

I don't see humanity destroying itself, but I think we're in for some massive upheavals. Thing is, at a certain point people will want their leaders to do whatever is necessary to 'fix' the problems, at which point I think we'll end up back in a more autocratic arrangement for much of the world and quite possibly a one-world government. The end of the species? Nah, but I think the planet will look as unrecognizable to us as we would to those who lived in the 19th century 100 years from now. Perhaps even moreso.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

I think we overvalue our own intelligence compared to other generations. Guarantee our children, grandchildren, etc. will be saying the same exact stuff about us, in a 'how the heck do you believe that crap/you embarrass me to my core/etc. type of way'. It's just the way things are.

If you've ever raised teenagers, you know this future is now.

[Thomkal]

So Roger Stone, with a partial gag order in place thanks to a judge trying to meet him halfway on First Amendment rights, has now apparently posted a picture of the judge on instagram with a crosshair above her head. Hope he now finds himself in jail where he belongs

[miked]

Meanwhile, actual election fraud (and no, it's not Mexicans voting)...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/18/polit...ing/index.html

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

I hope that SCOTUS stops it as well, but there is definitely more than a zero % chance that SCOTUS takes the President's side on this, especially with a more expanded view of executive power on the bench. Interestingly this may be another case where CJ Roberts has to stop the insanity leading to people on the right calling him Satan.

I also think the chance goes down to 0% if they don't hear it next summer & Trump isn't President in 2021. Conservative justices aren't going to approve that expanded view if the sitting President isn't interested in using that wall money and could use it for progressive causes.

Also, idk why people are latching on to climate change as the Boogeyman when it seems obvious gun control is the one conservatives should be scared about. It's not like there's even a way for the US to reverse climate change, let alone a politically palatable one, while there are obvious anti gun owner measures that would be supported by ~50% or more of the electorate. (And while the judiciary might not care about giving the executive branch more power vs the legislative, I think they'll be less enthusiastic to permanently give up judiciary power to the executive.)

[bronconick]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

So Roger Stone, with a partial gag order in place thanks to a judge trying to meet him halfway on First Amendment rights, has now apparently posted a picture of the judge on instagram with a crosshair above her head. Hope he now finds himself in jail where he belongs

He must assume that he's getting a pardon.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by bronconick

He must assume that he's getting a pardon.

I just assume he's insane and doesn't care what happens

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by miked

Meanwhile, actual election fraud (and no, it's not Mexicans voting)...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/18/polit...ing/index.html

They got to the main person they wanted to talk to, who was subpoenaed to appear, as were the other witnesses, Want him to testify voluntarily like the others did. He wants immunity from prosecution if he testifies. He refuses to testify and that will reflect negatively on him in terms of the board's decision. He is dismissed and will not testify. And day 1 of the hearing is over.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

They got to the main person they wanted to talk to, who was subpoenaed to appear, as were the other witnesses, Want him to testify voluntarily like the others did. He wants immunity from prosecution if he testifies. He refuses to testify and that will reflect negatively on him in terms of the board's decision. He is dismissed and will not testify. And day 1 of the hearing is over.

Yes, it's obvious Dowless was doing illegal things. Was it enough to affect the margin of victory idk, but either way it's enough for a new election (and the question then becomes whether you run the primary back too.) How much Harris knew is up for debate (my impression of him is that he's a political neophyte, while Pettinger was the one smart enough to understand just how shady Dowless was and stay away after past experiences), but no surprise Dowless is holding out for immunity.

I'd like McCready the most of the three candidates, but at a certain point I'd just really like if Charlotte had a representative for most of this 2 year cycle.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

Yes, it's obvious Dowless was doing illegal things. Was it enough to affect the margin of victory idk, but either way it's enough for a new election (and the question then becomes whether you run the primary back too.) How much Harris knew is up for debate (my impression of him is that he's a political neophyte, while Pettinger was the one smart enough to understand just how shady Dowless was and stay away after past experiences), but no surprise Dowless is holding out for immunity.

I'd like McCready the most of the three candidates, but at a certain point I'd just really like if Charlotte had a representative for most of this 2 year cycle.

Even if they get Dowless to testify, I'm not sure we will ever know how many ballots were tampered with. To me that means new election. The only question is if Harris knew what was going on and approved it. If he did, R's nominate someone else to run in his place. Dowless needs to go to jail for what he's done too.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

So Roger Stone, with a partial gag order in place thanks to a judge trying to meet him halfway on First Amendment rights, has now apparently posted a picture of the judge on instagram with a crosshair above her head. Hope he now finds himself in jail where he belongs

Roger Stone realizing what an idiot he has been, formally apologizes in court and says it was improper and should not have been posted.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Even if they get Dowless to testify, I'm not sure we will ever know how many ballots were tampered with. To me that means new election. The only question is if Harris knew what was going on and approved it. If he did, R's nominate someone else to run in his place. Dowless needs to go to jail for what he's done too.

Pettinger & Harris are basically the same in policy terms, so the R's would rather just nominate Pettinger who isn't tainted by association and get it over with. D's would rather McCready run against Harris than Pettinger, so that's part of what's taking so long.

[NobodyHere]

I was under the impression that the Rs can not redo their nomination since the results have been certified or something like that.

[RendeR]

So, how many of you are on meds to retain your sanity so far?

[Scoobz0202]

Bernie Sanders announces he is running again.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Scoobz0202

Bernie Sanders announces he is running again.

2020 can't get here soon enough. Win or Lose for Trump, the next election will say a lot about America

Watched snippets of his announcement - at 77 he speaks and presents himself pretty well.

[Marc Vaughan]

Originally Posted by Scoobz0202

Bernie Sanders announces he is running again.

Really disappointed by this - I love his policies but he's far too old to run imho and I can see this as an easy 'in' for disrupting the Democrat vote (again) through the 'why wasn't he the candidate' when he predictably fails to get nominated ...

[Thomkal]

at 77 being the key words there-just can't vote for someone that old-especially after seeing the 71? year old Trump in action these past two years.

[Thomkal]

Have you heard about the comic "Non Sequitir" by Wiley Miller? Seems a few days ago he scribbled a message to Trump in the corner of his comic, and its now costing him being published in a lot of newspapers.


Newspaper Cuts Ties With Comic After Discovering 'Go F**k Yourself' To Trump | HuffPost

[Noop]

Originally Posted by Scoobz0202

Bernie Sanders announces he is running again.

I see Russian's favorite Democrat is back for more.

[ISiddiqui]

Sherrod Brown at 66 is going to seem like a child when he announces he's running .

[Thomkal]

So the judge Roger Stone posted the picture of wants him to appear in court Thursday afternoon to explain his actions...

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Noop

I see Russian's favorite Democrat is back for more.

Sanders can't possibly be higher than #2. Tulsi Gabbard is the one and true Queen.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by Marc Vaughan

Really disappointed by this - I love his policies but he's far too old to run imho and I can see this as an easy 'in' for disrupting the Democrat vote (again) through the 'why wasn't he the candidate' when he predictably fails to get nominated ...

The Boomers will not quietly let go of their power, but it's time we moved on from them.

[PilotMan]

The Post has a bit today about Trump appointees promoting nuclear sales to the Saudis over the protestations of WH lawyers, and the head of the NSC, citing conflict of interest, national security and legal issues. Apparently this was still in discussion in the Oval Office as recently as last week.



Good to see the WH is still looking at punishing the Saudi's for the assassination in the Turkey.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

The Post has a bit today about Trump appointees promoting nuclear sales to the Saudis over the protestations of WH lawyers, and the head of the NSC, citing conflict of interest, national security and legal issues. Apparently this was still in discussion in the Oval Office as recently as last week.



Good to see the WH is still looking at punishing the Saudi's for the assassination in the Turkey.

It's this administration's uranium 1 scandal except it appears to be a legit scandal.

35% of the country still believes all of this is fake news without stopping to think that maybe 1 of the hundreds of scandals coming from this administration might be true.

I'm fairly certain if Trump just came out and admitted everything was true and resigned his supporters would just say the Deep State finally got to him.

[JPhillips]

And that fucks with non-proliferation, so there's some speculation that Flynn sent Eric Prince to the Seychelles meeting with the Saudis and the Russians to work out a deal everyone could agree to.

[Julio Riddols]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I'm fairly certain if Trump just came out and admitted everything was true and resigned his supporters would just say the Deep State finally got to him.

The Trump voters list has got to be the holy grail for phone scammers right now.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Julio Riddols

The Trump voters list has got to be the holy grail for phone scammers right now.

My MIL would watch FOX news 24/7 if I didn't make her turn it off when my kids are around. The commercials they run make it so blatantly obvious who the target audience is for Trump supporters.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by Marc Vaughan

Really disappointed by this - I love his policies but he's far too old to run imho and I can see this as an easy 'in' for disrupting the Democrat vote (again) through the 'why wasn't he the candidate' when he predictably fails to get nominated ...

The super delegates screwed up the dem vote last time. As an example, Bernie won all 55 counties in WV, yet somehow HRC pulled more delegates.

Watching the Dems will be interesting. I wonder who the choose as the heir apparent.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by tarcone

The super delegates screwed up the dem vote last time. As an example, Bernie won all 55 counties in WV, yet somehow HRC pulled more delegates.

Watching the Dems will be interesting. I wonder who the choose as the heir apparent.

I'm not sure that means anything. The eight unpledged delegates voted for Clinton at the convention, but by that point Clinton had well more pledged delegates than Bernie. Around 85% of the unpledged delegates went to Clinton, but the only way Bernie could have won is if almost all of those had voted for him, the loser of the pledged delegates.

As Sean Spicer would say, Hillary won because she had the most pledged delegates, period.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I'm not sure that means anything. The eight unpledged delegates voted for Clinton at the convention, but by that point Clinton had well more pledged delegates than Bernie. Around 85% of the unpledged delegates went to Clinton, but the only way Bernie could have won is if almost all of those had voted for him, the loser of the pledged delegates.

As Sean Spicer would say, Hillary won because she had the most pledged delegates, period.

Yes, that is true. But was it really what the people wanted? Bernie "ewon" a lot of states that turned around and handed HRC their delegates.

The unpledged is the problem isnt it? Isnt it like the Dems hating the electoral college after HRC lost? She got more fot he popular vote, yet lost. Bernie ran into the same thing on a smaller scale.

[molson]

I can understand the intent of any Dem primary structure intended to favor actual members of the party they're determining their nomination for.

Though apparently this year to run (as part of the compromise of scaling down the power of the super-democrats), Bernie will have to at least file an intent to join the party.

[tarcone]

Originally Posted by molson

I can understand the intent of any Dem primary structure intended to favor actual members of the party they're determining their nomination for.

Though apparently this year to run (as part of the compromise of scaling down the power of the super-democrats), Bernie will have to at least file an intent to join the party.

Yeah, makes sense. But when do the people matter? The power wanted HRC, the people, Bernie. Or so it seemed. I think that turned off a lot of dem voters in the presidential election. Like those WV dems.

[albionmoonlight]

I'm in the minority here, but I think that parties are private entities that should have pretty much unlimited control over their nominees. I don't think that it is "unfair" that party nominations are not just elections, but instead are a combination of primaries, party boss influence, etc.

General elections should be free and fair. But the party nominees are a different story.

The incentive to want to put up electable candidates provides enough incentive for the parties to try and put up good candidates.

[tarcone]

I would rather go towards a true democracy and elect the people with the highest vote totals.

[larrymcg421]

Yeah, we've been over this a million times.

Hillary won more contests (34 of 57), won the biggest contests (CA, NY, FL, OH, TX), and won more of the popular vote (55.2%). The superdelegates were not a factor.

[molson]

I mean there's the truth, but also the voice of the legions of BernieBros who still say they were screwed. Both are relevant and impact the political landscape. Truth is maybe less important than it's ever been.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by molson

Truth is maybe less important than it's ever been.

That's insightful, because truth is so spinnable in this context. There are lots of different metrics through which one can view a contest, so any group can feel that their guy should have won.

"We got more votes"
"We got more delegates"
"We won the swing states"
"We won the most caucuses"
"The other candidate ran up the score in the caucuses"
"We won the most primaries"
"We won the most votes after [news event X] happened"
"More voters in exit polls said that our candidate was the most electable in a general election"
"We won all the big states"
"The other candidate ran up the score in the big states"
"Our candidate got the most cross-over votes in open primaries, making them the best general election candidate."
"Our candidate did best in closed primaries, so they are the best candidate for motivating the base in a general election."

[larrymcg421]

Well on the basis of the argument that we're having (that superdelegates decided the election for Hillary in spite of popular support for Bernie), it's not spinnable.

Hillary won the most votes. Hillary had the most pledged delegates. She would've won if there were no superdelegates at all. That is a fact and not a spinnable argument. In fact, the only way Bernie could've won is if the superdelegates did for him what his supporters erroneously claimed the superdelegates did for Hillary.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by molson

but also the voice of the legions of BernieBros who still say they were screwed.

At some point, rationally, you have to start discounting the rantings of people who are that far gone.

[JPhillips]

With all the heat around the superdelegates before the convention, I'm pretty sure if Bernie was leading in pledged delegates most of them would have supported him.

[cuervo72]

I mean, what the fuck.

Donald J. Trump on Twitter: "The New York Times reporting is false. They are a true ENEMY OF THE PEOPLE!"

[I. J. Reilly]

Originally Posted by molson

I mean there's the truth, but also the voice of the legions of BernieBros who still say they were screwed. Both are relevant and impact the political landscape. Truth is maybe less important than it's ever been.

And the Bernie supports were also a major target for online manipulation, a lot of Putin Pals mixed in with the Bernie Bros. I’m sure there will be a major push on Twitter/Facebook/Reddit to make it feel like whoever comes in second got screwed.

[Scoobz0202]

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/20/u...ndraising.html

Just over 24 hours after announcing his presidential bid, Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont has already raised $6 million from more than 225,000 donors, his campaign said Wednesday morning.

I know the age thing is an issue to many, but I do think it's pretty obvious we have ourselves the early frontrunner for the Dems.

[sabotai]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

With all the heat around the superdelegates before the convention, I'm pretty sure if Bernie was leading in pledged delegates most of them would have supported him.

Which is basically what happened in 2008, IIRC. Most super-delegates were supporting Clinton at the beginning, but Obama started winning a bunch of states and their votes switched to Obama. Obama ended up with 2./3rds of the super delegates (and 51% of the pledged delegates).

If we were going by strict popular vote, Hilary would have been the nominee in 2008. She had 17.8 million votes to Obama's 17.5 million.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by sabotai

Which is basically what happened in 2008, IIRC. Most super-delegates were supporting Clinton at the beginning, but Obama started winning a bunch of states and their votes switched to Obama. Obama ended up with 2./3rds of the super delegates (and 51% of the pledged delegates).

If we were going by strict popular vote, Hilary would have been the nominee in 2008. She had 17.8 million votes to Obama's 17.5 million.

That's only by counting Michigan, where Obama had removed his name from the ballot because the DNC stripped it of all delegates. Without Michigan, Obama beats her in the popular vote.