Use both lanes until merge point

[spleen1015]

All of this is just a symptom of what is wrong with America. We don't give a crap about each other enough to be courteous to each other.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by spleen1015

All of this is just a symptom of what is wrong with America. We don't give a crap about each other enough to be courteous to each other.

Half the complaints here are about Minnesotans etc getting over too early and waiting in line for longer instead of passing people. (And where I grew up it used to be the same with New Hampshire drivers until that state got overrun with Massachusetts transplants.) This seems to be more of a case where people have different expectations of what's proper and the confusion leading to problems instead of people trying to be selfish.

[sooner333]

In Oklahoma they have signs leading up to a lane closure to merge and “it’s the law”.

[dawgfan]

I think an argument can be made for merging early when traffic is going at or close to posted speed limits and there's room to do so.

But when you're in a stop-and-go situation, use all of the available lanes for as long as possible. I'm not sure it makes the traffic go any faster that way, but it does - at least a little - reduce the back-up, because there's less wasted road way. Folks trying to merge waaaay ahead of where they need to in stop-and-go - and blocking their lane as they wait to be able to get over - are doing it wrong.

[nilodor]

Is zipping basically the driving form of communism? Great in theory, doesn't seem to work in practice?

[dawgfan]

Originally Posted by nilodor

Is zipping basically the driving form of communism? Great in theory, doesn't seem to work in practice?

I see it working frequently around Seattle. It's not 100%, but generally-speaking in stop-and-go traffic people here are good about alternating/zippering.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

I see it working frequently around Seattle. It's not 100%, but generally-speaking in stop-and-go traffic people here are good about alternating/zippering.

Yeah, I feel zipper merging works great at on-ramps/off-ramps & when 2 lanes genuinely merge into one. It's when you get lane closures with plenty of advance warning where it starts to fall apart, both because people feel like others are taking advantage of it and line cutting, and because the law doesn't really seem clear cut (signs in some states say drive as long as possible in the merging lane, but as Lathum points out the law still clearly states that any car in the lane being merged into has the right of way if there is an accident.)

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by dawgfan

I think an argument can be made for merging early when traffic is going at or close to posted speed limits and there's room to do so.

But when you're in a stop-and-go situation, use all of the available lanes for as long as possible. I'm not sure it makes the traffic go any faster that way, but it does - at least a little - reduce the back-up, because there's less wasted road way. Folks trying to merge waaaay ahead of where they need to in stop-and-go - and blocking their lane as they wait to be able to get over - are doing it wrong.

+1

Maybe the nuance I'm not understanding is people talking about merging at speed. Just to be clear, I'd never try to justify staying in a lane that's ending at 50mph and trying to cut people off to get over at the last minute - that's clearly a dick move and dangerous as hell.

But in the scenario you describe, I completely agree. In theory the scenario where everyone merges over 100 feet before the end of the lane instead of 10 is nearly as good (although it's extending the tailback another 90 feet, and that can be problematic if there's a junction or set of lights there) but you are never going to get everyone to agree on a common point, except where the lane ends. And in practice you get people who freak out and try to get over right away (these are usually the people who end up blocking the lane while doing it), people who think 100 feet is the right place, people who think 50 is, people who are adamant in staying in the lane all the way up and it's chaos. Just zipper where the lane ends and everything will be fine.

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I will third this.

People in the PNW have zero sense of urgency. 5 years in Seattle and 3 years in Portland, they are both terrible. I'm happy to be back in Jersey.

If it was so urgent maybe you should have left earlier... Just saying.

[cuervo72]

My route home has a point where three lanes narrow down to two. I am pleasantly surprised how smoothly the merge takes place. Things slow down, but it's rare when someone refuses to let folks merge (there's really no opportunity to progress past if you don't).

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by DanGarion

If it was so urgent maybe you should have left earlier... Just saying.

I shouldn't have to leave earlier because some twat wants to do 55 in a 65 lane.

[cuervo72]

I wondered if he was saying you should have left for Jersey earlier!

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

I wondered if he was saying you should have left for Jersey earlier!

Ha!

I wish I could have!

[miami_fan]

Can this be the thread where we complain about driving?

Re: changing lanes.

When did it become a thing for people to immediately stop mid traffic to allow a car to change lanes? I am not talking about slowing down gradually to allow for a lane change. I am not talking about being at a full stop and allowing someone change lanes in front of you before you begin to move. I mean we are all driving along at 50-55 mph in the center or left lane of a three lane road. Someone To the right give us a rare blessing of turning on their left turn signal to indicate a change of lanes. Within a second and a half, a car in front of you drops from 55 mph to 10 mph to allow the other car to let the other car in completely ignoring the fact that there is a line of cars behind them still driving 50-55 mph.

Or am I the only asshole who does not participate in this level of “kindness”?

[Ksyrup]

No, you're not. This isn't limited to highway lane changes either.

I'm all for being courteous on regular streets where there's traffic and someone is waiting to turn onto the street, so you leave them space to turn onto your street from a parking lot or a side street and what-not while you wait for a red light or traffic to clear. But I absolutely detest the people who see someone waiting for traffic to clear so they can turn, and that person who is driving in front of me decides it's OK to stop and let them in. It's a green light, doing the speed limit, no indication anyone is stopping or turning, and you are going to be "nice" by testing my reflexes and giving me a heart attack.

Just let the traffic clear and they will get into traffic like normal. You can't go out of your way to be nice, because you might kill someone behind you. MORON.

[bhlloy]

Funny enough I had this happen to me yesterday, peak traffic on the 101 and a guy slams on his brakes down to about 5mph to let somebody over. I’ll usually slow reasonably to let somebody over (maybe ease off 5-10mph in the flow of traffic) - God knows the 10% of people who use their indicator in LA deserve to get some courtesy, but I’m not hitting my brakes and certainly not slamming them on.

I wonder how much of it is courtesy and how much is just overly terrified drivers who shouldn’t be on the freeway in the first place. Kinda like the idiots who will do 50 in the left lanes for the next 7 miles rather than be next to a truck so they can pass it.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

No, you're not. This isn't limited to highway lane changes either.

I'm all for being courteous on regular streets where there's traffic and someone is waiting to turn onto the street, so you leave them space to turn onto your street from a parking lot or a side street and what-not while you wait for a red light or traffic to clear. But I absolutely detest the people who see someone waiting for traffic to clear so they can turn, and that person who is driving in front of me decides it's OK to stop and let them in. It's a green light, doing the speed limit, no indication anyone is stopping or turning, and you are going to be "nice" by testing my reflexes and giving me a heart attack.

Just let the traffic clear and they will get into traffic like normal. You can't go out of your way to be nice, because you might kill someone behind you. MORON.

Must be a KY thing, because it drives me up a friggen wall. I can't stand it, and it's dangerous as f.

[Mota]

In Toronto the crazy drivers will pull into a gas station entrance so they can pass 10 cars, then drive like maniacs until they merge back in, and we have to let them back in.

Or when there's an on ramp to the highway and the lane is empty, so these cars will jump into the lane, pass 3-4 guys and then expect you to let them back in front of you. If you're not actually merging onto the highway, don't go in the lane. It's the equivalent of driving on the shoulder.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Mota

In Toronto the crazy drivers will pull into a gas station entrance so they can pass 10 cars, then drive like maniacs until they merge back in, and we have to let them back in.

Or when there's an on ramp to the highway and the lane is empty, so these cars will jump into the lane, pass 3-4 guys and then expect you to let them back in front of you. If you're not actually merging onto the highway, don't go in the lane. It's the equivalent of driving on the shoulder.

This happens a lot in CA, too. Where possible and if I am positioned right, I will "randomly" drift partway over, blocking passage onward to any in that lane.

[Jughead Spock]

Dunno, I lived in the Seattle area for a long time, and now I'm in the Charleston, SC area and lemme tell ya - it's a tossup. I've never been more consistently bothered by bad drivers than here.

Doesn't help that I spent a good amount of time in Germany in between. Heaven for (good) drivers.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Jughead Spock

Dunno, I lived in the Seattle area for a long time, and now I'm in the Charleston, SC area and lemme tell ya - it's a tossup. I've never been more consistently bothered by,bad drivers than here.

Doesn't help that I spent a good amount of time in Germany in between. Heaven for (good) drivers.

I know people get a bit sensitive when comparisons are between Europe and the U.S.A, but damn driving in Germany is such a pleasure.

[BishopMVP]

It's amazing what actually enforcing lane discipline and not just setting up speed traps because it's the easiest to generate revenue can do to improve driving conditions.

Similar to the left lane on highways being for passing only & basically never being enforced, Massachusetts passed another sensible law - "Wipers on, Lights on" - and after the first week they stopped enforcing it too. It's like speeding and DUI's are the only areas they can maintain traction on, instead of the wide variety of things that make the roads more dangerous & more annoying to drive.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Mota

In Toronto the crazy drivers will pull into a gas station entrance so they can pass 10 cars, then drive like maniacs until they merge back in, and we have to let them back in.

Do you remember Rich Hall and Sniglets? This person is called an esso-asso.

[miami_fan]

Bump for driving complaint! Actually not really a complaint, more like an observation.

Has anybody else notice drivers running through red lights? I don't mean trying to beat a yellow light turning to red. I am talking about drivers waiting at a red light and then just taking off before the light changes to green. I have been seeing like 1 or 2 a week for about six months now . However, I have seen at least six this week alone.

[bhlloy]

I wonder if it's drivers who got used to driving with very few people around with COVID, and just haven't bothered to re-calibrate their driving now the streets are full again. I know I saw it way more than usual the odd occasion I'd leave my house in the early COVID times.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Bump for driving complaint! Actually not really a complaint, more like an observation.

Has anybody else notice drivers running through red lights? I don't mean trying to beat a yellow light turning to red. I am talking about drivers waiting at a red light and then just taking off before the light changes to green. I have been seeing like 1 or 2 a week for about six months now . However, I have seen at least six this week alone.

Oh yeah, that's been a big thing as traffic returned to pre-Covid levels.

Similar to how I saw a sudden surge in street/drag racing during Covid, I think as much as anything it's indicative of a generally lowered will to live.

Also in the past week I nearly got clipped twice in less than a minute, including a really creative 45 degree "turn" someone made across three lanes of moving traffic. He just gave no fucks whatsoever ... all in a hurry to get to a KFC just up the street (no, I'm not kidding, we watched him turn in)