Magic vs Bird ... maybe (NBA 2k23 Eras sim)

[JonInMiddleGA]

More "watching the game unfold" than dynasty probably, I've been meaning to give this a try for a while now.

I haven't found the gameplay particularly enjoyable tbh (though I haven't played in more than a month now, perhaps patches have improved things) but I'd like to get SOMETHING out of the investment so I'm going to give this a go.

Though I'll control a team to give myself some level of activity, I'm not planning on building a superteam if I can avoid it. Assuming the game allows, I'll probably move around as the years roll by so I'm sure I'll have some impact on how things unfold but I'll try to avoid completely unbalancing things.

Vanilla rosters and draft classes, sliders are default with the exception so far of moving sims to 12 mins (in case I do any of the interactive sim modes, I discovered that was a change you had to make to avoid screwing up stats)

Progress on posting will probably be kind of slow and maybe limited to end of season for a practical reason: I can't cast the screen to my computer and I can't read the damned screen from across the room, so I have to take notes from the console by hand & then bring them over here to the keyboard in order to post them.

I think of this more as a "flavor sim" maybe, it's mostly about some old names and nostalgia than anything. I've enjoyed the hell out of that aspect of FHM6 (where I did indulge in building a dynasty), I hope to get even a fraction of that enjoyment out of this.

[JonInMiddleGA]

2k23 starts the "eras" with the 83-84 season so that's where things begin.

I've taken control of the Indiana Pacers since they had the 2nd worst record in real-life the previous year (Houston was worse but they've added Ralph Sampson and should be improving). They also remained under 30 wins for the next three seasons in real life so it's unlikely I can do much damage to them.

In real life, the 76ers won the previous title by sweeping the Lakers in four. The reigning MVP is Moses Malone, the latest Rookie of the Year is Terry Cummings, the reigning DPOY is Sidney Moncrief and the top Sixth Man was Bobby Jones.

[Izulde]

You know I'll be following since I'm still PS5-less and won't give in to the scalpers

[JonInMiddleGA]

I'll admit that I'm not completely sure how to format things so that it doesn't become an incomprehensible mess, so that'll be a work in progress.

How things evolve in this universe is primary but seeing how things match up/diverge is also interesting I think. Thanks to basketball-reference dot com I can pretty easily find the real life counterparts to awards, stats, etc. I'll probably play around with colors/fonts/something to try to give the sim universe vs real-life some sort of legible difference.

Also, I've already figured out that I screwed up a little by not doing a mid-season/all star break standings note. I'll try to fix that going forward, my bad. Also discovered that simming days during the all-star break apparently means I don't see who wins the dunk contest or the three point contest, I only get a list of who participated. And I don't think anybody is going to be all that into the rookies vs sophomore game so I'll probably just let it slide by.

[JonInMiddleGA]

1983-84 Pre-Season

High octane offense in the West, serious physicality in the East. Can an aging Philly hold off Boston and repeat? Are the Lakers ready to take the next step? How much difference will clear cut #1 overall pick Ralph Sampson make in Houston?

For Indiana, the hopes are high for #2 overall pick Steve Stipanovich but the backcourt is still an area that needs work for the Pacers. Clark Kellogg and Herb Williams will be solid partners for the rookie but beyond them there are a lot of questions.

[JonInMiddleGA]

1983-84 First Half

The season has progressed largely to expectations for many of the favorites. Boston and L.A. are the class of their conferences at the All-Star break, Portland and Detroit seem next in line. The Lakers are challenged by the injury absence of Kareem Abdul-Jabbar who went down in December.

Disappointing starts for New York, Washington, and Seattle, and it seems clear that Philadelphia has slowed considerably compared to last season's title run.

Atlanta fires their head coach on Christmas Eve, Houston decides to make a change in mid-January in hopes of getting more out of the cast around the rookie sensation Ralph Sampson.

For the Pacers, a pre-season trade with Washington for veterans Tom McMillan and Charles Davis (for F George Johnson and two spare parts) paid dividends and helped the team get off to a stronger than expected start, hovering around the 4/5 spot in the conference for the first couple of months. Injuries to McMillan, then Clark Kellogg, and then Steve Stipanovich hampered things considerably and saw them fading toward the 6/7 spot by the break.

1983-84 All-Star Game
Eastern Conference (Position indicates starter)
G Isiah Thomas - Detroit
G World B. Free - Cleveland
F Larry Bird - Boston
F Julius Erving - Philadelphia
C Moses Malone - Philadelphia
Sidney Moncrief - Milwaukee
Otis Birdsong - New Jersey
Robert Parrish - Boston
Jeff Ruland - Washington
Dominique Wilkins - Atlanta
Kevin McHale - Boston
Maurice Cheeks - Philadelphia

Western Conference
G Magic Johnson - Los Angeles
G George Gervin - San Antonio
F Mark Aguirre - Dallas
F Adrian Dantley - Utah
F Kiki Vandeweghe - Denver
Alex English - Denver
Walter Davis - Phoenix
Ralph Sampson - Houston
Maurice Lucas - Phoenix
Jack Sikma - Seattle
John Drew - Utah
Darrel Griffith - Utah

East wins 134-115

Three differences in the East vs real life: Missing are Kelly Tripucka, Andrew Toney and Bernard King, replaced by Cheeks, Wilkins, and Ruland. The West is missing Kareem, Rickey Green, and Jim Paxson, replaced by Lucas, Drew, and Griffith. Of these differences, King and Jabbar have missed time due to injury.

[JonInMiddleGA]

1983-84 Second Half

The season trended toward haves and have nots as the second half wore on.

Boston and Detroit took firm control in the East, Los Angeles and Utah pulled away in the West.

Meanwhile Chicago, Houston, New York, Washington, and Seattle all fell farther to the rear. By season's end the Bullets, Knicks, Bulls, and Kings had all made head coaching changes.

Player movement was minimal with only a few relatively minor deals, the biggest name switching teams was probably Truck Robinson going from New York to Washington (primarily for George Johnson who Indians sent to the Bullets only a few months earlier)

Injuries made life tough for the Pacers who endured an 11 game losing streak down the stretch. As the season reached the final week, four teams were tied for the final two playoff berths. Game 81 was pivotal as Indiana beat Atlanta and clinched an unexpected trip to the postseason.

1983-84 Regular Season Standings
Eastern Conference

Atlantic Division
Boston 64-48
Philadelphia 55-27
New Jersey 46-36
New York 27-55
Washington 27-55

Central Division
Detroit 60-22
Milwaukee 46-36
Cleveland 39-43
Indiana 30-53
Atlanta 27-55
Chicago 15-67

Western Conference
Midwest Division
Utah 55-27
Dallas 47-35
Denver 47-35
San Antonio 41-41
Kansas City 32-50
Houston 25-57

Pacific Division
Los Angeles 64-18
Portland 53-29
Phoenix 45-37
Golden State 37-45
San Diego 32-50
Seattle 29-53

[JonInMiddleGA]

1983-84 Playoffs

Conference Quarterfinals
East
#1 Boston 3-0 over #8 Atlanta
#5 Milwaukee 3-1 over #4 New Jersey
#3 Philadelphia 3-1 over #6 Cleveland
#2 Detroit 3-0 over #7 Indiana
Pacers had nothing for the Pistons, losing all games by 15 or more

West
#1 Los Angeles 3-1 over #8 Golden State
#5 Denver 3-0 over #4 Dallas
#3 Portland 3-1 over #6 Phoenix
#2 Utah 3-0 over #7 Seattle

Conference Semifinals
East
#1 Boston over #5 Milwaukee 4-1
#2 Detroit over #3 Philadelphia 4-3
76ers did not go quietly but game 7 on the road is the end for the defending champs

West
#1 Los Angeles 4-0 over #5 Denver
#2 Utah 4-1 over #3 Portland
Lakers roll despite missing several players

Conference Finals
East
#2 Detroit 4-1 over #1 Boston

West
#1 Los Angeles 4-1 over #2 Utah
both winners dropped game one and then took four in a row to advance

NBA Finals
Los Angeles 4-1 over Detroit
Finals MVP: Magic Johnson

It's the third title in five seasons for the Showtime Lakers, all three coming as top seed in the West over an underdog from the East

[JonInMiddleGA]

1983-84 Awards & Leaders

MVP: Larry Bird - Boston
ROTY: Ralph Sampson - Houston
DOPY: Tree Rollins - Atlanta
6MOY: Kevin McHale - Boston
Most Improved: Sleepy Floyd - Golden State
Identical to real life awards, except Most Improved which doesn't seem to have begun until 1986

PPG: George Gervin 30.7 - San Antonio Adrian Dantley 30.6
RPG: Moses Malone 13.8 - Philadelphia Malone 13.4
APG: Magic Johnson 12.4 - Los Angeles Magic 13.1
SPG: Rickey Green 2.1 - Utah Green 2.7
BPG: Tree Rollins 2.5 - Atlanta Mark Eaton 4.3
3PM: Darrel Griffith 14- Utah Griffith 91
DD: Jeff Ruland 63 - Washington
TD: Magic Johnson 21 - Los Angeles
PER: Larry Bird 33.2 Adrian Dantley 24.6
3P makes/attempts are clearly borked in Eras, otherwise pretty good accuracy for a sim IMO. Also, universe note about those Triple Doubles for Magic. He had 21, the rest of the league combined had 15 total


All NBA 1st Team
Magic Johnson - LA
Alex English - DEN
Larry Bird - BOS
Julius Erving - PHL
Moses Malone - PHL
All NBA 2nd Team
Isiah Thomas - DET
World B. Free - CLE
Mark Aguirre - DAL
Dominique Wilkins - ATL
Jeff Ruland - WSH
All NBA 3rd Team
Rickey Green - UTH
Walter Davis - PHX
Marques Johnson - MIL
Clark Kellogg - IND
Jack Sikma - SEA
Real-life 3rd Team honors didn't begin until 88-89 season. Missing from the real top ten are Kareem, Bernard King, Adrian Dantley, Sidney Moncrief, and Jim Paxson. Replaced by English, Free, Aguirre, Wilkins, and Ruland

All Defense 1st Team
Sidney Moncrief - MIL
Magic Johnson - LAL
Larry Bird - BOS
Buck Williams - NJ
Tree Rollins - ATL
All Defense 2nd Team
Paul Pressey - MIL
Michael Cooper - LAL
Bobby Jones - PHL
Kevin McHale - BOS
Ralph Sampson - HOU
Half of these are different, missing Mo Cheeks from the 1st and Kareem/TR Dunn/Dennis Johnson/Dan Roundfield from the 2nd

All Rookie 1st Team
Ralph Sampson - HOU
Darnell Walker - NY
Clyde Drexler - POR
Ennis Whatley - CHI
Jeff Malone - WSH
All Rookie 2nd Team
Dale Ellis - DAL
Doc Rivers - ATL
Steve Stipanovich - IND
Jon Sunvold - SEA
Rodney McCray - HOU
Only six players named in real life, missing are Thurl Bailey and Byron Scott

[JonInMiddleGA]

1983-84 Post-Season

Elvin Hayes in the only notable retirement, leaving the Rockets and entering the Hall of Fame

Draft Lottery was as uneventful as could be, going chalk from start to finish. That means the Chicago Bulls will have the number one pick, with Houston going second. Washington will select third, Indiana (via New York) fourth, followed by Atlanta, the newly located Los Angeles Clippers (via Seattle) and Portland (via Indiana).

[JonInMiddleGA]

1984 draft

Everyone agreed the UNC star Michael Jordan was the prize of the draft but Indiana has eyes for PG John Stockton to upgrade their backcourt.

1 CHI - Michael Jordan ... no surprise here, top pick spent on the unanimous choice for top player
2 HOU - John Stockton ... surprising some, Rockets go with the guard to compliment ROTY Ralph Sampson. Mocks were split on whether they'd go here or get a second big man
3 WAS - G/F Howard Coles ... Bullets surprise everyone, don't draft Olajuwon
4 IND -- decision time for the Pacers with what some thought was the #2 player available shockingly on the board at #4. Instead, after some discussion, we have a trade:
HOU gets 1st round pick, PG Henry Lowry (66), 1984 2nd, 1987 2nd for PG John Stockton and PF Major Jones(72)
HOU picks PF Joey McGee (75)

5 ATL - Hakeem Olajuwon ... but they already have Rollins?

6 LAC trades pick to KC for PG Larry Drew (80) and SG Ernie Grunfeld (72)
KC picks Otis Thorpe

7 Portland pg Jay Humphries

8 KC trade to Atlanta for Tree Rollins (83) and Vince Kelly (68)
ATL picks Sam Perkins

9 PHL SG Daniel Rivers
10 LAC PF Quincy Stockton
11 DAL PF Michael Cage and his back problems
12 SAS PF Kevin Willis
13 PHX PG Blake Wingate
14 MIL C Jacob Joseph
15 NJ SF Sean Williamson
16 PHL SF Gerald Pierce
17 DAL C Tim McCormick
18 POR C Warren Tucker
19 PHL PF Benjamin Reid
20 Utah SF Drew McLeod
21 DET SG Tony Campbell
22 BOS SG Alan Madsen
23 LAL SG garret Gilmore
2nd Round
24 POR SF Jerome Kersey
25 SEA trade to WAS for SF John Carter (72)
WAS picks PG Dave O'Brian
26 GS PF Leo Jeffries
29 CHI SF Jeff turner
30 IND trades pick (and another 2nd later) to NJ for SF/SG Mike O'Koren (72)

The big weakness of the Eras mode shows up quickly, with 5 of the real-life top 8 players drafted not in the game. In all, only 11 of the 24 first round picks are in the game, only 1 of the 23 second round picks.
The real draft lasted 10 rounds, 18 players drafted R3-R10 would play in the NBA, a half dozen for 5 seasons or more

[Izulde]

I question Houston's draft logic there, too. Sure you have Sampson, but why would you not go for Olajuwon, Cage, Willis over the uh... whatever they drafted.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Izulde

I question Houston's draft logic there, too. Sure you have Sampson, but why would you not go for Olajuwon, Cage, Willis over the uh... whatever they drafted.

Of course, they don't see the him that we know, they simply see numbers. My scouting at least saw Jordan as like an 84, then Hakeem as a 77 (currently) and then something like all but two of the next 20 picks as being 72-74. If there's even minor variance between teams views, it could make sense

Interestingly, aside from the Hakeem pick, the game seemed coded to make sure that teams took their real life choice if they were available. KC made a very strange deal to get Thorpe, Portland picks Kersey something like 20 spots ahead of his projections.

[JonInMiddleGA]

1984 Free Agency

Not a ton of stars, though a fair sampling of recognizable names. More teams have needs than have cap space though, making for few potential landing spots.

When the dust settled, here are the top signings (or re-signings)

86 SG Jim Paxson stays in Portland for 4 yrs/3.9m
85 C Joe Barry Carroll stays in Golden State for 5/4.63
84 C Bill Cartwright goes to Golden State (from NY) 3/2.19
84 SF David Thompson goes to Golden State (from Mil) 3/2.96
82 C Bob Lanier goes to Utah (from Mil) 2/1.22
81 SG Gerald Henderson goes to Denver (from Bos) 3/1.09
78 PG T.R. Dunn goes to Cleveland (from Den)2/701k
78 SG Robert Reid goes to Atlanta (from Hou) 2/735k
78 SG Fred Brown goes to Indiana (from Sea) 1/350k
78 PG Allen Leavell stays in Houston 3/1.31
77 PG Nate Archibald goes to Washington (from Mil) 2/582
77 SG Paul Westphal goes to Golden State (from Phx) 2/547

In addition to the aging Fred Brown, we were busy in Indiana, picking up primarily veterans to go with a relatively young core
75 SF James Thornwell from Phl 1/140
74 PF Sam Williams from GS 1/130
74 PF Ersan Morgan from Bos 1/81
74 PF Tom McMillan resigns 1/81
73 PG Charlie Criss from Mil 1/81
72 PF Steve Hawes from Sea 1/81

[JonInMiddleGA]

Epilogue on a previous discussion

Remember how I mentioned Portland picking Jerome Kersey waaay ahead of his draft slot?

Apparently they renounced his rights, he has the proper draft info on his bio but is a free agent.

Fun 2k bug note #2: The curious case of George Johnson ... both of 'em.

There were two different George Johnson's in the NBA at the time this era starts.

One was a 6'11 PF/C who spent most of his career in Indiana, he attended something called Dillard University according to basketball-reference

There was another George Johnson, a 6'8 SF/PF who played for Atlanta in 82-83 but refused to report to the team in 83-84 (the season the video game begins with) without a guaranteed contract. Basketball references notes that he was neither released nor played for the entire season. He went to St. John's.

In the game? There are two George Johnson's, both with the appropriate career history ... but both are 6'11and both went to St John's. They literally mixed the two and made them the same player ... TWICE.

[JonInMiddleGA]

1984 Player Progression

This is the between-seasons stage where the game handles player progression/regression.

The top players? (Player / New Rating / Old Rating)

Magic Johnson 97 95
Larry Bird 96 97
Isiah Thomas 96 92
Moses Malone 95 95
Mark Aguirre 93 90
Sidney Moncrief 90 90
George Gervin 90 91
Robert Parrish 89 90
Dominique Wilkins 89 85
Adrian Dantley 89 90

Other notables
Michael Jordan 84 --
Hakeem Olaujuwon 83 --
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 88 95 his -7 drop is the largest of any player
Clyde Drexler 79 84 his +5 equals the largest of any player

My Indiana Pacers? Aging was not particularly kind, nor does it make my "get veterans in free agency" strategy look very good :/
Clark Kellogg 84 83
Herb Williams 81 82
Jerry Sichting 79 78
John Stockton 78 --
Fred Brown 77 78
Steve stipanovich 77 76
James Thornwell 75 75
Butch Carter 74 75
Sam Williams 71 74
Kevin McKenna 71 71
Major Jones 71 72
Steve Hawes 71 72
Ersan Morgan 71 73 disappointing, as he was signed largely on having B+ potential)
Charlie Criss 70 72
Tom McMillan 70 75 VERY disappointing, the -5 is the second largest drop of any player in the league

[JonInMiddleGA]

1984 Summer League
The first actual Summer League recognized by NBA history seems to be Orlando in 2002, but it exists in 2k23 Eras so we'll just roll with it

Cleveland wins as the 23rd seed over the #9 Knicks
Indiana finishes 11th

Notables:
CHI Michael Jordan 20.4 ppg for the #1 pick
POR Jay Humphries 19.3 ppg for the #7 pick
WAS Howard Coles 17.8 ppg for the #3 pick
ATL Hakeem Olajuwon 17.7ppg 7.0rpg 2.5 bpg for the #5 pick

Indiana notables (only 3 from my actual roster were eligible)
John Stockton 10.6 ppg 5.6 apg
Steve Stipanovich 9.2 ppg 8.4 rpg
Kevin McKenna 5.4 ppg 3.4 apg in a very poor showing
FA PF/SF Jerome Kersey 11.4ppg 4.4ppg
FA PF/C Reggie Stanley 13.2ppg 9.2 rpg

Shortly after the league wrapped up, we traded McKenna to Kansas City for a pair of future 2nd round picks. He could get playing time on their still-understaffed roster, good luck to him.

[JonInMiddleGA]

1984-85 Regular Season (first 20)

Strong starts with few real surprises as the season begins.

At the 20 game mark

Bos 14-6
Phl 14-6 with Erving out 4-6 weeks
Det 14-8
Atl 13-8
Ind 12-8 Kellogg missed 3g, Brown missed 9g
Mil 12-8 lister missed 15g
Chi 12-9 Jordan missed 3g hamstring
NJ 9-10
Cle, Was, NY trail with 5,5,and 4 wins

Dallas 19-3
Utah 15-5 Rickey Green missed 7
Lal 14-7 Worthy & McAdoo both now out 1-2 weeks
Den 14-7
Por 12-9
Sas 10-13 Gilmore out 1-2 more weeks after missing 5g
Kc 9-12 Eddie Johnson missed 7g broken nose
Lac 7-12 Larry drew missed first 5 recovering from acl
Sea, Phx, and GS with 7 wins each, Houston 5-15 GS best player Purvis Short played 10g now out for season with torn ACL

[korme]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

1983-84 Post-Season

Elvin Hayes in the only notable retirement, leaving the Rockets and entering the Hall of Fame

Draft Lottery was as uneventful as could be, going chalk from start to finish. That means the Chicago Bulls will have the number one pick, with Houston going second. Washington will select third, Indiana (via New York) fourth, followed by Atlanta, the newly located Los Angeles Clippers (via Seattle) and Portland (via Indiana).

That's because the lottery system doesn't begin until 1985. Carry on, Jon!

[korme]

I'd also highly recommend searching for draft classes. You can always scrap one if you load it in and revert to default or load in another one. It's worth finding the classes that are a little more beefed up with real players.

[korme]

Also, go ahead and download Player DNA for Barkley and get him in the game as well.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by korme

I'd also highly recommend searching for draft classes. You can always scrap one if you load it in and revert to default or load in another one. It's worth finding the classes that are a little more beefed up with real players.

That's an intentional choice (I used a d'loaded draft class in my actual first non-sim attempt). I thought seeing just how bad vanilla was (and how it was balanced) was a worthwhile exercise on its own. for example, will the reals dominate the league? Are the fictionals o.p. and they dominate instead? Or is there some semblance of balance?

[JonInMiddleGA]

1984-85 Trade Deadline

Once again we're the busiest team in the league with few players of note changing cities

IND Trade PG Charlie Criss (70rtg, 29g, 1.9p, 1.2a) & LAC '88 2nd
to GS C Chuck Nevitt (70 rtg, 29g, 2.3 p,4.4 r) & GS '89 2nd

IND Trade PF Ersan Morgan (71 rtg, 16g 1.7p 1.1r)
to Portland for CLE '87 2nd

IND Signed FA PF/C Reggie Stanley (73)
IND Signed FA PG Yogi Tolliver (69)

IND Traded PF Major Jones (71rtg, 26g , 1.6p 2.4r) and Den 87 2nd
to LAL SG Rayjon Jackson (72rtg, 14g, 0.6p) and 88 2nd

Also
KC trade SG Billy Knight (76) and PG Don Buse (74)
to SAS for PF Kevin Willis (77)

SAS trade '88 1st and SF Ed brooks (70)
to WAS PF Truck Robinson (74) and Hou '86 2nd

[JonInMiddleGA]

1984-85 All-Star Break

Bos 30-14
Det 28-14
Phl 27-16
Atl 27-17
Chi 25-17
Mil 24-19
Ind 19-22 (slumped when Sichting missed 12g)
NJ 18-26
----
Cle 15-25
Was 13-29
NY 10-33



Dal 33-20
Uth 33-11
Lal 29-12
Por 27-18
Den 22-22
Lac 19-23
Phx 1926
Kc 17-27
-----
Hou 16-26
Sea 16-27
Sas 15-29
Gs 12-32

PPG Jordan 28.6 Gervin 28,5
RPB Malone 14.6 Laimbeer 13.0
APG Magic 9.7 Johnny Moore 9.6
BPG Herb Williams 2.4, Joe Barry Carroll 2.2