Severe Weather

[Ksyrup]

Wife has been in and out of the house checking here in KY. We've got some low level stuff, not as good yet as a couple of months ago.

[Lathum]

Been keeping an eye out here in Jersey. Heard you can see them in a town a bit north

[JPhillips]

Nothing at the college or home, but people a little north are seeing the light.

[Lathum]

I was able to see them through the camera on my phone and get some pretty cool pictures.

[miami_fan]

Just checking in!

We lost power for about 40 hours starting late Wednesday night until this afternoon. So many tales and experiences. My general takeways.

1. In times of crisis, the vast majority of the people in our subdivision really pulled together to get each other's houses and property cleaned up.

2. I suspect the office that issues the permits to cut down will be very busy of the next three to six months. Whoever polices tree cutting without a permit is also going to be busy. Most of the damage I have seen in my travels have been from trees falling on structures.

3. A lot of people had their hurricane cherries popped this week. Many families either couldn't prepare properly or chose not to prepare properly and it showed especially in the aftermath. Hopefully, lessons have been learned.

4. The privilege, the narcissism, the victim mentality have been all on display. I can only assume the people that were exhibiting this behavior were experiencing their first "big" storm and folks had what to expect but Helene was just a few days ago. How are people shocked that gas stations might have no gas the day after a storm passes through or that power hasn't been restored within 24 hours of the storm leaving the area?!

Oh, and did you know that everyone gets $2400 from FEMA if they had to go 24 hours without power? I learned that on Ring Neighbors comment area.

[JonInMiddleGA]

re #4 - gas ... I'll be honest (and you know I don't give too much benefit of the doubt in general), I can see where a hurricane virgin might not have caught the gas shortage thing the first time around. If they didn't need gas during Helene, with all else that goes on around a storm, that feels like a not huge stretch to be caught unaware by.

Now if they're surprised next time, I'll be at the head of the line to call them fn stupid.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

3. A lot of people had their hurricane cherries popped this week. Many families either couldn't prepare properly or chose not to prepare properly and it showed especially in the aftermath. Hopefully, lessons have been learned.

Interested in learning more. Besides food, water & flashlights what would you say are the top 3 preps that someone riding out a hurricane should have?

[GrantDawg]

I picked up one of those power banks that connect to a solar panel. It has two AC plugs and several USB ports. I didn't end up using it, but I did see a guy that is surviving cut off in NC that was using those and he said they are fantastic. He also had a battery powered cooler that would be fantastic to have. He actually had two, and one would actually get cold enough to freeze. He said he would charge them every couple of days, either with his car or his gas generator.

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

re #4 - gas ... I'll be honest (and you know I don't give too much benefit of the doubt in general), I can see where a hurricane virgin might not have caught the gas shortage thing the first time around. If they didn't need gas during Helene, with all else that goes on around a storm, that feels like a not huge stretch to be caught unaware by.

Now if they're surprised next time, I'll be at the head of the line to call them fn stupid.

Originally Posted by Edward64

Interested in learning more. Besides food, water & flashlights what would you say are the top 3 preps that someone riding out a hurricane should have?

Before I go in further detail, I want to make sure everyone knows I am not talking about people with a resource issue. Unless they are living the doublest of double lives, they have the resources. In the mythical Hurricane Prep 101 handbook, it would tell you that if you have a vehicle or vehicles make sure the vehicles are filled with gas. You fill your gas tank not just because of the high probability that it will take a few days to get gas trucks filled to restock the gas stations but because EVERYONE is going to fill all of their vehicles before the storm many stations have already tapped into any local reserves they may have. So many people putting gas in only their vehicles, waiting an hour in line to put gas in their vehicle and/or looking for gas stations with gas to put gas in their vehicles starting at midday on Thursday for a storm that made landfall at 9pm on Wednesday. The thing is all summer long any possibility of any storm coming in the Gulf resulted in a rush to the gas stations.

Also in the handbook, It would say you should have at least a week's worth of supplies. But if you have filled the fridge with food supplies, I don't think it is unreasonable to expect that you would have a way of making sure that the refrigerator stays on to preserve your supplies i.e have a generator that at the very least can keep your fridge on. Also the gas necessary to keep the generator running to preserve your supplies. Again, from what I can tell lights in the area began going out around 10pm Wednesday night at the earliest. Power was restored for most by 6pm yesterday. People were looking for gas for their generators by Thursday afternoon. If the plan is to cook, have enough propane gas for your gas grill or make sure you have a charcoal grill. You could always get a case of canned meats and not have to worry about any of that.

I don't count food or water as should haves myself. I always have food and water in the fridge and in the pantry. If I am riding out a hurricane, I don't see why I need to remind myself to have those things. I just to make sure I have to make sure I have enough for my self and my family. I have a top four. My top four would be at least one generator (with enough gas to have to run for 24 hours a day for seven days) powerful to enough to keep the fridge on, flashlights both battery powered and rechargeable batteries(Ryobi, DeWalt etc), portable fans with rechargeable batteries, and a battery powered radio. That last one might seem out of place in 2024 but with everyone's WIFI out, you found out rather quickly how inadequate that one cell phone tower in between the two or three subdivisions in your area actually is when you are trying to anything on your phone including listening to the radio.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

My top four would be at least one generator (with enough gas to have to run for 24 hours a day for seven days) powerful to enough to keep the fridge on, flashlights both battery powered and rechargeable batteries(Ryobi, DeWalt etc), portable fans with rechargeable batteries, and a battery powered radio. That last one might seem out of place in 2024 but with everyone's WIFI out, you found out rather quickly how inadequate that one cell phone tower in between the two or three subdivisions in your area actually is when you are trying to anything on your phone including listening to the radio.

Thanks.

[Edward64]

Interesting article on Hurricane "resistant" subdivision. Pretty neat

Helene and Milton put this net-zero, hurricane-proof community to the test. The lights stayed on as everything else went dark | CNN

The developers of the new Hunters Point community, Pearl Homes, billed the property as the first “net-zero” single-family home development in the US, meaning residents produce more energy from solar panels than they need, with the excess energy either being stored or sold back to the grid – in a state where most electricity is generated by burning natural gas, a planet-warming fossil fuel.

They also boast some of the most sustainable, energy-efficient and hurricane-proof homes in the country: The streets surrounding the homes are intentionally designed to flood so houses don’t. Power and internet lines are buried to avoid wind damage. The sturdy concrete walls, hurricane-proof windows and doors are fortified with a layer of foam insulation, providing extra safety against the most violent storms.

Each of the three-story homes are designed like this: The ground floor is a garage designed with flood vents to drain rising water. The living spaces start on the second floor, which is intentionally built 16 feet above sea level. From the roof to its foundation, steel straps secure the entire structure. Solar panels are attached to the roofs’ raised vertical seams to prevent them from flying off.

[CrimsonFox]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Interesting article on Hurricane "resistant" subdivision. Pretty neat

Helene and Milton put this net-zero, hurricane-proof community to the test. The lights stayed on as everything else went dark | CNN

That's really cool.

But then the eartquakes and fire come...

[miami_fan]

Given the discussions around Tropicana Field and putting power lines underground, I must ask. Six months from now, are people going to be willing to pay the extra half mil to get the resistant features or will they choose to get the other new homes and save the money. Hell since it's South Florida, will the other guys who begin to build their own version of these community cut costs in the building of said community.

[Edward64]

Don’t know the answer to your question. I did google on the homes and they start at $1.5M.

Sustainable Living Homes for Sale near Anna Maria Island, FL

I do wonder if new multi-story apartments, condos can be built this way. Assume that’ll be more cost efficient (cost spread out over numerous units), will reduce insurance coverage, reduce HOA fees etc.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Edward64

Don’t know the answer to your question. I did google on the homes and they start at $1.5M.

Sustainable Living Homes for Sale near Anna Maria Island, FL

I do wonder if new multi-story apartments, condos can be built this way. Assume that’ll be more cost efficient (cost spread out over numerous units), will reduce insurance coverage, reduce HOA fees etc.

From the article

But these features come at a cost. According to the community’s website, the homes are selling for $1.4 million to $1.9 million, compared to other new homes in the area priced for at least $600,000.

[Ghost Econ]

So evidently with i-40 and i-26 not being fully operational in North Carolina is causing the surrounding interstates to overflow with traffic. The complaints are growing here about driving times on i-85 doubling in the past 2 weeks. Taking our daughter to swim was generally 30-40 minutes at 5:30 PM. It's since been an hour to 1:20. Thankfully coming home isn't a problem by the time we come back, but over heard AM rush hour is almost 3x as long.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

2. I suspect the office that issues the permits to cut down will be very busy of the next three to six months. Whoever polices tree cutting without a permit is also going to be busy. Most of the damage I have seen in my travels have been from trees falling on structures.

I just got a call from a friend of mine who lives in Delaware but has a home in Brandon that he rents out. Milton uprooted a tree in the yard and it fell on the two story house. His property manager emailed him to let him know that a company they asked to give them a quote to have the tree removed said it would cost $25,000. I paid two different companies to cut down a tree of similar height cut down AND had the sidewalk repaired that the roots of said tree had broken earlier this year.

It cost me $3,110 total.

[Edward64]

FWIW I took down a couple big trees, cost $1,200 each. But to be fair, those down trees are on a house so figure its much more complicated (but prob not $25K complicated).

Won't home owners insurance take care of that?

[Edward64]

All the talk about generators got me researching to buy a solar generator. I've found the below YT reviewer pretty helpful.

The Solar Lab - YouTube

Looking for a portable system with solar panels to charge up phones, laptop, hotplate, maybe a small space heater, a portable cooler/fridge etc.

I'll be on the lookout for Anker C800X or Jackery 1000 Plus this shopping season.

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by Edward64

All the talk about generators got me researching to buy a solar generator. I've found the below YT reviewer pretty helpful.

The Solar Lab - YouTube

Looking for a portable system with solar panels to charge up phones, laptop, hotplate, maybe a small space heater, a portable cooler/fridge etc.

I'll be on the lookout for Anker C800X or Jackery 1000 Plus this shopping season.

A solar generator without an additional fuel option doesn't seem very useful. In a scenario like a hurricane or storm its likely going to be rainy or cloudy and your generator is then just another soon-to-be-dead battery pack. Even for camping you would have to be a fair-weather camper (which is perhaps fine) and also stay at a site that has some un-shaded area to place the generator and panels. And hopefully you aren't planning to power that space heater at night because it will drain the battery in about an hour.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

I just got a call from a friend of mine who lives in Delaware but has a home in Brandon that he rents out. Milton uprooted a tree in the yard and it fell on the two story house. His property manager emailed him to let him know that a company they asked to give them a quote to have the tree removed said it would cost $25,000. I paid two different companies to cut down a tree of similar height cut down AND had the sidewalk repaired that the roots of said tree had broken earlier this year.

It cost me $3,110 total.

Must be geographic. I haven't gotten a quote under $5k for a single tree removal in nearly a decade. Average here seems to be around $8k for a medium and $15k and up for what I'd consider a "big" tree.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

A solar generator without an additional fuel option doesn't seem very useful. In a scenario like a hurricane or storm its likely going to be rainy or cloudy and your generator is then just another soon-to-be-dead battery pack. Even for camping you would have to be a fair-weather camper (which is perhaps fine) and also stay at a site that has some un-shaded area to place the generator and panels. And hopefully you aren't planning to power that space heater at night because it will drain the battery in about an hour.

You are talking about a very limited situation. Edward doesn't live in a hurricane area, and even in a hurricane, sky are usually clear by the next day. Hurricanes that stay over an area for extended time are a subset of a subset. The generators he is looking at can also be recharged using your car, making that a gas power generator of sorts.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Must be geographic. I haven't gotten a quote under $5k for a single tree removal in nearly a decade. Average here seems to be around $8k for a medium and $15k and up for what I'd consider a "big" tree.

Geographic and situational. The tree removal and clean up business in Florida is probably many times what it is in Delaware. For instance, to have house tented for dry wood termites is a tenth of what it cost in Florida as it does in Georgia. Not a native species here, so there are only like 3 companies equipped to do that, but almost every pest company probably has to do it in Florida.

[flere-imsaho]

I had a dead 50x50 hawthorn removed in IL for maybe 800 bucks.

[RainMaker]

I had 2 decent sized trees removed and some trimming down for $8k a couple years ago. That included stump removal (well they had a machine that ground it to bit). I don't envy the guy on the rope way up high.

[Ben E Lou]

Huh...a few months after we bought this house, an ol' boy who swore he was bonded and insured came through our neighborhood and offered to take out the ugly-as-sin pine tree in our front yard--stump grinding included--for $350. I was clueless about price comparison for this service, as we'd never had need to remove one, but I thought that sounded reasonable. Sounds like it was.

[RainMaker]

These trees were near my house so I don't know if that males it more expensive. They were very careful.

[dubb93]

Where I’m at it’s about $1000 for a large tree(I priced maple and oak). A little bit more if it’s close to something that it could fall on. Let’s call it about $1500. I imagine a pine tree would be significantly easier to remove than say a mature oak or maple.

[Ghost Econ]

It cost us 6500 to get someone to chop up our 150 year old oak that fell across our yard. Not even stump grinding, the stump and roots are still tipped over in the neighbors yard. Literally $6500 to have them chop it up and haul most of it off.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

These trees were near my house so I don't know if that males it more expensive. They were very careful.

Yeah, mine was in no danger of falling on the house. Took the dudes like an hour, including stump grinding. Got some firewood out of it, too.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Fidatelo

A solar generator without an additional fuel option doesn't seem very useful. In a scenario like a hurricane or storm its likely going to be rainy or cloudy and your generator is then just another soon-to-be-dead battery pack. Even for camping you would have to be a fair-weather camper (which is perhaps fine) and also stay at a site that has some un-shaded area to place the generator and panels. And hopefully you aren't planning to power that space heater at night because it will drain the battery in about an hour.

I know I won't be covering the worse-worse case, long duration scenarios but doing this for the most likely ones like a bad snowstorm knocking out all the power for 2-3 days. I'll have food, water, shelter but need to keep iPhones charged up.

You're right about the space heater. And darn, hot plates are 500-1,000 watts which will drain the 800-1,000 watt hours ratings on these < $1,000 generators ones pretty quick. I do have a propane grill so figure that'll come in handy for cooking. I also have backpacking cooking equipment, so figure those will work in a pinch.

I've watched a couple videos and the solar panels still work "some" under cloudy skies (not so much in shade by trees though). Much reduced efficiency but enough for a basic 2-3 days.

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

You are talking about a very limited situation. Edward doesn't live in a hurricane area, and even in a hurricane, sky are usually clear by the next day. Hurricanes that stay over an area for extended time are a subset of a subset. The generators he is looking at can also be recharged using your car, making that a gas power generator of sorts.

Many models will let you charge up with the cigarette port but that'll be 8+ hours. But there's an Eco flow model that will let you charge up with a car battery so in about 1-2 hours. Need an expensive adaptor though.

Many of the $1,000 models lets you buy a battery expansion also.

But yeah, a gas powered generator provides for more watt hours, so greater margin of safety. I do like the idea of having the solar generator though, can keep it inside the house, less noise & smell, easier for wife to use, and don't have to worry about having readily available gas all the time (or guess I could by a car gas tank siphon).

[Edward64]

My 2 x $1,200 was for a big & tall dead pine tree in the back (no stump removal) and one medium hardwood in front (with stump removed).

This was in early 2022. I know there's been inflation but some of the prices you guys are quoting are ridiculous.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Edward64

My 2 x $1,200 was for a big & tall dead pine tree in the back (no stump removal) and one medium hardwood in front (with stump removed).

This was in early 2022. I know there's been inflation but some of the prices you guys are quoting are ridiculous.

You'd get no argument from me about the absurdity of it ... but in my case that's just Athens.

ANY sort of thing that involves actual labor around here costs roughly 2x - 3x the price of the same thing in somewhere like (as an example) Roswell.

A combination of factors, namely a shortage of competition in most niches (caused by a general lack of work in the area) which is a function of having virtually no "middle class". This area is mostly either people who don't have enough money to pay anybody to do much of anything OR people who have so much money that they don't really ask many questions about price, they just want Task X done.

edit to add: You know the geography I'm about to describe well enough to get it I think. I had to replace an AC unit recently. I got the work done by a guy in f'n Blue Ridge. Same price as the main remaining local outfit ... but with 72 hour installation instead of the estimated 2-3 WEEKS I got from the local jerks.

[Fidatelo]

Originally Posted by Edward64

I know I won't be covering the worse-worse case, long duration scenarios but doing this for the most likely ones like a bad snowstorm knocking out all the power for 2-3 days. I'll have food, water, shelter but need to keep iPhones charged up.

You're right about the space heater. And darn, hot plates are 500-1,000 watts which will drain the 800-1,000 watt hours ratings on these < $1,000 generators ones pretty quick. I do have a propane grill so figure that'll come in handy for cooking. I also have backpacking cooking equipment, so figure those will work in a pinch.

I've watched a couple videos and the solar panels still work "some" under cloudy skies (not so much in shade by trees though). Much reduced efficiency but enough for a basic 2-3 days.


Many models will let you charge up with the cigarette port but that'll be 8+ hours. But there's an Eco flow model that will let you charge up with a car battery so in about 1-2 hours. Need an expensive adaptor though.

Many of the $1,000 models lets you buy a battery expansion also.

But yeah, a gas powered generator provides for more watt hours, so greater margin of safety. I do like the idea of having the solar generator though, can keep it inside the house, less noise & smell, easier for wife to use, and don't have to worry about having readily available gas all the time (or guess I could by a car gas tank siphon).

Yeah, I'm not trying to discourage solar. I have a 4kw system running my off-grid cabin and I love it. But some stuff, like especially space heaters and hot plates, are just massive power sucks and will drain a battery really fast so you need to avoid them.


And I also feel like for emergency situations my goal for power generation would be something that is high reliability, and unfortunately solar doesn't meet that standard. For example if your goal is to sit out a snow storm consider that you will likely get 0 input at all while it is snowing, and even when it isn't you will likely battle solid cloud cover, low sun angle, and short daylight hours (though that depends a bit on where you are, the sun angle and daylight hours are worse for me here up north than they would be for you).


Anyways, just things to consider. If you can work around or aren't concerned about those factors than I'm sure one of those models you listed or something similar would be a pretty neat gadget.

[Fidatelo]

Dola


I was closing up the cabin yesterday and winterizing all of my tools etc. I have a 3200W duel fuel generator (propane/gas) that we used before the solar was set up and now is just a backup for, well, emergencies. I like to run it for a few minutes in fall and spring just to make sure it works and try to prevent parts from seizing or whatnot.


So anyways I tried to start it up and, in a fun bit of irony given my 'lecturing' above, the starter battery is dead and the pull cord is seized. So maybe not quite as 'highly reliable' as I'd like

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

In not so severe weather, the Northern Lights were visible tonight here in Myrtle Beach

To be fair, there are apocrophal stories of northern lights getting people killed. Like drivers who then went off the road or people who walked off cliffs upon seeing them.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

To be fair, there are apocrophal stories of northern lights getting people killed. Like drivers who then went off the road or people who walked off cliffs upon seeing them.

No cliffs here in Myrtle Beach

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Edward64

FWIW I took down a couple big trees, cost $1,200 each. But to be fair, those down trees are on a house so figure its much more complicated (but prob not $25K complicated).

Won't home owners insurance take care of that?

From what I have been told, the tree could be cut in pieces but the crane is necessary to lift the tree off the house (before cutting I assume) to not cause more damage to the house.

Will home owners insurance take care of that? Maybe? Probably? More than likely?

Will the current insurer and other insurers drop him and others after they do pay and leave the public with less but more expensive options moving forward?

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

You are talking about a very limited situation. Edward doesn't live in a hurricane area, and even in a hurricane, sky are usually clear by the next day. Hurricanes that stay over an area for extended time are a subset of a subset. The generators he is looking at can also be recharged using your car, making that a gas power generator of sorts.

Not to drag climate change talk into this thread but. I was listening to a podcast earlier today that suggested we should expect more storms to travel further inland while maintaining its strength a la Helene. He advised more of these inland communities to start drawing up plans for stronger building codes, evacuation routes, recovery processes etc.

In short, it is possible that he may be living in a hurricane area and just does not know it yet.

[GrantDawg]

But even in a hurricane, most of the time, it is bright in sunny 12 hours after the storm. Edward already said he is not trying to prep for the extremes, so I don't know why this matters. I related earlier about a guy who is a prepper and lives outside of Ashville. In a most extreme situation, he used two of these solar generators for all his needs for a week without ever firing up his gas generator.

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

No cliffs here in Myrtle Beach

I am glad you are safe, then.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

But even in a hurricane, most of the time, it is bright in sunny 12 hours after the storm. Edward already said he is not trying to prep for the extremes, so I don't know why this matters. I related earlier about a guy who is a prepper and lives outside of Ashville. In a most extreme situation, he used two of these solar generators for all his needs for a week without ever firing up his gas generator.

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

Oh I was not commenting on the merits of different types of generators. I was just commenting on the changes that might cause more areas of the country to become seen as hurricane areas and the effects of those storms changing how we need to plan and prepare for them. The extremes as we know them now may be becoming more normal.

[AlexB]

The images coming out of Spain after the floods are like a disaster movie - I’m not sure I’ve seen anything like it in Europe before

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czxrnlld95zo

158 dead and the number is expected to rise

[Ghost Econ]

So, we lived cooler to cooler for 10 days after the hurricane. After the power came on someone put them outside on the deck. I thought because they had been emptied and just needed a cleaning. Finally had free time to clean them... Nope... They had not been fully emptied.

Let me tell you, the smell of rotten food floating in water after sitting out for a month on a deck in a sealed cooler in 70-90 degrees is not a pleasant smell. I fact, it's an extremely unpleasant smell and I nearly puked my brains out.

I then tried to clean them with a mask and nose plug on, but even that wasn't enough. I finally just dragged them to the curb and put a "free" sign on them. If someone wants to try and go through the necessary effort or has anosmia, feel free to clean that up. Thankfully, it was maybe $50 in coolers, but damn was that horrifying.