STARK (GoT) Thread

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

What's Zinto's usual online schedule, hoops?

Spotty during the day, more around later evening hours, from what I've discerned in this game and others.

[Coffee Warlord]

Gonna prolly ship you over his way later today, then.

[Coffee Warlord]

Save your raven, too. I'm waiting on a maester report, and if it's favorable...Shit. It May Be Going Down.

[hoopsguy]

Sounds good. Ravens remain in their cages for now.

[Coffee Warlord]

Didn't expect Julio to flee.

Karstark! You're up!

[MrBug708]

Hunting?

[Coffee Warlord]

Damn skippy. Why the hell not. I sent you some troops, and sent the order in.

[Coffee Warlord]

Interesting.

Seems Stannis would prefer to lead the next fight against Renly, rather than have me do it.

[hoopsguy]

Hmm, does he have reason to believe that there is an advantage to him leading rather than you? Not sure what information you might have shared with him ...

[MrBug708]

Is he going to highgarden?

[Coffee Warlord]

Not that he shared. I basically let him know that, to my knowledge, the Greyjoys won't be helping Renly, and Renly was hit hard by the war - be a good time to attack.

Then I laid out another idea of me striking an inland province instead, and forcing him to either retreat to the coast (where Stannis could help with his fleet), or stand and fight solo.

He seems to favor the former right now. I'm assuming he'll attack a coastal province and force Renly onto land.

[Coffee Warlord]

I'd imagine he's hitting Storm's End directly, though I don't know. I'd do it if I was in his place, though. Go for the jugular and force him to fight or flee his best province.

[hoopsguy]

I assume that we/Stannis have good intel on Renly's forces at this point?

We still working with assumption that Joffrey will aid in the defense?

How comfortable are you that Greyjoy's won't aid Renly? I suspect this gets very interesting if we have 3 kings versus 2, particularly on ground chosen by the 3 king force.

[Coffee Warlord]

1 - I'll be letting him know once I get the report how he looks.

2 - Yes. Though, I'm still going to emissary you later in the day to Zinto and see what's up there.

3 - With Theon fleeing, less comfortable than I was yesterday. BUT, if he passed on everything to Balon, he should know it'd be beyond dumb for him to help out Renly.

[hoopsguy]

When pursuing the conversation with Joffrey, what are we going to be offering him? I have to believe he knows his options for being the winner of the game of thrones are remote at this time, so what is his inducement to side with us? I think we have to assume that Stannis and Renly will be providing him some motivation to take a course of action as well.

[Coffee Warlord]

Well...

Unless bannermen have some special condition of "your secondary goal is to have a shit-ton of lands and money in addition to winning", he sure as hell doesn't need extra lands and titles. What's the point?

At the end of the day, I can make the case I'm in the strongest position - and thusly offer the best chance of actually winning. Is there really anything beyond that that makes a damn bit of difference?

[Coffee Warlord]

Though it's fairly obvious that whoever Joff falls to, everyone will immediately be gunning for them. The question really is...would we have enough cash and men to take them all on.

[Coffee Warlord]

To which I answer...3 vs 1? Maybe, maybe not. I'm moderately certain me and Joff have the highest amount of troops, though so it's not entirely out of the question.

[hoopsguy]

OK, so do we put some level of implied threat out there that if he sides with Renly in this battle that it may be harder for him to choose his landing place at House Stark?

I'm not sure we can make that threat, as we want to end up with him or Renly at some point in the near future. Ideally him, if he doesn't sacrifice his troops saving Renly.

[hoopsguy]

Just trying to walk through what kind of coercion we feel like we can apply to Joffrey ... honestly not sure we have much that is unique to offer. He is going to pick who he thinks yields the best chance at bannerman victory, and I suspect that is what I'll stress in the conversation.

[hoopsguy]

Let me know when you want me to depart/return from Kings Landing. Ditto on raven choice if that is to happen after I leave for Kings Landing since I will not be able to monitor these communications during that window of time.

[Coffee Warlord]

Yeah, that's really the only appealing thing we can offer - blunt honesty (which hey, it's worked well for me thus far!). If other people offer anything beyond Best Chance of Winning, they're full of shit.

The raven idea I had may not apply - I was gonna have you send a message to Renly's bannerman Not Name Brienne, and hint he should just flee now, if he wants to live (seeing as a whole world of pain was headed their way). If Stannis leads the charge, won't bother. If, however, I DO strike first while you're away, go ahead and send that message. May convince him to flee while he can.

[Coffee Warlord]

And really, I was just waiting until I saw Zinto tooling around.

[hoopsguy]

OK, I'll send that raven if it is you initiating. Possibly a one word message.

RUN!

[Coffee Warlord]

Hmm. We outnumber him, but not by as much as I'd expected.

[hoopsguy]

Why did you expect to have a massive edge on Renly? They had 25K more men last time the two armies collided. You made up, assuming good info from Littlefinger, somewhere between 5-10K due to differential in deaths, and I'm bringing a host of men.

Does the info on Renly's force give you insight into the size of Joffrey's army that you did not previously possess?

[hoopsguy]

Also, in the event that I'm going to be departing soon and our communications will be limited - anything in particular you would like me to do with cash on hand? I'm perfectly fine being left to my own devices, but figured it was good protocol to ask on my first day as part of House Stark.

[Coffee Warlord]

No, I just realized why I was surprised - last time I 'scanned' him, he had Loras still with him. The difference in troops was now Loras's troops are directly his.

[Coffee Warlord]

Heh. I would say dedicate 5k to mercs for tomorrow, to bolster our forces in the event of war. Aside from that, no.

Though we could off someone...

[Coffee Warlord]

Anyway. Head on over, hoops. I see a Zinto on.

Dispatch Lord Tywin to Camp Joffrey

[MrBug708]

You control the vote today Robb

I went hunting after Theon, right?

[Coffee Warlord]

Yep. We'll see how that turns out.

[hoopsguy]

OK, so I assume putting the vote on Stannis had to do with some level of negotiations with the Greyjoy group?

No reply on the raven I sent yesterday. If you have any particular direction for where I should send one today let me know in the next hour. Otherwise, I'll be out for a few hours leading up to deadline and will make some selfish, Tywin-first type decision on the raven before departing.

[Coffee Warlord]

As I told Stannis -

1) It was partially due to talks with Greyjoys. I couldn't very well vote them twice while talking them out of helping Renly in this war.

2) Voting Greyjoys would have put us within a single vote of a tie. I don't want any damn part of that mess again.

[Coffee Warlord]

I'm kind of zonked out right now - minor plague, and my head is kinda fuzzy. Your call today, I think.

[Coffee Warlord]

That said...how'd things with Joff go?

[hoopsguy]

Talks with Joffrey went very well, assuming he actually does what was discussed.

I suggested that he would do well to conserve his men and ships, sit out the next war rather than side with Renly. I reminded him that he'll be a bigger catch for the next king if he has more assets.

He isn't in a hurry to bend the knee, going through same thought process I did in terms of fearing that the alliance he joins will be next one gang tackled. I reminded him that he won't be only king pondering bending the knee, so to carefully consider where he wants to land and not let Renly end up dictating that decision.

I've also got info on his current army size + ships + ballpark figure on troops he lost in last battle. Not sure if you want it publicly here or if you already have that info via maester report.

[Coffee Warlord]

Him, I don't have a number on.

So is he gonna side with ANYONE in this battle, in theory?

[hoopsguy]

No, sitting on sidelines for the battle is what he indicated. I personally think that is the right strategy for him if he doesn't think that a Renly/Greyjoy alliance is going to emerge to threaten us + Stannis.

But he might just be telling me what he wants you to hear. Guess we'll find out tomorrow.

[hoopsguy]

Also, per Littlefinger, on the day that I was captured neither Stannis nor Renly had discussions with either Joffrey or the Greyjoys.

Renly only spoke with Robb.
Stannis spoke with his Hand, as well as sending me a raven about potentially joining him. While ignoring a raven from Robb.

Curious - I expect they both sent emissaries to talk to the Greyjoys but I'm surprised that neither exchanged ravens with anyone from House Greyjoy or House Lannister.

[Coffee Warlord]

Heh. It looks like there's no more Us + Stannis, too. Us + Renly, however, might be on the books for a day or two.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Heh. It looks like there's no more Us + Stannis, too. Us + Renly, however, might be on the books for a day or two.

That is especially interesting in light of a reply I got from the Part I raven - that party was intrigued by the suggestion of stepping aside, but wanted some assurances from you that he would find himself protected from attacks from within as the game of thrones draws to a conclusion.

[Coffee Warlord]

Hard assurances, nobody can give. However, it's in my best interest to keep him safe and happy while the other two whittle each other down.

[Coffee Warlord]

How long I can pull this off is another question.

[hoopsguy]

1.) I wonder, if Stannis had a "do over" on Ser Gregor, if the Mountain would still be wandering the lands?
2.) Any insight into why he executed him? Looking to gain honor, perhaps? Some kind of rule about sacrifice for Melissandre to get a kill later?
3.) Feel like tipping your hand on how to proceed with Theon? I certainly can wait until after deadline, or whenever else, but my natural curiosity leads me to want to discuss it.
4.) Have there been discussions about how to proceed with the war? The Us + Renly seems to suggest there may have been ... but not sure just how fluid that might be as Stannis has returned his votes to Asha Greyjoy.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

Hard assurances, nobody can give. However, it's in my best interest to keep him safe and happy while the other two whittle each other down.

Well, depending on how you want to see it play out perhaps some kind of subtle nod in the main thread would get your the short-term result you seek.

[Coffee Warlord]

Oh oh, I was actually thinking of someone else. You're referring to that little bonus raven I had you send yesterday. That, hell yes. It profits me nothing to behead potential allies.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

1.) I wonder, if Stannis had a "do over" on Ser Gregor, if the Mountain would still be wandering the lands?
2.) Any insight into why he executed him? Looking to gain honor, perhaps? Some kind of rule about sacrifice for Melissandre to get a kill later?
3.) Feel like tipping your hand on how to proceed with Theon? I certainly can wait until after deadline, or whenever else, but my natural curiosity leads me to want to discuss it.
4.) Have there been discussions about how to proceed with the war? The Us + Renly seems to suggest there may have been ... but not sure just how fluid that might be as Stannis has returned his votes to Asha Greyjoy.

1 - I can't see any profit in killing a bannerman, unless you know they're gonna screw you. Wars rip through bannermen, as do assassins.

2 - Honestly, no. I thought it was a mistake then, I still do. Perhaps there is a hidden mechanic, but my own is WAY less complex, so I doubt it.

3 - See my above thoughts. I see no reason not to keep him. Plus, I have a SLIGHT suspicion, based on comments, this is part of his utterly convoluted goals.

4 - Tough one, coming soon.

[Coffee Warlord]

It sorta seems our best course of action is to sit this one out. We profit nothing here, and those two hurting each other certainly helps us. Balon has no reason to jump into this, nor does Joffrey.

Though, on the flipside, we COULD stand to deliver a crushing blow to one side or another...

[Coffee Warlord]

My main concern is burning too many bridges too fast. But, being the 500 lbs gorilla in the room when no one trusts the other does have its advantages.