WW LXVII - Heroes (GAME OVER! HEROES WIN!)

[Poli]

Originally Posted by Narcizo

VOTE NO LYNCH

There. I've said it.

I thought about doing the same thing last night, and if I don't see anything in the next 10 min before I go to work I'll be joining you.

[Poli]

Heh, quiet night w/o the drama. . Glad I'm not involved in it.

I'm thoroughly disappointed that we don't have any leads.

UNVOTE ALAN T

VOTE NO LYNCH

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Doing a quick scan of the players that might be in the game, here's who I think is more likely to be in the game:

Claire Bennett-the cheerleader's gotta be there to save the world.
Issac Mendez
Hiro Nakumura
Peter Petrelli
Sylar-duh
Niki Sanders
Matt Parkman
Maury Parkman
Noel Bennet
Bob Bishop
Angela Petrelli
Mohinder Surash
Adam Monroe

I picked these because they were either/and:
-integral to the story, which may not mean too much here
-clearly defined powers that would fit in this game
-"good/evil" counterbalanced powers-the Parkmans, Hiro/Adam, and Peter/Sylar
-Members of the Company on the show, some are likely to be in the game.

Remember though that our names don't necessairly pertain to our side in this game, so we shouldn't put too much weight on someone if their name is revealed and its an "evil name" from the show.

Close to my list, but I don't accept that some of the duplicate powers are going to be in the game. So on my "must be in game list" I don't have Sr. Parkman (duplicate with son) or Adam Monroe (duplicate with cheerleader). I also didn't have Bob Bishop on my list, but if you think he is there then I think his daughter would be there as well.

[Poli]

Hoops, I'm running late and have to hit the ice, I mean road.

My best guess is there are 'similar' powers if you will. Parkman and his dad both could do mind stuff, as I recall. Seems like there was another two powers I saw that were similar as well.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Narcizo

That's a fairly bizarre comment to make. What did you expect to happen? A seer to come out and say "hey! X is a wolf". Of course you haven't seen a bunch of information coming out. That doesn't mean the information isn't there, providing a bit of help to some villagers. Shirley.

The rationale that was being provided is that "we learn so much on Day 1 that we shouldn't push a lynch which will likely be wrong and potentially take out a good role". You can see that I didn't really buy into that logic - this is werewolf and we learn information by applying pressure to people. But over 50% of the people in the game voted no lynch.

So, it was more intended to suggest to people "don't go down this line of thought next game - no lynch sucks as a villager strategy".

And I frankly did expect someone to have something to contribute if we all have powers and were using them on other people to gather information, protect ourselves, etc. I'm still catching up on my reading, so maybe someone did learn something in the late-night crowd, but I was surprised that there was zero information publicly shared on Day 2.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Close to my list, but I don't accept that some of the duplicate powers are going to be in the game. So on my "must be in game list" I don't have Sr. Parkman (duplicate with son) or Adam Monroe (duplicate with cheerleader). I also didn't have Bob Bishop on my list, but if you think he is there then I think his daughter would be there as well.

You could be right about that Hoops, I just thought it would be appropriate for both sides to have similar powers for game balance. And story wise it'd be fun to have them in though that probably wasn't a strong consideration for JHeinz. For story reasons I suppose it would make sense to have Bishop's daughter there, but I just hate that character so I left her out.

[hoopsguy]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

These posts just struck me as odd. If you have a role that allows you to collect information/data, then having a no lynch on Day 1 would mostly be a plus for you, because you're able to collect additional information without risking killing a good guy on no information at all via the Day 1 lynch, right?

Well, not exactly. When I go public I think it will make more sense.

[Thomkal]

Yeah hoops I agree, I thought there would be some information coming out today given all the powers that might be in this game, so its disappointing nothing has.

[Thomkal]

Well at least now I have a good reason to vote for someone. No wolf would "push too strongly" on day 1 unless they were up for the vote. As good a player as Pass is, he would not spark a fight with Alan on day 1 if he was a wolf.

VOTE CHIEF RUM

[hoopsguy]

Thomkal, for what it is worth I think you are the best vote for today. It isn't from anything you've said, but more related to some of Passacaglia's posts earlier in the game. He seemed to be asking questions about why people made certain assumptions on Sylar/Company and I felt like he was trying to re-direct more than understand.

It has very little, if anything, to do with Pass vs Alan arguments.

I know that I can't ask you to explain Passacaglia's thought process before you entered the game, but unfortunately it is part of the track record in sizing you up in the game.

If you have thoughts on this, I would be interested in hearing them. I'll go drudge up posts to back this up if you think the impressions that I'm listing here are bogus.

[hoopsguy]

Narcizo, since you are in the thread now - I actually like the "No Lynch" argument a tad more today than I did yesterday in light of only one death. But I still have the same issues with it overall, in that we have to apply pressure on players in werewolf as a means of obtaining information. The "No Lynch" is an easy way out, a way of being polite to our fellow FOFC denizens. But it potentially destroys voting records, which are a significant part of mid/late game analysis. It also deters discussion when a majority of people head in that direction.

I've gone with the "No Lynch" at least once in a game before and I regretted doing so in the coming days for the reasons I've listed this game. I'm pretty sure I'll be registering a vote every day, with the possible (very improbable) exception of an end-game scenario.

[Alan T]

I just dropped jeheinz a note to say I won't drop out after all. Its not fair to him to bring drama into his game. I'm dropping my thoughts about certain things until after the game is over. No reason to bring more drama into his game.

[hoopsguy]

(OK, this is a perfect time for some snarky comment about Alan to really set him off ....)

[hoopsguy]

I don't think Alan should drop out of the game. I hope that he will see this and send JEHeinz a note apologizing for bringing drama to his game. Why not just drop his thoughts on certain things until after the game is over?

Why don't people read Alan's posts????

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Narcizo, since you are in the thread now - I actually like the "No Lynch" argument a tad more today than I did yesterday in light of only one death. But I still have the same issues with it overall, in that we have to apply pressure on players in werewolf as a means of obtaining information. The "No Lynch" is an easy way out, a way of being polite to our fellow FOFC denizens. But it potentially destroys voting records, which are a significant part of mid/late game analysis. It also deters discussion when a majority of people head in that direction.

I've gone with the "No Lynch" at least once in a game before and I regretted doing so in the coming days for the reasons I've listed this game. I'm pretty sure I'll be registering a vote every day, with the possible (very improbable) exception of an end-game scenario.

One of the reasons that I am in favor of No Lynch right now is because we have no solid information to work with and, in a game like this, where everyone has roles, information is more likely easier to come by if we all don't start killing off each other blindly.

I do understand the need to establish voting patterns and pressure, if we didn't stand to lose more than we were to gain if we did have a run-off vote. In a regular WW game, we do. With this game, however, With everyone having roles and abilities, we stand more to gain by going for a No Lynch right now.

As it is, we may be buying some much needed time for our seers or whoever else has powers that can help.

Then again, if reliable information does show up, I will probably move my vote to act on it.

[Neon_Chaos]

Why are my posts not adding!?!?!

Did someone turn off the post count on Werewolf games!?!?!?

[Neon_Chaos]

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

Thomkal, for what it is worth I think you are the best vote for today. It isn't from anything you've said, but more related to some of Passacaglia's posts earlier in the game. He seemed to be asking questions about why people made certain assumptions on Sylar/Company and I felt like he was trying to re-direct more than understand.

It has very little, if anything, to do with Pass vs Alan arguments.

I know that I can't ask you to explain Passacaglia's thought process before you entered the game, but unfortunately it is part of the track record in sizing you up in the game.

If you have thoughts on this, I would be interested in hearing them. I'll go drudge up posts to back this up if you think the impressions that I'm listing here are bogus.

Hoops I understand why people think Pass was suspicious. Again I just question that a wolf would put himself out like that, especially in a game where we had a no lynch on day 1, thus no voting patterns to use in our discussion today. He's a target for some simply because there's almost no other targets on what acquaints to a typical WW day 1 type situation. I think its time to put pressure on those who keep trying to make Pass's comments seem anything more than just a villager speculating.

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

One of the reasons that I am in favor of No Lynch right now is because we have no solid information to work with and, in a game like this, where everyone has roles, information is more likely easier to come by if we all don't start killing off each other blindly.

I do understand the need to establish voting patterns and pressure, if we didn't stand to lose more than we were to gain if we did have a run-off vote. In a regular WW game, we do. With this game, however, With everyone having roles and abilities, we stand more to gain by going for a No Lynch right now.

As it is, we may be buying some much needed time for our seers or whoever else has powers that can help.

Then again, if reliable information does show up, I will probably move my vote to act on it.

I have to disagree with you here Neon Chaos. I thought it was fine to have a no lynch on day 1, but we really need to get some voting patterns going. And who knows how much information will come out after the vote today? We simply can't afford another day like today with little or no information to work off on. And I say this with my name high on the block to be voted out.

[Barkeep49]

Couple of notes.

First, I deleted the whole weird hoops post thing. Can't have people padding their post counts like that. Actually, with board hiccups and duplicate posts I routinely clean that up.

Second, a reminder that there is to be no name calling. We can play intensely without drooping to that level.

~Barkeep49, YFWWM

[mauchow]

Despite not posting much, I've been following very closely. I don't have much more to add at this point so I don't believe I can say anything to sway anybody towards a certain plan. I really want to vote for somebody today.

I hate to vote anybody at this point but to be different than everybody else, I'm going to put a vote on someone.

My reasoning? None really. Just to get my vote out there on someone.

Vote Neon Chaos

[mauchow]

I'm working today through the deadline. I don't imagine having time to stop back in for the rest of the day. Hopefully I can, but no big deal if I don't. I'll catch up.

[Barkeep49]

We need to start consolidating around some candidates. At the moment only No Lynch and Thomkal have multiple votes. I am not thrilled about the prospect of voting Thomkal and am hoping that a second lynching candidate arises. Otherwise I will be casting my vote in Thomkal's direction.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

We need to start consolidating around some candidates. At the moment only No Lynch and Thomkal have multiple votes. I am not thrilled about the prospect of voting Thomkal and am hoping that a second lynching candidate arises. Otherwise I will be casting my vote in Thomkal's direction.

I was just thinking this, we are totaly all over the place today.

We need to start getting some questions answered.

Vote Thomkal

This is my vote for now. Last game I was killed early becasue it gave us the most information at the time. This is the same premiss. If Thomkal comes up good I think we can trust alan a bit more. Alan is an uber valuable villager but also has a talent to string people along as a wolf.

[Barkeep49]

You don't think it would be beyond alan to confront a fellow wolf early on?

[Thomkal]

I will reveal my name and power if that will help sway people to move their votes, but you likely won't want me to do that.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

You don't think it would be beyond alan to confront a fellow wolf early on?

if thomkal is a wolf then Alan may be, is there someting I wasn't clear about?

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by Lathum

if thomkal is a wolf then Alan may be, is there someting I wasn't clear about?

I see. So you think it's unlikely a wolf alan would defend himself that way? I'm just confused how lynching Thomkal tells us anything about alan.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

I see. So you think it's unlikely a wolf alan would defend himself that way? I'm just confused how lynching Thomkal tells us anything about alan.

Pass and AlanT were sparring day one. Thomkal took over for Pass. If they are wolves putting on an act, which you just said you wouldn't put past Alan, the only way we find out is by killing one of them.

If thomkal comes up clean obviously they weren't putting on an act. If he comes up wolf maybe they were putting on an act.

[The Jackal]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I was just thinking this, we are totaly all over the place today.

We need to start getting some questions answered.

Vote Thomkal

This is my vote for now. Last game I was killed early becasue it gave us the most information at the time. This is the same premiss. If Thomkal comes up good I think we can trust alan a bit more. Alan is an uber valuable villager but also has a talent to string people along as a wolf.

I like your line of thinking here. Somewhat surprised Render hasn't said anything, but we can deal with that later.

Unvote Render
Vote Thomkal

[The Jackal]

I was going to expand on the vote count someone posted earlier but the post #'s in my thread don't match up for some reason. That being said, I think it's 4 on Thomkal, and 3 on No Lynch at the moment.

[Thomkal]

can we get an updated voting tally soon please?

[Thomkal]

heh posted before I saw Jackal's post obviously.

[Neon_Chaos]

Here we go. It's currently thomkal ahead with 4 votes. The post numbers are different from the other counts maybe because of BK's modding.

thomkal - claphamsa (318), chief rum (434), lathum (474), jackal (480)
ardent - st.cronin (328)
claphamsa - nfg (457)
nfg - alan t (426)
greyroofoo - schmidty (443)
oliegirl - mr.wednesday (444)
No lynch - narcizo (445), neonchaos (447), ardent (452)
chief rum - thomkal (459)
neonchaos - mauboy (471)

[oliegirl]

Wow - a lot to get through...here are my thoughts...

1. I'm glad Alan didn't drop out, and I agree that the name calling needs to stop. It's one thing to say a theory is off base, but to start getting personal is just unnecessary. Yeah, it's an intense game, but we can all treat each other with respect...

2. I'm really concerned with those who are using information from the show as a way of forming theories/ideas. Heinz was very specific when he said that a role in the game would not necessarily correlate to the character on the show. He went so far as to say someone good on the show could be evil in the game and vice versa. I think that is the main reason we should not reveal roles at this point...those who follow the show (which I don't) would be very easily swayed by this and could get everyone way off track by saying "well this character is good/evil or has this power on the show, so I'm voting for them/not voting for them".

3. As for Mr. Wednesdays vote on me b/c I was quiet yesterday - I got some very bad, devastating news about my father yesterday, there is a thread in GD where I'm asking for prayers...I went into shut down mode and was not in a frame of mind to deal with anything yesterday, let alone a WW game. I'm here today, a bit shell shocked so I can't guarantee that I'm going to be overly vocal, but I will be staying in the game and will certainly contribute when I have something to say.

4. I think a no lynch vote today is a huge huge mistake. I voted no lynch yesterday but made it clear that I thought we needed to lynch someone today. Unfortunately, lynching villagers is a part of WW, it has to be considered collateral damage - as a villager, I hate to take the chance, but we have to be proactive, we can't just sit around and wait for the wolves to make their move.

Thats all for now...

[Neon_Chaos]

I think us No Lynch people are not going to get enough votes and there is a building sentiment towards lynching and forcing pressure on a couple of people.

If a majority of the people are set on considering lynching someone, and Thomkal is the most likely candidate for lynching over the No Lynch choice, perhaps we should make this race be between two or three people, and not a choice of Thomkal and No Lynch, which generates no pressure at all.

I will consider switching to lynching someone if this is indeed what the majority wants to do.

[SnDvls]

Vote Ardent

it just concerns me he says he has no night power and doesn't sit well with me.

[Schmidty]

Let's make this interesting then:

Unvote greyroofoo

Vote No Lynch

[hoopsguy]

I'm going to have a hard time participating this morning. But I'm definitely looking to see us move in the lynch direction. I agree that having an alternate candidate alongside Thomkal makes sense.

I'll return to my candidate from yesterday for the alternate candidate. No information learned about him (I'm not trying to be subtle/crafty or anything of the sort) overnight, just figure that since he was the leading vote getter behind "No Lynch" yesterday that there may be more to learn from him on a vote than others.


VOTE THE JACKAL

[nfg22]

I have nothing to add but I likely wont be around after the deadline untill midnight.

[hoopsguy]

Also, I was really hoping yesterday that Chief Rum or one of the late-night guys was going to have some meaningful information for us to act on - playing blind for two days in a row kinda sucks.

[Thomkal]

thanks Neon for the updated vote count, and the call to put pressure on someone else besides "No Lynch" where the wolves can all hide. I am still willing to reveal my name/power, but again would prefer not to.

[path12]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

hoops: I think discussing which names are in the game would be useful but I don't know the show and thus couldn't contribute to the conversation.

Ditto about not knowing the show. But is there a way to discuss which names are in the game without coming out and saying what yours is?

[Thomkal]

Oh and Ollegirl I haven't read the GD post, but you are certainly in my thoughts today.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

The voting has seemed very weird to me the last two days.

Just want to reiterate this, I haven't really understood any of the reasons for the votes yet.

[nfg22]

Lets get a two way race going. I kind of like Thomkal and think maybe Alan was overreacting. im going to go after Jackal so we can get him and Thom talking.


Unvote Claph

Vote Thomkal

[path12]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

OK, here are my notes. Alan, if you have some others to plug in please do. Also, I think I posted this but did not write it down for my own notes - I'm a hero in game and hero on show. I have not commented on closeness of powers up to this point.

Alan - character was a good guy on show (83)
Lathum - power lines up with show (85)
Grey - power somewhat close to show (88)
Cronin - power doesn't match up with season one (103), nobody would guess power if given name (348)
NTN - hero, power matches closely to show (105)
Render - hero, worthless power (113)
BK - hero, power crammed into WW (114), revealing name would not give away power (123)
nfg - power pretty useless (168)
MrW - power reasonable extrapolation from show (179)
Chief - hero, similar power to show, only seen first few episodes (208)
DT - part of powers logical, part is a leap (266)
AE - doesn't have night power (270), role is passive of sorts, thinks there are others out there like him (287)
SnDvls - character name would not indicate powers (344)

hoops, I've deduced from wiki and other posts that my power is likely to match up pretty well with the show FWIW.

[nfg22]

oops. I wasnt thinking...

Unvote Thomkal

Vote The Jackal

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by nfg22

I usually try to be nice...Im sorry if I offended you. Yet, take a little heat man. Last game everyone killed me cause I talked alot, which I am again, but I didnt quit and hate it.

They voiced complaints at me for two days, yet I took it. Now I am back.

Just deal with it bro.

You can be confrontational without teh namecalling and insults that you used. As a player who went through a phase like that I can only ask you to stop and be much more civil in the future.

Originally Posted by Narcizo

Seriously then. Is there any reason not to reveal your name? If nothing else it should clear you from being Sylar. (seems like a huge risk for him to guess an unused name at this stage). The reason I've been against name reveals is because it could reveal powers. If it really is impossible to deduce your power from your name I don't see much reason to hold onto it.

I can back this idea, if its not going to reveal your power, lets have a name.

Originally Posted by Narcizo

That's a fairly bizarre comment to make. What did you expect to happen? A seer to come out and say "hey! X is a wolf". Of course you haven't seen a bunch of information coming out. That doesn't mean the information isn't there, providing a bit of help to some villagers. Shirley.

Again, I like how you think here. With every player having some sort of ability I really don't expect a ton of info to get divulged until perhaps day 4 or later. People need time to build up their data.

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Which means that there's a 0% chance that they're a behind-the-scenes alignment, because no one is that stupid.

True enough, but realize just how cunning some of these guys can be and tehy could have used this very logic against us, Yes?

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Why? WTF did he do. I'm baffled. He said Alan was being vague? Is that a bad thing now days? Man, this makes me miss Blade. There are different play styles. Not everyone is going to be hoops or Alan or CR. Name calling is obviously not good at all, but his intial comment that set Alan off was innocuous imo.

Quitting the game over it? Puhhllease. Maybe I'll quit if this is what WW has become.

NFG really was over the line for what was being said at the time, maybe he was in a bad mood, maybe he was just trying to push his buttons, I dunno, but reading his posts *I* was kinda pissed at him for being a dick, so its not just Alan seeing the problem here.

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

And I frankly did expect someone to have something to contribute if we all have powers and were using them on other people to gather information, protect ourselves, etc. I'm still catching up on my reading, so maybe someone did learn something in the late-night crowd, but I was surprised that there was zero information publicly shared on Day 2.

Color me stupified but I have to admit I'm really seeing Hoops' point here. For the first time since he screwed me over I actually get good vibes from you Hoopsy.

Originally Posted by Alan T

I just dropped jeheinz a note to say I won't drop out after all. Its not fair to him to bring drama into his game. I'm dropping my thoughts about certain things until after the game is over. No reason to bring more drama into his game.

Good deal Alan, glad you're sticking around.

Originally Posted by Thomkal

Hoops I understand why people think Pass was suspicious. Again I just question that a wolf would put himself out like that, especially in a game where we had a no lynch on day 1, thus no voting patterns to use in our discussion today. He's a target for some simply because there's almost no other targets on what acquaints to a typical WW day 1 type situation. I think its time to put pressure on those who keep trying to make Pass's comments seem anything more than just a villager speculating.

If it was anyone but Pass here I might agree with you, but I've watched Pass play the helpful villager gambit a couple times now and he's VERY good at it. So I understand the suspicion completely and in some ways believe he might have tried it again. Unfortunately for YOU, you have to deal with that backlash.

Originally Posted by Schmidty

Let's make this interesting then:

Unvote greyroofoo

Vote No Lynch

How does THIS make anything interesting? We needcompeting votes on Players, not on No lynch.


I'm gonna throw a vote down on someone I know is usually much more vocal and since I have nothing more to go on:


VOTE NEON CHAOS

[RendeR]

And to respond to whoever it was that mentioned me being quiet, this 1pm deadline is hard for me. I have to watch the kids in the morning and then I go to work at 2pm, so it falls at the worst possible time of day for me.

I usually post the most from work when I'm bored =)