FBI Opens Investigation into Shooting of Michael Brown

[Radii]

BTW, just to be clear since it's not getting much attention here and I'm one of the more "aggressive" far left voices - if someone identifying with "Antifa" brings a gun to a protest in Portland and shoots a MAGA asshole, he should be charged with murder as well.

[sterlingice]

Yup - that's kindof how it's supposed to work. Kill a person in premeditated fashion, be charged with murder. I think most of us assume that's how it's supposed to work. Even though we're seeing arguments to the contrary.

SI

[Ksyrup]

Get with the program - there are "fine, well-regulated militias" on both sides.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

but doesn't appear to be threatening or instigating anything

I feel like walking around a protest with a rifle is kind of doing that. Not to mention he was already a criminal at that point for illegally carrying a weapon. Whatever the case is, he admitted on camera he was going into harm's way which hurts his self-defense claims.

Just seems like if you are illegally carrying with your white supremacist buddy and driving 30 minutes away, your intention is probably not to protect the Applebees.

[RainMaker]

Also video of the right-wing hero assaulting a young woman.

New video of Kyle Rittenhouse the murderer. Here he is beating up a woman on camera. But yea he is a good kid because he was “ Cleaning up graffiti “ Get that shit out here. pic.twitter.com/KzxQmxwohn

— BlackCultureEntertainment�� (@4TheCulture____) August 29, 2020

[RainMaker]

The stuff about this gang within the police department has been out for awhile. But seems nothing has been done.

Deputy Who Shot Gardena Teen Was “Chasing Ink�

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I feel like walking around a protest with a rifle is kind of doing that. Not to mention he was already a criminal at that point for illegally carrying a weapon. Whatever the case is, he admitted on camera he was going into harm's way which hurts his self-defense claims.

Just seems like if you are illegally carrying with your white supremacist buddy and driving 30 minutes away, your intention is probably not to protect the Applebees.

Not to mention the accounts of him instigating shit and pointing his rifle at someone walking through the parking lot right before he killed the first person.

[PilotMan]

'Member that time that that those patriots killed that 15yrd old because he was 'disrespectfully looking' at that white woman?

Innocence is such a malleable thing.

[Brian Swartz]

I find myself as usual on a relative middle road here. I don't buy that merely having a gun is instigating/unhealthy/dangerous/posing a threat, etc.

But when you use said gun to shoot somebody, yeah there are consequences. Rittenhouse may be many things, but hero is not among them.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

Yup - that's kindof how it's supposed to work. Kill a person in premeditated fashion, be charged with murder. I think most of us assume that's how it's supposed to work. Even though we're seeing arguments to the contrary.

I would hope so too but I'm unsure enough about assumptions these days that it felt like it was worth mentioning

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

I find myself as usual on a relative middle road here. I don't buy that merely having a gun is instigating/unhealthy/dangerous/posing a threat, etc.

But when you use said gun to shoot somebody, yeah there are consequences. Rittenhouse may be many things, but hero is not among them.

I'm curious about this as I don't have an answer for it myself, but when does it become a threat?

If someone is pointing a gun at someone else, is that enough? By the time they pull a trigger, it seems too late. Even if they have a safety on, can the "target" be expected to know that when they think their life is in eminent danger?

SI

[Brian Swartz]

I would say it depends on the situation. But if we're in a protest scenario, a lot of people in public scenario, then yes I would equate pointing it at someone with dropping into a fighting stance/cocking your fists/etc. Becomes a threat at that point. Having the gun on you for whatever reasons you might choose but not actively pointing/aiming/brandishing it at people? Not a threat, just as having many other weapons on you (knife etc.) is not an inherent threat.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by sterlingice

I'm curious about this as I don't have an answer for it myself, but when does it become a threat?

If someone is pointing a gun at someone else, is that enough? By the time they pull a trigger, it seems too late. Even if they have a safety on, can the "target" be expected to know that when they think their life is in eminent danger?

SI

Pointing a gun at someone is textbook (as in law school 101) assault. So I'd say that's a high likelihood

[RainMaker]

Feds awfully slow to charge him for crossing state lines illegally with a weapon. Barr told us he was going to be especially hard on out-of-state criminals. Weird.

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Feds awfully slow to charge him for crossing state lines illegally with a weapon. Barr told us he was going to be especially hard on out-of-state criminals. Weird.

You should definitely not quote me on this, as I don't remember where or when I read this, but I read that someone gave him the gun when he got there.

[ISiddiqui]

Holy fuck...

Plea Deal Required Drug Suspect To Name Breonna Taylor A 'Co-Defendant' : NPR

Now it appears prosecutors attempted to tie Taylor to a life of crime after her death.

Glover was arrested the same night Taylor was killed, in a separate raid on an alleged drug house about 10 miles away. Police say they "recovered approximately 119.032 grams (4.2 ounces) of cocaine and over 10 dosage units of opiates," according to court records.

Glover's attorney, Scott Barton, told NPR that as part of a lengthy plea negotiation, the Jefferson Commonwealth's Attorney's office offered Glover a deal that included naming Taylor as a member of his "organized crime syndicate."

Barton said that he no longer has a copy of the initial plea offer but that his client "immediately rejected anything with her name in it."

[RainMaker]

Gunfire in a Tallahassee parking lot leads to arrest of armed couple, complaints of racism

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

You should definitely not quote me on this, as I don't remember where or when I read this, but I read that someone gave him the gun when he got there.

I know nothing about gun laws, but wouldn't than mean it wasn't his gun, thus making it a crime as well?

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I know nothing about gun laws, but wouldn't than mean it wasn't his gun, thus making it a crime as well?

It's not a crime to loan someone a gun. In many (most?) states, it's not a crime to give someone else a gun.

This shouldn't be confused with buying a gun on behalf of a convicted felon, which is a crime, and one of the things you have to assert that you're specifically not doing when you fill out the form for your background check. (The same form where you also assert that you're not addicted to marijuana.)

ETA: Link to the 4473 for the curious: https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/44...53009/download

[CrimsonFox]

Black man dies after police cover his head with hood and press his face into the ground while he is naked and handcuffed

Anyone have a police manual? Call me kooky but if you see someone that is high, I'm pretty sure tying a bag around their head and shoving their face into the pavement is not proper procedure. Could you look it up for me?

[AlexB]

At the same time if that person says they have Covid and starts spitting at them, they have to do something.

And before the inevitable replies, no: I’m not saying the man deserved to die, but just pointing out again that these things are rarely simple

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by AlexB

At the same time if that person says they have Covid and starts spitting at them, they have to do something.

And before the inevitable replies, no: I’m not saying the man deserved to die, but just pointing out again that these things are rarely simple

That was what the spit guard was for. Pushing his face into the ground until he suffocated and died was just pure malice.

[sterlingice]

Anyone want to lay odds that in the next couple of days we're going to find out via social media that most of these cops think corona is a hoax, but it's convenient if you want an excuse to use excessive force.

SI

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by AlexB

At the same time if that person says they have Covid and starts spitting at them, they have to do something.

And before the inevitable replies, no: I’m not saying the man deserved to die, but just pointing out again that these things are rarely simple

Where does the Covid claim come from? Does he say that on video?

[AlexB]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Where does the Covid claim come from? Does he say that on video?

I got it from this article:

Daniel Prude: New York police used 'spit hood' on man who died of asphyxiation - BBC News

The video shows that Mr Prude complied immediately when officers arrived on the scene and ordered him to lie on the ground and put his hands behind his back. He can be heard saying: "Sure thing, sure thing."

He becomes agitated, at times swearing at the officers who surround him and spitting, but he does not appear to offer any physical resistance, according to the footage.

Mr Prude told officers he was infected with coronavirus, and they placed a white "spit hood" over his head.

One officer is seen pressing down with both hands on Mr Prude's head and saying: "Stop spitting."...

[NobodyHere]

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Need link to the story before commenting but the video on its own is kinda funny. Hope it wasn't an innocent bystander but more a darwin award nominee.

[ISiddiqui]

So I came across this Tweet, which I think is quite interesting:

https://twitter.com/ImIncorrigible/s...50799334166528

This was from 1967. Where even after the Civil Rights Act and the Voting Rights Act and the March in Selma, etc. people still saw MLK as being an agitator and doing violent protests. I think it's a good lesson to learn.

[RainMaker]

This seems like a good idea.

A new program in Denver that sends a paramedic+a mental health expert to 911 calls instead of police launched amid calls for alternatives to policing. So far, the van has taken more than 350 calls without once having to call in police backup: https://t.co/GWuTXfT6M8

— Elise Schmelzer (@EliseSchmelzer) September 8, 2020

[I. J. Reilly]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

This seems like a good idea.

A new program in Denver that sends a paramedic+a mental health expert to 911 calls instead of police launched amid calls for alternatives to policing. So far, the van has taken more than 350 calls without once having to call in police backup: https://t.co/GWuTXfT6M8

— Elise Schmelzer (@EliseSchmelzer) September 8, 2020

No wonder police unions hate this stuff.

[Atocep]

I don't know how anyone could argue that the way we police is a success. It's time to start looking for alternative ways to address some things and mental health is probably the best place to start.

And yeah, unions are going to look for any way to shut this shit down or poke holes in it.

[cuervo72]

So wait, did we not even link the story about the 13yo autistic boy who was shot?

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

So wait, did we not even link the story about the 13yo autistic boy who was shot?

I will admit to getting flummoxed about which is the appropriate thread to post a particular shooting, according to the races, politics, or occupations involved. USA!

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Atocep

I don't know how anyone could argue that the way we police is a success. It's time to start looking for alternative ways to address some things and mental health is probably the best place to start.

And yeah, unions are going to look for any way to shut this shit down or poke holes in it.

first time one of these responders gets killed it will be used as evidence that they should have just called a cop with a gun.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by stevew

first time one of these responders gets killed it will be used as evidence that they should have just called a cop with a gun.

Exactly

Never mind that police officers are also killed on duty and civilians are safer with this arrangement.

SI

[Radii]

Originally Posted by thesloppy

I will admit to getting flummoxed about which is the appropriate thread to post a particular shooting, according to the races, politics, or occupations involved. USA!

The intersting thing with the police shooting the 13 year old with mental health issues is that the MAGA assholes / "All Lives Matter" crowd has nothing at all to say there. When a black man shot and killed a 5 year old boy a few weeks ago "all lives matter" was out in full force wondering with BLM people weren't raising it as an issue. The reason, of course, is that the black man who killed the boy was arrested and will be prosecuted.

BLM activists are VERY interested in the police shooting a 13 year old with mental health issues regardless of that person's race because the police are being put on administrative duty while the shooting is investigated and the pattern of protecting police brutality appears to continue, regardless of whether the victim is black or white.

It's a huge deal and it should be a huge deal to everyone - but, it isn't, because apparently if you're a racist in America a few 13 year old white kids with autism being shot is just the collateral needed to uphold systemic racism in our policing institution.

[PilotMan]

As the father of a 25 yr old on the spectrum, who has already had a negative experience with the police, any future interaction of a serious nature is really scary. And he's not even black. I mean, when the police officer says to you, I don't know what it means when you say he's on the autism spectrum, all I can do is shut up and get the fuck out of there.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

As the father of a 25 yr old on the spectrum, who has already had a negative experience with the police, any future interaction of a serious nature is really scary. And he's not even black. I mean, when the police officer says to you, I don't know what it means when you say he's on the autism spectrum, all I can do is shut up and get the fuck out of there.

Yeah the intersection of this shooting and the story above from Denver is especially interesting. The police should not have been the resource coming to that family's house

[RainMaker]

Sort of feels like an assassination.

Witness says officers never gave commands before firing at Michael Reinoehl outside WA apartment - oregonlive.com

[thesloppy]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Sort of feels like an assassination.

Witness says officers never gave commands before firing at Michael Reinoehl outside WA apartment - oregonlive.com

That whole situation has been such a clusterfuck, everyone involved is sketchy as hell and several people who weren't involved were misidentified as victim or shooter, over the course of the first few days. To some degree, I'm glad the whole national response has been relatively muted because it's been poorly handled all-around and more chaos is all that story has to offer at the moment.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Sort of feels like an assassination.

Witness says officers never gave commands before firing at Michael Reinoehl outside WA apartment - oregonlive.com

This definitely was attempted assassination.

L.A. Protesters Try to Break Into Hospital Where Two Officers Are in Critical Condition After 'A Cowardly' Shooting

So BLM supporters think it's OK to block emergency room access to crow over the fact that two cops were in critical condition.

[NobodyHere]

Now I see the NFL is pimping BLM on the Fox kickoff show.

*Turns off TV*

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

This definitely was attempted assassination.

L.A. Protesters Try to Break Into Hospital Where Two Officers Are in Critical Condition After 'A Cowardly' Shooting

So BLM supporters think it's OK to block emergency room access to crow over the fact that two cops were in critical condition.

You really think these are true BLM supporters? Nobody with any concern for human life, sense of decency or interest in supporting social justice would do such a horrible and heartless thing? Fuck no, whatever their agenda these people are complete scum and devoid of any soul. Fuck them and fuck the cowardly piece of shit that shot those officers.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Now I see the NFL is pimping BLM on the Fox kickoff show.

*Turns off TV*

The best way to kill a movement is to appropriate it for your own desires.

[JPhillips]

Don't you know, all black people are the same.

The article, which is hot garbage, never mentions BLM.

[cuervo72]

I can't believe anyone still watches the Fox pregame show.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

You really think these are true BLM supporters?

The protesters? Absolutely.

The shooter? Maybe.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by PilotMan

The best way to kill a movement is to appropriate it for your own desires.

The subtitle of my book on how NWA transitioned to Ice Cube in Disney movies.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

The protesters? Absolutely.

The shooter? Maybe.

You miss the point completely. Actions like this do not represent or further the cause of Black Lives Matter or social injustice, So no, they do not support or represent the message/cause any more than Proud Boys stand for conservative America. You can claim a cause and have absolutely no connection to it's principals or values.

Stop painting with a broad brush, it only gets you further away from reality. It's borderline ridiculous how some think this is a game of tit for tat, where you have to pick sides, instead of actually trying to have dialogue and work together for a solution. And that comment is not directed at you personally, just a general observation on what I see a lot of.

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by cuervo72

I can't believe anyone still watches the Fox pregame show.

That was my first mistake.