Big 10 Expansion Thread -Big Ten ready for a playoff .. finally?

[NorvTurnerOverdrive]

talk about scorched earth

When asked about the Texas Longhorns and the rumored mutual interest between the two, Swofford complimented the school but said he couldn't comment. Later, he called the ACC's revenue sharing arrangement "sacred," which would seem to rule out the onboarding of Texas and its Longhorn Network if true.

Then, Swofford admitted the ACC's basketball tournament could move to Madison Square Garden on a rotational basis. Which, whoa! Moving the conference's most prized event out of North Carolina would be a dramatic shift and signal that it thinks of itself as the east coast's conference, not just the other southeastern conference. Can't imagine Tobacco Road is very happy about hearing that, though.

link

[Radii]

I would love to see the ACC tournament rotate between MSG and DC and Charlotte and Atlanta,and I guess St. Pete.

[Chubby]

I totally could see a rotation between NC and NYC for the tourny, i don't see any benefit to expanding it beyond that

[JonInMiddleGA]

Maybe I'm just odd but honestly (with the exception of the tournament to MSG possibility mentioned above, which would turn me against the whole mess) I find myself almost completely apathetic about the two additions.

It's pretty much two teams I don't give a shit about one way or the other ... but that's nothing new with the ACC since I've felt the same way about the previous BE additions to the conference. Heck, I imagine NC State & UNC felt that way about GT when they were added so I'm not exactly setting the Jackets up as being above anybody else or anything of that sort. It's just a really meh sort of thing to me as a fan. Basketball gets tougher, football remains mediocre, I don't think does much for any other sports one way or the other with the exception of women's basketball where I badly want GT to beats the hell out of Pitt every time they see them (fuck Berenato, GT got the better end of the deal when she bailed anyway).

It's not anything I'm excited about, it's not even a switch that I truly hate (like some of the non-geographic ones being discussed in other conferences), it's just ... meh.

[Buccaneer]

Let's see: MSG in NYC vs. a colosseum in...what?...Greensboro. But rotating between the northern tier (NYC) and the southern tier (Charlotte, Atlanta?) makes sense.

I'm too biased regarding WVU and Rutgers to want either of them to have a soft landing. It should have been SU (or even Pitt) that moved to the ACC several years ago instead of VT and BC. But even if SU has to be in the same conference as those two colleges, at least it can try to bring UConn to have another decent basketball school to play with. Does Rutgers even have a basketball team?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Chubby

I totally could see a rotation between NC and NYC for the tourny, i don't see any benefit to expanding it beyond that

You know that Atlanta is already part of the rotation for the basketball tournament, right? Has been since 1983.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Chubby

I totally could see a rotation between NC and NYC for the tourny, i don't see any benefit to expanding it beyond that

2001 - georgia dome
2005 - MCI Center in DC
2007 - St Pete Times Forum
2009 - Georgia Dome

this year it's in Phillips Arena in Atlanta.

[britrock88]

I'm amused at all the comments to the effect that the Big Ten will be left behind by staying at 12 members.

The requirement to hold a conference championship football game is a minimum of 12 teams. There are no added benefits to going beyond 12 members as far as league competitiveness is concerned. Teams play each other less often, for one. Also, no matter the number of members in a conference, there we always be a similar distribution of teams at the front of the TV ratings / merchandising revenue pack and bringing up the rear within a conference.

Beyond that, look at the modern history of conferences with more than 12 members. The WAC and C-USA have both had their try, and their 14-16 team configurations broke up within about 5 years, as the princes tired of propping up the paupers and bolted -- creating the MWC, or joining the Big East en masse. And now that Pitt and Syracuse are jumping for the ACC, the Big East's massive all-sports configuration, which lasted the longest (reaching 14 teams in 1991), is possibly crumbling before us.

All in all, I think configurations of more than 12 teams have proved unsustainable. So in 5 to 15 years, when the SEC, ACC, and other conferences splinter, the Big Ten will (at this rate) still have its strong group of 12 members, and will likely emerge in a very profitable position.

[panerd]

My only request is we stop with the use B1G for the Big Ten... please. It really is the even worse than the division names and those are dumb.

[terpkristin]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

Indeed. And everything I've heard about WVU is that their fans are crazy for the team. Bowls love 'em, because the fans will travel and people will watch.

I wish I had something nice to say about WVU fans but after yesterday's game, I find them reprehensible. Dirty, rude, and generally just a-holes. I really hope that Maryland fans, when we travel, aren't as bad as the WVU fans were yesterday. And I'm not even talking about the stadium (where they were obnoxious but expectedly so), I'm talking about the tailgaters.

I was disappointed to see the news this morning about Pitt and 'Cuse joining the ACC. I know it doesn't make sense financially for the ACC to be small, but I loved the days when we played everybody in football and in basketball when we played every team twice. It made it feel like it was a bit more of an even/true playing field. Alas in this day and age, I get it that it just won't happen...

/tk

[Toddzilla]

UConn and Texas, UConn and Texas, UConn and Texas. That's all the "sources" down in Charlotte can talk about.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by terpkristin

I wish I had something nice to say about WVU fans but after yesterday's game, I find them reprehensible. Dirty, rude, and generally just a-holes. I really hope that Maryland fans, when we travel, aren't as bad as the WVU fans were yesterday. And I'm not even talking about the stadium (where they were obnoxious but expectedly so), I'm talking about the tailgaters.

I want you to know that you're not the only one who shares this opinion - It's pretty universal.

[MrBug708]

Originally Posted by britrock88

I'm amused at all the comments to the effect that the Big Ten will be left behind by staying at 12 members.

The requirement to hold a conference championship football game is a minimum of 12 teams. There are no added benefits to going beyond 12 members as far as league competitiveness is concerned. Teams play each other less often, for one. Also, no matter the number of members in a conference, there we always be a similar distribution of teams at the front of the TV ratings / merchandising revenue pack and bringing up the rear within a conference.

Beyond that, look at the modern history of conferences with more than 12 members. The WAC and C-USA have both had their try, and their 14-16 team configurations broke up within about 5 years, as the princes tired of propping up the paupers and bolted -- creating the MWC, or joining the Big East en masse. And now that Pitt and Syracuse are jumping for the ACC, the Big East's massive all-sports configuration, which lasted the longest (reaching 14 teams in 1991), is possibly crumbling before us.

All in all, I think configurations of more than 12 teams have proved unsustainable. So in 5 to 15 years, when the SEC, ACC, and other conferences splinter, the Big Ten will (at this rate) still have its strong group of 12 members, and will likely emerge in a very profitable position.

Is three divisions go to 16 and the Big-10 stays at 12, they will be left behind

[panerd]

Doesn't Syracuse and Pittsbrugh moving to the ACC with zero speculation from the "insiders" beforehand while none of their other predictions ever coming true make anyone else roll their eyes?

(I enjoy this thread, I am talking more about the "experts" with inside knowledge)

[MrBug708]

FWIW from another Arizona insider on Texas

Barring a last minute change- Texas has decided to join the Pac 12. Here are the "concessions" that the Pac 12 made to make the Horns feel all warm and cozy:

* The league will work with UT and ESPN to find a graceful way to blend, dissolve or do whatever to the LHN. ESPN will likely get an expanded stream of games in its first tier rights and a guarantee of Texas in a certain amount of telecasts. Also, the league will help absorb some of LHN's startup costs as they fold it into the Pac 16 Network. So basically, the league allows UT to save face, ESPN gets probably more UT football than the LHN would have been able to provide and the Pac gets to re-up first tier rights fees with both ESPN and FOX while getting even more premium content for its own networks.

* Texas Tech will be member #16. It will lessen the political strife and give UT a true travel partner.

* Pods are highly probable guaranteeing a game in CA every year. Texas would prefer a game in So Cal every year, but realizes that this is probably the best they can do as the rest of the league won't put up without equal access to LA.

* A second league office in Dallas. Really a formality, but another thing to make the eastern schools feel good.

* A rotating FB championship game and Men's BB Tourney between LA and Dallas. We all know the home site FB championship game is temporary anyways and the Rose Bowl (until Farmers Field is built) and Jerry World will eventually take this game over. Same for the Pac Tourney as nobody has any desire to hold the tourney in places like Utah, Seattle or Oakland. Staples, American Airlines Arena, Vegas and even the Pepsi Center seem to be most on the radar as of now, and there is strong sentiment for an easy east west rotation.

* Hoops scheduling is undertimed. Could be either pods or divisions. Look for a strong push for Arizona-UCLA, UCLA-Texas, USC-OU and Arizona-Texas games to be showcased.

* The votes will be unanimous despite some "public posturing" by Colorado and Arizona. Utah has been told to keep their traps shut as they are easily replaced in any model.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

You know that Atlanta is already part of the rotation for the basketball tournament, right? Has been since 1983.

well, I don't really pay attention to the ACC (until now). Who'd pay attention to a 2nd rate bball league playing in some hillbilly towns for their tournaments?

I could see MSG replacing Atlanta, what is the draw of having the tourny in Atlanta outside of bigger gates?

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by panerd

Doesn't Syracuse and Pittsbrugh moving to the ACC with zero speculation from the "insiders" beforehand while none of their other predictions ever coming true make anyone else roll their eyes?

(I enjoy this thread, I am talking more about the "experts" with inside knowledge)

It amuses me.

I also wouldn't mind a count of teams that have moved since the inception of this thread...while Missouri hasn't yet moved anywhere.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by panerd

Doesn't Syracuse and Pittsbrugh moving to the ACC with zero speculation from the "insiders" beforehand while none of their other predictions ever coming true make anyone else roll their eyes?

(I enjoy this thread, I am talking more about the "experts" with inside knowledge)

Yeah, esp. the lack of speculation regarding Missouri before they joined the Big10.

[Chubby]

I wouldn't say it was nescessarily not talked about (SU to ACC), at least around here but it was never something that was leaked.

I mean, SU isn't the attention whores Missouri seem to be

[Swaggs]

I wonder if, without Oklahoma and Texas, the Fiesta Bowl will become a sort of free agent BCS bowl or if they will house who- or whatever becomes the fifth BCS conference (whether the MWC, B12, BE or some combo of them).

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by MrBug708

Utah has been told to keep their traps shut as they are easily replaced in any model.

Lol. As much as I like Utah over hated BYU (so happy that it was Utah in the Pac12 and not BYU), sometimes you got to know your place in the grand scheme of things. BUY's place is remain independent so no one can continue to care about them. :P

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Looks like a story coming today on sportingnews.com concerning expansion of SEC and Big 10 in response to the ACC move. Matt Hayes is the writer. He said on Twitter...

"the ACC pulled out a pop gun. The SEC and Big Ten are getting ready to pull out a howitzer."

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Looks like a story coming today on sportingnews.com concerning expansion of SEC and Big 10 in response to the ACC move. Matt Hayes is the writer. He said on Twitter...

yawn

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Chubby

well, I don't really pay attention to the ACC (until now). Who'd pay attention to a 2nd rate bball league playing in some hillbilly towns for their tournaments?

I could see MSG replacing Atlanta, what is the draw of having the tourny in Atlanta outside of bigger gates?

I don't understand why we have to limit it to two locations? I love the idea of rotating between as many reasonable locations as possible within the conference's reach. In the last decade the tournament was held in 5 different venues (including greensboro and charlotte). Why not just add a 6th in NYC.

Note that I'm interested in competition and fun basketball not in min/maxxing $$$. If you wanted to do that you just hold it in Charlotte every year I'm sure, and they keep it in NC way too often now as it is.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Chubby

yawn

I understand that those in Syracuse aren't all that interested, but for the rest of us in limbo-land, it's probably of interest.

[Izulde]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Looks like a story coming today on sportingnews.com concerning expansion of SEC and Big 10 in response to the ACC move. Matt Hayes is the writer. He said on Twitter...

Sporting News is the Sportsdigs of sports journalism - complete crap that isn't worth the resources used to produce it.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Looks like a story coming today on sportingnews.com concerning expansion of SEC and Big 10 in response to the ACC move. Matt Hayes is the writer. He said on Twitter...

If the news of Texas/Tech/Oklahoma/OSU going to the Pac 12 is true, I don't see how there is enough ammo left for the SEC AND the Big Ten to make a big move. With Florida State and the rest of the ACC schools locked into $20-million buyouts, Notre Dame is the only big "free agent" left.

[Young Drachma]

If there's anything these shuffles should've taught us over the past few years, it's never rule out anything.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by terpkristin

I wish I had something nice to say about WVU fans but after yesterday's game ...

Then they'll be right at home in the SEC

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Chubby

I could see MSG replacing Atlanta, what is the draw of having the tourny in Atlanta outside of bigger gates?

It's a helluva lot closer to the core of the conference than NY, helluva lot cheaper for most fans to attend too.

[DeToxRox]

If UT goes to the Pac 1x, then the onus is on Delaney to make Notre Dame happen. I expect it will. Then it comes down to finding one more team. A conference that has Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Notre Dame and Nebraska amongst others will never have to worry about anything.

[Young Drachma]

Seems highly unlikely that the Big East basketball schools are going to give up MSG. More likely that the ACC will add NYC to their rotation by going to the new Barclays Center in Brooklyn or Prudential Center in NJ. But I doubt the Big East will be the one moving given they're at MSG every year.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Not quite as exciting as the preview tweet.....

ACC begins seismic shift, SEC and Big Ten will finish it - NCAA Football - Sporting News

[timmynausea]

Here's a tweet from Colin Dunlap a former Pittsburgh Post Gazette writer that broke the Dana Holgorsen to WVU story and the Stewart as traitor stuff:

Same university source who told me Dana was getting hired--& was spot-on re: everything--says WVU sent paperwork to SEC today. We'll see.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

I understand that those in Syracuse aren't all that interested, but for the rest of us in limbo-land, it's probably of interest.

limboland? You've moved to 3 conferences in the last, what, 9 months?

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Seems highly unlikely that the Big East basketball schools are going to give up MSG. More likely that the ACC will add NYC to their rotation by going to the new Barclays Center in Brooklyn or Prudential Center in NJ. But I doubt the Big East will be the one moving given they're at MSG every year.

I'm pretty sure it's up to MSG and not the BE, especially if the BE doesn't exist

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Let's see: MSG in NYC vs. a colosseum in...what?...Greensboro. But rotating between the northern tier (NYC) and the southern tier (Charlotte, Atlanta?) makes sense.

I'm too biased regarding WVU and Rutgers to want either of them to have a soft landing. It should have been SU (or even Pitt) that moved to the ACC several years ago instead of VT and BC. But even if SU has to be in the same conference as those two colleges, at least it can try to bring UConn to have another decent basketball school to play with. Does Rutgers even have a basketball team?

Can you just die or something old man. I'm sick of you, sick of your school and sick of your school's fans that killed bowl tie-ins for the Big East for the last 15 years

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Seems highly unlikely that the Big East basketball schools are going to give up MSG. More likely that the ACC will add NYC to their rotation by going to the new Barclays Center in Brooklyn or Prudential Center in NJ. But I doubt the Big East will be the one moving given they're at MSG every year.

Big East's deal with MSG is unti 2016.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

Big East's deal with MSG is unti 2016.

Big 12 has a deal in KC for three more tournaments.

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan

Big 12 has a deal in KC for three more tournaments.

Yes, but the basketball onlies will keep the Big East name for their Atlantic Ten clone.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Originally Posted by General Mike

Yes, but the basketball onlies will keep the Big East name for their Atlantic Ten clone.

Without the big names, do they care to keep hosting it there? Probably so. I guess they still have enough teams nearby that location to make it work. I guess it's a bit different than the B12 in that they move to a mid-major b-ball conference rather than fully dissolving like the B12.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Let's see: MSG in NYC vs. a colosseum in...what?...Greensboro. But rotating between the northern tier (NYC) and the southern tier (Charlotte, Atlanta?) makes sense.

Greensboro Coliseum has more seating capacity than both the Bobcats arena in Charlotte and MSG, fwiw.

It should have been SU (or even Pitt) that moved to the ACC several years ago instead of VT and BC.

Dear god a thousand times yes.

[Buccaneer]

Originally Posted by Radii

Greensboro Coliseum has more seating capacity than both the Bobcats arena in Charlotte and MSG, fwiw.

Didn't know that but what are the ticket prices in Greenboro compared to MSG?

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by Buccaneer

Didn't know that but what are the ticket prices in Greenboro compared to MSG?

Don't they have to give tickets away when Duke/UNC aren't playing?

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by terpkristin

I loved the days when we played everybody in football and in basketball when we played every team twice. It made it feel like it was a bit more of an even/true playing field. Alas in this day and age, I get it that it just won't happen...

Too true.

[Chubby]

Originally Posted by General Mike

Yes, but the basketball onlies will keep the Big East name for their Atlantic Ten clone.

Which MSG will want no part of

[duckman]

Statesman is reporting that a deal is close to add Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, and Texas Tech:

Texas Longhorns: Football, Basketball, Baseball and more | Statesman.com

[britrock88]

Originally Posted by Chubby

Don't they have to give tickets away when Duke/UNC aren't playing?

They only sell tournament packages for all 11 (13) games.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by Chubby

Don't they have to give tickets away when Duke/UNC aren't playing?

If only we could trade Miami and Boston College back to the Big East for Syracuse/Pitt instead of keeping them all then perhaps this would change.