The 2011 NBA Offseason---Stern says no - Page 11

bhlloy · 12-08-2011, 10:53 PM

Stern really must live on another planet. How you could deal with the lockout, finally get that out of the way and get people thinking about basketball and then pull something like this, before a ball has even been bounced is just unreal. I think he's made Bettman look competent.

LloydLungs · 12-08-2011, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Did he veto the trade, or did he just say he wouldn't sign a long term deal.. big difference.

No, he did not veto any trades as far as I know. But without a commitment from him the trades became much more unpalatable. Clips pulled Gordon off the table (if they were offering in the first place), Warriors switched in Monta Ellis and his $11 mil/yr instead of Curry. Certainly understandable, at least on GSW's part, but neither of those trades ended up being as good as the LAL/HOU trade, which still wasn't that good.

JonInMiddleGA · 12-08-2011, 10:57 PM

Maybe the league would let Paul go to Atlanta for Marvin Williams. Heck, the Hawks could throw in a superstar like Joe Johnson for NO to build around. I mean, a guy with a $119m contract has to be a franchise cornerstone type, right?

stevew · 12-08-2011, 10:57 PM

The easiest way to fix all this no-compensation stuff would be to give compensation picks slotted anywhere after 5th overall in the draft. Based on criteria, etc. Last year LeBron nets the 5th pock, Bosh like the 8th pick and Amare roughly the 9th pick.

molson · 12-08-2011, 11:04 PM

Ya, is why a league shouldn't own a team. When the deal was about to go through, people were killing the NBA, pretty fairly I think, since they were going to throw a great player at LA, right after a long lockout that they claimed was partly due to competitive balance issues. Now that they block the trade, of course they're going to get killed for that too.

Young Drachma · 12-08-2011, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Maybe the league would let Paul go to Atlanta for Marvin Williams. Heck, the Hawks could throw in a superstar like Joe Johnson for NO to build around. I mean, a guy with a $119m contract has to be a franchise cornerstone type, right?

Paul wouldn't stay in the ATL after his deal expired, since it'd be an empty cupboard. That's the point. He should end up in Golden State or with the Clippers or something based on assets, but he doesn't want to go there. He wanted to go to New York, even after Boston said they'd send Rondo (before changing their mind...) and so, the Lakers come out and say "we want both Howard and Paul" and both teams essentially concede how to get it done.

Stern is probably trying to save face after feeling like he'd beaten these guys, that it's just a repeat of Melo 2.0, except without it being dragged out for months.

So you deal him where he has no choice and the league wins AND Paul loses out on millions, because he has to leave a team where he doesn't want to play...or you deal him where he wants to go, he gets paid and the team makes do with what they get back.

This veto is about costing Paul money for saying "I don't want to go to [insert presumed small market here.]" and putting the leverage back into the team's hands to get the best deal it can get.

They want to make an example out of him. And they just might.

JonInMiddleGA · 12-08-2011, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Paul wouldn't stay in the ATL after his deal expired, since it'd be an empty cupboard. That's the point.

For the opportunity to unload the albatross of Joe Contract, it'd be a great deal for Atlanta. I was hoping that the league might just take pity on having owners as bad as the Hawks or something, figured it couldn't hurt to ask.

Young Drachma · 12-09-2011, 12:08 AM

Quashing CP3 deal shows NBA at its least bright - ESPN

Crapshoot · 12-09-2011, 12:08 AM

David Stern and the NBA owners are just proving to be epic dickheads.

Crapshoot · 12-09-2011, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Decent deal? What are you...a Lakers fan?

Its a good deal. You wouldn't be bitching if he went to Boston for Rondo.

Groundhog · 12-09-2011, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Cloud

Quashing CP3 deal shows NBA at its least bright - ESPN

My problem with that article:

"The Hornets would have received Lamar Odom, Luis Scola, Kevin Martin, and Goran Dragic. That's one of the most versatile players in the league, a guy who averages 18 and 10, a proven 20-a-night scorer, and a point guard who, if nothing else, has shown he can have a 23-point fourth quarter in a playoff game against the Spurs. You can compete for the playoffs with that team. You're going to tell me that's worse than the package of Wilson Chandler, Raymond Felton, Danilo Gallinari, Timofey Mozgov and draft picks that the Nuggets received for Carmelo Anthony?"

Firstly, you don't want to compete for the playoffs, which is exactly the ceiling those guys would give you - ie. mid-1st round draft selections and a guy with a long term expensive contract who is over 31 years old.

Secondly, yeah, it's far worse than Chandler/Felton/Gallinari and picks that the Nuggets got IMO. Chandler and Gallinari are both young talents with high ceilings, while Felton isn't a bad PG either.

bhlloy · 12-09-2011, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Its a good deal. You wouldn't be bitching if he went to Boston for Rondo.

Really? Rondo is young and elite, something none of those guys are. Groundhog hits the nail on the head. That deal would have made no sense for the Hornets at all, except make them older and more likely to be a low playoff seed this year.

DaddyTorgo · 12-09-2011, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

Its a good deal. You wouldn't be bitching if he went to Boston for Rondo.

That'd be a better deal. Rondo is a better player than anyone they'd be getting back as a result of this trade. It'd hafta be Rondo+Green+picks though I'm sure.

miami_fan · 12-09-2011, 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

It's a clusterfuck and no one knows. What seems like happened is a bunch of owners got on the phone irate that they were going to trade him to the Lakers. It would have looked like shit had they done it and looks like shit now that they vetoed it. League should not own a team.

We don't agree on much in the NBA but this is spot on! The fact that the NBA did not see this one coming is baffling.

DeToxRox · 12-09-2011, 01:54 AM

Danny Granger is about to get fined

dgranger33 Danny Granger
Due to the sabotaging of the LA/NO trade by david stern, and following in the footsteps of my athlete brethern Metta World Peace and Chad Ochocinco, I'm changing my last name to "Stern's Bi#&h" #effectiveimmediately

jbergey22 · 12-09-2011, 01:55 AM

Sterns time needs to be over as what he pulled today was completely BS. Is he really trying to tell New Orleans that they cant trade Paul and have to lose him for nothing in a few months?

MrBug708 · 12-09-2011, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Sterns time needs to be over as what he pulled today was completely BS. Is he really trying to tell New Orleans that they cant trade Paul and have to lose him for nothing in a few months?

So what happens when the Hornets try and trade Paul and Buss calls up Stern and says to pass, but Stern does it anyways? Lawsuit?

Lets be real here, if it were any other team than the Lakers, this deal goes through and nobody says anything

Crapshoot · 12-09-2011, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrBug708

So what happens when the Hornets try and trade Paul and Buss calls up Stern and says to pass, but Stern does it anyways? Lawsuit?

Lets be real here, if it were any other team than the Lakers, this deal goes through and nobody says anything

I strongly dislike the Lakers, but this is accurate. What stern pulled was horseshit, WWE style.

Crapshoot · 12-09-2011, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

That'd be a better deal. Rondo is a better player than anyone they'd be getting back as a result of this trade. It'd hafta be Rondo+Green+picks though I'm sure.

You get to determine that? Of all the trades, this is the worst one? Not the crap Boston gave MIN for Kevin Garnett (to take one example)?

jbergey22 · 12-09-2011, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrBug708

So what happens when the Hornets try and trade Paul and Buss calls up Stern and says to pass, but Stern does it anyways? Lawsuit?

Lets be real here, if it were any other team than the Lakers, this deal goes through and nobody says anything

Id agree completely but now whats he to do?

Tell the Hornets they can trade him to Detroit or Boston but not LA. He completely fucked it up. In order to be fair now he cant let him be traded.

RainMaker · 12-09-2011, 02:08 AM

Part of me doesn't think what Stern did was wrong. It was a bad deal for NO and would horribly alter the balance of the league right after you pretended that parity was something you cared about.

jbergey22 · 12-09-2011, 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Part of me doesn't think what Stern did was wrong. It was a bad deal for NO and would horribly alter the balance of the league right after you pretended that parity was something you cared about.

It was a better deal than running the risk of getting absolutely nothing in return for him.

I think they were getting Odom, Scola, Martin, and a 1st round pick for Paul. Not terrible for a player in his final 6 months at New Orleans and the world knows it.

Stern is yesterdays news. He is no longer benefitting from Larry Bird, Magic, and MJ taking the league to new heights.

MrBug708 · 12-09-2011, 02:13 AM

What's funny about Gilbert being the one throwing a hissyfit, he just made it easier for Miami and Lebron to win a title. Unless Lebron isn't his sworn enemy anymore, which I highly doubt

RainMaker · 12-09-2011, 02:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbergey22

It was a better deal than running the risk of getting absolutely nothing in return for him.

I think they were getting Odom, Scola, Martin, and a 1st round pick for Paul. Not terrible for a player in his final 6 months at New Orleans and the world knows it.

Stern is yesterdays news. He is no longer benefitting from Larry Bird, Magic, and MJ taking the league to new heights.

A bunch of above average aging veterans making big money isn't going to help New Orleans. So they finish with 35-40 wins? That isn't helping them long term. If they're giving up Paul, their best course of action is to blow it up.

I still say you call up the Clippers and ask for Aminu, Bledsoe, Kaman, and Minny's #1. Who says no?

Groundhog · 12-09-2011, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbergey22

It was a better deal than running the risk of getting absolutely nothing in return for him.

I think they were getting Odom, Scola, Martin, and a 1st round pick for Paul. Not terrible for a player in his final 6 months at New Orleans and the world knows it.

As I said above, I think it is worse than getting nothing for him. Having a guy leave for nothing (and the associated cap space and lottery chances the losing will provide) is better than winding up with a contract you are stuck with for 4 more years (Scola), 1st round playoff exits, and mid-round draft selections.

jbergey22 · 12-09-2011, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

A bunch of above average aging veterans making big money isn't going to help New Orleans. So they finish with 35-40 wins? That isn't helping them long term. If they're giving up Paul, their best course of action is to blow it up.

I still say you call up the Clippers and ask for Aminu, Bledsoe, Kaman, and Minny's #1. Who says no?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Groundhog

As I said above, I think it is worse than getting nothing for him. Having a guy leave for nothing (and the associated cap space and lottery chances the losing will provide) is better than winding up with a contract you are stuck with for 4 more years (Scola), 1st round playoff exits, and mid-round draft selections.

Well the Timberwolves model is nothing to hang their hats on either. That doesnt seem to be going anywhere soon.

RainMaker · 12-09-2011, 02:36 AM

They have a pretty horrible GM along with some bad luck.

Danny · 12-09-2011, 02:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Groundhog

As I said above, I think it is worse than getting nothing for him. Having a guy leave for nothing (and the associated cap space and lottery chances the losing will provide) is better than winding up with a contract you are stuck with for 4 more years (Scola), 1st round playoff exits, and mid-round draft selections.

I agree that the trade is not good from a basketball standpoint for the Hornets, but it doesn't matter what I think, what you think or what anyone else thinks regarding the value of the trade. This isn't a fantasy basketball league where other owners can vote down trades they don't like. There is no way in hell the trade should have been vetoed.

jbergey22 · 12-09-2011, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

They have a pretty horrible GM along with some bad luck.

A lot of the picks havent worked out but like New Orleans they have very little chance of bringing in a big name star so they have to play the hand they are dealt. I dont know if blowing everything up and hoping a Blake Griffin falls in your lap is the best rebuilding strategy for teams like Minny and New Orleans.

RainMaker · 12-09-2011, 02:39 AM

I don't know what other option there is for small market teams though. That's just how they win.

Danny · 12-09-2011, 02:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RainMaker

I don't know what other option there is for small market teams though. That's just how they win.

This is pretty much true, it's really their only chance for a championship type team. You can be a playoff team otherwise, but in order to win titles you have to be a big market or get one (or two) of those superstar draft picks.

Danny · 12-09-2011, 02:44 AM

But again, the system is what it is. You can't simply make up your own rules as you go. This is akin to Selig vetoing the Yankees signing players because they already have the highest payroll.

Danny · 12-09-2011, 02:46 AM

I love all four major professional sports, but basketball has drifted into my 3rd and 4th favorite along with MLB, but I think this kind of crap puts it at a distant 4th. Heck, I've always been into pro sports more then college, but it may put it behind college basketball and football as well.

DeToxRox · 12-09-2011, 02:48 AM

All the insiders are saying there is buzz a decent sized amount of players around the league will not show up to camps tomorrow out of solidarity over this entire debacle.

DeToxRox · 12-09-2011, 02:48 AM

KBergCBS Ken Berger

For those wondering why all chatter stopped: After trade nixed, all league business effectively halted. GMs/agents didn't know what to do.

DaddyTorgo · 12-09-2011, 02:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crapshoot

You get to determine that? Of all the trades, this is the worst one? Not the crap Boston gave MIN for Kevin Garnett (to take one example)?

Apples and Oranges. Minnesota wasn't owned by the league at the time. That argument doesn't even make sense.

And idk that I'd call Al Jefferson "crap" - at least not at the time. He still had a very high ceiling then, and was coming off a couple years (or was it just one big year) in Boston.

Danny · 12-09-2011, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Apples and Oranges. Minnesota wasn't owned by the league at the time. That argument doesn't even make sense.

And idk that I'd call Al Jefferson "crap."

But you can't cherry pick things. Either you have policy in place to say that a team that is league owned must cease operations regarding all personal or you trust the people in charge to make decisions.

Danny · 12-09-2011, 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaddyTorgo

Apples and Oranges. Minnesota wasn't owned by the league at the time. That argument doesn't even make sense.

And idk that I'd call Al Jefferson "crap" - at least not at the time. He still had a very high ceiling then, and was coming off a couple years (or was it just one big year) in Boston.

The problem is you seem to think your talent and personal evaluation actually matters. You think it is a bad trade so you are ok with Stern going beast mode? But if you think it is a good trade, you would be upset then?

jbergey22 · 12-09-2011, 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeToxRox

All the insiders are saying there is buzz a decent sized amount of players around the league will not show up to camps tomorrow out of solidarity over this entire debacle.

I really cant blame them at all. This was a complete dictatorship that decided on this. If they can pull something like this what will happen next? It appears the league wasnt ready for an agreement.

They might as well just get rid of the Salary Cap as it seems to be doing nothing for parity. It just forces teams into braindead trades down the road from bonehead contracts.

Without a cap perhaps a team can win a player with money rather than "well if I am going to be paid the same no matter where I play I might as well play on a team of friends that give me the best chance to win"

In the sport where a star player means the most(other than maybe QB of a NFL team) its odd that they decide to cap the stars in the NBA. A guy like LBJ is probably a 30+ million/yr player in an uncapped market. Basically any team that has a star player on their team is getting him at a discount price. No wonder the league has little parity.

Fucking morons in the NBA try to convince people that the cap helps the small market teams. Its done nothing for small market teams and saved the owners stupid asses from spending money they cant afford. I still cant believe these star players have put up with being paid half their market value for all of these years.

Sorry for the rant. Dannys post about how much more he used to like the NBA got me thinking about how cool it used to be and how some of it could be improved if Stern would get his head out of his stubborn ass.

bronconick · 12-09-2011, 07:39 AM

I can't figure out why the hell the owners agreed to this CBA if they didn't want this to keep happening. Morons. If you actually planned to try to change something large enough to make small market teams have a chance in hell of winning, you were going to have to burn a season, not 16 games. As is, they should take their luxury tax payments and embrace their roles as farm teams. They'll start losing money hand over fist as fans realize nothing changed, but that's their own fault.

Ksyrup · 12-09-2011, 07:59 AM

If the exclamation point on NBA Offseason! in the thread title wasn't there before, it certainly deserves it now.

RainMaker · 12-09-2011, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bronconick

I can't figure out why the hell the owners agreed to this CBA if they didn't want this to keep happening. Morons. If you actually planned to try to change something large enough to make small market teams have a chance in hell of winning, you were going to have to burn a season, not 16 games. As is, they should take their luxury tax payments and embrace their roles as farm teams. They'll start losing money hand over fist as fans realize nothing changed, but that's their own fault.

The CBA was all about money. Now they're crying that the system is still broke. Should have fixed it when they had the chance. In fact, they made it worse. Not allowing extend-and-trades has forced teams like the Clippers and Warriors out of the running since Paul won't commit.

Ksyrup · 12-09-2011, 08:40 AM

I think I heard someone say that what they fixed was the small market teams were upset because they were losing talent and money. Now they will not lose money. But no one fixed the talent/stars choosing where to go issue (or considered it important enough to keep fighting about once the money issue was resolved).

SirFozzie · 12-09-2011, 09:25 AM

File under "You're not helping"

Dan Gilbert published an email he sent to David Stern urging the trade to be voided:

Commissioner,

It would be a travesty to allow the Lakers to acquire Chris Paul in the apparent trade being discussed.

This trade should go to a vote of the 29 owners of the Hornets.

Over the next three seasons this deal would save the Lakers approximately $20 million in salaries and approximately $21 million in luxury taxes. That $21 million goes to non-taxpaying teams and to fund revenue sharing.

I cannot remember ever seeing a trade where a team got by far the best player in the trade and saved over $40 million in the process. And it doesn’t appear that they would give up any draft picks, which might allow to later make a trade for Dwight Howard. (They would also get a large trade exception that would help them improve their team and/or eventually trade for Howard.) When the Lakers got Pau Gasol (at the time considered an extremely lopsided trade) they took on tens of millions in additional salary and luxury tax and they gave up a number of prospects (one in Marc Gasol who may become a max-salary player).

I just don’t see how we can allow this trade to happen.

I know the vast majority of owners feel the same way that I do.

When will we just change the name of 25 of the 30 teams to the Washington Generals?

Mr. Gilbert: You had the best player in the league for seven years, and each year, you fell short. This is nothing more then whining that you signed a CBA not twelve hours beforehand that didn't give small market teams the ability to restrict free agents from going where they want to go, so you're trying to do it unofficially. Also note the first thing he complains about isn't the basketball reasons for the trade, but the fact that with this deal the Lakers won't be paying as much money in luxury tax and revenue sharing. So this is hypocritical to the extreme "We want the Lakers to give us money.. but we don't want them to have the type of player that is worthy of them paying the big salary for."

In short: Worry about lifting your own team up rather than what a team in the other conference is doing. As it stands your team IS the Washington Generals.

MrBug708 · 12-09-2011, 09:34 AM

What's great about this whole mess that Stern has created is that this trade has been in the works for a while. Hell, everyone knew it was going down. At anytime during the process, all Stern had to do is call up NO and say "don't trade Paul to the Lakers" and this mess would be avoided. Instead, Stern waited until the deal went down, a few owners started crying and then decided to step in and veto it without a reason.

Ksyrup · 12-09-2011, 09:38 AM

Do CBAs come with one of those 72-hour free look, no-hassle return policies?

SirFozzie · 12-09-2011, 09:59 AM

Dan Gilbert is doing the impossible. Making LeBron into a good guy again. Someone over at DVDVR said it best "How did he survive seven years with this nutjob?"

BillJasper · 12-09-2011, 10:03 AM

I'm confused?

How can a trade be blocked if it is within the parameters of the rules and CBA?

miami_fan · 12-09-2011, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbergey22

I really cant blame them at all. This was a complete dictatorship that decided on this. If they can pull something like this what will happen next? It appears the league wasnt ready for an agreement.

They might as well just get rid of the Salary Cap as it seems to be doing nothing for parity. It just forces teams into braindead trades down the road from bonehead contracts.

Without a cap perhaps a team can win a player with money rather than "well if I am going to be paid the same no matter where I play I might as well play on a team of friends that give me the best chance to win"

In the sport where a star player means the most(other than maybe QB of a NFL team) its odd that they decide to cap the stars in the NBA. A guy like LBJ is probably a 30+ million/yr player in an uncapped market. Basically any team that has a star player on their team is getting him at a discount price. No wonder the league has little parity.

Fucking morons in the NBA try to convince people that the cap helps the small market teams. Its done nothing for small market teams and saved the owners stupid asses from spending money they cant afford. I still cant believe these star players have put up with being paid half their market value for all of these years.

Sorry for the rant. Dannys post about how much more he used to like the NBA got me thinking about how cool it used to be and how some of it could be improved if Stern would get his head out of his stubborn ass.

The CBA has an opt -out clause after six years. The owners will blame the players and lock them out once again.

RainMaker · 12-09-2011, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillJasper

I'm confused?

How can a trade be blocked if it is within the parameters of the rules and CBA?

Commissioner has veto power over any trade. Not to mention the league owns the Hornets.

View Poll Results: Will the lockout cost the NBA any games?
Yes	57	79.17%
No	11	15.28%
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Voters: 72. You may not vote on this poll

12-08-2011, 10:57 PM	#503
JonInMiddleGA Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Behind Enemy Lines in Athens, GA	Maybe the league would let Paul go to Atlanta for Marvin Williams. Heck, the Hawks could throw in a superstar like Joe Johnson for NO to build around. I mean, a guy with a $119m contract has to be a franchise cornerstone type, right? __________________ "I lit another cigarette. Unless I specifically inform you to the contrary, I am always lighting another cigarette." - from a novel by Martin Amis

12-09-2011, 02:46 AM	#533
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	I love all four major professional sports, but basketball has drifted into my 3rd and 4th favorite along with MLB, but I think this kind of crap puts it at a distant 4th. Heck, I've always been into pro sports more then college, but it may put it behind college basketball and football as well. Last edited by Danny : 12-09-2011 at 02:46 AM.

12-09-2011, 07:59 AM	#541
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	If the exclamation point on NBA Offseason! in the thread title wasn't there before, it certainly deserves it now. __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

12-09-2011, 08:40 AM	#543
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	I think I heard someone say that what they fixed was the small market teams were upset because they were losing talent and money. Now they will not lose money. But no one fixed the talent/stars choosing where to go issue (or considered it important enough to keep fighting about once the money issue was resolved). __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete." Last edited by Ksyrup : 12-09-2011 at 08:40 AM.

12-08-2011, 10:53 PM	#501
bhlloy Coordinator Join Date: Nov 2003	Stern really must live on another planet. How you could deal with the lockout, finally get that out of the way and get people thinking about basketball and then pull something like this, before a ball has even been bounced is just unreal. I think he's made Bettman look competent.

12-08-2011, 10:57 PM	#504
stevew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: the yo'	The easiest way to fix all this no-compensation stuff would be to give compensation picks slotted anywhere after 5th overall in the draft. Based on criteria, etc. Last year LeBron nets the 5th pock, Bosh like the 8th pick and Amare roughly the 9th pick.

12-08-2011, 11:04 PM	#505
molson General Manager Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: The Mountains	Ya, is why a league shouldn't own a team. When the deal was about to go through, people were killing the NBA, pretty fairly I think, since they were going to throw a great player at LA, right after a long lockout that they claimed was partly due to competitive balance issues. Now that they block the trade, of course they're going to get killed for that too.

12-09-2011, 12:08 AM	#508
Young Drachma Dark Cloud Join Date: Apr 2001	Quashing CP3 deal shows NBA at its least bright - ESPN

12-09-2011, 12:08 AM	#509
Crapshoot Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Dec 2003	David Stern and the NBA owners are just proving to be epic dickheads.

12-09-2011, 01:54 AM	#515
DeToxRox Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Michigan	Danny Granger is about to get fined dgranger33 Danny Granger Due to the sabotaging of the LA/NO trade by david stern, and following in the footsteps of my athlete brethern Metta World Peace and Chad Ochocinco, I'm changing my last name to "Stern's Bi#&h" #effectiveimmediately

12-09-2011, 01:55 AM	#516
jbergey22 Grizzled Veteran Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Minnesota	Sterns time needs to be over as what he pulled today was completely BS. Is he really trying to tell New Orleans that they cant trade Paul and have to lose him for nothing in a few months?

12-09-2011, 02:08 AM	#521
RainMaker Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	Part of me doesn't think what Stern did was wrong. It was a bad deal for NO and would horribly alter the balance of the league right after you pretended that parity was something you cared about.

12-09-2011, 02:13 AM	#523
MrBug708 Head Coach Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Whittier	What's funny about Gilbert being the one throwing a hissyfit, he just made it easier for Miami and Lebron to win a title. Unless Lebron isn't his sworn enemy anymore, which I highly doubt

12-09-2011, 02:36 AM	#527
RainMaker Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	They have a pretty horrible GM along with some bad luck.

12-09-2011, 02:39 AM	#530
RainMaker Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Chicago, IL	I don't know what other option there is for small market teams though. That's just how they win.

12-09-2011, 02:44 AM	#532
Danny Head Coach Join Date: Jul 2001	But again, the system is what it is. You can't simply make up your own rules as you go. This is akin to Selig vetoing the Yankees signing players because they already have the highest payroll.

12-09-2011, 02:48 AM	#534
DeToxRox Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Michigan	All the insiders are saying there is buzz a decent sized amount of players around the league will not show up to camps tomorrow out of solidarity over this entire debacle.

12-09-2011, 02:48 AM	#535
DeToxRox Head Coach Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Michigan	KBergCBS Ken Berger For those wondering why all chatter stopped: After trade nixed, all league business effectively halted. GMs/agents didn't know what to do.

12-09-2011, 07:39 AM	#540
bronconick College Starter Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Kalamazoo, MI	I can't figure out why the hell the owners agreed to this CBA if they didn't want this to keep happening. Morons. If you actually planned to try to change something large enough to make small market teams have a chance in hell of winning, you were going to have to burn a season, not 16 games. As is, they should take their luxury tax payments and embrace their roles as farm teams. They'll start losing money hand over fist as fans realize nothing changed, but that's their own fault.

12-09-2011, 09:25 AM	#544
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	File under "You're not helping" Dan Gilbert published an email he sent to David Stern urging the trade to be voided: Commissioner, It would be a travesty to allow the Lakers to acquire Chris Paul in the apparent trade being discussed. This trade should go to a vote of the 29 owners of the Hornets. Over the next three seasons this deal would save the Lakers approximately $20 million in salaries and approximately $21 million in luxury taxes. That $21 million goes to non-taxpaying teams and to fund revenue sharing. I cannot remember ever seeing a trade where a team got by far the best player in the trade and saved over $40 million in the process. And it doesn’t appear that they would give up any draft picks, which might allow to later make a trade for Dwight Howard. (They would also get a large trade exception that would help them improve their team and/or eventually trade for Howard.) When the Lakers got Pau Gasol (at the time considered an extremely lopsided trade) they took on tens of millions in additional salary and luxury tax and they gave up a number of prospects (one in Marc Gasol who may become a max-salary player). I just don’t see how we can allow this trade to happen. I know the vast majority of owners feel the same way that I do. When will we just change the name of 25 of the 30 teams to the Washington Generals? Mr. Gilbert: You had the best player in the league for seven years, and each year, you fell short. This is nothing more then whining that you signed a CBA not twelve hours beforehand that didn't give small market teams the ability to restrict free agents from going where they want to go, so you're trying to do it unofficially. Also note the first thing he complains about isn't the basketball reasons for the trade, but the fact that with this deal the Lakers won't be paying as much money in luxury tax and revenue sharing. So this is hypocritical to the extreme "We want the Lakers to give us money.. but we don't want them to have the type of player that is worthy of them paying the big salary for." In short: Worry about lifting your own team up rather than what a team in the other conference is doing. As it stands your team IS the Washington Generals. __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com Last edited by SirFozzie : 12-09-2011 at 09:27 AM.

12-09-2011, 09:34 AM	#545
MrBug708 Head Coach Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Whittier	What's great about this whole mess that Stern has created is that this trade has been in the works for a while. Hell, everyone knew it was going down. At anytime during the process, all Stern had to do is call up NO and say "don't trade Paul to the Lakers" and this mess would be avoided. Instead, Stern waited until the deal went down, a few owners started crying and then decided to step in and veto it without a reason.

12-09-2011, 09:38 AM	#546
Ksyrup This guy has posted so much, his fingers are about to fall off. Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: In Absentia	Do CBAs come with one of those 72-hour free look, no-hassle return policies? __________________ M's pitcher Miguel Batista: "Now, I feel like I've had everything. I've talked pitching with Sandy Koufax, had Kenny G play for me. Maybe if I could have an interview with God, then I'd be served. I'd be complete."

12-09-2011, 09:59 AM	#547
SirFozzie Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: The State of Insanity	Dan Gilbert is doing the impossible. Making LeBron into a good guy again. Someone over at DVDVR said it best "How did he survive seven years with this nutjob?" __________________ Check out Foz's New Video Game Site, An 8-bit Mind in an 8GB world! http://an8bitmind.com

12-09-2011, 10:03 AM	#548
BillJasper Pro Starter Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Northern Kentucky	I'm confused? How can a trade be blocked if it is within the parameters of the rules and CBA? __________________ The Confederacy lost, it is time to dismantle it.

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