Werewolf LXI - Ocean's Eleven (GAME OVER, SEE PAGE 19 FOR RESULT.)

[claphamsa]

what is a COT? I forget

[claphamsa]

Originally Posted by RendeR

*takes a breath* *sighs* anyway. Beyond lathum's personel death warrent for me, why are the rest of your voting for what is normally a trusted role? The simple possibility that there is an evil opposite? Or is there some real evidence?

Come on people, stop following Lathum's coattails like well beaten dogs. Give pepole some validation for taking out a good role villager!

If the seer scans me, how are they supposed to get that info to YOU Lathum? I'm all for it, but I want you to stop this attempt to OUT the seer by demanding that its the only way you'll trust me. Talk about wolfish. Others have bad vibes about you, but this really makes my skin crawl.

The thing that suprises me the most about this is my top 3 are the ones voting for you, which seems real silly and obvious. Why would they pile on you if you really were the duke? this is making me doubt my previousl thouhgts! that being said I cant get these arguemtns either. they are rediculous!

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by RendeR

Explain this, You have NO real reason beyond a gut feeling here. you have a 0/50 shot at being right and I hate to break it to you, but yer wrong, again, about me.

Why do you always have a stick up the butt about me? You drive votes against me constantly, and you've never been right?

actualy I have been right about you in the past.

You are taking it way to personaly as usual.

I have more then a gut feeling. From the rules

Loyal Wolf: You function as a regular wolf, but have the ability to change one lynching from the selected candidate to the person of your choosing. You will know this role from the beginning.

The Persuader: You can change the lynch results one time to a player of your choosing.

Not all roles may be in the game. Best of luck

you are claiming that you are a role that is usuay trusted but there is no way to verify which duke you are.

To me a vote for you is the most logical way to go since you have already used up your ability.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by RendeR

Let me try turning your own reasoning back at you here:

If what you say is true and players take more risks as villagers than as wolves:

What seems more likely? That I took the big risk in duling to ches as a good duke or as a bad one? Using the ability like that is a huge risk for the bad duke because it does exactly what we see here, it gets people coming after him. So based on your own theory, it would have been utterly stupid of me to use the ability so early without knowing that my target was worthwile.

We've recently seen the addition of BGs kjnowin g what roles are in teh game to rulessets, no reason to think they aren;t in this one too.

[RendeR]

But again, the real point isn't that voting for me is logical, its that YOU don't trust me, which is perfectly aceptable. but you have no validation for getting others to trust you. I'm not taking this personally, I'm stating a fact, you have a case for me in EVERY game, with or without reason and I do recall one game when you were right, so I stand corrected there.


This is what bothers me, BK and Anxiety lining up like sheep to follow your gut instincts. And don't tell me you have more than that because you don't. You have a 50/50 shot and your GUESSING lathum, and instead of considering that you might be wrong or coming up with aything more relevant than "the rules say not all roles are in the game" you throw down an ultimatum that only outing the seer can provide.

Lynching me is a complete mistake and does nothing but give the wolves 2 more dead villagers on day 2. Odds are the villagers lose after this. Lynching me gains nothing beyond soothing Lathum's assumptions.

I'm done.

VOTE LATHUM (Argues that he's got a valid reason when in fact he's guessing, throws out and ultimatum that will out the good seer, argues for lynching someone with a known role that canot harm anyone further but in fact CAN build a CoT around)
I'll be back tomorrow.

[Lathum]

I never said that I wanted the seer to say anything. You are attempting to put words in my mouth.

Plus if anyone has a candidate that is better the 50/50 at this point I will gladly switch to them.

[Lathum]

dola- I also never carry over anything from game to game. The fact that Render and I have butted heads in the pass has no bearing on this game.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Lathum

dola- I also never carry over anything from game to game. The fact that Render and I have butted heads in the pass has no bearing on this game.

Ew. You'd think I'd remember that.

Anyway, RendeR takes things personally as a villager, too. So I don't think that his reactions today make him look any more or less wolfish.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Lathum

that isn't really a satisfactory explination. You usually are the type of player that votes based on your own theories. Not someone else's day old theory.

First of all, I never expected you to find my reasoning for voting for you satisfactory. You called my vote a hit and run, when it was failry obvious that I had been there and giving my reasons the whole time. Again, I'm not trying to convince you -- just pointing out that it was not hit and run.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by claphamsa

what is a COT? I forget

Nice job helping out the newb, guys. COT = circle of trust.

[path12]

I have to go now, and won't be back before deadline. This sucks that I can't argue my case more, but here is my preservation vote:

VOTE RENDER

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I never said that I wanted the seer to say anything. You are attempting to put words in my mouth.

Plus if anyone has a candidate that is better the 50/50 at this point I will gladly switch to them.

Someone said why it was a 50/50 proposition before. I need this explained to me. I am actually seeing it as a 33/67 proposition of Render's Guilt.

The three possibilities I see are :
1. Render is the Loyal Wolf (wolf's Duke) and there is no good duke.
2. Render is the Persuader (village Duke) and there is no bad duke.
3. Render is the Persuader and there IS a Loyal Wolf as well.

In terms of Render being the Loyal wolf and a Pursuader also in the game... this is a non factor.
First, I don't believe it, as I think the Pursuader would have come forward. And Secondly, Even if it WAS true, then it won't matter who we decide to lynch, as the Pursuader will duke to the then known wolf.

[Barkeep49]

NTN I think you actually argue for a situation 4, quite convincingly. If I'm the good Duke I stay quiet and simply duke it over to Render at the end. So we're back to 50/50.

[Barkeep49]

FTR, I'm not upset, at all, to see pressure on path. He's my other suspect.

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

NTN I think you actually argue for a situation 4, quite convincingly. If I'm the good Duke I stay quiet and simply duke it over to Render at the end. So we're back to 50/50.

True, but from a practical stand point situation 4 should not really concern us the average workaday villager. so for our voting aspect, we should treat this as it has 0% chance of happening. so this is why I say 33/67

[ntndeacon]

the path vote for me was the lesser of the 4 candidates in terms of trust. I don't DIStrust him yet, but he seemed more of a cypher to me thus far.

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by ntndeacon

True, but from a practical stand point situation 4 should not really concern us the average workaday villager. so for our voting aspect, we should treat this as it has 0% chance of happening. so this is why I say 33/67

Why should we treat this as a 0%?

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Why should we treat this as a 0%?

We have both agreed that if there is a good duke other than Render, that they should stay quiet and duke the heck outta him at the end. Well ihaven't said iagree, but I do. then nothing we do will change that.

Another point..(not about the 0%) this will give us a look at another unknown for us. So we have a possibility of determining 2 names with not voting for Render. Render's and either a duke or the other person we lynch

[Barkeep49]

Originally Posted by ntndeacon

We have both agreed that if there is a good duke other than Render, that they should stay quiet and duke the heck outta him at the end. Well ihaven't said iagree, but I do. then nothing we do will change that.

True. But the existance of a 4th possibility, equal with others, suggests there is still a 50/50 shot that he's bad. I like voting for bad guys.

Another point..(not about the 0%) this will give us a look at another unknown for us. So we have a possibility of determining 2 names with not voting for Render. Render's and either a duke or the other person we lynch

Can you explain this point for me (sorry I'm dim tonight)?

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

True. But the existance of a 4th possibility, equal with others, suggests there is still a 50/50 shot that he's bad. I like voting for bad guys.



Can you explain this point for me (sorry I'm dim tonight)?

I don't see this 4th possibility as equal to the others.

As for my other post. If we do not vote for Render we verifiy 2 folks the partially verified Render and either the Lynchee who is dead, or a new Duke.

[PurdueBrad]

Here is the current vote tally (as of post 520):

RendeR (4)- Barkeep49 (421), Lathum (465), Anxiety (476), Path12 (511)
Path12 (3)- Claphamsa (422), SnDvls (462), ntndeacon (489)
Barkeep49 (2)- Telle (455), jeheinz72 (479)
Lathum (2)- Passacaglia (453), RendeR (505)

[Lathum]

render voted for me brad

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by Lathum

render voted for me brad

Fixed as of 7:19. Above vote summary is currently correct.

[Lathum]

man. sure got quiet

[RendeR]

Grrrr. I hate ties.


Self preservation vote:

UNVOTE LATHUM

VOTE PATH12

[RendeR]

How do you fix TIES Brad?

[claphamsa]

Wow I made it back in time to make a final decision and there is none to make

[PurdueBrad]

Here is the current vote tally (as of post 526):

RendeR (4)- Barkeep49 (421), Lathum (465), Anxiety (476), Path12 (511)
Path12 (4)- Claphamsa (422), SnDvls (462), ntndeacon (489), RendeR (525)
Barkeep49 (2)- Telle (455), jeheinz72 (479)
Lathum (1)- Passacaglia (453)

[PurdueBrad]

DEADLINE...WRITE-UP WILL TAKE A SECOND DUE TO GAME DYNAMIC...

[SnDvls]

the anticipation for this should be good since it's an unknown

[claphamsa]

Do we break for the weekend?

[Lathum]

I hate the tie this late in the game

[ntndeacon]

Originally Posted by claphamsa

Do we break for the weekend?

Usually we have just a more relaxed system. maybe one day for the weekend sometimes one day one Sat til Sun afternoon and then another from then til Monday night.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I hate the tie this late in the game

its day 2 lathum......

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by RendeR

its day 2 lathum......

actualy it's day 3.

[PurdueBrad]

Last night's loss of Chief Rum has left the team reeling. You decide that Vegas is no longer safe and that your best chance is to get on the road. Two cargo vans, all your gear, and your wounded pride hop on the road out of Lost Wages and to Los Angeles.

The team is about half an hour out of town, when one cell phone rings, then another, eventually among the two vans eleven cell phones ring in unison.

You are the first one to answer and you hear a familiar voice:

"Put me on speaker..."

"So, I get one damn phone call from this rotten jail and what do I find? You guys turning tail and running? I think not. This is Ocean's Eleven, as in Danny Oceans' eleven man crew. You may not be able to break me out of jail but I'll tell you this, you head back to Vegas and Benedict will never see you coming."

Everyone looks around, shocked to hear the voice of their leader echoing through the vans.

"Well boys, we knew this score would be hard, we figured some of us wouldn't make it but we ain't busted yet. In fact, I feel a lucky streak coming on and it all starts now. Tonight, no style, no grace, no cleverness, tonight is all about shock and awe..."

[PurdueBrad]

The Desert Inn and The Flamingo...SIMULTANEOUSLY!

The crew splits in half and rams the vans through the front door of each casino. Waving guns, yelling, and causing general chaos is enough to catch Benedict, his goons, and most importantly, his money, by surprise.

The first team at the Desert Inn of RendeR, Anxiety, Path 12, ntndeacon, and Barkeep49 finish first, pulling in a cool $27 million dollars into the back of their van.

Moments later the second team finishes their score. Sndvls, Claphamsa, Lathum, Jeheinz72, and Telle try to top it...and do! $31 million!!

$58 million in just a matter of minutes. The celebration is on, the Kristal is popping, Danny is on the phone in jail drinking some jail cell hooch, but wait...

[PurdueBrad]

"Where is Passacaglia," St. Cronin asks through the phone's speaker.

Everyone looks around and nobody knows. In fact, in all the excitement, nobody even remembers which team he was with.

Or at least nobody claims to remember.

Pass is found moments later by the Las Vegas PD, duct-taped inside the casino vault. On his head is a nice little red gift bow and a little note that says, "Merry Christmas Terry, one more down, many more to come. Love, your wolves."

Pass was 'Mushy' O'Connor, simple villager.


BEGIN DAY FOUR...

(Cronin is back, bringing back the Oceans' win-set. However, he cannot vote, chat, or be voted out)

[Lathum]

I;m confused.

was Pass the night target or the result of the tie?

[RendeR]

well thats new....

[claphamsa]

Originally Posted by PurdueBrad

"Where is Passacaglia," St. Cronin asks through the phone's speaker.

Everyone looks around and nobody knows. In fact, in all the excitement, nobody even remembers which team he was with.

Or at least nobody claims to remember.

Pass is found moments later by the Las Vegas PD, duct-taped inside the casino vault. On his head is a nice little red gift bow and a little note that says, "Merry Christmas Terry, one more down, many more to come. Love, your wolves."

BEGIN DAY FOUR...

(Cronin is back, bringing back the Oceans' win-set. However, he cannot vote, chat, or be voted out)

WTF!

So Pass is dead? Even tho he had no votes? and Cronin is back? but he cant do anything. uhhhhh

[RendeR]

Pass was the night kill/target based on the note.

[PurdueBrad]

Originally Posted by Lathum

I;m confused.

was Pass the night target or the result of the tie?

I hoped the card would give it away...the wolves have struck.

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by RendeR

Pass was the night kill/target based on the note.

that would be my guess and St. C/Danny Oceans is back as a result of the tie, but in a limited role

[claphamsa]

Originally Posted by RendeR

Pass was the night kill/target based on the note.

oh yeah, i keep forgettgin the run simultaneouosly! so either the BG protected somone or ties dont count. or whok konws

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Lathum

actualy it's day 3.

day 4 now..but yea, I missed a day in there somewhere....


Get your vote on me, get it over with.

[Lathum]

so the result of the tie is a no lynch?

[Lathum]

PurdueBrad- Does Oceans count towards winning ratio numbers?

[SnDvls]

Originally Posted by Lathum

PurdueBrad- Does Oceans count towards winning ratio numbers?

I would guess not since he can't be voted out again either.

[PurdueBrad]

Oceans does not count towards your win ratio. This no lynch was one of several possible outcomes of the tie. There were half a dozen outcomes possible here, most did not involve a no lynch.