COVID-19 - Wuhan Coronavirus (a non-political thread, see pg. 36 #1778)

[Ksyrup]

Is basketball considered fall or winter? What's a fall sport - football and soccer?

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Is basketball considered fall or winter? What's a fall sport - football and soccer?

I believe it is winter

[Ksyrup]

What's ND going to do if P5 conferences go conference-only? Play an ACC schedule? Kinda defeats the purpose of staying closer to home.

[panerd]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Also, I like how when push comes to shove, no one is even pretending that the NCAA has (or should have) any power in this situation.

I am slowly trying to come up with a list of positives from COVID-19. I will add this to the very short list I have so far...

* Curbside pick-up
* Credit card dining credits.
* Powerless NCAA

[panerd]

Originally Posted by NobodyHere

Aren't only about 20 college football teams profitable? And the situation will only be worse this year since stadiums won't be allowed to pack in the fans.

I would think close to every college football team is highly profitable. You might be thinking entire athletic department. At Mizzou for example the football and men's basketball programs are they only one turning a profit and overall the entire department is still in the red but mostly paid for by their profits.

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by panerd

I am slowly trying to come up with a list of positives from COVID-19. I will add this to the very short list I have so far...

* Curbside pick-up
* Credit card dining credits.
* Powerless NCAA

I'd add credit card mileage balance. Between canceled trips and extra miles for grocery store purchases, I'm nearing 300K miles. And depending on how long it takes to feel comfortable traveling again, I'll probably be close to 400K. I probably won't pay for a Delta flight until 2023 or 2024.

[Ksyrup]

Anticipating interruptions or early shutdown...

Also hearing per sources thst the B1G’s league-only schedules will be frontloaded with division games, as those are the most important to play before potential interruptions. https://t.co/yZzJmPJMUr

— Adam Rittenberg (@ESPNRittenberg) July 9, 2020

[whomario]

I feel safer already. This will most definitely be fine. pic.twitter.com/Ay99KyEvzH

— David Atkinson (@drdaveatkinson) July 9, 2020

Purdue University

And yeah,agree with his additional comment:

I know this is funny, but it's a metaphor for a profounder absurdity: if American colleges and universities don't open F2F in the fall, we risk the collapse of a world class system. That's the real absurdity.

Although i would also add, that the whole supercharging aspect of earnings and spendings contributes to the problem.

[cuervo72]

Oh FFS.

At least we've been informed that all students have to test negative before returning to campus, so that's something. But yeah, whatever that is isn't going to accomplish a whole lot.

edit: son agrees that looks ridiculous

[Butter]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I'd add credit card mileage balance. Between canceled trips and extra miles for grocery store purchases, I'm nearing 300K miles. And depending on how long it takes to feel comfortable traveling again, I'll probably be close to 400K. I probably won't pay for a Delta flight until 2023 or 2024.

I would go ahead and book some flights at some point because it is very likely that Delta and others will devalue those miles at some point in the near future

[ISiddiqui]

My friend who is an Administrator for Emory University in Atlanta posted the following on Facebook:

2 things: ONE- new cases of COVID are rapidly rising in Georgia and Atlanta. More testing is part of the reason for that, and testing is a good thing, as it helps us track who has COVID to keep people safer. But the uptick is quite real because... TWO- The rates are currently alarming, hospitals here are packed with COVID patients, worse than ANY other time in our local history with COVID, with only a hand full of ICU beds left in the city, and that is after cancelling some surgeries. This is a huge upswing in cases in the hospital. Please mask, social distance and be very careful.

The fact that the ICUs situation is worse now than it was in April/May is terrifying to me.

[Ksyrup]

It is SO hard not to go all-in on an "I told you so" rant on FB and with people I've talked to about this. I went to HS in Georgia so I know a lot of people there, and many of them supported re-opening and basically accused anyone who was against it of wanting them to fail and for people to die. Nobody wanted it, but it was hard to believe it wouldn't eventually happen.

This whole thing has been a slow-motion train wreck, where the people in charge are switching tracks to veer right into the path of an oncoming train.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

It is SO hard not to go all-in on an "I told you so" rant on FB and with people I've talked to about this. I went to HS in Georgia so I know a lot of people there, and many of them supported re-opening and basically accused anyone who was against it of wanting them to fail and for people to die. Nobody wanted it, but it was hard to believe it wouldn't eventually happen.

This whole thing has been a slow-motion train wreck, where the people in charge are switching tracks to veer right into the path of an oncoming train.

As I read this, all I can think of is you posting this on AITA Reddit.

[whomario]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

My friend who is an Administrator for Emory University in Atlanta posted the following on Facebook:



The fact that the ICUs situation is worse now than it was in April/May is terrifying to me.

Yeah, it is ... Because that is when people die that really did not have to even assuming Infection was a given. Not to mention other patients not getting care soon enough or catching Covid on top of whatever they are in hospital for already. Or HC workers and other staff getting sick (because of course now PPE becomes an issue again).

There's also a new NYT article looking at the growing problem in multiple states, including some with so far benign death numbers like Mississippi:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/09/u...-capacity.html

“When hospitals and health care assistants talk about surge capacity, they’re often talking about a single event,” said John Sinnott, chairman of internal medicine at the University of South Florida and chief epidemiologist at Tampa General Hospital. “But what we’re having now is the equivalent of a bus accident a day, every day, and it just keeps adding.”

In Mississippi, five of the state’s largest hospitals have already run out of I.C.U. beds for critical patients, Dr. Thomas Dobbs, the state health officer, said on Thursday. “Mississippi hospitals cannot take care of Mississippi patients,” he said.

[Lathum]

The really scary thing is everything is 2-3 weeks behind also, so if they are bad now it will be horrible soon.

[Brian Swartz]

I'm curious to see how thoroughly it is enforced, but a new executive order from Gov. Whitmer now requires businesses in Michigan to bar entry to those not wearing a mask, and anyone not wearing a mask in an indoor space is subject to a $500 fine.

[Ksyrup]

As expected, KY issued a mask mandate and the governor was promptly sued by the AG.

[Ksyrup]

ACC considering 10 game season made up of 5-team home-and-home series, with ND the 15th team.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

ACC considering 10 game season made up of 5-team home-and-home series, with ND the 15th team.

At what point do they realize they are trying to jump through one too many hoops?

[whomario]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

I'm curious to see how thoroughly it is enforced, but a new executive order from Gov. Whitmer now requires businesses in Michigan to bar entry to those not wearing a mask, and anyone not wearing a mask in an indoor space is subject to a $500 fine.

There was the same arguments here (including "but how will you enforce it ?") and in the end it was the same as with other comparable imfractions that can only very spottingly be enforced: Even the off-chance of a fine was enough for 95% to stick to the rules, still do even with virtually no new cases locally. And support for the measure actually grew in polls from 70% to 87% right now.
So i'd just give it a chance and see.

The whole enforcement thing: Stores and other businesses/services have and enforce rules in normal times, too, no ? That doesn't mean they enforce them every time (or call the police), which in turn still does not lead to a mass movement of ignoring them because you let it slide a few times (maybe because the person in violation is a 7 ft dude with a scowl on his face).

Perfect shouldn't be the enemy of improvement.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

It is SO hard not to go all-in on an "I told you so" rant on FB and with people I've talked to about this. I went to HS in Georgia so I know a lot of people there, and many of them supported re-opening and basically accused anyone who was against it of wanting them to fail and for people to die. Nobody wanted it, but it was hard to believe it wouldn't eventually happen.

This whole thing has been a slow-motion train wreck, where the people in charge are switching tracks to veer right into the path of an oncoming train.

I am pretty much in the same boat. With high school and college friends mostly from Georgia and nearly all my family in the southeast, I have been holding my tongue about some of their ridiculousness and selfishness for months.

I finally lost it the other night with my father. He knows my wife is high risk due to almost dying from pneumonia and he still has the gall to equate being safe regarding covid to people virtually stripping him of all rights. I finally told him what I thought...

The last few months have been so trying a time, I have virtually lost faith in a large number of people due to their actions.

[miami_fan]

Pac 12 is now conference only in all sports for the fall.

Pac-12 follows Big Ten in moving to conference-only schedule for fall sports

[SirFozzie]

I honestly think there will be no fall sports. I don't think the MLB season will complete. The bubble stuff probably will complete (as long as they respect the bubble) Anything that requires massive amounts of movement cross-country is a non-starter I think.

[ISiddiqui]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

I honestly think there will be no fall sports. I don't think the MLB season will complete. The bubble stuff probably will complete (as long as they respect the bubble) Anything that requires massive amounts of movement cross-country is a non-starter I think.

So as long as teams have private planes I don’t think cross country travel may be that bad. Though MLB needs to get serious about teams self-quarentining before the season.

[SirFozzie]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

So as long as teams have private planes I don’t think cross country travel may be that bad. Though MLB needs to get serious about teams self-quarentining before the season.

Here's the thing. The bubbles only work when everyone is in one location. That way you can track who comes in and out. Will you be able to isolate them as much in other cities? (Getting to and from the airport to the hotel to the ballpark is fine, but how are you going to keep them from "going out to a club" (or even the hotel bar which will have a lot of foot traffic).

Once it gets into one team (or even one player who made a stupid choice), it's going to spread. First to the rest of that team. Then possibly to the three-four teams they've played before showing symptoms.

edit: The Washington Post has a good story on the troubles even in the bubble. https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...sports-return/

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Alan T

I am pretty much in the same boat. With high school and college friends mostly from Georgia and nearly all my family in the southeast, I have been holding my tongue about some of their ridiculousness and selfishness for months.

I finally lost it the other night with my father. He knows my wife is high risk due to almost dying from pneumonia and he still has the gall to equate being safe regarding covid to people virtually stripping him of all rights. I finally told him what I thought...

The last few months have been so trying a time, I have virtually lost faith in a large number of people due to their actions.

My parents are huge Trumpers and live in Texas. All I've been hearing is that everything is great there, they wear their masks but they are basically going about things like normal. They have a timeshare in Hilton Head that they are going to lose 10 days on if they don't use it, so they decided to book a vacation in early August. They want to come visit us afterward. I finally had to tell them no - no way are they going from Texas to South Carolina and then coming into my home. It's just pure madness. Then my mom says, OK, well we could also go to Phoenix instead of Hilton Head. PHOENIX! Oh yeah, much better idea! Why don't you run naked through a spit line on Miami Beach if those plans fall through!

I just can't deal with it. We have yet to have the Trump discussion thankfully, but it's coming, I'm sure.

[NobodyHere]

I am seriously considering buying a plague doctor's mask to use. But they don't seem to be compatible with my glasses.

[Brian Swartz]

The part I have the most trouble dealing with is the illogical extremism, of which we have plenty on both ends just like most issues. The ones who just do stupid things are par for the course. The ones you insist you join them in said stupid things or you're the one with the problem ... that grinds my gears a lot more. I have a number of people posting social media takes, links to inflammatory articles, etc. and then 'no comments/debate please, just posting for informational purposes' or whatever. If you don't want to discuss an opinion on social media, don't post it people.

/rant

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

Pac 12 is now conference only in all sports for the fall.

Pac-12 follows Big Ten in moving to conference-only schedule for fall sports

NDSU fans are weeping over the missed Oregon game.

[GrantDawg]

You know, China might not have released this purposely on the world, but what the US response has proven, something like this would be a very affective tool to wipe us out. We have no plan, and even if we did, most of the country would ignore it.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

You know, China might not have released this purposely on the world, but what the US response has proven, something like this would be a very affective tool to wipe us out. We have no plan, and even if we did, most of the country would ignore it.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

I'm sure that's crossed their minds at this point

SI

[miked]

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui

My friend who is an Administrator for Emory University in Atlanta posted the following on Facebook:



The fact that the ICUs situation is worse now than it was in April/May is terrifying to me.

I am in no shape or form representing Emory right now but do not forget that the increased testing has put a strain on resources for more testing. Considering most counties have now delayed school for weeks (Fulton and Cobb I believe are now virtual for the first 9 weeks), I'm not sure what will happen at Emory.

[Ksyrup]

https://www.cleveland19.com/2020/07/...s-fourth-july/

I'm seriously torn on how to handle this kind of stuff. I feel terrible that another American has died, but this guy is absolutely what's wrong with this country. Not just the Covid stuff, but some more detailed articles I'd seen showed a lot of his posts which included rape jokes and such.

What struck me was a comment from one of his friends: "We should still be compassionate whether we agree with someone’s beliefs or not." This goes beyond "beliefs" - choosing to ignore science is not a valid "belief." You can't equate the way people are ignoring Covid preventative measures to a disagreement over food stamps or the defense budget.

[larrymcg421]

Originally Posted by miked

I am in no shape or form representing Emory right now but do not forget that the increased testing has put a strain on resources for more testing. Considering most counties have now delayed school for weeks (Fulton and Cobb I believe are now virtual for the first 9 weeks), I'm not sure what will happen at Emory.

Unless there's been a very recent announcement, Fulton has only delayed schools one week and offered students the chance to enroll in a virtual learning opportunity. For the rest of the students , school will be in person. Masks will be required for teachers, but not for students. It's going to be a nightmare.

[JPhillips]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

https://www.cleveland19.com/2020/07/...s-fourth-july/

I'm seriously torn on how to handle this kind of stuff. I feel terrible that another American has died, but this guy is absolutely what's wrong with this country. Not just the Covid stuff, but some more detailed articles I'd seen showed a lot of his posts which included rape jokes and such.

What struck me was a comment from one of his friends: "We should still be compassionate whether we agree with someone’s beliefs or not." This goes beyond "beliefs" - choosing to ignore science is not a valid "belief." You can't equate the way people are ignoring Covid preventative measures to a disagreement over food stamps or the defense budget.

I think it's all tragic and sad. I'm heartbroken that the rest of the country didn't learn from the suffering in NY. That guy that told the nurse he made a mistake and thought it was all a hoax just wrecked me.

[PilotMan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

37-year-old Port Clinton war vet dies from COVID-19 complications on Fourth of July

I'm seriously torn on how to handle this kind of stuff. I feel terrible that another American has died, but this guy is absolutely what's wrong with this country. Not just the Covid stuff, but some more detailed articles I'd seen showed a lot of his posts which included rape jokes and such.

What struck me was a comment from one of his friends: "We should still be compassionate whether we agree with someone’s beliefs or not." This goes beyond "beliefs" - choosing to ignore science is not a valid "belief." You can't equate the way people are ignoring Covid preventative measures to a disagreement over food stamps or the defense budget.

We talked about this a few months ago. People simply will not begin to take it seriously until it directly effects them, or someone they know.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

https://www.cleveland19.com/2020/07/...s-fourth-july/

I'm seriously torn on how to handle this kind of stuff. I feel terrible that another American has died, but this guy is absolutely what's wrong with this country. Not just the Covid stuff, but some more detailed articles I'd seen showed a lot of his posts which included rape jokes and such.

What struck me was a comment from one of his friends: "We should still be compassionate whether we agree with someone’s beliefs or not." This goes beyond "beliefs" - choosing to ignore science is not a valid "belief." You can't equate the way people are ignoring Covid preventative measures to a disagreement over food stamps or the defense budget.

I read the article before seeing your comment and you nailed it. Until people get past the concept that a mask is a philosophical belief we will never get past this thing.

Originally Posted by JPhillips

I think it's all tragic and sad. I'm heartbroken that the rest of the country didn't learn from the suffering in NY. That guy that told the nurse he made a mistake and thought it was all a hoax just wrecked me.

They are no worse then drunk drivers. How many other people did they potentially harm because they are too stubborn or stupid to listen to the science.

Fuck them, Darwinism for the win.

[bob]

Originally Posted by larrymcg421

Unless there's been a very recent announcement, Fulton has only delayed schools one week and offered students the chance to enroll in a virtual learning opportunity. For the rest of the students , school will be in person. Masks will be required for teachers, but not for students. It's going to be a nightmare.

Atlanta Public Schools announced the 9 week online thing. Fulton has only delayed start until the 17th.

[albionmoonlight]

Getting Covid-19 twice: Why I think my patient was reinfected - Vox

For as bad as stuff has been on the society/politics side of things, the news from the science side of things has been really good.

This is an exception to that pattern, and I hope that this represents an outlier case (or something that a vaccine can overcome).

[miked]

Originally Posted by bob

Atlanta Public Schools announced the 9 week online thing. Fulton has only delayed start until the 17th.

That's it, obviously since I'm in crappy Dekalb (who have not even made a plan yet) I get Fulton/Atlanta mixed up. I thought I heard that a few other counties have also followed Atlanta and switched to virtual for the first 2 months.

[whomario]

Originally Posted by albionmoonlight

Getting Covid-19 twice: Why I think my patient was reinfected - Vox

For as bad as stuff has been on the society/politics side of things, the news from the science side of things has been really good.

This is an exception to that pattern, and I hope that this represents an outlier case (or something that a vaccine can overcome).

I think he raises enough valid reasons to (for now and for us as citizens !) leave this in the "you never know" column where you keep an eye on things (one more reason for meticulously keeping data as well) but not jump to conclusions.

One thing not mentioned: There's also the real chance of him getting a false positive the first time around, especially given how 3 months ago flu/cold was a valid reason for symptoms, his were mild (so nobody would really take other measures) and testing was at best chaotic so i would not be certain all protocolls were followed stringently all the time at all steps. Heck, a german Lab was found to have saved money not doing the Standard "2 RNA areas checked" that really drives down FP chances, doing 1 instead. A FP obviously is rare, but so are these reports.

From my understanding a vaccine is a bit different in that it triggers a heightened immune response by default, which is part of why safety testing is so important (you have to give the immune system a good 'nudge' to react), so short immunity or none in really mild cases would not mean a vaccine can't get better 'mileage'.

[sterlingice]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

37-year-old Port Clinton war vet dies from COVID-19 complications on Fourth of July

I'm seriously torn on how to handle this kind of stuff. I feel terrible that another American has died, but this guy is absolutely what's wrong with this country. Not just the Covid stuff, but some more detailed articles I'd seen showed a lot of his posts which included rape jokes and such.

What struck me was a comment from one of his friends: "We should still be compassionate whether we agree with someone’s beliefs or not." This goes beyond "beliefs" - choosing to ignore science is not a valid "belief." You can't equate the way people are ignoring Covid preventative measures to a disagreement over food stamps or the defense budget.

I have a hard time with this, too. I don't want to see another human being die. But I also worry how many other people did he put at risk with his carelessness.

SI

[miked]

As one of the teachers in my son's school said, if the meetings where you are deciding about re-opening schools need to take place over zoom for fear of the virus 3 weeks before the school opens, perhaps the decision is easier.

[Brian Swartz]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

What struck me was a comment from one of his friends: "We should still be compassionate whether we agree with someone’s beliefs or not." This goes beyond "beliefs" - choosing to ignore science is not a valid "belief." You can't equate the way people are ignoring Covid preventative measures to a disagreement over food stamps or the defense budget.

Is there a reason why we have to relate the two? You can hate everything a person did and stood for and still have empathy for things that happened to them. Those can be two distinct considerations.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Brian Swartz

Is there a reason why we have to relate the two? You can hate everything a person did and stood for and still have empathy for things that happened to them. Those can be two distinct considerations.

Not in my mind. He is an adult who made the conscious decision to ignore science, putting himself and others at risk. His death is a direct result of that. I have zero empathy for him the same way I would have zero empathy for someone choosing to drive 80 MPH in a 50 zone who wraps their car around a tree.

[SirFozzie]

I disagree. You can have empathy for someone who made a bad/wrong decision, even if it's just a reflection of the empathy you should feel for someone who lost a family member.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

I disagree. You can have empathy for someone who made a bad/wrong decision, even if it's just a reflection of the empathy you should feel for someone who lost a family member.

feeling empathy for the family is different than the individual. I do feel for the family/friends.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

I disagree. You can have empathy for someone who made a bad/wrong decision, even if it's just a reflection of the empathy you should feel for someone who lost a family member.

I agree with this and at the same time you can still be critical of him for being careless and a general douche bag. I would probably not go as far as to castigate him online immediately after he died though. He made his own choices and a far greater degree of my compassion goes to those he needlessly exposed.

[Edward64]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Not in my mind. He is an adult who made the conscious decision to ignore science, putting himself and others at risk. His death is a direct result of that. I have zero empathy for him the same way I would have zero empathy for someone choosing to drive 80 MPH in a 50 zone who wraps their car around a tree.

I'm with you.

I'm assuming his disbelief was consistent in the past 3-5 months. I'd have sympathy for a teenager or young adult but a 37 old person made a conscious decision(s). I wouldn't have wished for him to pass but not feeling sorry he's gone either.

I wouldn't go as far as 80mph in a 50 zone example but certainly applies race car drivers, wing suit flyers, free solo rock climbers ...

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

I agree with this and at the same time you can still be critical of him for being careless and a general douche bag. I would probably not go as far as to castigate him online immediately after he died though. He made his own choices and a far greater degree of my compassion goes to those he needlessly exposed.

I agree with this also. No need to piss on his grave