Werewolf XXX: The Ghost Council of Orzhova - Game Over - Game Ends Night Five

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

So does it then reason that he could still be a Dimir and yet compel the actions of the truly devout?

I am guessing so at this point. I can't quote the PM, but it basically said as head of religious caste I should do as he chose. As a devout follower I culd not opoose him.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

So it's not about a game within a game, where the true believers are battling the atheists for some secondary prize?

I'm not aware of such a dynamic, but that doesn't mean one won't develop. After all, we have been informed that you can be regarded as rather self-serving, IIRC. That would seem to go against the group effort we need to kill the Dimir.

But at the moment, I myself, as a devout believer, do not believe you pose a threat to our attempt to rid ourselves of the Dimir.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I'm not aware of such a dynamic, but that doesn't mean one won't develop. After all, we have been informed that you can be regarded as rather self-serving, IIRC. That would seem to go against the group effort we need to kill the Dimir.

But at the moment, I myself, as a devout believer, do not believe you pose a threat to our attempt to rid ourselves of the Dimir.

I wouldnt have told him that chief if you were a member of our faith. We dont know what he is capable of and he definitly made me be a deciding vote to kill a good guy today. He likely can compell you tommorrow. (or maybe tonight)

[path12]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Its a fancy way of saying that you cant bribe me or convert me. I have a different ability that protects me at nights.

Has there been a game where someone is actually invulnerable? Because that's what I'm getting here, and it seems like a nice ability to have.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

st. cronin, I'm curious in that you changed your vote without making much of a mention as to why. I found that suspicous at the time and am wondering what made you switch.

At the time hoopsguy was way out in front. I didn't know what to make of either guys story, or Swaggs for that matter. I wish Fouts had been a little bit more ... convincing.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by path12

Has there been a game where someone is actually invulnerable? Because that's what I'm getting here, and it seems like a nice ability to have.

If you're a bad guy try it out. Maybe you'll like it as much as me

[st.cronin]

dola

I also thought that knowing if Fouts was good would be more helpful than knowing that hoopsguy was good. In other words, had we lynched hoops and he turned up good, I would not have been convinced of Fouts badness.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Alan T

I wouldnt have told him that chief if you were a member of our faith. We dont know what he is capable of and he definitly made me be a deciding vote to kill a good guy today. He likely can compell you tommorrow. (or maybe tonight)

I'm actually not sure my devotion is as strong as yours, as the wording of how you describe your invulnerabiltiy varies somewhat from my own. So I am not so sure I am as vulnerable to his power.

Regardless, I have other ways of protecting myself, and I feel the matter will be settled before he feels the need to compel my vote.

[hoopsguy]

I will consider it a monumental upset if I'm in a position to compel a deciding vote tomorrow.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

dola

I also thought that knowing if Fouts was good would be more helpful than knowing that hoopsguy was good. In other words, had we lynched hoops and he turned up good, I would not have been convinced of Fouts badness.

I don't understand this logic at all.

Your late vote shift and this logic does not look good to me. I hope you can do something tonight to make us see that you are truly on our side.

[Schmidty]

Damnit, I left with my wife for a "quick trip to the store" a couple of hours ago, and didn't get back until just now. I'm really sorry about missing the deadline guys.

Now I have to catch up.

[Swaggs]

Alan, any chance you have tonight's and last night's votes handy?

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

I don't understand this logic at all.

Your late vote shift and this logic does not look good to me. I hope you can do something tonight to make us see that you are truly on our side.

Nothing I can do. My abilities are strictly political, and right now they appear to have been taken away. I'm sorry if you don't see the logic the same way I do.

[st.cronin]

dola

Apparently I will get my political prowess back if I vote for a Dimri.

[hoopsguy]

As a show of faith, I'm willing to take suggestions on who to visit tonight:
1.) search for faithful, in attempt to clear them
2.) search for Gruul, in attempt to expose them

I expect to have both actions available to me this evening. So for those who are doubting me the most, tell me where I should go. You make the decisions - I absolve myself of responsibility here.

If someone wants to test me, send me to a certain place, watch me, and verify if I'm indeed carrying out my orders.

[saldana]

my top suspects right now:

Hoops (duh)
Path

a couple others are close to making the list, but i dont have anything more than hunches, so i wont point fingers yet.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

As a show of faith, I'm willing to take suggestions on who to visit tonight:
1.) search for faithful, in attempt to clear them
2.) search for Gruul, in attempt to expose them

I expect to have both actions available to me this evening. So for those who are doubting me the most, tell me where I should go. You make the decisions - I absolve myself of responsibility here.

If someone wants to test me, send me to a certain place, watch me, and verify if I'm indeed carrying out my orders.

how about staying in your room and sleep soundly?

[Chief Rum]

Interesting side point to consider: this is a guild with a power structure. If someone in a powerful position is euthanized, would not that position then be open, to be filled either by election, lottery or a previously determined order of succession? Would that new person ascending tot hat position than also receive the powers that come with that position? I would imagine so.

hoopsguy is the top religious figure, and st. cronin the head of the guild. Does this possibility make them targets even more? After all, we have been described as a very self-serving group. And the Dimir would attempt to do this as well, if their own aren't already in power. What better place to be than to be the one on top if you have infiltrated the guild?

Also, if hoops or st. cronin were euthanized (choosing the top positions, BTW, not making a statement for either), does that mean that the Praetor, KWhit, becomes the Magister? And who would replace hoops? If it is the most devout, would it be Alan T?

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Interesting side point to consider: this is a guild with a power structure. If someone in a powerful position is euthanized, would not that position then be open, to be filled either by election, lottery or a previously determined order of succession? Would that new person ascending tot hat position than also receive the powers that come with that position? I would imagine so.

hoopsguy is the top religious figure, and st. cronin the head of the guild. Does this possibility make them targets even more? After all, we have been described as a very self-serving group. And the Dimir would attempt to do this as well, if their own aren't already in power. What better place to be than to be the one on top if you have infiltrated the guild?

Also, if hoops or st. cronin were euthanized (choosing the top positions, BTW, not making a statement for either), does that mean that the Praetor, KWhit, becomes the Magister? And who would replace hoops? If it is the most devout, would it be Alan T?

My understanding is I am lowest rank, everyone and the janitor ranks above me. I have no idea as Im confused a bit by this story line though.

My understand is I am not of political power, I just am a very devout believer.

[hoopsguy]

Alan, that option doesn't really help our cause. Demonstrating someone is devout should help create a circle of trust. Locating a Gruul should give you someone to lynch after I'm dead. These are activities that would help us and would be wasted with me staying in my room.

If I had assurances that doing nothing would advance our cause, I would do it. But I'm also concerned about the impact of giving the Gruul an extra day, based on my initial PM.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Also, if hoops or st. cronin were euthanized (choosing the top positions, BTW, not making a statement for either), does that mean that the Praetor, KWhit, becomes the Magister?

I think that might be true. Although it might depend on what the exact circumstances were.

[hoopsguy]

Chief, the last game we played certainly worked that way in terms of getting a promotion with the death of a superior. But I haven't seen anything yet in this game to suggest this is the case.

[saldana]

if there were promotions or successions, i would like to think Anxiety would have told us about that being part of the game structure, as it would prove to be kind of an important motivator for some peoples actions.

[Barkeep49]

I'd love to see a Grul exposed. Yeah think that would be a good thing.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Alan T

My understanding is I am lowest rank, everyone and the janitor ranks above me. I have no idea as Im confused a bit by this story line though.

My understand is I am not of political power, I just am a very devout believer.

Politically, yes, you are perhaps on the lowest rung. But you have been demonstrated to be very devout, and the Pontifex Maximus is outside of the normal power structure. Would it not be the most devout living member of the guild who woul dget strongest consideration for that role if it should become open?

As I am devout as well, of course, I would assume I would also be a candidate in those circumstances.

[hoopsguy]

So far every death has been a Prelate, so that isn't helping us learn about promotions.

Saldana, you implied earlier that you thought private roles were tied to public roles - do you still believe this? I didn't have any reason to think so at the time, based on my own mismatch but your comment didn't draw much conversation. Perhaps because it was wrapped around a big helping of loco that we have now come to expect from you ...

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Politically, yes, you are perhaps on the lowest rung. But you have been demonstrated to be very devout, and the Pontifex Maximus is outside of the normal power structure. Would it not be the most devout living member of the guild who woul dget strongest consideration for that role if it should become open?

As I am devout as well, of course, I would assume I would also be a candidate in those circumstances.

I suppose then its a possibility. I have no idea how that all works.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by saldana

if there were promotions or successions, i would like to think Anxiety would have told us about that being part of the game structure, as it would prove to be kind of an important motivator for some peoples actions.

You saying that would have motivated you to kill?

Just kidding.

[hoopsguy]

CR, happy to have you in the mix today. After your first day, I was wondering if you were not enjoying your virgin werewolf experience.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

CR, happy to have you in the mix today. After your first day, I was wondering if you were not enjoying your virgin werewolf experience.

Oh, not at all. I am loving it. I just had to work at both jobs yesterday, and the day job today. I don't have Internet access to here from either. I'm afraid the day time job will continue to get in the way of my participation in the Days (at least until the weekend).

You will usually see me very early (quick stop before I go into work), or running in at the end to read and catch up before the end-of-Day deadline. Then I should be a lot more active at night (like tonight).

I'm having a blast.

[saldana]

chief,

couple things

1. glad you are enjoying yourself..it is always great to have new players, they add an element to games that is always fun, hope you stick around and play some more

2. one of the standing rules of all werewolf games is please dont edit your posts, even if it is just to fix a typo, or you think the post is completely innocuous. if you need to correct something you posted, just quote yourself or dola it

3. i have found it useful in situations like yours, when you are ducking in at the end of a "day" and need to get caught up fast to announce that you are here, and someone will ususally give you a quick recap of the days major events and voting trends...you can usually throw a vote out based on that and then go back and read stuff more thoroughly later on. this way you arent trying to jam through 8 pages of posts with one eye on the clock

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by saldana

chief,

couple things

1. glad you are enjoying yourself..it is always great to have new players, they add an element to games that is always fun, hope you stick around and play some more

2. one of the standing rules of all werewolf games is please dont edit your posts, even if it is just to fix a typo, or you think the post is completely innocuous. if you need to correct something you posted, just quote yourself or dola it

3. i have found it useful in situations like yours, when you are ducking in at the end of a "day" and need to get caught up fast to announce that you are here, and someone will ususally give you a quick recap of the days major events and voting trends...you can usually throw a vote out based on that and then go back and read stuff more thoroughly later on. this way you arent trying to jam through 8 pages of posts with one eye on the clock

Thanks, saldana. For the record, I only edited that post to add the smilie. I didn't want you think I was seriously questioning your motives.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by hoopsguy

So far every death has been a Prelate, so that isn't helping us learn about promotions.

Saldana, you implied earlier that you thought private roles were tied to public roles - do you still believe this? I didn't have any reason to think so at the time, based on my own mismatch but your comment didn't draw much conversation. Perhaps because it was wrapped around a big helping of loco that we have now come to expect from you ...

more so now than ever i believe this to be true. how do you consider your own roles a mismatch...you are the head of the religious sect, and you have the power to search for a faithful acolyte at night...those 2 things are rather connected...as for your Gruul searching thing...i think thats BS, so i am not factoring that into my idea.

and what the hell are you talking about?

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Thanks, saldana. For the record, I only edited that post to add the smilie. I didn't want you think I was seriously questioning your motives.

thats ok, i knew you were kidding....but thats not the post you edited

now stop trying to convince everyone to kill me

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by saldana

thats ok, i knew you were kidding....but thats not the post you edited

now stop trying to convince everyone to kill me

Whoops, same thing, different person. I had a similar post toward st. cronin. That was the one where I decided to add the smilie, because I didn't want st. cronin to read more into it than I meant it to.

Regardless, I won't do that anymore.

[st.cronin]

I have to say, I'm very curious about what happens during the night. Although I expect I won't really have any idea until I hear it from you guys.

[Fouts]

Can't say I'm surprised people fell for the fake role bs for the millionth time. Good luck to the Orzhov.

FYI, at least I did very well on my exams, which is more important than arguing with hoops.

[Blade6119]

Originally Posted by Fouts

Can't say I'm surprised people fell for the fake role bs for the millionth time. Good luck to the Orzhov.

FYI, at least I did very well on my exams, which is more important than arguing with hoops.

Ill use my one night comment to apologize to fouts for the rule change my death created. I wish ya could talk more, sorry mate.

[Poli]

Holy Cow. Chief Rum is playing? I wish I could.

Even if I could somehow try to play, I'd be 7-9 hours ahead of most of you...and most likely lynched like most of us out here (Euro guys).

[Abe Sargent]

Late in the night, so late that some of you might call it early morning, you hear shouts coming from the room of KWhit

You make your way down the hall to see KWhit shouting at...

...a random guy you haven't seen before. None of you know who this guy is, but he is dripping blood and acid from a lethal wound in his stomach. This man is lying on the ground in the hallway outside of KWhit's room.

KWhit continues to shout at the man as if you weren't even there.

"Did you think I wasn't going to be protected? Did you? I worked my up to the second highest positon in one of the most secretive and backstabbing guilds in the land. Did you think I would die to some guy who doesn;t even know magic, and just uses a blade?"

Kwhit is so angry that with one motion he magically flings the man up against the hallway wall opposite KWhit's room. KWhit turns to you all as if acknowledging you for the first time. "I'm not good at mental charms. Who's somebody I trust?" He looks at you all in turn and sighs. "I don't trust any of you. You, Alan T, you were talking about how you were all devout and what. You have no position of power. Mindscan him."

Alan T moves up to the man, still suspended by KWhit's force magic. Alan T begins scanning the man and then backs away. He turns to KWhit as if to say something, but KWhit stops him.

"No, no, not yet. I didn't say I trusted you, I said you weren't in any authoritative position. Barkeep, no one cares about you, you are the least likely person to ever lead a coup, mindscan."

Barkeep shrugs his shoulders and appraoches the man. A little more slowly than Alan T he scans the mind of the dying man. As Barkeep steps away, KWhit begins talking again.

"Okay, Alan T, telepathically inform what you saw. Interesting. Okay, now Barkeep, tell me telepathically what you saw. Yes, that's what I thought"

KWhit turns to you all. "They saw the exact same thing. This guy works outside the guildhouse and was approached earlier this evening by hoopsguy and paid 100 gold coins to kill me. A compulsion spell was placed on him so that he'd have to follow through and he was paid."

KWHit stares directly at hoopsguy, "The only thing that prevents me from killing you right now is that we still have rules and laws in our guild. Something you must have forgotten a long time ago. Don't think you are going to get away with this."

KWhit begins to walk back to his room and stops. "Time to take out the trash," he says. He holds up his right fist, and then opens it so quickly you didn't even see it open up. At the same time, you hear a tremendous *thwack* sound and turn towards it. There lies the man, slumping to the ground, body in an odd position as if many major bones were just broken, including the spine. The person is obviously dead.


Day Three has begun. Deadline is 9:00 pm EST Wednesday Night.


-Anxiety

[tanglewood]

Well...

Vote Hoopsguy

[Swaggs]

I have a long workday ahead, but will try to sneak on later this morning if I have a chance.

If not, I will place my vote now:

Vote hoopsguy

I should be back by 7:00 PM EST. I picked up a little more information last night, so it should be interesting to see what information goes up between now and when I return.

[Chief Rum]

I will be away all day until the end, but I am uncertain of all this just yet, so I cannot cast the obvious vote. There is more going on here than I think is clear to everyone. I would wait to hear what Alan T, Barkeep and KWhit say before casting a vote.

[hoopsguy]

This is just silly. As a religious leader I don't even draw a salary, let alone have 100 gold coins. All of our funds are placed back into the church and focused on efforts to help each and every one of you find salvation in the afterlife.

There is another devout among us who should be able to vouch for my role after last night.

And Saldana is not Gruul. Doesn't mean he's not crazy, or that someone is not trying to kill him. But he is not Gruul.

[Swaggs]

One last thing and then I am out the door...

If someone made an attempt last night that was blocked, please do not reveal yourself today, unless you really feel it is necessary. I feel like I interfered with someone else's magical action last night, but it was unintentional, and I did not get any bad vibes from that person, at all.

So, do not feel like I will reveal who you are. In fact, I would lean towards believing that you had good intentions last night.

[hoopsguy]

Another thing - I have now been accused with two non-kills during night actions. If I am the villain everyone seems intent to paint me as, I'm obviously horribly incompetent.

KWhit - I'm glad you are OK.

[Alan T]

I don't really have anything else to comment about last night's events. I did not receive a PM and I did not submit any night action.

My knowledge of what happened is the exact same as what everyone else read here. If I have to guess, Barkeep will say the same.

[Alan T]

Swaggs asked for this earlier, but I forgot all about it..

Day 1 votes:

Saldana - Blade (139), Schmidty (158), Fouts (203), Path (227), Barkeep (230)

Fouts - Chubby (143)

Hoops - AlanT (172), Swaggs (181)

Blade - Cronin (201), KWhit (219), Hoops (226), Tangle (231), Saldana


Day two votes:


Fouts - Hoopsguy (335), Cronin (438), Tanglewood (441), Chubby (450), Path (471), Rum (472)

Hoopsguy - Fouts (336), KWhit (346), Barkeep (361), Saldana (364), Swaggs (388), Alan (474)

[Barkeep49]

Just so you all know I recieved no PM about the action, so I have no particular insight to give.

Just as I did yesterday I will
Vote Hoopsguy

[hoopsguy]

I thought about this on the car ride into work today, trying to make some sense of these events.

1. Did anyone follow me last night, spy on me last night, or have any way to confirm my accounts for night activities? If so, they should have clearly seen me meet with Chief Rum. If they are able to detect magic, they should have been able to detect my casting of a spell to view Saldana.

2. The idea of bribery has been introduced into the game. In this case, I believe that the unnamed person attacking KWhit is the one that was bribed. The information KWhit holds is a result of knowledge passed by the Thug. This feels like some kind of "plant evidence" power - something that has been available in other WW games.

As I stated before, I do not have any kind of money in this game. I don't know if other offices have some form of currency but I certainly do not. So any story that suggests I paid a random guy to attack KWhit is categorically false.

I don't expect any of this to change votes today if someone is not willing to come forward and somehow vouch for me. I think we are very fortunate that up to this point we have not lost any of our members to a night attack, although I would argue that we are in fact losing me as a result of a Dimir night action if/when you euthanize me today.