Pro Wrestling Discussion Thread **Spoilers Possible**

[duckman]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I have only the faintest notion of who he is, could somebody who has seen him give me an idea of whether he can actually work?

He's a decent worker, but has the charisma of a paper sack.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by duckman

He's a decent worker, but has the charisma of a paper sack.

i disagree...i dont think he can work, or has any charisma.

Jon, he was originally Christian's bodyguard, which may be how he got "in" at TNA...all he really ever did was interfere in Christian's matches...in the matches he actually worked in, he was just another moderately agile, tall, roid bag....his finishing move was an irish whip that comes off into "the big boot" to the face (something i always consider to be the finisher of the talentless).

i consider this to be a name recognition signing.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

That was indeed, the Dweam hisself.

He's part of an angle for Survivor Series that has The Spirit Squad (aka the annoying male cheerleaders in green track suits) taking on a team of Legends (Flair, Anderson, Rhodes, Simmons, and I think Piper is the fifth one).

Piper is out after having a mass removed from his lower back. Ron Simmons is taking his place in the match.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by duckman

Piper is out after having a mass removed from his lower back. Ron Simmons is taking his place in the match.

and Slaughter is the other guy on that team....not sure about Arn though...last night they said he would be at ringside, but not specifically in the match, so i wonder if he is actually gonna get in the ring or just stand there.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by saldana

i disagree...i dont think he can work, or has any charisma.

Jon, he was originally Christian's bodyguard, which may be how he got "in" at TNA...all he really ever did was interfere in Christian's matches...in the matches he actually worked in, he was just another moderately agile, tall, roid bag....his finishing move was an irish whip that comes off into "the big boot" to the face (something i always consider to be the finisher of the talentless).

i consider this to be a name recognition signing.

Agreed. I vaguely remember the name, but couldn't figure out who he was or what he'd done in the WWE. After reading his bio, I still don't remember.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

After reading his bio, I still don't remember.

Same problem I had.

[Flasch186]

I seem him sometimes, out and about, in St. Augustine. He stands out amongst the crowd.

[JonInMiddleGA]

(watching the Genesis replay today)

Y'know, I'm starting to think that there isn't anybody I'd rather watch in the ring right now more than Christopher Daniels.

I'm not saying he's the best wrestler in the world right now, nor the most charismatic, nor the most ... anything.

Just that he's become the guy that I enjoy watching work more consistently than anybody else right now.

[Toddzilla]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

I seem him sometimes, out and about, in St. Augustine. He stands out amongst the crowd.

I work in Ashburn, VA, and Batista frequents the Gold's Gym across the complex. He's here one in a while, and he is a lousy driver...


...but I'm not telling him.

[molson]

Originally Posted by saldana

and Slaughter is the other guy on that team....not sure about Arn though...last night they said he would be at ringside, but not specifically in the match, so i wonder if he is actually gonna get in the ring or just stand there.

He'll just be hanging out at ringside, and probably get a few shots in on the 5th Spirit Squad member who is also at ringside.

He had a career ending back injury, so I'm guessing he had an insurance policy where he would forfeit the benefits if he wrestled again.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

I work in Ashburn, VA, and Batista frequents the Gold's Gym across the complex. He's here one in a while, and he is a lousy driver...but I'm not telling him.

Good call

Meanwhile, as for brushes with fame, Jason Blackman (of NWA-Anarchy) stood in line behind us at the UWF-TNA event in South Carolina.

Okay, I got nothing.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

(watching the Genesis replay today)

Y'know, I'm starting to think that there isn't anybody I'd rather watch in the ring right now more than Christopher Daniels.

I'm not saying he's the best wrestler in the world right now, nor the most charismatic, nor the most ... anything.

Just that he's become the guy that I enjoy watching work more consistently than anybody else right now.

Daniels is without question a top 5 wrestler in the world. He consistently delievers. He is great on the mic and he is always looking to make someone else look good. Frankly my dream match still is Benoit vs Daniels, but the chances of that look slimmer by the day.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DeToxRoxDVHStyle

Daniels is without question a top 5 wrestler in the world. He consistently delievers. He is great on the mic and he is always looking to make someone else look good.

By golly, I think the words we might be looking are could be "true professional".

[TazFTW]

Roddy Piper has Hodgkin's lymphoma.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by TazFTW

Roddy Piper has Hodgkin's lymphoma.

Very sad to hear.

[MikeVic]

Originally Posted by TazFTW

Roddy Piper has Hodgkin's lymphoma.

Yeah, that sucks.

[jbmagic]

Vince Mcmahon classic music video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjFFoy3tg4s

[Deattribution]

Apparently the ECW PPV lastnight was so bad that they've let Paul Heyman go. Most people are saying it's one of the worst PPVs ever. They had to find someone to be the scapegoat.

Originally Posted by PWinsider.com

As Mike reported a few minutes ago, Paul Heyman is gone from WWE. From talking to a number of people in company, the impression I received was that Vince McMahon was irate about how awful the PPV was last night and wanted to pin the blame on Heyman for it. Anyone who knows anything about Heyman's booking, as I have for years now, have a pretty good idea that the show was much more McMahon than Heyman. But according to people I spoke with, Heyman got pinned with the blame for it with the theory being that "he is caught in the past and doesn't understand the new vision of ECW". You know, the vision that ends PPVs a half hour early and makes the fans boo what WWE creative books for them.

The problems started yesterday at the ECW PPV when everyone realized that the show really stunk. Heyman was said to be unhappy with the way that the show was booked (big shock right) and sources backstage told me that he voiced that concern both before the show and after it. People at TV told me today that it was obvious that there were issues between Vince McMahon and Heyman because of the how the show played out on pay TV, with everyone knowing it was a disaster. Problems carried over from last night and led to the incidents that happened today.

A number of sources told me that there was a meeting today around two o'clock with Heyman, Vince McMahon and Stephanie McMahon-Levesque at the building. Heyman came out the meeting and seemed like his normal self, with no one I talked to having any idea that something bad had happened. Shortly thereafter, Heyman gathered his things and left the building to go home.

The word going around from everyone I talked to is that this is not a storyline in any way and he is legitimately done with the company.

[SirFozzie]

And, as expected, tonight's rematch between Lashley and Big Show at the tapings for tommorrow night's show will be the last match for Big Show for a while, as his commitments are complete and he will retire (at least in the short term) to deal with his injuries.

[molson]

Originally Posted by Deattribution

Apparently the ECW PPV lastnight was so bad that they've let Paul Heyman go. Most people are saying it's one of the worst PPVs ever. They had to find someone to be the scapegoat.

Pretty interesting blurb on WWE.com:

Distraught by the results of December to Dismember, ECW Representative Paul Heyman appeared to be distant and depressed this afternoon at the North Charleston Coliseum hours before an ECW live event.

This condition was further exasperated by Mr. McMahon, who decided to send Heyman home. The WWE Chairman cited slumping television ratings and a disgruntled talent roster as causes for Mr. Heyman’s dismissal.

Check back to ECW.com for updates on the status on Paul Heyman and ECW.

I've never heard the WWE mention the crappy ratings of one of their own shows. The "struggling brand" might be a fun angle, if the WWE were brave enough to pull it off.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I just read a recap of the PPV and ... Wow. What a steaming pile that sounds like. I feel bad for Paul but at the same time, I can't imagine how he couldn't have anticipated how this would turn out.

[duckman]

Originally Posted by molson

I've never heard the WWE mention the crappy ratings of one of their own shows. The "struggling brand" might be a fun angle, if the WWE were brave enough to pull it off.

The rumor is that Heyman is on his way out due to how badly the PPV went last night. He and McMahon got into a confrontation over the creative direction of the program and it led to tonight's blowup.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Can you imagine what adding Heyman's brain could do for the TNA booking?

Won't happen, but if he still has the ability to let storylines build and keep the fans interested all the while ... damn.

[Maple Leafs]

If Heyman shows up on TNA and verbally runs down ECW, does that pretty much kill the brand immediately?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Maple Leafs

If Heyman shows up on TNA and verbally runs down ECW, does that pretty much kill the brand immediately?

I dunno, I think it's already pretty much dead as a brand (at least to anyone who remembers the original).

But it sure would make for some interesting television as well as a perfect companion piece to the VKM angle that TNA is running right now. He would also make a logical successor to Cornette as the on-camera authority ... which would last maybe a couple of months before he had the same no-control problems with Russo that he had with the McMahons.

Sigh.

[DeToxRox]

TNA is focusing on WWE far too much.

The VKM is stupid. Killings had a rap on the TNA site about Cena. Enough is enough. All it does is show how far behind the WWE TNA is.

[Deattribution]

Originally Posted by DeToxRoxDVHStyle

TNA is focusing on WWE far too much.

The VKM is stupid. Killings had a rap on the TNA site about Cena. Enough is enough. All it does is show how far behind the WWE TNA is.

Sadly they're not that far apart, one just has a bigger built in fan base... This is further proven by the EXACT rip-off of Angle/Joe on Raw tonight between Cena/Umaga. Funny stuff.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by Deattribution

Sadly they're not that far apart, one just has a bigger built in fan base... This is further proven by the EXACT rip-off of Angle/Joe on Raw tonight between Cena/Umaga. Funny stuff.

Well considering that Joe/Angle wasn't exactly an original concept it think it's a bad example to cite but I understand where you're coming from. But when TNA is only drawing .9 on Primetime and WWE consistently draws 1.5's with ECW that tells me that TNA isn't near their league and they need to worry about their own business.

Why would Vince be worried about VKM skits? Acknowledging it would be worse then anything and ignoring it it just keeps TNA looking like hacks (And yes the WWE does a good job being hacky too but people still watch)

And for people bitching about DX, that's all VKM is.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DeToxRoxDVHStyle

Killings had a rap on the TNA site about Cena.

That's a weird deal anyway. Killings has once again requested his release from TNA. I figure he wanted to do the Cena thing as a way to try to build some heat & catch Vince's attention. Meanwhile I figure TNA let him do it because they figure Vince will hate it & not want him.

[Toddzilla]

Odd - why show Heyman on TV if he indeed is gone...

[jbmagic]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Odd - why show Heyman on TV if he indeed is gone...

That part was tape not live.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Odd - why show Heyman on TV if he indeed is gone...

Its a storyline. WWE.com IMO would not report these incidents in such detail if it was not. I have a feeling it involves ECW's old guard vs the ECW's new blood. Just a hunch

[SirFozzie]

Don't think so, or if so, it's fooled ALL the dirt sheets, including Melzer

[duckman]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

Don't think so, or if so, it's fooled ALL the dirt sheets, including Melzer

The firing is legit, but I bet he did the TV appearance for story continuity.

[Deattribution]

Originally Posted by duckman

The firing is legit, but I bet he did the TV appearance for story continuity.

Because WWE is ALL about continuity

[Jas_lov]

I think they taped that ECW before Heyman was fired. I'm not really sure if it's a storyline or it's legit. But if it's a storyline then they intentionally made a bad PPV that cost people money? I don't buy it. If Heyman had just been given control at the start of ECW it would probably be a lot better. If only he could sign with TNA somehow.

[DeToxRox]

Is TNA really as awful as everyone is saying? This sounds like a bad episode of Raw. Oxymoron, yes.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by DeToxRoxDVHStyle

Is TNA really as awful as everyone is saying? This sounds like a bad episode of Raw. Oxymoron, yes.

Let's just say that from reading the live pbp I was not impressed.

Sounded like a very Russo'ish PPV.

[DeToxRox]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Let's just say that from reading the live pbp I was not impressed.

Sounded like a very Russo'ish PPV.

Yup. Lots of kayfabe broken and VKM is getting stupid. WCW tried it before and they were a lot closer to WWE then TNA and look at what happened.

[Toddzilla]

Did you guys see the same PPV I did? It was easy enough to ignore the Russo-scripted horseshit (the bikini match, VKM, etc), and beyond that the PPV was phenomenal. Joe v. Angle was worth the price of the PPV all by itself - classic classic match where I still didn't know who was going to win even after the build up (i.e. Joe getting pinned a second time on the TV show). LAX continues to be the best thing in wrestling, and it was nice to see AMW act like they cared for a change. Sabin/Daniels and Styles/Rhyno (except the finish) were really good, too.

I bought the PPV but got sick, so I got it on the DVR. I'll be watching this one a few more times for sure. This was miles ahead of anything the WWE has done in years, and whats scary is that we all can see where TNA can improve.

[DeToxRox]

I ended up watching it last night.

It was okay but the X-Divison got buried in the opening two matches and were just spot fests with no story. Americas Most Wanted decide to break up again after being back on the same page with no tension for a month.

The best thing on the show was AJ Styles owning Rhino. That was awesome and well done.

And Joe/Angle was awesome but ... I am sorry. HBK/Angle I + II and Joe/Punk I + II were better then both Joe/Angle matches. In fact Joe/Angle II was eerily similar to Punk/Joe III which I found the most enjoyable of the series.

PS - If you want to see the MOTY so far check out this six man tag match from Dragons Gate on one of ROHs shows in March. Do Fixer vs Blood Generation. I know I run down the spot fests TNA had and this was a spot fest but this was 25 minutes of just sick wrestling.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=cUaqZARIqCk --> Part 1. The other two parts are also on there.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Toddzilla

Did you guys see the same PPV I did?

I won't actually see it until one of the replays this week.

But ...

-- The bikini match is downright ridiculous, offensive not so much with the angle itself but rather how badly they've botched the handling of the whole Bobby Roode angle. It seems obvious to me that he's one of the people most victimized by the return of Russo, who clearly has different ideas about how to use him.

-- They managed to overuse the VKM stuff last night. I've been pretty forgiving about the angle overall, really not all that bothered by it but that was way too much time & emphasis put on it for my taste.

-- You forgot to mention the whole baseball player angle. Mildly cute if you need filler I suppose, but I hate getting filler on PPV.

-- By the time the "PCS Series" angle plays out nobody will give a shit. Oh wait. Nobody really gives a shit now. Move Nash over to the VKM angle and keep him the hell out of the X-Division picture. Period.

-- I tenatively approve of the Styles-Rhino finish, pending actually seeing if it was executed well. Although I don't like the Styles turn (or semi-turn) and would have preferred them to keep Styles/Daniels together in the tag division, it seemed as though last night's match actually made sense & was in tune with Styles new character. Problem is, I figure Russo will expect us to forget about any heelish behavior with the next 60 days & AJ goes back to being a face.

-- I see absolutely no rhyme or reason to not doing the obvious thing in the AMW/LAX match last night. Sometimes the obvious thing is the right thing, because it makes sense. Conventional wisdom dictates that AMW goes over last night in the non-title match, with LAX winning to retain the belts next month. Instead, we get a horrific continuation of the current LAX angle
(I mean really, can they get any more heat out of this than they've already gotten? It's already probably a pretty good thing that they aren't doing many house shows, that shit could get somebody shot in some venues) AND we get the sudden return of the AMW internal conflict. And for his own good, will they please keep Konnan out of the ring until after his surgery? Most of what I've read for the past couple of months consistently says that he's risking the ability to walk again if he doesn't get the hip replacement, so it's almost asinine to me that he's even near a situation where he might get bumped right now. I can only assume that this angle is going to run a while, so write up some convoluted storyline to get him out of the picture, go ahead and (ugh) bring Senshi into the fold & rent Julius Smokes for a couple of months while Konnan heals. He can come back & dispose of Smokes to regain control of the group easily enough.

-- Killings/Hoyt vs Seratonin in the pre-show? WTF? Two former world champions stuck in the pre-show while we get Eric & Tracy in a bikini contest in the PPV? rolls eyes. Yep, Russo has got the book.

-- The 3-way for the title. I typically don't like multi-man matches for the top belt, blame that on the traditionalist in me I guess. This isn't an exception to that rule. Let Sting & Cage settle their business. Then let Abyss deal with one of them. Then move on to the next challenger. Hell, everybody knows that this is all placeholding until Angle gets the title/Jarrett returns/Joe gets at least a short title run. So don't make it any more convoluted that it needs to be. Let them chase the Title, you know, that thing that's supposed to be the pinnacle of the profession.

-- Angle/Joe. Well, it reads good. And at least they did the right thing by letting Joe go over last night. Interesting to see Angle getting heelish last night (and in the last Impact before the PPV). It's a tricky situation they've got on their hands here. Two guys that are over so much that they're going to have to really plumb the depths of despicable to turn the crowd against them. And sooner or later they're going to have to work other people. Right now though, they really seem to be head & shoulders ahead of everybody else in the company, I don't know how you separate them for very long when they both obviously need to be around the title. Eventually one of them has to take on the heel role, IMO ... since I figure saving the face/foiling the heel will be how they turn Jarrett when he comes back in a few months.

[Flasch186]

the little thing victoria does, grabbing her hair like she's crazy is possibly one of the dumbest, out of place, worst performed things Ive ever seen and I wish they would just have her be a bad ass like she could be.

[jbmagic]

Did Melina from Raw get a boob job? They seem bigger.

[Flasch186]

LOL

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by TazFTW

Roddy Piper has Hodgkin's lymphoma.

It's actually non-Hodgkins Lymphoma and it was caught very early, so the prognosis is good, here's to hoping it works out for the best for Hot Rod, always one of my favorites.

[MikeVic]

Watching the PPV tonight... a couple of pretty solid matches. The tag title match was especially fun, and Mercury looked gross after getting hit in the nose. It would have made more sense to advertise the match as a ladder match with both MNM and the Hardys added though. That would have gotten buys I think.

The Cruiserweight match was also decent...

[Ryche]

Originally Posted by MikeVic

Watching the PPV tonight... a couple of pretty solid matches. The tag title match was especially fun, and Mercury looked gross after getting hit in the nose. It would have made more sense to advertise the match as a ladder match with both MNM and the Hardys added though. That would have gotten buys I think.

The Cruiserweight match was also decent...

According to WWE, Mercury suffered a broken nose and 18 stitches. You know it's bad when they send you to the hospital before the match is even over.

[Ryche]

Good picture of how Mercury is looking the day after...well, good might not be the right word. Ow!

http://www.wwe.com/shows/armageddon/exclusives/38575801

[Maple Leafs]

Originally Posted by Ryche

Good picture of how Mercury is looking the day after...well, good might not be the right word. Ow!

http://www.wwe.com/shows/armageddon/exclusives/38575801

I'm not sure I've ever seen anyone have both eyes sweel shut five seconds after getting hit in the face. That's generally not a good sign.