Soccer Thread 2022-2023

[Ghost Econ]

We need to amend the rules so that the person fouled is the one who takes a free kick or penalty like it's a free throw in basketball.

[SirFozzie]

Fast break footy!

Drew the penalty for the first goal, and then Coast to Coast solo for the 2nd goal

[Solecismic]

Not quite the same, obviously, but Pulisic could take some notes on how to plow through the box and the keeper and score without sacrificing his vital parts. That was remarkably athletic and the poor defender looked lost. It will be interesting to see if Croatia can generate much pressure in the second half. This has been very one-sided, but teams seem to turtle with the lead in this Cup.

[Ghost Econ]

Twitter and reddit seem to think that shouldn't have been a penalty for Argentina. Is there something I missed?

[bhlloy]

I really hope Messi wins this now. What a player.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Ghost Econ

Twitter and reddit seem to think that shouldn't have been a penalty for Argentina. Is there something I missed?

Basically, it is the equivalent of the block/charge argument in basketball. People arguing that the keeper was standing still and Alvarez ran into him.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

We wondered why Gio didn't play more? Here is why he did not play more

Report: Gio Reyna's Lack of Effort at USMNT Training Resulted in World Cup Benching | News, Scores, Highlights, Stats, and Rumors | Bleacher Report

I still don't understand why Gregg told him his role would be very limited before the World Cup and how that conversation went if it tanked him, or why Gregg is talking at paid speaking engagements like 2 days after the World Cup ends. Combine it with the John Brooks saga and I just want Gregg gone and a non nepotism hire at this point.

I'm also pretty strongly on the side that national team coaches should get one cycle through a World Cup anyways unless they win or vastly exceed expectations like a Croatia or Morocco has, and frankly we didn't do that.

[albionmoonlight]

Looks like Qatar did not kill Grant Wahl, which saves everyone a lot of diplomatic trouble:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...ause-of-death/

Still sucks

[flere-imsaho]

It sucks a lot.

Edit: Brian Phillips, who is also an excellent soccer/football writer, though in a quite different way (want to lose an afternoon? Read his multi-month dynasty, as we'd term it, of managing Pro Vercelli in FM 2009) wrote this in The Ringer about Wahl that I thought was very good:

A quick postscript. This one hurts. Grant Wahl, the most influential American soccer journalist who ever lived, died on Friday, in Qatar, at the age of 48. Grant was a giant in the field. I didn’t know him well, but I knew him well enough to call him a friend, which isn’t surprising; almost everyone who knew him seems to have felt that way about him. He had a way of showing up for people when it counted the most. When I gave a book reading in Brooklyn—even one I hadn’t told him about—he’d be there. When I launched a soccer podcast earlier this year, he invited me on his show to talk about it, then promoted it more vigorously than I did myself. Dozens of people have stories like that about Grant. They’ve been all over Twitter since he died.

I am still struggling to comprehend the loss of my friend. More than that, I’m struggling to comprehend the loss of such a potent force for good in the sport we both loved.

Grant was a fearless critic of FIFA and the Qatari regime, but he managed to look hard at the rotten institutions that control the game without losing his capacity to delight in the game itself. I look at the worst stories to come out of FIFA’s past 20 years and I start to get cynical, I get bitter; as far as I could tell, Grant never did. He thought soccer should be better, so he did what he could to make it better. He talked to migrant workers. He showed up for LGBTQ+ rights. He took meaningful risks to make the sport more just. But his extensive firsthand experience of the game’s corrupt heart never made him lose hope or dampened his enthusiasm for debating the efficacy of a classic 4-4-2.

From the very beginning, this World Cup has demanded an impossible balancing act from its viewers. How can we appreciate these games, many of which have been magnificent, while remaining appropriately horrified at the context in which they’re taking place? Almost none of us have gotten this balance right. Grant did, and it’s a cruel irony that his death now will make that balance even harder to find for the rest of us.

All we can do is try—try to treat each other the way he treated us, try to make the world as good as he thought it could be. I don’t know if I think the world will ever be that good, but I’m trying, for my friend’s sake. May he rest in peace.

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by BishopMVP

I still don't understand why Gregg told him his role would be very limited before the World Cup and how that conversation went if it tanked him, or why Gregg is talking at paid speaking engagements like 2 days after the World Cup ends.

I don't have a problem with speaking engagements, per se, but the two things taken together (plus him talking about Reyna, without naming him, at those engagements) shows some very amateurish man management skills. And that's a problem because honestly a national team coach is, IMO, even more about man management skills than a club coach.

I'm also pretty strongly on the side that national team coaches should get one cycle through a World Cup anyways unless they win or vastly exceed expectations like a Croatia or Morocco has, and frankly we didn't do that.

I could agree with that in general, though I think you can also look at progress overall and alternatives available. England & Southgate spring to mind, here. Yes, they probably missed expectations, but IMO the team is still progressing and I don't see the squad having wholesale changes for the next European Championships. Henderson is probably the only player that ages out, but Harry Kane has easily 2 more tournaments in him and everyone else is young, with increasing good competition for spots (hopefully very much in central defense). I'd take it a tournament at a time, yes, but why shake things up so much.

If I had advice for the FA, though, it would be that they need to address Southgate's weaknesses, like most well-run companies do for their executives. I've worked with a lot of C-level executives and they're always working on improving something. Only the bad ones think they're great at everything. For Southgate, maybe some mentoring on in-game tactical adjustments might be a good thing, for instance.

Further, I'm not especially enthralled with the alternatives being bandied about. Howe & Potter could very well be better (especially Potter), but their clubs aren't going to give them up. Tuchel & Poch & Rodgers are all pretty serious gambles.

But back to the U.S., it's certainly a different situation. Berhalter was OK, but his body of work certainly paints a picture of middling ability. It's hard to believe an upgrade would not be available.

[miami_fan]

I would love to get a better timeline with the Gio situation. I would also like some clarity on some of the verbiage. What does "Just before the World Cup" mean, was he told that his role would be very limited before when the team was announced? Before hr got to Qatar? Or before the first match after showing the lack of effort in training? Also what does "very limited" mean? Was he only supposed to come on as an impact sub? I don't think that would be an insane decision given some of Gio's injury issues this year. Finally, when did he apologize?

Either way, it is on Gio that he did not show the effort required and had to be called out not just by the coaching staff but also by his teammates. I am generally against coaches calling players out in public. I also know that many coaches believe that to be the next corrective step if they have tried to resolve the issue with the player in private and it hasn't worked. It could also be Berhalter putting his side on the record if he no longer is going to be the head coach.

[Solecismic]

Surprised to see Morocco's defense make such a critical mistake so early. Not surprised to see France all over it. Can Morocco play from behind? It will be interesting to see, but I suspect this could get ugly quickly.

[HomerSimpson98]

Morocco definitely up for the fight. Been a fun game

[HomerSimpson98]

I fucking jinxed it

[Solecismic]

They did better than I thought they would. If they could finish the way France can finish, it would have been a nail-biter.

[miami_fan]

For when the inevitable stories that will come out about people quickly jumping on a plane to be in Doha to be there in case their country wins.

Paris to Doha leaving Saturday arriving on Sunday and coming back on Monday costs $2461 round trip.

Buenos Aires to Doha leaving Friday, arriving Sunday morning and coming back early Sunday morning costs $12,772 round trip.

[flere-imsaho]

Honestly, the best part about this French side doing this well is that neither Paul Pogba or Karim Benzema are involved.

[miami_fan]

News from the club football world.

European Super League: legal adviser’s view delivers blow to ailing project | European Super League | The Guardian

Basically, clubs can set up and play in the Super League without FIFA and UEFA approval. but FIFA, UEFA and the domestic leagues can remove those clubs from their competitions. This is non binding but the final verdict follow the the initial verdict around 75%-80% of the time.

Bring on more hedge fund and nation state ownership.

[MIJB#19]

A 32-team club world cup in 2025... *slap face*

Yeah, those people at FIFA have seriously lost their minds. Do they really expect everything in football to stop in December every single year? And all that in the middle of the season that will end with the 2026 actual World Cup. Or is the plan to throw that tournament into the 2025 summer and fuck up players and schedules only in the odd years?

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by MIJB#19

A 32-team club world cup in 2025... *slap face*

Yeah, those people at FIFA have seriously lost their minds. Do they really expect everything in football to stop in December every single year? And all that in the middle of the season that will end with the 2026 actual World Cup. Or is the plan to throw that tournament into the 2025 summer and fuck up players and schedules only in the odd years?

It's scheduled for June 2025 FIFA to launch new Club World Cup with 32 teams in 2025

The fixture congestion part is the issue. If a team just made a run to the CL and domestic cup finals will they run a rotated squad out for most of this? How many Euro powerhouses will be in it vs just allowing a ton of league champions in from across the globe? Seeing an underdog team like Seattle going up against Chelsea sounds cool in theory, but if it's Chelsea's B team what does it really matter? It's tough to see the European teams caring enough about this, though I suppose if like 8 of them make it in I could see a team like Real or Juventus that crashed out of the Champions League early pushing for it and pretending they care almost as much about it as the UCL.

[miami_fan]

You forgot about the FIFA World Series!

In order to increase the possibilities for teams from different confederations to play each other, FIFA would launch friendly tournaments – "FIFA World Series" – which would take place in the March window in even years. The decision for the FIFA World Cup 2030 host will also be made in 2024, with the bid regulations to be published early next year.

Or you know, one nation's FA can coordinate with another nation's FA to arrange a friendly?

[cartman]

ESPN had an interesting story today about how every World Cup final since 1982, including this year, has had a player from both Bayern Munich and Inter Milan.

[Ksyrup]

Third place games are unnecessary and suck for the loser. For one team, they make an amazing run to the semifinals, only to end the tournament with 2 losses.

[bhlloy]

$$$$ for FIFA

[Ksyrup]

Oh I get that, I'm just thinking from the standpoint of the teams.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Third place games are unnecessary and suck for the loser. For one team, they make an amazing run to the semifinals, only to end the tournament with 2 losses.

I agree it sucks for the loser. On the other hand, I have begun to look at it like I do Senior Day in high school and college sports. It has to be really cool for a guy like Luka Modrić to have one more World Cup match as captain with his national teammates and to leave on a victorious high. He is the equivalent of the HS star who is destined for the next level as he goes back to Real Madrid. Many of his other teammates will never play at that level again. Others may have just played their last game at all. Does it mean anything as far as the standings go or will anyone remember who won the third place game? To be fair, I also think it makes a difference who is on the third place game. Is it patronizing to say that it is cool to see Croatia vs Morocco but a France vs Argentina third place game would have been depressing?

[flere-imsaho]

A Croatia vs. Morocco final would have been cool while a France vs. Argentina third place game would have been hilarious.

[flere-imsaho]

Congrats to Morocco, though. A hell of a run. Losing to an experienced team like Croatia is nothing to be ashamed about.

[bob]

I thought he was falling before contact was made

[Edward64]

Okay, I'm watching this game from the beginning and am somewhat entertained.

(But am playing X-Com 2 WOTC at the same time)

[miami_fan]

Incredible counter attack!

[Edward64]

Argentina is making it look easy so far.

[miami_fan]

Well those are interesting substitutions.

[sovereignstar v2]

"2-0 is one of the most dangerous leads."

[Radii]

Absolute dominance thus far. I'm loving it, I really want to see Messi get a world cup title.

[miami_fan]

Yes, people who play for PSG. That is Kylian Mbappé pressing hard from the front. Yes, Kylian. That is exactly the way your PSG teammates feel when you leave them pressin by themselves.

[GrantDawg]

Well, that turned fast

[Radii]

Holy shit that got interesting fast

[miami_fan]

At least 10 minutes of stoppage time?

[Edward64]

Fun game

[sovereignstar v2]

Oh Messi you have to place that better

[Ksyrup]

Instead of playing this game, someone should have just fired up MS-DOS and played a game of Bird vs Dr. J.

[sovereignstar v2]

Alvarez has been running 90+ minutes for himself and Messi. He's insane

[GrantDawg]

This is going to suck if it is decided by PK.

[Lathum]

If this is overturned by VAR shut it down

[sovereignstar v2]

Yes!

[miami_fan]

Can someone tell Sergio Agüero to come down please?

[Coffee Warlord]

Wow.

[Lathum]

Wonder what this guy is going through

Bettor Who Needs France World Cup Win For Massive Parlay Cashes Out

[sovereignstar v2]

Ffs