Pro Wrestling Discussion Thread **Spoilers Possible**

[miami_fan]

I took my son to his first live show last night. I have not been to a live show in over 25 years myself so it was a pretty new experience for me as well. I am by no means an expert nor a huge fan but here are my impressions.

Cena-Rollins was probably the best match overall based on the response from the crowd.

Rollins and Bray on the mic were amazing. I did not expect them to address the Reigns suspension but there was Rollins hitting it right off the bat.

I wonder if WWE Creative should be concerned that as soon as the Miz- "Mystery Opponent" match was set up by Stephanie, my eight year old and his friends said that Kane was going to be the opponent and said very matter of factly and with no excitement.

Overall a good night.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by miami_fan

I wonder if WWE Creative should be concerned that as soon as the Miz- "Mystery Opponent" match was set up by Stephanie, my eight year old and his friends said that Kane was going to be the opponent and said very matter of factly and with no excitement.

Okay, hard not to just LOL about that.

Great stuff.

[cthomer5000]

I love Rollins coming out and going right after Rollins on the mic.

I think Rollins is quite clearly their best in-ring/on-mic combination at this point.

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by cthomer5000

I love Rollins coming out and going right after Rollins on the mic.

I think Rollins is quite clearly their best in-ring/on-mic combination at this point.

Weird, I felt as if it was wwe doing what they do worst. I think it was the anniversary of punks "pipebomb" but it felt like he was following a script. I mean he just goes off on his own but they had Roman's tweet up a second after Seth asked for it. If it was really off script there would be no production for the titan ton ready.

When they get pushed up against the wall, they seem to look at what worked before and just place names in those spots. If anyone should have been out there it should have been ambrose. They could have made him their next austin/bryan putting him as the one that called Roman out. Instead they are making him a middle guy.

[RainMaker]

I got a kick out of this.

[molson]

Cena is so great at stuff like that. It really is tough to imagine anyone else ever filling his shoes.

[murrayyyyy]

I forgot to post this in my crazy dream with the brand split going on but does anyone think we could see a new "Team Canada" with Zayn and KO becoming a tag team and someone like EY or Roode joining later on? I don't know why but it seems like Zayn/KO are going to be the ones to take the belt off New Day. I just think because KO and Zayn can play the middle in a feud against good or bad guys that they would be a perfect fit for this @ Survivor Series in Canada.

[murrayyyyy]

Had to know it was coming...

OKC Thunder Implode. pic.twitter.com/oBYpA6vDlT

— Brother Negro (@khristen) July 4, 2016

[murrayyyyy]

This is either the greatest thing or the worst thing ever.

[bulletsponge]

so a lifetime of taking drugs gets you a big house, a nice gym, a hot senorita, and makes you batshit insane!

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by bulletsponge

so a lifetime of taking drugs gets you a big house, a nice gym, a hot senorita, and makes you batshit insane!

Welcome to Hardyville.

Though, if the chick you mentioned is the one I figure it is, then you left out hot-but-batshit.

[molson]

(Saw this posted elsewhere)

Fun facts about Final Deletion from Borash's appearance on Wrestling Observer Live:

-Everything he used to do the Final Deletion is available on Amazon
-The Hardys' estate really is a creepy gross swamp full of fog, snakes, and mosquitos
-The whole setup was improvised out of shit they found on Matt's property, including the dilapidated boat
-Jeff has sculptures just sitting around everywhere that he built, including a 12-foot-tall alien
-Matt came up with the persona on the spot when filming the first Broken Matt Hardy vignette and they've just gone with it ever since
-Matt is 100% committed to this character. "It's not performance art, it's creepy!"

[JonInMiddleGA]

My son just reminded me where I was 18 years ago tonight.

Georgia Dome, Hogan vs Goldberg.

Damn, time flies AND I'm old.

[jbergey22]

So for those of you that follow wrestling other than WWE any predictions on this cruiserweight tourny? Id guess it will be one American and one European in the Finals. Going to make this a worldwide event.

I am sure the WWE will find a way to screw this up but this seems exciting to me. Trying to bring back the sport in it all.

Maybe this will help trigger the lightbulb with the bookers/writers to create more Events/PPVs like this and create the storylines organically from outcomes/events that have meaning rather than creating stupid storylines just to give the fans something beyond belief to follow.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

So for those of you that follow wrestling other than WWE any predictions on this cruiserweight tourny? Id guess it will be one American and one European in the Finals. Going to make this a worldwide event.

Not sure about a final two but I'll go with a final four of Gran Metallik, Sabre, Jr, Ibushi, and the Gargano/Ciammpa winner.

(I've seen first taping spoilers, honestly don't remember who won that one)

[JonInMiddleGA]

We need, badly, a Cornette watches Final Deletion shoot tape.

[RainMaker]

I was entertained by the Final Deletion and TNA should just give the book to the Hardys.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I'll be 50 years old next year, been watching wrestling for at least 45 of those years. Final Deletion -- aside from the impressive production values given the challenges of the "venue" -- was the single dumbest thing I've ever watched.

Hands down, bar none.

[RainMaker]

I agree, but I was entertained by the absurdity of it all.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I think I'd be capable of being entertained by it IF I didn't believe they actualy think this is ... good.

That makes it tragic to me, the sheer enormity of how fucked in the head they (or at least one of them) have to be. Granted, this isn't a shock considering the participants but still.

There's like a brief moment of clarity -- the fireworks "oh shit" spot was actually funny for the sheer abruptness of it -- but otherwise ... dear God. It's like watching a train hit a busload of preschoolers.

[Suicane75]

Nah man, they know how absurd it is. They're just having fun at this point. Part of me thinks they're actually trying to see how far in outer space they can get before TNA says no.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Suicane75

Nah man, they know how absurd it is. They're just having fun at this point. Part of me thinks they're actually trying to see how far in outer space they can get before TNA says no.

I honestly don't get that vibe from it. These are two guys with pretty long history of ... reasons to be utterly fucked in the head.

I'm reminded of nothing so much as the -5 star review for Victory Road 2011, where it was suggested that the company should just die & Dixie goes back to being the happy perky receptionist at Panda Energy.

It's past time, the corpse of the promotion is just decomposing at this point.

[Suicane75]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I honestly don't get that vibe from it. These are two guys with pretty long history of ... reasons to be utterly fucked in the head.

I'm reminded of nothing so much as the -5 star review for Victory Road 2011, where it was suggested that the company should just die & Dixie goes back to being the happy perky receptionist at Panda Energy.

It's past time, the corpse of the promotion is just decomposing at this point.

Oh, I completely agree the company is a walking corpse at this point, but I think Matt knows what he's doing. If you've ever seen some of his ROH stuff and online weirdness, there was a time when he was probably legitimately out there, but he's known what he's doing and been having fun with it for a long time now. The fact that this seems more like his brainchild than Jeffs makes me feel completely comfortable that they're just doing this for shits and giggles.

[RainMaker]

The funny part is they copied his height from Wikipedia because it has the citation noted next to it.

[hoosierdude]

My sons think it is so bad it is good, I just look at it and think, if the Hardys are allowed to do this without some kind of input from the company, then TNA is really on the outs, since they are pushing it hard. What else is going on at TNA? What is the other wrestling feuds (storylines) going, who cares, let's ride this wave and see where it takes us.

I can see why they are doing it, but, man their creative staff must really be poor if this is the best TNA can do. I hope they survive, but, man, you gotta cringe sometimes..

Kudos for trying something different, but, if I was a former WWE wrestler looking to join an organization, I would look hard at ROH and NJPW before I took a chance at TNA.

[murrayyyyy]

I thought it was great with the amount of easter eggs in it. You got call backs from the fireworks all over Jeff (almost like when the WWE had the Pyro "accident" to get him off TV), the V.1 reference, Willow (which I think Jeff used all the way back in OMEGA) and Matt even has flash backs before setting Jeff's logo on fire (when the scree ngoes nuts it's pictures of them winning the tag title on X division ropes, picture of them outside of their high school, etc). Part of me wonders if the entire thing was a call back to Stagger Lee/Midnight Rider/Mr R. type stories. (I know, probably thinking too deep about it)

Also worth noting. The July 5th episode of Impact Wrestling averaged 410,000 viewers, way up from last week’s 322,000. This was the most-watched episode of Impact since moving to Pop back in December. This is coming off a week when RAW had it's worst TV ratings in a long time.

With Impact releasing the tape early to wrestlers, do we think it's just a coincidence that the Wyatt's had a pre-taped performance for RAW? I think Final Deletion's impact combined with Lucha Underground's success will lead the WWE back to pre-taped segments. I mean the wrestling in FD was horrible but I just thought it was shot very well and made you feel like you were watching a story for once even if you hated it.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

This is coming off a week when RAW had it's worst TV ratings in a long time.

Well, it was the 4th.

do we think it's just a coincidence that the Wyatt's had a pre-taped performance for RAW?

Absolutely. It's not the first time they've had one IIRC.

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Well, it was the 4th.

There's always an excuse though. It was the NBA playoffs or Monday Night football games between Jaguars and the Titans. It was Reigns being a boring champion. It's one of the few shows they didn't lose viewers going deeper into the show (third hour is usualy a huge drop off). That's a wake up call for the WWE and they were shown how to use social media by a lesser company by two guys who are washed up.

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Absolutely. It's not the first time they've had one IIRC.

When was the last time? When he was in that 3 week feud with Roman following his daughter? Don't get me wrong, I think it adds a lot to the product to do them. They should be used when someone is injured (I mean when's the last match with anyone from the Wyatt Family) to keep them relevant. The timing just seems weird as they've gone with using the Wyatt's for the firefly effect because it looks cool to a production piece suddenly. Monday will probably tell more as Smackdown should focus on Austin tonight (if anyone can make a storyline in the WWE anymore).

Watching Impact my kid kept asking me who the guy in green was (Gregory Helms) so I pulled up those pre-taped segments when it was Hurricane vs the Rock to show who he was. The Rock was great at pre-taped breaks to allow the crowd to get in their cheers/boos. I just think the early release of FD match got back to Vince and the light bulb went on that "hey, we use to be great at those". When they were at their best in the past (ratings wise) they had taped segments. DX on a tank, Austin-Rock with a bridge, hell even Booker T Austin in a 7-11. All those were pre-taped and helped their guys go over huge because they didn't have to worry about them talking about Tater tots on live TV.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

All those were pre-taped and helped their guys go over huge because they didn't have to worry about them talking about Tater tots on live TV.

The irony of that, maybe, being that the tank skit was almost completely improvised, according to the way the participants tell it on the segment in the Monday Night Wars documentary/series thing.

Were those guys -- and let's remember who we're talking about specifically in that instance -- really that much smarter than today's rosters? Damn, that's kinda scary to consider (though it's a very real possibility I suppose).

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

The irony of that, maybe, being that the tank skit was almost completely improvised, according to the way the participants tell it on the segment in the Monday Night Wars documentary/series thing.

Were those guys -- and let's remember who we're talking about specifically in that instance -- really that much smarter than today's rosters? Damn, that's kinda scary to consider (though it's a very real possibility I suppose).

Easily because they were allowed to fail back then. For every great pre taped skit there is a stinker like Katie Vick or dx dumping fake poop on someone. But they are still seen as great today because "Those" guys all knew how to manipulate the crowd. Besides New Day, what CLIQ can do this today? I don't think the club can even pull this off right now. I mean the best thing Anderson has said is that he has a hot Asian wife. Part of me thinks Russo was right with wrestling not always being about wrestling. Do we think more of the Attitude Era guys because of their ring performances or their mic skills?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

Easily because they were allowed to fail back then. For every great pre taped skit there is a stinker like Katie Vick or dx dumping fake poop on someone. But they are still seen as great today because "Those" guys all knew how to manipulate the crowd. Besides New Day, what CLIQ can do this today? I don't think the club can even pull this off right now. I mean the best thing Anderson has said is that he has a hot Asian wife. Part of me thinks Russo was right with wrestling not always being about wrestling. Do we think more of the Attitude Era guys because of their ring performances or their mic skills?

I think Arn's frequent point about guys simply not having the number of dates to have the green worn off them (my paraphrase) plays a role in that.

While not all of the attitude era guys weren't quite from the original oldest old school days, many rode some miles & worked several years of the 250-300 nights a year era. That didn't just bring ring skills, it improved the psychology (and therefore the ability to improvise) they ended up with.

As for The Club specifically, I've thought they've looked extremely vulnerable time & again, almost to the point of being "exposed".

New Day has "it",at least for the moment. How much of that is Woods though, remains to be seen. I think under Bray's leadership the Family has most of it (entirely on the basis of him). Not sure how many others tho.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Lesnar versus ... Orton, for summerslam.

Announced tonight on Smackdown apparently

[JonInMiddleGA]

My apologies for thinking WWE was too smart to try to copy The Deletion.
Those who called it were right, and I was wrong.
{shakes head}

[RainMaker]

Ambrose is really good.

Ambrose's amazing promo - Streamable

[Mota]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Ambrose is really good.

Ambrose's amazing promo - Streamable

Yeah that was great! Nice to see him doing what he does best, instead of all those cutesy promos that were obviously given to him this past year.

He can pull off that intensity well. Makes you want to see him defend the title.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Tonight's promo was like you took some of his best moments, polished them, and put them on display.

Ambrose/Moxley- Promo Compilation - YouTube

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

My apologies for thinking WWE was too smart to try to copy The Deletion.
Those who called it were right, and I was wrong.
{shakes head}

I didn't see it yet but please tell me it had some of the following elements.

1) Dunn's shit camera elements
2) Pickup trucks in the woods because wasn't RAW in Detroit and that would make perfect sense
3) A commercial break in the middle of the action
4) They're just having fun Maggle! Like obscure wrestlers x,y,z and then someone you've heard of
5) End with New Day not being able to find any Wyatts and Bray suddenly appearing and saying feed the buzzards because that line is only 4 years old and hasn't gotten over yet.

And I think it's funny that Cass and Enzo got that American Alpha set I threw out there.

The WWE is just struggling to think of anything original right now. I'm sure this brand split well help a ton since they can't write an original story line for 6 superstars, let's double that workload!

[General Mike]

Calling Shane McMahon the commissioner of Smackdown Live maybe the lamest title in wrestling history

[murrayyyyy]

Originally Posted by General Mike

Calling Shane McMahon the commissioner of Smackdown Live maybe the lamest title in wrestling history

Okay, so having not watched RAW, why the hell did my phone say something about the Yes movement takes over Smackdown live? Is Shane the commish and DB the GM? When I read the blurb it said that both children pick their GM next week but the title pretty much told me who the GM would be fore Smackdown, didn't it?

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

Okay, so having not watched RAW, why the hell did my phone say something about the Yes movement takes over Smackdown live? Is Shane the commish and DB the GM? When I read the blurb it said that both children pick their GM next week but the title pretty much told me who the GM would be fore Smackdown, didn't it?

Yeah I think they spoiled their own stuff. Still not sure who will be Raw GM though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by murrayyyyy

I didn't see it yet but please tell me it had some of the following elements.

1) Dunn's shit camera elements
2) Pickup trucks in the woods because wasn't RAW in Detroit and that would make perfect sense
3) A commercial break in the middle of the action
4) They're just having fun Maggle! Like obscure wrestlers x,y,z and then someone you've heard of
5) End with New Day not being able to find any Wyatts and Bray suddenly appearing and saying feed the buzzards because that line is only 4 years old and hasn't gotten over yet.

And I think it's funny that Cass and Enzo got that American Alpha set I threw out there.

The WWE is just struggling to think of anything original right now. I'm sure this brand split well help a ton since they can't write an original story line for 6 superstars, let's double that workload!

It's got at least 1, kinda 2, most definitely 5 almost.
It's too short to have have 3, I think, and was so bad that I ffwd through it and can't swear about 4.

[Scarecrow]

Originally Posted by General Mike

Yeah I think they spoiled their own stuff. Still not sure who will be Raw GM though.

Thought it was odd the Steph was doing the 'Yes, Yes, Yes' thing last night...

[General Mike]

Originally Posted by Scarecrow

Thought it was odd the Steph was doing the 'Yes, Yes, Yes' thing last night...

Cheap attempt to get cheers from the sheep. F'n hate Stephanie McMahon's character. Depending on how the draft goes, I may give up Raw completely.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Even with one botched move, the Sean Maluta kid (another Afa nephew) looked pretty good in the first night of the CWC.

Definitely NXT roster caliber, no matter whether he eventually gets a shot or not, he could do it easily.

[murrayyyyy]

Well looks like Impact has decided to let Matt run with it...

[PilotMan]

Taking the youngest to the NXT house show here tomorrow night. Finn Balor is his favorite by far, and he about melted when he found out he was coming. How could I not take him to that show?

[RainMaker]

I love the work WWE did with graphics for the CWC. The presentation makes it feel like a big deal. Especially the video game style mashups.

squaredcircle GIF | Create, Discover and Share on Gfycat

[SirFozzie]

This is mostly for Jon and the other Cult Of Enzo folks. This was a pretty good "freestyle".

Enzo freestyles on the imminent WWE Draft and you can't teach that: July 14, 2016 - YouTube

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by SirFozzie

This is mostly for Jon and the other Cult Of Enzo folks. This was a pretty good "freestyle".

Enzo freestyles on the imminent WWE Draft and you can't teach that: July 14, 2016 - YouTube

Heh, my son showed me that very clip earlier.

That's when I realized that there's a very good chance that he's blessed with a photographic memory.

[RainMaker]

So it sounds like 6 NXT wrestlers will be drafted. Any thoughts on who?

My guess is Balor, Bayley, Aries, Nia Jax and then I'm stumped. Maybe a tag team like American Alpha. Maybe guys like Tye Dillinger and Mojo Rawley who have been around forever and they'll see if they can make it on the main roster.