Werewolf LVII: Cathedral (GAME OVER!)

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Right now I see no reason to not vote for Neon Chaos.

People with their own victory conditions freak me out.

The reason I see is that he's willing to play along with our plan. Voting for him will mean we'll need 5 votes to get him (assuming he votes for CR), while it would only take 3 votes to get Alan. Assuming CR comes in here and votes in self-defense, we should be fine.

[Lathum]

Vote Saldana

It is a little to convienent he is coming after me in a semi subtle way by saying my actions are something a demon would do and by saying i am trying to make myself important.

I think he may be trying to use my reputation in past games against me.

[Passacaglia]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Vote Saldana

It is a little to convienent he is coming after me in a semi subtle way by saying my actions are something a demon would do and by saying i am trying to make myself important.

I think he may be trying to use my reputation in past games against me.

It's okay -- Your Lordship, Page, we can still get this thing without wasting too much. We need 3 votes to combat Alan's CR votes. If you guys can be around at deadline to make sure CR gets his votes in, than we can all spend the rest of our time getting stuff built.

[Lathum]

I probably won't be around at the deadline

[Barkeep49]

Vote and work update:

Caprentry – Purdue (561), Purdue (581), path (585), Pass (606), Pass (607)
Roof – Lathum (562)
Artwork – Anxiety (589),


Rum – Alan (610), Alan (610)
Saldana – Lathum (652)

Actions Remaining:
Neon Chaos 2
oliegirl 2
saldana2
Chief Rum 2
path12 1
Mr. Wednesday 2
st.cronin 2
Schmidty 2
Anxiety 2

[Lathum]

I made my vote fully aware that Saldana has 2 actions left still.

I am curious to see how this plays out but alas, will be gone for the evening.

[Abe Sargent]

Originally Posted by Barkeep49

Vote and work update:

Caprentry – Purdue (561), Purdue (581), path (585), Pass (606), Pass (607)
Roof – Lathum (562)
Artwork – Anxiety (589),


Rum – Alan (610), Alan (610)
Saldana – Lathum (652)

Actions Remaining:
Neon Chaos 2
oliegirl 2
saldana2
Chief Rum 2
path12 1
Mr. Wednesday 2
st.cronin 2
Schmidty 2
Anxiety 2

I only have one action remaining BK

[Abe Sargent]

Quiet again

[Neon_Chaos]

Well, we did send the Musician straight to the bowels of hell from where he doth came.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Vote Saldana

It is a little to convienent he is coming after me in a semi subtle way by saying my actions are something a demon would do and by saying i am trying to make myself important.

I think he may be trying to use my reputation in past games against me.

just so i have this straight...

you come up with "the plan", where you are going to unnecessarily order Oliegirl to cast a vote for someone.

I call the plan into question, as well as your assertion that you should be in the COT because you helped lynch the cultist, despite the fact the Demons very likely had no idea who the cultist was.

you then try to lead a charge against Neon because he has his own victory conditions....this charge gets little to no support.

then, despite the fact that you have spent the entire day telling everyone they should do nothing but work on the cathedral, use one of your action points to vote for me.

anyone else see this as erratic at best, bizarre at the worst?


either way, i can prove i am a villager, and will if necessary.

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Lathum

and For the record, I haven't ordered Oliegirl to do anything today and I probably won't since it really is mute at this point.

dola, and its MOOT point...unless your point was able to speak by itself, and then lost it.

[Mr. Wednesday]

Originally Posted by saldana

then, despite the fact that you have spent the entire day telling everyone they should do nothing but work on the cathedral, use one of your action points to vote for me.

That is a decidedly odd choice on Lathum's part. I look forward to the explanation.

[Mr. Wednesday]

I'll put in one unit of work now and defer my other action until I'm certain whether it's better to devote it to more work or to a vote.

WORK ON ARTWORK

[st.cronin]

I don't understand Lathum's vote at all. If there is a duke, this might be a good day for the duke to assert himself, since it seems like we're sort of all over the map.

[Barkeep49]

As I mentioned before I am now out until likely after lynch. I will be at a scheduling meeting for my basketball teams until who knows when. It would be great if there could be an accurate vote and work update so I could process quicker.

Vote and work update:

Caprentry – Purdue (561), Purdue (581), path (585), Pass (606), Pass (607)
Roof – Lathum (562)
Artwork – Anxiety (589), Mr. W (663)


Rum – Alan (610), Alan (610)
Saldana – Lathum (652)

Actions Remaining:
Neon Chaos 2
oliegirl 2
saldana2
Chief Rum 2
path12 1
Mr. Wednesday 1
st.cronin 2
Schmidty 2
Anxiety 1

[Passacaglia]

I'm out until after lynch, too.

[RendeR]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

Well, we did send the Musician straight to the bowels of hell from where he doth came.

Just keeping your seat warm your grace.....

[Abe Sargent]

As I've said before, although I think Lathum's plan was good in theory, you aren't going to get four different factions all algined in addition to people who have different reasons for their actions. Then he voted fo saldana when the easiest vote, accoridng to his plan, would have been AlanT, who could not vote in self defense because he has already voted, so three votes there and we are done. Now we have votes all over the place.

Lathum's idea was poor, administravitely, and he carried it out poorly. That's doesn;t make him a wolf, per se, but I have to question why a good player would make what I believe is a bad call, especially the saldana vote.

I don;t have a read on saldana much, he's been a little utr at times, so I'd be okay if we all voted him off, but the best candidate is AlanT since he doubles voted.

Now everybody is going to vote because they have to. There are too many votes out there, and if someone swings their vots to you after you've put two actions on the cathedral, then you are screwed with no way to defend yourself, so the incentive to push for the cathedral is gone.

Ergo, tehre is no reason for me not to cast a vote right now. Lathum strike ms as odd, but he did bring us the cultist yesterday. That gives him solme credibility to me, but he's credibility is not what it was.

AlanT has struck me as a bad villager from the start. At some point in time we have to look his way/

CR has two votes on him, and he's been a bit utr too, even for him. But he sometimes comes in on Day four or five with these amazingly insightful posts that are completely right and bang on. Handing out for a day or two at teh bginning is not unusual for him

Who else has had votes, let me see. Mr. Wednesday had one yesterday. I've never been able to get a good read on him in tehpast when I played with him, he was still in the new stage of a player. Who knows what he is like now, but I am still unable to figure him out one wayu or the other,

I'm comfortabel with cronin and pass. I wouldn;t say that I trust them per se, but I'm looking elsewhere,

oliegirl hasn;t sturk me as unusal, bu tshe hasn't really dfistinguhsied herself iether.

Saem with Schmidity, but i feel he is playing his normal game, and I;m not sure if I respect that he didn;t vote back yesterday or fear it.

PurdueBrad - no clue. Most UTR player around I beleive. If he;s a demon we're in trouble.

I suspect, like most of you, that N_C has ulterior motives, but right now, I have more serious concerns. However, I remember a game long ago when I had other concerns and arguably lost us the game and won it for Lathum who was neutral when I killed the last necromancer as the elder guard. My eye is on him, but with trepedation.

Those are my thougghts ont h peops. Obviously, path is clean.

So, where to vote? Poeple who have done things in the thraed that I question are Schmidity, whose action io am unsure of, Lathum, and AlanT. UTR players like CR, PurdueBrad and saldana at times are suspect. Also, vocally active players who don;t do much, lik eoliegirl, tweak my wolfdar a little biut. I can;t ge a read on MrW, so there is that too. N_C scres me based ont eh rules, but not how hes played it here.

In other words, I am not sure of most of you!

Who to vote for? For now, I'm sticking with one of the three that has taken an action I qustion: AlanT, Schmidity, and Lathum. Of those three, I can dismess Schmidity because his action might also be really good, in addition to being bad.

So I'ml leaning towards LOathum and AlanT. Both have admitted they like me in the thread today, but I can;t lee that stop me.

Lathum gets a pass, for now, because he brought us the Cultist yesterday.

Therefore

VOTE ALANT

Please note that I'd be comfortable voting for most of you, so if actiosn change, yadda yadda, happy to change my vote, yadda yadda.



WHo to vote for? Well,

[Abe Sargent]

Hmm forgot to edit my post before I posted and delete that line that was in there twice. Ah well - no editing now.

[saldana]

quiet evening.

[Neon_Chaos]

I take it that seeing as how the Knight veered from his own plan, I am no longer required to go with the Page's vote to prove my innocence?

[saldana]

Originally Posted by Neon_Chaos

I take it that seeing as how the Knight veered from his own plan, I am no longer required to go with the Page's vote to prove my innocence?

i would think not, your grace...in truth, i am sorely tempted to return the knights' trespasses against me onto hisself

[Schmidty]

WORK ON ARTWORK

[st.cronin]

VOTE CHIEF RUM

WORK ON ARTWORK

[Schmidty]

Originally Posted by Schmidty

[COLOR="DarkOrange"]WORK ON ARTWORK[/color]

Let's try that again:

WORK ON ARTWORK

[st.cronin]

Barkeep's list, updated:

Caprentry (5) – Purdue (561), Purdue (581), path (585), Pass (606), Pass (607)
Roof (1) – Lathum (562)
Artwork (4)– Anxiety (589), Mr. W (663), st.cronin (674), Schmidty (675)


Rum – Alan (610), Alan (610), st.cronin (674)
Saldana – Lathum (652)
Alan T - Anxiety (668)


Actions Remaining:
Neon Chaos 2
oliegirl 2
saldana2
Chief Rum 2
path12 1
Mr. Wednesday 1
Schmidty 1

Left to do:

Walls - Finished
Roof - 1 unit of work (1 done)
Windows - Finished
Artwork - 9 units of work (4 done)
Carpentry - 6 units of work (5 done)

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Viewing the amount of damage undone to the cathedral last night, the demons can sabotage us long enough for us to run into problems. As others have said, if you think Barkeep is going to let us just build a cathedral and win on day 3 or 4 or 5 or something without killing a demon, then well its either a very poorly written game or you are deluding yourselves.

I don't mind Lathum's plan that much, but I question the judgement of those who are pushing the direction of it. For days I have tried to push people to get to the bottom of the Chief Rum - Anxiety thing (as well as giving us more information about both Path and Cronin. I would still be pushing for Cronin because of his defense of Render, but for the time being will assume that A) Demons don't know the cultist identity and B) Anxiety is indeed good as I've started figuring this morning. Because of that, we really need to see what Chief Rum's allegiance is to help lock that CoT in. I still don't feel as confident as others do about it.

I've waited as long as I could for the "plan" to come forth, but lack of discussion and movement and goof faith actions leave me believing that it will not happen. We've already been told that Neon won't be following the plan, and I am guessing there will be others. The plan doesn't work when everyone isn't on board. So if people won't join me in going after Path, Cronin or Anxiety, perhaps they will follow me in the opposite direction instead. One way or another we need to figure out which members of this block are on which side.

Vote Chief Rum
Vote Chief Rum

Killing me will waste a day for a village, and personally, be quite disappointing for me, as I am past the two job days and can finally fully participate. That said, if you really feel I must die to prove your theory wrong, then I guess lynch away. I won't go quietly, but I also know I have no powers or abilities whatsoever. I have nothing to contribute to the village except whatever I bring to the table myself. So killing me costs the village nothing but a day (which has value, but if Alan is going to lead the kill parade, you might as well find out he's wrong now).

[Chief Rum]

VOTE ALANT

VOTE ALANT

That's two votes. This is just self-preservation. I actually don't think Alan or saldana are demons, but they are the only ones I can vote for to give myself a chance.

Alan has done this before. I know path sees it. He mentioned himself Alan's propensity for the conspiracy theory. Sometimes a vote is just a vote. Alan himself pointed out on Day Two how well known my schedule is on Monday. And I reiterated that myself when making my vote late Sunday night--I would not be around Monday, so I had to vote. I made the mistake of not noting the possibility of avoiding voting for a player at all, a mistake I already owned up to. But my vote on Abe was nothing more than it seems to be--a welcome back pat on the back for a long time player that is just a pointless random Day One vote (as is common on Day One).

It certainly isn't some indication I know something or that I was taking a firm stance on Anxiety. The entire basis for Alan's theory/hunch is convoluted and an extreme reach. I am not Gabriel or Lucifer. Whoever they are, they are both certainly laughing at you all right now. Or for sure, Lucifer is. Gabriel is probably deciding whether he should try to save me or not.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Lathum

It really doesn't matter at this point, alanT blew it up.

My whole point was to only use a single vote so we can dedicate the rest of our actions on the cathedral.

Now thanks to AlanT we will be costing ourselves 5 actions, Alant's 2 votes plus 3 more to counter them.

So forget my idea, we can just continue to stay disorganized and run around like chickens with our heads cut off.

FWIW, I would have followed your plan if I wasn't forced to defend myself.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

If that's the case, why did you vote for Chief twice, instead of Alan?

Thanks! Glad someone else noticed that. Nothing made me laugh more reading this thread than cronin's "I have no read on Chief" comment. He's been gunning me almost from the word go.

If I weren't trying to save myself or locked into a plan like Lathum's proposal, I would have placed both of my votes on cronin. In fact, that's exactly what I would have done this morning before I left for work, except I held off, not wanting to commit to voting as opposed to building the cathedral.

[saldana]

neon and olie, i see you are in the thread...i am not trying to pressure you to do anything, but i dont want to use my actions until i know if i need to save myself

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Thanks! Glad someone else noticed that. Nothing made me laugh more reading this thread than cronin's "I have no read on Chief" comment. He's been gunning me almost from the word go.

If I weren't trying to save myself or locked into a plan like Lathum's proposal, I would have placed both of my votes on cronin. In fact, that's exactly what I would have done this morning before I left for work, except I held off, not wanting to commit to voting as opposed to building the cathedral.

As pointed out before, I did not vote for you twice on day 1. And I still have no read on you. I simply think that, of the players with votes, you are least likely to be a villager.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

Yeah, looking back, it looks like you did. But I replied by saying "TWO votes on him?" Maybe I was seeing double then, because I said that thinking you voted for him twice, and still thought that until now. But there's just one vote there. Weird. I think this orange is freaking me out.

You may be wrong about the vote number, but you're not wrong that he has been going after me from the start. And it was a little more obvious in the reading than a "coin flip between Alan and Chief", like he makes it out to be.

When I come up a villager, look hard at cronin.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

As pointed out before, I did not vote for you twice on day 1. And I still have no read on you. I simply think that, of the players with votes, you are least likely to be a villager.

My comment was about you coming after me, not about the votes. That's on Pass.

And if "no read" means coming after me the way you have, you must think everyone else in the game is good.

[Neon_Chaos]

I do not like how things are brewing... not one bit. I feel that we are being manipulated into a situation to vote for two innocents?

I find it quite puzzling that the good Ser Knight devised a plan, that quite a few followed, and then retracted, voting for the Friar, who was a crucial part in vanquishing the evil Musician. Perhaps he hath been able to do his part... taking away crucial votes that might have been important?

Vote Lathum

Vote Lathum

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

My comment was about you coming after me, not about the votes. That's on Pass.

And if "no read" means coming after me the way you have, you must think everyone else in the game is good.

Did you not notice who I voted for on day 2? I don't even think I mentioned you on day 2.

I am interested ONLY in lynching demons, if you can point us to a demon, please do so.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

I'm actually ok with a Chief Rum lynch. Since Alan isn't coming back (apparently), we would just need one vote to keep him from defending himself.

How often do you need to write this? Okay, everyone gets it. You want me dead. It was already pretty obvious. BTW, the sky is blue.

[st.cronin]

Neon, as I said before, I have some reason to think Lathum is not a demon. Its not 100%, but I think he's a poor choice if you REALLY want to lynch a demon.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

How often do you need to write this? Okay, everyone gets it. You want me dead. It was already pretty obvious. BTW, the sky is blue.

Its understandable that you would focus on the obviousness of that post, instead of looking at it in context and thinking that maybe there was another meaning being transmitted.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Did you not notice who I voted for on day 2? I don't even think I mentioned you on day 2.

I am interested ONLY in lynching demons, if you can point us to a demon, please do so.

I noticed who you voted for on Day One. I notice who you're voting for now. I notice you feel compelled to mention you're "okay with a Chief Rum lynch" in two separate posts.

And you know I can't point out a demon. I have no powers whatsoever. Except perhaps I'll pray to God to exact vengeance on your ill-advised and perhaps deceitful strategy after I am gone. Alas, I am but a novice, so not too good yet at turning the other cheek.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Its understandable that you would focus on the obviousness of that post, instead of looking at it in context and thinking that maybe there was another meaning being transmitted.

I saw the context. It makes no difference--point is, it's too much. For a guy with "no read", you are coming after me phenomenally hard, and you're going to look awful when I come up a villager. I really hope the village lynches you tomorrow after I turn up good.

[st.cronin]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

I saw the context.

Obviously you didn't.

[oliegirl]

Originally Posted by saldana

neon and olie, i see you are in the thread...i am not trying to pressure you to do anything, but i dont want to use my actions until i know if i need to save myself

I am not planning, at this time at least, to vote for you tonight Saldana. you were never on my list of suspects today.

Has anyone given thought to the idea that NC is Gabriel or Lucifer? And that he is purposely making his posts convoluted and difficult to read???

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by st.cronin

Obviously you didn't.

You're right. You were right there looking over my shoulder when I posted. I forgot.

[oliegirl]

Alright,if I'm looking at everything correctly, we have a 3 way tie between NC, Lathum and AlanT.

Saldana - you and I seem to be on the same page...I don't feel right voting for Lathum as he is my Knight and I do believe that he is good. I'm torn on NC and AlanT however...if you and I can come to an agreement between the 2 of them and cast our 4 collective votes for one person, we should be able to successfully lynch who we want...what do you think?

[Neon_Chaos]

Originally Posted by oliegirl

Alright,if I'm looking at everything correctly, we have a 3 way tie between NC, Lathum and AlanT.

Are you trying to mislead the people, Page?

Unless I have read correctly, I do not have votes upon me.

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by oliegirl

Alright,if I'm looking at everything correctly, we have a 3 way tie between NC, Lathum and AlanT.

Saldana - you and I seem to be on the same page...I don't feel right voting for Lathum as he is my Knight and I do believe that he is good. I'm torn on NC and AlanT however...if you and I can come to an agreement between the 2 of them and cast our 4 collective votes for one person, we should be able to successfully lynch who we want...what do you think?

Huh? Unless I missed a few votesm it's me and Alan tied at 3, with saldana 1 vote.

[Lathum]

just so i have this straight...

you come up with "the plan", where you are going to unnecessarily order Oliegirl to cast a vote for someone.

I think I was clear why I thought it was a good idea for me to order oliegirl to vote but just in case it was missed I will explain again.

IMO it would prevent any shenanagins with the vote. I would order her to vote so she would HAVE TO DO IT. If anyone else voted it would be suspicous.

If you think it is a poor idea that's fine, but to say it isn't a good explination is wrong

I call the plan into question, as well as your assertion that you should be in the COT because you helped lynch the cultist, despite the fact the Demons very likely had no idea who the cultist was.

Again, I agree the demon's probably do not know the cultist, but as a demon on day 1 I would never sacrifice an alley who knows who I am in an attempt to gain a very thin level of trust, it would be plain stupid and I would hope you think I am a better player then that

you then try to lead a charge against Neon because he has his own victory conditions....this charge gets little to no support.

"lead a charge??????"

that is a little much I think, all I said was people with their own victory condition freak me out and I see no reason not to vote him. I hardly consider that rounding up a posse

then, despite the fact that you have spent the entire day telling everyone they should do nothing but work on the cathedral, use one of your action points to vote for me.

My vote for you came after SEVERAL posts about how AlanT blew up my plan and it was pointless to try and make it work.

anyone else see this as erratic at best, bizarre at the worst?


either way, i can prove i am a villager, and will if necessary

I find it a little to convienient how you are leaving out certain facts and instead again trying to spin things to make me look bad.

Oh, AND HOW CONVIENIENT NEON CHAOS VOTED FOR ME.

Does anyone else find it odd how buddy/ buddy Saldana and Neon Chaos have been?

[Abe Sargent]

I don't find it odd cosndiering their roles

[Abe Sargent]

No odder than you and page being all budd buddy