POTUS 2024 - Harris vs Trump - General Election Discussion

[JPhillips]

It's always the fault of the Dems.

The fact is GOPers like MAGA, want MAGA, and will vote to force everyone else to suffer MAGA. The only other option is an old guy, but one's who's competent and decent. He's not my favorite but he's so far better than the alternative that I'd crawl over glass if I was the deciding vote.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

It's always the fault of the Dems.

The fact is GOPers like MAGA, want MAGA, and will vote to force everyone else to suffer MAGA. The only other option is an old guy, but one's who's competent and decent. He's not my favorite but he's so far better than the alternative that I'd crawl over glass if I was the deciding vote.

Dems are expected to be daycare for the GOP, guardrails for democracy, and appease everyone from moderates to progressives to get people's votes while the GOP has to simply not have a D next to their name to get votes.

The disingenuous bullshit people use to justify a Trump or 3rd party vote is tiresome.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by MJ4H

If you want to talk about presidents' effects on gas prices, I don't know of much that has affected them as much as Trump's two deals with OPEC to first flood the market with oil pre-covid and then cut back on production post-covid. The first nearly destroyed the american oil and gas industry and the second, as a desperate attempt to save it, was such an over-reaction that it led to the huge spike we saw in 2021-2022.

But yeah, mostly presidents don't affect gas prices much.

I thought Obama's strategy was pretty smart. He lorded weapons over the Saudis until they cranked up as much oil as they could which led to lower gas prices, fucked Russia over hard (part of the reason they were so in the tank for Trump), and forced Iran to negotiate. If you're going to work with these detestable regimes, at least get something out of it.

Biden threatened the Saudis with consequences for oil cuts but they called his bluff and realized he's a weak kneed pussy who is subservient to them.

‘There is only so much patience one can have’: Biden appears to back off vow to punish Saudi Arabia | CNN Politics

It's kind of funny in retrospect since the knock on Obama during the 2008 campaign was that he was too inexperienced and naive to handle these things. But he had some brilliant moments and had the Saudis wrapped around his finger by the end.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

Biden threatened the Saudis with consequences for oil cuts but they called his bluff and realized he's a weak kneed pussy who is subservient to them.

Biden has the US producing more oil domestically and importing less from the Saudi's than at any other point so I wouldn't call him subservient to them.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Biden has the US producing more oil domestically and importing less from the Saudi's than at any other point so I wouldn't call him subservient to them.

Biden admin approves potential multibillion-dollar arms sales to Saudi Arabia and UAE | CNN Politics
US poised to ease restrictions on sale of offensive weapons to Saudi Arabia | CNN Politics
US expected to lift ban on sale of offensive weapons to Saudi Arabia, FT reports
reuters.com
Intercepted Podcast: Biden’s War Expands From Gaza to Yemen

We're another term away from Biden letting the Crown Prince fuck his wife in front of him.

Also lol at the defense of this being that Biden is actually worse for the planet than Trump was. Reminds me of the Biden PR hack who came out yesterday proclaiming that CEOs backed Biden. Not the win you think it is.

[RainMaker]

Maybe we can get a "Drill baby Drill" chant going at the DNC.

[MJ4H]

Well that's not something I saw coming. lol

[thesloppy]

Biden speaks like a deflating balloon

[HerRealName]

15K jobs, 15M jobs what's the difference... and then it gets worse.

Trump is a disaster too but the voice is brutal.

[Edward64]

Joe is speaking too fast.

Uh oh … he froze just now on taxes on the billionaires.

Trumps content may be BS but he’s doing a better job presenting right now.

[HerRealName]

This election is a disaster. Two blubbering idiots 10 years past their primes.

[HerRealName]

In-laws vs incest, what's the difference? There better be an exit plan because this is even worse than I ever feared.

[thesloppy]

Joe is getting dogwalked by a dude talking about after-birth abortions

[JonInMiddleGA]

Life’s but a walking shadow, a poor player
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage
And then is heard no more: it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

[HerRealName]

Fucking shit. Trump is an idiot and Biden is worse.

[HerRealName]

It has been like 20 minutes and the election is over if Biden doesn't drop out.

[Edward64]

Joe leaving his mouth open when not talking is not a good look IMO.

I like the question on illegals, but the fact checkers will be up late for both of them.

[RainMaker]

Trump handed him a layup in abortion and Biden turned it into an immigrant rape story. What in the fuck.

[thesloppy]

I'm out, before a half-hour is even over. We are fuuuuucked.

[larrymcg421]

I watched like 10 seconds, enough to see Trump destroy Biden with the "I don't know what he said, and I don't think he does either."

So much for my mental health over the next 4 years.

[Flasch186]

I cant vote for Trump and now I can't vote for Biden. What a disaster for the Dems and of their own making. How the recover over the next 5 months will either save the party (maybe country) or be a complete wipe out.

[BYU 14]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

I cant vote for Trump and now I can't vote for Biden. What a disaster for the Dems and of their own making. How the recover over the next 5 months will either save the party (maybe country) or be a complete wipe out.

It would be called convincing Biden to step down and putting someone coherent in his place. I echo the earlier sentiment, we are fucked for the next 4 years. Thanks a lot to both parties for this shit show.

[RainMaker]

They absolutely cannot run him in November.

[Edward64]

I like this format. No interruptions so far.

[GrantDawg]

Who has lost this debate? America.

[dubb93]

Originally Posted by BYU 14

It would be called convincing Biden to step down and putting someone coherent in his place.

As someone who works in long term care, I can tell you that there are some instances where you don’t convince a person that is “incoherent” of anything. You move to establish them as incompetent and appoint a power of attorney. I think we may be at that point here. It obviously isn’t Plan A, but it exists as an option.

[HerRealName]

This prepared answer by Trump on Jan 6 is laughably terrible

[Ghost Econ]

Who decided it was a good idea to have two 70+ year olds debate at 9 PM? I'm in my 40s and have been ready to go to bed since dinner.

[HerRealName]

Trump could feel the danger in the air so he sent the crowd to the Capitol?

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Flasch186

I cant vote for Trump and now I can't vote for Biden. What a disaster for the Dems and of their own making. How the recover over the next 5 months will either save the party (maybe country) or be a complete wipe out.

I don't see a save here. Biden stepping aside and allowing party delegates make the choice would be a disaster. Biden should have never decided to run again. It was a mistake from the get-go. No guarantee anyone that came out the primary would have won, but you have to think at this point they would have at least had a fighting chance. Maybe Biden can pull some miracle after this, but he was already in trouble and I'm seeing die-hard supporters think "what have we done?" at this point.

[HerRealName]

Biden isn't capable of landing even the easiest segment.

[thesloppy]

Regardless of party, everybody under 70 will come out of this some flavor of angry and resentful. We're all going to crumble into dust as our boomer 'leaders' refuse to give up a sliver of money or power.

[RainMaker]

Biden somehow lost on a question regarding January 6th. Did they not prep at all?

[HerRealName]

Biden's best moment was talking about the porn star affair. Gods help us.

[Ghost Econ]

Its morbidly poetic that the children of the The Greatest Generation, the generation that literally saved democracy, end up destroying it because they never measured up.

[HerRealName]

Biden's team must be even more incompetent than Biden. He should have turned every topic into a Jan 6th and convicted felon question. Fucking West Wing wannabes as usual.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by HerRealName

Biden's team must be even more incompetent than Biden. He should have turned every topic into a Jan 6th and convicted felon question. Fucking West Wing wannabes as usual.

Or abortion. An issue that people actually go out and vote over.

[Coffee Warlord]

Everyone's a winner now. Why? It's over.

[JPhillips]

Fall debates generally don't matter, so I doubt this one will either.

But it does give everyone something to talk about for the next few days.

[Saul Goode]

The problem was this wasn't a serious format. This was a free 90 minute Trump rally on live TV. It was just 90 minutes of watching a pathetic rich guy whine and lie. He never answered one question and I'm not sure if he ever told the truth at all. It was pathetic by the don. As is America, it's Joe is old and not don is a sad, old pathetic convicted felon of a lunatic that shouldn't even be nominated in the first place. If you vote for trump and the pea brained GOPers that worship him, you deserve what is coming.

[Lathum]

I'm about 20 minutes in and this is a disaster. Most voters aren't paying attention until now and honestly if I was one of them I would probably vote Trump based off this performance.

[Coffee Warlord]

Originally Posted by Saul Goode

The problem was this wasn't a serious format. This was a free 90 minute Trump rally on live TV. It was just 90 minutes of watching a pathetic rich guy whine and lie. He never answered one question and I'm not sure if he ever told the truth at all. It was pathetic by the don. As is America, it's Joe is old and not don is a sad, old pathetic convicted felon of a lunatic that shouldn't even be nominated in the first place. If you vote for trump and the pea brained GOPers that worship him, you deserve what is coming.

I agree the format was ridiculous, but on what planet do you think CNN is going to tilt a debate format in Trump's favor?

[Atocep]

Both were really bad. Biden on presentation and Trump on sustenance. Biden got better as the debate went on but those opening 15 minutes so were brutal. Everything from Trump was either a lie or just rambling to avoid answering the question.

Younger, effective politicians from either side eat these guys alive tonight.

[bronconick]

Someone should take both to a retirement home and we'll pick new people starting tomorrow.

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

I agree the format was ridiculous, but on what planet do you think CNN is going to tilt a debate format in Trump's favor?

This isn't the first time trump has done this. Debates without any control are perfect for him. He just gets to be his normal lying unhinged clown self.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Coffee Warlord

I agree the format was ridiculous, but on what planet do you think CNN is going to tilt a debate format in Trump's favor?

You missed the whole Chris Licht deal?

Changes spark chatter of CNN shifting to the right

Shame on CNN for That Naked, Cynical Play for Fox Viewers

CNN getting more Republicans on-air as it seeks political diversity

[RainMaker]

CNN definitely gave Biden dementia and made him look terrible.

[thesloppy]

Trump lied and avoided questions entirely, but nobody on either side can claim to be surprised by his performance in any way. On the other hand some significant knives are bound to come out for Joe over this (you can already find calls for him to step aside), and on balance it was obviously a major loss for Biden.

[larrymcg421]

The incumbent often does pretty bad in the first debate. Obama was abysmal in 2012 and Reagan looked out of it in 1984. The difference was that both were ahead before those debates. Biden is in a much worse position right now.

What are the chances Trump finds a way to skip the 2nd debate?

[Atocep]

Biden could have come out in his underwear saying he spoke to Beau backstage before the debate and I'd still vote for him.