2024 NFL Offseason, Free Agency, and Draft Talk

[Jstraub]

I agree about the injury history. But nonetheless, dont agree its a bad pick. See the Green Bay Packers for multiple examples of why its not.

[Jstraub]

One of my biggest pet peeves about media and most fans is the concept of "mentoring" among these professional athletes, especially in football. As Torry Holt said on live TV when the rams drafted a WR, "I'll mentor his ass right to the bench".

Its even more surprising when people are shocked to hear athletes response when asked about their potential successor was just drafted. Of course they are pissed about it. shocking.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

I wonder if Cousins is more upset that they drafted his replacement with the #7 pick or didn't use that pick to improve the team he'll (presumably) be QBing for a couple years. Like, he's in "win now" mode and they just invested in the post-Cousins era with an asset they could have used for more immediate needs. I feel like Cousins is probably more embarrassed about the situation than anything else. But he is 35 coming off an Achilles, so...

I would think it is more the latter. I am also making the assumption he is another one of those veteran qbs who has no interest in helping the rookie take his job. Edward brought up the mentoring piece. This feels like it will be more of the reported Aaron Rodgers/Jordan Love dynamic than say the reported Alex Smith/Patrick Mahomes dynamic. Obviously Mahomes has become Mahomes and Love seems to have turned out ok so it may not matter all that much. But I can see Cousins getting a bit agitated with the inevitable questions about his relationship with the rookie.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Jstraub

I agree about the injury history. But nonetheless, dont agree its a bad pick. See the Green Bay Packers for multiple examples of why its not.

They spent pick 20 on Love. Pick 24 on Rodgers. If this had been a late first round pick or an early second round, I wouldn't hate it as much. A top ten pick is supposed to contribute immediately. They are supposed to be an immediate upgrade, not the third string guy you hope never plays.

[GrantDawg]

dola: Just to add, on a team with as many holes as the Falcons, spending a premier pick on someone you hope doesn't play in 2-4 years is just not smart. The only way this pick ends up being smart is if Cousin has a seriuos injury, but then signing him was a major mistake.

[JPhillips]

If the plan holds, Penix will be 26 or 27 when he starts his first full season.

[weegeebored]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

I find it funny that the players watching from home look all surprised when they get called on the phone and drafted...like did no one told them they were in the draft? ...haha

To me it's more ridiculous to see the NFL draft room people hug and shake hands after the pick is called. Why? You made the pick so it wasn't a surprise that that player's name was called. And it wasn't a lottery. It's also not like the player is going to say "Nope. I ain't goin' there" and the team execs are relieved. The exuberance just seems weird to me.

[flere-imsaho]

Looks like the old Bears front office migrated to Atlanta.

[cuervo72]

Originally Posted by Jstraub

One of my biggest pet peeves about media and most fans is the concept of "mentoring" among these professional athletes, especially in football. As Torry Holt said on live TV when the rams drafted a WR, "I'll mentor his ass right to the bench".

Its even more surprising when people are shocked to hear athletes response when asked about their potential successor was just drafted. Of course they are pissed about it. shocking.

No kidding. I mean we have mentors on teams - they're called coaches.

[larrymcg421]

Packers are better now because of the Love pick, but they made the conference championship that year. Would an immediate upgrade have made the difference and got them another championship?

[QuikSand]

Yes, occasionally the value of a draft pick is getting a guy you never want to let go. Fine. Maybe if Penix turns into that guy, this won't look that bad in the longish run... like Aaron Rodgers, more or less.

But it's a salary cap league. A huge part of the value of early draft picks is to get plus contributors for far less than market price under the cap. The Packers, with Jordan Love, were paying him (likely) more than the market rate for a QB2 while he sat and waited - they missed out on the value portion of draft value, and now they face paying him market rate for his actual service.

Let's say that Cousins plays two full seasons and then the Falcons arrange a costly separation. Then they get Penix for 2 seasons plus an extension year. The chances of that usage providing much cap-related value are just not very high.

And that's before you weigh in the opportunity cost of adding, say, an impact pass rusher (for 4-5 years cheap under the cap) to a team supposedly in go-for-it-now mode. The math is pretty compelling here, even acknowledging that football QB is a uniquely valuable/critical position.

[GrantDawg]

My evaluation of the three older quarterbacks before the draft was that they all were great college quarterback mostly because they benefited for the extra time they had to develop. By the end of their college career, they were men playing among boys. The three (Daniels, Penix and Nix) have pretty much developed into what they are and probably have very little growth left. Habits at this point have set in and are going to be much harder to change. Daniels is the most talented of the three, and I think he is going to be a solid starter in the NFL. His legs put him a bit over the top. Maybe not MVP level, but solid. Penix is an average starter. Serviceable, but nothing exciting. His injury history also suggests he might not stay on the field at the next level. Nix is a below average starter. He is going to look much more like Auburn Nix than Oregeon Nix in the NFL.
Of course, I could be wrong, and at least for Penix, I hope I am. But reaching for an older and often injured player to sit for two years or more just looks dumb.

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by Jstraub

One of my biggest pet peeves about media and most fans is the concept of "mentoring" among these professional athletes, especially in football. As Torry Holt said on live TV when the rams drafted a WR, "I'll mentor his ass right to the bench".

Its even more surprising when people are shocked to hear athletes response when asked about their potential successor was just drafted. Of course they are pissed about it. shocking.

And yet whenever a player goes into the Hall of Fame, we see a bunch of active players talk about how that player mentored them when they first came into the league. I mentioned Alex Smith with Patrick Mahomes. Reggie Wayne (who should be a HOFer btw) talks about how much Marvin Harrison taught him when he came into the league. Ed Reed and Champ Bailey used to bring the DBs to their houses every week of the season to teach the DBs how to watch film the way they did. Somehow, all those mentors were still able to maintain their spots on the team and have ok careers before they lost their jobs to players they mentored.

I get it if we were talking about the Drew Brees/Phillip Rivers situation in San Diego. Bress was barely out of his rookie contract facing a highly rated rookie who was actually older than him coming in. I know pro athletes are ultra competitive. They have every right to be insecure as they know that teams will cut their asses in a hot second if the team can find a cheaper alternative at their position. Maybe holding a couple of veteran tricks up their shoulder pads will be the difference between keeping the job or losing it. Finally no player HAS to be a mentor to anyone especially one who could be there to take his job.

I just think there is a difference between being competitive and wanting to show that you are the better option versus intentionally abdicating the role of being the young player's "vet" by not giving advice and tricks of the trade that will help the player and eventually the team because of your insecurity especially if you are claiming to be a leader on the team and you do so for teammates who don't play your position. I don't think Aaron Rodgers not mentoring Jordan Love gave Rodgers an advantage in the starting QB competition in Green Bay and kept Love on the bench. Rodgers was the starter because he was better than Love. Alex Smith did not lose his job with the Chiefs because he served as a mentor for Patrick Mahomes and used those tricks against Smith. To me, it is just too normal to hear about veteran players taking young players who plays the same position under their wings and teaching them the ropes even though the young player will eventually take the vet's job hopefully using that passed on knowledge to do so for it not to be weird when it does not happen. Maybe the QB position is just different.

[Lathum]

If I am Cousins and see Odunze on the board and instead my team takes my replacement I would be hella pissed.

[albionmoonlight]

I'm hearing Spencer Rattler is very much in play for Atlanta with the 43rd overall pick tonight as the team plans for the post-Penix era.

— Andy Behrens (@andybehrens) April 26, 2024

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Lathum

If I am Cousins and see Odunze on the board and instead my team takes my replacement I would be hella pissed.

The knock on Odzune to the Falcons is they already have him in Drake London. They need a wr2, but they need him to be more an explosive speedster to convert to the Rams style offense. I do wonder if Nabers had been available, if that would have changed things. I really don't think so, because I believe they might have been set on this stupid plan.

[CrimsonFox]

That was definitely a fun draft night. Love the trade action. Now I get it.

Thing I find odd is that some teams have acted like this draft is in a vacuum. But there have been drafts every year and continue to be. I mean you don't HAVE to have a QB this year, you can wait til next or whatever. Teams prob have qbs and things from past drafts. I'm delving into other drafts and wow last year's draft didn't have much qb action at all in the first round you guys are right.

I wonder if the falcons end up trading Penix for like a big stud they need.

[GrantDawg]

Mina is just right all the way around:

Mina Kimes' takedown of the Falcons' selection of Michael Penix Jr: "I find the justification to be somewhat logically incoherent... if you think you're going to be good, which is why you pay Kirk Cousins $100 million guaranteed, you're doing your team a disservice by not making… https://t.co/okXqRbBXmR pic.twitter.com/h9J55MCYx3

— Awful Announcing (@awfulannouncing) April 26, 2024

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

Looks like the old Bears front office migrated to Atlanta.

They dd! Ryan Pace works for the Falcons.

[Ksyrup]

Apparently Mina Kimes hasn't watched ESPN talk shows for the past 25 years.

[CrimsonFox]

FOntenot trying to explain himself to the owner lol

https://twitter.com/CodyChaffins/sta...nix-jr-pick%2F

[flere-imsaho]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

They dd! Ryan Pace works for the Falcons.

See, I didn't even know that. That is too funny!

[Ghost Econ]

Can Alex Anthropolous run 2 Atlanta teams next year?

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Ghost Econ

Can Alex Anthropolous run 2 Atlanta teams next year?

He follows the Falcons closely. I have heard him break things down on the radio, and the host did ask if he would be willing to run both teams.

[RainMaker]

This is such an insane response too. Sit a QB for 4-5 years? Their rookie deal is only 4 years plus a very large option year.

Full quote : "If you believe in a quarterback, you have to take him. And if he sits for four or five years, that's a great problem to have because we're doing so well at that position. So, it's as simple as, if you see a guy you believe in at that position, you have to take him."

— Marc Raimondi (@marcraimondi) April 26, 2024

Like even if you loved Penix, you're still paying like $7 million for a backup. It's just an insane use of cap space and a high pick.

I'd have gone with Oduzne just so Cousins has more weapons. But they could have also traded back and grabbed one of the many good defenders that went in the middle of the round. Just baffled by the move.

[CrimsonFox]

Minn Head Coach O Connell's reaction when the GM tells him he just traded up to get Turner.

[Bobble]

The 4-5 years has to be hyperbole. You have to really love the prospect to say that you're going to (likely) sit him for two years and then only have him on the rookie deal for another 3 years at age 26-27, all the while being such a good team that you couldn't possibly draft anyone close to him. This better be a CJ Stroud kinda guy.

[Passacaglia]

I hinted at this in another thread, but does anyone know why Darius Robinson's mom was so mad in the interview after he was drafted? Seems like the only source of good drama in a draft where everyone was a great human.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Passacaglia

I hinted at this in another thread, but does anyone know why Darius Robinson's mom was so mad in the interview after he was drafted? Seems like the only source of good drama in a draft where everyone was a great human.

I'm glad someone else noticed this too! She looked irate. I couldn't tell if it was an issue with the grandmother talking a lot or she just didn't want to be there.

[sovereignstar v2]

mother-in-law vibes, yeah

[Carman Bulldog]

Everyone: Playing first year quarterbacks is a disservice to the player and teams should give them time to develop on the bench for a year to two without rushing them into games.

Also everyone: What is Atlanta doing drafting a quarterback who they plan on sitting for a few years?

Count me among those who don't hate the process. There were people that were critical of the Chiefs in 2017 when they gave up assets to move up and take their quarterback of the future when they already had a Pro Bowl quarterback on their roster. People were saying they should have improved the defense instead. How did that work out?

Unfortunately, there is really only one way to build a winning team in today's NFL and that's hitting on a superstar quarterback. Every QB that a team drafts is basically like a lottery ticket and you need to hit on one of these tickets if you want to be competitive year after year with a shot at winning Super Bowls. While the addition of Cousins means the Falcons should be a playoff team over the next few years, I don't think anyone sees him as a superstar quarterback.

So if a team really believes they have found their future superstar quarterback, then I don't think there is anything wrong with taking him in that spot, even if you already just signed another guy (who happens to be 36 years old coming off a torn Achilles) for the next few years. Whether Penix is that guy is another question altogether.

SI.com: Grade B+. "The Chiefs paid a huge price for a developmental quarterback, choosing Mahomes over Deshaun Watson. This is the type of move that can make or break a front office."

SB Nation: Grade D. "The Chiefs gave up pick Nos. 27, 91 and a 2018 first-round pick to take a backup quarterback. At least for a season, that’s what this pick is in reality. While this move helps Kansas City in the future, what does it do immediately in 2017 and 2018? It doesn’t give them a top cornerback opposite Marcus Peters. It doesn’t give them a linebacker they need. It gives them a developmental player. Look, I like Mahomes as a person and prospect. I just don’t like the value at all."

Bleacher Report: Grade C. "My issue is that the Chiefs have been in playoff also-ran mode for years. They could have traded up and upgraded their defense to get over the top in 2017. Reid's Eagles tended to get stuck in 10- 11-win ruts. They could swap out quarterbacks and remain in the same rut, because they still have too many needs in other areas."

ESPN: Grade C+ (for the full draft). "...Giving up a third-round pick and next year's first to move up 17 spots was a ton for a team with immediate needs elsewhere and some defenders getting up there in age."

Chatsports: Grade C-. "Chiefs had to move up to get Mahomes, but is he truly worth it? They gave up a future first, which could come back to bite them. The upside is there with Mahomes and it might pay off. If it does, it's an easy A. If not, it's an F. I'll split the difference for the time being."

USA Today: Grade C-. "Calling Mahomes a project is a major understatement. He’s nowhere near ready to play in the NFL. And, honestly, he may never be. Between his inconsistent accuracy due to poor mechanics, his tendency to bail from clean pockets and his lack of field vision, he’s going to leave as many big plays on the field as he creates. This was a risky pick."

[CrimsonFox]

have you ever seen a grandmother that wasn't bitching about something?

[CrimsonFox]

Have you guys ever seen someone that was unhappy or even pissed at the team that drafted them? Like a caught on camera reaction?

I don't think it's happened this year yet

[NobodyHere]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

Have you guys ever seen someone that was unhappy or even pissed at the team that drafted them? Like a caught on camera reaction?

[JPhillips]

WTF are the Falcons doing?

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

WTF are the Falcons doing?

Falcon'ing.

[RainMaker]

Don't they need an EDGE pretty bad? I thought their defensive tackles were pretty good but maybe they lost someone.

[CrimsonFox]

Finally a rb is drafted <3

[B & B]

Fellow Lions fans, lets trade down or just take Cooper Beebe and call it done.

Was hoping for Frazier but he is a Steeler.

[CrimsonFox]

Any team drafting someone named kool-aid should be embarrassed

[CrimsonFox]

Why are OTs such a heavy draft take and not OG .

[Danny]

Originally Posted by CrimsonFox

Why are OTs such a heavy draft take and not OG .

Partly, options. A lot of the best lineman lften go to tackle in college and in the pros if they dont work out at tackle can kick in to guard and sometimes be really good. A clear guard has no where to go if they fail there.

[CrimsonFox]

So what's the difference between the two. They are both line. Why is ot harder than og

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Carman Bulldog

Everyone: Playing first year quarterbacks is a disservice to the player and teams should give them time to develop on the bench for a year to two without rushing them into games.

Also everyone: What is Atlanta doing drafting a quarterback who they plan on sitting for a few years?

Count me among those who don't hate the process. There were people that were critical of the Chiefs in 2017 when they gave up assets to move up and take their quarterback of the future when they already had a Pro Bowl quarterback on their roster. People were saying they should have improved the defense instead. How did that work out?

Unfortunately, there is really only one way to build a winning team in today's NFL and that's hitting on a superstar quarterback. Every QB that a team drafts is basically like a lottery ticket and you need to hit on one of these tickets if you want to be competitive year after year with a shot at winning Super Bowls. While the addition of Cousins means the Falcons should be a playoff team over the next few years, I don't think anyone sees him as a superstar quarterback.

So if a team really believes they have found their future superstar quarterback, then I don't think there is anything wrong with taking him in that spot, even if you already just signed another guy (who happens to be 36 years old coming off a torn Achilles) for the next few years. Whether Penix is that guy is another question altogether.

Seems like a move you make with a QB who has 1-2 years left and you're drafting their replacement. But Cousins just signed a 4 year deal with tons in guaranteed money. The team is in win now mode. Just seems like a really bad use of resources.

[Ksyrup]

The Athletic also gave the Falcons a D+ for their early 2nd round choice. I don't know if that was a universal feeling, but I think I know who will be listed among the post-draft losers in Monday's articles.

[GrantDawg]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

The Athletic also gave the Falcons a D+ for their early 2nd round choice. I don't know if that was a universal feeling, but I think I know who will be listed among the post-draft losers in Monday's articles.

I have seen a "B+" for it. I just don't understand why they traded up to get a guy that was projecting in the third round, but then who knows what the team boards are like. They must have been convinced someone was going to take him and jumped up. Overall, the guy sounds like a good pick. Was he worth giving up another third rounder for? IDK. He does seem like a good prospect, though.

[JPhillips]

I just don't understand the trade picks and win now mentality combined with the get a future QB mentality. They could have kept their pick and gotten Byron Murphy if they were set on a DT.

[Lathum]

Falcons finally got one right with Bralen Trice. He's going to be their best player taken in this draft. Has Max Crosby vibes.

[sovereignstar v2]

Was shocked to find out he played for UW

[Thomkal]

Originally Posted by GrantDawg

I have seen a "B+" for it. I just don't understand why they traded up to get a guy that was projecting in the third round, but then who knows what the team boards are like. They must have been convinced someone was going to take him and jumped up. Overall, the guy sounds like a good pick. Was he worth giving up another third rounder for? IDK. He does seem like a good prospect, though.

As they made the trade with the Cardinals (i think), I fully support this trade.