The Walking Dead -- TV Series Thread

[DanGarion]

I've only got through the first 72 comics, I've been buying the hardcover 12 issue books and I'm waiting to read #7 (73-84). I've really enjoyed the books and both my brother in law and my wife are now reading them.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by DanGarion

I've only got through the first 72 comics, I've been buying the hardcover 12 issue books and I'm waiting to read #7 (73-84). I've really enjoyed the books and both my brother in law and my wife are now reading them.

I love them. I am not sure where I am at. I buy the soft cover ones. I have all that they've printed so far, through #15, I think.

Like the show, they aren't perfect but I do enjoy them. I think there are somethings the TV show does better and some things the comic does better.

I am really inerested to see just how much of all the Mayor stuff they include. Some of the stuff that goes on there is pretty fucking crazy and intense.

For example:

Spoiler

Do they have the Mayor keeping his zombied daugther in his apartment? Do they have him kiss her on the mouth? Do they have the mayor keeping a collection of zombie heads in jars in his living room? Do they have the rape scene with Michonne (assuming she's on the show by then)? Do they cut off Rick's hand? (I seriously doubt this. Kirkman has already said that he regrets having done this in the comic.) Do they have staged fights between people with chained zombies all around for entertainment? Madness!!

[DanGarion]

Originally Posted by Honolulu_Blue

I love them. I am not sure where I am at. I buy the soft cover ones. I have all that they've printed so far, through #15, I think.

Like the show, they aren't perfect but I do enjoy them. I think there are somethings the TV show does better and some things the comic does better.

I am really inerested to see just how much of all the Mayor stuff they include. Some of the stuff that goes on there is pretty fucking crazy and intense.

For example:

Spoiler

Do they have the Mayor keeping his zombied daugther in his apartment? Do they have him kiss her on the mouth? Do they have the mayor keeping a collection of zombie heads in jars in his living room? Do they have the rape scene with Michonne (assuming she's on the show by then)? Do they cut off Rick's hand? (I seriously doubt this. Kirkman has already said that he regrets having done this in the comic.) Do they have staged fights between people with chained zombies all around for entertainment? Madness!!

You mean the Governor...

[DanGarion]

[JonInMiddleGA]

Well.

[stevew]

Budget cutbacks are a motherfucker. I'd suspect Hershel, Daryl and/or Lori go soon, as they are probably the most accomplished actors left.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by stevew

Budget cutbacks are a motherfucker. I'd suspect Hershel, Daryl and/or Lori go soon, as they are probably the most accomplished actors left.

I wasn't aware there'd been any further cutbacks. If anything, I'd assume next season ends up with a considerable larger cast (at least for a while).

[JonInMiddleGA]

Just noticed something on the replay (haven't bothered to find the remote)

Is it just me or did the stuck zombie react to being hit by the rock? Maybe I can justify that as him reacting to a potential food source or something, but it just seemed wrong to me.

[DanGarion]

Budget cutbacks are a motherfucker. I'd suspect Hershel, Daryl and/or Lori go soon, as they are probably the most accomplished actors left.

Rumor has out Dale wanted to leave the show after the producer from the first season was fired...

[Radii]

Massive shit sandwich of an episode. Great beginning, great ending, with 50 minutes of pure pain in between. I dunno what they should have done differently but they did a fucking AWFUL job of making the moral dilemma about the decision on whether or not to kill the prisoner interesting. They just made EVERYONE awful and annoying for the entire episode.


So Rick fails to pull the trigger and be a leader twice in like 20 minutes of real time... not good for him.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Radii

So Rick fails to pull the trigger and be a leader twice in like 20 minutes of real time... not good for him.

The latter one didn't bother me so much really. It seemed, okay, and I don't think it comes up an issue.

The other one on the other hand, well that one seems considerably more problematic.

[Swaggs]

I thought that was a pretty strong episode up until the last ten minutes or so. The scenes that explored Carl's humanity, even though they overdid them, were much better than anything in the comics, in my opinion.

The death scene was lame. The 120 lb. zombie, that was baking in water and sun for weeks or months, overpowers and then tears open a relatively healthy man's stomach? Dale is one of the most beloved characters in the story. If you are going to dump him, at least send him out in style. And, if the actor was upset, they had the perfect out for him during that episode. He could have drove off in his RV, never to be seen again.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Radii

I dunno what they should have done differently but they did a fucking AWFUL job of making the moral dilemma about the decision on whether or not to kill the prisoner interesting. They just made EVERYONE awful and annoying for the entire episode.

I didn't think it was that bad in that regard really. I think a good bit of the point to it was to see both people deferring to Rick and to show how willing many of them were to defer to pretty much anyone willing to take responsibility.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Swaggs

He could have drove off in his RV, never to be seen again.

Eh, we've already got a missing Merle & an absent black dude+kid to await the return/discovery of. I think going to that well a 3rd time might have been kind of annoying.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

Eh, we've already got a missing Merle & an absent black dude+kid to await the return/discovery of. I think going to that well a 3rd time might have been kind of annoying.

Eh. He (along with others) split up with the group in the books and came back later, so it wouldn't be anything overly unusual. Plus, maybe you see him again and maybe you don't.

If you aren't going to give him a glorious death, may as well leave the storyline open.

In any case, it is clear that the book and television series have completely diverged, so it will be interesting to see if and how they incorporate some of the cooler characters and environments.

[Simbo Klice]

This episode sucked for the most part, and I'll really really miss Dale continually shit-talking Shane to everyone, but I loved one specific thing: Carl not being able to pull the trigger on the zombie and the ramifications it had foreshadowing dire consequences for Rick not being able to shoot the kid they rescued. That was brilliant to me.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA

I didn't think it was that bad in that regard really. I think a good bit of the point to it was to see both people deferring to Rick and to show how willing many of them were to defer to pretty much anyone willing to take responsibility.

I've been in the camp that feels little attachment to the characters given how far we are into the series, dying for better writing. The last two episodes I thought did a really good job with dialogue and adding something interesting outside of the action and walkers. Everything with Carl and the debate in the house I felt was back to awful overdone overcaricatured writing and acting again. I know I'm in the minority here with that opinion so I won't dwell on it here


I do feel like there is something interesting there with Rick's leadership. Like you say, most of them were willing to defer to him. The act of just having that debate defers some of the responsibility away from Rick and to a bunch of people who just want no part of an awful and impossible decision. A better leader would be able to shoulder all of the responsibility for the peace of mind of everyone else.

[Grover]

Well... fuck.

[Bigsmooth]

Dang, I was hoping Randall would end up killing Dale and knocking up Maggie. Or at least killing Dale..

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by Radii

A better leader would be able to shoulder all of the responsibility for the peace of mind of everyone else.

I'm starting to become more convinced that it's an intentional flaw, not one entirely for dramatic purposes either I mean.

Maybe some deeper, like how "perfect is the enemy of good" or something. Shit hits the fan, perfect leaders are going to be hard to come by, as good as you can find is probably going to have to be good enough.

[stevew]

I was pretty clear that Randal is an evil raper...right? I thought the scene with Carl made this pretty clear, but my brother said he thought it was ambiguous.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Originally Posted by stevew

I was pretty clear that Randal is an evil raper...right? I thought the scene with Carl made this pretty clear, but my brother said he thought it was ambiguous.

I'm with you, the look of "uh oh I just gave myself away" was pretty hard to miss I thought.

[Draft Dodger]

when Carl took the gun, I thought he was going to shoot Randall. Which would have made this terrible episode much, much more interesting

[Butter]

I guess I am missing how this episode was terrible. I thought it was pretty good, all things considered.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Just thinking ... Carol's bit about "just leave me out of this" could almost have been a nod to the "aaargh" nature of the Randall debate.

My biggest complaint of the night was actually the Carl scenes, the zombie teasing itself was soooo predictable & him trying to look "hard" just isn't working for me. A more complex conflicted-Carl-in-transition is more compelling & believable than the more extreme swings we got last night.

[Blackadar]

Ug...this show is headed downhill fast.



It's the level of stupidity that's starting to drive me nuts, as well as the lost opportunities in character development.

The stupidity in this episode comes mainly from Carl. First of all, how does a 10 year old kid end up wandering in the woods by himself in a middle of a zombie apocalypse? As a parent, I know my 12 year old would be confined to the house and the front porch. Then the stupidity of with playing with the zombie, Carl being disciplined by Shane and trying to turn Carl into some cold-blooded killer. It's all dumb. Is there anyone at this point NOT wishing he had been killed earlier?

Dale getting killed was even more dumb, though I can forgive some of that. Maybe his mind wasn't in the right place due to the distraction of the impending execution and that's how he was taken by surprise. That's explainable. But the whole ripping open his intestines? Did zombies suddenly develop super-strength or something? WTF?

Then there's the numerous lost opportunities with character development or just lousy character development. Let's start with Andrea. Could they make her any more wishy-washy? One minute she's conspiring with Shane and sounding like Xena, Warrior Princess. The next she's all soft, changing her mind and thinking there's a "better way" than killing the kid. Come on...pick a direction!

Here was a perfect chance to reintegrate T-Dog into the group. We haven't heard him speak in weeks. We could have had him speak up and become a moral compass during the group meeting, something this group will need with the absence of Dale. We could have heard him speak against the execution. We could have heard him speak up for the execution. Something! But no...he's just sitting in the background.

And they missed yet another opportunity with Glenn and Maggie. We get this "passing of the torch" scene (out of nowhere, I might add), and then when we cut to the group meeting, Glenn is sitting opposite the room from Maggie? Again, we could have seen him next to her, talking about execution and then we might get the impression that he's trying to protect her with his decision. But no, on the other side of the room, hunched over, he just came off like a little bitch.

Overall, this was a horrible episode.

[Draft Dodger]

no argument from me at all. just a terrible show, after a couple of really solid shows that made it seem like they were going to start hitting their stride.

about Dale - wouldn't it have made more sense for the zombie to bite Dale, forcing them to make a harder decision than they had?

I picture the T-Dog actor getting his script every week and flipping through trying to find his name. "Nope, not this week"

[Honolulu_Blue]

I didn't think this episode was horrible at all. There were a few scenes that I didn't quite like, but overall I thought it was pretty well executed. I know most people seem to equate: anytthing talking/character interaction + farm = horrible. I disagree. Do I like the zombie action scenes more? Yes, but I don't mind the other stuff.

I didn't really care for the Darryl torturing Randall scene. It seemed to come out of nowhere really and felt all a bit gratuitous. I also didn't care for the Hershel and Glenn scene. It felt kind of out of place and schmaltzy (I don't think that's a word or if it is, probably spelled wrong).

I did get a weird rapey vibe from Randall. It actually goes back to the last episode when he killed that one female zombie. He seemed a waaay too enthusiastic when stabbing her in the head and yelling "How do you like that bitch?!?!" And all of that. That raised a brow and his interaction with Carl certainly didn't help that.

I really liked the conversation between Dale and Hershel about killing Randall. Hershel has always been quite righteous - my farm my rules and all - but over the past few days he's realized that he's made too many mistakes. He doesn't know this world. It's quite beyond him and he knows that. He's always more than willing to admit that he'll bury his head in the sand when it comes to stuff like this. Instead of trying to hide from his problems with drink, he's just pretending they don't exist. I like the character shift.

I really liked the group scene in the house during the debate. I don't blame Carol for saying she didn't sign up for this. Just because she survived and is with this group doesn't mean she ever wanted to be on some sort of death panel. Dale's accusation that her silence was just as bad as pulling the trigger wasn't fair. I thought Dale nailed it during that scene. His conviction, passion and then look of dispair when he knew he was beaten. Just fantastic. I also loved that Andrea came over to his side. Hopefully it's a turn in the right direction for a character was becoming pretty harsh, cold and unlikeable. I didn't see her change as being wishy-washy. She came around to it when really pressed. Everyone is struggling with this new world and trying to deal with it. I was really happy to see this. Perhaps a saving grace for the character.

To think Glenn would act any different during that debate than how he did is odd. His entire reaction and demeanor was spot on for his character. Just because Hershel gave him a little speech and a watch a few hours earlier isn't going to radically change him into something he's not. That's not Glenn.

As for Dale's death scene. My wife asked me about this last week. She was wondering how zombies manage to tear into people and rip them open. It's not like zombies have claws or are super strong or anything. Human hands aren't really made for that. It's a good point. The only think I can say is that zombies tearing into people - especially into their stomachs for those tasty-tasty entrails - is as old a zombie trope as zombies themselves. There was a scene in the original "Night Of The Living Dead" where they did just that - when they took the truck out to try and gas it up. Perhaps it's a combination of zombies feel no pain, longer fingernails and some sort of feral rage when they finally get close to meat. It's not something that really bothers me. I think it would have been more effective to have the zombie simply bite his neck, but they went for the gore out and perhaps classic nod to "Night".

I also think the show sent a very harsh message about it's world when it visciously rips open and kills the one guy who was pleading for civility and compassion. It will be interesting to see how Dale's death affects the group dynamic moving forward.

The Carl thing was interesting. I am not sure how I feel about it. He's what 8? 9? 10? year old kid trying to explore this new world. See what's about. What his place in it is. What the rules are. It's gotta be quite weird being a kid there.

As for the group doing stupid stuff... Well, that's sort of been their M.O. since pretty much day one. I don't think Carl being by himself is all too out of whack on that farm. They all feel pretty safe there and were all pretty pre-occupied with the impending decision. Still, I agree, if I had a child I would make sure that he/she never left the house or was always, ALWAYS with an adult, especially after what happened to Sophia.

I was really shocked by Dale's death and saddened by it. I never really heard any rumors about him wanting off the show post-Darabount. Totally didn't see it coming at all.

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Draft Dodger

I picture the T-Dog actor getting his script every week and flipping through trying to find his name. "Nope, not this week"

Based on the previews next week, T-Dog will get more screen time in this next episode than he has in the past four combined and gets to bust out a Will Smith "Aw hell no!"

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Draft Dodger

about Dale - wouldn't it have made more sense for the zombie to bite Dale, forcing them to make a harder decision than they had?

I don't know. The only decision at that point is shot him now or shoot him later after he dies. They've already done that a few times, with Andrea's sister and with that other guy who got bit and they left on the side of the rode.

I was thinking a bite to the neck would have been the way to do it. Have him bleeding. Would have had the same effect without the issue of how can a zombie be strong enough to rip open a person's stomach but not be strong enough to keep a death grip on a 10 year old's ankle.

[stevew]

The show guy on Talking dead said that due to decaying a zombie develops sharp boney fingers.

[wishbone]

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by stevew

The show guy on Talking dead said that due to decaying a zombie develops sharp boney fingers.

Hrmm...

I guess I'll buy it. Between a sort of feeding frenzy mentality when that close to sweet, sweet meat, sharp, boney fingers, not feeling any kind of pain... Sure. Also, it's a horror show. You expect people to die in horrific, perhaps somewhat unique and/or challenging ways.

[Honolulu_Blue]

One thing about the whole Randall situation...

His weirdness and possible rapeyness aside, any potential he ever had of actually being a productive, solid member of Rick's group went out the fucking window a long time ago. He has been almost killed twice now - once when Shane shot at him in that parking lot and then when Rick almost executed him. He was chained up and visciously tortured and beaten by Darryl.

So even if Randall was a decent enough kid who just started running with the wrong crowd to be better protected, how could you ever expect him to be loyal to this group or to trust them? If I were him and was freed, I'd take off the first chance I'd get. Who knows what happens if Rick dies and Shane takes over. Who says they wont beat you again if something goes wrong. At this point, even if Randall was decent, he's damaged goods.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Zombie CSI in the woods with Darrell gives way to the unexpected timing ending.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Make that the double ending (although that one was telegraphed)

[sabotai]

Well, that settles the "can you become a zombie without getting bit" speculation.

[stevew]

I thought that was a really good episode, can't wait for the finale here.

[Radii]

Damn good episode, though I was really looking forward to everyone confronting Shane with all the information Darrell put together tracking them.

[stevew]

read this after watching

Spoiler

'The Walking Dead' Dissection: Robert Kirkman Dishes on 'Monumental Event' - Hollywood Reporter

Spoiled the link cause it maybe could be consider spoilerish.

[Brownkeg8]

Originally Posted by stevew

read this after watching

Spoiler

'The Walking Dead' Dissection: Robert Kirkman Dishes on 'Monumental Event' - Hollywood Reporter

Spoiled the link cause it maybe could be consider spoilerish.

great find

[Chief Rum]

Is that spoilerish as a dissection of the TV series so far (in which case, it doesn't matter to me because I have seen the whole series), or is it spoilerish from the perspective of the comic book the series is based on? If it's the latter, I won't follow your link, since I have not read the comic book.

[Chief Rum]

And, wow, what an ending. I am confused as hell.

[stevew]

Originally Posted by Chief Rum

Is that spoilerish as a dissection of the TV series so far (in which case, it doesn't matter to me because I have seen the whole series), or is it spoilerish from the perspective of the comic book the series is based on? If it's the latter, I won't follow your link, since I have not read the comic book.

TV show. lots of spoilers about tonight's episode.

[Grover]

So, I think we now know what CDC Man whispered to Rick...

[Chief Rum]

Originally Posted by stevew

TV show. lots of spoilers about tonight's episode.

Thanks. That is indeed a great find. I recommend all avid watchers follow that link, although not until you have seen tonight's episode.

[Blackadar]

Originally Posted by stevew

read this after watching

Spoiler

'The Walking Dead' Dissection: Robert Kirkman Dishes on 'Monumental Event' - Hollywood Reporter

Spoiled the link cause it maybe could be consider spoilerish.

Good link, but I disagree with their characterization of the event as a...

Spoiler

...murder. It clearly was self-defense. Shane was still pointing a loaded gun at Rick.

This was probably the best episode since Season 1. We actually got to see/hear from pretty much all the actors and the flow was so much more natural. The opening sequence was well done, with the funeral scenes interspersed with the zombie kills. The overall episode was tight and the character actions all reasonable. I also loved the big reveal...

Spoiler

...that everyone is already infected. They'd been hinting about this for weeks and the CDC guy whispered something to Rick just before they left in Season 1, so it's about time. I thought that the reveal was really well done - Glenn's face as perfect as he started to realize what it all means.

Plus, it looks like next weeks' episode is shaping up for some serious zombie mayhem, which is always good.

[Honolulu_Blue]

I really enjoyed last night's episode.

The scene at the begining where Shane, Darryl, T-Dog and Andrea took down that group of zombies was some classic "Walking Dead" comic book stuff. They have a lot of those types of scenes. It was very well shot even if I couldn't help but think of that poor fax machine from "Office Space" when they started kicking the hell out of that last zombie.

I also thought that the Shane/Rick confrontation scene was well done and beautifully shot. A couple of the shots with the two silhouetted by the moon on that hill were fantastic. That whole ending was amazing, especially that last shot of the herd coming across the field.

Darryl finallly missed a shot with his crossbow!

I also liked the first scene where the group finally started talking about moving the cars into sensible positions, stocking up on supplies, rationing, etc. I guess it took the death of Dale to finally snap them out their little shangrila that was the farm.

So now it's pretty clear that everyone is infected and, like in in the comic, regardless of how you die you come back a walker. That certainly makes the situation much, much more dire.

Did they discuss this at all in that "Talking Dead" show? There was that first episode of Season 2 when the group came upon that massive traffic jam and there were a number of corpses - that looked free of head trauma - strapped into cars. If they just died some other way, how come they weren't zombies? It's nothing something I am going to get too worked up about. Perhaps these people died early enough that they didn't catch the virus that it hadn't spread quick enough to infect them before they died.

Next week looks like it's going to be full on zombie madness. A zombie apocalypse come to Hershel's farm.

Did anyone catch that "Mad Men" commercial for "Walking Dead" fans? It was pretty funny, especially the line at the end where they mentioned something about everyone drinking like Hershel used to.

[Grover]

T-Dog had some lines! He must've been excited to shoot this episode.

HB, Talking Dead kind of danced around the issue of everybody being infected already. They didn't really tackle it too head on because they were preoccupied with Shane's double death.

They showed an excellent preview for next week's episode with Carl asking Rick what happened with Shane as they're walking back to the farm, then they start to hear the groaning and they look across the field to see the undead army heading in their direction. It was a fantastic little scene.

The Mad Men ad, was that with Jon Hamm drinking "Stop me when I've had three, this is number one"?

[Honolulu_Blue]

Originally Posted by Grover

The Mad Men ad, was that with Jon Hamm drinking "Stop me when I've had three, this is number one"?

I am not sure if it had that line or not. It might have. It was the first commercial of the first break and had "The Walking Dead" voice guy narrating the commercial and drawing all of these parallels between "The Walking Dead" and "Mad Men".