Ongoing pro/college basketball thread (2023-24)

[Atocep]

Texas went 6-12 in conference play and was safely in. UNC went 1-12 in quad 1 games.

The committee claims player availability hurt WVU with Tucker DeVries being out. He's been out for 4 months and all over WVU's biggest wins were without him.

[RainMaker]

How did UNC make it?

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

How did UNC make it?

The committee chair had to justify the extension he handed Hubert Davis.

[bhlloy]

Originally Posted by Atocep

WVU becomes the first team that was a unanimous selection in the bracket project, which tracks 111 bracket projections, to not make the NCAA tournament. UNC gets in as the last team, coincidentally their AD is the chair on the committee.

When asked by Seth about it that was some of the most awkward TV I've seen in a while. But yeah, total name/brand/$$$ pick, I think they'd have liked to have Indiana over Drake too but even they couldn't justify that.

[Atocep]

Of the 111 brackets tracked by the bracket project.

WVU was in on all 111.

Indiana was in on 90.

Texas was in on 50.

Xavier was in on 30.

UNC was in on 27.

[Kodos]

IU didn’t deserve to make it in. No loss there. Now we are clear of the season and can name a new coach.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Kodos

IU didn’t deserve to make it in. No loss there. Now we are clear of the season and can name a new coach.

Agreed. I told my dad (who's a season ticket holder*) that we needed at least one win in the Big Ten tourney to have a real shot.

Like everything else this season, IU fell short when they needed it...which is a shame, because I liked the kids on this team, but they just didn't seem capable of playing like a team when it counted.

* My mom died in March of last year from pancreatic cancer. Dad, who's always been a huge IU fan, was considering returning to Texas for the winter, so my brothers and I managed to secure season tickets for him as a lure to keep him in Indiana and close to family.

[Kodos]

Sorry to hear about your mom, Drake. That’s awful.

[Radii]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

How did UNC make it?

It's truly absurd.

[albionmoonlight]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

How did UNC make it?

People look at that uniform and see Jordan, Worthy, Carter, etc.

The past is a powerful drug.

[miami_fan]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

How did UNC make it?

Because the committee had to pick 68 teams instead of 65? Maybe 64?

WVU should have gotten in but not as a replacement for UNC. UNC should not not have made it but I think WVU were worthy of at least a 10 seed if UNC as the last team in got an 11 seed.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Of the 111 brackets tracked by the bracket project.

WVU was in on all 111.

Indiana was in on 90.

Texas was in on 50.

Xavier was in on 30.

UNC was in on 27.

I'm sort of surprised they were even on 27 of those. I saw some where they weren't even listed as a last 4 in. I know they played a tough schedule but they didn't beat anyone good all year it seems.

[JonInMiddleGA]

Ngl, this is pretty dirty stuff

South Alabama has NIT invite rescinded - 'Unacceptable' - ESPN

[Ksyrup]

My boss is a U of L donor/season ticket holder and he's getting 2 tickets for Session 1 at Rupp on Thursday, so he's invited me to go with him (seeing as though I live 20 minutes from Rupp). Pretty cool. I've never been to an NCAA tournament game of any kind. Auburn plays in game 2.

[Ksyrup]

Anybody seen or used this before? Any idea which stats have historically mattered the most in the tournament?

Algebracket

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Kodos

And Lucy pulls the ball again! Charlie desperately tries to kick it anyway and lands on his back with a tremendous thud. His back is broken.

x.com

Jeff Goodman
@GoodmanHoops
BREAKING: Boston Celtics president of basketball operations Brad Stevens told @TheFieldOf68
that he is not a candidate for the Indiana University job.

“I thoroughly appreciate being a Celtic and love the people I get to work with every day,” Stevens told @TheFieldOf68
.

It sounds like WVU coach DeVries is a target at Indiana. Iowa tried but couldn't match the NIL and salary WVU has on the table for an extension. Indiana can and DeVries is a Midwest guy.

[Lathum]

about to fill out my Buffett bracket. Wish me luck!

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Atocep

It sounds like WVU coach DeVries is a target at Indiana. Iowa tried but couldn't match the NIL and salary WVU has on the table for an extension. Indiana can and DeVries is a Midwest guy.

I've been a season ticket holder for a long time and my interest in college basketball is landing at an all-time low. Seeing WVU go 19-13 (10-10 in the Big 12) with neutral court OOC wins over Gonzaga and Arizona and @ Kansas (plus beat Iowa St) and not get in, while UNC and Xavier and San Diego St. somehow did. And seeing Oklahoma win .333 of their SEC games (and both have the same number of ranked wins as WVU has, despite having more opportunities) and getting a 9-seed was defeating.

But, the dagger is if we end up losing Devries, that will be 4 coaches in 4 years and complete roster turnover each year. I can't blame him for wanting to go to Indiana, I guess. But I can't see me caring about the tournament and now next year is going to be another lost season. Meanwhile, I'm paying for seats, licensing, have to walk a mile if I want to park, and spend about $75 to feed my family when I go to games. Feels like an arms race that I'm just throwing money into and getting zero return.

I just paid almost $4000 for three football tickets and I'm guessing the best hope there is to win 8 or 9 games.

College sports is pretty darn broken for all but a handful of programs. Coaching contracts don't matter, player contracts don't seem to matter (or at least equal any type of long term stability), and conference affiliation feels like it is all temporary. I'm tired of every offseason feeling like we go back to square one.

[flere-imsaho]

Get some of these people to pony up some NIL money, then.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

Get some of these people to pony up some NIL money, then.

For basketball, WVU has a really strong NIL budget. Definitely top 25, but still not competing with Indiana there if Indiana really commits. NIL is really the only thing coaches are caring about right now and WVU can get closer to Indiana than most realize but still not good enough.

Indiana side are saying it's done but are probably jumping the gun. I think he goes if/when offered. There are some good coaches out there to replace him but the pool isn't as deep as last cycle when it was hard to make a bad hire.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by flere-imsaho

Get some of these people to pony up some NIL money, then.

I'd say we generally punch above our weight in fundraising and certainly with NIL. Guys like John Chambers and Ken Kendrick have been very generous over the years and Pat McAfee has been very supportive since he's gotten more famous and wealthy. Our athletic department has already said that they are fully funding the maximum profit sharing (about $22M beginning in the 25-26 season), so the commitment is there to maximize what we have, I think.

The bigger issue is that, even at our best, we can't expect to compete with the Ohio States and Texases of the world, but with the Big Ten and SEC now earning so much through TV/broadcasting, the gap between WVU and say Vanderbilt/Miss. St./Purdue/Iowa is soon going to be insurmountable, too - even if we do everything right. We won't be able to retain assistant coaches, have as many staff members, budgeting for recruiting, etc.

I'm not asking for anyone to feel sorry for me here. It's just frustrating that the a lot of the winners and losers in this system were largely chosen by who you aligned yourself with 50 or 100 years ago.

[Kodos]

Sounds like it might be Darian DeVries to IU.

[Lathum]

Insane ending to the first play in game

[wustin]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

How did UNC make it?

Of all 8 of the first 4 and last 4 teams, UNC is ranked #1 in all relevant metrics except for quad 1 wins where they're last. Ever since UNC made their permanent starting lineup change, they've been playing like a top 25 team so that 1-12 quad 1 record was always a silly talking point. They nearly beat Florida and Duke (without Flagg). Previous 10 games UNC has had a top 10 offense and shooting 44% from 3. They were up 82 to 42 against SDSU at one point yesterday lol.

[Lathum]

American needs to get the Rogers kid out of the game before he does permanent damage, if he hasn't already

[Lathum]

dola- please stop showing his mom holding back tears

[Thomkal]

It was about this time last year that Coastal Carolina moved on from Cliff Ellis and I thought things were looking up for the program: much younger, more media/community friendly coach-all around campus/local news/town but sadly the team on the court might have been the worse yet. No wins in the Sun Belt until late in the season and then a first round loss as the 12th or 13 seed. If things don't improve with more of his own players on the team next season there may be a quick turnaround in head coaches.

[Lathum]

Jesus. Clemson scored 13 points in the first half.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Jesus. Clemson scored 13 points in the first half.

Wade's a great coach and will make NC State dangerous in the NIL era. I'm not sure how long he stays there, though, because he'll be attractive at other places in a hurry and if NC State isn't giving him enough resources he won't hesitate to leave.

[Swaggs]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Wade's a great coach and will make NC State dangerous in the NIL era. I'm not sure how long he stays there, though, because he'll be attractive at other places in a hurry and if NC State isn't giving him enough resources he won't hesitate to leave.

Wade will have NC State near the top of the ACC in no time. I think he'll eventually end up at Clemson, though. He's obviously an alum, but I've heard he's super attached to them.

[Ksyrup]

Went to the Louisville game. From what I saw, bad matchup with Creighton, Creighton hit everything in sight, and the refs called a game that allowed heavy contact inside that did UL no favors on top of everything else that didn't go their way. It wasn't for lack of crowd, though - I'd say 90% UL fans, at UK's home court. A bunch of people taking pictures with middle fingers at the Rupp sign. Then they threw bottles on the court near the end, causing a delay.

Thanks to UL blowing it, we left after the game and didn't watch Auburn.

[RainMaker]

Originally Posted by Atocep

Wade's a great coach and will make NC State dangerous in the NIL era. I'm not sure how long he stays there, though, because he'll be attractive at other places in a hurry and if NC State isn't giving him enough resources he won't hesitate to leave.

NC State feels like a perfect fit but I'm a little surprised he isn't getting even bigger offers. That guy is a masterful tactician. Good lord that gameplan they had for Clemson in the first half was perfect.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by RainMaker

NC State feels like a perfect fit but I'm a little surprised he isn't getting even bigger offers. That guy is a masterful tactician. Good lord that gameplan they had for Clemson in the first half was perfect.

A lot of risk there. It takes a string AD or someone willing to accept the risk
He has guys that bankroll his NIL needs and insert themselves in the program with no loyalty to the school. NC State's AD is on the hot seat a bit and is likely fired if he doesn't nail this hire so the risk made sense.

[HerRealName]

Every time I watch Kansas I'm amazed by how sloppy they are. I don't know how Self has managed to keep his sanity this year. Hopefully this is the end of Dickinson.

[Lathum]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

Went to the Louisville game. From what I saw, bad matchup with Creighton, Creighton hit everything in sight, and the refs called a game that allowed heavy contact inside that did UL no favors on top of everything else that didn't go their way. It wasn't for lack of crowd, though - I'd say 90% UL fans, at UK's home court. A bunch of people taking pictures with middle fingers at the Rupp sign. Then they threw bottles on the court near the end, causing a delay.

Thanks to UL blowing it, we left after the game and didn't watch Auburn.

Did you throw the water bottle?

[Lathum]

I think St Johns may be in some trouble

[Ksyrup]

Originally Posted by Lathum

Did you throw the water bottle?

I didn't care enough about who won to get that pissed. It also happened on the other side of the court from where we were sitting.

[Edward64]

Holy crap. Hogs beat Kansas!

[RainMaker]

Big 10 undefeated in round 1.

[Edward64]

Holy crap. Hogs beat St John’s

[Lathum]

The end of these games are unwatchable with all the reviews.

[Ghost Econ]

Duke is the only non SEC, B10, B12 team left. Underdogs.

[JPhillips]

Probably me and my stress/distractions, but this tournament just didn't grab me the way past tournaments have. Pretty uneventful/unexciting first weekend. With a couple of exceptions, UConn/FL is the biggest.

[BishopMVP]

Originally Posted by JPhillips

Probably me and my stress/distractions, but this tournament just didn't grab me the way past tournaments have. Pretty uneventful/unexciting first weekend. With a couple of exceptions, UConn/FL is the biggest.

I think it was a little better than people give it credit for because there weren't any buzzer beaters until a Colorado State/Maryland game that gave us two, but I think with the current rules the top teams have never been better and the gap between them and the best mid/low majors who are usually the fun upset teams has widen considerably. Gaulke got the attention but the real star player from last year's Cinderella Oakland team made it to the Sweet 16 last night (Trey Townsend), he just did it as a depth piece on Arizona putting up 2/3/2 instead of the guy putting up 30/17 vs NC State last year (and he did it next to a guy who put up 20/7 a game at Campbell).

There are still occasional lightning in a bottle teams like Drake that pulled their top players up with the coach, or guys like Robbie Avila and Yaxel Landeborg who prefer a coach and situation they like over chasing the $$$, but for every one of them there are dozens of others that could be starring as the 1-3 on a frisky lower conference champ and 12-15 seed that are instead filling out the depth chart as the 4-8 at the high major teams with all that $$$ advantage. Really sucks as someone whose two teams are Charlotte (Igor Milicic, Dishon Jackson, LuCye Patterson last year, all gone to start for power teams) and UMass (RJ Luis, Javohn Garcia, Matt Cross, Josh Cohen going from All-A10 to 13mpg for a bottom tier B1G team, etc) and I think it definitely tamps down the number of upsets or close games early, but the flip side is this is pretty easily the best the remaining 16 teams should be so it's not what I prefer but there is a different reward at least. Literally the only team close to an underdog is Coach Cal's Arkansas and they're rolling out multiple 5* NBA prospects and a guy like Johnell Davis who also lead a recent Cinderella run at a smaller conference school.

We'll see if this year was just a huge outlier - and we'll still get SOME upsets - but I think we're entering a new top heavy era instead of the fairly wild west one we've seen recently. Since 2013 the top 25 KenPom teams have averaged between +21.62 to +24.94, this year they're up at +27.4, and the B1G should catch up to the SEC in fully weaponizing their money and the NIL structure. Big 12/ACC/some lower powers like Memphis or Gonzaga will be able to keep up with the cap if they can get near it or if their school chooses to focus on basketball over football, but you can't build around hidden gems over a couple seasons at the lower levels, 90% of All-Conference guys are gone after one.

[Ksyrup]

The Sweet Sixteen matchups seem pretty good. UK/Tennessee is going to be interesting. I doubt UK can pull off a third victory against them this year.

UK, Arkansas and BYU all made the Sweet Sixteen. I think the coaching musical chairs worked out well for everyone.

[Atocep]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

The Sweet Sixteen matchups seem pretty good. UK/Tennessee is going to be interesting. I doubt UK can pull off a third victory against them this year.

UK, Arkansas and BYU all made the Sweet Sixteen. I think the coaching musical chairs worked out well for everyone.

Last year's hiring cycle was arguably the strongest ever. This year's is not.

[HerRealName]

Originally Posted by Ksyrup

The Sweet Sixteen matchups seem pretty good. UK/Tennessee is going to be interesting. I doubt UK can pull off a third victory against them this year.

UK, Arkansas and BYU all made the Sweet Sixteen. I think the coaching musical chairs worked out well for everyone.

The good thing about the relative lack of upsets this year is that the rest of the tournament is going to be incredible.

[Arles]

Yeah, I'm pretty excited for:
AZ/Duke
BYU/Bama (BYU is live here)
Kentucky/Tenn
Michigan/Auburn

A lot of good teams left (including my finals duo Florida and Houston) - should be some good games.

[HerRealName]

I failed to get my brothers to change our yearly NCAA bet - I wanted to pick every game as they happen instead of the traditional bracket before the start of the tournament. I still think it's a good idea so I'm going to try again next year. We're really close on score and it will just come down to whoever picked the right winner. It feels lame to me.

[Atocep]

Women's basketball is watching 3-4 players hit the floor with no call and then a ticky tack call 2 seconds later.